Thoughts on Mini-Lathes

[CraigH]

Nesse1,

Sounds like you found a nice machine.

Sometimes space is an issue for buyers.

 

[Smithdoor]

The 7x mini-lathe has now been available for quite some time - well over 20 years which is about when I bought my first - Homier 7x12. (A personal aside - after being lathe-less for a few years, I was going to get a 9x20, but got a good deal on a 7x16 and went that direction - poor decision.) BTW, does anyone really and truly know where the 7x mini-lathe was developed? By "7x mini-lathe" I mean the 7 inch, electronically controlled spindle speed, Chinese/Asian lathe as we know it. And not the Craftsman/Atlas 6x18, various watchmaker lathes, and etc. Neither Frank Hoose (mini-lathe.com) or Chris Wood (LMS) could provide authentic information in this regard.

Not much has really changed on 7x despite advertising hype. The only significant change is the brushless motor and the 4 inch spindle, and the latter, in certain size situation, is not best. The rest are just minor things of marginal significance. And, IMO, quality has not improved - perhaps a bit worse. Certainly my experience. Manufacturer inertia (a body at rest tends to stay at rest) provides that there will be no serious improvements. And I only refer to items that would not upset the 7x size platform or aftermarket support - such as bed rigidity (more bracing), headstock rigidity (and 4-bolt attachment - as I have done), and tailstock rigidity. I have always noticed that the tailstock is taller than its length - not a good formula.

But a true improvement would be a completely new bed with wider ways with dual V's, and much better bracing in the motor area. Some of the 8x lathes make some improvements in this area. The 8x lathes have been "received" into the mini-lathe definition. I am of two minds on that, but it is the current situation. The 8x lathes with the 1 3/8 inch (nominal) spindle through hole and 50% more weight really become a more capable machine. That is of course my opinion as one does not stop by Walmart to examine one.

I expect we all occasionally, or often, take on work that is larger than the designers of the mini-lathe had intended. And I paraphrase a statement by one wag that said; "A cantankerous, troublesome mini-lathe is better than no lathe at all". I must agree as I, quite some years ago, built a Sparey 5cc engine with my first 7x lathe - a Homier 7x12.

When look at mini lathes and different brands they look like came off the same product line then use different color and sticker just before boxing. Even boxing looks the same.

I want best price from Walmart.
I did look at Grizzly, HF , Vevor , LMS and others also look at Amazon. I went with because of returns. The lathe is great

Dave

 

[wrmiller]

Thank you for your comments on the SB1001, Bill.

I do recall this lathe on the Grizzly website and that it was initially quite expensive there. Not having a threading gear box at its introduction made my hesitant. But current web searches indicate it came down in price substantially to under $2,000 before being discontinued. I was not in the market at that time thought.

I just looked at the SB1001 manual. Its belt drive system is interesting if a bit complex. Just something to learn and use. Some components have a passing resemblance to Grizzly 10 inch lathes. Without looking up the weights, I think the SB1001 is closer the the Grizzly 10 inch than the Grizzly 9 inch.

I should think it is a rather quiet, smooth running machine and worth the price.

It is a very quiet and smooth running lathe. And quite accurate. It's not my old PM1340GT, but then I didn't have to pay 8k+ for it either. IIRC, I paid about 2400 for the little SB.

I customize/build/work on 1911/2011 type pistols, turning barrels, hardened pins, bushing cones, and compensators. The little SB is fine for that.

 

[Aaron_W]

That's pretty much what you get with one of the better importers of mini lathes but you also get to learn how to disassemble a lathe, learn how to lap the occasionally dubiously machined surfaces, learn how to measure the need for shim material and learn how to fit that material.

It's always a school day with a mini-lathe

Much the same can be said for buying a vintage lathe as well. I have only bought one vintage USA machine that did not need to be disassembled, and refitted. That is only because the prior owner had already done a full rebuild.

When in need, a buddy loaned me his Sherline, which stayed camped at my place for about a year. I made lots of fun parts with that tiny machine. When the time came to buy my own machine, I bought an 8x16. It's much heavier than the 7x lathes. The more I used it, the more its limitations presented itself, though. And I'm not talking limitations in terms of size, I'm talking about its crap build quality. Also, the lead screw was useless because it turned way too fast.

Honestly, if I had a do-over, I'd have made the jump straight to full size. I had a SB 9" years ago, and while it was worn out, it was 100x the machine of the small china machines. In the end, I found a Taiwan 12x36 in excellent shape for $1650. A much better value than trying to rebuild a POS china mini lathe.

My Sherline lathe and mill will be the last tools to leave my shop, and somebody else will have to remove them, because I will no longer be walking the earth.

 

[wrmiller]

Much the same can be said for buying a vintage lathe as well. I have only bought one vintage USA machine that did not need to be disassembled, and refitted. That is only because the prior owner had already done a full rebuild.



My Sherline lathe and mill will be the last tools to leave my shop, and somebody else will have to remove them, because I will no longer be walking the earth.

I built my first USPSA Open division 1911 on my little Sherline lathe and mill. This required lots, and lots (and lots) of patience and creativity. Then I realized I needed a larger mill and lathe. LOL...

 

[SouthernChap]

My issue is purely with the dime a dozen 7x14s all being too close to the fine line between usable and junk to be worth most people's time and money. They have no real rigidity, spindle strength and runout are usually just plain bad

I'm sorry but I have to take issue with this kind of talk.

This kind of hyperbole is one of the reasons people don't give sensible notes of caution against buying a mini-lathe as much credibility as they should.

The biggest determiner of whether any given instance of Chinese mini-lathe can be turned into something useful (it seems they're pretty much all unusable out of the box; there's a good reason ArcEuroTrade in the UK have guides on how to strip down, fettle, upgrade and adjust the Seig lathes they sell on their site) is the importer and whether they've paid enough to the factory in China for their imports, to do enough of a job on the QC.

Buy from a good importer and the lathe will have potential that can be realised. Buy from some rando on eBay or worse still Vevor (who seem to sell the rejects from Seig/Real Bull/Weiss) and there'll be trouble.

Of course, if buying new, people will be better off buying something larger from PM or maybe Warco but not everyone can afford those prices or fit a 10x22 (which obviously can't be put away after use). Also not everyone lives in the UK or US. Different regions have very different availability.

Okay there's secondhand; an ML7, an SB9 or one of the better Atlas fellas would do very well, but again you have the space requirements (maybe one of the Unimat Compact lathes might be a possibility, though) and for a beginner, assessing a secondhand lathe can feel intimidating. Plus there's that regional thing again. I suspect Myford and Southbend lathes, for example, are pretty scarce in say, oh, Latvia or Brazil.

This is why, when talking about the Chinese mini-lathe, to best serve beginners looking for lathe purchasing advice, those who do have experience ought to take seriously any constraints that the beginner thinks they have (that aren't obviously and definitely the result of any misapprehension).

So, whilst maybe guiding them to something like a new 10x22 or decent secondhand old iron, people offering first lathe purchase advice might need to accept that a mini-lathe could actually be the best fit for a given beginner, at that point in time.

In which case, the best help would be to make that beginner aware of the best options for a mini-lathe the market has to offer. Also, and just as importantly, making them aware that there will likely be a fair bit of improvement and tidying work to be done on their new mini-lathe before they can start making chips.

So to sum up:

• Avoid hyperbole or vague words like "junk", "garbage" or "crappy".
• Take seriously, and respect the constraints the person asking for advice, says they have.
• Offer region-appropriate advice.
• Steer the beginner to the most rigid, size capable lathe that their constraints can aaccommodate.
• And if the above turns out to be a mini-lathe, don't give up but try to suggest an importer that has decent quality standards.

 

[SouthernChap]

trying to rebuild a POS china mini lathe.

I refer the honourable gentleman to the reply I made earlier.

 

[dabear3428]

there are a lot of upgrades in this area, the newer ELS equipped lathes the 8.3/8.7 swings all the way out to 32" between centers.
these are heavier and more powerful. i recently bought a MX-600A off of ebay, i was not expecting a PM or even grizzly lathe i was expecting an assembled box of lathe like parts that i could tinker with and have fun while i decided what i wanted in a larger lathe.

MX-600A 9"x24" mini lathe

well i bit the bullet and bought a MX-600A (1100w brushless 8.7X23.6 with a F/R H/M/L gearbox and a 1.5" spindle bore, shipps with a steady rest, a follow rest and a dead center) off of e-bay, after getting it and turning some steel (does a decent job IMO). I got this expecting a box of lathe...

www.hobby-machinist.com

i was pleasantly suppressed by the fit and finish (still not a PM or Grizzly) and it is powerful enough with an 1100W brushless motor. It is not rigid by any stretch of the imagination, but i have not bolted it down yet.

 

[GrifterGuru]

i recently bought a MX-600A off of ebay

Sounds like & Looks like a Crenex model number. Even more so if it is painted battleship grey.

 

[dabear3428]

Sounds like & Looks like a Crenex model number. Even more so if it is painted battleship grey.

Creworks? that is the manufacturers name, yes very battleship grey