728VT really unhappy!

[SouthernChap]

That’s what I said. Any reputable business owner goes out of the way to make things right. I am nuts about keeping my customers happy. I am not surprised to see you agree to swap it out.

@qualitymachinetools

Dear God alive man! Will you please setup a branch in the UK (or at least the Republic of Ireland; it's an EU member).

Here in the UK, we have Warco who are at least a bit picky about which Chinese company they buy from but their customer service people, whilst getting an 'A' for effort, aren't generally technically knowledgeable as much as could be desired.

ArcEuroTrade are good guys and they do work closely with SEIG to provide a better QC of their products, but the fact that they have a "How to build your sketchily-pre-assembled-for-convenient-shipping-but not-fully-finished SEIG C3/SC3 kit" manual (okay, it's not called that, but effectively, that's what it is ) available for download tells you the limitations of the products they sell.

Amadeal are also nice chaps but the technical expertise isn't really there and they sell mostly the same level of kit as ArcEuroTrade.

Honestly, this side of the Atlantic is crying out for a high quality operation like yours. Basing it in the Republic of Ireland would give you access to all of the EU and the UK too, to some extent.

Eh, what I know about running a profitable sales business could be put in a matchbox without removing the matches (that and an utter lack of entrepreneurial drive is is why I haven't done something similar ) so I daresay there are good reasons why this isn't as simple as a flight to Dublin to look for premesis and bit of effort but the longing ache whenever I see people talking about PM and its products hurts me deep inside! .

 

[davidpbest]

@qualitymachinetools

Dear God alive man! Will you please setup a branch in the UK (or at least the Republic of Ireland; it's an EU member).

Here in the UK, we have Warco who are at least a bit picky about which Chinese company they buy from but their customer service people, whilst getting an 'A' for effort, aren't generally technically knowledgeable as much as could be desired.

ArcEuroTrade are good guys and they do work closely with SEIG to provide a better QC of their products, but the fact that they have a "How to build your sketchily-pre-assembled-for-convenient-shipping-but not-fully-finished SEIG C3/SC3 kit" manual (okay, it's not called that, but effectively, that's what it is ) available for download tells you the limitations of the products they sell.

Amadeal are also nice chaps but the technical expertise isn't really there and they sell mostly the same level of kit as ArcEuroTrade.

Honestly, this side of the Atlantic is crying out for a high quality operation like yours. Basing it in the Republic of Ireland would give you access to all of the EU and the UK too, to some extent.

Eh, what I know about running a profitable sales business could be put in a matchbox without removing the matches (that and an utter lack of entrepreneurial drive is is why I haven't done something similar ) so I daresay there are good reasons why this isn't as simple as a flight to Dublin to look for premesis and bit of effort but the longing ache whenever I see people talking about PM and its products hurts me deep inside! .

Have you checked out RotaGripOnline.com ? I’m in the US but buy a lot of stuff from them in the UK. Significantly higher quality lines than ArcEuro.

 

[GrifterGuru]

@SouthernChap Yes, I too would like to see some PM Machines in the UK. We could do with a quality supplier to shake the tree and get rid of the "less than stellar" crop of options currently available. If I had the option of a PM machine versus the sieg, I would have gone with PM without even having to think about it.

I have dealt with Warco, Arc and Ad A Meal and have never had any problems though I agree, quality all-around could and should be better but sadly is not, such are the times we live in nowadays.

Anyhoosles, enough of me adding to the hijack.

@55fairlane @qualitymachinetools Any updates on the situation? Following the subject since it is showing how a problem such as this should be dealt with properly and professionally.

 

[qualitymachinetools]

Since I was asked for an update, we are swapping machines out, its going to take time to get the new one ready and all checked out, shipped and get the old one back.

There is no question that if there is a problem which is not reasonably fixable by the customer on site, we replace. There is no other way, people spend money and it should be right. Its that simple. And same goes for us, if we have something made that has a spec, it should be in spec. That simple. You think I want to spend time getting involved in things like this? Heck no. Not the easiest thing to ship a machine back and forth, but it is what it is, we can't make them a blow up design that folds up in to a USPS box.

Sometimes we ask a lot more questions than others, because there are a lot of people who see a post or a video, think they have a problem or get so obsessed they talk themselves in to thinking they have a problem, and we have to talk them off a ledge.

But when there is a problem, its handled. Many times it just takes a lot of elimination to see what or if there is something actually going on. Even if its not a problem, we certainly handle it, but have to explain a lot and bring them back down to reality. Some people get it, some people take one thing they read somewhere online as fact when many times its the opposite. There are a whole lot of online machinists out there who I don't think have ever actually made a part, that's for sure! But that goes for any kind of thing. Seems the more time they spend online giving advice, the less actual experience they have. There is a local guy I have known of for years who posts in Haas forums all the time with his "expert" advice. But he is a retired mechanic, not a machinist, and all he did was own one old clapped out Haas toolroom mill that he got from the local trade school that closed the machining program.

Above is nothing to do with this problem, if that angle place is accurate (Which after talking to OP I have no doubt that it is) then its obvious something is out. As I said earlier, I am really curious to see what happened here. Not like they just push something through inspection that does not meet spec with these, its a very careful process for each one and well documented. These people in Taiwan really do take things seriously. They really do get it. We also have probably 25 emails back and forth with the factory people, they also hate to hear that there is a problem. Not like they dump it on us and make it our problem, they work with us to fix things if they come up.

We ship many hundreds of this particular mill each year, and while its not 100% perfect, its about as close as it gets. Problems are very rare with this one. Overall they are rare with all of them, but some have more than others.

During production/assembly, they do fail initial tolerance inspections here and there but they correct them as they go through the process. Its all part of it. Like - this tolerance measured XX, that is out of spec, they scrape it in, replace something, or fix it however is appropriate, check again, etc.

Like the OP said, there was an obvious hit during shipping by the condition of the pallet, but thats not going to make the cast bend and stay there. Thats not my experience with cast iron and how it works.

Sorry, the above post got long. Probably too much info ha Long story short, machine getting swapped, I will check the old one when it gets back to see what the heck happened.


I've thought about the UK and other countries. But, its hard enough to handle a problem if its in the US or Canada, we would just be stretched too thin to handle it properly. Plus there we would have to keep up on all the different electrical, safety, whatever it is. Maybe taxes too, who knows. This mill is ours 100%, exclusively our machine, designed by us from casting molds to the motor. So we could possibly sell through an established company in another country, but they would have to take care of customers the way we want them to. We're growing fast enough here, really working to improve things day by day. It is hard to even think about expanding more at the moment.

 

[SouthernChap]

Have you checked out RotaGripOnline.com ? I’m in the US but buy a lot of stuff from them in the UK. Significantly higher quality lines than ArcEuro.

I've had some drills from them and was very happy. Good chaps.

But unless one wants a micro lathe or micro mill they're no use for mills or lathes.

Either that or I'm failing to navigate their site properly.

 

[GrifterGuru]

@qualitymachinetools Good to here it put like that. I too am curious as to what has caused the issue. Time will tell and it will be interesting to learn what it is.

 

[55fairlane]

@qualitymachinetools ok all , my milling machine has been palitized & is waiting for exchange with a new machine. Apparently Matthew himself is handling this issue.

As soon as I get the machine on the stand I will fully run (& document) the tests again, I will post results.

Has anyone here scraped there gibs in? I have heard (on a different, non machining fourm ) the gibs really need scraped in

 

[wrmiller]

Matt is good people. I've known him for years. He'll get this done for you.

 

[wrmiller]

@qualitymachinetools ok all , my milling machine has been palitized & is waiting for exchange with a new machine. Apparently Matthew himself is handling this issue.

As soon as I get the machine on the stand I will fully run (& document) the tests again, I will post results.

Has anyone here scraped there gibs in? I have heard (on a different, non machining fourm ) the gibs really need scraped in

I have always inspected the gibs on any new machine I buy. I check them, true them up when necessary and use a tool I have to 'scrape' in shallow divots into the surface for oil retention. But I'm no machinist, just a garage hack.

 

[Dhal22]

Return it?

My idea is looking more and more valid.