Looking for my perfect size hobby mill....

I am quite happy with my mill, but you can understand my occasional mill envy. I'm thrilled to have 16", a lot of other mills in this class only have 12-13".
This is exactly why I chose the machine I have. I love a good knee mill but I discovered having a huge x and Y envelope was useless if I could not get my tooling over the work piece. With the 940 the X Axis is 26" with the X power feed and the Y Axis is 12", both very respectable; but 22" table clearance and 20" of Z Axis movement sold me. I haven't done a project yet where tool clearance even entered my mind with this mill.
 
you guys are assuming that square column mills are all small bench top machines but to by a knee mill with the work envelope of a PM940V or M (specifically Z axis of 22"), is an expensive large machine and the PM932 is pretty large as well with a table clearance of (Z axis) of 18".
The PM 932 is 850 lbs, without a stand, how is it even considered a Bench Mill, Its almost 400 Lbs more than the Mill I should be getting the PM 7x28 VT, I try to listen to to everyone because you guys have been through this buying dilemma. lol its kind of funny thou and no disrespect to anybody, no matter the size all I read from everyone is you need bigger...

That being said the PM 932 size M - or -V is where I'm drawing the line for size, I have a PM-1236T I do not consider it a hobby lathe, When I think Hobby Lathe I think any brand 9"X19" as the perfect size hobby lathe to get your feet wet, then move on up from there if you need.

I am Completely Mill ignorant and apologize for the rant, I'm just getting frustrated figuring this all out.

Thanks for help, I do appreciate it, Mike

Did you get your Mill back up and running, Make a new bolt for it..?

I am quite happy with my mill, but you can understand my occasional mill envy. I'm thrilled to have 16", a lot of other mills in this class only have 12-13".
I am glad your happy and your Clausing Mill treats you well, you sound fond of it, which makes me think I should be reconsidering the PM-728VT, basically the same attributes to your Clausing... I hate changing my mind over and over, was set on the PM-932 a few days ago, but there are a lot of positives for the PM-728VT...

I really like the 5 year Warranty, Its made in Taiwan, There are plenty of mod videos on the net for it, less HP means more forgiving while learning, Smaller size is less intimidating... that kind of stuff, The PM-932 has positives as well such as longer time to grow out of, way heavier more stable. The price is about the same for both variable speed versions and a lot less for the Gear head Manual PM-932.

Forget the money, what makes a better hobby machine to get your feet wet, and start learning when you have Zero Mill knowledge, Your Clausing is smaller, weighs less and sounds like you really enjoy it. On the other hand you get a lot more machine with the PM-932V. so on one hand you get a little more quality VS more capacity, I'm good with either really, what's your thinking..? Thanks for your perspective in advance, Mike...
 
Last edited:
Less rigidity, and less HP narrows the performance window, and you will need to be more precise with tooling, the feeds, speeds, DOCs, and may get more chatter, and other issues. That's how I understand it anyway.
 
I am glad your happy and your Clausing Mill treats you well, you sound fond of it, which makes me think I should be reconsidering the PM-728VT, basically the same attributes to your Clausing... I hate changing my mind over and over, was set on the PM-932 a few days ago, but there are a lot of positives for the PM-728VT...

I really like the 5 year Warranty, Its made in Taiwan, There are plenty of mod videos on the net for it, less HP means more forgiving while learning, Smaller size is less intimidating... that kind of stuff, The PM-932 has positives as well such as longer time to grow out of, way heavier more stable. The price is about the same for both variable speed versions and a lot less for the Gear head Manual PM-932.

Forget the money, what makes a better hobby machine to get your feet wet, and start learning when you have Zero Mill knowledge, Your Clausing is smaller, weighs less and sounds like you really enjoy it. On the other hand you get a lot more machine with the PM-932V. so on one hand you get a little more quality VS more capacity, I'm good with either really, what's your thinking..? Thanks for your perspective in advance, Mike...

Analysis paralysis is common, and I don't think a bad thing to a point. Machines are not cheap and for many of us we don't know what we don't know so dragging your feet some is perfectly normal before making a big purchase like this..


Too small is a real issue, and is often emphasized. Too small makes things difficult to impossible, but too small is relative.

I started out with a Sherline mill, the table is 2.75x12", 12" spindle to table, and weighs 50lbs so it is a very small mill.
Lots of people warned me it would be too small, but I didn't have the space for a bigger mill (or so I thought) and it has done a great job for the projects I was interested in when I bought it. The only problem I have had with the Sherline, is my interests grew. Even though I know have larger mills, I still use it quite a bit for my smaller projects.

The Clausing is quite a bit larger than the Sherline, but in the big picture it is not a large mill (roughly comparable to the many import 7x27 mills, including the PM-728) . It happens to be about the biggest mill I could manage in my space and luckily has worked for me.
I have a small space and mostly make small things, I'm not fixing farm equipment or other large items. The closest I've come to it not being big enough, comes down the the vise that fits being smallish, which means coming up with work arounds, more effort, but gets the job done.

The size of the mill also impacts the size of accessories, vise, rotary table, dividing head etc. When I got it, it had a 5" vise which is too big and limits the full range of table movement. I bought a 4" vise that is a better fit, but having that 5" vise has proved to be useful so I've been glad to have it for a few jobs that pushed the limits of the mill. Fixturing to the table is more difficult, but would allow me to work on parts too big to fit even the 5" vise.


What you see mentioned far less often, is too big, but that is also a thing particularly in a small space. You have to live with the mill, and a mill that is so large that it makes working in your space difficult, will not make you happy. There have been people on this site who bought the biggest mill that they could fit and have since expressed some disappointment and a wish that they had gone with something a bit smaller because it impacts the utility of their space. It is not as common as people unhappy with too small, but too big exists.


A lathe is pretty much contained within its foot print, by contrast a mill needs space side to side, and a smaller amount in front to allow the table its full range of motion. Many mills also require room for the head to move, possibly side to side, and room to the rear. This creates a lot of dead space around the mill. With some planning the space can be worked with, but it is a factor. Mills are also quite tall, many in excess of 7 feet which can be an issue with ceiling height.

Using my Clausing since it is what I have.

mill.jpg


I have a small space and a low ceiling with a hard height limit of 76". This only leaves 4" over the mill and eliminated many mills including the 932 from consideration (81" tall). I also have to make the most of my space so I used the dead space behind the mill caused by the long overhang of the head for storage shelf. Similarly I use the dead space on either side under the table for storage.


Where it becomes hard for others to advise you, is you know your space, and you have to live with the mill. You may not know exactly what you are going to make with it, but you have a better idea than we do.
Too big is not good, but I think most agree too big is better than too small. Just right is ideal, but a very hard target. Most default to the what is the biggest you can live with.


The 932 is a solid choice, but If the 728 feels like a better fit for you, that may be the right way to go. It is a nice size for many.
The PM25 was very high on my list of options. The 728 wasn't available at that time or it would have made my list as well. I was where you were, second guessing my options when the the Clausing basically fell into my lap. I was lucky to know the seller, who had bought a Bridgeport and was getting ready to sell the Clausing when I happened to ask about mills. It was too good an option to pass up which made the decision easy even though it was about $1000 more than I had budgeted for a mill.
 
Last edited:
Analysis paralysis is common, and I don't think a bad thing to a point. Machines are not cheap and for many of us we don't know what we don't know so dragging your feet some is perfectly normal before making a big purchase like this..


Too small is a real issue, and is often emphasized. Too small makes things difficult to impossible, but too small is relative.

I started out with a Sherline mill, the table is 2.75x12", 12" spindle to table, and weighs 50lbs so it is a very small mill.
Lots of people warned me it would be too small, but I didn't have the space for a bigger mill (or so I thought) and it has done a great job for the projects I was interested in when I bought it. The only problem I have had with the Sherline, is my interests grew. Even though I know have larger mills, I still use it quite a bit for my smaller projects.

The Clausing is quite a bit larger than the Sherline, but in the big picture it is not a large mill (roughly comparable to the many import 7x27 mills, including the PM-728) . It happens to be about the biggest mill I could manage in my space and luckily has worked for me.
I have a small space and mostly make small things, I'm not fixing farm equipment or other large items. The closest I've come to it not being big enough, comes down the the vise that fits being smallish, which means coming up with work arounds, more effort, but gets the job done.

The size of the mill also impacts the size of accessories, vise, rotary table, dividing head etc. When I got it, it had a 5" vise which is too big and limits the full range of table movement. I bought a 4" vise that is a better fit, but having that 5" vise has proved to be useful so I've been glad to have it for a few jobs that pushed the limits of the mill. Fixturing to the table is more difficult, but would allow me to work on parts too big to fit even the 5" vise.


What you see mentioned far less often, is too big, but that is also a thing particularly in a small space. You have to live with the mill, and a mill that is so large that it makes working in your space difficult, will not make you happy. There have been people on this site who bought the biggest mill that they could fit and have since expressed some disappointment and a wish that they had gone with something a bit smaller because it impacts the utility of their space. It is not as common as people unhappy with too small, but too big exists.


A lathe is pretty much contained within its foot print, by contrast a mill needs space side to side, and a smaller amount in front to allow the table its full range of motion. Many mills also require room for the head to move, possibly side to side, and room to the rear. This creates a lot of dead space around the mill. With some planning the space can be worked with, but it is a factor. Mills are also quite tall, many in excess of 7 feet which can be an issue with ceiling height.

Using my Clausing since it is what I have.

View attachment 493167

I have a small space and a low ceiling with a hard height limit of 76". This only leaves 4" over the mill and eliminated many mills including the 932 from consideration (81" tall). I also have to make the most of my space so I used the dead space behind the mill caused by the long overhang of the head for storage shelf. Similarly I use the dead space on either side under the table for storage.


Where it becomes hard for others to advise you, is you know your space, and you have to live with the mill. You may not know exactly what you are going to make with it, but you have a better idea than we do.
Too big is not good, but I think most agree too big is better than too small. Just right is ideal, but a very hard target. Most default to the what is the biggest you can live with.


The 932 is a solid choice, but If the 728 feels like a better fit for you, that may be the right way to go. It is a nice size for many.
The PM25 was very high on my list of options. The 728 wasn't available at that time or it would have made my list as well. I was where you were, second guessing my options when the the Clausing basically fell into my lap. I was lucky to know the seller, who had bought a Bridgeport and was getting ready to sell the Clausing when I happened to ask about mills. It was too good an option to pass up which made the decision easy even though it was about $1000 more than I had budgeted for a mill.
I'm a bit confused by your picture there. It looks like the table has very little X traverse space.

I expect I'm missing something though. :)
 
Analysis paralysis is common, and I don't think a bad thing to a point. Machines are not cheap and for many of us we don't know what we don't know so dragging your feet some is perfectly normal before making a big purchase like this..
Thank you so much for taking the time out of your day to create this well thought out write up..! Analysis paralysis is torture, I try and use Logic and Extremism to help problem solve when all variables are unknown, after reading your post a couple times I believe I'm right on track with the PM-932, At bare minimum the smaller PM-728 is a safe purchase with a lot of fun to be had but less growth potential... As you note above, space was one your limiting factors, and the fact the Mill practically dropped in your lap made your decision a bit easier.

I appreciate your write up pointing out both sides of the coin, it helps me further cement the direction I was already heading, I have the room, and the PM-932 has more growth potential..

I know people are right when they say buy the biggest mill you can afford, but unlike my lathe where I had a hint of what to expect, I cant justify spending what I can afford on a machine type I know nothing about, the PM-932 is the largest mill on my list, and I need to start somewhere...

On another Note... Your Clausing Mill looks very well cared for, That is one nice looking machine....
 
Thank you so much for taking the time out of your day to create this well thought out write up..! Analysis paralysis is torture, I try and use Logic and Extremism to help problem solve when all variables are unknown, after reading your post a couple times I believe I'm right on track with the PM-932, At bare minimum the smaller PM-728 is a safe purchase with a lot of fun to be had but less growth potential... As you note above, space was one your limiting factors, and the fact the Mill practically dropped in your lap made your decision a bit easier.

I appreciate your write up pointing out both sides of the coin, it helps me further cement the direction I was already heading, I have the room, and the PM-932 has more growth potential..

I know people are right when they say buy the biggest mill you can afford, but unlike my lathe where I had a hint of what to expect, I cant justify spending what I can afford on a machine type I know nothing about, the PM-932 is the largest mill on my list, and I need to start somewhere...

On another Note... Your Clausing Mill looks very well cared for, That is one nice looking machine....
you are on the right track, and after you have made a decision you will have the peace of mind that you considered all your options.
In the end it is your space, hobby, money, time, projects that are the deciding factors and only you know them. Keep in mind that wishing you had bought a smaller mill is very rare, most of us find things to do that take more after we get going and you can always make small parts on a big mill but big parts on a small mill takes a lot more effort. The cost of accessories is also a factor bigger end mills/ vices/ etc cost more and take up more space/ weigh more, but you can always use smaller vices / end mills etc on the larger mill but not the reverse. size if you have the space for it gives you options.

IMO if you are planning on installing the mill on a bench (not free standing base) i would tend to stay with the 727/728 size they are 475 and 370 lbs where the 932 is 750lbs and IMO a lot to be putting on a bench. in the end they are all good equipment. and any mill is better than no mill.

I currently have a grizzly g0758 (smaller than the PM25) that fell into my lap and i can do most things that i need with it but i have always understood that it is a starting point and i will probably just keep it right next to a larger mill when i get around to getting larger, but i'm not space limited my shop is 30X60 so different conditions make for different decisions. I have learned from my experience with a small mill and I'm trying to pass that experience on to you. Most people here will give me advice based on their perspective I try to understand their conditions that led to their opinion to help me make a better choice for myself.
 
Last edited:
The PM 932 is 850 lbs, without a stand, how is it even considered a Bench Mill, Its almost 400 Lbs more than the Mill I should be getting the PM 7x28 VT, I try to listen to to everyone because you guys have been through this buying dilemma. lol its kind of funny thou and no disrespect to anybody, no matter the size all I read from everyone is you need bigger...

That being said the PM 932 size M - or -V is where I'm drawing the line for size, I have a PM-1236T I do not consider it a hobby lathe, When I think Hobby Lathe I think any brand 9"X19" as the perfect size hobby lathe to get your feet wet, then move on up from there if you need.

I am Completely Mill ignorant and apologize for the rant, I'm just getting frustrated figuring this all out.

Thanks for help, I do appreciate it, Mike

Did you get your Mill back up and running, Make a new bolt for it..?


I am glad your happy and your Clausing Mill treats you well, you sound fond of it, which makes me think I should be reconsidering the PM-728VT, basically the same attributes to your Clausing... I hate changing my mind over and over, was set on the PM-932 a few days ago, but there are a lot of positives for the PM-728VT...

I really like the 5 year Warranty, Its made in Taiwan, There are plenty of mod videos on the net for it, less HP means more forgiving while learning, Smaller size is less intimidating... that kind of stuff, The PM-932 has positives as well such as longer time to grow out of, way heavier more stable. The price is about the same for both variable speed versions and a lot less for the Gear head Manual PM-932.

Forget the money, what makes a better hobby machine to get your feet wet, and start learning when you have Zero Mill knowledge, Your Clausing is smaller, weighs less and sounds like you really enjoy it. On the other hand you get a lot more machine with the PM-932V. so on one hand you get a little more quality VS more capacity, I'm good with either really, what's your thinking..? Thanks for your perspective in advance, Mike...
I am back up. Trammed in and running :)
 
I'm a bit confused by your picture there. It looks like the table has very little X traverse space.

I expect I'm missing something though. :)

The mill only has 15" travel so it doesn't need a lot, but the camera also makes it look tighter than it really is.
 
Back
Top