Surface Grinder for a hobbyist

[pdentrem]

We are buying a Chevalier FSG-3A20 to replace our near death BS 618. It is surprising what get done on these machines. Very handy.
Pierre

 

[Driveslayer45]

So is there any magic to checking the spindle bearings? This machine is not currently connected to power, is that a concern. I even trying to read up it most seem to advise running it without a wheel to look for vibration.

I'm looking at a Boyer and Shultz 6 x 12...

 

[pdentrem]

Not connected to power is very much a problem. Spindle bearings and worn out table ways are the things to look at. Our BS has worn ways and the feed screws are in need of replacement. There are no parts available for our particular machine, and we cannot afford the down time. We really could use 2 machines! The spindle is loose but we start up in the morning and leave it running all day. Since the machine is used a lot there is no sense to turn off and the bearings as they warm up become tighter and thus we get a better finish. Cost to rebuild is more than buying a newer used machine! The one we are buying is $3600 vs more for the spindle repair alone!
Pierre

 

[Chipper5783]

I love my little 6x18 Ingar. It is an all manual machine. It came to me in 3 main pieces and several cardboard boxes. That is how the previous owner received it. I paid $600 CAD, I had to buy a magnet, and a bunch of minor components, and then spent plenty of time cleaning and fixing. Once it was powered I discovered the spindle bearings were no good - more $$ and time.

It works great now. I'm glad that I headed down that rabbit hole - I'm grinding stuff all the time. Sure it cost more than I thought it would, but I learned lots and had fun. All in it was about $1500 CAD, and I learned a lot, I understand the machine and had/having fun.

 

[MontanaLon]

There has been a little Hitachi blade grinder listed for a while now. I keep toying with the idea of getting it and seeing what I can do with it. It appears to have a single T slot table with a blade grinding attachment on it. Seems to have a decent x axis travel but very little y axis and no z axis. Probably entirely unsuited for anything but grinding blades but still kind of cool.

 

[Driveslayer45]

so is there any way to check the spindle bearings without power?

will one of these perm magnet chucks on amazon for $150 be fine or do i need more?

 

[C-Bag]

I looked long and hard at a SG and when two came up that I could afford and there was still parts for I read everything I possibly could here on several threads. With that in mind I set off and both failed the tests.

I don't think there's any way to test a spindle without it being under power. I was warned not to buy anything that you can't test. Like to grind something. The one had a bunch of wheels, fancy tooling etc and the spindle sounded great. But when we pulled the table and checked the ways, no bueno por nada, fail. The other was cheaper and looking back most of what was wrong with it was it had been bought new over 20yrs ago and never ever set up. The wheel was loose(!) the gibs had never been adjusted. Just everything I touched or tried to check was loose. I got spooked and bailed on the whole idea. If you go in with the idea you want a project and it turns out it ok you're golden. If not you've got maybe a project or a boat anchor as some have not been made for decades. SG's are a very deep subject so I decided I've got enough I'm trying to fix and learn to use.

 

[Chipper5783]

so is there any way to check the spindle bearings without power?

will one of these perm magnet chucks on amazon for $150 be fine or do i need more?

I don't believe you can check the spindle bearings without power. Obviously if it is seized - that's a problem. In my case (the Ingar) performed okay, but I really wasn't getting as good a surface finish as I felt I should be. When I finally took the plunge and disassembled the spindle, I discovered a previous owner had installed conventional C3 clearance bearings (about $25 for all three). The correct bearings, called out in the manual were nearly $500 (they would have been more, but I got two of them as NOS off ebay).

In the case of the Ingar design, the spindle is actually quite simple. I made special sockets (4 finger) for the bearing nuts and a pusher to keep everything straight on the disassembly. I heated the bearings for the installation. Most of the time was spent in making tooling. However, all spindles are not the same. I have no doubt that some are very difficult to service.

The new bearings really did help, but technique is also important. Just because the grinder turns on and the wheel goes around without squealing - does not mean the spindle is good. Just because you don't get a good surface finish, does not mean the spindle is in poor shape. In otherwords, simply being able to turn the grinder on, perhaps do a quick grind - will tell you almost nothing.

If you want to buy a grinder that you know is all good - then go to a machinery dealer and get one with a warranty. Expect to spend a lot more $$.


The cheap permanent magnet chuck is probably fine. I got one and I am very satisfied with it. Once you have the magnet ground in, there really isn't much that can go wrong.

Be forewarned, grinding is a skill all in itself. Don't expect to mag a block of metal down, switch the machine on and start getting "rock star" results.

C-Bag is certainly correct that one is well advised to run a machine before buying. I rarely do that. I generally just give the machine a good look over and then buy or walk. The reason is that I'm buying at the bottom of the market - and any machine that is powered up and working well is out of my price range. Of course if you have the $$ and want the confidence, then test the machine out thoroughly. I've been fortunate - I've bought 6 machines based just on looking them over, all have worked out well for me. I have bought a couple that I was able to test out - they needed repairs too. My very first machine (38 years ago) is not one of those 6 - that one I got from a machinery dealer.

How much is the grinder you are looking at? If you are not overly exposed, then go for it. Perhaps it will be a boat anchor, perhaps you'll be able to sell it on - maybe it will work out. I suggest looking for "good bones" and don't sweat the small stuff.

Let us know how you make out. David

 

[Driveslayer45]

Thanks for the great feedback.

I'm looking at a Boyer and Shultz 6x12 for $300. After a cheap mag Chuck and vfd I'll be into it about $600, then there's tooling. Outside of a used wheel that's on it I don't think it comes with much more, if any.

 

[7milesup]

Just bought this a bit ago.
Also purchased a Huayang VFD drive for it, which I did hook up to convert my single phase to 3 phase. Purchased a 2hp VFD to provide electrical headroom on driving the 1hp SG motor.
My SG seems to be in great shape, although the mag chuck needs to be taken apart. The Ceramax chucks are filled with oil and I have a feeling mine might be filled with other crap too.
Oh, paid $500 for this and the best part it was only 40 miles from my home. Yippeee!!!