How good is a bad Bridgeport?

Cheeseking said:
We had a few but too hard find parts for old Tree mill. Zps in WI may be the only option.
Crazy special spindle taper kind of like Cincinnati Toolmasters. Good machines but use proprietary collets.
Something R8 is going to be a better choice IMO.
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The Tree mills were originally made in Racine. There still seems to be a fair amount of tooling and a number of machines for sale in the Wisconsin area. It's getting to the point that what's left on the market is slowly coming down in price. Last year a friend of mine purchased a NOS taper boring head from a local used equipment dealer for $200.00. Those heads originally cost around $1,000.00.

I think it's purely a function of supply and demand. There are far fewer Tree machines in service than there were 30 years ago, but the tooling is nearly bullet proof. We had at least a dozen Tree brand machines in our shop(s), but as far as I know only 3 are still in service. They were purchased by a local shop when the company closed the inhouse shop in 2000. All 3 seem to be in good condition, and well tooled.
 
I know 3 guys that have Tree mills. One of them has two.
I can't look them in the eyes without looking away. :)
Great milling machines.
 
Investigator said:
My question is difficult to put into words, both the asking and the answering. Let me put it in terms I am more used to.
I've been a commercial mower for several years, putting it in those terms..... A commercial Scag zero turn rider is a pure joy to use. It cuts great, has lots of power to get through tall and thick grass and even light brush. A Commercial Scag with thousands of hours on it isn't anything a pro would keep using in most cases. But that same unit for a guy with a large yard he mows once a week would still be far and away better than the 38" rider he could get new at a big box store.

Does a B'port knee mill start out with such a high level of quality and accuracy that even after years of use and wear it is still better than an new square column?
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Well, if the two started out life equal it would probably be different, but realize they aren't designed with to function the same right off the get-go. The B-Port (or clone) was designed to split tenths repeatably for daily use over many highly repairable/rebuildable years and parts are available to do just that, unless it's been badly abused it will do just that. The "Square column" units are designed to maybe hold within a couple of thousandths. And aren't really designed to throw away, but parts can be a challenge. And like it or not if you use it, regardless of how careful you are at some time going to have a crash and need support.
Also remember, lots of times the big heavy one (lathe, mill, grinder or whatever) probably doesn't need a stand but, will probably be 3 phase and might actually be cheaper because lots of "new to the game" guys don't understand how easy it is to make or use, VFD's are getting more affordable and make the 3rd phase quick & easy.
I know it's become a bit long-winded but ...
 
I had the same exact question you did, I was thinking I wanted a smaller import mill. I wanted to avoid something with a round column but I wasn't picky other than that. Most used ones in my area will still fetching a good price, some more than you could order one new (how does that work?).

Then a few BPs became available close by for a decent price. I ended up buying one, I figured A) having a worn mill is better than no mill, B) Any tooling and experience I pickup along the way will be easily transferred to a newer/better BP or BP clone in the future.

Yeah mines worn but it doesn't have any major binding issues so it's worn evenly at the very least. They were also using it right up to the point where I bought it so everything works though a few things need some attention. It was cheap enough that I can fix some things and still be OK.

Not sure if I did the right thing or not. We will see.

K
 
I have to agree with Bruce, find a nice used machine that isn't worn out, or consider a Taiwanese clone. Depends on what you want to spend, and the scope/size of work. You are not going to wear out any of these machines using them as a hobbyist. I had a new mainland Chinese square column mil (Optimum BF-30) that I purchased at a little over 3K about 10 years ago and could do tight tolerance work with no issues. I hated the ergonomics and that everything was cobbled together even though it was considered high end. It now sells for 5K+. Parts were a nightmare, and there was little support from the dealer who later went out of business. I sold it and purchased a new Sharp (Acra) which has been trouble free and a pleasure to use. I would never go back to a square column Asian mill unless I was downsizing and had limited space.

I looked at the used market, Bridgeport's were typically over priced for what you got, the Lagun's FTV-2's I checked out seemed to be in better condition at a lower price. They all needed some work, the variable speed drives were noisy and often the table drives weren't working. The ones I looked at were back-up machines in shops that mostly went CNC, or didn't pass accuracy requirements which were 0.0005". I was looking at 3K plus probably another 1K to rebuild the heads and drives. The Sharp (Acra) new started at 6K for the base model, lots of other Taiwanese mills in that price range. I also wanted to make sure parts were available, and they were mainstream models that had been around for a long time. That parts were available from multiple sources.

If I had a budget of 3-4K I would have gone with the used market in a machine that wasn't worn out or required minimal work to getting it working well. At 5-6K, either a pristine used mill with all the add ons or something new. I do not see that the Bridgeport name alone assures you that it is any better then say a Lagun, the Lagun's I milled with were solid and a pleasure to use. I purchase my mill and lathe to be the last machines I expect to buy until I am long gone, and then someone else will get to enjoy them after me.
 
ArmyDoc said:
Maybe a more specific example would be helpful. For ~ $4000, which would you choose?
Bridgeport like this:
https://machineinventory.shop/shop?olsPage=products/recondition-bridgeport-milling-machine-basic-1-hp-mikk

or the PM 833T, which is from Taiwan, and with a base it is about the same price
https://www.precisionmatthews.com/shop/pm-833t-page/
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Neither is a good buy. You want to find a fair deal, from a private party, on a quality, used machine, in excellent condition, with comprehensive tooling package.
 
ezduzit said:
Neither is a good buy. You want to find a fair deal, from a private party, on a quality, used machine, in excellent condition, with comprehensive tooling package.
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OK. But between these two, which would be the better machine?
 
ezduzit said:
The Bridgeport.
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Cool. That's good to know, because I suspect the 833T arguably represents best of class for bench-top square mills (i.e. it's as good as anything out there in it's class). If a bridgeport in decent condition is better at even money, it is clearly better if you can find one for a grand less (or more), especially if it comes with tooling.
 
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