-
Welcome back Guest! Did you know you can mentor other members here at H-M? If not, please check out our Relaunch of Hobby Machinist Mentoring Program!
Atlas QC10 purchase (was Request value input on a QC10F TH42)
- Thread starter rzbill
- Start date
- Joined
- Dec 25, 2011
- Messages
- 10,552
Yes, I agree.
Bill, I think that I recall now that the Chinese company using the Phase II trade name bought the QCTP design from Yuasa. Yuasa is still in business but apparently no longer make tool holding systems. But if Phase II made an accurate copy, it is a good design. And probably 20 years newer than mine.
On the Z-bracket and belt cover, it would appear that it is attached to the movable part of the countershaft. Which probably wasn't a good idea. The fixed part of the original change gear guard mounting bracket is in your third photo, front row to the left of the tumbler.
It would appear, then, that the nameplate on the bed goes to the bed. There is a small chance that the serial number might be of some use. You will find it, sometimes with prefix letter or letters, stamped into the top of the front way at the right (tailstock) end. At the right end of the rear row of your fourth photo is what might be the original gear guard (from before the addition of the QCGB). I can't tell from your photos whether or not the newer gear guard is 10-1504B or not. But if so, I don't see in any of your photos 10-1504T (which covers the left end of the spindle and part of the tumbler. If you go to DOWNLOADS, drill down to the Altas manuals and get "Atlas Lathe 10F Series Parts 10L-6 Rev5.PDF", on file page 10 you will see your version of the 10" QCGB. It shows what should be there.
The number that you would find inside the headstock casting is almost certainly 10A-2B, common to all 10F's.
Bill, I think that I recall now that the Chinese company using the Phase II trade name bought the QCTP design from Yuasa. Yuasa is still in business but apparently no longer make tool holding systems. But if Phase II made an accurate copy, it is a good design. And probably 20 years newer than mine.
On the Z-bracket and belt cover, it would appear that it is attached to the movable part of the countershaft. Which probably wasn't a good idea. The fixed part of the original change gear guard mounting bracket is in your third photo, front row to the left of the tumbler.
It would appear, then, that the nameplate on the bed goes to the bed. There is a small chance that the serial number might be of some use. You will find it, sometimes with prefix letter or letters, stamped into the top of the front way at the right (tailstock) end. At the right end of the rear row of your fourth photo is what might be the original gear guard (from before the addition of the QCGB). I can't tell from your photos whether or not the newer gear guard is 10-1504B or not. But if so, I don't see in any of your photos 10-1504T (which covers the left end of the spindle and part of the tumbler. If you go to DOWNLOADS, drill down to the Altas manuals and get "Atlas Lathe 10F Series Parts 10L-6 Rev5.PDF", on file page 10 you will see your version of the 10" QCGB. It shows what should be there.
The number that you would find inside the headstock casting is almost certainly 10A-2B, common to all 10F's.
- Joined
- Feb 16, 2017
- Messages
- 136
Thanks again.
I'll keep the belt guard comments in mind and change it as needed.
I have a borescope at the hangar I will try to remember to bring home today. should be able to see the casting number with that.
I hooked up the motor and ran the countershaft, back gear and spindle. Surprisingly quiet (based on 'noisy' comments here and on MrPetes vids) but maybe its just a matter of lower RPM I happen to have the belts in.
I have the threading gears removed (because there are some discrepancies in the QCGB installation) so did not get to hear that.
FIRST SHOW STOPPER.
The motor is bleeding voltage. Of course it is a non polarized plug as was common in the day. Plug it in one way and I have voltage on the lathe frame while the lathe is not running. Flip over the plug and then the voltage on the lathe is evident with the motor running. I took the motor apart and as expected the wire insulation is in less than optimum condition. Measuring the leak gives roughly 46 ish volts. I can't see much wrong with the lacquer on the winding wires though. I have started looking for a replacement motor (new) but I see frame numbers have changed a lot. I can't find any reference to a 118C frame motor. I've measured and looked on the web a bit only to realize an adapter plate is a certainty.
There must have been others in this situation before. Anyone care to comment on replacement motor selection?
I'll keep the belt guard comments in mind and change it as needed.
I have a borescope at the hangar I will try to remember to bring home today. should be able to see the casting number with that.
I hooked up the motor and ran the countershaft, back gear and spindle. Surprisingly quiet (based on 'noisy' comments here and on MrPetes vids) but maybe its just a matter of lower RPM I happen to have the belts in.
I have the threading gears removed (because there are some discrepancies in the QCGB installation) so did not get to hear that.
FIRST SHOW STOPPER.
The motor is bleeding voltage. Of course it is a non polarized plug as was common in the day. Plug it in one way and I have voltage on the lathe frame while the lathe is not running. Flip over the plug and then the voltage on the lathe is evident with the motor running. I took the motor apart and as expected the wire insulation is in less than optimum condition. Measuring the leak gives roughly 46 ish volts. I can't see much wrong with the lacquer on the winding wires though. I have started looking for a replacement motor (new) but I see frame numbers have changed a lot. I can't find any reference to a 118C frame motor. I've measured and looked on the web a bit only to realize an adapter plate is a certainty.
There must have been others in this situation before. Anyone care to comment on replacement motor selection?
- Joined
- Feb 16, 2017
- Messages
- 136
My better half was working today so I had the afternoon to keep working on the lathe.
I fully disassembled the motor and did a detailed cleaning first. The bearings were chock full of baked grease and of course there was black sticky dust all over as one would expect on any old motor. The bearings came clean and felt good so they were regreased and used. Bearing size 202SF if anyone cares. I wrapped all the old stator and capacitor wires with high temp fiberglass electrical tape in the hopes that would fix the electrical leaking problem. Reassembled. Ran smooth and quiet but still have the electrical problem. As mentioned previously, depending on the orientation of the 2 wire plug, I would have 110V on the frame either while it was running or while it was off. Not both.
I decided to use a workaround rather than go the motor replacement route. I replaced the power cord with 3 prong plug to make it a one way only plug into the wall outlet. I chose the wiring orientation to fix the 110V on the frame while running but leave the 110v on the frame while off problem. To deal with that, I then replaced the single pole motor switch (breaks only one of the two lines going to the motor) with a double pole switch that breaks both lines going to the motor. This fixes the 110V on the motor frame while"off" problem.
Sooo.... it worked and then I got 'antsy' to cut some metal.
I chucked up a tiny rod of aluminum and made a few cuts. Had to tighten a few things I overlooked but so far so good.
I still have some work to do on the gear train. I want to PM the QCGB and I have a descrepancy with the FWD/REV tumbler gears. Specifically the FWD/REV gears are not lining up or engaging like they should because the tumbler arm mount (the piece that has the FWD/OFF/REV holes is not right ). The tumbler arm pivot point is too far away from the spindle. Secondarily, there is something screwy with the bearing stud that occupies the pivot point. The male thread is too small for the thread in the tumbler arm mount. The PO epoxied a smaller thread nut on the back side of the mount. Fine, but Atlas did not plan on room for that nut so it is pushing a lot of stuff out of alignment. What size thread is supposed to be on that? Need to determing whether I am looking at a 50 year old manufacturing error by Atlas or a jury rig by a PO that did not have the right parts.
I know the above needs pics but I'm bushed. Maybe later.
Happy day overall.
I fully disassembled the motor and did a detailed cleaning first. The bearings were chock full of baked grease and of course there was black sticky dust all over as one would expect on any old motor. The bearings came clean and felt good so they were regreased and used. Bearing size 202SF if anyone cares. I wrapped all the old stator and capacitor wires with high temp fiberglass electrical tape in the hopes that would fix the electrical leaking problem. Reassembled. Ran smooth and quiet but still have the electrical problem. As mentioned previously, depending on the orientation of the 2 wire plug, I would have 110V on the frame either while it was running or while it was off. Not both.
I decided to use a workaround rather than go the motor replacement route. I replaced the power cord with 3 prong plug to make it a one way only plug into the wall outlet. I chose the wiring orientation to fix the 110V on the frame while running but leave the 110v on the frame while off problem. To deal with that, I then replaced the single pole motor switch (breaks only one of the two lines going to the motor) with a double pole switch that breaks both lines going to the motor. This fixes the 110V on the motor frame while"off" problem.
Sooo.... it worked and then I got 'antsy' to cut some metal.
I chucked up a tiny rod of aluminum and made a few cuts. Had to tighten a few things I overlooked but so far so good.
I still have some work to do on the gear train. I want to PM the QCGB and I have a descrepancy with the FWD/REV tumbler gears. Specifically the FWD/REV gears are not lining up or engaging like they should because the tumbler arm mount (the piece that has the FWD/OFF/REV holes is not right ). The tumbler arm pivot point is too far away from the spindle. Secondarily, there is something screwy with the bearing stud that occupies the pivot point. The male thread is too small for the thread in the tumbler arm mount. The PO epoxied a smaller thread nut on the back side of the mount. Fine, but Atlas did not plan on room for that nut so it is pushing a lot of stuff out of alignment. What size thread is supposed to be on that? Need to determing whether I am looking at a 50 year old manufacturing error by Atlas or a jury rig by a PO that did not have the right parts.
I know the above needs pics but I'm bushed. Maybe later.
Happy day overall.
Last edited:
- Joined
- Feb 16, 2017
- Messages
- 136
Attached are a couple of photos. One is of the tumbler mount that I complained about in the message above. I am looking for feedback from other ATLAS QC10 owners to tell me which part is wrong, the mount or the stud? Stud is 3/8"-16. Mount has a 1/2"-13 tapped hole with a 3/8"-16 thin nut epoxied to the back of the mount. Currently the stud is only engaging the epoxied nut. I suspect the mount plate is wrong. Please confirm.
The other pic is of a belt guard built by a PO that Robert and I discussed earlier in the thread. I assembled it today and actually it is fine as it is. The guard is 100% cantilevered off the moving part of the jackshaft pivot assy. That keeps it centered on the big pulley. The bottom part that covers the motor pulley moves a little, when the belt is loosened, in relation to motor centerline but not enough to cause any issue. I'll leave it like it is.
The other pic is of a belt guard built by a PO that Robert and I discussed earlier in the thread. I assembled it today and actually it is fine as it is. The guard is 100% cantilevered off the moving part of the jackshaft pivot assy. That keeps it centered on the big pulley. The bottom part that covers the motor pulley moves a little, when the belt is loosened, in relation to motor centerline but not enough to cause any issue. I'll leave it like it is.
Last edited:
- Joined
- Dec 25, 2011
- Messages
- 10,552
On the tapped hole in the 10-1502 Hanger, I am pretty sure that it should be 3/8"-16. Call Clausing and ask them whether they have the drawing on 10-1502. If they do and don't have the part, ask them to email you the drawing. If they do have the part, they will not send you the drawing but should be willing to look at the drawing and tell you what the thread is. If they have neither the part nor the drawing, then repeat for the 10-1547 Stud.
Assuming that it should be 3/8", to repair it get a piece of 1018 or 12L14 (machines better) 1/2" diameter and thread about an inch of it 1.2-13. Before cutting it off to a length equal to the thickness of the Hanger plus the thickness of the jam nut, drill and tap it 3/8"-16. Cut it off and dry fit it first to be sure that it works and that the length is OK. Once you're satisfied with it, stud lock it and the jam nut to the hanger.
If you haven't found them yet, both the parts manual and the operating manual for the 1500 (and the 6800) are in DOWNLOADS. You will notice that the tapped hole is not even shown on the 10-1502 in the parts manual. If you get the drawing of the 10-1502, upload it here into the folder/category in DOWNLOADS for Atlas Lathe drawings, and I'll fix the hanger drawing.
Assuming that it should be 3/8", to repair it get a piece of 1018 or 12L14 (machines better) 1/2" diameter and thread about an inch of it 1.2-13. Before cutting it off to a length equal to the thickness of the Hanger plus the thickness of the jam nut, drill and tap it 3/8"-16. Cut it off and dry fit it first to be sure that it works and that the length is OK. Once you're satisfied with it, stud lock it and the jam nut to the hanger.
If you haven't found them yet, both the parts manual and the operating manual for the 1500 (and the 6800) are in DOWNLOADS. You will notice that the tapped hole is not even shown on the 10-1502 in the parts manual. If you get the drawing of the 10-1502, upload it here into the folder/category in DOWNLOADS for Atlas Lathe drawings, and I'll fix the hanger drawing.
- Joined
- Feb 16, 2017
- Messages
- 136
Thanks Steve,
I made a thread insert last night so I can stake that into the hanger when I get back home this weekend.
I think the PO used a different stud too because the male thread sticks out well past the end of the casting (to engage the epoxied nut), not flush on the original casting like yours.
I have an inquiry in to Clausing. I'll post anything useful that I get back.
I made a thread insert last night so I can stake that into the hanger when I get back home this weekend.
I think the PO used a different stud too because the male thread sticks out well past the end of the casting (to engage the epoxied nut), not flush on the original casting like yours.
I have an inquiry in to Clausing. I'll post anything useful that I get back.