Need info on a good oxy/acteylene set up for brazing

[helmbelly]

Strike 1, Uniweld adaptor $40 on ebay apiece. Strike 2 NAPA looks good but not in stock except Oklahoma and does it sell one with a LH thread? -with shipping $20 delivering next week. Strike 3 Amazon - base hit- $20 be here tomorrow, one of them is LH thread, I can feel it!

 

[epanzella]

Please do not take the following the wrong way but, I am a bit sinsitive to the terminologies used, they really do have meaning in the real world.

I get your point; but, you continue to use 200CF which means very little, If you want 200SCF of gas the actual size of the cylinder will vary based upon the cylinder pressure and gas.

Please note, in the industrial gas world which includes welding cylinders that:
ACF sometimes refered to as water volume stands for "Actual Cubic Foot" which is the physical internal volume of the vessel/tube/cylinder/bottle.
SCF is the uncompressed volume of a compressible fluid such as Oxygen and stands for "Standard Cubic Foot"; therefore, 200 SCF will compress into a small ACF but it is still 200 SCF.

A large cylinder is a 3AA-2400 which is 9" OD x 55" tall and it has a water volume of 1.7ACF +/-, with Oxygen that cylinder at 2400 PSI will hold 174.92 SCF per ACF or a total of 297.36 SCF. As a comparison the same cylinder same pressure full of Nitrogen is 159.48 SCF per ACF or 271.12 SCF total cylinder volume. Now, if you can find a cylinder of this ACF in a 3500 PSI full of Nitrogen is 220.263 SCF per foot or 374.45 SCF total cylinder volume.

With all of that said, the 3AA-2400 cylinder is a fairly large welding bottle and expensive for what a hobbiest needs, the 3AA-2265 is the bottle(s) that I have and I think you are talking about, this bottles full pressure is 2265 PSI at 1.3 ACF +/-, with Oxygen that cylinder will hold 163.99. SCF per ACF or a total volume of 213.2 SCF and is common and inexpensive relativly speaking.

Just as a side note for those who actually read all of this, Compressors use CFM "Cubic Feet Per Minute" to tell us how much SCF of volume they move, not a true volume of storage, the compressor tanks or recievers are typically rated in gallons which is uncompressed volume (water volume) which means a 15 gallon reciever is actually 2 ACF and at 120 PSI holds 7.928 SCF per ACF or 15.86 ACF total; so, A little more than 1 SCF per gallon....

You sound like a solution in search of a problem. Go to any welding supply and ask for cylinders north of 200 cf and you'll likely get tanks similar to what I have. They have served me well for 30 years. I don't think you'll be required to give the counter guy the formula for unobtanium to get what you need.

 

[verbotenwhisky]

You sound like a solution in search of a problem. Go to any welding supply and ask for cylinders north of 200 cf and you'll likely get tanks similar to what I have. They have served me well for 30 years. I don't think you'll be required to give the counter guy the formula for unobtanium to get what you need.

In slang terms this is a 64.2 CF tube (64.2 ACF) this is smaller than you are recommending by 135.8 CF, and this one is 24"OD and 25'-0" Long.


Just say'in....

 

[epanzella]

Got it. Open outer doors. Load tubes one and two. BTW, where do I get a 25 foot by 2 foot acetylene tank that only yields 64cf. ? My supply house is fresh out and I need one for my next job.

 

[verbotenwhisky]

Got it. Open outer doors. Load tubes one and two. BTW, where do I get a 25 foot by 2 foot acetylene tank that only yields 64cf. ? My supply house is fresh out and I need one for my next job.

Acetylene is a different creature, this would work with Oxygen though and it can be purchased from a number of places, CPI, Weldship, CCH Equipment, FIBA, etc.... You can get them manifolded together and have multiples and they make them even larger....

My original point stands, there is terminology that is used for this stuff and I try to use it, you be you, I am certain the guy in the welding supply will know you are not wanting to buy his charging vessels and it'll give those guys something to laugh about later, you know once you walk out the door.

 

[epanzella]

Acetylene is a different creature, this would work with Oxygen though and it can be purchased from a number of places, CPI, Weldship, CCH Equipment, FIBA, etc.... You can get them manifolded together and have multiples and they make them even larger....

My original point stands, there is terminology that is used for this stuff and I try to use it, you be you, I am certain the guy in the welding supply will know you are not wanting to buy his charging vessels and it'll give those guys something to laugh about later, you know once you walk out the door.

If I try spouting the above jiberish they'll be laughing long before I get out the door. They'll likely show me the door. They deal with real people doing real jobs every day. People trying to make simple things complicated tend to irritate working stiffs.

 

[verbotenwhisky]

Yeah, your right, what was I thinking.

 

[RaisedByWolves]

I'm starting to lean towards oxy propane from what I'm hearing y'all. It's puts out 6000F, much less expensive and for brazing - seems like it will work well

The problem I have with this is that propane bottles are cumbersome and much thinner walled than acetylene bottles.

You're not referring to anything I said but I'll chime in anyway. I think what was meant is that buying used bottles from an individual is cheaper than buying new bottles from a gas supplier. And they (hopefully) come with the bonus of already having some gas in them - whatever is left over from the previous owner. And/or it could have referred to bottle rental; owning your own bottles and refilling them makes way more sense for a hobbyist or small scale production than renting. Renting only makes sense for high volume production and even then, I think it is less a cost saving mechanism and more a case of "how can I make this situation more manageable?"

Let me clue you into some inside information, and I’m going to preface this by saying my bottles have the “customer owned” ring on the top. I like it this way incase I need to sell or my heirs need to sell as it will cause less confusion(?) for the seller and buyer as this idea of ownership is greatly misunderstood.

No individual “owns” and high pressure vessel save for scuba tanks, or industrial applications, and you really don’t want to.

Bottles need inspection periodically and if “your bottle” doesn’t pass they won’t fill it and you likely won’t get it back, yet you may be charged for the inspection and handling.

Now that is all hypothetical as like I said, you don’t own the bottle, nor do you want to.

The cost of the inspection and handling is baked into the price in any case. The he idea of owning the bottle is due to the fact that you can “buy”one and have it filled, but this is merely a cosmetic issue and a “ thought” of ownership.

I don’t want my bottles filled as it takes too much time and too many trips. I want an exchange for a like bottle with the CO ring on it, but that is mostly due to not wanting scabby looking gear all around my garage. If they don’t have one with the ring it’s no big deal as long as it’s a decent looking bottle.

Pride of ownership of you will.

 

[RaisedByWolves]

Yeah my Acet tank is 200 um, (is Verboten listening?) well it's 200 somethings. Not CFMs! $25 to fill it. I think it was $15 for the air tank which is bigger. The guy said I'd prob go thru 2 air tanks to every 1 Acet, almost like they thought about it. If they'd thought a little longer seems like they'd make the Acet twice as big and save me a trip. I'm curious how long a 200 somethings of Acet lasts for brazing. If I get a couple hours of use I'll be happy. Good steer John Thanks again

They actually did, the issue is with the package you bought. Not that there is anything wrong with it, it’s just sized to fit conveniently in a small space so you sacrifice capacity.


I started with that set 25yrs ago, and once I started buying bigger is when the ox/acet came in like sized volumes use wise.

As to talking the talk, I just go in and ask questions, which is how I learned about ownership.

 

[epanzella]

Let me throw my $.02 in here about ownership of bottles. Many years ago (about 40) I bought my my oxy/acetylene bottles out right from the supply house. I believe they were in the 225 cf range somewhere. When I brought them to be filled the supply house just swapped them out as if they were leased. I felt a little uncomfortable with that because I when I got my bottles they were brand new but after the first fillup I obviously got older bottles and my shiny new ones went into the line up for the next guy. A relocation forced me to sell the tanks and when I went to buy tanks at my new loc all but the smaller bottles were lease only. As all the bottles were swapped when refilled the only difference between owning or leasing seemed to involve just the method of payment.