First mill/drill help

[imagineer]

I would advise to avoid a round column mill. As mentioned before, you lose spindle/work orientation when you need to change the height.
I have a Jet JMD-18 and it's a royal PIA when I need to change the height.

 

[matthewsx]

Beginner here. I'd like to be able to machine small parts in both aluminum and steel. Space is at a absolute premium in my shop, as in I have none, and so I'm considering swapping my drill press for a mill/drill. I only have space for something that is ~24" wide and ~28" deep (or smaller) and mobile so under 250lbs or so. I've been looking at small 13/14" mill/drills. Its my understanding that these small mill/drill combo's aren't the best for serious milling, but for learning and making small parts, I'm assuming it should fit my needs. I've been looking at something like this:

14" Vari-Speed Gear Head Milling Machine

EQUIPPED WITH: Halogen work light Depth stop Digital speed read out Digital readout depth gauge Interlocking spindle safety guard Draw bar

palmgren.com

But under a different brand (seems this make/model is sold under different brands) as I can get one at a reasonable price ~$2200.00

Are these machines any good? Or should I be looking at something different in this size and price range?

If by “different brand” you mean Bolton, no.

Unless your projects have a lot of variance in the z axis (tall) the round column will not be an issue. Even if they do there are many, many ways to get around the limitation.

Good thing about RF30/31 is that there are so many out there you can usually find one for half what a new square column (smaller) costs.

At around 600lbs they can take a much bigger cut than a mini mill. There is also a square column RF45 but they are much more rare.

Keep asking questions and post any machines you find on here.

John

 

[mickri]

It is very easy to bring a round column back to position if you needed to move the head. I use a dial indictor along with a steel rod and a magnetic base. Place the rod against the head and zero the DI. Move the head to do what you need to do. Then carefully bring the head back to just touching the rod with the DI back to zero.

 

[dabear3428]

for learning and making small parts, I'm assuming it should fit my needs.
yes they will and if you decide to do larger things or heavy production you will need to upgrade, but selling a used mill is easy with most retaining 75% of new value, more important is tooling, if you get serious you will have much more invested in tooling/workholding than the mill. most mini mills can be had with R8 spindle and that caries over to Bridgeport and other larger mills where MT 3,4,5 dont and the CAT system is rare in smaller mills.

the way i look at it get what fits your needs/desires now and plan to upgrade if you need to later,
all of the recommendations above will work, i would not get to hung up on round vs square column, belt vs gear heads, all of them can do what you want as stated above.

i would avoid the one you listed due to the mt2 taper and the price, the grizzly g0704 is much better for less money, the g0758 is less money and has close to the same capabilities, the pm-25mv cost about the same and is hands down a better machine.

the one thing i would caution against is going way out of you comfort zone money wise for a hobby that you do not know where you want it to go, you can buy any of the above listed mills and then sell it if you decide you want bigger.

used is an option but keep in mind, if you do not know how to evaluate a mill you may have a hard time knowing when to walk away and when to run.

in the mean time keep asking questions and know that everyone's response is based on their (or my) perspective and may not match your situation.

keep in mind that any mill is better than no mill.

 

[stupoty]

Mountainbear

Unless your projects have a lot of variance in the z axis (tall) the round column will not be an issue. Even if they do there are many, many ways to get around the limitation.

I use an er32 collet chuck mostly on my rf30 , this helps with height as you can use it for holding everything from 2-20mm so I don't need to put the drill chuck in to drill holes which saves putting the head up and down to accommodate that.

You get quick at using an edge finder with a round column mill also

Stu

 

[T Bredehoft]

I really enjoyed my PM25mv. I'd run Bridgeports and larger in real life. Retired I opted for the PM25. It did what I wanted to do, albeit, perhaps at a slower pace. I built my own X feed, worked well with a Ford windshield wiper motor, but a bit limited in speed. While I no longer have need of a metal working mill, I wouldn't mind having one in my shop today. just in case...

 

[verbotenwhisky]

I've read that the belt drives are a bit of a pain and that depending on the speed you can lose power at the cutting head. Is this true?

Also most of the belt drive units I've seen in this size use a round column vs the square column. Again something I've read is that the round column is less "ridged" and the up/down adjustment tends to be less accurate. Is this true?

The precision Mathews is a square column mill with belt drive and appears to be a good machine for its size. If you look up blondiehacks on YouTube and go back a year or so ago she was using a PM25. I have a PM940V which is belt drive and I use a 3" face mill with it and have no issues.

Edit: I might add that a great deal of the belt drive has to do with the type belt it uses.

 

[mickri]

Another thing to keep in consideration to not have to move the head is what is called the longest tool. When figuring how to do a project look at the different tools you will need. Then try to make your set up so you can change both the shortest and longest tools without having to move the head. I use this along with ER32 collets. Since doing this I have not had to move the head to do a project. ER32 collets seem to take up the least amount of space, gives lots of wiggle when changing tooling and you don't have fiddle with the drawbar. Drill chucks are the biggest space wasters. I never use a drill chuck on my mill/drill.

 

[verbotenwhisky]

Another thing to keep in consideration to not have to move the head is what is called the longest tool. When figuring how to do a project look at the different tools you will need. Then try to make your set up so you can change both the shortest and longest tools without having to move the head. I use this along with ER32 collets. Since doing this I have not had to move the head to do a project. ER32 collets seem to take up the least amount of space, gives lots of wiggle when changing tooling and you don't have fiddle with the drawbar. Drill chucks are the biggest space wasters. I never use a drill chuck on my mill/drill.

If you are talking about the PM mills or most of the Grizzly's and possibly Little Machine shop models bench tops owning a good set of R8 collets would not be a bad idea. If the mill uses R8 quill attachments those collets will reduce the tool make-up distance allowing more work room for your project.

 

[AllenV]

I fall in line with the folks advising against a round column mill. I had an RF-40 clone round column for quite a while and am well familiar with the disability of recovering the head XY location while moving it up and down in Z. Yes it can be done as post #13 above explains. But those extra steps are a big complication when all you want to do is raise head to do a tapping or reaming operation after drilling a hole.
If you can manage a square column, you'll be glad you did. If the only mill that fits your space/budget is a round column, so be it. You'll get by okay for a while. Eventually you'll want to sell the round column in favor a square column. I did exactly that.