# Rebuilding a Van Norman #12 in UK



## Pauldarby1 (Sep 19, 2013)

I've wanted of a while a larger milling machine to replace my Tom Senior. The Tom Senior is both a vertical and horizontal machine, but much smaller and not so easy to change over. The VN had been standing in a shed for 5 years following a bereavement. I hadn't even heard of these machines, but following some research I have been able to establish that it was built in 1947. It appears to be all there, with the exception of the right side table handwheel feed screw casting and the base side casting plate. The guy had replaced all 3 motors with 230V single phase. Fortunately he had kept the original motors. I have a 415V supply in my home workshop and intend to use the original motors. All the original electrics are there. Below the main electric box is a metal electric box containing a transformer. The output wires from this run in a metal conduit together with the main 3 phase wires to the other side of the base. Hear is located the master switch and a round 3 pin socket, fitted with a threaded screw cap. I assume this was for powering an inspection lamp.
I have almost completed the move to its new home. I only have the column and base to separate. The machine is then going to have all it's slideways and gibs reground and scraped. It's a coincidence, but both this machine and the 1926 Indian motorcycle I am building we're built in the same town/city.


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## Pauldarby1 (Oct 19, 2013)

The base before.

- - - Updated - - -

Cleaned and painted in Raglan Lathe blue.


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## ScubaSteve (Oct 20, 2013)

I like that color!

Been getting some use out of my VN12 this weekend....drilling 3/8' holes through 3/4" 316 SS. Needless to say, it is a slowwwwww process. Having to use the knee for my z "feed".  I really wish I had a 1-RQ for the quill and power downfeed.


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## toag (Nov 5, 2013)

can't wait for more pics on this rebuild!

as for a VN with a quill... this VN 16S has been on ebay for ever and is the only 16S ive ever seen... 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/130837145040?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649

worth 2500? probably not... quill travel is maybe 3", but that 3" more than most VNs :roflmao:


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## Pauldarby1 (Dec 23, 2013)

The ram head is almost finished. Just needs the lever tops plating in chrome. All the gears have been out and everything is in good condition. I was going to have the ram head reground, but you can see all the original scraping marks, so on Cal's advice I've decided not to. I was able to save the gaskets, which I intend to re-use. The column, knee, saddle and table have gone off to be re-ground. Chrominance is quiet expensive, so I'll get everything chromed together.


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## toag (Dec 23, 2013)

that's a nice bit of kit!
see' i speak british:jester:
looks great:thumbsup:


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## David (Dec 23, 2013)

Great job on the rebuild!  I'm sure end result will be well worth the effort!

David


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## Pauldarby1 (Dec 24, 2013)

Ram head prior to renovation


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## ScubaSteve (Dec 24, 2013)

Simply awesome. A very unique color choice as well....not typical for VN, but I like it! You are really doing a true rebuild on this thing....can't wait for more!:thumbsup:


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## Pauldarby1 (Mar 12, 2014)

Well it's been a while since I've had the opportunity to work on the machine. I've got the column back from the machinist. He's ground and scrapped the ways for the knee. I've also had all the chrome done. I'll post a photo of that soon. On my machine the knee operated hand wheel has been converted to a handle. While I wait for the knee, saddle and table I'll mount the electrics. Oh, I also had the 3 motors attended to. The large cutter motor needed a re-wind and new bearings. The other two were overhauled, lacquered and new bearings fitted.


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## toag (Mar 12, 2014)

that scraping looks swank!
that's on heck of a rebuild.  Can't be too many VN's running amock across the pond.  to be honest there aren't many running amock here:rofl:.


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## Pauldarby1 (Mar 13, 2014)

I'm sure there are a few, but I haven't heard of any. This machine has the VN control box, but all the other electrics are British. Also the main cutter motor a 11/2hp Electro Dynamic, but the two other motors are British. Not sure why that is. Maybe it was shipped like that?


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## chuckorlando (Mar 13, 2014)

Awesome build man. I almost got a #12 if only they has a quill.


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## toag (Mar 13, 2014)

hmmm that's interesting.  maybe they shipped without electrical parts to save on weight and since things might be different on that side of the pond.  then installed them once it was uncrated.  I would love to know the history of that expat.


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## Pauldarby1 (Mar 14, 2014)

My machinist has phoned to say that the table is bent!!!! It rocks on the saddle and he can't take a straight measurement. It seems that I have big problems. He was originally going to grind and then 'Turcite' it back to original size. However, he can't determine which end to use to straighten the table. Ultimately, there's no problem straightening the table, but the problem lies with re-aligning the table feed screw in the saddle. He thinks it could need grinding as much as .043" in places.
He has suggested that I may need to have the table feed screw casting ground off and machine a new one. Also there may be an option of boring out the centre of the table feed screw casting. I would then need to make an insert to the original internal diameter, but off set in the bore by the amount taken off the table to realign it.
I'm off to see him today to get a better understanding of the problem.


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## Thomas Paine (Mar 14, 2014)

the table is BENT?  wth.  I need to see this in person.


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## toag (Mar 14, 2014)

off .043 sounds like a lot, I am surprised a table can get that out or whack, thats alot of metal to take out to get to flat.


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## thomas s (Mar 14, 2014)

Wow good job on the rebuild looks great
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## Pauldarby1 (Nov 25, 2014)

It's been a long time since the last post. I've been busy reconditioning a Jones & Shipman 1212E cylindrical grinder. I'm a sucker for a piece of machinery. I'm in the early stages of building an 1926 Indian Scout, so the machines with come in very handy. Due to the bend in the table it was decided to mill off the leadscrew casting. A new bearing housing was machined and trial fitted. A few thou at a time was taken off the depth until it could tightened up and the lead screw could be wound in and out fully without any stiffness. I think the early VN12 tables had a separate bearing housing.


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## herbet999 (Nov 27, 2014)

Your machine is coming along nicely. I look forward to seeing it when it's done.

I'm currently working on a Van Norman No2. I'm trying to dismantle the spindle head. While it's a bit different from your spindle head, I was wondering if you have any pointers on how you rebuilt yours. Or perhaps you might have some pictures.


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## HMF (Nov 28, 2014)

Paul,

Fantastic job mate!!


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## Pauldarby1 (Nov 28, 2014)

herbet999
         that's all I have left to work on. Cal Haines is the Van Norman man. I think it's worth messaging him.


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## herbet999 (Nov 28, 2014)

Thanks, I have communicated with Cal. He's provided a lot of information. And I was able to dismantle the head on my machine.


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## HMF (Nov 28, 2014)

herbet999 said:


> Thanks, I have communicated with Cal. He's provided a lot of information. And I was able to dismantle the head on my machine.




Cal is the man. AND he shares his info very unselfishly.


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## Pauldarby1 (Nov 30, 2014)

Nels, 
        Nany news on the right hand lead screw casting? "We may make some based on the #16 casting which is sturdier at some point"

Paul Darby


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## HMF (Jun 8, 2015)

VN 12 1940's Brochure


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## Cal Haines (Jun 8, 2015)

Pauldarby1 said:


> Nels,
> Nany news on the right hand lead screw casting? "We may make some based on the #16 casting which is sturdier at some point"
> 
> Paul Darby


I *STRONGLY *urge against trying to make a "sturdier" right hand bracket.  The problem isn't that the bracket isn't sturdy enough, it's that idiots remove the maximum limit of travel feed stops to try to get a little more travel, then power feed the table into the saddle.  If the right hand bracket doesn't break, something else will.

_Cal_


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