What do I need to mill on my machine???

I like the ER set up has anyone tried these?

http://www.wttool.com/index/page/pr...+Chuck+Set+(WT)&update_continue_shopping=true

$99 is not bad but it's an 8 pc...


I like the quick change itea between this and the R8 collets that attach to the drawbar. Is that the difference?

$65 for the R-8 collets without the ER feature... looks strong but pain to change tools.
http://www.wttool.com/index/page/pr...Collet+Set+(WT)&update_continue_shopping=true
(maybe this is a good way to start and nice to have for some situations)

What do you guys think?

~Charlie
 
wolframore said:
I like the ER set up has anyone tried these?

http://www.wttool.com/index/page/pr...+Chuck+Set+(WT)&update_continue_shopping=true

$99 is not bad but it's an 8 pc...


I like the quick change itea between this and the R8 collets that attach to the drawbar. Is that the difference?

$65 for the R-8 collets without the ER feature... looks strong but pain to change tools.
http://www.wttool.com/index/page/pr...Collet+Set+(WT)&update_continue_shopping=true
(maybe this is a good way to start and nice to have for some situations)

What do you guys think?

~Charlie
Click to expand...

Charlie,

ER collets aren't quick change. You still need to loosen the nose of the holder to change the tool and completely remove it to change the collet (they snap in). What a ER collet buys you is range. An R8 collet only holds a specific sized shank, 1/4", 5/32, 3/8" etc., but an ER collet will expand or contract to hold diameters slightly larger or smaller than nominal. The only quick change holder for an R-8 spindle that I know if is made by Royal, their Quick Change Tooling System, and it is VERY expensive.

I would suggest getting a few R-8 collets for your mill. They are inexpensive and work very well for holding end mills. An ER system would be better suited for your lathe, where you would be more apt to hold work in the collet than cutters. Then the added flexibility in range would pay off.

Tom
 
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I think ultimately you will end up with "all of the above"

R8 colelts first. You need the standard set of 11 (?). Import ill do fine. One advantage R8s have is they don't use up any Z-axis room.
MIlling cutter holders - You probably need to have a couple to fit the cutters you use most. 3/8" is pretty much standard for small mills.
ER collets you will probably want at some point if you change tooling a lot. No drawbar to mess with.

Right now I have 4 R8 mills, and have yet to buy an ER collet set, though I'm about that that point for one of the machines.
 
I don't like those tool holders that stick down well below the spindle. It causes the spindle setup to be more long,drawn out,and therefore more flexible. Flexing endmills break suddenly.

To tell the truth,R8 collets aren't really supposed to be used to hold end mills,but they are all I use to hold mine anyway. You're supposed to use endmill holders that have the big setscrew to bear against the flat spot in "Weldon type" endmill shafts.

But,like I said,they stick down too far to suit my idea of rigidity.

You MUST,MUST,MUST make sure there is NO OIL at all in your collets or endmill shanks. The spiral endmills can pull right out of those collets,and plunge cut your mill's table,or ruin work,so keep all DRY. My partner managed to cut a dollop into our mill's table from an endlill that came loose ANYWAY,even without oil. Possibly a trace of oil from his fingers,or now tightened enough. That's the trouble with collets. The threads on your drawbar suffer,too,from the tightening necessary,if the drawbar isn't made of decent steel. Imports likely are too soft.

A P.S.: NEVER,EVER use a brass bushing to hold an endmill into a collet. If you MUST use a bushing,make one out of STEEL. Brass bushings WILL NOT HOLD. Brass is a slippery metal,be warned. Early on,I had a few accidents before I learned better than to use brass bushings. Brass and bronze are used for plain type motor bearings precisely because they are inherently slippery.
 
etard said:
Dude, you live in Chicago, IL! You guys must see R8 collets in the streets and gutters like disregarded beer bottles. At least that's how I imagine it being there in the midwest...:rofl:
Click to expand...

Dude I lived out of Thousand Oaks, San Jose and was stationed in 29 Palms long enough... You have some cool stuff being made out in Cali for aeronautics...

There are some cool retired machinists out here! I'm planning a trip up to 7 mile fair in Milwaukee for the weekend. Heard there's a guy selling all kinds of machinst stuff there.

I will have to do more exploring for local sources... metal's way easy to find. The local scrap yard has brass, stainlless, alum and steel all the time from machine shops... some long rounds, other cut up and partially machined. Got some cool 420 round bar cut offs (annealed) for $0.25/lb. Machines beautifully and you can have it tempered to HRC50.


George, thanks for your explanation... Sounds like I should look into end-mill holders. What are R8 collets for if you're not supposed to use them for end-mills? I'm really a newbie and this was the 3rd time I tried to mill with the drill chuck/end-mill. first time kinda worked because I used the sides to clean up a tool. 2nd time was disaster - was tryin to mill a flat but didn't know it was 304.
 
You may want to re-read George's post before ordering those. He mentions that he doesn't like them because they increase the amount of tool overhang and I tend to agree. It's not a big deal on a rigid industrial mill, but on a light hobby mill that already has rigidity issues, it can be a real problem. R8 collets are perfectly fine for holding end mills. In all the years I've been using mills, only once did I run into one that had trouble holding end mills with a collet, an old Index mill with a wimpy drawbar. Other issues with end mill holders is that the set screw pushes the end mill slightly off center causing it to cut more on one side than the other and that extra couple of inches cuts into the usable capacity of your mill in the Z axis. Neither is a big deal, just a couple more reasons why I prefer to use collets.

Tom
 
Oh dang they're on order... and i see... or will when I get them. I did get some beefy cutters from my retired machinist freight that looks like they need the end mill holders with flats milled on them. I will get some R8 Collets hopefully this weekend at the 7 mile fair.

What is overhang? Is that the tool sticking down from the quill - closer to work piece?
 
Overhang is the distance the end of the cutter is from the nose of the spindle. That's the nice thing about collets. They are pretty much flush with the spindle nose and the only overhang is the amount of end mill sticking out.

Tom
 
Just use the R8's and keep oil from getting into them,or onto the shanks of endmills so they don't suck out of the collets. Like I said,I know they aren't really the proper thing but I use them anyway and have for many years.
 
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