Inflation or price gouging

[addertooth]

To be frank, the jobs I'm talking about are all "unskilled" jobs. No degree, no education. I couldn't speak to skilled labor jobs at all. In manufacturing, you can usually get into skilled labor positions with nothing more than longevity. So, these are "great" opportunities for young people. But we really can't keep them. I don't know why. My own kids flatly refused to even consider factory work. (Not even for a summer job!) That's two kids who can thank manufacturing for literally every thing they have! With a Dad who has been preaching the gospel of Mike Rowe their entire lives. So...idk.

There is a secondary mechanism at play here. Many companies have added automation every year, which allows them to employ workers who could not have previously (acceptably) performed the job. It requires less SKILL to perform the job, thanks to automation.

Let me give an example: McDonalds Restaurants.
In the early 70s, they guy at the grill had to know when to flip the burgers and sear them. He had to monitor how "done" the burgers were, to compensate for the grill cooling down, when a large number of frozen patties were placed on it. Now, they have the automated "clamshell grill" which cooks both sides of the burgers at once. He only needs to load the frozen patties on, sprinkle on some salt and paper, and hit the start button. The upper clamshell closes and both sides of the burger cooks at once. It opens when the burgers are done, and he removes them from the clamshell cooker. He only needs to know how to load, season, and unload it. He requires less skill.

Similar story for the fry station. The new fry station only requires he load the basket and hit start. It automatically lowers the basket and then lifts it when the fries are done.

The point of sale systems are fully a breeze to use, and calculates/makes change for the person at the register; plus there are fewer cash transactions these days, with many people using a card. They have added ordering Kiosks to many of their restaurants, with the customer doing the work.

These are ONLY examples. But, this use of automation has spread across most industries. It allows for less capable people to be hired, who in turn, merit less pay (and the company has to recoup the additional cost of automation). So YES, this has driven down (or prevented growth over time) of the wages.

 

[Navy Chief]

I'm sorry but that is complete BS. That type of logic is what I call "bar logic"; guys sitting around at a bar making up "facts".
I work part time for a manufacturing company (I'm in R&D). We have some really great young folks on the floor that have been there for quite some time. This belief that people are better off sitting at home because "the government pays more" is not based on actual facts and reality. I could say that the states that get the most government aid are red, but I won't.

Happy to hear there are young folks in your area willing to work, I know they are out there. What I posted is based on what my son and my wife hear at work all the time. People come and go all the time where they are and the conversation is almost always the same "why work when I can get unemployment".

When I was a hiring manager in the IT industry I lost track of the number of interviews I conducted with fresh college graduates that expected to be hired directly into management, they had zero interest in entry level positions.

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[woodchucker]

Happy to hear there are young folks in your area willing to work, I know they are out there. What I posted is based on what my son and my wife hear at work all the time. People come and go all the time where they are and the conversation is almost always the same "why work when I can get unemployment".

When I was a hiring manager in the IT industry I lost track of the number of interviews I conducted with fresh college graduates that expected to be hired directly into management, they had zero interest in entry level positions.

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I had the same experience. None of them realize that learning on the job is critical. When they get out of school they really know nothing. All they know is the BS that school taught them, not real life, not business, not real programming if a programmer/engineer. You can't believe how many think they know it all and make the mistakes that we all learned long ago not to make. Yet they think they are ready to manage everything.
I was in management, hated it. I hated dealing with people who thought they deserved so much more for doing so little. Or the people that never met their deadlines , spent so much time socializing while at work, and thought you were wrong when reviewing them. Or the one or two that threatened you because in their minds you were wrong and they were right. I remember one person telling me how much they worked late at night on projects. Yet I could tell they spent no time logged in after hours. I know that they had to log in to do their work.. they argued they did it all offline, yet that was not possible. I resigned from management and went back to what I was good at; being a techie. So many slackers think they do more than they do. This goes for business analysts, project managers, you name it. no one is immune. You get to know the real players. I worked with a great team, in the middle of the night we were grinding the oil, 4 -5 in the morn we would see each other on Instant messaging programs. You knew who was carrying a team.

 

[jwmay]

This goes for business analysts, project managers, you name it. no one is immune. You get to know the real players. I worked with a great team, in the middle of the night we were grinding the oil, 4 -5 in the morn we would see each other on Instant messaging programs. You knew who was carrying a team.

Pareto's Principle still stands. Although it seems we (Me included) wandered off track some time ago. Lol. This thread was about inflation, right? Ha!

 

[Aaron_W]

I think Covid showed a lot of people that the old both parents working thing isn't required, particularly when the job given up is at the lower end and the income barely exceeded the costs of child care. People realize that they are paying other people to raise their kids and in many cases child care simply isn't there anymore or at least has gone up in price meaning even if they wanted to work, it becomes a losing situation where they make less than the cost of child care. Many workers also discovered that retirement wasn't actually all that bad, and people who planned to work for another 5 or 10 years chose not to return to the work force when things reopened.

Unemployment isn't stupid. It is hard to qualify if you quit your job or get fired. There are a few situations where that is acceptable, but will usually result in a denied claim. It is also based on what you made 18 months ago, so the idea that people are taking jobs and working for 2 months then quitting to "reset" their unemployment is fantasy. If you sat on unemployment for 2 years, worked for 2 months and legitimately lost your new job, your unemployment will be based on the salary you were drawing 18 months ago ($0) which is going to net you the minimum amount which in California is $40 a week.

The above points of view are all viable, for the geography they are at. We have had some local fast food locations close for a few days, because nobody wanted to show up. So yes, on the lower end of the pay scale, there is a serious problem with apathy among the (mostly young) workers.

My wife works at the lower end of medical. When the vaccine mandates came out, she started to look at all the listings for "help wanted desperately" which were non-medical. There were a lot of medical workers who fled the market when the deadline for the mandates were approaching. She learned that a lot of the job listings were phantom or "prospecting" listings. The employers were not as motivated to hire as they *sounded* in their listings. In some cases they were listed as 9 to 5 jobs, but after you applied you learn they were for graveyard shift. Most were shy to mention rate of pay until after the interview.

I work in technology. When I go on websites for jobs, the companies give a laundry list of Degrees, Certifications, and verifiable job experience that only a handful of people on the globe would match. Many of those listings are for that 1 in a million employee. They may be hoping he comes across their listing. The more typical "center of mass" tech employee will not be likely to get a call back. I also realize some companies are actually hoping nobody responds, so they can get the government to give them a H1 visa to hire a foreign worker. Then they will accept a far less qualified foreign worker, at about 1/3rd the US worker cost. It is how they play the game to obtain that visa (you create a bloated listing with a laundry list of requirements, then whine to the government you can't find any qualified American applicants).

In short, across the spectrum there are a LOT of companies which say they are hiring, and desperate for workers. But it is not exactly as it appears. In the 1970s, a person could go out and find a job in a single day. I am not talking about fast food. The industries have changed, and 1 day hires are now the exception, rather than the rule.

So some of these employers are this guy

 

[RJSakowski]

I think Covid showed a lot of people that the old both parents working thing isn't required, particularly when the job given up is at the lower end and the income barely exceeded the costs of child care. People realize that they are paying other people to raise their kids and in many cases child care simply isn't there anymore or at least has gone up in price meaning even if they wanted to work, it becomes a losing situation where they make less than the cost of child care. Many workers also discovered that retirement wasn't actually all that bad, and people who planned to work for another 5 or 10 years chose not to return to the work force when things reopened.

Unemployment isn't stupid. It is hard to qualify if you quit your job or get fired. There are a few situations where that is acceptable, but will usually result in a denied claim. It is also based on what you made 18 months ago, so the idea that people are taking jobs and working for 2 months then quitting to "reset" their unemployment is fantasy. If you sat on unemployment for 2 years, worked for 2 months and legitimately lost your new job, your unemployment will be based on the salary you were drawing 18 months ago ($0) which is going to net you the minimum amount which in California is $40 a week.



So some of these employers are this guy

View attachment 397109

This should have been posted in the Today' Joke thread. Everything this seller offers is either $1K or $10K.
From the same seller:

 

[woodchucker]

Pareto's Principle still stands. Although it seems we (Me included) wandered off track some time ago. Lol. This thread was about inflation, right? Ha!

show me one thread that stays on track for more than a few posts.

 

[Navy Chief]

Getting back on track. Yes, there is absolutely some price gouging going on, companies are making all kinds of excuses about the reasons that prices are going up.

Quick example, there is supposedly a shortage of OSB that is driving the consumer price up. Did a project the other day and needed 2 sheets of 7/16 OSB. The manufacturing date on both of them was May 2021, so according to the retailers there is a "shortage" but at the same time the material they are selling has been sitting around for 9 months...

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[Eddyde]

We are at $4.00 a gallon down here for diesel fuel these days . Pa. is typically .50 cents above Md . This is crazy .

I paid $3.60 a gallon two weeks ago. I paid $4.18 a gallon, two days ago... Crazy Indeed!

The stock market is what helped kill this country.

Jeff, I think you hit the nail on the head. It once was a way to help a company grow, become competitive, turn a profit and make some money for the investors. Now the stock market is simply a way to make money from nothing. Companies that once focused on making a better product for their customer are now only beholden to the board of directors and shareholders. The quality of the product is only as good as it needs to be and the workforce is squeezed as much a possible. Maximum profit is all that matters.

 

[Ischgl99]

Getting back on track. Yes, there is absolutely some price gouging going on, companies are making all kinds of excuses about the reasons that prices are going up.

Quick example, there is supposedly a shortage of OSB that is driving the consumer price up. Did a project the other day and needed 2 sheets of 7/16 OSB. The manufacturing date on both of them was May 2021, so according to the retailers there is a "shortage" but at the same time the material they are selling has been sitting around for 9 months...

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Check out the videos of Uneducated Economist on YouTube, he works in that industry and has been talking about what has been going on for a while. He was saying last year when there was a shortage that the mills were stacked full of finished products waiting to be shipped.