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Things that will not turn you into a machinist
- Thread starter OrangeAlpine
- Start date
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2013
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- 185
Its interesting that some "get it", while others don't. The idea of this post is point out that NONE of the mentioned "stuff" is needed in order to become an accomplished machinist, yet they seem to be on every noobs "must have" list. I definitely am not saying that a person should not buy it. Its just they do not turn a person into a machinist. Nor do they make you a better machinist. Some loose sight of that fact, others never realize it.
I put the micrometers on the list because with the advent of the cheap precision calipers, I find myself using my satin finished, carbide tipped 0"-1" vernier Lufkins (I love 'em) a very few times a year. 99.9% of the time, the calipers have all the accuracy I need, are quicker to use and I make fewer mistakes while using them.
Bill
I put the micrometers on the list because with the advent of the cheap precision calipers, I find myself using my satin finished, carbide tipped 0"-1" vernier Lufkins (I love 'em) a very few times a year. 99.9% of the time, the calipers have all the accuracy I need, are quicker to use and I make fewer mistakes while using them.
Bill
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2013
- Messages
- 185
They may not make everyone a machinist (my wife for example)) but they sure won't hurt those who want to be.
It's hard to be a race car driver without a race car and it's easier to win with a good race car, huh?
Excellent analogy. Good race cars do not turn a poor driver a good race car driver. In fact, they are difficult to drive and bring out the worst in a poor driver. Good race car drivers bring out the best in any car they drive.
Bill
- Joined
- Feb 15, 2013
- Messages
- 45
Don't panic, I got it Bill
It's the same as 'It's a poor workman who blames his tools'
All of the things you list are excellent tools and have their own strengths and weaknesses. But just owning them isn't going to help you at all
Isn't that what this forum is about though? Learning what stuff does what, what owning a bit of kit will do for you, what you can and can't do with what you have? That last one is the most important thing. If you are making black powder cannons, working to tenths of a thou is pointless. If you are making precision tools, you may need more than Grandad's wooden rule
Richard
- Joined
- Feb 15, 2013
- Messages
- 45
They're damn uncomfortable to go shopping in though, and useless at bringing home your latest junkyard find
Richard
- Joined
- Dec 29, 2012
- Messages
- 47
I am just a sometimes wannabe hobby machinist that plays in the garage, but I went down the path of buying all the "neat" gotta have accessories as many others have done and will do. One thing I have discovered for sure is that I would trade many, maybe most of that stuff for a better grade "whatever" to start with.
For instance, trying to teach myself to TIG weld with a cheap welder that has no foot pedal control and only the very basics otherwise is frustrating at best. The whole idea of hobbyist or entry level machines is insane. I've never gotten to play with a real TIG welder, but I did get to do so with a real MIG welder as compared to my home quality 120V Lincoln. Night and day difference. A pro could maybe get good work out of these, but they mostly wouldn't bother, which is part of what makes them a pro in the first place. So many things are "just too hard" because our tools are crap and we don't even know it.
Another for instance is that whole just file it concept. Try it with a Walmart branded file and tell us how easy it is!
If we could learn this stuff with good tools to start with it would then be easier to recognize whether any given tool is up to par even in a hobbyist capacity. Even better, find a pro to show us how it is done with good tools first.
But I do like my quick change tool holder because I absolutely hate shimming.
For instance, trying to teach myself to TIG weld with a cheap welder that has no foot pedal control and only the very basics otherwise is frustrating at best. The whole idea of hobbyist or entry level machines is insane. I've never gotten to play with a real TIG welder, but I did get to do so with a real MIG welder as compared to my home quality 120V Lincoln. Night and day difference. A pro could maybe get good work out of these, but they mostly wouldn't bother, which is part of what makes them a pro in the first place. So many things are "just too hard" because our tools are crap and we don't even know it.
Another for instance is that whole just file it concept. Try it with a Walmart branded file and tell us how easy it is!
If we could learn this stuff with good tools to start with it would then be easier to recognize whether any given tool is up to par even in a hobbyist capacity. Even better, find a pro to show us how it is done with good tools first.
But I do like my quick change tool holder because I absolutely hate shimming.
- Joined
- Aug 20, 2011
- Messages
- 43
Mike, I am a wannabe machinist like yourself but I think it is important to have the best tools you can afford. I base this on 41 years experience as an industrial millwright. We used to laugh at the occasional apprentice who came on the crew with "GlobeMaster and etc" tools expecting them to last on equipment made starting in 1929. They didn't work well and they didn't last. We had a saying on our crew, "the difficult we do immediately, the impossible takes a little bit longer." Now I'm not saying that as a wannabe machinist but, I can say from experience that decent tools are a definite advantage.
PS. I don't know how you can do machine work without measuring tools (micrometers). I hope this helps.
PS. I don't know how you can do machine work without measuring tools (micrometers). I hope this helps.
- Joined
- Nov 16, 2012
- Messages
- 5,596
FWIW: I think the original post was excellent and hope a lot of the new folks take heed and try to learn the basics before jumping into all the contraptions. Equipment doesn't always solve a problem and feel it can actually set a newcomer back. Then again, lot's of folks just like to own tools -and that's fine too if it floats your boat. We're all here because we love mechanical things... The more the merrier, I say!
The post made me think of how things evolved for me in the past 4-5 years -and I can honestly say, all but a few pieces of equipment and tools were acquired out of practical necessity. It's still that way and I try to hold-off on buying things until the need is sincerely justified. The "need" can be defined as something that facilitates substantial time savings, money savings in the long run, or perform a new task to add to the list of services/skills offered. This is probably a character fault on my part but, I really do an awful lot of analysis and well... almost agonizing rationalizing/justification before proceeding with a purchase. In some cases, this has been detrimental as I passed-up on good/rare deals on items that were needed later... Oh well...
Now, here's one thing that I bet everyone here feels you can never have enough of. Space. -Boy would I like to buy a bunch of that!
Great thread, Orange!
Ray
The post made me think of how things evolved for me in the past 4-5 years -and I can honestly say, all but a few pieces of equipment and tools were acquired out of practical necessity. It's still that way and I try to hold-off on buying things until the need is sincerely justified. The "need" can be defined as something that facilitates substantial time savings, money savings in the long run, or perform a new task to add to the list of services/skills offered. This is probably a character fault on my part but, I really do an awful lot of analysis and well... almost agonizing rationalizing/justification before proceeding with a purchase. In some cases, this has been detrimental as I passed-up on good/rare deals on items that were needed later... Oh well...
Now, here's one thing that I bet everyone here feels you can never have enough of. Space. -Boy would I like to buy a bunch of that!
Great thread, Orange!
Ray
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Bill Gruby
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All the tools in the world will not make a Machinist, it's what he does with the few tools he has. ------ "Billy G"
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Micrometers ?
Hey, the first tool I bought as a machinist was a 0-1" micrometer, that I still have and use ALL the time. Maybe that was second after my 6" pocket scale.
My DRO does seem like cheating...
Ditto!!! I have an 0-1 Starrett mic that I bought 35 years ago, and it was used when I bought it. I would be pretty disappointed if anything happened to it. To me, it is a necessity right along with a pair of 6" calipers. I have a few 6" scales, but I like my 6" calipers better.