D-bit Tool Cutter Grinder R8 to 5C work head conversion

[petertha]

I've been watching a lot of TCG YouTube content & its amazing the variation in usage. I guess on one hand that possibly speaks to the flexibility of the D-bit style machine. Or maybe another perspective is that not all methods are awesome.

The Vee drill holder accessory included with my kit is not pretty from any angle. I've seen some people toss it aside, others modify, others rebuild from scratch using better drill retention & orientation clamps. As best I can figure this jig is meant to grind the classic edge where the cone relieves back continuously via the jig swiveling on its axle in the collet. But I think it could also rock laterally across the ways of desired? So that Vee jig would accommodate variable drill diameters & therefore not confined to matching collets. Stefan shows a drill held in collet with the 4-facet method stroking across the wheel (only) no rotational component other than to repeat operation at 180-deg. So this would require matching collets.

Toolmaker51 I've looked around for R8 collet blocks in the past. They are not abundant the way 5C & R8 are. They could be made. the bigger question is then what? I could maybe remove the collet work head & mount to a different/dedicated tooling block like the one they offer for lathe tools & what not. The good thing is the dovetails would lend themselves to tool block retention. Not sure how that would help hold incremental dill sizing. I was thinking something like a precision mini chuck. But that might have the same sickout issues as ER & be even more limited to length.

I'm sure there is a solution in here somewhere & once I get going on it things will become more apparent. The decision meter is still tilting slightly to 5C though.

I'm also getting a vibe that there are different quality builds to these not necessarily reflected in pictures. The U2 style Stefan.G has & the Shars U2 that Rob Renzetti has looks better than mine in may regards. And I'm not talking about their replaced parts & overclocking features. The Shars has nice rotation shafts for the work heads, mine are meaty chunks of blacksmith iron. Rob.R mentioned the Grizzly (Taiwan?) is an upscale version of his (Chinese) but 2-3x the cost. I assumed all Chinese TCG's were probably the same, but I now have my doubts.

Before I go too far, I did some searching on forum but surprisingly there isn't really a lot of posts & chatter on these TCG's which surprised me. Am I missing some forum areas where these are discussed in more detail? Happy to start something & can post the YouTube links etc. I've collected. Would be happy to hear how others are getting on with theirs.

 

[petertha]

Stefan 4 facet grind.

 

[Toolmaker51]

Somehow 'that' C word has been dropped from certain posts I submit.
Well, I submit quality control, quality management and quality checks aren't the same, nor electives in manufacturing.
Products from one area of one continent has nothing on their offshore competition, aside from copious over production.

 

[Larry$]

There is a youtuber from Australia that has done some good mods to a D bit grinder. His corner rounding one is very nice. I'm too lazy to make it and just eyeball and free hand for close enough.
These contraptions can do OK work but are not tool & cutter grinders. Their small working area is often limiting.
Figuring out how to do setups can be a challenge also.

 

[petertha]

Maybe you are thinking of Projects Down Under?
Once I think I've scraped most of the video links, maybe I'll organize into pdf & upload. Aside from Rob.R & Stefan.G there's also Tool & Die Guy, Blondihacks, Woods Creek, Dave.M.... many international. Some are Deckel rebuilds but insightful as to the innards & root machine basis.

I'll drop one here pertaining to the drill jig by Luc Wybo. A bit hard to follow but I think there is some thought put into the drill jig fixturing geometry.

 

[petertha]

Different machine obviously (and big-asz drill) but I like how the drill is set once in a symmetrical box holder

 

[brino]

I am following along.
Thanks for all the info and links.

I have wanted one of these for years, but never found one with all the features I wanted for a price I was willing to pay.
The biggest feature being 5C collet compatible.

By the way Grizzly has discontinued theirs:
https://www.grizzly.com/products/grizzly-tool-and-die-grinder/g0687
but still appear to have some of the accessories available.

Brian

 

[petertha]

Interesting about Grizzly. A place here in Canada sells what I think is the Taiwan version with U collets. When I checked a few years ago it was like $2700 CDN ~2000 USD. I've never seen one in the flesh so cant speak to build quality.

https://bauerltd.ca/grinders-u2

Looks like Taiwan machines are still produced, suspect like most machines, available under different distributer labels & paint schemes.

U2

www.imachine.com.tw

VERTEX U2 Universal Cutter Grinder | VERTEX MACHINERY WORKS CO., LTD.

Find Details about VERTEX U2 Universal Cutter Grinder from Taiwan Tool & Cutter Grinder supplier-VERTEX MACHINERY WORKS CO., LTD. Source on Taiwantrade.

1twvertexvise.en.taiwantrade.com

And then there's Cuttermaster. Guessing premium but it will set your credit card on fire

Search Results

Search Results

accusizetools.com

 

[Lucas E]

Ive heard there are a lot of different varieties with the d-bit clone grinders. Some of them have different spindle tapers, etc. I would be very surprised if the shars head bolts right on without modification.

That being said. I have the shars universal grinder. It is probably the highest quality machine tool I've ever seen from China. I would buy it again. You're probably best off just selling your current unit and buying the shars. They run 15% off sales once or twice a year. I bought mine during the black Friday sale end of last year. The machine is actually a very good price for all the attachments it comes with, but shipping adds hundreds of dollars. I was able to get the shipping down by haven't them ship to a local Fed ex distribution center and I drove down to pick it up. It was on a small pallet and they loaded it into my truck with a forklift.

One final thing, does your 5c collet set have internal threads? The shars 5c head uses the internal threads to pull in the collet, so if your collets aren't threaded internally they won't work.

 

[petertha]

All good points Lucas. Yes my 5C collet set has inside threads, I was aware of that aspect.
I'm kind of at a crossroads. Selling the Accusize & applying proceeds to a Shars has crossed my mind. Seeing some of the general external fit & finish of mine has me wondering what is under the hood. I'm personally convinced there are quality gradations among the manufacturers even though they originate from the same country. Unfortunately these TCGs are kind of heavy buggers to ship (to Canada). I do have means but the transport cost starts getting up there.