[Documentation] Working Group - Thread Collection - Place Links, Source Materials, Images we want to use here.

[extropic]

@Aaron_W

Very useful input.
I like the range of perspectives contributed.

 

[Weldingrod1]

You might want to split it into two steps or two-three lists. The first one has maybe 5 items. A sneaky next step would be to divide the next level into something like "it has to be small and/or 120v powered" and "I have 240 and I'm not afraid to use it".

We've really got to be careful about scaring off the total beginners before they catch iron fever ;-)

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

 

[Aaron_W]

Just to be clear I'm not trying to be a wet blanket. I think we have two related but different goals working themselves out here.

You might want to split it into two steps or two-three lists. The first one has maybe 5 items. A sneaky next step would be to divide the next level into something like "it has to be small and/or 120v powered" and "I have 240 and I'm not afraid to use it".

We've really got to be careful about scaring off the total beginners before they catch iron fever ;-)

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

Exactly having been on the receiving end of "your machines aren't worthy of discussion" I may be a little sensitive to the possibility that we could give anybody the impression that they aren't good enough to post here. The fact that we have some members with 40+ years of experience that are willing to answer total noob questions makes this place very special. A lot of sites oriented towards trades skills are pretty brutal to the inexperienced.

 

[mikey]

I'm trying to let you guys run with this without interfering, which is why I'm sort of "quiet". It is truly a rare thing for me to be quiet, let me tell you!

I just wanted to put in my 2 cents and say that none of this needs to be overly complicated or scary to new guys. What we simply need to have is some basic info so we can tailor our responses. For example:

• Have you given any thought to what you need to do with the lathe? Of all the things you can spend your mental effort on, this is the most important because it impacts on the size of the lathe. That, in turn, impacts on power requirements, space requirements, budget for the machine and accessories, tooling needs and many other things. Only you can define your needs and the more realistic and clear you are on this one thing, the better you choice will be.
• What other hobbies do you engage in? Quite often, hobby machining will greatly augment your efforts in those other hobbies and make them more enjoyable. Gunsmithing, archery, photography, model trains, model engines, clock making and many other hobbies will greatly benefit from being a machinist. Learning about your interests may help in choosing one lathe over another so this helps.
• Budgets tend to be a very loose target in this hobby and you need to be aware that associated tooling can cost as much or more than the machine itself. Of course, expenditures can be spread out over time so the hit to your budget will not be a shock but it is there nonetheless so be aware of this, okay? So, do you have a budget and have you taken a look at lathes that will fall into that budget? What is your budget? I guarantee that we will do our best to help you blow right past it!
• Do you have any machining experience? This will give the forum some idea of how basic or complicated our answers must be. Many guys are brand new to the machining hobby and if that is you then fine, we'll tailor our responses in a simpler fashion. On the other hand, if you already know how to run a lathe and are familiar with the nomenclature surrounding these machines then our guys will get into the nitty gritty pretty fast.

I could go on and on with this but you get the idea. We simply need some idea of the guy's basic needs so we can present a realistic approach, that's all. None of this needs to be threatening.

 

[ArmyDoc]

I like the idea of a sub-forum titled "What machine should I buy?" as a place to catch all of those requests. I think this should inturn have subforums for lathes, mills, and "other" (such as bandsaw, surface grinder, welding machine etc)

In each of the subforums, there should probably be a sticky thread at the top that contains information, such as the questionair being developed, the overview that I submitted and spread sheets comparing machines etc. Then let the discussions and questions role like they normally do...

One question. Where do you want to put the forum "What machine should I buy"? There are a LOT of forums on this site, and it can be difficult to find things. I would say this should go towards the top, both because it is important/common and because the new guy won't see it if you put it towards the bottom. My suggestion is that the "Main Forum" should be ahead of Projects, and that the new forum on what machine to buy should be listed right underneith "A beginners forum"

 

[Aaron_W]

I like the idea of a sub-forum titled "What machine should I buy?" as a place to catch all of those requests. I think this should inturn have subforums for lathes, mills, and "other" (such as bandsaw, surface grinder, welding machine etc)

In each of the subforums, there should probably be a sticky thread at the top that contains information, such as the questionair being developed, the overview that I submitted and spread sheets comparing machines etc. Then let the discussions and questions role like they normally do...

One question. Where do you want to put the forum "What machine should I buy"? There are a LOT of forums on this site, and it can be difficult to find things. I would say this should go towards the top, both because it is important/common and because the new guy won't see it if you put it towards the bottom. My suggestion is that the "Main Forum" should be ahead of Projects, and that the new forum on what machine to buy should be listed right underneith "A beginners forum"

I like the idea of a sticky post "what machine should I buy" at the top of each section with a collected pool of information. This would be a good place to include some of the lists being created. Also the place to explain why the information requested in the simple blurb is being requested. It probably needs to be a locked thread as well so it doesn't become cluttered with comments and questions. People can start a separate post for that.

Combined with a blurb of good information to include in a post asking for recommendations at the top of each respective forum that would go a long way towards not giving the impression the admin is saying "don't make new machine posts" while also making the information readily available for those who are willing to do some of their own legwork (finger work?).

It should also be clear that these "buying a new machine" forums would also be the place were people can discuss other related material, place posts on individual experiences buying machines etc, so not strictly a newbie asking advice forum, but also a place for newbie advice (unsolicited) can be collected. I also like the idea of having an area for different kinds of machines (I think it was suggested by VTCNC), so manual lathe , manual mill, CNC etc. This has an added benefit of keeping the beginners thread open for other than new machine questions. This brings up another issue, I am often conflicted on whether to post a question in the general or beginner area. If we (you the admins) are going to be setting up a new area of the forum, it might be a good idea to make some clarification on what constitutes a beginner question vs a general one just to keep things nice and neat. Personally I tend to post in beginner if it seems like a really basic question, like how do I sharpen drill bits, rather than asking how to do something specific (I need to tap a hole in an unusual way), but that is just me.

 

[ACHiPo]

Here is an example that a Kitchen Knife forum I belong to uses when people are looking for a new Knife. A similar, relatively free-form questionnaire might be good for lathe and mill shopping?
LOCATION
What country are you in?



KNIFE TYPE
What type of knife are you interested in (e.g., chefs knife, slicer, boning knife, utility knife, bread knife, paring knife, cleaver)?

Are you right or left handed?

Are you interested in a Western handle (e.g., classic Wusthof handle) or Japanese handle?

What length of knife (blade) are you interested in (in inches or millimeters)?

Do you require a stainless knife? (Yes or no)

What is your absolute maximum budget for your knife?



KNIFE USE
Do you primarily intend to use this knife at home or a professional environment?

What are the main tasks you primarily intend to use the knife for (e.g., slicing vegetables, chopping vegetables, mincing vegetables, slicing meats, cutting down poultry, breaking poultry bones, filleting fish, trimming meats, etc.)? (Please identify as many tasks as you would like.)

What knife, if any, are you replacing?

Do you have a particular grip that you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for the common types of grips.)

What cutting motions do you primarily use? (Please click on this LINK for types of cutting motions and identify the two or three most common cutting motions, in order of most used to least used.)

What improvements do you want from your current knife? If you are not replacing a knife, please identify as many characteristics identified below in parentheses that you would like this knife to have.)

Better aesthetics (e.g., a certain type of finish; layered/Damascus or other pattern of steel; different handle color/pattern/shape/wood; better scratch resistance; better stain resistance)?

Comfort (e.g., lighter/heavier knife; better handle material; better handle shape; rounded spine/choil of the knife; improved balance)?

Ease of Use (e.g., ability to use the knife right out of the box; smoother rock chopping, push cutting, or slicing motion; less wedging; better food release; less reactivity with food; easier to sharpen)?

Edge Retention (i.e., length of time you want the edge to last without sharpening)?



KNIFE MAINTENANCE
Do you use a bamboo, wood, rubber, or synthetic cutting board? (Yes or no.)

Do you sharpen your own knives? (Yes or no.)

If not, are you interested in learning how to sharpen your knives? (Yes or no.)

Are you interested in purchasing sharpening products for your knives? (Yes or no.)



SPECIAL REQUESTS/COMMENTS

 

[extropic]

@vtcnc
Glad to see your working on a new draft (from the other thread).

et all,
It seems to me that there has been considerable paranoia expressed about intimidation factor and scaring noobs away.
I will admit to not being excessively warm and fuzzy. However, when we're discussing access to machinery that can easily do grievous bodily injury, I prefer to use specific and straight forward language. My interest here is in creating a TOOL that can help guide a noob through to purchasing what works for him/her. The checklist/questionnaire, IMHO, is to be a tool. No one is forced or required to use it.

If I were to bump into a future "What lathe should I buy?" thread (sans sufficient parameters from the OP), I would like to be able to reply with a link to a sticky. The sticky would include sufficient introduction, language blessed buy the Psychologists and wet-nurses, to assuage any imaginable degree of intimidation, and include an invitation to try to provide some information per the attachment(s). Maybe it would be good to attach more than one option. The noob could be invited to choose the one that is most attractive. Would that be scary?

 

[vtcnc]

@vtcnc
Glad to see your working on a new draft (from the other thread).

et all,
It seems to me that there has been considerable paranoia expressed about intimidation factor and scaring noobs away.
I will admit to not being excessively warm and fuzzy. However, when we're discussing access to machinery that can easily do grievous bodily injury, I prefer to use specific and straight forward language. My interest here is in creating a TOOL that can help guide a noob through to purchasing what works for him/her. The checklist/questionnaire, IMHO, is to be a tool. No one is forced or required to use it.

If I were to bump into a future "What lathe should I buy?" thread (sans sufficient parameters from the OP), I would like to be able to reply with a link to a sticky. The sticky would include sufficient introduction, language blessed buy the Psychologists and wet-nurses, to assuage any imaginable degree of intimidation, and include an invitation to try to provide some information per the attachment(s). Maybe it would be good to attach more than one option. The noob could be invited to choose the one that is most attractive. Would that be scary?

wet nurses....lol

 

[Aaron_W]

@vtcnc
Glad to see your working on a new draft (from the other thread).

et all,
It seems to me that there has been considerable paranoia expressed about intimidation factor and scaring noobs away.
I will admit to not being excessively warm and fuzzy. However, when we're discussing access to machinery that can easily do grievous bodily injury, I prefer to use specific and straight forward language. My interest here is in creating a TOOL that can help guide a noob through to purchasing what works for him/her. The checklist/questionnaire, IMHO, is to be a tool. No one is forced or required to use it.

If I were to bump into a future "What lathe should I buy?" thread (sans sufficient parameters from the OP), I would like to be able to reply with a link to a sticky. The sticky would include sufficient introduction, language blessed buy the Psychologists and wet-nurses, to assuage any imaginable degree of intimidation, and include an invitation to try to provide some information per the attachment(s). Maybe it would be good to attach more than one option. The noob could be invited to choose the one that is most attractive. Would that be scary?

Educate don't denigrate.