A few questions on new mill purchase

[dado5]

i went to an auction this weekend with 4 birdgeport sized knee mills. There was a Bridgeport, xlo, kondia and jet. I liked the excello the best but it seemed pretty beat up to me and I did not want to open that can of worms. When I came home I was thinking that I have never even run a mill! I really am thinking about getting a smaller bench type machine to learn on and keep my eye out for an older Bridgeport style machine. If I eventually get a larger machine maybe I can convert the bench mill to cnc. Is there a limit on size of bench mill to convert to cnc, or a tipping point of when it gets too expensive, etc..? Will a larger bench type mill such as a pm940 be close enough to a Bridgeport that I wont even want to look at them? I really don't have a clue since I have never run one before. Anyone in central Pa have one they want to show me?

 

[tweinke]

My advise would be to get the largest mill you can fit in your shop and budget. I think the PM 940 would be big enough to not outgrow very quick. Table size wise its about Bridgeport size.

 

[mksj]

The 940 should give you similar working scope to something like a 3/4 knee, so 835/935. The 833 gives up about 1" in the Y axis, and I still feel it is one of the best options in a bench top style mill. A bench top is a more manageable weight if that is an issue. So work envelope wise, I think they all will work well and you will not need to be too concerned about taking baby cuts of a smaller mill. Having had both a medium size bench top and a full size knee, there is no substitute for weight. But both will chew through metal with no issues. If you are just starting out, then used iron can often be a Pandora's box of mysteries, unless you have the experience to know what you are getting into and you have the time to rebuild it (which can be a bit of a nightmare once you get into it). When I was transitioning from a bench style mill to a full size knee, I looked at the used market, and something like a working Lagun mill in decent condition was 3-4K. Most had a few issues which would have added maybe another 1K to the pot. At the end of the day, for not much more I could buy a new knee mill. So I went with a new knew knee mill, I didn't want to spend the time rebuilding and sourcing parts (which add up quickly). It is just a matter of preference, budget and finding a decent used machine if you go that route.

So for someone new to the game without the experience and knowing what to look for and really what you want, then you can get bitten in the used market. I recommend buying new, and having a warranty. Just a matter of opinion, I have seen many hobbyist spend months rebuilding machines to pristine shape, and they enjoy the process. My hat is off to those that have the ability and patience to do so.

If you just want to learn and be able to mill out of the box, then I would look at the 833, 835, 935 or full size mill in that order of increasing price. There are also a lot of excellent full size knee mills in the 5-6K range, I went with a 9x42 knee because it fit my space needs. I did a lot of projects on my bench top mill, but the knee mill brings it up to the next level. I was fortunate to have a fellow hobbyist help me thought the decision/purchase process, otherwise I would have not been able to move the knee mill to my house.

 

[assaulter]

I've seen several endorsements on the new 833. I was looking hard at that one. Is the 1500 max rpm a big drawback?

 

[richl]

I've seen several endorsements on the new 833. I was looking hard at that one. Is the 1500 max rpm a big drawback?

If you are machining mostly steel, it would be ok, aluminium with smaller cutters would require higher speeds. I never noticed that, would not be on my list of desirable features

Dado... something to consider, just something I went thru and may help you.
2003 I purchased an older south bend mill a 9x42 1800 lbs machine. I thought as a novice machinist but someone who has been around machines of all types most of my adult life, I felt it might not be too hard a learning experience with just the machine equipment aspect of hobby machining. I don't have any support around here to fall back on, I figure it out myself, or get info from this or other forums... in a nutshell, the first couple years was a huge learning curve, figuring what was me, and what was the machines fault. Chasing things I thought were wrong, learning to dial in and adjust the machine. Fixing stuff, adjusting, buying tooling and cutters appropriate for the machine... not fun. I'm glad I went thru it and I understand better what i am doing. I know better how to ask questions in order to get back information, or help. That was a biggie.

New machines are a bit easier, not perfect, but a bit easier, you have a distributor to ask questions, you have YouTube to get info on your machine, you have lots of info on this and other forums... I bought a nearly 60 year old machine, a bit of an orphan, it's cool, does anything I can figure out how to do, solid, unique (Not many of these puppies around), but if something goes wrong, you have to figure out how to do it yourself, there is no one around to get any info from...

If you can afford it by new, or at least a used current model, something supported by a company like grizzly or precision Mathews. If you think you will enjoy this hobby, buy big and heavy. Knees and rams are wonderful, hp as much as you can.

Have fun, enjoy the ride.

Btw, as for pm940, looking to get one for cnc conversion myself, I think it will complement the manual mill just fine. Look at the hardened ways upgrade if you plan on going cnc

 

[dado5]

Ok still trying to figure out what to do, but my projects waiting for a mill are piling up!! Is there any downsize to a knee mill if I have plenty of space and am willing to spend the money? I may be giving up on my search for the bridgeport in good shape and am now thinking of a PM935TV or the like. Would I ever regret not having a bench mill (can't imagine I would)? I don't want to buy twice.

 

[richl]

Others will probably confirm, there is nothing I can think of my knee mill can not do that a bench mill would do better. That said, I am looking to add a pm940 bench mill to convert to cnc... but that is about manual to cnc differences. Ram head and knee makes a wonderful machine if you have the room and can swing the money for it.

Just my opinion

 

[Asm109]

A knee mill is a real mill. A bench mill is a drill press with good spindle bearings and a drawbar. You will never regret buying a knee mill.
Pay once. Cry once.

 

[richl]

I certainly would not want to stop you from putting money in precision Mathews hands, https://danville.craigslist.org/search/sss?query=milling+machine
I don't know how close you are to any of these machines, you could save yourself some money and get a nice increase in machine by some of the machines listed here... and the added benefit of tooling many times...
Just saying

 

[fradish]

I know you've mentioned the PM25 but have you looked at the PM727V? The speed range on that
is 40-3000rpm. I have the manual version of that mill with a much lower rpm range, but I'm pretty
happy with it regardless. Had the variable speed version been available when I bought mine I would
have gotten it...