1966 Brown & Sharpe 618 Micromaster spindle repair (pic heavy)

[Janderso]

Look at page G 3 - I found a manual that shows the headstock gib adjusters. They call them a gib, but it's not the typical tapered gin.

http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/2185/23934.pdf

Richard,
In the parts print (part #17) is called a felt wick.
I’m familiar with felt wicks and their use. However in this application I am completely baffled.
There is a wick in the hole shown. There are no moving parts in this housing. The bore has no hole to allow for any lubricant to pass from the wick.
Any ideas?

As a side note, the pulley that is mounted to the spindle has a set screw and a lock screw.
Upon disassembly I noticed the outer lock screw was missing.
In the manual, they say to be sure to install the lock screw for proper balance. I thought this was interesting

 

[Richard King 2]

All I can think it is - An air breather vent of some kind and the wick is to keep the grinding grit out. At first I thought it was a drain hole, but it looks like it's on the top Did you get some new bearings?

 

[Cadillac]

I have to thank you Jeff. After reading your thread it sparked me to look for bearings again for my Boyer Shultze spindle. I lucked out and found NOS Bardens on eBay. When I got the machine I ripped it down and went through everything. At the time I cleaned and regreased the spindle with some kluber.
What caused you to investigate your spindle. Your finishes seemed good was their a problem. I have been chasing my tail to get pristine finishes. I can’t seem to get rid of ripples which you don’t see until I use my precision stones then they appear. I hope the bearings take care of it. Good luck on your rebuild!

 

[Richard King 2]

I have to thank you Jeff. After reading your thread it sparked me to look for bearings again for my Boyer Shultze spindle. I lucked out and found NOS Bardens on eBay. When I got the machine I ripped it down and went through everything. At the time I cleaned and regreased the spindle with some kluber.
What caused you to investigate your spindle. Your finishes seemed good was their a problem. I have been chasing my tail to get pristine finishes. I can’t seem to get rid of ripples which you don’t see until I use my precision stones then they appear. I hope the bearings take care of it. Good luck on your rebuild!

I suspect your not dressing your wheel right. Burnishing it and the wheel is bouncing. Or your wheel is to fine and it dulls fast. Have you bought a a new diamond dresser as they do get dull after years of use, especially if the operator never turned it when using it. , checked the block it fits into. You may want to make a new block or check it for burrs and the diamond is locked into it with a tight set screw. Next time you dress the wheel, drop down .002" and dress it fast and stop. don't keep moving the diamond back and forth until you don't hear it touching, that dulls the wheel. Use a 46 grit wheel. Check with bluing the fit of the wheel tapered adapter and the spindle taper. Have to be a detective. I found this Do-All manual with a few tips when you get bad grinds. It's not a Boyer Shultz, but the principals are the same. I looked at several of the Boyer Shultz books on Vintage Machinery, but could not find a troubleshooting page.

Take a look at page 44. I has a troubleshooting page of grinding issues.

http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/256/26909.pdf

 

[Janderso]

I suspect your not dressing your wheel right. Burnishing it and the wheel is bouncing. Or your wheel is to fine and it dulls fast. Have you bought a a new diamond dresser as they do get dull after years of use, especially if the operator never turned it when using it. , checked the block it fits into. You may want to make a new block or check it for burrs and the diamond is locked into it with a tight set screw. Next time you dress the wheel, drop down .002" and dress it fast and stop. don't keep moving the diamond back and forth until you don't hear it touching, that dulls the wheel. Use a 46 grit wheel. Check with bluing the fit of the wheel tapered adapter and the spindle taper. Have to be a detective. I found this Do-All manual with a few tips when you get bad grinds. It's not a Boyer Shultz, but the principals are the same. I looked at several of the Boyer Shultz books on Vintage Machinery, but could not find a troubleshooting page.

Take a look at page 44. I has a troubleshooting page of grinding issues.

http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/256/26909.pdf

Richard,
Yes, I received the bearings today. I followed Craig’s suggestions as to how to clean, dry and pack the bearings.
Also, the directions say to line up the arrows 180 degrees. I did. See pic.

I assembled the spindle. Piece of cake!!
I couldn’t be more pleased. The spindle is smooth and quiet.

Not sure about preload, I did have to fine tune where the spindle floats in the housing. By this I mean, I noticed there was some scraping noise, I loosened the front nose piece a bit and tightened the rear. This took care of the scraping. I guess it was rubbing on the housing as it was too deep if that makes sense.
See pic, I now have zero runout reading, well maybe .0001” When I lift up on the taper now, I get .0008”. Vs. .003” before.

I’ll run it and recheck for heat, looseness, noise? I can’t check for end play accurately without mounting the unit.
I think turn it on then shut it off. Check end play and runout as I go along. Surely there is some break in?

Again, you saved my butt sir.
Thank you, thank you, thank you!!!

 

[Janderso]

I have to thank you Jeff. After reading your thread it sparked me to look for bearings again for my Boyer Shultze spindle. I lucked out and found NOS Bardens on eBay. When I got the machine I ripped it down and went through everything. At the time I cleaned and regreased the spindle with some kluber.
What caused you to investigate your spindle. Your finishes seemed good was their a problem. I have been chasing my tail to get pristine finishes. I can’t seem to get rid of ripples which you don’t see until I use my precision stones then they appear. I hope the bearings take care of it. Good luck on your rebuild!

The reason I pulled the spindle was due to the bearing noise. I assumed it was the motor but when I removed the o rings and spun it the noise was the same.
Regarding grind quality, like Richard said, I am probably inconsistent with my dressing skills and I probably use the wrong wheel at times.
I do know that when I’m grinding hardened parts and I dress properly, and I happen to use the right wheel I get a beautiful finish. I’m looking forward to using the SG now that I hve new bearings and I’m going to get rid of my dull, rounded off dressers and replace them.
Grinding is an art with many tricks.
Us hobby guys are at a real disadvantage.
Grinder hands that do this for a living know the quirks of the trade.

 

[Janderso]

I have to thank you Jeff. After reading your thread it sparked me to look for bearings again for my Boyer Shultze spindle. I lucked out and found NOS Bardens on eBay. When I got the machine I ripped it down and went through everything. At the time I cleaned and regreased the spindle with some kluber.
What caused you to investigate your spindle. Your finishes seemed good was their a problem. I have been chasing my tail to get pristine finishes. I can’t seem to get rid of ripples which you don’t see until I use my precision stones then they appear. I hope the bearings take care of it. Good luck on your rebuild!

I should add, I read somewhere the visible ripples can measure about .0001”. Edit- the Do-all manual Richard referenced, says the naked eye can see ripples that measure .00001”. Not .0001” as I stated.
I believe that’s why they say to run the spark out process until there is no more material coming off.
I can visualize each pass taking off the high points of the ripples.

 

[Richard King 2]

How much were the bearings? Grease ?

Many people are afraid to do it yourself - Like I have said for years "machine Rebuilding and scraping is easy IF you have a pro help you"
You learned to scrape in a week, now you know how to rebuild a precision spindle.
Next time someone in here wants to repair / rebuild a spindle pass on what we taught you.

If you don't have an infrared thermometer to check the temp run it until it gets hot to touch, shut if off and let it cool down to warm, run it again, repeat until it doesn't get hot. 140 F is the max it should not reach. Once you get the headstock back in the column then mount the mag base on the outside of the spindle housing and put the indicator on the end of the spindle and push or pry with a 2 x 4 to check the thrust.

Good Job!! Be sure to call or write Craig and thanks him. I told him the other day when I retire to the scraping school in the sky, he can teach the classes. Rich

 

[Janderso]

How much were the bearings? Grease ?

Many people are afraid to do it yourself - Like I have said for years "machine Rebuilding and scraping is easy IF you have a pro help you"
You learned to scrape in a week, now you know how to rebuild a precision spindle.
Next time someone in here wants to repair / rebuild a spindle pass on what we taught you.

If you don't have an infrared thermometer to check the temp run it until it gets hot to touch, shut if off and let it cool down to warm, run it again, repeat until it doesn't get hot. 140 F is the max it should not reach. Once you get the headstock back in the column then mount the mag base on the outside of the spindle housing and put the indicator on the end of the spindle and push or pry with a 2 x 4 to check the thrust.

Good Job!! Be sure to call or write Craig and thanks him. I told him the other day when I retire to the scraping school in the sky, he can teach the classes. Rich

I highly recommend Bearing Brokers Inc.
The bearings were $103.89 each!!
Not $685 each which was quoted to me by the company that purchased Brown & Sharpe.
I’m good with NSK, Made in Japan.

Good information on the break in process Richard. I don’t have an infrared thermometer but now I have a reason to own one

 

[Janderso]

All I can think it is - An air breather vent of some kind and the wick is to keep the grinding grit out. At first I thought it was a drain hole, but it looks like it's on the top Did you get some new bearings?

I put some oil on the felt yesterday. Today I found oil coming out of the spindle housing. I think a vent hole and a way of keeping the sleeve, #18 in the breakdown, from locking up or rusting to the housing.