Hey RZ I have a TH42 as well mine has the pic-o-matic gearbox , you did good, I inherited a bare lathe and have almost what you have in yours just in accessories. I took mine completely apart just to get the ancient dried grease out of all the nooks and crannies . Mine had the optional Furnas drum switch but was wired for 220 with Fwd only I have switched it to 110 and fwd and rev. Its on the side line for now as my commuter truck lost a head gasket and its sailing season but I will get back to it in the fall. TJ
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Atlas QC10 purchase (was Request value input on a QC10F TH42)
- Thread starter rzbill
- Start date
- Joined
- Feb 16, 2017
- Messages
- 136
Just an update on my continueing life with the Atlas including how it has already saved the day.
Inspection and repair of the lathe:
I spent yesterday fixing the reversing lever and its mount that I spoke about earlier in the thread. I made a 1/2-20 to 3/8-16 insert out of a 1/2" bolt and installed it in the oversized hole in the hanger. Staked it with a punch on both sides in multiple spots. As a corolary, I tore into the QC gearbox. Similar to what I have found elsewhere, cup pointed setscrews wreaked havoc with the shafts. I cleaned them up. A few were in positions that I could put a flat on the shaft with the mill. Others got a brass pellet under the screw. I learned that one of the QC gear change handles is bent. It made the change gears misallign. On inspection it was evident that a couple of machined washers could move the gears in a manner to line things up. I did that instead of attempting to bend the zamax lever. I think I disassembled and reassembled the gears and shafts about 4 or 5 times before I got it how I liked it.
Spent a lot of time remounting the gearbox, the banjo and the reversing gears. I was pleased to see that I could get all the gear meshes where they should be just by fiddling with the slop in the various mounting points of the gearbox and tumbler system. I did learn that a lot of noise can come from gears that are running too tightly together. Oh yeah, looks like all the bearings in the QCGB housing were replaced (assuming originals were oilites) with std bronze. Two were not drilled for oil holes. Obviously bad. Fixed that.
The lathe makes its first contribution:
After I was kinda' done with the QC gearbox, I started working on the left front 4WD hub of my tractor. I had ordered parts a few weeks ago. I rebuilt the right one a few years ago. I went like expected (read major pain in the ***) including the use of all my big hammers and such. The showstopper happened when I found a new bearing would not slide onto a new kingpost shaft like it should. A pair of mics told the story. The shaft was 0.0006" too big. The Atlas is not up to cutting that but about 30 minutes with some 400 grit sandpaper with the shaft in the chuck brought it down perfectly. Took my time and stopped to measure frequently.
Lastly ... and this is for Robert. After all the lathe running today I noticed the front spindle dust seal was loose. I took off the chuck and removed the seal to check it out and reinstall. While in there, lo and behold was a dated Timken bearing outer race. 11-30-1945. Not sure what to make of the POs claim that the bearings were replaced.
Inspection and repair of the lathe:
I spent yesterday fixing the reversing lever and its mount that I spoke about earlier in the thread. I made a 1/2-20 to 3/8-16 insert out of a 1/2" bolt and installed it in the oversized hole in the hanger. Staked it with a punch on both sides in multiple spots. As a corolary, I tore into the QC gearbox. Similar to what I have found elsewhere, cup pointed setscrews wreaked havoc with the shafts. I cleaned them up. A few were in positions that I could put a flat on the shaft with the mill. Others got a brass pellet under the screw. I learned that one of the QC gear change handles is bent. It made the change gears misallign. On inspection it was evident that a couple of machined washers could move the gears in a manner to line things up. I did that instead of attempting to bend the zamax lever. I think I disassembled and reassembled the gears and shafts about 4 or 5 times before I got it how I liked it.
Spent a lot of time remounting the gearbox, the banjo and the reversing gears. I was pleased to see that I could get all the gear meshes where they should be just by fiddling with the slop in the various mounting points of the gearbox and tumbler system. I did learn that a lot of noise can come from gears that are running too tightly together. Oh yeah, looks like all the bearings in the QCGB housing were replaced (assuming originals were oilites) with std bronze. Two were not drilled for oil holes. Obviously bad. Fixed that.The lathe makes its first contribution:
After I was kinda' done with the QC gearbox, I started working on the left front 4WD hub of my tractor. I had ordered parts a few weeks ago. I rebuilt the right one a few years ago. I went like expected (read major pain in the ***) including the use of all my big hammers and such. The showstopper happened when I found a new bearing would not slide onto a new kingpost shaft like it should. A pair of mics told the story. The shaft was 0.0006" too big. The Atlas is not up to cutting that but about 30 minutes with some 400 grit sandpaper with the shaft in the chuck brought it down perfectly. Took my time and stopped to measure frequently.
Lastly ... and this is for Robert. After all the lathe running today I noticed the front spindle dust seal was loose. I took off the chuck and removed the seal to check it out and reinstall. While in there, lo and behold was a dated Timken bearing outer race. 11-30-1945. Not sure what to make of the POs claim that the bearings were replaced.
Last edited:
- Joined
- Dec 25, 2011
- Messages
- 10,552
Bill,
Thanks. But first, I don't have your machine in the database. This thread started out with you inquiring as to whether the asking price was reasonable. After you decided to buy it and later took possession, we never got back to your writing it up in the Serial Number thread at the top of the forum. And second, because of the bed swap, the serial number doesn't go with the bearing date. So if you want to write it up, I'll put it in the database. But the date won't help date machines that we don't have the bearing dates on.
On the PO's claim to have replaced the bearings, perhaps he only replaced the cones. Which incidentally, isn't a good idea in general.
Thanks. But first, I don't have your machine in the database. This thread started out with you inquiring as to whether the asking price was reasonable. After you decided to buy it and later took possession, we never got back to your writing it up in the Serial Number thread at the top of the forum. And second, because of the bed swap, the serial number doesn't go with the bearing date. So if you want to write it up, I'll put it in the database. But the date won't help date machines that we don't have the bearing dates on.
On the PO's claim to have replaced the bearings, perhaps he only replaced the cones. Which incidentally, isn't a good idea in general.
- Joined
- Feb 16, 2017
- Messages
- 136
Right on both counts of course. It would not bother me if a moderator could change the title to something like Atlas QC10 purchase and rework or similar. I'd kinda like to keep info on this machine in one thread and the title no longer applies.
Could even use the title Atlas Frankenstein since it also describes the uselessness of going after serial numbers on this machine.
Could even use the title Atlas Frankenstein
since it also describes the uselessness of going after serial numbers on this machine.
- Joined
- Dec 25, 2011
- Messages
- 10,552
Done. Actually, the term "Frankenstein" or "Frankenstein Lathe" usually means something a little more drastic than just replacing the bed or updating the machine by adding a QCGB or the later cross slide and compound upper swivel. As these are all things that were supported or encouraged by the factory. Most common example would be a 10D or earlier or a 101.07402 or earlier that has been essentially converted into a 10F or 101.07403 by changing the carriage assembly, headstock. lead screw and change gears to the final version. Depending upon what the original lathe started life as, in the extreme case, all that would be left would be the bed and legs. And maybe the tailstock and countershaft assembly.
Last edited:
- Joined
- Feb 16, 2017
- Messages
- 136
My compliments to the Clausing group.
I called them yesterday to inquire and order a few gears for the skirt. (Mitre gear for one since its key is just a sliver)
Honestly, due to the age of these lathes, I expected to be treated like a red headed stepchild waiting for somebody to dust off the old books and then check stock.
Could not have been further from my expectations.
Service was courteous, knowledgable and immediate.
"Well done" to Clausing.
I called them yesterday to inquire and order a few gears for the skirt. (Mitre gear for one since its key is just a sliver)
Honestly, due to the age of these lathes, I expected to be treated like a red headed stepchild waiting for somebody to dust off the old books and then check stock.
Could not have been further from my expectations.
Service was courteous, knowledgable and immediate.
"Well done" to Clausing.
- Joined
- Jun 11, 2013
- Messages
- 731
Another place for atlas parts, and cheaper than clausing is mymachineshop.net
- Joined
- Feb 16, 2017
- Messages
- 136
Thanks Steve, I think I saw that recently but have not explored it sufficiently.
I took a 'staycation' this week for home hobbies like farming and bees and stuff. It includes playing with the lathe.
Because of commentary here and by Tubalcain videos about Atlas feed being too coarse, a goal was to see how small a feed value I could get on the QC lathe with the application of the standard set of 10F (non-QC) change gears and a few others that came with the purchase.
I looked at the Atlas10QCgearsetup download but some of those gears are not included in what I have on hand.
SO, I laid the gears on the bench and messed about until I got the largest ratios I could mount on the banjo.
Installed and turned the spindle 10 revs while measuring the carriage travel. Got ten thou movement or approx .001" per rev. !
That surprised me so I did some gear math and it shows I should be at 0.00092"/rev. (I think).
For posterity sake, this is the setup, listed in same format as the download:
Feed 0.00092
TPI ~1082
Position A Near 24 Far 48
Position B Near 54 Far 24
Position D Near SS Far 52
Compound 16
Left Lever E
Right Lever 9
Used this to cut on a piece of mystery steel. Hot rolled I think. Lots of chatter and poor surface finish at first. Tightened the spindle bearings per the instructions (not enough preload) and that put surface finish in the ballpark but I think I can get even better with cutter improvement. The cutters I have are brazed insert cutters from India. Zero rake. I did some shimming in the QCTP to get a few degrees of rake. I tried my general purpose pedestal grinder but the wheel I have did not touch the carbide much at all. I think my next task is to get set up to sharpen and properly profile the bits. I saw a post here about using diamond coated dremel discs from Horror Fright. Probably try those since they are cheap. If they don't pan out I'll start looking for a small pedestal grinder for bits.
I took a 'staycation' this week for home hobbies like farming and bees and stuff. It includes playing with the lathe.
Because of commentary here and by Tubalcain videos about Atlas feed being too coarse, a goal was to see how small a feed value I could get on the QC lathe with the application of the standard set of 10F (non-QC) change gears and a few others that came with the purchase.
I looked at the Atlas10QCgearsetup download but some of those gears are not included in what I have on hand.
SO, I laid the gears on the bench and messed about until I got the largest ratios I could mount on the banjo.
Installed and turned the spindle 10 revs while measuring the carriage travel. Got ten thou movement or approx .001" per rev. !
That surprised me so I did some gear math and it shows I should be at 0.00092"/rev. (I think).
For posterity sake, this is the setup, listed in same format as the download:
Feed 0.00092
TPI ~1082
Position A Near 24 Far 48
Position B Near 54 Far 24
Position D Near SS Far 52
Compound 16
Left Lever E
Right Lever 9
Used this to cut on a piece of mystery steel. Hot rolled I think. Lots of chatter and poor surface finish at first. Tightened the spindle bearings per the instructions (not enough preload) and that put surface finish in the ballpark but I think I can get even better with cutter improvement. The cutters I have are brazed insert cutters from India. Zero rake. I did some shimming in the QCTP to get a few degrees of rake. I tried my general purpose pedestal grinder but the wheel I have did not touch the carbide much at all. I think my next task is to get set up to sharpen and properly profile the bits. I saw a post here about using diamond coated dremel discs from Horror Fright. Probably try those since they are cheap. If they don't pan out I'll start looking for a small pedestal grinder for bits.
Last edited:
- Joined
- Feb 16, 2017
- Messages
- 136
Milestone today. I made something I thought was good enough to put on the POTD thread.
Potd - Project Of The Day- What Did You Do In Your Shop Today?
Continueing to putz with the machine. Recently read a thread here about spindle bearing temperature. Mine were COLD so they became targets for tightening up further. Ran the spindle at high speed for 20 minutes and tightened the spindle as much as I could with a light hammer applied to an allen wrench in the spindle nut set screw. Basically got to 'three teeth' past original hand tight. Ran for another 20 minutes and bearings still stayed cool.
I still have not put the lathe into its 'home'. Its still on moving rollers, not level, etc etc etc. The girl is waiting on me to get some leveling feet installed.
Afterwards, work is going to be customization of the cross and compound lead screw mounts. Cheezy. Needs thrust bearings.
The lead screws and nuts are tight but the screw mounts wont operate without 5 to 10 thou 'backlash" slop.
Potd - Project Of The Day- What Did You Do In Your Shop Today?
Continueing to putz with the machine. Recently read a thread here about spindle bearing temperature. Mine were COLD so they became targets for tightening up further. Ran the spindle at high speed for 20 minutes and tightened the spindle as much as I could with a light hammer applied to an allen wrench in the spindle nut set screw. Basically got to 'three teeth' past original hand tight. Ran for another 20 minutes and bearings still stayed cool.
I still have not put the lathe into its 'home'. Its still on moving rollers, not level, etc etc etc. The girl is waiting on me to get some leveling feet installed.
Afterwards, work is going to be customization of the cross and compound lead screw mounts. Cheezy. Needs thrust bearings.
The lead screws and nuts are tight but the screw mounts wont operate without 5 to 10 thou 'backlash" slop.
Last edited:
- Joined
- Dec 25, 2011
- Messages
- 10,552
Actually, you can get the cross feed screw end float down to about 0.001". If the best that you can do with end float is 0.010", something is definitely wrong. It's been a while and I think it was done on a 10" and/or 12", but there have been several projects reported where the owner installed a ball thrust bearing. However, with a stock nut and cross feed screw, 0.010" is about as good as you are going to get it.
What you are probably measuring is running clearance between the cross feed screw and nut. Another member recently came up with a possible solution to that. Time will tell how long it lasts. He also added a felt wiper and oiler to the nut. Instructions are in a recent thread (sometime over the past week, I think).
What you are probably measuring is running clearance between the cross feed screw and nut. Another member recently came up with a possible solution to that. Time will tell how long it lasts. He also added a felt wiper and oiler to the nut. Instructions are in a recent thread (sometime over the past week, I think).