Spin indexer vs. dividing head

Winegrower said:
I am starting to think of these lower cost items, like spin indexers, swivel vises, tailstock live chucks, anything from India, etc., not with disgust at the quality lack, but with appreciation for providing 80% of the solution and an interesting challenge to take it the next 20%.

it would be difficult for me to afford all of these gizmos if they were all US or German made precision stuff, so I now think of these as “kit” items but with not so much boring machining required. Self delusional maybe, but it prevents some disappointment, and spurs some creative thinking opportunities.

And when you get done, you have a tool that you really understand and have characterized pretty thoroughly.

Wadda ya think, are you with me? :cool:
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Indeed, I could not afford to do this hobby otherwise. I try to buy as much quality used gear as I can but some stuff is unobtainable for me.
 
I guess I have different thoughts about low end imported tools. I've bought a few over the years, but avoid it whenever possible. In our area there's an abundance of lightly used older machine tools and tooling made in the USA. In almost every case the older used stuff has been superior to the new imports in both quality and functionality.

When I buy a tool I research what quality level is needed to do the job, what's available, and the cost. If it's for a one time use, and the price is right I'll probably buy cheap Chineseium. If I intend to use it on a regular basis I'll go for something I think will last even if it's a bit more expensive.

A couple examples outside the realm of machine tools are: A few years ago we were putting a new deck on the family cottage. We needed railings/guard rails to keep the young nieces and nephews from taking a 15' dive. We researched the cost of having them made, and the cheapest was over $2,600.00. I knew I could make them for far less so I set out to get the needed materials and a few tools.

The wife wanted radiused corners where the balusters met the horizontal rails. I did the bulk of the work on the mill, but needed a die grinder for finishing. I ended up with a HF die grinder because I knew it would be a one time use. It did the job, but would get extremely hot when using it more than a few minutes at a time. The grinder hasn't been used since that job was finished. It was however cost effective. I was able to fabricate the railings for a total cost of less than $800.00.

Another project was replacing the deteriorated tile on our screen porch. The contractor wanted $1,000.00 to remove the old tile. Again I knew I could do it for far less so I purchased a Bosch hammer drill. I knew this tool would be used on a regular basis, and with the previous HF experience I didn't feel comfortable that one of their tools would do the job. I got lucky in that the drill was on sale and the company was offering a rebate. The total cost was less than $300.00. I have used it dozens of times since then, and it has always worked as expected.

The last thing want to do is repair or modify a tool before I use it, or have to do it during the course of trying to use it. A tool is supposed to make a job easier, not add frustration to the process because of poor design or construction.
 
Kind of drifting here, but there is cheap, and there is cheap. Harbor Freight has a lot of cheap tools, really only good for those things where you might use it once or twice, or where my use is very light duty. They also have some stuff that is actually quite nice and still affordable. Their 4x6 bandsaw and US General Tool Chests fall into this second category.

It seems like a lot of the more recent import machine tools have really good bones to work with. It may take some clean up and fine tuning, maybe even a little modification but then you have a very good hobby grade tool for just a fraction of the price of a used vintage piece. I really wanted a vintage dividing head, but most that I could find were missing parts, often looked well used and were still twice the price of brand new Chinese dividing head. For something I won't use much it just made more sense to get the import which is actually quite well made. I did spend a little extra to buy it from PM where I knew I could get some service if I got a reject.
 
Buying a 30+ year old industrial machine has it's risks and parts are likely to be really expensive, if available. I'd have no problem buying a Taiwan made from a reputable reseller (PM) but some of the stuff sold on eBay would be a shot in the dark. My spin indexer was a bit crude but not bad as a kit. Now works fine. My Vertex rotary table and index plates seem well made. I could do a Stefan or Robin job on it but it is not necessary. My collet blocks are disappointing, could be fixed, if I had a surface grinder. My collet chuck is excellent (from PM.) The cheap Chinese stuff has made it possible for many of us to enjoy this hobby. It does appear that many of us spend more time modifying our tools than making things. For me it's a game of pushing my limits.
 
Aaron_W said:
I'm really not sure how a rotary table with dividing plates compares to a dividing head of similar quality for accuracy.
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I only have the rotary table so no dividing head to compare to. That said, my Vertex RT seems well made and has no discernable slop. Moving the worm into proper mesh is easy and there is no noticeable variation in fit as the table is rotated. Quite accurate positioning can be done w/o the use of the indexing plates when working in #s that evenly fit into 360. The plates and sector arms make it easier to keep track of where you are. The semi-universal dividing head allows the axis to be tilted. Might be able to do that with some Rube G. work on a RT. The full blown universal is quite another animal. I doubt there is any difference in accuracy between RT & dividing HD.
I've seen the videos of modifying a Spin Indexer to make finer than one degree incrementing possible. Certainly a cheap option for some uses.

Just found out I've been exposed to the virus via a grand kid. Now in quarantine.
 
Oh man! I hope your all fine with the virus thing. Really! We have grand kids crawling all over this place and I love it.

I want a dividing head! I'll say, the spin indexer is one of the best 70 bucks I have spent on machining. I squared the edges in the mill and can drop it in the vise in a few second. I use it primarily for flats on hexes, squares etc. I haven't needed an uneven number of degrees. Never made a gear either. That would be cool. When I grow up I might get to do that!
 
projectnut said:
Anything needing greater accuracy goes on a rotary table. Both have scales that read down to 1 minute of a degree, but that's the limit of their accuracy. Anything needing resolution down to a second, or fraction of a degree would need a dividing head with the appropriate plates.
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My 12"Enco RT resolves to 5 seconds of arc with its vernier.
 
And my 6" Tormach 4th axis (a stepper motor driven 6" Phase II RT) increments in .0001º steps. That's .36 seconds of arc.
 
Larry$ said:
Just found out I've been exposed to the virus via a grand kid. Now in quarantine.
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Oh brother. Be well Larry!


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