# New PM-1228 Joins the Crew



## AlanB (Apr 10, 2022)

I have been looking at a lathe upgrade for a few years, and finally the stars aligned. The PM-1228VF-LB is replacing a 10x21 that I've been using for a very long time. It has been doing the job but I wanted more features. I could write a lot about the selection process, but as with most things, this is a good compromise between what I need and what I want and what I actually have room and budget for. It's also about as much as 120V can provide, and minimizes the startup projects.







Picking it up at the depot on my utility trailer works better than trying to deal with a delivery, and that went fine. They forklifted the double palleted box onto the trailer and I strapped it down and brought it home. Transferring the 490 pound machine to the workbench was the next challenge. The tailstock and chuck were removed but that doesn't help a lot on this machine. The scheme we came up with was to position a hydraulic lift table across the end of the workbench, and back the trailer through the garage door and right up to the lift table. Unfortunately I didn't stop to take pictures, we were rather busy focusing on the task at hand. The procedure was to slide (two people pushing accomplished this) the stacked pallets onto the hydraulic table  which had been matched to the trailer height. The trailer was stabilized by the 3/4 ton truck it was still connected to, and about 1/3 of the pallet fit onto the hydraulic table. The pallets were then elevated so the lathe was at workbench height by alternately raising the hydraulic table and a floor jack on the trailer under the tailstock end of the pallets. The pallets were kept level through the process. We used a 2x4 lever to get the floor jack under the pallets, but lifting was all hydraulic thereafter. The hydraulic table kept the pallet level on the lathe's X axis, and the floor jack was matched to the table's height keeping the Z axis level. Once the top of the pallets was at workbench level the attachment bolts from lathe to pallet were removed. A pair of rollers cut from closet rod were levered under the headstock foot and the lathe was rolled and tailstock slid a few inches at a time, moving the rollers to keep one under the fairly short foot, onto the workbench and into position. The rollers were finally removed using wood levers.

The chip pan is not under the lathe yet, that will be a future project. I'm not sure if this workbench will be the final support. I'm thinking a small gantry crane might be useful to have around and this workbench might be upgraded to something with drawers as I did on the PM-728 mill earlier.

The lathe arrived in good condition, there are a few scrapes and the usual paint chips, but overall it is good. The plastic tool chest is badly cracked and useless, but apparently that is the norm. 

In any case we're operational. I installed the AXA Toolpost and topped up the oil. I picked up a 150 ml syringe and use that for putting in the oil. I overfilled it, so I removed the sight glass to let the extra out rather than drain the whole thing. That worked well, but I discovered something on the threads of the sight glass which appears to be teflon tape. This makes no sense as there is a gasket and these are not sealing threads. In any case the proper oil level has been reached.







The gearbox is shifting a bit rough and uncertain.  I know that it needs to be run at low speed, or the chuck rocked to align the gears, but it seems to be a little tricky to find the gear. The manual suggests using a sharpie to better mark the knob skirt. The knobs were very dirty, so I removed them to clean them and the ball bearing detents fell out. I didn't lose anything, but reassembly is a bit tricky. So I designed and 3d printed a tool to hold the balls in alignment while the knobs are being reinstalled. The small slots hold the balls in position while the central slot rides under the shaft keeping the jig in the right spot. Once the knob springs push on the balls and hold them in place the tool can be withdrawn. That worked out nicely.






But the shifting is still a bit difficult, sometimes it seems to want to be slightly off the marks in some gears. I wonder if I should slightly chamfer the holes in the face of the lathe to make the ball detents more positive, or ? Any suggestions??

I had some trouble getting the Feed and Cross Feed shifting engaged - it sometimes locks out and never engages. It turns out that the Halfnut lever has more than 2 positions. Engaged, Disengaged, and a little beyond that is Too Far Disengaged. In the Too Far Disengaged position it locks out the Feed and Cross Feed. Is there a fix for that? It can be worked around of course.

One of the tasks that I use the lathe for is winding line onto some reels that I 3D print. I use a turns counter to measure the line with appropriate calculations for the reel circumference, accounting for the change as it fills. To do this I use a magnet on the spindle and an LCD counter that I 3d printed a mount for. This used magnets to stick to the top of the old lathe. Well, the top of this new lathe is plastic, and I wanted to get this counter further back and out of the way anyhow, so I designed a new mount setup for this. The magnets are on the side now, and it is back out of the way of the chuck key and tool area that might be in use. Another problem solved with a little 3d printing. This is the prototype but it is working so well I haven't printed up a more final version.






Well, that's most of the story so far. I made a few chips and am starting to get used to having a DRO which is a nice improvement. I would like to put an Electronic Leadscrew on this someday, but it is not a priority. With 15 speed gearbox this covers most imperial threads without gear changes, and it gives a good range of feed rates. I like the brushless DC motor, though the speed pot only goes down to 50 RPM. I'm used to a speed pot that goes to zero. When winding line on a reel this means I have to push a button to stop it, rather than just using the knob. It stops very quickly especially from low speeds, and we don't wind at high speeds anyway, so it is manageable.

I did a quick test and a "D" Maglite will fit in the bore of the PM-1228. Just in case you need to turn, thread, or modify any of your Maglites.

Thanks in advance for any comments and suggestions,

AlanB


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## Firstram (Apr 10, 2022)

Pull the label off of the shift knobs, the detent spring tension can be adjusted. You may need to clock the sticker to better align with the divot. The same thing for the half nut lever, lube and a little more pressure maybe.


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## AlanB (Apr 10, 2022)

Firstram said:


> Pull the label off of the shift knobs, the detent spring tension can be adjusted. You may need to clock the sticker to better align with the divot. The same thing for the half nut lever, lube and a little more pressure maybe.


Thanks for your comments.

I didn't know there was an adjustment (but looking at the exploded drawings it is shown). The tension is pretty stiff but it probably needs to be. It's hard to tell where the detents are, it feels like there are more positions than there should be. The arrows are not nearly precise enough, the manual suggests marking the skirt with a fiber tip ink pen, which I did after cleaning the knobs. Generally the marks line up, sometimes they are slightly off.

If the halfnut control is not in exactly the "Not Engaged" spot, the Feed is solidly locked out. Plenty of lube there now. It's probably a case of "not deburred" corners on the parts inside, so just a little off the spot and it blocks the feed shift lever. I don't know if I want to take the carriage gearbox apart or just live with it. I wonder if other owners have experience with this, if it is something easy to address or too much trouble to bother with.

AlanB


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## erikmannie (Apr 11, 2022)

I would bet that as you use the lathe, you will get very accustomed to where the (feed speed?) knob as well as the half nut lever positions need to be.

With my most recent new lathe, I would totally stress out about changing the levers to a new setting (would be inches/rev or thread pitch) on the Norton gear box. A few weeks of struggling with it, & now I don’t even think about it because I got a feel for it.

Congratulations on a brand new lathe! I know you got so many miles out of your old lathe, & then you sold it for only $200 less than you paid for it (and it didn’t even have a DRO). Your old lathe probably only cost you 5 or 10 cents every time you used it.

The way the economy is right now, you told me that used machines are commanding top dollar. I think a lot of the craigslist people enjoy the thrill of the hunt! The people that I know that use craigslist rather than buying new are like this: buying new would not fulfill this enjoyment of the pursuit.


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## erikmannie (Apr 11, 2022)

Alan, you were talking about getting a chuck with a larger center hole for your Maglite bodies. Don’t bother; bring me the (hopefully 8”) chuck(s) that you have, & we can bore out the center hole up to 2.56” diameter in under 60 minutes.

You don’t even have to (and you shouldn’t) remove the D1-4 backing plate because the adapter gets bored out, as well.

Don’t even stress about boring out a new chuck & backing plate; I guarantee that it will be as good or better than factory.


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## AlanB (Apr 11, 2022)

The three and four jaw chucks have sufficient center bore diameters already, equal to or larger than the headstock bore. I only mentioned a six jaw because Maglite body tubes are thin and probably should be gripped with a six jaw to minimize distortion. The test I did today with a D Maglite was through the three jaw chuck. I didn't try a really old Maglite, those had larger diameter bodies and might not fit, but the newer products are a smaller diameter, and I'm unlikely to run into more of the old larger ones. 

I did a number of upgrades on the old lathe, so it was worth more than I paid, plus the prices have gone up a lot and availability is limited. I priced it to sell quickly, I'm sure I could have gone higher, there were many "buy" responses on it. The market is hungry at least in this area for 10x lathes and I don't see many on CraigsList. So it's a good time to sell your old one.

As you suggest, I'll get used to it, but I'm still wondering what if anything others have done on the 1228. I've done some searching but haven't found these issues mentioned. I'll have to search further.

In the short run I'm going to use it the way it is, and make some parts.


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## Chewy (Apr 11, 2022)

One thing I learned the hard way with that lathe is to cover the hole under the bed in the headstock.  I di a lot of cutting last year and opened the back cover to oil the gears.  One day I opened it and found metal shavings all over the gears and back side of the headstock housing.  It is open under the headstock  and eventually there accumulates enough swarf to make it to the gears.  I cleaned it out and duct taped the opening and no more problems. Will do a more permanent repair sometime this year.


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## AlanB (Apr 11, 2022)

Chewy said:


> One thing I learned the hard way with that lathe is to cover the hole under the bed in the headstock.  I di a lot of cutting last year and opened the back cover to oil the gears.  One day I opened it and found metal shavings all over the gears and back side of the headstock housing.  It is open under the headstock  and eventually there accumulates enough swarf to make it to the gears.  I cleaned it out and duct taped the opening and no more problems. Will do a more permanent repair sometime this year.


Thanks for the tip.


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## AlanB (Apr 11, 2022)

Here's the PM 8 inch Taiwanese 4-Jaw option. The 50mm bore is larger than the lathe's 1.5" so no issues there. The chuck key is the same tip size so fits both the 3 and 4 jaw chucks and the D1-4 Cams, and has a longer T bar plus the safety ejection spring. I think I'll use this chuck key for everything, and the spring pops off for those preferring the unsprung ride. The DRO is in lathe mode but still shows X and Y for some reason. Not sure if there is an option to fix that.


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## LVLAaron (Apr 11, 2022)

I think you'll want to get that bundle of wires on your rear panel out of there before use.


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## AlanB (Apr 11, 2022)

LVLAaron said:


> I think you'll want to get that bundle of wires on your rear panel out of there before use.



Good suggestion. They are fixed there from the factory so not loose, but rerouting them would make cleanup easier.

Alan


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## LVLAaron (Apr 11, 2022)

For sure. You don't want that full of oil and swarf.


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## AlanB (Apr 11, 2022)

I mostly cut plastic, but I have already rerouted them. Thanks.


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## AlanB (Apr 12, 2022)

Finalizing a 3D model for the way covers and chuck support blocks. This template verifies fit and centerline.


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## Aurelius (Apr 12, 2022)

AlanB said:


> Good suggestion. They are fixed there from the factory so not loose, but rerouting them would make cleanup easier.
> 
> Alan


How did you reroute them?
I was thinking of just taking them under the backsplash and going up the back side using the same holes, but I've been working on other aspects and hadn't quite gotten around to asking if there was a better way.


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## AlanB (Apr 12, 2022)

Aurelius said:


> How did you reroute them?
> I was thinking of just taking them under the backsplash and going up the back side using the same holes, but I've been working on other aspects and hadn't quite gotten around to asking if there was a better way.


For the moment I just shoved them under the backsplash and plugged them back in, my access to the rear is difficult so I haven't done anything to restrain them at the moment. I also got a couple of cookie trays to put under the lathe on the workbench's wood top, and the lip interacts with the cable and backsplash in a less than ideal way, so I'm looking at alternative routings. I may change from this workbench to a different setup and then use the provided chip tray. At the moment I don't have a way to lift the machine and get the chip tray underneath. I'd like to get a gantry but most of them are too tall for my garage, it would need to fit under the garage door, I haven't found a shorter one that wasn't pricey. So any cable routing is temporary.


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## AlanB (Apr 12, 2022)

So now that we have some CAD that seems to match the Lathe bed and Chuck centerline, here's a Chuck Support Block for the 160mm 3 jaw.


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## AlanB (Apr 13, 2022)

Hot off the Printer


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## erikmannie (Apr 13, 2022)

I have contacted Alan, & asked him to print me a chuck rest (chuck support?) like this for my PM-1660TL/12” chuck combo.

Surely there will be others who have just got to have one of these.


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## AlanB (Apr 13, 2022)

Added a chamfer to the top edge. Showing support blocks for both 160mm and 200mm chucks. 3mm clearance to the chuck. These have to fit the lathe somewhat precisely to work properly.


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## ptrotter (Apr 13, 2022)

Looks good. How long does it take to print?


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## AlanB (Apr 13, 2022)

ptrotter said:


> Looks good. How long does it take to print?


Using default settings in 0.2 speed with PLA it took a little over 9 hours on a Prusa MK3.


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## erikmannie (Apr 13, 2022)

AlanB said:


> Using default settings in 0.2 speed with PLA it took a little over 9 hours on a Prusa MK3.


Alan is making things while he sleeps!


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## AlanB (Apr 14, 2022)

One of these days I will CNC the PM-728 mill, but probably not the lathe. I am thinking about putting an ELS on the lathe however. But the 3D printer is magical. Send it a sliced and diced CAD design and wake up to a present every morning!


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## Cletus (Apr 16, 2022)

I've got the @clough42 ELS on my old Grizzly G4000 Lathe. Man, what a difference that makes!








						G4000 ELS Upgrade
					

Back around 2005, I purchased my Grizzly G4000 Lathe and did quite a few very useful mechanical mods to it, leading to the publication with the help of others, two FREE handbooks "Tricking out the Asian 9 x 20 Lathe" and "Rebuilding The Asian 9 x 20 Lathe". Well, this lathe has served me well...




					www.hobby-machinist.com


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## AlanB (Apr 16, 2022)

I'm definitely thinking about an ELS and I have looked at every one out there, including the Clough42 and your nice thread. I should have put one on the old lathe, it had only change gearing (no shifting at all), so I never changed it from 0.005 feeding (or learned how to single point thread). The 1228 has 15 speeds for feeding and threading which is a nice start but there are still a pile of change gears that I don't want to be using. I would like a setup that allows using any of the 15 gearbox speeds so the ELS needs an input and display arranged to accommodate that. So it is a bit different from any that I've seen so far. But I've worked out the math and enjoy real time coding so that part should be fun. I have the encoder and an extra motor, I bought 3 Nema 23's for the mill CNC project but later found that Z needed a larger Nema 34. The hard part is figuring out mounting on the new 1228 without mauling the new machine or taking it offline for very long. I was looking at the $4 Pi Pico which runs at 133 MHz and has dual cores, so one can do the realtime encoder to motor pulse generation and the other can do the user interface. At 2000 rpm with a 1024 line encoder there are over 900 Pico clock cycles per encoder edge transition event so not too difficult to keep up with the real time part.


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## Cletus (Apr 16, 2022)

Oh, cool!  ....could be a fun project.   Yup, I fully understand thee bit about having the lathe off-line.  I was able to do mine keeping the lathe on-line all the way through.


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## AlanB (Apr 16, 2022)

I'm enjoying the 1228. I didn't have power cross feed before, have been using that to part off a bunch of rings for a project. It was so fun I did more than I needed.


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## Cletus (Apr 17, 2022)

I know that feeling!  ....last month we designed and made a custom coolant flow indicator/sensor for a client's Cosmetic Laser, it went so well and we were so pleased with It, we made another just to keep around the shop.


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## AlanB (Apr 17, 2022)

Very neat. I keep thinking I need a CO2 laser so I can do acrylic. But I should probably just get on with the CNC install on the mill... I've been collecting parts for it since before the virus..


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## AlanB (Apr 20, 2022)

Today I was doing some boring and decided to try the carriage stop. The carriage just pushed the stop, even with it quite tight. So I found the clutch adjustment pins to reduce the clutch tension. One pin fit fine, the other did not quite fit into the holes on the clutch adjuster. A few moments on the belt sander fixed that. I reduced the tension too far and the heavy spring pushed the threaded end of the adjuster out entirely. I used a piece of wood to push the adjuster's end nut against the strong spring and spun the housing with fingers to re-engage it to a minimum setting, with 2-3 threads engaged. This seems to be working, at least with the present workload which is quite light. The mechanism slips quietly, not with the loud clicks as mentioned and shown in Frank Hoose's videos. This was at low speed, at higher speed it might get noisy. The feed clutch is another nice feature of the PM-1228.


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## AlanB (Apr 26, 2022)

I 3D printed a cradle for the four jaw chuck, here are both the 6" (160mm) and the 8" (200mm) cradles on the PM-1228. The cradles have 3mm clearance  so they don't get stuck when the chuck is mounted on the lathe. They are precisely fitted to the lathe ways so the alignment of the chuck is very close. The same design can be used to make way covers which will come in handy. Sharp eyed viewers will notice that the cradle under the smaller chuck is an earlier version and lacks the chamfer on the upper edges that was added. Both designs now have that feature.


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## AlanB (Apr 28, 2022)

I have published the files for the chuck cradles here:





__





						Printables
					






					www.printables.com


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## ptrotter (Apr 28, 2022)

What program did you use to design these models?


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## AlanB (Apr 29, 2022)

OpenSCAD


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## AlanB (Apr 29, 2022)

I will probably print some way covers next.


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## AlanB (Apr 29, 2022)

I made the first way cover 50mm wide, which fits from the headstock to the chuck cradle when changing chucks. Next I'll make another section 75mm wide which covers under the chuck, together that's about the right amount to use when working near the chuck. I have some ideas about a telescoping addition that will provide ways protection further out.


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## Badabinski (Apr 29, 2022)

Chuck cradles are a brilliant idea. How heavy are your chucks? My 8" 6 jaw is like 60-70 pounds with the backplate and is an absolute bear to mount on a threaded spindle nose, so having a cradle like that would be fantastic.


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## AlanB (Apr 29, 2022)

Your chucks are about twice what these chucks weigh for the 12x28 (I don't have a 6 jaw yet). It pays to use extra care when working with them. I recall one accident investigation involving a 75 pound lathe chuck and some unfortunate fingers. Having a healthy safety perspective is important. Separating the lifting operation from the mounting operation is a useful process improvement. These chucks are in the weight range where it seems easy enough to skip using lifting equipment, but the consequences of a slip can be significant. The cradle is a big help but in order to be able to extract it there must be some clearance to the perfect alignment, unless the cradle had a built in jack or similar feature.

I would like to have a 6 jaw chuck. They have gone quite pricey..


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## AlanB (Apr 29, 2022)

50 and 75mm way covers, fresh off the Prusa MK3 3D Printer:


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## AlanB (Apr 29, 2022)

I don't know how well it might work, but here is a chip shield that magnetically attaches to the carriage and overlaps the way covers.


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## AlanB (Apr 30, 2022)

Here's a short prototype for fit testing.


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## AlanB (Apr 30, 2022)

Here is the first full size prototype. Telescopes nicely over the way covers and looks like it will do the job. Stays out of the way when the carriage is fully retracted. More magnets can be used to hold it if desired. Will make a top cover to keep the magnets in and the swarf away from the magnets. If hot chips are anticipated a thin aluminum sheet over the top would be prudent.


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## AlanB (May 1, 2022)

This cover has dimples underneath matching the magnet holes to help keep it in place. I'll cement it on after I have decided how many magnets to use. If I cement the top and not the magnets themselves I can split it off to recover the magnets when it is no longer used. This setup telescopes for a useful length of about 120mm. I can print more sections of the way covers to lay in when working farther from the chuck. Perhaps I should consider adding more coverage in the front to protect the leadscrew with this system. Another possible improvement is to print some locating tabs underneath that index to the carriage in the X direction. There's always an improvement that can be made. 

This cover can easily be lifted off when the follow rest is desired, or to reach the rear oiler.


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## ptrotter (May 1, 2022)

3D printers are great. I have the same one.


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## AlanB (May 1, 2022)

They are, and the Prusa is a good one.


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## AlanB (Jul 22, 2022)

It doesn't look like I mentioned it earlier in this thread (or I missed it in a quick review), but when I used the turns counter together with the DRO to measure lathe travel to verify some gear ratios they came out wrong. I sent some data to Precision Matthews, and they instantly suggested counting the teeth on the 90 tooth gear. I did so (using a photograph printed on a sheet of paper) and sure enough there was an extra tooth on that gear marked Z90. They have seen this on a few lathes, a mismarked gear. They had just run out of that gear at the time (May) and I've just now received the replacement (and verified the tooth count). Good service. Something to be aware of, easy enough to check with a caliper or DRO on your lathe.


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## erikmannie (Jul 23, 2022)

AlanB said:


> It doesn't look like I mentioned it earlier in this thread (or I missed it in a quick review), but when I used the turns counter together with the DRO to measure lathe travel to verify some gear ratios they came out wrong. I sent some data to Precision Matthews, and they instantly suggested counting the teeth on the 90 tooth gear. I did so (using a photograph printed on a sheet of paper) and sure enough there was an extra tooth on that gear marked Z90. They have seen this on a few lathes, a mismarked gear. They had just run out of that gear at the time (May) and I've just now received the replacement (and verified the tooth count). Good service. Something to be aware of, easy enough to check with a caliper or DRO on your lathe.



That is very impressive that you detected that error!


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## AlanB (Jul 23, 2022)

I measured the 24 TPI threading travel with the DRO and 24 rotations of the spindle (carefully positioning the chuck, with the slack removed) which produced 0.989 inches of travel, which is 24.27 TPI. I verified the DRO with a dial indicator. I made other measurements as well to verify the error. Having a turns counter on the chuck and the DRO made it pretty easy to do the measurements.


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