Runout of a 3-jaw chuck on an ENCO 13 x 40 lathe

Jkassis

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I am wondering what the acceptable runout on a 3-jaw self centering 6" chuck would be. I have a three-jaw chuck that has no runout on the body of the chuck, but when I put a milled piece of round stock in the jaws, I have about .005" of runout. This seems to be way too much runout to me. I would like to hear from others on their opinion and a possible way to correct this problem (without having to purchase a new chuck). Maybe a way to mill the jaws to correct the problem???
Thanks in advance!
 
I would start by chucking up a few different diameters in the chuck. This will determine if the runout is a result of wear in the scroll. Also mark the high/low points on the chcuck body. If the high/low moves as the chuck diameters change etc then the scroll is worn irregularly which means it aint gonna get any better no matter what you do. But if the runout is consistent and the chuck is mounted on a backing plate, you can loosen the backing plate bolts and try knocking it around a little witha soft hammer to dial it in or try matching the holes differently, sometimes it makes it better, sometimes worse. If the scroll is not worn terribly, you could machine the jaws i suppose. But i'm not the guy to tell you how best to do that.
 
Im not sure about the truth in this, but an old timer hard core lifelong machinist told me years ago,
to always tighten the same number on a 3 jaw. As to pick a number and stick with it. To each his
own I guess. My view is 3 jaw and repeatability dont go hand & hand. We do a share of tractor
axle shafts. So 3Jaw being fast is used. The stock is 2" and take off .750 do snap rings do threading,
do all operations one shot. Only then part it and unchuck it. Then it goes to keyways splines etc.
For unknow reasons it has to go back then its the 4 Jaw. So 3 Jaws have some reason. And then
customer has new shaft or new something and needs tweeking or threads thats 4Jaw job.
 
I have heard and read of this before. No idea of the truth or strength of the argument behind it. But if you look at a 3 jaw chuck, any screw turns the scroll by the same relationship.... But I do make it a point of tightening each of the 3 holes in my chuck....

Im not sure about the truth in this,....to always tighten the same number on a 3 jaw....

What do owners of single hole chucks do? Hope that the one hole they have will be the right one to get it all concentric?

Cheers Phil
 
Yes Phil later on after I made that reply about tightning one jaw, I had a flashback, I recalled the old
timer scolding me on a drill press, I use to tighten one he said, what do you think the three holes are
for?? Use them. Such is life sam
 
I have heard and read of this before. No idea of the truth or strength of the argument behind it. But if you look at a 3 jaw chuck, any screw turns the scroll by the same relationship.... But I do make it a point of tightening each of the 3 holes in my chuck....



What do owners of single hole chucks do? Hope that the one hole they have will be the right one to get it all concentric?

Cheers Phil

I just learned something new today. I always thought the three holes were there for convenience.;)
 
It is very common to find that one of the "holes" is more accurate than the other two by a few thous. No idea why but it is the case on every scroll chuck I have checked and is repeatable. That is the only hole I use on mine out of habit. My 6" Japanese chuck runs out .005 consistently with 2 of the three holes but .003" with the one over the medallion. Give it a try and see if it helps a little.

.005" is not great but is not bad. I'm with GK1918 a scroll chuck is for new work. When a part is made it will still be round and accurate as long as the stock is big enough for having some removed all around. Besides most common stock is worse off than .005 unless it is ground or such.

If it needs to be accurate it's either the independent jaws or collets for repair work.

Steve
 
I have a JET lathe that I purchased about a month ago. I was surprised that the amount of runout on the Inspection Sheet that came with the lathe showed the runout being .0004. I had the opportunity to check it out on a piece I made the other day. I had a 6" dia. piece of 7075 that was almost to the thickness that was called for on the print. I could only turn half the length back, then had to turn it around in the lathe and turn the remaining half. When you have runout, it is always real noticeable when you do this. I could not tell where the line was where I stopped on the first side. I'd be willing to say that the runout was next to nothing. For a Chinese made lathe, I was truly amazed.

With that being said, depending on your chuck, you should have the face of the chuck bolted to the body. You can loosen the bolts on the face and move it around very slightly to remove the runout. What you need to do to start is make sure everything is absolutely spotless when you do this. Not knowing how your chuck mounts, whether with three or four pins, or with a large spindle nut, if you have pins, make sure they are tight in your chuck. If a large spindle nut, make sure the spindle is free of any and all burrs. You can do this with a fine stone or a piece of fine sandpaper on a wooden block. Or remove the key turn the spindle on and polish it with some real fine sandpaper. What you will need now is a known large dowel or rod. I keep a guide pin out of a die shoe for this purpose. Mount your chuck to the lathe after everything is spotless. Chuck up the large pin or dowel and set up a tenth indicator on your compound. Loosen the face bolts on the chuck then snug them enough that the face won't move on it's own, but loose enough that you can tap it around with a plastic hammer. Once you get it to where you want it, tighten each face screw a little at a time until you have all securely tightened. To check the work, take a piece of round stock that is rigid. Use something around 6" long and around 1" in diameter. Turn about 3" of the stock taking off just enough to clean it up plus a few more thou. Shut the lathe off and move the compound towards the tailstock without changing the setting on the cross-slide. Turn your stock around then turn this end down. Both cuts should come together with no steps in the stock.

Checking the outside of the chuck for runout is not a good way to check a lathe for runout. One reason is the chuck components are all made in separate stages then bolted together. Doing that on different machines you end up with errors. Put all of those errors together and you will get something other than desired. If the chuck on your lathe was ever dropped, the lathe wrecked, or God forbid, someone leaving the chuck key in the chuck when they turned it on, will knock a chuck out of tolerance. Every once in a while, when I was working, I would check a chuck for runout and probably once a year I would have to refurbish it. I would tear it completely down, wash all of the parts off in the clean tank, stone off any burrs, use a good grease on the screw jaw plate and the tightening screws, reassemble and calibrate it. The bad is when multiple people run a machine and not pay attention. But for home, a good tune-up on your chuck will last a long time. If you do a lot of work on it that has interrupted cuts, you may want to check the chuck every few months. Other than that, a thorough tuneup once every year or two should suffice.
 
Yes Phil later on after I made that reply about tightning one jaw, I had a flashback, I recalled the old
timer scolding me on a drill press, I use to tighten one he said, what do you think the three holes are
for?? Use them. Such is life sam

I had heard that on a drill chuck the three holes are not equally spaced at 120 degrees, but something like 121, 120 and 119 to allow for better tightening of the chuck by using each one. I must say I have no idea if this is true or how it would work, but it does seem to work. I typically tighten each spur on my lathe's 3 jaw chuck to what feels like an equal amount to me, but for precise work only use the four jaw.
 
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