# Kunming KXM10 4" Universal  Cutter Grinder



## Ulma Doctor (Jun 8, 2017)

after doing some surfin' on CL,  i found a vintage import Kunming KXM10 4" Universal Cutter Grinder
it is a clone of the famed Deckel SO cutter grinder
























this lil' 220v 3 phase, 5,300 RPM, 1/4 hp cutter grinder came complete with tools.
namely an assortment of HSS and Carbide blanks and grinding wheels, spare grinding wheel hub, & the stock set of deckel style collets (1/8-5/8 by 1/8" increments- 8 total)






it also came with a vintage storage stand with heavy duty ball bearing drawers







to power the unit on single phase 240v, i'll be using a surplus Yaskawa VFD .
i'll post video's in the coming weeks!


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## mikey (Jun 8, 2017)

Dang, sure would like to have one of those. Congrats, Mike!!


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## Bob Korves (Jun 9, 2017)

Nice purchase, Mike.


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## Ulma Doctor (Jun 13, 2017)

Thanks Guys!!!


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## Ulma Doctor (Jun 13, 2017)

i made a short walk around, after i got a Yaskawa Mini Vs CB .2kw single phase input, 3 phase output VFD hooked up to test run ...


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## mikey (Jun 13, 2017)

That looks and sounds sweet, Mike! What an awesome acquisition to your shop.


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## Dabbler (Jun 13, 2017)

very nice!


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## Ulma Doctor (Jun 13, 2017)

mikey said:


> That looks and sounds sweet, Mike! What an awesome acquisition to your shop.


Thank you Mikey! i look forward to try to get the most of it.
i'm going to try to sharpen a (cheap) damaged boring bar as the first victim 




Dabbler said:


> very nice!


Thank you Dabbler


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## chips&more (Jun 13, 2017)

Mike, I didn’t know you had the talent to read the hieroglyphics on the name tag and identify the machine! You very smart man! But you still suck!...Dave


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## Ulma Doctor (Jun 13, 2017)

chips&more said:


> Mike, I didn’t know you had the talent to read the hieroglyphics on the name tag and identify the machine! You very smart man! But you still suck!...Dave


Thanks Dave,
But if it was not for Google, I would'nt have known the manufacturer 
But thanks for giving me credit I don't deserve!


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## Bob Korves (Jun 13, 2017)

I already have a big box of dull tools gathered up to bring over and test it out...


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## chips&more (Jun 13, 2017)

Ulma Doctor said:


> Thanks Dave,
> But if it was not for Google, I would'nt have known the manufacturer
> But thanks for giving me credit I don't deserve!


Yeah, I had to use Google to on how to spell “hieroglyphics”.


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## Ulma Doctor (Jun 13, 2017)

Bob Korves said:


> I already have a big box of dull tools gathered up to bring over and test it out...


you are welcome in my shop anytime Bob.
the cutter grinder is here waiting for work! 
now i just gotta go thru the learning curve


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## Bob Korves (Jun 13, 2017)

Ulma Doctor said:


> you are welcome in my shop anytime Bob.
> the cutter grinder is here waiting for work!
> now i just gotta go thru the learning curve


Reality check.  I have an end mill sharpening fixture to use on my surface grinder and have not even tested it yet...  Nice machine you have there, capable and not too fussy to use.  Find some dull tools that aren't too special and use them as guinea pigs.  What could go wrong???


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## Ulma Doctor (Jun 14, 2017)

Well i jumped into the pool and here is the proof!
the big carbide endmill is there to show a comparison of the relative condition and damage done to the repaired endmill.
i didn't snap a before picture, so that was the second best i could offer.













other than needing to get more familiar with the nuances of operation, 
i'd say the first test was successful!  
the endmill is by no means perfect, but i got rid of the chipped cutting surfaces.
with further grinding,
i may be able to restore the end cutting ability, but that's for the next chapter.


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## chips&more (Jun 14, 2017)

I have a very similar grinder (pic) and use it for sharpening single lip pantograph cutters. Does a nice job of it. Have not used it for some time now because I can buy carbide cutters for pennies. And when the cutters dull I repurpose the carbide shanks and make micro boring bars out of them. It’s a win win. Have always wondered how the grinder would sharpen other stuff. I have soooo many cutters that I’m not really concerned about a sharpening capability in my shop. But it would be nice to know. I will also scratch my head, we can scratch our heads together.


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## chips&more (Jun 14, 2017)

A question; does the head (part that holds the collet and also rotate) have any positive stop(s) of rotation? Or do you just turn, note the graduation and lock?


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## Ulma Doctor (Jun 14, 2017)

chips&more said:


> A question; does the head (part that holds the collet and also rotate) have any positive stop(s) of rotation? Or do you just turn, note the graduation and lock?


Hi Dave,
Very cool grinder you have!

Yes sir,  the head on the kmx10 can be locked in one position and manual graduation is noted and it has a 180* rotation feature.
There is a type of pawl that is lifted and rotated to select free rotation, locked, and 180* rotation.
There may be (read: are) other functions that i am ignorant of


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## chips&more (Jun 14, 2017)

So it’s currently as it sits for two flute end mills, drill bits and the like? And just sharpening the ends of said stuff?


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## Ulma Doctor (Jun 14, 2017)

It can do some limited cylindrical grinding and can produce (relatively short) tapers too!

I want to grind some carbide boring bars from scraps


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## Ulma Doctor (Jun 15, 2017)

chips&more said:


> So it’s currently as it sits for two flute end mills, drill bits and the like? And just sharpening the ends of said stuff?


apparently it is better suited to sharpening things than originally anticipated.
i found out that there are more indexing capabilities, by accident- there is some grinding dust that interferes with the pawl operation 
i'll need to clean that up to use the indexing function fully !
more mysteries uncovered by the moment!


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## Ulma Doctor (Jun 15, 2017)

chips&more said:


> I have a very similar grinder . And when the cutters dull I repurpose the carbide shanks and make micro boring bars out of them.


now i do too!


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## chips&more (Jun 15, 2017)

Ulma Doctor said:


> now i do too!


Looking good Mike! That outta work! I have a few watchmaker lathes. And I dedicated one of them to the harsh environment of grinding swarf. The boring bars that I make (pic) are typically very small because of my work envelope. I can bore 0.010” holes (but have not done that in a while). More like 0.025” and bigger is the range for my retirement years. Please make sure you use a vac system when grinding carbide…Dave


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## Ulma Doctor (Jun 15, 2017)

Thanks Dave,
Wow those are some cool boring bars!
I'm waaay to heavy handed and clumsy to use such well crafted and small tooling 

Thanks for the reminder about carbide dust control and collection!


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## Ulma Doctor (Jun 17, 2017)

as a point of information,
i did some more investigation, the head pawl has 15* set index points plus a vernier rotating feature that allows for virtually any angle to be indexed.
a very well thought out feature.


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## mikey (Jun 18, 2017)

Mike, living vicariously through your posts is not making me happy!


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## Ulma Doctor (Jun 18, 2017)

mikey said:


> Mike, living vicariously through your posts is not making me happy!


Hi Mikey,
i have wanted my own machine shop since i was a kid. my grandfather had a lot to do with it!
he had a modest shop with only a few tools, but he made useful things that are still being used- although he has been gone 40 years now.

i don't want to make money from the machine shop, that's not my intention.
this is a venture of blind love- arguably, the a quest of a fool who loves tools.
i just want to have the oddest/coolest tools i can get my hands on to construct or repair things of interest.

if my ramblings and show and tell inspire others to do something or go after something they would like, then i'm happy to to be the beacon. 
if my work serves no other inspiration than a way to instruct others as how NOT to do something, i'm cool with that too. 

i really do appreciate all the folks who stop by and read my crap or at least look at the pictures!


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## Ulma Doctor (Jul 1, 2017)

after looking around in the cabinet that was furnished with the cutter grinder, i found the original Chinese/English manual from August 1982 !
i scanned the english portion of the manual for those interested as follows:































































what is really strange/coincidental,
is that i live in the 209 area code, the S/N is 209


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## peter.van.haren (Feb 4, 2020)

Hi, I just found/bought the same model. It's 380 3 phase so won't be running it for a while.
How's your's working for you?
More later.
Peter


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## Diecutter (Feb 4, 2020)

My Deckel SO had a 3 phase high voltage motor on it when I got it.  Switched it for a Delta compact bench grinder motor and have been using it daily for 25 years. The motor layout in the manual hints that you may be able to do this if this option appeals to you. Make sure the rpms of the motors are the same.


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## pontiac428 (Feb 4, 2020)

Mike, for your two flute end mills, after you've ground away the broken bits and index the face to the helix, you need to cut big relief cuts in front of each cutting edge.  Then cut your 5-deg cutting edge and clean up the clearance cut.  It's a funny thing with two flutes, they don't work like 3+ flute EMs in that regard.  Keep a good example on hand as you go, it'll help.  Welcome to the club, and good start!  Your tool budget will find wiggle room now that basic cutting tools can be reused until there's nothing left but a stub.


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## middle.road (Feb 4, 2020)

(_dons dust mask before posting..._)
Did you ever get to using this puppy regularly?



Ulma Doctor said:


> after doing some surfin' on CL,  i found a vintage import Kunming KXM10 4" Universal Cutter Grinder
> it is a clone of the famed Deckel SO cutter grinder
> 
> this lil' 220v 3 phase, 5,300 RPM, 1/4 hp cutter grinder came complete with tools.
> ...


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## peter.van.haren (Feb 5, 2020)

Anyone have any experience with the cheaper Chinese grinding wheels/cups?  For 20-40 bucks (vs tyrol for $$$), the Chinese eBay versions look worth a try.  I'm thinking about what I type(s) need and prefer to make mistakes on cheaper purchases.


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## pontiac428 (Feb 5, 2020)

I can vouch for the cheap Chinese diamond/CBN wheels (yeah, it's a mystery), but stay far away from imported vitrified stones.  Stefan Gotteswinter says he abuses his $10 diamond wheels and chuckles about it in his Deckel clone videos.  I decided to try treating mine like that, beating on them like they owe me money with whatever metal at whatever rate.  They do hold up well.  For stones, though, I would go straight to Norton.  You will want to get a cup wheel in white #38A for most work (I like 60 grit, some seem to like super coarse, but I've ground enough at this point to think I know better), and I prefer the "purple" (actually kinda brown) #32AA in 60 grit for roughing.  The latter stays amazingly cool while removing lots of tool steel stock such as lathe bits.


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## peter.van.haren (Feb 6, 2020)

Thank you for that.  Now that you mention it, a while back when I was looking for a used machine, I did see Stefan's video.  It didn't register in my head at that time.  I ordered a couple Chinese diamond cups/disks already and will give them a try.... after I get my motor issue sorted.
Right now I'm have a bit of difficulty to find a 220VAC single phase (approx. 2800 rpm so has to be 2 pole) motor as a shoe-in (existing motor base and shaft seem to be an odd size). Don't really want to get an inverter that will transform 220 single to 380 three phase for the existing motor. Besides, the bearings are a bit noisy.
All in all, at least the project is putting grease under my finger nails!
Peter


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## Diecutter (Feb 6, 2020)

If you use a diamond wheel it's good to have one of those soft white cleaning sticks to remove glazing from buildup between the diamond grains. They really make a difference and only run a few bucks.


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## Janderso (Feb 6, 2020)

Nice score Mike!
Like Bob said, You Suck.


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## peter.van.haren (Feb 6, 2020)

Diecutter said:


> If you use a diamond wheel it's good to have one of those soft white cleaning sticks to remove glazing from buildup between the diamond grains. They really make a difference and only run a few bucks.


Thanks, I'll get one.


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## ub27Rocks (Feb 18, 2020)

peter.van.haren said:


> Thank you for that.  Now that you mention it, a while back when I was looking for a used machine, I did see Stefan's video.  It didn't register in my head at that time.  I ordered a couple Chinese diamond cups/disks already and will give them a try.... after I get my motor issue sorted.
> Right now I'm have a bit of difficulty to find a 220VAC single phase (approx. 2800 rpm so has to be 2 pole) motor as a shoe-in (existing motor base and shaft seem to be an odd size). Don't really want to get an inverter that will transform 220 single to 380 three phase for the existing motor. Besides, the bearings are a bit noisy.
> All in all, at least the project is putting grease under my finger nails!
> Peter


Or use a 1725 RPM motor with a larger pulley. The goal is to get > 4000 RPM for good cutting action.

The import diamond wheels work very well. For the white wheels, take the advice given in Deckel and Alexander manuals, dress a relief in the wheel edge so you are not grinding with the full width, this greatly reduces the heat build up when splitting blanks or otherwise removing lots of material. I bought a Triumph flaring cup wheel and loving it for most of my grinding.


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## peter.van.haren (Feb 21, 2020)

ub27Rocks said:


> Or use a 1725 RPM motor with a larger pulley. The goal is to get > 4000 RPM for good cutting action.
> 
> The import diamond wheels work very well. For the white wheels, take the advice given in Deckel and Alexander manuals, dress a relief in the wheel edge so you are not grinding with the full width, this greatly reduces the heat build up when splitting blanks or otherwise removing lots of material. I bought a Triumph flaring cup wheel and loving it for most of my grinding.


well, I got another VFD (my existing Delta developed a short) and hooked it up.  It seems to work alright, however it seems that torque might be reduced.  Unfortunately I couldn't try the grinder before, so don't know if it's because of the VFD or not.
Also got some new bearings for the motor.  Lucky they are common 6200 (30x10x9) bearings, but haven't installed them yet.
Another thing I'm not sure of is the rpm's so will use an optical rotation meter (or what ever it's called) and see what kind of rpm's I'm getting. At least with the VFD I can adjust for that "rpm for good cutting actions".
Thanks a bunch!
PS  wondering what options I might have for a drill bit grinding accessory I might try.  The accessories I've found on ebay are EXPENSIVE.  Lot's to learn!


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## ub27Rocks (Feb 21, 2020)

I do four facet drill ends, no attachment except collets. And for that I have an ER16 collet chuck inside a 16mm collet.


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