Face mill recommendations?

[davidpbest]

I'm considering the 2.5" HS6NP as well on a Bridgeport. What insert type are you using most? I'd like to avoid stocking many types. I'll mostly be using this for squaring stock and finish passes. I usually work with mild steels like 1018 or 304 stainless and aluminum. I was considering the polished HN25 even though it's speced for aluminum. I figured the low hours I put on the tool would likely have them hold up well.

Does the tool come with insert screws? I see HAAS sells them.

Yes, the Haas face mills come with insert screws. I would not recommend using the inserts designated for aluminum on 304. 304 is a difficult material to begin with because it's so sticky and will work harden if you don't take aggressive enough cuts.

Here is a video of the 2" face mill with rectangular inserts cutting 304 stainless using the HMP20 inserts designated for stainless. RPM is 625, DOC is .187", WOC is 3/8". Feed rates increase during the cut from 3 to 6 to 9, then 12 inches/minute. Best results were at 12 IPM, but at this DOC and WOC, it was pushing the rigidity limits of my PM-935.

https://flic.kr/p/2kBtvoF

 

[Ianagos]

The haas face mills were great for $99 for the whole kit which a lot of us got them for.

For a low budget I still recommend a facemill from maritool as the inserts are a standard size and can be obtained from China for cheap. The haas facemills have nice thick inserts but I’ll tell you I’ve never broken an insert on one of the smaller I’ve only chipped the edge which I’ve also done on the haas facemill.

The haas tools are just more expensive to run but not bad tools at all. They are also imported from China.

In my opinion the haas tooling are really meant for a large cnc. Here is a short video using haas recommended speeds and feeds. This is pushing about 10hp in spindle load on a 22hp machine with a 2:1 gearbox. That was really a light cut for what these tools are meant for I could easily take the same cut with a apkt facemill and appropriate inserts.

2” rectangular insert facemill

Edit if anybody needs some apkt face I’ll inserts for aluminum pm me. I can get you guys some lightly used name brand ones (we replace them early at a company I do work for)

 

[macmccaskie]

The haas face mills were great for $99 for the whole kit which a lot of us got them for.

For a low budget I still recommend a facemill from maritool as the inserts are a standard size and can be obtained from China for cheap. The haas facemills have nice thick inserts but I’ll tell you I’ve never broken an insert on one of the smaller I’ve only chipped the edge which I’ve also done on the haas facemill.

Thanks, you just saved me some cash. I really was hesitant to go HAAS because they didn't really mention much about home shop machines much less cater to them - I don't blame them - there will be better business doing what they already do. The other brands I checked were either WAY expensive or looked "import knock-off" with no mention of feeds and speeds, at least the MariTool professes precision and the mill heads are branded - and appear to have versions and documentation.

If I came along at the right time to get the kit for $100 bucks I might be more inclined to take the risk. FWIW: my cursory search for (steel) inserts didn't turn up anything exciting, except one guy sell used ones 8-0

 

[poorboy]

I recommended the square shoulder Haas because of the deeper cut and higher rate of material removal, but you can also go with a 45 degree shoulder type with the insert seat pocket more vertical as opposed to significantly positive. Also want to look at the number of cutting edges per insert as that will effect time before replacement/costs. You are limited by the rigidity and Hp, but you should be able to spin a 2.5" head w/o difficulty. The 833T (assuming gear head) should have plenty of power due to it's geared head) where the 833TV might have some more difficulty in steel. Aluminum you can definitely dial up both RPM and feed, and benefits from a more positive rake pocket. I was just impressed with the Haas in steel, the finish was great and very little vibration. The arbor for the face mill is a function of the size face mill, I have been using the Sowa shell arbors which are reasonably priced and well made. Please note that you may need to buy a different mounting bolt for the Haas face mills, as they use ones with a smaller bolt head then provided with the arbor. You could also use a rougher like a 3/4 or 7/8" and hog out a lot of material and then come back with a face mill for final finish.

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There are a multitude of factors as to how a face mill will perform so one can generalize, but it does not account how an individual face mill will perform and the type of insert used. That being the case, I get very good finishes with all the different face mills I use, and part of this has to do with the design/accuracy of the head and the inserts. There have been a number of issues with some of the generic types having different insert heights with poor finish. I run a 4" face mill for final finishing and the inserts can be setup for either ferrous or non-ferrous materials, since they are positive rake they cannot be flipped, but have 8 cutting edges. DOC is probably limited to around 0.050", this is around 2800 RPM, feed of 10-12 IPM in 7075, mill is 3 Hp and not breaking a sweat. So there are a number of choices, they will all work reasonably well given you are not looking at maximum material removal rates.
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@mksj can you please let me know the part number of the R8 shell mill holder and arbor screw that you have used here (I am assuming that it is the HOP, 4" Diameter Shell Mill w/1-1/2" Pilot Bore) ?

Thank you

Adam

 

[davidpbest]

@mksj can you please let me know the part number of the R8 shell mill holder and arbor screw that you have used here (I am assuming that it is the HOP, 4" Diameter Shell Mill w/1-1/2" Pilot Bore) ?

Thank you

Adam

Details are in the attached document. Mark and I both use the Sowa shell mill arbors.

 

[poorboy]

Details are in the attached document. Mark and I both use the Sowa shell mill arbors.

Thank you David. One quick question - what about the arbor screw ? Will it come with the R8 arbor ? This is for the 4" face mill.

 

[davidpbest]

The SOWA arbors do come with an arbor screw, but as my writeup says about the Haas face mills: “All versions except the 4" version require a custom sized arbor bolt available from Haas (shown with hot-link in the table below).” I updated the tables in the writeup to have hot-links (blue underlined text) to each face mill and the SOWA arbor and the required arbor bolt if a special version is required. Download the writeup again, then click on the blue hot-link and it will take you to the product page where you can see specs and purchase.

 

[poorboy]

Thank you - I missed the part about "4" version do not require a custom sized arbor bolt available from Haas"

Adam

 

[davidpbest]

Thank you - I missed the part about "4" version require a custom sized arbor bolt available from Haas"

Adam

The 4” versions do NOT require a special arbor bolt. The other smaller-sized face mills DO require the Haas specific bolt.

 

[poorboy]

The 4” versions do NOT require a special arbor bolt. The other smaller-sized face mills DO require the Haas specific bolt.

Yes I mis-typed .. corrected the original post now. Everything has now been ordered. Thank you for your help.