So, i'll start this off by clarifying, i'm the idiot, LOL. Incase that wasn't obvious, allow me to explain:
Yesterday i took a 20 hour road trip to California to pick up what i thought to be the surface grinder to fix my problems. Spoiler alert: when i got there i realized just how in over my head i was, and walked away empty handed (I'll explain a little more in depth in a minute). I'm a knifemaker, looking to install a more permanent solution to grinding things flat(ish) and true, compared to my current setup. It something that a lot of people in this field end up resolving the way i did - a 2x72 belt grinder attachment that has a built in sine table to be able to grind accurate tapers. While the attachment works beyond well enough for what i use, there are more than a couple problems that make this system terrible.
First, the current chuck is like 2x12, which isn't enough width for what i like to make. Currently a lot of the projects in the shop are knives that are wider than 2", and i struggle to find a way to adequately compensate for this. It seems though the conventional stand alone units would pose the opposite issue - length. I think the perfect medium for me would be something like 6x18. This would allow me to continue to make full tang kitchen knives, but transition into folding knives later and parts that really need to accurately flat and true. Second, the chuck is always magnetized, so getting anything on or off it (especially if you go for a good surface finish) is a nightmare. The magnet picks up dust and particles, and it makes cleaning between each step a must, which leads to a really cumbersome process. Third, is rigidity. The system seems to move more than what i like, and feels to be really stressing everything to the limit (this might be a feels over reals thing for me, but what can i say). Overall though, it's worked till now and i can get a 8 inch part within .02" of each other (which for full tang knife making, is fine, but folders and precision work i'm LIGHTYEARS away).
Back to the trip yesterday, i found a unit on EBay that i thought looked promising, it was priced super high (which i correlated with a good condition unit), and shot the owner a message. He provided some videos of each of the components working, and it under power, and we agreed to meet up. In the meantime, i was researching (not very well) on what to look at to determine if it was worth the coin. The seller slashed the unit price almost in half, which made it super enticing, and prompted me to make the trip. I didn't have anyone local to consult, and a majority of the people in my field, don't buy these stand alone units, so it was hard to find someone with advice. This forum was useful in trying to figure out how to vet the machine, but upon arrival i knew i didn't bring enough tooling, nor did i really know scientifically how to determine what was a good buy. While looking for things that i should be reviewing before purchasing, i found a company that rebuilds spindles, and makes balancing stands for the wheels (as well as balancing hubs), so i wasn't concerned with the fact that the machine didn't come with those components.
Harig 6x18 with a walker chuck was the unit i was looking at, it had hydraulics to run power feeds both directions and the owner assured me of some of the hoses they replaced to make everything work. The limit switches and speed toggles all worked, as well as the cooling pumps, but the first thing i looked at were the ways. They looked, well worn, with large gouges in them, which was the first alarm. After noticing that, i put the machine in manual mode and checked backlash. The left to right feed of the table was INCREDIBLY tight, and it got even tighter in some areas - which i think means it was less worn in those areas, but this didn't make me confident as it seemed like it would be hard to do anything manually with this machine. All the adjustments were tight to be honest, but nothing like the left to right. The second alarm was the wheel look to be oscillating pretty hard under power, this could have been an illusion, or a wheel that needed to be dressed, but i was concerned about spindle bearings, and didn't bring a dial / base (because i don't own them, time to fix that) to inspect it. After that, i decided i wasn't going to pay premium coin for something that could be garbage, and i'd come here and seek more help. I've been browsing the forums, but i'm not finding any specifics of what i should be doing / looking for. If you have reference material i could review, or a post you found helpful, i'd love to enlighten myself. This won't be the only machine i plan to purchase, as a mill will be in the near future (bonus time makes for new tools
).
The questions i have are as follows: besides getting a machinist buddy to come (do they have a machinist mingle yet? LOL) with me and do the inspecting on some of these older machines that get posted on craigslist and ebay, what are things i can look for?
Grizzly has a unit that is 8x20 for 5500$? That seems like a decent price, and if new is the way to go, what do you think about that option? All opinions are welcome, thank you for coming to my ted talk.
Yesterday i took a 20 hour road trip to California to pick up what i thought to be the surface grinder to fix my problems. Spoiler alert: when i got there i realized just how in over my head i was, and walked away empty handed (I'll explain a little more in depth in a minute). I'm a knifemaker, looking to install a more permanent solution to grinding things flat(ish) and true, compared to my current setup. It something that a lot of people in this field end up resolving the way i did - a 2x72 belt grinder attachment that has a built in sine table to be able to grind accurate tapers. While the attachment works beyond well enough for what i use, there are more than a couple problems that make this system terrible.
First, the current chuck is like 2x12, which isn't enough width for what i like to make. Currently a lot of the projects in the shop are knives that are wider than 2", and i struggle to find a way to adequately compensate for this. It seems though the conventional stand alone units would pose the opposite issue - length. I think the perfect medium for me would be something like 6x18. This would allow me to continue to make full tang kitchen knives, but transition into folding knives later and parts that really need to accurately flat and true. Second, the chuck is always magnetized, so getting anything on or off it (especially if you go for a good surface finish) is a nightmare. The magnet picks up dust and particles, and it makes cleaning between each step a must, which leads to a really cumbersome process. Third, is rigidity. The system seems to move more than what i like, and feels to be really stressing everything to the limit (this might be a feels over reals thing for me, but what can i say). Overall though, it's worked till now and i can get a 8 inch part within .02" of each other (which for full tang knife making, is fine, but folders and precision work i'm LIGHTYEARS away).
Back to the trip yesterday, i found a unit on EBay that i thought looked promising, it was priced super high (which i correlated with a good condition unit), and shot the owner a message. He provided some videos of each of the components working, and it under power, and we agreed to meet up. In the meantime, i was researching (not very well) on what to look at to determine if it was worth the coin. The seller slashed the unit price almost in half, which made it super enticing, and prompted me to make the trip. I didn't have anyone local to consult, and a majority of the people in my field, don't buy these stand alone units, so it was hard to find someone with advice. This forum was useful in trying to figure out how to vet the machine, but upon arrival i knew i didn't bring enough tooling, nor did i really know scientifically how to determine what was a good buy. While looking for things that i should be reviewing before purchasing, i found a company that rebuilds spindles, and makes balancing stands for the wheels (as well as balancing hubs), so i wasn't concerned with the fact that the machine didn't come with those components.
Harig 6x18 with a walker chuck was the unit i was looking at, it had hydraulics to run power feeds both directions and the owner assured me of some of the hoses they replaced to make everything work. The limit switches and speed toggles all worked, as well as the cooling pumps, but the first thing i looked at were the ways. They looked, well worn, with large gouges in them, which was the first alarm. After noticing that, i put the machine in manual mode and checked backlash. The left to right feed of the table was INCREDIBLY tight, and it got even tighter in some areas - which i think means it was less worn in those areas, but this didn't make me confident as it seemed like it would be hard to do anything manually with this machine. All the adjustments were tight to be honest, but nothing like the left to right. The second alarm was the wheel look to be oscillating pretty hard under power, this could have been an illusion, or a wheel that needed to be dressed, but i was concerned about spindle bearings, and didn't bring a dial / base (because i don't own them, time to fix that) to inspect it. After that, i decided i wasn't going to pay premium coin for something that could be garbage, and i'd come here and seek more help. I've been browsing the forums, but i'm not finding any specifics of what i should be doing / looking for. If you have reference material i could review, or a post you found helpful, i'd love to enlighten myself. This won't be the only machine i plan to purchase, as a mill will be in the near future (bonus time makes for new tools
). The questions i have are as follows: besides getting a machinist buddy to come (do they have a machinist mingle yet? LOL) with me and do the inspecting on some of these older machines that get posted on craigslist and ebay, what are things i can look for?
Grizzly has a unit that is 8x20 for 5500$? That seems like a decent price, and if new is the way to go, what do you think about that option? All opinions are welcome, thank you for coming to my ted talk.
