VFD's: Huanyang (eBay) vs AC-Tech SMVector, Teco, Hitachi, etc...beyond 3hp

rdhem2 said:
Once again I have to agree with 'ol Ray C, Vettbob has some good points also. Largest single phase drive I run is a 5hp Allen Bradley on a vertical bandsaw. Runs great, no problems. But who built it? Rockwell, who owns AB? I doubt it. Hitachi? Thats what I heard but can not prove it. I have been told that the majority of brand name VFDs are Hitachi on the inside. I know SqD Telemecanique (Tele) was that way for a while until they developed their own small HP units. From what I have seen Hitachi builds a pretty bullet proof drive and I have heard nothing but good about TECO but never used one.

I'll be honest, I spent my life fixing things and now would rather use the stuff then work on it. I have no interest in any CHINAMAN product for many many reasons. I will not fix the `trade unbalance by myself but I will try. I don't want the hassles and freight costs of sending stuff back and forth. If I can not afford the cost I will find a different hobby. I do it right or not at all. That's OK, my wife doesn't understand either, and *****es about it all the time too. Its just me.

You are correct also in saying you will not find an all USA made unit. I doubt if all the small pieces parts are even made in the US. But in the long run, support USA made product. All six of the drives I run say AB or SqD Tele on the outside and I have never had a day of regret. I just keep shoveling out the SWARF!
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Some clarification Rockwell purchased Allen-Bradley in 1985 and slowly over the years as Rockwell expanded the the product line Allen-Bradley became more of product line name. Rockwell Automation is the company name while Allen-Bradley is a product line. think of it as Ford Motor company which builds the Lincoln cars. Today the drives still carry the Allen-Bradley name. If you have an older AB drive such as the 1336, 1305 or the 160 these were designed by Allen-Bradly and built in the US by Allen-Bradley. of the newer products the 4 series and the new 5 series were designed by Rockwell Automation but built off shore. in many cases in plants that are in joint partnership with Rockwell Automation. The 7 class drives are built in North America and to my knowledge there is only one other AC drive manufacture that is building product in the US that was designed in the US, sadly it is a design that is over 20 years old. There are many manufacturers that build product for the brand names the most prevalent is the Delta drive. Hitachi is a minor player in the VFD world that's not to say its a bad product they just haven't figured out how to sell in the major markets.


As for the de-rate comments for running a 3 phase drive on single phase. Its all in the power supply and boils down to the size of capacitors and if the drive has a choke (properly called a DC link choke) in the DC circuit. With out the choke a 60 to 70% de-rate for continuous operation is normal with the choke 40 to 50% de-rate. How do you know you have a choke in the drive just pick it up the drive will be considerably heaver and bigger. Some drives give you the option of adding the choke but that for the hobbyist is too expensive. A comment on sizing and de-rating a drive. Forget HP its all about Amps. A typical new 3 HP 3P 230 VAC motor will have full load current rating around 6.7 amps. If you purchase a 3HP drive rated at 11 amps continuous
 
My apologies on the my post it appears that not only was it posted twice the rest of the post was not downloaded.

"Forget HP it's all about Amps. A typical new 3 HP 3P 230 VAC motor will have full load current rating around 6.7 amps. If you purchase a 3HP drive rated at 11 amps continuous" and operate the drive on single phase you already have a 40% current margin. So in this case you should have no real problem in a hobby/home shop. If you want to size the drive correctly, assuming you can, I would measure the current draw of the motor when you are doing the most demanding machining that you would normally do. Use this current as your reference point. using the 3Hp motor example if you measure the current at 4.5 Amps then the 11 amp 3 Hp drive will be more than sufficient for your machine.

On to the "quality" of the various drives. The answer to this is very difficult and the best answer would be based on you usage of the drive. If you were going to use the drive in a critical application whare an hour of down time would cost you $10,000 it would not make sense to buy a drive off of eBay that is not one to the big three drive manufactures (Siemens, ABB, Rockwell Automation/ Allen-Bradley). on the other hand if the drive is only used for 5 or 6 hours per week it would not make sense to purchase a top line high performance drive. What I would not purchase is a complete no-name drive by that I mean a drive that is not generally found in the US. Back to the Amps I have seen drives sold as 3HP (230Vac) that could only deliver 6.5 Amps continous, that is not a 3Hp drive on the other end the product that I am associated with does produce 11 amps continuous.

Feel free to contact me by private message if you have a specific question or for that matter to disagree with me.

Jim
 
I am building a large epoxy granite mill and looking at running a 7-10 hp 3 phase 240v spindle for it in my garage. I have 240v 50 amp service via a sub panel. What would be the best way run a motor this size in a garage environment and single phase power to start with?
 
gt40 said:
I am building a large epoxy granite mill and looking at running a 7-10 hp 3 phase 240v spindle for it in my garage. I have 240v 50 amp service via a sub panel. What would be the best way run a motor this size in a garage environment and single phase power to start with?
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I just spec'ed this VFD for a similar application, with a 100 amp sub-panel. https://www.driveswarehouse.com/p-2537-wj200-110lf.aspx

It is a bit overkill for a 5.5HP (4KW) motor, but in this case every bit of motor power will be used nearly continiously. Because this VFD is not rated for single phase input, I doubled the size. The 10HP unit was marginal on the input current capability, so I went to the next larger size just to make sure. Just a little bit overkill, but not much. So for a 10HP motor I would go with at least a 20HP VFD.

Your 50 amp sub is right on the edge of being not quite big enough to run a 10HP motor.
 
JimDawson said:
I just spec'ed this VFD for a similar application, with a 100 amp sub-panel. https://www.driveswarehouse.com/p-2537-wj200-110lf.aspx

It is a bit overkill for a 5.5HP (4KW) motor, but in this case every bit of motor power will be used nearly continiously. Because this VFD is not rated for single phase input, I doubled the size. The 10HP unit was marginal on the input current capability, so I went to the next larger size just to make sure. Just a little bit overkill, but not much. So for a 10HP motor I would go with at least a 20HP VFD.

Your 50 amp sub is right on the edge of being not quite big enough to run a 10HP motor.
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Thanks for the info. I think will look at 7.5-8hp size then. FYI I noticed you and I have the same series Jet lathe. I converted mine to CNC with ground ballscrews and servos. Pretty easy conversion...
 
gt40 said:
Thanks for the info. I think will look at 7.5-8hp size then. FYI I noticed you and I have the same series Jet lathe. I converted mine to CNC with ground ballscrews and servos. Pretty easy conversion...
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Your welcome.

I would be interested in seeing pictures of your lathe
 
JimDawson said:
Your welcome.

I would be interested in seeing pictures of your lathe
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I did a build thread on cnczone before I found out about this place. Currently have my epoxy granite build there I am working on there too. Is there and dedicated cnc conversion/build log section here at Hobby-Machinist? I just found out about this place not long ago from Darkzero...

Anyway, here is the thread on the lathe: http://www.cnczone.com/forums/vertical-mill-lathe-project-log/223036-cnc.html#post1492610

If your interested, here is the thread on the giant epoxy granite mill I am building:

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/verti...470-marks-epoxy-granite-18-quot-x20-quot.html

I am happy to move/reconstruct a summary of the builds here if you think there would be a benefit for folks.

Mark
 
Nice build! Now I'm going to have to put a CNC lathe on my to do list, right after the CNC surface grinder, that's next.
 
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