TTS Tool Holders- Collets

[Firebrick43]

Hobbyist with manual machine. I hate tool changes. Trying to speed that up and be able to set the Z height. I have not had any pull out issues with the R8 collets. Is the ER series better in that regard? Why is the ER an improvement?

The double taper and slotting of the ER collets allows for much improved contact to the tool over a longer length *if* the size is less that optimal for the collet. Ball bearing nuts make higher torques easily attainable as well.

Single taper R8 and 5C collets work very well if the tool/material chucked up in them is close to the nominal size of the collet. But if you have a tool/material to chuck up that is between sizes you are going to get more clamping at the end of the collet and less as you go back into the collet making it not as ridged.

So for end mills that are sized very accurately, ER is not that much of an advantage in comparison to an R8 Collet in contact or gripping power.

If your chucking up number or letter drills and the bit is off somewhat from nominal size of the collet, the ER collet will perform better.

Also note, collet run out is generally a function of cost. Crappy er collets that are abound on ebay will typically give crappy run out results. This is usually immaterial in a home shop, in a production shop running carbide tools it makes a huge difference in cost over time.

In smaller diameter tools (under 1/2") the Rule of thumb is for each addition 0,0001" additional runout your tool life will be reduced 10%

So a tool with 0.0005" runout will have half the life of one that is perfect. That is why companies will pay big money for hydraulic and shrink fit tool holders, because it saves them big money in cutting tools when your punching 100's of holes an hour.

 

[RaisedByWolves]

Hey, what is up with the ER32 nuts that have wrench slots on the wrong end???

View attachment 505751

Unless you use a semicircle wrench you can't get the wrench off? I hate those semicircle wrenches. I can never get them on.

That’s simply the price you pay for it being a ball bearing nut.

I have a couple, not a big deal to use a half wrench.

 

[rwm]

@Firebrick43 -Excellent summary! That make a lot of sense. Thanks.

 

[RaisedByWolves]

Single taper R8 and 5C collets work very well if the tool/material chucked up in them is close to the nominal size of the collet. But if you have a tool/material to chuck up that is between sizes you are going to get more clamping at the end of the collet and less as you go back into the collet making it not as ridged.


So for end mills that are sized very accurately, ER is not that much of an advantage in comparison to an R8 Collet in contact or gripping power.

If your chucking up number or letter drills and the bit is off somewhat from nominal size of the collet, the ER collet will perform better.

Also note, collet run out is generally a function of cost. Crappy er collets that are abound on ebay will typically give crappy run out results. This is usually immaterial in a home shop, in a production shop running carbide tools it makes a huge difference in cost over time.

In smaller diameter tools (under 1/2") the Rule of thumb is for each addition 0,0001" additional runout your tool life will be reduced 10%

So a tool with 0.0005" runout will have half the life of one that is perfect. That is why companies will pay big money for hydraulic and shrink fit tool holders, because it saves them big money in cutting tools when your punching 100's of holes an hour.

I disagree with this.


Within reason, the taper of the spindle acting on the taper of the collet will act to pull the collet petals at the taper parallel on a slightly reduced shank.

This will probably vary with the size of the collet somewhat.

 

[rwm]

Haas has some good pricing. Does anyone have experience with their quality? I assume they are re-branded Asian stuff?

 

[rwm]

So I went ahead and ordered some parts for a TTS ATC setup. Some from Tormach and some from iCarbide. I went with ER20. I got some end mill holders also


I would like to make a TTS holder for my Criterion boring head. That is the one tool that alignment will not be critical. Shockingly, Google does not find a diagram of the TTS dimensions? Does anyone have source for a reference or diagram of a TTS holder?


The shank will obvi be .750 x something and the other end 7/8 x 20TPI.

 

[Parlo]

I disagree with this.


Within reason, the taper of the spindle acting on the taper of the collet will act to pull the collet petals at the taper parallel on a slightly reduced shank.

This will probably vary with the size of the collet somewhat.

I agree with you. It is a popular myth that the 5C and R8 bores do not remain parallel when holding nonstandard diameters. The shank held in the bore also straightens the collet jaws. There was a wooden model on YouTube somewhere that was fudged to try to prove that the bores closed at an angle.

 

[RaisedByWolves]

So I went ahead and ordered some parts for a TTS ATC setup. Some from Tormach and some from iCarbide. I went with ER20. I got some end mill holders also
View attachment 505985

I would like to make a TTS holder for my Criterion boring head. That is the one tool that alignment will not be critical. Shockingly, Google does not find a diagram of the TTS dimensions? Does anyone have source for a reference or diagram of a TTS holder?


View attachment 505979
The shank will obvi be .750 x something and the other end 7/8 x 20TPI.

I was pleasantly surprised by the quality of the Icarbide er25 collet holder and collets I bought.

HAAS should also be good quality if they put their name on it.

 

[rwm]

I finally found a TTS drawing on CNC Zone.

EDIT: The original drawing was WRONG on some dimensions. I drew it up fresh and created the pdf below based on an actual Tormach part.

 

[RJSakowski]

So I went ahead and ordered some parts for a TTS ATC setup. Some from Tormach and some from iCarbide. I went with ER20. I got some end mill holders also
View attachment 505985

I would like to make a TTS holder for my Criterion boring head. That is the one tool that alignment will not be critical. Shockingly, Google does not find a diagram of the TTS dimensions? Does anyone have source for a reference or diagram of a TTS holder?

View attachment 505979
The shank will obvi be .750 x something and the other end 7/8 x 20TPI.

Tormach doesn't sell the shank as a separate part? I bought the assembled boring head from Tormach when I bought my machine. The shank has the same dimensions as the rest of their TTS accessories. Mine measured to 1.40" to the spindle seat.