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Bridgeport Power Feed 6f Motor Mount Question

Discussion in 'BRIDGEPORT MACHINES INC. & B'PORT CLONES' started by expressline99, Dec 14, 2016.

  1. expressline99

    expressline99 H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Two new switches ordered. If I'm lucky I'll get to do some testing this week once parts get in.

    There were 4 resistors that were waaay out of tolerance. The bad ones were rated at 18k, 27k, 300k and 2.7 million.

    I hope you guys are going to help me rebuild the top end. It's quite noisy.
     
  2. chips&more

    chips&more United States Active User Active Member

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    Nope, it was not any of those resistors. Good Job.
     
  3. expressline99

    expressline99 H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Well the bad ones are coming out. I went through every single one on the board by de-soldering one leg on each. Making sure that I put a sharpie "dot" next to
    each as I tested them. The resistors that were bad I bent the leg over that I had de-soldered which should make quick work when I get the replacements.

    This board, control panel, and switch setup should be in fantastic shape once I'm done learning! :)
     
  4. chips&more

    chips&more United States Active User Active Member

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    Most of the components on that board are not value sensitive. What I mean is, if the reading you get is out of tolerance to the posted value on the component, then chances are it’s OK. You should be looking for something that is dead, no longer any good and not just out of tolerance. I would not de-solder all those resistors and other things. All those 1/2 watt resistors are the last thing on the planet that would fail on that board. What is more likely to happen is damage to the copper circuit paths from all the de-soldering. Good Luck…Dave
     
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  5. expressline99

    expressline99 H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Hey Dave, I was lucky and very careful about de-soldering I tinned and cleaned the tip of the iron every time. So no excessive heat or lingering if it didn't flow right away. I won't de-solder almost everything next time. But it's hard for me to not get excited and jump right in.

    I came home today to find all my electronic goodies! It's like second Christmas! The only thing I'm disappointed in is the pot. The shaft is way too long. I'll have to dremel it to length. So I've got my new caps, switches, pot, and resistors. Hopefully I can do some dry runs...sans gearbox this weekend or perhaps tomorrow. I am thoroughly jazzed about all the parts.
     
  6. expressline99

    expressline99 H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    OK, on the motor direction switches are they adjusted to their "neutral" position? This being when the direction control handle is in neutral position.

    I assume this is correct? So that the any contacts marked "NC" are closed and the "NO"s are open?
     
  7. expressline99

    expressline99 H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Does anyone have an expanded diagram of the boehm 4640. Apparently I've got "spring" type disk and flat washer that go in some position on the non-output end of the shaft (I think) under the spring clip. I've forgotten how they go back in.

    Yesterday after putting this back together and hand spinning the motor it would go in one direction but spinning backwards would cause it to catch and drag on something. I assume it was an electrical line. Or perhaps the missing spring washer. So I'm going to put the spring washer in between the two flat washers I think it fits between and put it back in. If It binds up again I'm at a loss since the output side bearing was replace. It's possible that I'm not getting the armature lined up on the bearings properly? Guess I will try again tomorrow.
    Paul
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2017
  8. Rick_B

    Rick_B United States Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Hey Paul - don't know if you got by the preload washer issues or not - see below for what mine looked like on the output end

    Motor%20Preload_zpspjzhpugt.jpg

    Maybe you can help with an issue I am having regarding orientation of the clutch shaft - see next post

    Thanks
    Rick
     
  9. Rick_B

    Rick_B United States Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    So I've been pretty distracted with a variety of things going on and this is the first chance I have had to get back to this power feed. I've got the majority of the main housing re-assembled but have a question on the orientation of the clutch shaft. The clutch shaft has a woodruff key slot for the handle that I believe faces the back of the unit (assuming the access door with the sight glass is the front). This results in the drive pin hole on the clutch shaft facing the front to back. Also - at the other end - the narrow ridge faces front (this is the switch actuation end of the clutch shaft). I believe the cam detent faces the front and the large "V" that rides on the clutch arm detent roller faces right. Here's a few pictures of how I think the clutch shaft is assembled. I'm hoping someone can confirm this.

    Top (handle) end
    PICT0001_zpsrlim3cal.jpg

    Bottom (switch actuation end)
    PICT0002_zps9wduqgbg.jpg

    Thanks
    Rick
     
  10. expressline99

    expressline99 H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Hey Rick, That's exactly how mine is assembled.

    I've got mine assembled up to being able to test the wiring. The motor is detached from the gear housing. However, the Motor is still acting up and blowing fuses. I did get the motor to spin up but once moving the speed control wouldn't slow it down or change it's speed. Then blown fuse. I'm getting close to sending this in to someone that can handle the board and trouble shoot it and the wiring. I can't see that I'm any closer than I was when I started. :(


    Paul
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2017
  11. Rick_B

    Rick_B United States Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Thanks for the verification Paul - wish I could help you with the electrical side but you've already exceeded my knowledge and skills in that area.

    Mine was working fine before I started playing with it - hopefully I won't introduce any issues :)

    Rick
     
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  12. expressline99

    expressline99 H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    I appreciate the good thoughts Rick. :) I'm sure yours will be good to go.

    So should I be figuring out how to measure the output of power from the board to the motor while turning the new pot I put on there?

    Anyone have any idea what to test next? Before I throw $500 more at fixing this part. Probably without any direction I will start throwing money at it. Because I'm getting worn out on what should be something simple and my patience can only go so far. >insert grumbling here then ignore it<

    To recap current problem: I turn the on switch on. Pilot light turns on. I switch into gear and turn the pot. The motor doesn't start moving until I'm up to probably 25% 30% of speed. Once it starts turning the pot has no effect on speed and will not stop the motor from turning even if turned all the way down. If you turn the pot all the way up or somewhere near full speed it blows the fuse. Note the motor is not mounted to the gear box so there is no load on it.

    Thanks, Paul
     
  13. expressline99

    expressline99 H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    OK so quick question as I'm still slowly messing with this. Whenever I get a few minutes. I've got a guide for things to test on the motor. Can someone clarify on testing the resistance on several points of the armature. If I understand it correctly it's tested by probing each brush while mounted..(cover screw taken out of course)... Looking for 1 ohm across. Then turning it to a different spot and doing the same. Will this accomplish the 180 degree offset between contacts on the armature? Or should I just take the thing apart for this testing?

    I checked the field winding's and they aren't shorted to the casing so I assume the insulator/shellac/varnish(whatever that coating is) is still OK. Also I get close to the 500 ohm reading across the winding's (lead to lead). This with everything else pulled from the center casing.

    Everything I see says motor is OK...

    Still grinding at this until it's further exhausted.

    Paul
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2017
  14. expressline99

    expressline99 H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    This is the last time I put this motor together....I'm not going to do it again. Today. I've spent time messing with the switches and I've determined that they are adjusted fine. But I was getting odd readings with the wiring hooked up. So it might be wiring. I think the previous owner did some adjustment wiring.... So I will be rewiring next. I hope that is the end of it.
    Paul
     
  15. expressline99

    expressline99 H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    OK so after making sure all wires are properly attached to the switches. I'm getting proper ohm readings at idle position and if the wires are disconnected from the switch terminals. If either plunger is depressed the opposite switch has a reading of 552 ohms +/- all direction I read state it should either be Zero or infinite depending on position and never anything else. Does this mean my field windings are trash? See the picture. The motor field is connected to the Yellow and white wires to the left. (Also the board is detached while checking resistance.)
    DSCN4657.JPG
     
  16. expressline99

    expressline99 H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Could it possibly be a transistor? I put it all together today to test again. Same result. Nothing happens until I start turning the speed control up. Then it runs up I believe to full speed..if you turn the pot back down to zero nothing changes it keeps running. Then blows the fuse after a short while. The 500 +/- ohm resistance above must just be coming from the field windings from all simple deduction.
     
  17. expressline99

    expressline99 H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Well I gave up and mailed the board into a dealer. I was getting no where on my own. >Insert personal failure and let down here<
     
  18. expressline99

    expressline99 H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    LOL so the board is fine. I either fixed it or it was already OK... So I mailed in the motor today. Gotta love it. If they tell me the motor is fine...then there isn't much left but the wiring above or the on/off switch or the fast travel button. I almost hope it's the motor just so I can move on to the next part of the rebuild.
     
  19. expressline99

    expressline99 H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    So I found out today that the armature is shorted out. So I get to buy a new one...an extra $300 plus install. I'm letting them install it just so it comes back to me working and adjusted to the board. I thought I tested it out properly but I guess I didn't understand it as well as I thought I did.
     

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