# 3-jaw chucks: Who makes what?



## just old al (Mar 22, 2017)

Putting a new (to me) SB9 on line in my shop and decided to eeat myself to a new 6" 3-jaw chuck to replace the two battered monstrosities I have in the shop.

Looking at the vendor sites I'm familiar with shows me no names I'm familiar with and lots of choices. Also, all of them seem to have American pattern replaceable jaws - a feature I am unfamiliar with.

SO - bottom line (and yes I did search before asking) who makes a decent 3-jaw chuck for an SB9 that will simultaneously work with a decent TIR and not break my wallet?

            Thanks - Al.


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## strantor (Mar 22, 2017)

What's "decent" TIR?
I got this chuck, .003" TIR for $109
http://www.cdcotools.com/
P/N 25433

Need to buy a back plate that matches your spindle thread


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## just old al (Mar 22, 2017)

"Decent" TIR: .003 sounds reasonable to me - not a problem.


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## wildo (Mar 22, 2017)

I bought a Bison 3 jaw chuck that is self-centering with fine adjustment. It's pricey, but you can dial it in to be dead center. That was important to me. You can see it in my resto thread: http://www.hobby-machinist.com/threads/south-bend-9a-restoration-pic-heavy.44300/


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## woodchucker (Mar 22, 2017)

I think 6" is to big for the SB9. I have a 4 jaw 6, that's fine, but for the 3 jaw, I have a 4" a 5 might work, but 6 I believe is too big, it will work, but I'm betting you'll hit your cross slide and not be able to get in close too many times.
Runnout will be based on how well you setup your backplate. So what you are looking for is a good chuck, and a good back plate... that you will machine. As long as it tightens down, does not deform, smoothly works. You want reversible jaws... do you need the option of soft jaws?  If you have collets setting up the chuck is easier if the screws come in from the front. You can setup a rod with a center drilled out. Then mount it in the chuck, and use your tailstock to hold it centered on your machined  backplate. then you can take transfer punches in the front and mark your holes. you can run an indicator on the rod next to the chuck to make sure it's dead on b4 marking, if not tap it into position.  I don't believe its as easy to do a rear bolted chuck. Others might disagree and have come up with a way to do it.


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## wildo (Mar 22, 2017)

woochucker said:


> I think 6" is to big for the SB9. I have a 4 jaw 6, that's fine, but for the 3 jaw, I have a 4" a 5 might work, but 6 I believe is too big, it will work, but *I'm betting you'll hit your cross slide* and not be able to get in close too many times.



I'm not sure how that would be possible. Even with the compound set parallel to the cross slide, the tool holder still sits to the side of the cross slide. But I suppose stranger things have happened.


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## markba633csi (Mar 22, 2017)

I bought a 4" chinese 3J chuck for my 6" Atlas.  110 $ with backplate.  Not too bad it's about .0033 runout.  If you get a chuck with 2 sets of jaws, check them both right away- I had to return one set for a replacement; they were not made correctly.  In my next life I'll spring for a Pratt Burnerd. 
Mark S.


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## just old al (Mar 22, 2017)

Re: Chuck info: Good data, all. Reason I was looking for a 6"er is that is what I have presently - two very, very shagged-out examples. TBH if I need things dead on I'll either use my 5C collet chuck or dial it up in the 4-jaw.  Anything I do in the three-jaw is going to get an initial truing cut in any case, so a small amount of runout is not unacceptable.

This lathe came with yet another three-jaw - whose jaws had had pads welded to them...badly. That one went RIGHT into the tip once I took a good look at it. I ca handle runoput but that should have just run away.

As far as machining the backplate in situ - that's always been on my radar. Semi-finished backplates in 1-1/2 - 8 TPI are quite inexpensive - surprised me when I looked them up. i've done it from scratch with a raw casting before but that level of work, while entirely possible, just doesn't meet my time constraints anymore. Gonna throw my wallet at it this time.


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## woodchucker (Mar 22, 2017)

wildo said:


> I'm not sure how that would be possible. Even with the compound set parallel to the cross slide, the tool holder still sits to the side of the cross slide. But I suppose stranger things have happened.


You haven't opened the jaws, which is what would hit. but looking at your chuck, your jaws are definitely  taller and may eliminate that inteference. But possibly reversing your jaws to grab something larger, I still think you have that risk. Maybe I'm wrong.


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## intjonmiller (Mar 22, 2017)

I've been very pleased with my 6" 4-jaw scroll chuck from Shars on my 10" Logan. Should be pretty comparable experience to an SB9. I paid about $170 or $180, shipped (from their eBay store), for mine. IIRC it was about $10 more than the 3-jaw, which is about 5th or 6th down my list of future purchases, somewhere below a collet chuck and good set of collets. It is heavy and substantial and feels very well-made, and it came with a 1-1/2"-8 threaded backplate.


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## fradish (Mar 22, 2017)

I have a Shars 6" on my South Bend 9C.  I have the scroll chuck that comes with 2 piece
jaws and a 1 1/2" 8 thread backplate, currently they sell for $160 plus shipping.  You just
Have to mount the backplate and true it up on your spindle before mounting to the chuck.
They have instructions on how to do this to minimize your runout.

I think if I had the jaws opened really far it might be able to hit the arms of the carriage.
I just make sure I turn the chuck by hand before I turn on the power to make sure that
doesn't happen.

The thing I like about the 6" with the 2 part jaws is that I can put a cylinder 1 3/4" in
diameter over 4" deep into the chuck.  The original 5" I had had a much smaller through hole
(1 1/4") and the jaws were not very long (a little over 2") and I never felt that I had a good hold on my stock.

Update: tonight I actually measured both chucks.  The 6" is deeper but the through hole is
not quite as wide as I thought.  Still much better than the 5".


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## Nogoingback (Mar 22, 2017)

wildo said:


> I bought a Bison 3 jaw chuck that is self-centering with fine adjustment. It's pricey, but you can dial it in to be dead center. That was important to me. You can see it in my resto thread: http://www.hobby-machinist.com/threads/south-bend-9a-restoration-pic-heavy.44300/



Or, for a bit less $$$, Bison p/n 7-805-0552: 3 jaw, 5" diameter, 1 1/2-8 mount so you won't spend money on the backplate.


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## intjonmiller (Mar 23, 2017)

I forgot to mention that the jaws fall out of my 6" Shars before they collide with the ways, and they're only holding on by one or two teeth when they clear the saddle.


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## darkzero (Mar 23, 2017)

Keep in mind when looking at 6" chucks. They come in both 6.0"/152mm or 6.3"/160mm (sometimes called 6-1/4"). That difference may be enough to give you problems. Sometimes the vendor doesn't specify exactly, they just say 6".

I have a 12x36 import lathe & I'm used to having the 6.3" size. I purchased a 6" Gator 3-jaw that was the 6.0" size eventually it bother me so I got a 6.3" size, well that and I got a good deal. That reminds me, I need to post that Gator chuck for sale

Not sure how much you want to spend but Gator makes some pretty good chucks. They're made in China but they're better than any other China chuck I've seen. I own 2 & I'm happy with them. My other most used chucks are Bison, made in Poland. Pretty nice chucks but a lot more than an Asian chuck but the quality shows. And if you really want to get something nice, Pratt Burnerd chucks are very nice, made in England! I had a TMX chuck once, made in China, it was garabage for the price, I returned it. I hear TMX has recently moved their chuck production to Poland, I guess they realized too.


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## just old al (Mar 23, 2017)

Wow - what a fountain of information. Thanks, All - this is what I needed.

DZ, i know Pratt Burnerds well - I have a Myford in the shop as well and its chucks (all ex factory) were Pratt Burnerds. Lovely things, but not seen a vendor of them here. 

SO, what do you want for that Gator?


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## richl (Mar 23, 2017)

Grizzly sells Pratt burners on their website. Pricey, but they do look great, probably looking to get one myself.

Rich


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## darkzero (Mar 23, 2017)

just old al said:


> DZ, i know Pratt Burnerds well - I have a Myford in the shop as well and its chucks (all ex factory) were Pratt Burnerds. Lovely things, but not seen a vendor of them here.
> 
> SO, what do you want for that Gator?



There's a few PB dealers but none that I know of that gives discounts, pretty much have to pay full price on them.

I didn't want to offer my Gator since it has a D1-4 backplate. It's an adjustable chuck so you can dial it in to get under .001" TIR. It's the semi steel version so it's more affordable than the forged steel models. You'd have to buy or make a new backplate for it to fit your lathe. I'm not willing to sell the chuck seperately from the backplate. It is pretty much brand new though. I figure it might be cheaper if you went a different route since I have the D1-4 backplate already.

But if you are still interested anyway, PM me. The chuck is 1-901-0600 & the adapter for 1-1/2 - 8 is FLE-160T2 . The adaptors were usually around $125 but AllIndustrial recently changed their website & Gator products are currently not listed. I'm not sure who has the best prices on Gator stuff now.


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## talvare (Mar 23, 2017)

Kalamazoo is a nice American made chuck. A little pricey, but last time I compared prices several years ago, they weren't much higher than Bison. Check them out here:
http://www.kalamazoochuck.com/index.htm

Ted


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## mksj (Mar 23, 2017)

I have the 6" PBA Setrite that I purchased from Grizzly 4 years ago, Bill (wrmiller) has the 8", very nicely made chucks and slightly more expensive then the Bison equivalent. They are beautiful chucks, but pricey. I had a discount coupon for Grizzly which helped. http://www.hobby-machinist.com/threads/pm1340gt-with-a-3-jaw-pratt-burnerd-6-setrite.30758/

If you do not need a set-true type and don't want to bust the bank I would recommend looking at the Shar's FS series http://www.shars.com/fs63-6-1-4-3-jaw-forged-steel-self-centering-scroll-lathe-chuck , they also have a set-true type.  I also have Bison chucks and I have not been disappointed.  Not sure on Kalamazoo chucks, when I was looking at chucks several years ago it seemed like there where a number of posting discussing quality issues, and Gator seems to be hit or miss. http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/general/kalamazoo-chuck-co-207822/


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## jbolt (Mar 24, 2017)

I have read a number of posts about problems with the newer Bison scroll chucks. Most common complaint is slippage of the part in the jaws. I have a Bison adjustable 5C collet chuck but almost never use it unless I need to use a special collet or have a part not suited to a 3-jaw. My Gator adjustable 3-jaw holds its centering position over a such a large range it is my preferred chuck for most work.


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## Splat (Apr 11, 2017)

I've heard mostly good about Gator chucks. MOF, I'm thinking of getting one soon, unless I can score a nice Bison on sale.


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## Nogoingback (Apr 11, 2017)

Splat said:


> I've heard mostly good about Gator chucks. MOF, I'm thinking of getting one soon, unless I can score a nice Bison on sale.



Splat, if you're looking for a Bison, have a look at these folks: http://www.rlstephenstool.com/lathe_chucks.htm.  I got a 4 jaw from them a while back and saved about $250.00 when
compared with everybody else I looked at.  They were easy to deal with over the phone, and my
chuck showed up within a few days as well.


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## Splat (Apr 12, 2017)

Nogoingback said:


> Splat, if you're looking for a Bison, have a look at these folks: http://www.rlstephenstool.com/lathe_chucks.htm.  I got a 4 jaw from them a while back and saved about $250.00 when
> compared with everybody else I looked at.  They were easy to deal with over the phone, and my
> chuck showed up within a few days as well.



I just checked them out. Grizzly sells the 8" D1-5 4-jaw for less. Grizz wants $24 to ship though. I'm gonna have to call that company you provided and see what's what. Thanks.


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## westsailpat (Apr 13, 2017)

It would be good to have a Buck Indicator chuck , but that would break the bank big time . I think at this point in time the Chinese cats are getting pretty good at the game . The thing about " replaceable " jaws is you can get aluminum " soft jaws " , bore them out to fit the part and then run out , among other things is not a issue .


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## darkzero (Apr 13, 2017)

westsailpat said:


> It would be good to have a Buck Indicator chuck



What is an indicator chuck? I never heard of the one before & I'm curious. Or did you mean independent?


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## chips&more (Apr 13, 2017)

I believe he meant a set-tru type chuck. And they are worth every penny in IMO.


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## darkzero (Apr 13, 2017)

Ah I see. I have 2 Bison Set-Tru chucks, I agree, I absolutely love them.


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## Doubleeboy (Apr 13, 2017)

The down and dirty (read cheap) way of getting set tru action at less than set tru prices is to machine your backplate about 10 or 20 thou too wide, loosen mounting bolts of chuck to back plate just a bit tap chuck to get smallest runout then re-tighten bolts and check again.  Another way is to mimic a set tru back plate with holes drilled in from perimeter and install set screws, a better set up, I actually double the set screws on top of each other for a locking effect.  With my cheapo 5c collet chuck from CDCO , cobbled on to a D1-6 back plate with the set screws as mentioned I can get this cheap rig to dial in within a tenth or two.  luckily my little lathe which is much older was purchased when Bison was still affordable gear, my set tru Bisons are marvelous, but out of reach for me anymore.

If I had my machining life to do over I would have saved a bunch of money and not bought 3 jaw chucks, just collet chucks and 4 jaws, maybe one 6 jaw for thin wall parts.  Three jaws are handy but unless they are set tru they are a pain in derriere to reload a previously machined part in with any expectation of part running tru unless you do the tap tap tap routine with deadblow hammer.   If I were mentoring a newbie I would strongly encourage learning to love a 4 jaw.


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## westsailpat (Apr 13, 2017)

Never heard it called a Set-Tru , but then I don't know crapola plus I just turned 61  and I feel like boiled shi* . Indicator /Set -Tru chucks are super precision , the 6 jaw is ambrosia . Yes they work kinda' like a independent 4 jaw . But back to my alum. soft jaw , I'm sayin' good sub .


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## darkzero (Apr 13, 2017)

westsailpat said:


> Never heard it called a Set-Tru , but then I don't know crapola plus I just turned 61  and I feel like boiled shi* . Indicator /Set -Tru chucks are super precision , the 6 jaw is ambrosia . Yes they work kinda' like a independent 4 jaw . But back to my alum. soft jaw , I'm sayin' good sub .



The actual name is "adjustable scroll chuck". Set-Tru is what Bison calls it. Others have their own names but all do the same thing, Buck = Adjust-Tru, Pratt Burnerd = Set-Rite, Gator = Tech-Tru. I believe Buck is the originator though.

Did someone say 6-jaw? I love 6-jaw chucks, that's what I primarily use but I do have a 3-jaw Set-Tru also. 6-jaw chucks are like chuck porn! 


My old avatar (sorry I couldn't resist):


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## Silverbullet (Apr 14, 2017)

I'm fond of my six jaw too. I'd take it over any three jaw. With the six jaw you have the three jaw by removing three, or the option of two jaw even. Did you ever think of the four jaw that's scroll driven not independent jaws. They use to make them both ways in a combo so setting up odd parts could be set up once then open the scroll to insert the next part.  The four jaw scroll chuck isn't a bit higher in price from what I have seen .


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## darkzero (Apr 14, 2017)

Those combo 4 jaws are nice & they still make them. I've always wanted one but they are expensive. With the chucks I have now I have no need for one.


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## just old al (Apr 17, 2017)

Got lucky - ended up scoring a Set-Tru 6-jaw for my old SB in trade for an old collet chuck and a bunch of collets. Dialed that sucker in and...bliss. Scary looking thing, though. I did do myself a favur and stripe the backs of the jaws in orange just as a reminder to NOT PUT HANDS HERE!


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## Splat (Apr 21, 2017)

Since Toolmex/Bison has gotten out of China and moved their manufacturing back to Poland I would check them out for chucks now. Any model # that starts with a "7" was made in China. Model #'s starting with an "8" are made in Poland. That's what I got straight from Toolmex/Bison tech support.


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## rzbill (Oct 9, 2017)

woodchucker said:


> You haven't opened the jaws, which is what would hit. but looking at your chuck, your jaws are definitely  taller and may eliminate that inteference. But possibly reversing your jaws to grab something larger, I still think you have that risk. Maybe I'm wrong.



Hey, thanks for that.  I just ran down the the shop to check the Polish Bison 6-1/4" that is on my 10" Atlas. Never had considered the open jaw aspect.  Jaws fall out with about 3/4" to spare above the carriage and custom carriage stop.  I like the Bison by the way.  I have not measured its TIR yet.  I did the spindle taper recently and got 0.001 TIR with my Last Word which I am obviously happy with.  I don't have any ground shafting handy to do the Bison check but I guess I could turn a short piece and then flip it and measure the cut portion.


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