Anti-Freeze as coolant

RV stuff doesnt do that scrap metal, if used in camper water tanks then comes camping time theres always a little and I aint dead yet, and then
my junk yard buddie gives me his drained car antifreeze I strain it mix it spike it with a little new so I got 55gal. But we do truck and car repairs
Not me my kid does.
 
FWIW, here's the deal on RV versus regular automotive antifreeze.
The glycols come in several flavors - just like the alcohols.

Regular automotive antifreeze is ethylene glycol (EG). As pointed out by others, it is poisonous to humans and animals. I don't think you want to breath the mists either.

RV antifreeze is propylene glycol (PEG). It is used as a food additive such as in chocolate to make it silky instead of chalky. It is also used as a laxitive and as an aircraft de-icing fluid. It can cause health issues in extremely high concentrations, but then so can peanut butter. It is also an approved additive for dog foods, but not for cat foods where it has been associated with a certain type of anemia.

Regular ethylene glycol can be quite corrosive to steel. For automotive uses, corrosion inhibitors are added. From what I understand, all glycols generate organic acids as they degrade - especially when heated. If these acids are allowed to accumulate in the solution, the solution becomes corrosive to many metals, ferrous and otherwise. Commercial ethylene glycol and propylene glycol intended for heat transfer applications (such as Dowtherm and Dowfrost) have a passivators added to make metals less susceptible to corrosion - they also have additives to buffer the acid that forms.

Data published by Dow Chemical shows that uninhibited EG is about 5 times more corrosive than PEG. Unihibited PEG is about equally corrosive as plain water. With the additive packages, both EG and PEG are less than 1% of the rate for plain water.

So, it would appear that one should be sure to use inhibited glycols, and to clean the parts and the machine well after use. If you recycle the glycol in a coolant system, change it out from time to time to keep the acids from building up.

Those who regularly work with coolant systems may be able to comment on the build-up of organisms in the fluid. I suspect that EG and PEG will also support lifeforms if biocides are not added.

Terry S.
 
Good info, Terry. Thanks.

FYI: PEG is used in Kool Mist and a lot of the quenching fluids used in heat treating. I personally gave-up on flood coolants because the real issue is rust. Once the solutions begin to degrade, the pH also changes (and it doesn't matter if it goes base or acid) and you'll be plagued with rust. The same thing can happen with Kool Mist but, a several hour working session only uses about 6 oz of mixed solution and most of it evaporates. A quick wipe down with an oily rag or a few sprays of WD-40 and there's no problem.

Flood coolant tanks and Funky Smell:... I hate to be so "graphic" but, it's the only way I can describe the truth... If you leave flood coolant in a tank and don't watch-after the pH, it literally smells like the stale urine smell of a subway or back alley in the rough part of town. -Not trying to upset anyone's delicate sensibilities but, that's really what it smells like.


Ray
 
Walt said:
Not to spoil your fun, but most garages will take used anti-freeze and recycle it. I've disposed of mine this way, there should be no charge to you.

Walt
Click to expand...

Not at all worried about a charge, I could easily dump it in the ditch. I just figured I could save a few bucks by using it instead of throwing it out or "recycling" it. To that end I have put a 50/50 mixture in the machine and will run with it.
 
As long as no kids or pets have access, by all means use what ya got and know you saved the bucks. I too use whatever I have available for a lot of different applications. I use Bar and Chain oil for way lube because I can get high grade B&C oil for 4 dollars a gallon, Way oil is over 10 a gallon if you buy the exact right stuff. As long as it is lubed and has a film to keep corrosion down what is the difference? Every dollar I can save is another dollar more I can spend on tooling or material. I buy refiltered hydraulic oil from the local hydro shop and use it as a lube, coolant and parts wash. Clean oil will dissolve grease and hold it in suspension and you can wipe it clean with a shop rag pretty easily. If it needs further cleaning I break out the green stuff and water after the oil bath and then dip it back in oil after the wash. No rust, no smell, no mess. I even use oil to clean my hands when they are especially greasy and dirty, save a ton of hand cleaner and shop towels doing it that way. It probably is cancer causing or something, but breathing air is too, so if I am going to die at least I will have enjoyed myself getting there. Have a great 4th and don't set the yard on fire with the fireworks if you can avoid it...

Bob
 
Cant aggree more with ya Bob, just watch TV they got ya dead already, its sickning. Id be dead long time ago with all the stuff my hands been subject
to. If I dont wash something in gas maybe daily somethins wrong. My 98% chance of dying is driving out the driveway
 
Why can't they make flood coolants that are bio stable like the good old days; I especially pine away for the good old Cimcool, and Fiske's Metsol; you could use it as long as you could stand it getting mucked up with tramp oil, etc. and it never degraded like the more modern coolants.
Remember the big scare over NITROSAMINES ? This was mainly a food scare issue, but coincidentally when these things were removed from foodstuffs, like the nitrite preservatives in processed meats (hot dogs and suchlike), the nitrites were also removed from coolants, which were mainly a nitrite/amine formulation.
So, now they may be "safe" but they just don't last very long, especially where they are not used in a machine very often and they get an oil film on top, which cuts off oxygen contact and it seems to work pretty much like a septic tank in degrading the coolant; in my shop at home, I've given up on water based coolants and thinking of using (flood) cutting oil in all but the lathe, which I mostly use dry, except for cutting oil or Tapfree for finishing.
 
benmychree said:
Why can't they make flood coolants that are bio stable like the good old days; I especially pine away for the good old Cimcool, and Fiske's Metsol; you could use it as long as you could stand it getting mucked up with tramp oil, etc. and it never degraded like the more modern coolants.
Remember the big scare over NITROSAMINES ? This was mainly a food scare issue, but coincidentally when these things were removed from foodstuffs, like the nitrite preservatives in processed meats (hot dogs and suchlike), the nitrites were also removed from coolants, which were mainly a nitrite/amine formulation.
So, now they may be "safe" but they just don't last very long, especially where they are not used in a machine very often and they get an oil film on top, which cuts off oxygen contact and it seems to work pretty much like a septic tank in degrading the coolant; in my shop at home, I've given up on water based coolants and thinking of using (flood) cutting oil in all but the lathe, which I mostly use dry, except for cutting oil or Tapfree for finishing.
Click to expand...

In a way, I think you answered your own question. The "nanny state" gets to dictate what the industry produces and the industry is more than happy to comply because it will sell more product because the new government mandated products will not last as long.

JMHO

-Ron
 
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