# Mill Spindle Light



## Turbinedoctor

Here are some pictures of a light I made to go on my Grizzly 705 mill spindle. First picture shows the shotty job of soldering the LED's but also shows that the inner two rings of lights are tapered at 25 degrees to point them at the tool, the next twoo rings are straight down to flood the area around the work site. The second pictures is the front showing the array layout. Next we have the side profile showing the height of the whole assembly of two inches. It could be a little shorter but for my mill no longer. Last we have the larger ring that clamps to the main spendle housing with three set screws.

I will try to get pictures of it in operation but until then you have to take my word for it, it works great. Lots of light and no shadows since there are LEDs all around the tool bit. It is powered by a 9volt 1 amp wall charger for a radio.

Turbo


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## Hawkeye

I have a couple of plastic LED rings that I got for $20 each. They really help, but yours is just plain impressive. Can't have too much well-aimed light around the spindle.

Nice work, Turbo.


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## 8ntsane

Turbo
Nice job
You should have all the light you ever need over the work piece now. I had one of those store bought ones , but it only had about 8-LEDs . You should have enough on yours to light the entire table.:thumbzup:


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## Metalmann

Very impressive! Do you have a link of where to buy the LEDs and resistors?

A few years ago, I bought some on Ebay, but they weren't bright enough to do what I wanted.


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## Tony Wells

Does that come with sunglasses?  

Looks pretty good. I have considered building something like that, but never got around to it. I even have the materials, just too lazy I guess. Or maybe too busy? Dunno.


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## ScrapMetal

Metalmann said:


> Very impressive! Do you have a link of where to buy the LEDs and resistors?
> 
> A few years ago, I bought some on Ebay, but they weren't bright enough to do what I wanted.



If I'm in a hurry I'll see what Radio Shack has in stock but I tend to order mostly from Mouser Electronics - http://www.mouser.com (can be a bit confusing) and use Digikey as a "fallback" - http://www.digikey.com

Hope that helps,

-Ron


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## jgedde

Nice!  How about some pics of her mounted up and illuminating a workpiece?  I've been looking for an excuse to make one and that might be just the the thing.

John


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## Turbinedoctor

Thanks for all the nice replies. I got the LEDs from ebay, a seller from Hong Kong, they even came with the resistors and very inexpensive. Will try to post pictures of it mounted and working later. My life is upside down now. Lost father in law in february to ALS "lou Garretts", Mother in law and I were in auto accident in september, she just passed away last saturday. Never came home for hospital.

I will spare you the rest for now but to say the least, I have alot going on right now.

I do look forward to working in the shop as a little get away.

Turbo


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## ScrapMetal

Sorry to hear that Turbo.  My heart goes out to you and your family.

-Ron


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## Tony Wells

I hate to hear that, Turbo. I had been wondering where you had been. There are better places to be than where you've been lately. Anything I can do to help, let me know, please.


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## Turbinedoctor

Thanks guys for your thoughts, it will be mostly time that helps now. 

Thanksgiving was good but not the same, and I am sure Christmas will be hard also.

It is good to get back in here to take the mind off of things for a while.

Turbo


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## CMAGIC0

Very nice and useful idea. 

Martin


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## Turbinedoctor

Now that things are getting back to somewhat normal I am spending more time in my shop and working on some projects. Currently working on rebuilding a Troy-bilt tiller and will have to turn the shaft down once it gets welded. Since I will most likely have my camera in the shop making a video I will get some pictures of the light mounted and in action.

I must say while it has been great to use I did run into a clearance issue while milling on a AR 15 upper receiver and had to remove it. Other than that it has not been in the way.

Turbo


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## Turbinedoctor

Here is a video I did which give a good look at the mill spindle light being installed and in use. Also a little talk about my thoughts on the lower end of the line DRO's. The spindle light starts at 4min and 44sec.


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## Walt

Hi TD,

I do not see a link to your video, does it show up for you?

Walt


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## hman

Back in 2009, I wrote up an article for one of the Yahoo machining groups I'm on.  I used commercially available 12VDC LED "festoons" (36 LEDs each) and mounted them (with hot melt glue) on a thin piece of plywood surrounding my spindle.  They've worked well since then, and I've had no problems.

Just for completeness, I'd included a bunch information about several alternatives, including LED rings, homemade LED sources (was not aware of Turbo's work until now), etc.  

Unfortunately, much of the supplier information in the .pdf is now obsolete.  My two favorite suppliers seem to have gone out of business.  I'm currently working on finding new suppliers and updating the file, which I'll post as soon as I have it together.  Meanwhile, I can suggest Deal Extreme, http://dx.com.  In addition, I'd suggest eBay.  For eBay, try searching for "LED festoon 12v panel". 



- hman
(John Herrmann)


View attachment LightUpYourMill_2.pdf


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## Turbinedoctor

Sorry Walt I thought I put a link here. Anyway here it is now, you can skip to around minute 4 to get to the light if you wish.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOadBm0sH_A


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## Pmedic828

Metalmann said:


> Very impressive! Do you have a link of where to buy the LEDs and resistors?
> 
> A few years ago, I bought some on Ebay, but they weren't bright enough to do what I wanted.



Jameco has LED's and pieces parts - when connecting LED's, why don't you create 2 power rails, 1 positive and 1 negative, then increase the wattage of the resistor and just connect it in series between the power supply and either the positive or negative rail, and connect all the leds between the 2 rails.  seems easier to wire to me.


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## Turbinedoctor

I just started messing with LEDS a short while ago and use an online calculator to do the wiring scheme. I was wondering if that could be done without damaging the LEDs but haven't looked any further yet. Yes it would be alot easier if there was only one or two resistors.


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## iron man

Wouldnt it be easyier to use one of these might be cheaper too. Ray

http://www.superbrightleds.com/cat/led-headlight-accent-lights/


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## fretsman

I've used those and yes, they work great, but you can also get the ones made for exterior uses and have the dome resin on them, and they're waterproof. I got mine from Reggie over at Tricplate:

It's a 70 OD and 60 ID.

http://tricled.com/TricLed.com/Home.html

I used one on my G0704.










Dave


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## iron man

It looks like it was made for it it seems no matter how much light you have on a mill there is always a dark spot somewhere.. Ray


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## Pmedic828

http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10001_10001_2174881_-1 is the link for jameco white led's.  Depending on the DC voltage, order appropriate resistor for current of 20ma.  If you use a 12 volt DC supply, the resistor should be between 600 and 625 ohms.  Size the wattage of the resistor such that P (power) = I (current) X E (Voltage)  if you use 30 LED's, use (0.020 watts (20 ma) X 30) X 12 volts = 7.2 Watts -> round up to 10 watt 600 ohm resistor.
Hope this helps - make sure that the 10 watt resistor is elevated or is on some type of heat sink, otherwise use a 1/2 watt 600 ohm resistor for each led.


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## Splat

You can get those halo lights on Ebay for roughly $10. I've seen another guy do this on his mill and it's downright cool. Looks like a spaceship.


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## fretsman

Splat said:


> You can get those halo lights on Ebay for roughly $10. I've seen another guy do this on his mill and it's downright cool. Looks like a spaceship.



Do you mean the weather proof exterior style with the domed resin coating? 

If so, I'd love a link as that was much cheaper than I paid.

Thanks,
Dave


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## Splat

fretsman said:


> Do you mean the weather proof exterior style with the domed resin coating?
> If so, I'd love a link as that was much cheaper than I paid. Thanks, Dave



Well, that I don't know about but I guess not for the price. I don't remember if it was here or another forum where the guy had installed it on his mill and he loved it. If you search "halo light ring" on Ebay you'll see all the different kinds. I've also heard of guys using camping tent light rings. Check this link for more ideas, though he doesn't use it on a mill but you get the idea.


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## RCWorks

I have mine about half way done for the Harbor Frieght mini mill...

I have them all around the spindle and a bunch behind the spindle as well

I bought 100 LEDs from china for another project and had some left over. The prices on Ebay can't be beat.


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## Turbinedoctor

Yes you can probably buy something similar and cheaper but there is the satifaction and knowledge of doing it your self. It was a learning project for me.


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## 24more

I'm gonna have to steal this idea.  Beats trying to position a desk lamp correctly.


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## Turbinedoctor

24more said:


> I'm gonna have to steal this idea. Beats trying to position a desk lamp correctly.



Good luck with your project and remember to post some pictures.


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## garryp

cool lamp. are the leds a blue light or a white light?


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## CMAGIC0

I can honestly say that a led for my mill is a must have. The spindle light just blew me away. Very nice, and very clever.  Martin


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## velvetpig

This is great. I will have to make one


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## eac67gt

These have always been a great layout, the ring around the spindle. I wonder why, and maybe they have, use just a few Cree leds instead of a whole bunch of common bright leds.

Ed


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## Splat

eac67gt said:


> These have always been a great layout, the ring around the spindle. I wonder why, and maybe they have, use just a few Cree leds instead of a whole bunch of common bright leds.



Build it and they will buy.


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## Turbinedoctor

garryp said:


> cool lamp. are the leds a blue light or a white light?



The ones I used were listed as white but give off a blueish light but not as blue as the ones listed as blue.

Try mixing things up a bit and use blue, red green and even yellow to see what color you get.  LOL


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## Turbinedoctor

CMAGIC0 said:


> I can honestly say that a led for my mill is a must have. The spindle light just blew me away. Very nice, and very clever. Martin



Thanks Martin, try designing you own to fit your needs and post some pictures of the build.

If I do another one I will try to get it to be as low a profile as possible. I found the other day while using my drill chuck, that the chuck key will not turn all the way around and I have to pull it out rotate it and re-insert it. That is one thing I would change and maybe a little smaller in diameter.

I am happy with the LED configuration. Good amount of light.


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## Turbinedoctor

velvetpig said:


> This is great. I will have to make one



Please post pictures of you build. I did not take any of mine since it was a spur of the moment build. Been thinking about it for a while but just set out to build it in the middle of another project I was working on.


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## Turbinedoctor

eac67gt said:


> These have always been a great layout, the ring around the spindle. I wonder why, and maybe they have, use just a few Cree leds instead of a whole bunch of common bright leds.
> 
> Ed



What is a Cree LED?


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## Walt

Turbinedoctor said:


> The ones I used were listed as white but give off a blueish light but not as blue as the ones listed as blue.
> 
> Try mixing things up a bit and use blue, red green and even yellow to see what color you get.  LOL



FWIW, I would avoid this approach. (I see your "LOL") If there is any distance between the individual lamps, you will get colored segments of shadow, different for each segment. Very distracting.

Walt


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## Walt

Turbinedoctor said:


> What is a Cree LED?



Cree is the industry leader worldwide in high-output LED lamps. 

I use their LEDs in my bike lights. They have high power output and good control of color. Most commercially built bike lights (and most flashlights) are made to achieve the highest possible number of lumens. It's a number that buyers can compare and get the most of for the least amount of money, so that tends to drive the market toward blueish lights. However, it turns out the the human eye (at least my human eye) is more comfortable with, and process motion better with light with most of the power concentrated toward the red end of the visible spectrum. Additionally, the things that happen to make up the surface of a bike trail; dirt, rocks, and roots all tend to look the same under blueish light.

Not sure if any of this applies to machine work, but I don't like blueish LEDs, and Cree (among others) sells lamps in different color temperatures. I buy ones at the neutral to reddish end of the spectrum, under 5000K. It costs more (money and lower lamp output), but the results are worth it to me, YMMV.

http://www.cree.com/lighting

Walt


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## arvidj

Walt said:


> Cree is the industry leader worldwide in high-output LED lamps.
> 
> ...
> 
> However, it turns out the the human eye (at least my human eye) is more comfortable with, and process motion better with light with most of the power concentrated toward the red end of the visible spectrum.
> 
> http://www.cree.com/lighting
> 
> Walt



Thanks for the reference to Cree.

For completeness, here is a graph of the average human eye color sensitivity. Given that most light sources are sold by color temperature rather than wavelength this chart might be useful to get from one to the other. I am assuming it is much more complicated than this but using a KISS methodology suggests to me that, assuming the same lumen output, lighting in the 3500 to 5000 temperature range probably gives off the most usable light.

Arvid


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## Turbinedoctor

Well this has turned out to be a rather enlighten thread. (Pun intended)


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## ntc51

That might be one of the coolest things I've ever seen!


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## Turbinedoctor

Well it's almost been a year now and I don't see anybody else's designs. Come on guys show what you came up with.

Durwood


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## Pmedic828

Well, Here you go Turbinedoctor:

My latest creation:  4 12V led pods mounted on a circle mount which has magnets hot glued to it to stick on my milling spindle.  See pics:  
I am about to update the pods to the new SMD-5050 48 LED light wafers that I have a picture below - they give off more light in a smaller space - you can find them on ebay.  I choose the SMD-5050 because there is more light output than the 3000 series for the same current.  See pics:  



	

		
			
		

		
	
This is the ring mounting for my milling spindle:thinking:


	

		
			
		

		
	
Ring mounted on the spindle)


	

		
			
		

		
	
Spindle mounted on the mill from the lathe bed


	

		
			
		

		
	
  LED Lights on :cool2:



	

		
			
		

		
	
This is with the LED's on shining down



	

		
			
		

		
	
Shows how I mounted the Spindle Light to the Mill with Hot Glued Magnets so it can be removed:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:


	

		
			
		

		
	
  New SMD-5050 X 48 Light LED purchased on e-bay


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## Turbinedoctor

WooW so much thinner and simpler than mine. I like the idea of the LED Pods.

Thanks for sharing.


Anybody else??

Durwood


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## Pmedic828

If anyone is interested in finding those "Pods", just let me know - they come in Cool white like I have, yellow, blue, red, green, and other colors - I also can get others that are wider or more narrow and still come in these following colors - I use them to install lighting on Motorcycles - they are waterproof and connect directly to a 12 Volt DC plug in power inverter (like you have on your phones or other devices - just make sure they say 12 VDC and tell you the polarity.  I am looking forward to changing out these pods to the new SMD-5050 as they are 3X as bright as the pods for the same voltage and amperage -  now, my next project a tachometer for my lathe and mill.


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## xalky

I bought one of these 


from:http://www.superbrightleds.com/more...adlight-accent-lights-with-t3-14-adapter/878/

It comes with the protective dome already on it. The size is perfect for a Bridgeport or clone spindle.
I epoxied 4 small high power magnets to it. I spliced in a coiled telephone cord, so that it can move and stay out of the way when the spindle is extended. Grabbed a toggle switch that I canniballized from something. Scrounged a small plug-in transformer that I saved for just such a project. And voila...An awesome spindle light that's unobtrusive and gives off some excellent lighting, exactly where it's needed.








I mounted the toggle switch right below my DRO mount swing arm.





Thanks for the ideas guys. This is great!

PS: I don't have the patience for soldering in all those LEDs. Maybe it's my caffeine consumption...the hands jitter too much.)  I had enough soldering, just soldering in the wire and switch connections.:whistle:hew:


Marcel


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## awander

Pmedic828 said:


> Jameco has LED's and pieces parts - when connecting LED's, why don't you create 2 power rails, 1 positive and 1 negative, then increase the wattage of the resistor and just connect it in series between the power supply and either the positive or negative rail, and connect all the leds between the 2 rails.  seems easier to wire to me.



Doing it that way is not a great idea, though a lot of inexpensive electronic devices do it that way.

The problem is that you need to use a resistor that will drop the proper amount of voltage when the current for all of the LEDs is being drawn through it. Then if any of the LEDs burn out, the current through the resistor will be less, so the voltage dropped will be less, meaning the remaining LEDs will see a higher voltage. To some extent , this higher voltage will cause a greater current through each LED, and can cause more of them to fail, making the situation worse.


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## John Hasler

awander said:


> Doing it that way is not a great idea, though a lot of inexpensive electronic devices do it that way.
> 
> The problem is that you need to use a resistor that will drop the proper amount of voltage when the current for all of the LEDs is being drawn through it. Then if any of the LEDs burn out, the current through the resistor will be less, so the voltage dropped will be less, meaning the remaining LEDs will see a higher voltage. To some extent , this higher voltage will cause a greater current through each LED, and can cause more of them to fail, making the situation worse.



Also, if all the LED are not identical (and they aren't) some will draw more current than others.    Better to put all the LEDs in series with a single current-limiting resistor and a higher voltage supply.  Much simpler and more efficient.


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## awander

Pmedic828 said:


> http://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10001_10001_2174881_-1 is the link for jameco white led's.  Depending on the DC voltage, order appropriate resistor for current of 20ma.  If you use a 12 volt DC supply, the resistor should be between 600 and 625 ohms.  Size the wattage of the resistor such that P (power) = I (current) X E (Voltage)  if you use 30 LED's, use (0.020 watts (20 ma) X 30) X 12 volts = 7.2 Watts -> round up to 10 watt 600 ohm resistor.
> Hope this helps - make sure that the 10 watt resistor is elevated or is on some type of heat sink, otherwise use a 1/2 watt 600 ohm resistor for each led.



There are a couple of problems with the calculations and resistor values shown above.

1) To size an LED resistor, you calculate the resistance to give the desired current using Ohm's Law, but you need to use the voltage across the resistor, NOT the supply voltage. All LEDs have an intrinsic voltage drop, and the drop for a white LED is usually about 3.4V. So when using Ohm's Law, you need to use (Supply voltage minus LED voltage), instead of just supply voltage. The 600 ohm resistor mentioned above would only let 20mA of current flow if it had the entire supply voltage across it.

Assuming a white LED with a voltage drop of 3.4V, you would calculate the proper resistance to give 20mA of current using R(resistance)=V(volts)/I(current), or R=(12V-3.4V)/.02, which gives a resistance value of 430 ohms.

Using a 600 ohm resistor in this circuit would give a current of I(current)=V(volts)/R(resistance), or I=(12V-3.4V)/600, or only 14.3mA. Note that this would probably work OK, as most modern LEDs will be nearly as bright with 15mA of current as they will with 20mA of current.

2) If you use one resistor to drive all of the LEDs in parallel, you actually need to change both the resistance and the power rating from that used for a single LED.

So using the 430 ohm resistor as calculated above for (1) 3.4V LED with a 12VDC supply, we have the following values:
Vs(Supply Voltage)=12V
Vl(Voltage across the LED)=3.4V
Vr(Voltage across the resistor)=8.6V
I(current through the LED and the resistor)=20mA
R=430 ohms

If you tried to then change the circuit so that (1) 430 ohm resistor(of a higher power rating) was supplying current to (30) LEDs in parallel, I would increase to 20mA*30 or 600mA. 

Drawing 600mA through a 430 ohm resistor would cause a voltage drop across the resistor of V=I*R or V=600mA*430 ohms, or 258V! Obviously, that will never be attainable with a 12V Supply.

If instead, you connected the LEDs in series, you could use use a single resistor to limit current to 20mA, but you would then need a power supply voltage of more than 3.4V * 30 or 102V. You would need to calculate the resistance value as above, using R(resistance)=V(volts)/I(current), where V was (Supply Voltage-102V). Assuming a 120VDC supply, R=(120-102)/.02 or 400 ohms. This resistor would need to have a power rating of 8V*.02A or .16watts, so a 1/2 watt, or even a 1/4 watt, unit would work.

This scheme has the disadvantage that if any of the (30) LEDs burns out, the entire string would go dark.


It is a much better idea to simply bite the bullet and use a proper current-limiting resistir for each LED. It will be much more reliable in the long run.


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## Turbinedoctor

I really like the idea of using the coiled phone cable to extend and retract. I have my wire set so it is just long enough for the longest length of the spindle and find it is not in the way when retracted. But if done again I would use the phone cord. I don't have a switch yet but want to add one soon. Kind of a pain to have to plug the power supply in and out every time I use it. Might install the phone cable when I install the switch.

Thanks for the idea.


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## Senna

Dang, too small for the 4" quill on my Gorton 9J. I'll have to measure my 8.5D quill to see if these will fit on it.

Very cool lighting and thanks for posting the link Marcel.



xalky said:


> I bought one of these
> View attachment 69536
> 
> from:http://www.superbrightleds.com/more...adlight-accent-lights-with-t3-14-adapter/878/
> 
> It comes with the protective dome already on it. The size is perfect for a Bridgeport or clone spindle.
> I epoxied 4 small high power magnets to it. I spliced in a coiled telephone cord, so that it can move and stay out of the way when the spindle is extended. Grabbed a toggle switch that I canniballized from something. Scrounged a small plug-in transformer that I saved for just such a project. And voila...An awesome spindle light that's unobtrusive and gives off some excellent lighting, exactly where it's needed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I mounted the toggle switch right below my DRO mount swing arm.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the ideas guys. This is great!
> 
> PS: I don't have the patience for soldering in all those LEDs. Maybe it's my caffeine consumption...the hands jitter too much.)  I had enough soldering, just soldering in the wire and switch connections.:whistle:hew:
> 
> 
> Marcel


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## xalky

They sell bigger ones. You have to buy the dome seperately, but the domes are cheap. Check the site. When you scroll down the page of the different halo fixtures, the dimensions are towards the bottom. 

Marcel


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## Senna

Thanks Marcel. Those are very cool and the coiled telephone cord is pure genius.


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## RCWorks

I got a little side tracked and built a building in the mean time. I hope to be back on track by next month... Being older with a few health conditions tends to keep me in the house when the temps are in the 10, 20 and 30s.... 

Hope others are having warmer days.


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## 283v8

My condolences and prayers go out to you.

I like the LED light - I'll be looking for one.


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## darkzero

Here's mine....


I decided to build one too after seeing the  angel eye/halo LED that xalky used for his mill, thanks Marcel! The vendor he linked  didn't have the size I wanted so I ordered it on ebay. I used a 90mm  ring with 60 LEDs.


Here are the parts I used, the angel eye LED that I rewired, an AC to DC converter, & a lighted rocker switch.




I installed the AC to DC converter inside the control box which is being  powered from the stock light's 24V circuit.




I choose the 90mm ring so it would fit just over the bottom ring on my  quill. Had to remove just a bit of the ID to fit & it snaps right  into place. Although I didn't need it I added a bit of double sided tape  just in case. Couldn't have asked for a better fit!







Installed the lighted rocker switch on one of the existing holes &  the other hole for the wiring to the control box. 








I'm pretty happy with it & I like the slim profile much better than the drill press quill LED unit that they sell. Thanks for the ideas everyone!

- - - Updated - - -

Oh & this is the one that I tried before installing this one. I didn't like it cause it was too bulky & the tint was too cool.


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## kd4gij

xalky said:


> They sell bigger ones. You have to buy the dome seperately, but the domes are cheap. Check the site. When you scroll down the page of the different halo fixtures, the dimensions are towards the bottom.
> 
> Marcel





What do these require for a power supply


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