Tool selection for a PM1030V

[OutaTheBox]

I am relatively new to turning and have outgrown my Grizzly 7x14. i have a 1030V on order and need to also order some tools. I have ground some bits before, mostly one off form tools, but to be honest i'd rather be cutting metal and making stuff rather than perfecting the art of grinding bits. So i'm looking at insert tools. I had read somewhere that lower powered lathes like the 1030 would be happier with triangle inserts than diamond shape inserts and HSS would generally be a better choice than Carbide. Given that, i was going to buy some 1/2" tools that will take TCMT32.5x carbide inserts and then get some T15 HSS TPMB-322 inserts from AR Warner.
Two questions:
1. Are my assertions correct, does my plan make sense?
2. Other than the price , what is the difference between an expensive insert tool and a moderately priced insert tool? specifically will there be a noticeable difference in rigidity, and/or is it a matter of "(insert) fit and finish"

Peter

 

[jwmay]

1. Your plan is logical within the constraints of your stated preferences.

2. Within my own limited experience with industrial grade tooling, the difference does exist. Industrial grade tooling is “better”. You will experience greater rigidity as a result of greater mass. You will probably experience better finish as a result of more expensive inserts from reputable US based machine tool vendors.

At the hobby level, we often prioritize a lot of affordable tooling over a little bit of industrial grade tooling.

The best equipped hobby shops are either built with used industrial grade stuff, or budgets that most of us couldn’t justify.

If you want to know about insert tooling, we have a member with the username davidpbest, who I believe literally wrote a book on the subject. Search out his content!

And besides him, there’s a bunch of guys who (unlike me) aren’t stricken with sudden bouts of dyslexia when confronted with names like CCMNG, or CCMT.

All my industrial grade tooling was used when I got it. I do tend to favor it. Besides quality, they tend to offer greater ease of use and reliability. And some of it was all used up by the time I got it.

 

[davidpbest]

If you want to know about insert tooling, we have a member with the username davidpbest, who I believe literally wrote a book on the subject. Search out his content!

Indeed. More info here.

David P. Best - Selected Resources for Machinists

Sharing technical resources, opinions, and anecdotes about machining and equipment.

www.hobby-machinist.com

My suggestion for a newcomer to indexable tooling is to purchase three basic tools from known brands. It’s all detailed in the book. Nothing is more frustrating than getting poor results with your indexable toolong and not knowing if it’s your technique, or if it’s the toolholder or insert you bought on the cheap.

 

[OutaTheBox]

Thanks JW and David! - will check out Davids Resources.

 

[OutaTheBox]

David, just looked thru your table of conternts and noticed you don't cover T15 HSS inserts like the ones from AR Warner.

I had consistently good results with these on the 7x14. One nice aspect to these is that they are extremely easy to sharpen - just lay them flat on a stone and hone...no critical angles to regrind

 

[davidpbest]

David, just looked thru your table of conternts and noticed you don't cover T15 HSS inserts like the ones from AR Warner.

I had consistently good results with these on the 7x14. One nice aspect to these is that they are extremely easy to sharpen - just lay them flat on a stone and hone...no critical angles to regrind

The AR Warner tools and inserts are fully reviewed and covered in my book.

About my book "Introduction to Indexable Tooling for the Metal Lathe"

Some of the members here on Hobby-Machinist ask questions about my book “Introduction to Indexable Tooling for the Metal Lathe”. So, I thought I would post some sample pages from the book, to give an overall flavor of the writing style, and include the complete Table of Contents as an attachment...

www.hobby-machinist.com

 

[mikey]

Peter, your first investment should be to buy, read and follow the advice on David's book. It is the single best resource of it's kind and will save you money in the long run.

I'm a proponent of HSS tooling on smaller lathes. The problem with this is that you have to learn to grind good tools. For me, nothing is simpler but I remember how it was in the beginning; not so simple. Accordingly, I agree with trying insert tooling.

David recommends three basic tools and I would follow his advice. The difference between better turning tools and cheap crap is the fit of the insert in the pocket. Good inserts fit better, cut better and last longer. I've been using inserts for over 35 years and am convinced this is true.

With that said, one of David's recommendations is tooling that takes CCMT/CCGT inserts. I believe these turning tools will also accept CCMW HSS T-15 insert from AR Warner and is the way I would go. Buy at least one good turning tool from a good maker - Seco, Iscar, Valenite, Kennametal, etc. - and also buy a small supply of inserts from the same maker. It will cost a bit more but they will last longer. I have insert that are on the same point after years of use, honest. I would also buy a few CCMW inserts from AR Warner and see how they work for you. These inserts are flat on top and are simple to sharpen as you well know. Avoid the triangle inserts. They are an older and less efficient design.

Do yourself a favor and don't give up on tool grinding. A good HSS tool with the proper geometry will very likely outperform your inserted tool. I have decades of experience with HSS tools and while I may be in the minority, I am confident in taking this position for smaller lathes like ours.

Best of luck. Go buy David's book and listen to him.

 

[Tammy63]

I have the 1030 and use the CCMT/CCGT inserts PM sells and they work really well.

 

[OutaTheBox]

I will go read the book!

 

[verbotenwhisky]

I am relatively new to turning and have outgrown my Grizzly 7x14. i have a 1030V on order and need to also order some tools. I have ground some bits before, mostly one off form tools, but to be honest i'd rather be cutting metal and making stuff rather than perfecting the art of grinding bits. So i'm looking at insert tools. I had read somewhere that lower powered lathes like the 1030 would be happier with triangle inserts than diamond shape inserts and HSS would generally be a better choice than Carbide. Given that, i was going to buy some 1/2" tools that will take TCMT32.5x carbide inserts and then get some T15 HSS TPMB-322 inserts from AR Warner.
Two questions:
1. Are my assertions correct, does my plan make sense?
2. Other than the price , what is the difference between an expensive insert tool and a moderately priced insert tool? specifically will there be a noticeable difference in rigidity, and/or is it a matter of "(insert) fit and finish"

Peter

My 2 cents worth, when I bought my PM1236 I had been using a mill but this was my first lathe so I opted to by insert tools from PM so I would not get my lathe set up and not be able to use it. I bought a set that included a large and a small boring bar and a number of holders and I bought a threading set, inside and out. I did not find the price too painful and these work well, the inserts which came with them work but are not stellar; but they are standard inserts so it is easy to find better quality inserts that fit them and make the tools very good. I hope you took the quick change tool post option....