ER32 Fail (Learn from my mistakes)

[25ring]

Ray, per ebay rules, if the item is not as described the seller has to give you a full refund plus pay shipping back to him. This is not open for debate by the seller. If he refuses, get ebay involved and they will resolve it. There is no way you should have to deal with this.

This must be why I got a prompt refund + shipping on the the one I returned.I went through ebay using their process for returning defective items instead of contacting the seller directly.

 

[Ray C]

Ray, per ebay rules, if the item is not as described the seller has to give you a full refund plus pay shipping back to him. This is not open for debate by the seller. If he refuses, get ebay involved and they will resolve it. There is no way you should have to deal with this.

The problem is that the advertisement did not give specifications. The instruction sheet said "Adjust tool if TIR is greater than 0.0004". I was not able to see those instructions until after I purchased it. It was a known gamble when I bought it. The cost is not upsetting to me. What is annoying is the unsuspecting newby machinists who will buy this thing and struggle needlessly.

Quick update: I just viewed the listing and it seems the review has been pulled down.

Ray

 

[mikey]

Since the issue is a poorly ground R8 arbor and internal taper, the item is defective. Ebay will back you up, Ray, especially since you photographically documented the issue. The item may not cost much but the seller needs to be put on notice, financially, that he cannot sell tools like this because you're right - the next guy may be one of our new guys and that just won't do.

 

[Downunder Bob]

Ray, per ebay rules, if the item is not as described the seller has to give you a full refund plus pay shipping back to him. This is not open for debate by the seller. If he refuses, get ebay involved and they will resolve it. There is no way you should have to deal with this.

Exactly as Mike says. I've had a looka t the add, and it says


-This is a "brand new" precision collet chuck holder for professionals and hobbyists demanding.

-Ease of operation and high quality work results.

The words "precision collet chuck holder for professionals, demanding Ease of operation and high quality work results." entitles you to expect a quality product that conforms to industry standards.

Then "
-This is a "brand new" precision collet chuck holder for professionals and hobbyists demanding.
-Collet must be assembled into the clamping nut before inserting into the chuck.
-Ease of operation and high quality work results.

Note
1. Before using this tool, please measure tool deflection, if tool deflection accuracy exceeds 0.01M. Please adjust before cutting.

Last time I looked 0.01mm equals 0.00039", under half a thou. right there is the spec.

he suggests you adjust before cutting, but there is no adjustment on the tool, so the only way to adjust it is to replace it. I'm sure eBay and Paypal would back on this. Full replacement or full refund including postage, and if he wants his crap tool back he has to pay return postage.

I have h6ad them back me on similar claims.

Go for it buddy.

 

[Ray C]

Another development...

The seller removed the first product review so I re-posted it at/around 9pm. By 9:30pm, it was removed again. This morning, there are emails from eBay and Paypal indicating a full refund was credited to the account.

So... product reviews on eBay aren't worth the photons it takes to display them on your monitor -and this seller is going to pedal that junk for as long as they want.

Ray

 

[rgray]

Ray, per ebay rules, if the item is not as described the seller has to give you a full refund plus pay shipping back to him.

Cost me $3.50 shipping when "discount tools" sent me a collet wrench way to small for an ER-50 that it was supposed to be for.
I paid shipping back to them for their mistake. Seems dumb. They obviously grabbed the wrong one or have a box mislabeled.
Ebay automated system disconnects any personal help. It's just pay to send it back. No contact no woops we made a mistake and we'll
fix it. Not getting anything from them again.
Small amount but not thrilled with paying for their mistake.
Would I assume they would send the correct item next time? Not gonna chance it.

 

[RWanke]

Must have been a different seller. After initiating the return request, the seller has asked for pictures, asked for barcodes (which do not exist), asked for procedures on how I took measurements etc. So far, I've given him a good machine-shop lesson. I sent him the same information I posted in this thread. https://www.hobby-machinist.com/threads/diagnosing-bad-er32-r8-collet-chuck.68829/ The seller is offering to refund $5 to the paypal account. The eBay ad says full refund and full return shipping. I'm having a fun exchange with the seller. My last response was "Why would I be satisfied with $5.00 refund when I paid $27?".

I got bigger fish to fry but, plan to continue talking to this seller. Normally, I don't pursue refunds on small amounts. This unit is pure junk and it bugs me when unsuspecting hobbyists buy stuff like this and spend hours trying to figure-out what the heck is wrong.

Here's the seller and picture of unit. It's the same unit sold by many, many different sellers.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/6-3-R8-ER32-7-16-Collet-Chuck-Holder-16CM-CNC-Milling-Lathe-Tool-With-Wrench/222763079394?_trkparms=aid=111001&algo=REC.SEED&ao=1&asc=20160727114228&meid=65eb4143d762402181a8c8a892b1e573&pid=100290&rk=1&rkt=4&sd=222763079394&itm=222763079394&_trksid=p2060778.c100290.m3507
Ray

Reading the masterfully written product description in this E-bay ad reminds me of the occasional emails I get from the Saudi Prince that wants to befriend me and the very helpful IRS agent that is trying to keep me out of prison.

 

[Downunder Bob]

Another development...

The seller removed the first product review so I re-posted it at/around 9pm. By 9:30pm, it was removed again. This morning, there are emails from eBay and Paypal indicating a full refund was credited to the account.

So... product reviews on eBay aren't worth the photons it takes to display them on your monitor -and this seller is going to pedal that junk for as long as they want.

Ray

At least you got your money back, and yes he'll continue to sell junk, but eventually it will catch up with him. If enough customers complain to eBay they will eventually do something. I know in my case they threatened the seller with loss of account if he kept misrepresenting his products, they had had a lot of complaints about him. So it does work, it just takes time.

 

[Ken from ontario]

Another development...

The seller removed the first product review so I re-posted it at/around 9pm. By 9:30pm, it was removed again. This morning, there are emails from eBay and Paypal indicating a full refund was credited to the account.

So... product reviews on eBay aren't worth the photons it takes to display them on your monitor -and this seller is going to pedal that junk for as long as they want.

Ray

You are absolutely right on that.
I doubt you'll see your review now after the full refund, ebay has left a huge gray area where the sellers can pull down negative reviews and still not break ebay's rules and policies.after all they both need the complaining buyers to disappear so they can continue to sell their stuff to the next person.

This may not be a big deal to many of us buyers but leaving a negative feedback earns the reviewer a spot on the seller's block list, and it is quite possible that sellers share the info on" trouble makers" with some of the other sellers .
Ebay sellers(some of them of course) also roam the chat rooms or "buyers forum" and seek out the complainers( who look for advice on ebay) and proceed to block them, it has not happened to me personally but I've been on the buyer's forum for years and know this happens often, in fact some sellers don't even hide their disdain for any persistent buyer and blatantly announce that he/she " will be blocked"

 

[Janderso]

If we do not keep the sellers honest, and let them get away with poor business practices, then things will keep getting worse, and we will only have ourselves to blame. Do not accept anything that does not come as represented, regardless of price or the seller dragging his feet. We must insist on a transparent and fair buying experience or take our business elsewhere.

A bit later..... I agree Bob. I just received a half price set of stubby “High Quality” drill bits from a very popular, high quality tool source.
The metal box was a cheap piece of crap and the trays would not open properly.
I returned it rather than trying to rig a fix. Plus, the drill bits had, “made in China” stamped on all the larger bits.
This was a $650 set for $299.
Dang, I really thought I was getting a deal.