Lubrication issue, foaming, bad level

[aaronpadilla]

Hi there
I am running my SM series 2000 lathe since a few days ago, I noticed that the fast it runs the lower oil level is in the window, after turning off the lathe, the level comes back in the window buy wit a noticeable foaming.

I ran it with the upper cover open, I noticed that the input shaft gears are full in the oil sump and they pump it hard so, even if they are not all engaged, they form a sort of oil ring around them and they brew so hard the oil that haevy foam is formed.

Is it normal??

I have tried the recommended sae30 non detergent oil and as it is old and the headstock gears are worn I put a slight heavier oil doesn<t matter the oil it is the same foam formation and lost in level.

Running the lathe at mid speed, the oil window is empty, I guess it can t be normal.

Could you advice?

 

[RJSakowski]

A decrease in oil level while running would be normal as it takes some time for oil to drain back down to the sump. This would be more pronounced with heavier weight oil. Foaming is caused by air getting whipped into the oil. It could be caused by low or high oil levels, depending upon the arrangement of gears in your gear box. High oil levels in an internal combustion engine will foam if the level is high enough for the connecting rods to hit the oil surface. On the other hand, gears that are normally intended to run totally submerged but now are exposed to air will carry air into the oil causing foaming. As long as foaming isn't inhibiting the flow of oil to lubrication points, it shouldn't be harmful. Yoir operators manual should tell you id the oil level is checked while running or after allowing oil to drain back into the sump.

 

[Tim9]

As long as your level comes back you should be good to go. I would double check to make sure you are using the proper oil. I think some hydraulic/ headstock oils are anti-foaming. There’s additives to inhibit the foaming. Foaming is a big problem with hydraulic oils....especially vehicle P/S fluids so almost all vehicle ps fluids have foam inhibitors.

if you want to read more....here’s an article I just found.

Controlling Oil Aeration and Foam

Foam and air entrainment problems are quite common, but are traditionally hard to treat. Previously, the standard procedure was to run an ASTM D892 foam test on the offending oil, and then...

www.machinerylubrication.com

“If foaming recently started in an established system, ask the question, “What has changed?”. Foaming that initiates just after an oil change, particularly a change in brand or manufacturer, may be a direct result of the new oil.

Some oils that contain detergents may dislodge deposits left behind by a nondetergent product. Foam that is produced while the system is being cleaned of old deposits will foam, but the foam goes away with time. Foam caused by an incompatibility between the two oils will be more persistent, however, and is a more serious issue.”

Personally, I’d probably double check the oil I’m using and then probably drain and refill.... making sure I am using the proper oil.

 

[sdelivery]

Switch to a hydraulic oil. Better anti foaming properties. Also available in different viscosities.
Fill it to the recommended level.
The level will vary with speed.

 

[Cyclebuster]

oil is not cheap for those, i understand. you could have moisture from condensation. drain it into a large pan and boil it and see if it steams about 212 degrees.

 

[aaronpadilla]

oil is not cheap for those, i understand. you could have moisture from condensation. drain it into a large pan and boil it and see if it steams about 212 degrees.

I can't do that at my place but I wonder if it is not too dangerous.
I guess that oil fumes at high temperatures should be pretty flammable

 

[RJSakowski]

I have used a heat gun to boil water out of oli. No open flame, no risk of ignition. I experience a small amount of water in the gear lube on my outboard lower and have boiled it out to determine the amount of water.

Unless your lathe was exposed to precipitation or a water based coolant, I would be very surprised if there was any measurable water in your oil. Even if oil does enter, it will usually sink to the bottom of the sump and doesn't get mixed with the oil until ther is a significant percentage to where the gears can capture it and mix it with the oil. This usually results in an opaque caramel colored liquid.

 

[aliva]

If you have a BBQ or grill, take some oil, a couple of teaspoons, will do put it on some tin foil and heat it up if it crackles then you have water.( used to do this on marine engines) If not your good to go. I doubt you have water , as water will turn the oil milky in colour. I use ISO 32 in my lathes head stock and 68 in the apron. Check the oil level with the machine off. You check the oil in your car with the engine off don't you.

 

[mksj]

Heavier oil is counter productive in particular in colder climates, it is more likely to have the issues you are seeing and cause more drag on the drive. A synthetic oil would have less viscosity at lower temperature and be less prone to aeration and would settle out quicker, but is expensive. In non-pressurized lube systems that use splash lubrication a higher viscosity flows less readily to the bearings. As others have noted the hydraulic and gear oils have anti-foaming and anti-corrosion additives, which should settle down the foaming, and if in a colder climate may consider an ISO68 oil. I use the Miles oils sold by Zoro through eBay.CA and Amazon CA and they often send 20% discount coupons. I use to have a high speed gear head mill that the SAE 80 gear oil foamed quite a bit, I switched to a synthetic gear oil 75-80W (ISO100) and it significantly decreased both foaming and operating temperature. Most 12-16" light industrial lathes typically use an ISO32 headstock oil and some ISO68, but that is with higher (2500 RPM) spindle speeds. I did review the SM 2000 series lathe manual and they did mention SAE30 or ISO100 oil for everything, but may be worth calling them to see what they recommend.

ISO100 oils, they are also available as an ISO68.

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[sdelivery]

All these oils are available at your local tractor supply or Rural King for half this money.