PM935T Has landed

COMachinist said:
Well looks like I made a mistake ordering this from PM. I have had problems with replacement parts from them before. When I call the number it says the they are closed,and my emails for parts orders is going unanswered. I should have bought a South Ben mill from
Grizzly same mill with much better support and parts availability. They failed to get my order correct, the did not ship my DRO with the mill. Support is seams is highly over rated.
Very disappointed.
CH
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I'm sure Matt will take care of you, They have been slammed busy since covid hit and I'm sure fatigue is setting in and things can get overlooked when overtime has been the norm for years. Give him a chance.
 
COMachinist said:
I should have bought a South Ben mill from
Grizzly same mill with much better support and parts availability. They failed to get my order correct, the did not ship my DRO with the mill. Support is seams is highly over rated.
Very disappointed.
CH
Click to expand...
A PM 935T is not the same as a South bend mill.
 
Drives me nuts when I spend that much on a machine and I instantly have problems with it and cust service is un-helpful or even difficult.

Unfortunately, no matter how good QA is, theres always some machines that sneak through with “issues”.

Thats at understandable, but cust service being difficult there is no excuse for….


My sympathies for your troubles. Fingers crossed it works out for you.
 
great white said:
Drives me nuts when I spend that much on a machine and I instantly have problems with it and cust service is un-helpful or even difficult.
Click to expand...
No excuse for poor quality control. Unfortunately, you have already lost confidence in the product and the company.
Hey, maybe this is the only issue
Let's think positive but check everything :)
 
From the OP it sounded like the problem came from trying to rotate the head, possibly without supporting it as specified in the manual.

-----------------------
5 Copyright © 2021 Quality Machine Tools, LLCPM 935T v3 2021-05
Section 2 INSTALLATION

Moving the head
If it is necessary to swivel the head for hoisting purposes, partially
loosen the four head mounting bolts, Figure 2-1, while
supporting the head to prevent sudden movement. Continue
supporting the head while using a wrench on hex head #1,
Figure 2-2, to crank the head to the desired position. Tighten
the bolts in the diagonal sequence, Figure 2-1, first pass at 25
lb-ft torque, second pass at 50 lb-ft. Over-tightening can distort
the head, causing the quill to bind.
To tilt the head to the front or back, loosen the three bolts ar-
rowed in Figure 2-2, then turn hex head #2 while supporting
the head
--------------------

Obviously I wasn't there so I don't know the exactly what happened but it doesn't sound like an issue with quality control, but simply a mistake anyone not familiar with Bridgeport style machines could make. It's also possible the damage occurred in transit, and that PM was negligent for not tightening the bolts that hold the head down. If that's the case I would expect parts to be shipped without charge.

Despite my last name being Matthews I have no affiliation with PM and don't own any of their machines. However, from reading this forum it seems like they maintain a stellar reputation for quality and customer service overall. I'm confident the OP will get this issue addressed and ultimately be happy with the machine in question.

Parts were ordered a week ago so in my experience that's not an excessive amount of time to wait for orders to be processed and shipped out. Also, there's no guarantee that these particular parts are on the shelf in Pennsylvania, they may need to be sourced from Taiwan which could add more time to fulfillment.

In the mean time, it should be possible to lock the head in a vertical position and start making chips, since rotating is only one feature and not needed for the majority of mill operations. Yes, the heads on these machines are heavy, that's definitely a feature though.

As with any purchase it's up to the seller to make good with whatever the buyer ordered. I know that the owner and staff of PM sponsor and regularly monitor this forum so I fully expect this will get resolved.

John
 
matthewsx said:
From the OP it sounded like the problem came from trying to rotate the head, possibly without supporting it as specified in the manual.

-----------------------
5 Copyright © 2021 Quality Machine Tools, LLCPM 935T v3 2021-05
Section 2 INSTALLATION

Moving the head
If it is necessary to swivel the head for hoisting purposes, partially
loosen the four head mounting bolts, Figure 2-1, while
supporting the head to prevent sudden movement. Continue
supporting the head while using a wrench on hex head #1,
Figure 2-2, to crank the head to the desired position. Tighten
the bolts in the diagonal sequence, Figure 2-1, first pass at 25
lb-ft torque, second pass at 50 lb-ft. Over-tightening can distort
the head, causing the quill to bind.
To tilt the head to the front or back, loosen the three bolts ar-
rowed in Figure 2-2, then turn hex head #2 while supporting
the head
--------------------

Obviously I wasn't there so I don't know the exactly what happened but it doesn't sound like an issue with quality control, but simply a mistake anyone not familiar with Bridgeport style machines could make. It's also possible the damage occurred in transit, and that PM was negligent for not tightening the bolts that hold the head down. If that's the case I would expect parts to be shipped without charge.

Despite my last name being Matthews I have no affiliation with PM and don't own any of their machines. However, from reading this forum it seems like they maintain a stellar reputation for quality and customer service overall. I'm confident the OP will get this issue addressed and ultimately be happy with the machine in question.

Parts were ordered a week ago so in my experience that's not an excessive amount of time to wait for orders to be processed and shipped out. Also, there's no guarantee that these particular parts are on the shelf in Pennsylvania, they may need to be sourced from Taiwan which could add more time to fulfillment.

In the mean time, it should be possible to lock the head in a vertical position and start making chips, since rotating is only one feature and not needed for the majority of mill operations. Yes, the heads on these machines are heavy, that's definitely a feature though.

As with any purchase it's up to the seller to make good with whatever the buyer ordered. I know that the owner and staff of PM sponsor and regularly monitor this forum so I fully expect this will get resolved.

John
Click to expand...
Yeah I was supporting it with a tow strap looped around the motor and the drive section with chain host hooked to the strap. The swivel shaft would only turn a few turns, then it would lockup. I think there were bent teeth on the worm drive and 33 tooth gear. I hate to put it back together then, have to remove the head again to put the parts in it. I was worried that with out the gear and worm locked together during a heavy cut, would rotate, and break something else. That head is son of gun to get off, and back on. The head weighs a lot feels like 400+ lbs.
CH
 
COMachinist said:
Yeah I was supporting it with a tow strap looped around the motor and the drive section with chain host hooked to the strap. The swivel shaft would only turn a few turns, then it would lockup. I think there were bent teeth on the worm drive and 33 tooth gear. I hate to put it back together then, have to remove the head again to put the parts in it. I was worried that with out the gear and worm locked together during a heavy cut, would rotate, and break something else. That head is son of gun to get off, and back on. The head weighs a lot feels like 400+ lbs.
CH
Click to expand...
Hopefully they get back to you with parts availability after the weekend. Like I said earlier I have the old (non PM) version of one of these and think it's about perfect for the home shop.

John
 
Janderso said:
No excuse for poor quality control. Unfortunately, you have already lost confidence in the product and the company.
Hey, maybe this is the only issue
Let's think positive but check everything :)
Click to expand...
Nah, I’ve done QA before in the aerospace industry. Its a known fact that humans miss things from time to time. Theres no way to avoid humans missing something/making mistakes. Even the perfectionists will mess something up sooner or later. Its innate to our species. You accept that its going to happen and set up “traps“ at critical junctures in the work flow.

We used to catch things that got missed with 2 or 3 levels of QA, given how critical a failure could be. No one took offense when the next guy picked up something you missed, we were just happy it didn’t go out the door with a fault or “oversight”.

But something like a consumer level mill? You’d be lucky to have it go through one level of QA at the end and even then, humans make mistakes. QA adds cost and these businesses tend to operate on a fairly thin bottom line. More often than not, manufacturers do random QA checks, meaning they pull a random machine off the line and inspect it. If its good, they assume the rest of that production run is good. It makes more financial sense to do it that way than tear down every single machine off the line. Otherwise, the cost of the object woukd skyrocket.

its just the way things are in this world. The larger the production run, the more likely a few “duds” will get through. Its just a game of statistics.

Unless you want to embody aerospace level QA inspections, which is cost prohibitive for a consumer level product, things will get through.

Its why I typically tear down anything that is going to get critical (for me in my shop that is) use and inspect it myself. Even then, things still get missed.

Humans make mistakes. Fact of life. Just gotta deal with it when it happens.

Where you find out if you bought from an ethical seller is the customer service and how they handle a fault when it is brought to their attention.

I, personally, will never buy from Busy Bee ever again after having to deal with their so called “customer service”. They wouldn’t do a bloody thing for any of the issues I found on my mill. Every excuse under the sun from “the warranty doesn’t cover that” or “thats a wear item” or the most shocking answer I got: “we don’t consider that a problem we are going to fix”.

Seriously? A drive gear that chips off a tooth is a “wear item”? A chip shield that arrives ripped open “isn’t covered by the warranty”?

Busy Bee - Never again, not even a carpenters pencil….
 
Last edited:
great white said:
Unless you want to embody aerospace level QA inspections, which is cost prohibitive for a consumer level product, things will get through.
Click to expand...

...actually, the absolutely WORST way to try to assure quality, is by trying to "inspect in quality".

True high quality comes from manufacturing processes that make the product RIGHT the first time. This means process control. NOT inspection after the fact.

Each manufacturing operation must have the proper tools, trained technicians, good raw materials, etc, to assure a high level of "process capability." This means, that the manufacturing step is done right.

If done right, the QC check after everything is built, should be an afterthought.
 
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