Dial Indicators

[RJSakowski]

View attachment 395345


RJ, this indicator shows 0.004 per revolution, 0.0001 per division, just as mksj says.

@mksj had stated .0004 per revolution so he errored by adding an extra decimal place. My error was not looking at the specs.

 

[RJSakowski]

@RJSakowski
Heh heh! Yes indeed. At some stage around 1326, Edward II decreed an inch was three fat barleycorns. So check out what your shoe sizes are today. That we always have units hangovers is a human thing, and not particularly "American" or "Portuguese" or whatever. Folk are OK with getting to use all sorts of units they can see advantages for, but they will resent like hell any attempt to force anything on them. For a whole lot of stuff, there is no particular need to change, and there would only be some costs involved if you do.

We have much less problem if the machine we covet and love, and do need for the business, was made in Germany, or Taiwan, or if the lovely gal we are smitten by would respond to carets (or fractions thereof) much like Jackie Evancho as Kitty, (or pre-dating me a bit), say Marilyn Monroe + Jane Russell !

Let me try for some more..
Fathoms. rods, perches, poles, bushels pecks, slugs. US gallons defined via the Queen Anne wine barrel. What's a ton? Oh yes - 2200lb. Huh? No, that's a "long ton"! Go for 2000 pounds. Umm, it does not take long for somebody to tell you pounds is a mass, and what it weighs kind of depends where you are. 1000kg = 1 metric ton. Oh yeah, that's about 2200 pounds weight, is it not? Did someone say there were 5280 yards in a mile? What's a furlong? Oh yeah, one side of an acre. The short side is a surveyor's chain = 1 cricket pitch worth!

Just lately, I have been getting used to eV (electron volts), barns (as in, could hit the side of a barn), and Angstrom Units.
I am somewhat in envy of the @kiwi_007 collection of dial indicators. Wow! Wish I had some of that kit!

[Edit - a "barn" is about the cross section area of a uranium nucleus ]

If I remember correctly, there was quite an uproar in the pubs when it was proposed that beer be sold by the liter or deciliter. Funny, they didn't complain about milk though. Here, we sell beer by the fluid ounce but hard liquor by the ml.

As for the stone, that may be a vanity thing. It sounds like less when you say you weigh 12 stone instead of 168 lbs.

 

[kiwi_007]

@RJSakowski
Heh heh! Yes indeed. At some stage around 1326, Edward II decreed an inch was three fat barleycorns. So check out what your shoe sizes are today. That we always have units hangovers is a human thing, and not particularly "American" or "Portuguese" or whatever. Folk are OK with getting to use all sorts of units they can see advantages for, but they will resent like hell any attempt to force anything on them. For a whole lot of stuff, there is no particular need to change, and there would only be some costs involved if you do.

We have much less problem if the machine we covet and love, and do need for the business, was made in Germany, or Taiwan, or if the lovely gal we are smitten by would respond to carets (or fractions thereof) much like Jackie Evancho as Kitty, (or pre-dating me a bit), say Marilyn Monroe + Jane Russell !

Let me try for some more..
Fathoms. rods, perches, poles, bushels pecks, slugs. US gallons defined via the Queen Anne wine barrel. What's a ton? Oh yes - 2200lb. Huh? No, that's a "long ton"! Go for 2000 pounds. Umm, it does not take long for somebody to tell you pounds is a mass, and what it weighs kind of depends where you are. 1000kg = 1 metric ton. Oh yeah, that's about 2200 pounds weight, is it not? Did someone say there were 5280 yards in a mile? What's a furlong? Oh yeah, one side of an acre. The short side is a surveyor's chain = 1 cricket pitch worth!

Just lately, I have been getting used to eV (electron volts), barns (as in, could hit the side of a barn), and Angstrom Units.
I am somewhat in envy of the @kiwi_007 collection of dial indicators. Wow! Wish I had some of that kit!

[Edit - a "barn" is about the cross section area of a uranium nucleus ]

There is only one in the photo that was bought "new" in New Zealand, the Mitutoyo 513-404 and that wasn't cheap, all my indicators were won/bought off Ebay over the last 24+ years and came from USA, EU, GB, Russia etc.
The used items that are available overseas are cheaper and in much better condition than what comes up for sale in NZ and the variety is also far superior.
BTW that is only about 1/3 of my dial indicator collection.

If anyone has a Moore & Wright or Starrett display cabinet for sale please let me know

 

[graham-xrf]

There is only one in the photo that was bought "new" in New Zealand, the Mitutoyo 513-404 and that wasn't cheap, all my indicators were won/bought off Ebay over the last 24+ years and came from USA, EU, GB, Russia etc.
The used items that are available overseas are cheaper and in much better condition than what comes up for sale in NZ and the variety is also far superior.
BTW that is only about 1/3 of my dial indicator collection.

If anyone has a Moore & Wright or Starrett display cabinet for sale please let me know

Wow! and Wow! On this site, there is always somebody who shows you how it's done!

That you have them all so carefully kept, laid out in the purpose-made box, shows the kind of pride and attention that I have to admit, I don't quite get up to in myself. I was always the untidy kid who went like hell for the end result, leaving a trail of mess behind him. Now that I have to pay up more for the stuff I have, and have to avoid the consequences of mess, I have now become more tidy. I have had some unfortunate experiences that have variously drawn blood, and one that left me temporarily poisoned (ingesting IPA mistaken for fruit juice).

I love your kit! Right now, I am debating with myself the relative worth of a Mitutoyo swing-lever dial gauge vs settling for some not-necessarily-crappy, but lower cost alternatives, and simply replacing later. I think I will fork out for the Mitutoyo. Something like a dial gauge one wants to use a lot, and know it will last for years.

 

[kiwi_007]

Wow! and Wow! On this site, there is always somebody who shows you how it's done!

That you have them all so carefully kept, laid out in the purpose-made box, shows the kind of pride and attention that I have to admit, I don't quite get up to in myself. I was always the untidy kid who went like hell for the end result, leaving a trail of mess behind him. Now that I have to pay up more for the stuff I have, and have to avoid the consequences of mess, I have now become more tidy. I have had some unfortunate experiences that have variously drawn blood, and one that left me temporarily poisoned (ingesting IPA mistaken for fruit juice).

I love your kit! Right now, I am debating with myself the relative worth of a Mitutoyo swing-lever dial gauge vs settling for some not-necessarily-crappy, but lower cost alternatives, and simply replacing later. I think I will fork out for the Mitutoyo. Something like a dial gauge one wants to use a lot, and know it will last for years.

Mitutoyo makes quality measuring tools, their dial test indicators were redesigned in 2017 and Long Island Indicator repairs consider the new models to be superior to the previous models. It's also interesting that they say the Mahr is a copy of the Mitutoyo only with a metal bezel.

Test Indicator Brand Comparison

Test Indicator Brand Comparison: Mitutoyo, Starrett, Bestest, Interapid and others.

www.longislandindicator.com

 

[mmcmdl]

There is only one in the photo that was bought "new" in New Zealand, the Mitutoyo 513-404 and that wasn't cheap, all my indicators were won/bought off Ebay over the last 24+ years and came from USA, EU, GB, Russia etc.
The used items that are available overseas are cheaper and in much better condition than what comes up for sale in NZ and the variety is also far superior.
BTW that is only about 1/3 of my dial indicator collection.

If anyone has a Moore & Wright or Starrett display cabinet for sale please let me know

These displays are pretty cool !

 

[ClintNZ]

A question for the DTI gurus... is it normal for a lever type indicator to fail to read when used on it's side? I just got my first one & when I lay it down to centre up an axial hole in work in the lathe chuck it won't read with the dial vertical. Reads fine tipped on it's back or standing up. But of course laid down with the dial vertical is where I'd always want it for indicating work in the 4-jaw...

Admittedly this is a very cheap one, no great loss if it's a dud. Is it worth opening it up to see what's falling out of whack or will that likely go very bad? A decent Mitutoyo or Starret is in the long term plan but my metrology spend since I got my new lathe & mill a couple of months back has now gone past the 4 figure mark so give me a break on that for now!

Cheers
Clint

 

[kiwi_007]

A question for the DTI gurus... is it normal for a lever type indicator to fail to read when used on it's side? I just got my first one & when I lay it down to centre up an axial hole in work in the lathe chuck it won't read with the dial vertical. Reads fine tipped on it's back or standing up. But of course laid down with the dial vertical is where I'd always want it for indicating work in the 4-jaw...

Admittedly this is a very cheap one, no great loss if it's a dud. Is it worth opening it up to see what's falling out of whack or will that likely go very bad? A decent Mitutoyo or Starret is in the long term plan but my metrology spend since I got my new lathe & mill a couple of months back has now gone past the 4 figure mark so give me a break on that for now!

Cheers
Clint

All my indicators work in whichever position I use them in so possibly your indicator, what brand is it?
If buying a indicator in New Zealand they aren't cheap, well except for the Chinese imports, Starrett indicators sold here are the cheaper line which are made in China, the US made ones have "American Made" on the dial.
My recommendation if buying new would be a Girod, swiss made

Dial Test Indicator Horizontal Range 0.8mm x .01mm 37mm Face 12mm Long Stylus

Swiss quality, high sensitivity repeatability and accuracy; durable and reliable; unaffected by magnetic fields; automatic reversal types which are fully jewelled with completely independent movement; supplied in case with carbide contact point (12mm stylus length modules only) and 8mm dia...

mytools.co.nz

Or Mitutoyo 513-404
Basic set

Mitutoyo DTI 0-0.8mm x 0.01mm Horizontal Type 513-404-10E

Provides easy access to shrouded surfaces that cannot be reached with conventional dial indicators. No-clutch structure for automatic reversal of measuring direction. Resistant to water and dust. The glare-free flat crystal face has a scratch-resistant coating. High sensitivity and quick...

mytools.co.nz

Full set

Mitutoyo DTI 0.01mm x 0.8mm 513-404T Full Set - Horizontal Type

Full set comes with clamp, holding bar, 1mm, 2mm & 3mm stylus and 4mm & 8mm stems.Provides easy access to shrouded surfaces that cannot be reached with conventional dial indicators. No-clutch structure for automatic reversal of measuring direction. Resistant to water and dust thanks to the...

mytools.co.nz

When I first got into machining I was told, "you will spend more on tools and tooling for machining than the machine cost'

Looking at the price of new tools, I would say I've got more than double in tools and tooling than my lathe and mill cost me.........lol

Kiwi

 

[Boswell]

Interesting problem. I thought that there is a direct mechanical connection between the lever and the dial. Possibly there is a gear that is loose so it does make good connection in certain orientations. Just a wild guess.

 

[ClintNZ]

Thanks Guys, the seller of the cheap DTI gave me a refund instantly after I mentioned the problem. May take it apart & check (never miss an excuse to dismantle something new!) It's like a rack is falling off the side of a pinion or something.

That is really good info for when I do get something decent thanks @kiwi_007 ! I notice the Girod has a 12mm long stylus & the Mitutoyo is 20mm - seems to me a bit longer stylus may be better but I've hardly used these things before so would welcome some advice on that.

Cheers
Clint