Got My First Lathe... Logan 1875 - With Restoration.

[Mr Mike]

I got the bed completed.. The new spray guns worked out just ok with the PGP oil paint. The paint was a 2500 fast dry deep base, the Orifice was to small 1.0 on the detail gun for the viscosity of paint - that however worked really well for the Dark Gray because I needed it to be slow and accurate. But for the white I had to switch to the big gun for the second coat which was to slow - but a little faster with the 1.4 orifice, knew I should have gone with the 1.8 oh well.

I also switched and used the hi gloss white, because when I read the directions for the low sheen paint, It stated dry to touch after 4 hours and additional coats after 24 hours, I am doing this out doors so I had to pass on it.

The supports need more work before they are ready for paint, so I just did the bed today. There is orange peel - but it helps hide some of the imperfections in the bed. The paint job came out pretty Ok but ill use the 1.8 on the supports and see how that goes... If it goes well Ill give it a thumbs up using these guns with this paint, If not then Ill buy a hand held airless to do the pedestals and chip tray.

I did not do the testing I would normally do with a new paint elixir I'm not familiar with.. I just got very lucky the paint was forgiving - I did ask the paint people at PGP if there would be an Issue using a 1.0 orifice detail gun, they told me it would be slow but should be ok, The flow knob was wide open air at 25 Psi - there was no sputter or spiting and was going on even, but it felt more like air brushing then painting.

I inspected it after a couple hrs of drying, Its smooth all around with no dull dry looking spots so If it passed the fingernail test Friday I think we're golden.



For those wondering how I got a nice crisp paint line between the Dark Grey and White without taping, thats the reason for the 10" long bolts, They stand atop saw horse's without any obstruction to the ground so there is no blow back of the paint to contaminate the previous color. as long as your not putting it on so thick that it runs this will be the natural result.

 

[Laytonnz]

Nice work! Looks good, I had the same issue with a 1.5 and added some turps and turned the psi up on the compressor, I got more overspray but had a decent fan.

 

[Mr Mike]

Nice work! Looks good, I had the same issue with a 1.5 and added some turps and turned the psi up on the compressor, I got more overspray but had a decent fan.

Hi La...

My first issue is there are no coating instructions on the can.. Just warnings all over - which clearly states for professional use only, not for residential use. Obviously I should not be using it - But I did tell them I needed a paint that would hold up to Oils and Coolants for use on a Lathe... Not much info online either.

I'm doing the best I can here with what little info I have.. I got my fingers crossed that the 1.8 will have better results, I also have a 2.0 gun I could use - wonder if I should just try that instead..?
The nice thing about this paint is the re-coat time which has to be done within 2.5 hours, and dries to the touch in under 30 minutes.. the primer I used can be top coated almost immediately but before 24hrs, nice open window..!

The negative about this paint is you really need a spray booth for the fumes or be out doors in a large open area - Nasty stuff - regular mask wont help, Definitely not in a Garage.

 

[Laytonnz]

What i would do is download the MSDS - material data safety sheet, it should give all relevant info on product use.

If you can't find the MSDS online maybe ask the paint rep, they should have one in store. It should tell you how much you can thin for spray application.

That's nice and quick the stuff I used took ages! Over a week to be recoatable at probably. .. uhh 12 degrees during the day 5 overnight.

 

[Mr Mike]

What i would do is download the MSDS - material data safety sheet, it should give all relevant info on product use.

If you can't find the MSDS online maybe ask the paint rep, they should have one in store. It should tell you how much you can thin for spray application.

That's nice and quick the stuff I used took ages! Over a week to be recoatable at probably. .. uhh 12 degrees during the day 5 overnight.

Hi La..
I did search for and found a PDF with directions for the paint.. and it stated under the thinning options --> should not need thinning... lol
Well I'm sol for now paint wise so - the painting portion of the project is coming to a halt till I can figure out my painting issues.. I love the Bright White color but hate the gloss...

I'm currently looking for a Matt, Low Sheen, Eggshell finish to redo my lathe bed.. I'm just not happy with the results..

I have my want list regardless of whether its realistic or not.
1. Matt finish.
2. Can be sprayed. ( Even if I need to buy a better Pro Detail Gun )
3. Can be re-coated in less then 8 hrs.
4. between 30 to 60 minutes dry to the touch. ( I have no choice but to spray out doors ) so I'm at the mercy of the weather.
5. None yellowing Bright White. ( most oils yellow over time ) but they have modified ones that don't.
6. Water cleanup preferred but not required. ( They make an oil modified water based paint ) I'm looking into this.
7. Oil & Hot Chip Resistant.

See I'm not asking for much

 

[Mr Mike]

Hello peoples,
I'm having to go back over my lathe paint choices and redo some work, In a bind I settled for spraying a gloss coat on the bed... I made the exception because I thought I would be wasting a weekend - I know to stick to my guns, I didn't and now I'm not happy with my choice. So I need to take a couple steps back for peace of mind and deal with it now rather then later. My painting portion of the project is on hold till I solve the paint Issue. Ill still be working on other stuff.

The bed supports are going back in the for a 2nd electrolytic bath, They are in good enough condition that I could prime and paint them, but I would like to do some more electrolytic testing.

I'm doing the supports individually, one will be with 1/3 cup Sodium Carbonate and the other with just plain tap water. Both will have close to a 1.5 amps flow, to see what difference the washing soda makes if any.



Lots of pitting in the area of both supports where right angles meet.




Fresh tap water only to start and you can see the scrubbing bubbles at work. 5 pm.




Added 1/3 cup Sodium Carbonate and mixed to get to about 1.5 amps, withing 15 minutes the water turned colors. 5:30 pm




Elapsed time 2 hours 7 pm. You can see a froth starting to build.



Elapsed time 5.5 hours 10:30 pm.



This is a very interesting photo below. Billions of micro sized bubbles can be seen coming of the bottom and top of the bed support. ( site restriction on photos like this are a shame ), Not all but some bubbles below the anode are carrying what looks like rust.. None of the bubbles above the anode seem to have this feature.

I also have some cool video showing this in action, To bad it cant be posted directly to this site.



Elapsed time 14 hours 7 am. amps read 1.55 - Dont know why yet but the amps seem to drop then rais over time.


Elapsed time 22 hours 3 pm. The photos below show the before and after, the support came out looking great.. but there are still small black pits still left. I have no complaints and really feel this is supirour in every way to harsh chemical to remove rust as long as there are no time constraints.

I have a couple other ideas in mind - maybe pairing this and Evapo-Rust... Use electrolysis to remove all the massive rust and Evapo-Rust to get the remainder... I cant test that just yet or on these supports, but will in a future test.



Before the second electrolysis session. The first run was with the lathe bed.


The after shot looks Great, No visible rust just tiny black heavily pitted areas.
Its ready for paint but I have one more test with these supports - Id like to see if an extended length of time in electrolysis will remove the black from the pitted areas. Ill do both supports for that 2 day test. the total amount of time the supports were subjected to electrolysis at that point will be about 3 1/2 days.



This concludes the test for an electrolysis bath with 1/3 cup of Sodium Carbonate. The next support will be done with just tape water but at about the same amp flow. It may be a wast of time.. and may have no desirable effect cosmetically in the second bed supports outcome, If thats the case then we will know to use the Sodium Carbonate only as a current flow regulator of sorts.

 

[Mr Mike]

Second bed support, tap water only. electrolysis started at 4 pm.

The tank was completely cleaned and filled with fresh tap water, you can see an orange glow begin to start
around the second lathe bed support with in just a couple minutes.



Elapsed time 30 minutes, the whole tank is orange.



Elapsed time 4 1/2 hours 8:30 pm. The amps have dropped, and a thick froth is building very similar to the previous time laps lathe bed support post.
the water in the tank is clearing up as seen in the next photo.





Elapsed time 9 hours 1 am. Amps have gone down and there is very little change.
The water has cleared even more, to the point where you can see thru it.
If I had to bet on it i'd say my parts are as done..! That will have to be checked out in another test.





Elapsed time 15 hours 7 am. Amps have gone down more, The water is not as clear this morning.
You can see the rear Anode in the photo below this one taken at the same time, but not much past that. The froth looks normal as compared to all others.





Elapsed time 22.5 hours 2:30 pm. Amps have gone up some.
The froth is the same as expected, the water is getting cloudy as seen in the photo below this one..
You can just make out the rear Anode.





This support was done using plain water.



This support was done using Sodium Carbonate. There is virtually no difference between the two.



This ends this time laps posting, I've had fun and learned allot from doing this, but now this has left me with even more questions unanswered. will this madness ever end

 

[Bob Korves]

Second bed support, tap water only. electrolysis started at 4 pm.

The tank was completely cleaned and filled with fresh tap water, you can see an orange glow begin to start
around the second lathe bed support with in just a couple minutes.

View attachment 243431

Elapsed time 30 minutes, the whole tank is orange.

View attachment 243430

Elapsed time 4 1/2 hours 8:30 pm. The amps have dropped, and a thick froth is building very similar to the previous time laps lathe bed support post.
the water in the tank is clearing up as seen in the next photo.

View attachment 243428


View attachment 243429

This is a time laps Post please check back later for more updates on this tap water only electrolysis test.

I did not know that you could do electrolysis using just tap water. Clear, pure water is a poor conductor. I thought an electrolyte was needed for better current flow. You certainly seem to be proving otherwise.
http://www.waterboards.ca.gov/water_issues/programs/swamp/docs/cwt/guidance/3130en.pdf

 

[Mr Mike]

I did not know that you could do electrolysis using just tap water. Clear, pure water is a poor conductor. I thought an electrolyte was needed for better current flow. You certainly seem to be proving otherwise.
http://www.waterboards.ca.gov/water_issues/programs/swamp/docs/cwt/guidance/3130en.pdf

Hi Bob our tap water is not even close to pure here, besides being very hard water they add chemicals like fluoride and other goodies, and depending water softeners will add trace amounts too.
If you look at the post with the Sodium Carbonate you can see my anodes ( 43" steel bars ) are farther away from the bed support - almost flush with the edge of the tank, I had to move them closer to the bed support get the amp flow up in this run.

It is true that the purer the water, the higher the resistance, making it harder for electrons to flow. So your thinking is absolutely correct - The more electrolyte there is in the water the more conductive it is.

 

[Mr Mike]

We are back up to speed on the project. I used acetone to quickly to remove the uncured paint back to bare metal.
I then used filling primer and sanded a couple times to improve the finish quality, and bring the lathe back to a near new condition.



It didn't take to long. maybe a couple of hours to get the bed ready for painting.



You can see in the not yet sanded photo below the actual condition of the bed support.
This was the worst side of them all, but both bed supports had pitting issues on all four sides.



This is the after sanding photo below, and the product I used to smooth out and level the lathe bed, and both bed supports.
You can see by the amount of primer left after block sanding how bad the pitted areas are...
This primer was only use to fill and sand, another thiner harder primer was used for painting because the
filler primer will not dry as hard.



I used a washer seen below, that was close in size to support seats to cut the tape, making it
easy to peal off... then only have to sand the tiny area left painted.



The Lathe bed and supports came out looking almost factory fresh. There is still a few pitted areas left that I didn't tidy up.
I wasn't shooting for that new pristine car look, more like - how long has that lathe been sitting in an unopened box look.



These are the products I used in the photo below. I wanted to try, but failed at using a more robust product.
I returned to using what I'm familiar and have been very successful using in the past on other projects. so don't laugh.
They are oil based, but may or may not be able hold up to lathe abuse.



To finished the lathe bed and supports I used.
2 Coats of filling primer and sanding between coats, about two hours wait.
After the final sanding I used 1 Coat of the thiner automotive primer.
15 minutes after priming I used 2 coats of the flat white, 15 minutes apart.
Then 15 minutes after the final white coat, I used 3 coats of the satin clear, 15 minutes apart.
Painting out doors but not in direct sunlight, It will take a few days to get to hard,
The filling primer did a good job of filling the pits, machine marks and small dings.



Unfortunately the photo below does not show how nice it turned out, just the progress.




So basically after an additional week I'm back where I left off at... But I'm much happier I stopped an took the time to get it right. was it necessary, probably not but every now and again my OCD kicks in.

Next is the part I'm kinda dreading, the pedestals and chip pan are next.. Actually the chip pan looks to be in great shape, but theres allot of rust at the bottom of the pedestals and the right door is in bad shape.
I'm probably gonna have to get some help with the door issue. I could bend the top of the door back but the bottom is a whole other story. It has a compound bend in it that I'm not sure can be straitened.
I'll remove the door and take it to a sheet metal shop, have it fixed or replaced if I cant repair it my self.

At least painting these wont be to big an issue, I have a full size airless to paint them up lickety-split with the Dark Grey paint.. First Ill clean them up and remove all hardware out of them, and see just how bad they are.
Hmm what to do about the rust...