Recommendations for Lathe and Mill with Space Limitations

[RJSakowski]

Personally, unless I was totally cramped for space, I would stay away from the combo machines. You can't combine the different machines without some compromises. It is also nice to be able to go from one machine to another without having to tear down your setup.

As to specific machines, it is hard to speak to that without knowing what the space and budget limitations are. The first step would be to lay out a floor plan. I did this with simple boxed to represent the machines and other equipment. Regarding a lathe, it is good practice to keep the left side of the lathe as free as possible to permit longer stock to be entered through the headstock. For the mill, it is good practice to keep the envelope clear at the furthest extremes to left and right of the table travel. Ideally, you would also want additional space for longer work. Desks or workbenches can fit under those spaces if necessary.

Unless you are anticipating larger work, a 10x22 lathe will work nicely as will some of the bench top mill/drills. I have the Grizzly G0602 and it has been relatively free from problems. The RF30 or clones are also a capable machine. The PM machines are arguably a step up albeit at a step up in cost. There seems to be a common belief that bigger is better. I don't subscribe to that. True, a bigger machine generally is more rigid and higher power but they are more expensive, they require more space and power requirements are greater.

 

[verbotenwhisky]

Are all of the arguments against a combo lathe/mill machine valid?
Or are there any higher-priced units that supersede these limitations?

Welcome to the forum.

I once looked at the Granite machines by Smithy because a buddy had one but his comment was a machine that does everything isn't great for anything. I had owned mill before but not a lathe and thought an all in one would be good but found few good comments about them and the size work envelope was a prime complaint.

I am partial to the PM machines, I have 2 of them and I am happy with both; and the customer support is great. one of the things that PM does is to sell machines with imperial lead screws which I also like, you just need to define what you can and cannot live without.

Depending on your budget, for a mill, I would suggest either the PM-30MV (inexpensive option) or the PM-833T or TV (more expensive with a bit better fit and finish), for a lathe I would suggest a PM-1022V or if you have the space a PM-1030V or if you have the budget and the room a PM-1236T. I am not telling you these are the only choices nor that PM is the only company, this is simply my opinion/suggestion concerning you question.

 

[FortyFivePalms]

When I was looking for my lathe and mill I quickly came to the conclusion that anything coming out of a machine shop was probably worn out. Why else would they be selling it. So I concentrated on looking for estate sales.

I tend to agree with this assessment...I like a project as much as the next guy, but I think I can afford to shop around.
Plus I like the idea of finding something with bonus tooling & accessories, if possible. The Atlas 618 I scored two decades ago was hobbyist-owned and came with damn near every accessory available for it.

 

[FortyFivePalms]

Flat ways aren't my favorite but this Craftsman looks pretty clean.

Atlas/Craftsman 12 inch metal lathe. Very good condition. - tools - by owner - sale - craigslist

Atlas/Craftsman metal lathe12 inch model ,in very good condition with hardly any ware All features work correctly comes with nice work table with built-in tool rack also comes with tooling in...

sandiego.craigslist.org

John

Thanks for all of the leads.
I already saw this one...I think a 12 x 36 may be the perfect size for me, and it looks clean, and I must admit to a certain affection for Craftsman/Atlas machines, but I was hoping to find something with a QCGB.

Whatever you do, do not buy one of these....

COMBO Lathe-milling machine - tools - by owner - sale - craigslist

HQ400 Combo lathe, milling machine, drill press. Been in back of garage unused for lengthy time.

sandiego.craigslist.org

I had one and all it will do is convince you to take up another hobby....

John

One thing I've learned over the last couple of days, is that folks have VERY strong opinions (both good and bad) about these combo machines. I think I have enough room - BARELY - to qualify me for separate units.

 

[extropic]

Welcome to H-M.

There seems to be a makerspace in San Diego.
That is what I would recommend for you, to figure out what you want and to develop your skills.
Their web site indicates they have classes, manual machines as well as CNC.
<2 hours away by bus and <30 minutes away by private vehicle (zero traffic, ).
Having those sorts of recourses available is priceless.

Maketory

Maketory - Wood Shop, Metal Shop, Blacksmithing, Laser Cutting, 3D Printing, and Coworking Office Space - Schedule a Tour Today!

www.maketory.com

 

[FortyFivePalms]

Personally, unless I was totally cramped for space, I would stay away from the combo machines. You can't combine the different machines without some compromises. It is also nice to be able to go from one machine to another without having to tear down your setup.

As to specific machines, it is hard to speak to that without knowing what the space and budget limitations are. The first step would be to lay out a floor plan. I did this with simple boxed to represent the machines and other equipment. Regarding a lathe, it is good practice to keep the left side of the lathe as free as possible to permit longer stock to be entered through the headstock. For the mill, it is good practice to keep the envelope clear at the furthest extremes to left and right of the table travel. Ideally, you would also want additional space for longer work. Desks or workbenches can fit under those spaces if necessary.

Unless you are anticipating larger work, a 10x22 lathe will work nicely as will some of the bench top mill/drills. I have the Grizzly G0602 and it has been relatively free from problems. The RF30 or clones are also a capable machine. The PM machines are arguably a step up albeit at a step up in cost. There seems to be a common belief that bigger is better. I don't subscribe to that. True, a bigger machine generally is more rigid and higher power but they are more expensive, they require more space and power requirements are greater.

As much as I would like to have more clearance to the left of any lathe I may get, I only have about 76" x 36" to work with, and the left side will be up against a wall. I have about 40" x 36" for a compact mill. It sounds as if a setup similar to yours may work well within my limitations. I do have the option of blocking the outside entrance door to the toolroom (which would extend the lathe space another three feet) but I am trying to avoid that if possible). If there was a way to place a lathe cabinet on wheels (is there?) I would consider blocking the door for more space.

 

[FortyFivePalms]

There seems to be a makerspace in San Diego.
That is what I would recommend for you, to figure out what you want and to develop your skills.
Their web site indicates they have classes, manual machines as well as CNC.
<2 hours away by bus and <30 minutes away by private vehicle (zero traffic, ).

I appreciate the suggestion...thanks but no thanks.

Back when I had a very small garage, I tried a shared auto repair/storage space, with the concept being that for a monthly sum I would have access to a large garage space with lift equipment, hoists, hand tools, etc. What a disaster. Never again.
I'm sure this concept may work for others, but I've done extremely well teaching myself all of my skills through research, investigation, observation and then application.

 

[matthewsx]

Thanks for all of the leads.
I already saw this one...I think a 12 x 36 may be the perfect size for me, and it looks clean, and I must admit to a certain affection for Craftsman/Atlas machines, but I was hoping to find something with a QCGB.


One thing I've learned over the last couple of days, is that folks have VERY strong opinions (both good and bad) about these combo machines. I think I have enough room - BARELY - to qualify me for separate units.

I like my 12x36, it's Taiwan built and came with all the basics used for less than a grand. It fits in a 60" space just barely but to me it's about the smallest I'd want for my interests which also include classic cars.

There's also a Craftsman "industrial" machine near you but it's missing the cross slide and compound.

Lathe. Classic multi speed Craftsman lathe. - tools - by owner - sale - craigslist

Great old metal lathe, probably best for wood working now because it's missing the metal working tool post. Runs on 110/120 Volts. Plug it in and have some fun! Comes with it's stand. Call or text...

sandiego.craigslist.org

Might be worth taking a look if you're willing to hunt down the parts and you can get it for half what he's asking.

If you only have space for one I'd suggest getting the best lathe you can, you can do a lot of mill type work on a lathe but not so much the other way around unless it's a CNC.

As for mills I really like having a knee and think it's worthwhile stretching your space to make one fit. sometimes you can rearrange things to push one into a corner to take up less room.

I had my multi-function machine when I was just starting out but remember being frustrated trying to run it as both a lathe and mill, just wasn't good for either with my limited experience at the time. Perhaps if I knew more I could have made it work but I paid about $600 for it new and was happy to sell it for half that much within a year. I ended up getting a Seneca Falls Star lathe for $300 and it served me well even though it didn't have a QCGB. One work around with a change gear lathe is to set it up with a 3 phase motor so you have variable speed, doesn't help with setting up for threading but does the trick for adjusting speeds.

I'm sure you can get what you need close to home if you want a used machine, or even a newer one if that's your preference.

Lathes. Large Bore. Precision Matthews 1127-VF-LB, 120V - tools - by owner - sale - craigslist

Selling two Precision Matthews 1127 - VF - LB lathes - WITH STANDS and extras. The stands alone are worth $500 new! This is a large bore, 1.5 inch lathe that runs on 110/120 Volts. Just plug it in...

sandiego.craigslist.org

Just take your time and feel free to post up any other questions you have.

John

 

[GT-6 Racer]

There are lots of good recommendations above. However, if you are looking for industrial quality and capability to do very precise work, and have the budget, I would consider a Deckel FP1 or FP2 mill. The FP series are amazing machines, very rigid and with unrivaled accessories to do virtually any task within its size restrictions. and have a quite small footprint. If buying a Deckel, do the research and buy one with a Heidenhain DRO, the most complete set of accessories and best condition you can find. I have an FP3 and just love it. For a small lathe the Hardinge HLV-H is very hard to beat. If you can manage the weight, a Monarch 10EE in good condition is magic to use. Both lathes will work to 10ths. All will be 3phase and require some sort of phase convertor, unless you find a modular drive 10EE which is single phase.

 

[durableoreo]

Given your limited .space, the old addage of "buy the biggest machine you can that fits your space and your budget" is always the first thing to consider.

Then you have to factor in tools and tooling for each machine which, as I am sure you are aware, can and will eclipse the cost of the machine many times over

The third consideration is whether to go used or new and both have caveats. Used carries the caveat of being aware of if the machine is worn out or not, buying new comes with the caveat of inspect before purchase to assure yourself of quality.

Do your research for each machine and be diligent with it as every machine has pros and cons.

@ChazzC has recommended two of the best suppliers there are, so maybe look over the offerings of both companies and compare machines between the two, though I will say, PM seem to have the edge on Customer support.

As for combo machines, they are 100% a compromise in that they are good at neither one thing, nor the other.

I feel oddly compelled to counter the advice to buy big. Too big is a problem. Bigger machines cost more, are harder to transport, tooling costs more, etc. I recommend a 9x20 lathe and RF-45 mill. Also, buy new if you can. Used machines appear to be amazing deals but often the buyer does not include the value of their time and the lifestyle level of commitment required to find good deals. And you only hear about the success stories.