# Precision Mathews PM1440E LB lathe



## maker of things (Oct 1, 2014)

I thought I would start a new post so future researchers would have an easier time finding this.

So I can show you a few tips of probably not how to unload your lathe.



I have a Kubota BX1870 that is a big help moving things around the yard/shop, but it can only handle 300# or so lifting by the front end loader.  I chained the skid and carefully and slowly slid it down the ramps.


This was the first pucker when it crossed the tipping point.  The skid was on blocks so the fork lift that put it on the trailer could get out.  


Pucker 2, one of the blocks caught funny and slid the skid off center where it would certainly fall off the ramps on the way down.


Since I was taking my time, I had time to think through how to fix it and grabbed the come-a-long and pulled the skid back onto the ramps.


When I had 1/3 of the ramp left to go I gave it the gas and got it onto the driveway in one motion.


The transition between off the ramp caused the top skid to crush the 2x4s on the bottom skid, all three of them, both ends.


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## zmotorsports (Oct 1, 2014)

Nice.  Subscribed.


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## mgalusha (Oct 1, 2014)

I know the feeling. I have it's cousin, a PM-1440BV, which is very similar with a VFD. Mine was on a skid that was on a pallet, getting it off was, shall we say, entertaining. Can't wait to see it up and running. Enjoy!


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## maker of things (Oct 1, 2014)

So the crate came pretty close to filling the opening of a standard garage door.  I borrowed a pallet jack to help move the skid around, that worked beautifully, even over the lunar landscape that is my shop floor.


1st peek inside the crate.


Uncrating was pretty interesting.  The crate was tight against a cabinet and the 12z.  I ended up crawling through the 12z's base (try that with a bridgeport) about a dozen times to get at different angles and for tools that were inevitably on the other side from me.


Got the crate off and finally got a good look at the whole thing.


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## maker of things (Oct 1, 2014)

Well I thought I had it all figured out.  I would place the skid as close to the final position as possible, pick the lathe up with my 2 ton shop crane, and pull the skid out. DOH!

Of course the boom of the crane, by design, does not stick out past the legs.  Well, I sawzall-ved that problem. Except I didn't.  I still couldn't get directly over the chuck and even with the tail stock off and the carriage close to the chuck, I couldn't balance the machine.

The next few steps I am not going to document as they were somewhat dicey and really really hard work.  I never put myself in danger, but the lathe felt like it might go over more than once.  After installing the leveling pads McMaster#2531K39 and getting the machine on the floor sliding it in to place was almost trivial.  I used one of those 5' long solid steel load moving "pry" bars that works really well.  I think tru-temper makes them still.

Oh, and I found out that the whole lathe and crate were only secured to the 2x4 skid with three metal bands, so that could have gone a lot worse.


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## maker of things (Oct 1, 2014)

So here are some of the detailed highlights.


It is equipped with a 3hp motor.


A pull out chip tray and cast iron base


The change gear setting for inch thread also does turning.  .0041 inch/rev through .0548 inch/rev and tpi of: 4,5,8,10,16,20,32 and 40 all with no gear changes.


Back side view of tail stock.  The quill lock is a little weird to me.  Both cams are shown in locked position.


The compound scale is on of those non "standard" reading.  Reads 60 ish degrees for traditional threading.


The compound has a tapered gib and feels very smooth plus nice and solid (to a guy with a jet 9x20).


Not really any accommodation for auxiliary mounting to the cross slide.  Didn't occur to me to check that before I ordered.  The carriage has the steady follow mounted when shipped.  the two threaded holes can be seen here.


The threading dial is the 1,2,3,4 type.  I will have to get used to that.


A close up of the ways.  The groove is hand painted.


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## maker of things (Oct 1, 2014)

Comes with a safety shield.  Mine felt like the mount was a little loose so I "temporarily" removed it and accidentally cut the wire leading to it (and butt spliced them together).  You know just until I decide what to do.


This is under the mount for the safety shield.  Looks hand crafted.  I put the base block back on to cover it up.  Maybe I will find something else to mount to it.




I ordered the micrometer carriage stop with my lathe.  The spring pin isn't quite seated deep enough to keep the knob in place and the area that sits on the vee of the bed has a lot of paint on it.  The set screws that are there to shim the bottom plate are directly in front of the hex bolts that hold it together which makes getting a wrench in there very tricky.  I'll probably do a bit of rework to this part.


A view under the hood.  There was a little vibration until I tightened up the belts a bit.


It comes with the cute little hip toolbox too.

Did I miss anything?


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## maker of things (Oct 1, 2014)

And now some results.


A piece of 3/4" 1018 crs that I had tried knurling on the 9x20.
Shown left to right:.030", .060, .090 and .125" depth of cut (ie per side).  The lathe barely changed pitch while running 190rpm .005"/rev feed.  That .125 didn't leave a nice finish, but the chip curling off was impressive (to me).  I just eyeballed the tool height and this was my first cut with this toolbit so I think I will be able to take a bigger bite by far.


Another view of the bit.


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## GA Gyro (Oct 1, 2014)

GREAT pictures.... almost like being there watching...
However I would not have fit through the stand of the mill... 

How much does it weigh... wondering how close to capacity your engine hoist was loaded?  
I have read and viewed the pics of many a 'receive/un-crate/set/clean/chips' thread... still thinking carefully about how I will unload and set them up when they arrive.

THX again for the detailed thread!

GA


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## maker of things (Oct 1, 2014)

GA said:


> GREAT pictures.... almost like being there watching...
> However I would not have fit through the stand of the mill...
> 
> How much does it weigh... wondering how close to capacity your engine hoist was loaded?
> ...


The crate was labeled 1487# iirc.  Matt told me it was 1700#.  The boom position on the crane is labeled for 1/2 ton capacity.  Don't really have a good way to know for sure.
 I still can't think of a good way to unload and move without a hi-lo.


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## Chip (Oct 1, 2014)

Very good write up Sir!


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## MarioM (Oct 1, 2014)

Big lathe!!......far to big for me but beautiful.  Congratulation. Nice job on handling it.


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## Hardly (Oct 1, 2014)

Nice lathe and thanks for taking the time to document all the action.


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## zmotorsports (Oct 2, 2014)

Nice job on the setup.  Looks great.  Personally, I like the numbering on your thread dial a bit better than mine but yours is what I am more used to is all.


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## george wilson (Oct 2, 2014)

I note with satisfaction that the lathe will cut 19 threads per inch,which is unusual,and hard to find. A friend of mine is always working on large frame Remington Rolling Block rifles. They have 19 TPI screws in them.


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## maker of things (Oct 6, 2014)

Quick update.  When I was setting up the lathe I noticed that the spindle ran opposite direction from expected.  i.e when the spindle lever is shifted down the spindle ran in reverse.  Within 15 minutes from emailing Matt he had me the answer.  I had to switch 2 wires in the control panel.  Marked yellow in the pic.  My wires are labeled 7 and 9.  Pretty easy.





I checked the runout of the included 3 jaw chuck today too.  I ordered a precision ground hardened shaft from mcmaster #6061K446 for setup.  I read .003 variation on the chucked up bar.  The outside of the chuck between the jaws and the pinion measured <.001"


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## chuckorlando (Oct 6, 2014)

Very nice bro


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## jeff_g1137 (Oct 6, 2014)

Hi
Very nice :thumbsup2:

I am thinking my lathe is to small 10x24, 

This site is going to cost me big. :help: LOL


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## Ray C (Oct 6, 2014)

jeff_g1137 said:


> Hi
> Very nice :thumbsup2:
> 
> I am thinking my lathe is to small 10x24,
> ...



Hate to tell you this but, Matt's given me dibbs on an overstock of 1440 ELBs -with DRO installed no less...


Ray


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## coolidge (Oct 6, 2014)

Here's a low cost upgrade. At someone's suggestion I tried a couple link belts vs Made in USA Napa belts. You can get the link belts at Harbor Freight, they are manufactured in the European Union. I found the link belts were worth the investment.

Vibration with 2 made in USA Napa belts 

[video=youtube;vfoeUNkfVFA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vfoeUNkfVFA[/video]

Vibration with 2 link belts installed

[video=youtube;zBCN1uwQiKU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBCN1uwQiKU[/video]

The two link belts in action

[video=youtube;rcdhb2DKIh4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rcdhb2DKIh4[/video]


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## jeff_g1137 (Oct 7, 2014)

Ray C said:


> Hate to tell you this but, Matt's given me dibbs on an overstock of 1440 ELBs -with DRO installed no less...
> 
> 
> Ray



Hi 
No problem i live in the UK, but the 14x40 is looking good, it is on my list
after a Mill. LOL


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## maker of things (Oct 7, 2014)

A few more items for the record:



The cross slide reads reduction of the diameter.



And the compound reads radius (depth of cut).





The threading dial chart is not on the lathe.  This is from the owners manual.  According to Matt, the hashes between 1234 are 5678  so 15263748.  and where the manual state 1.3 is 1 or 3.

An idiosyncrasy I noticed is the carriage feed direction lever label. 


In this picture the lever is set to feed the carriage towards the spindle, which makes sense, but the label doesn't really make any sort of sense to me.  In the manual the picture of the label shows the direction arrows the opposite way, which makes more sense to me.



For comparison, the top tool holder came with the lathe, and the bottom one I ordered from Shars.  Other than the lettering they match.  I ordered a box of set screws to replace all the tool holders from mcmaster #91390A147.


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## richl (Oct 7, 2014)

Nice write up on your lathe purchase. I have the pm 1440elb on my list of possible lathe choices. My main concern with lathes in this weight class is the stability and the width of the bed. I am presently using an enco 1340 lathe (it is an 11 year old machine and i aquired it from a medical research facillity) and it was quite a challenge setting the machine up for vibration free operation. Love to hear more about the operation of your machine if it is possible.
She sure looks great! Now get her all dirty 

Rich


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## Jamespvill (Oct 10, 2014)

What the HECK?! Mine didn't come with a badass little toolbox...I'm gonna have to talk to Ray about that!

Congratulations on the fancy new toy...I believe you are going to enjoy it, I sure do like mine! As for the backwards wiring of the power lever and the backwards-ness of the carriage direction, mine were also shipped like that. My cross feed dial was also the wrong one, I'm sure you would have noticed that by now, but just in case!

Glad she landed safely in your shop, good luck on making chips!

I miss my machine being that clean...


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## maker of things (Oct 12, 2014)

To me the tail stock seemed to slide when locked way too easily, so I investigated.  The clamp block under the ways was not clamping flat with only the diagonally opposite corners touching.  


Looks like a ADD beaver go ahold of the part.



I clamped the block inverted with the misalignment split between both sides and made just enough of a pass to give a reference surface.



I then flipped the block over and set the fresh ref surfaces on parallels.  Again taking just enough of a cut to get through the mess.  That seemed to have helped a bunch.



The bottom of the tail stock is another matter, it is scraped true.


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## maker of things (Oct 12, 2014)

The only other "issue" I ran into is vibration from the motor.  Well, that is not exactly accurate.  The problem is really that there is a very tight window of belt tension that the machine likes.  I chased my tail a bunch trying to add dampening between the motor and machine only to come to the conclusion that is was all hinging on the belt tension, and that was a real bugger.  Supporting that heavy motor while trying to reach the bolts to adjust the tension only to have the bracket not move when I wanted it to, and then overshoot an instant later.


I determined the paint was the culprit, so I pulled the motor and bracket and used a sanding disc on a cordless drill to remove the paint from the machined surface where the bracket mounts.



Did the same for the mating machined surface of the bracket, and broke the razor sharp corners at the edges of the bracket.
I wiped a very thin coat of grease on both with my finger before reassembling.

I also changed to Dayco AX34 gold label synthetic made in usa belts that I got from AutoZone for $6.99ea.  The AX belts are the only style rated for the 2.2" approx pitch dia of the pulley on the motor.  They are rated to 1.58 hp each.   I took a stiff wire brush on an angle grinder to both pulleys to take the paint off the surface the belts ride on as well.  So far she's running smooth.


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## JohnsonFabrication (Oct 12, 2014)

I am soo jealous, i been wanting one of these lathes since the first time i saw it on QMT website. Keep up the good pics and posts!


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## maker of things (Oct 13, 2014)

I didn't really get into the DRO yet did I?  Well let me tell you, this is a big deal.  No, you all already understand why a DRO is handy, I mean the fact that it was delivered installed and set up.  I have supervised similar installations on a mill and lathe.  I don't think most of us could do this install in less than an entire Saturday.   The Easson DRO looks decent and has good documentation.  I could barely fit my point and shoot camera behind the bed to get a pic of the mounting, glad I didn't have to try to reach in there!


Cross slide viewed from the tail stock end. X on the DRO.


Long axis (Y on the DRO Z to CNC guys) viewed from the headstock end.


Bottom of the Y scale.


DRO head unit with wire routing.  The base was bolted to the top of the lathe, I just had to thread the head on and plug in the wires.


Wire routing under behind the machine.  Wires were laying in the chip pan when I received it, but I like them hanging behind better.  The pan does not quite pinch them.


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## george wilson (Oct 13, 2014)

One thing I have done to a couple of Taiwan lathes,is get rid of those cheap looking sheet metal cursers for the dials. I made up new ones with long,tapered,hollow ground(sort of) very thin needle tips,rather than those fat inked marks. It's easier to split thousandths with a nice,fine tipped needle to look at,which is no thicker on the ends than the width of the markings on the dials. Make them nice and close to the surfaces of the dials to eliminate parallax,and to not get anything caught on them. I have never caught anything(like clothing or a rag,on mine,yet,they do not actually touch the dials and scratch them.

Another thing I do is get rid of the too hard to move springs under the dials. I drill and tap a hole in each dial,and make a knurled knob. When the knob is loosened,the dials rotate effortlessly to reset to zero,etc,without nudging the crossfeed or compound feed screws.


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## tmarks11 (Oct 13, 2014)

maker of things said:


> I don't think most of us could do this install in less than an entire Saturday..... I could barely fit my point and shoot camera behind the bed to get a pic of the mounting, glad I didn't have to try to reach in there!


4 or 5 bolts, and the sheet metal backsplash comes off, giving you all the access you want or need...

....assuming you didn't back the lathe up against a wall.



george wilson said:


> Another thing I do is get rid of the too hard to move springs under the dials. I drill and tap a hole in each dial,and make a knurled knob. When the knob is loosened,the dials rotate effortlessly to reset to zero,etc,without nudging the crossfeed or compound feed screws.



Nice tip.  I sweat every time I go to zero the cross slide, using both hands to try from bumping it out of adjustment.  Guess I have some drilling to do...


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## mgalusha (Oct 13, 2014)

george wilson said:


> Another thing I do is get rid of the too hard to move springs under the dials. I drill and tap a hole in each dial,and make a knurled knob. When the knob is loosened,the dials rotate effortlessly to reset to zero,etc,without nudging the crossfeed or compound feed screws.



This is on my todo list already, appreciate the reminder, that will help get me moving. 



Sent from my SM-P600 using Tapatalk


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## george wilson (Oct 13, 2014)

I ought to post pictures when I get some made. Nothing special about the knurled knob though. Just about a 10/24 threaded shank with a flat top knob 1/8" thick,knurled before cutting off. 1/2" in diameter. Be careful WHERE on the dial you put yours. I like to see the "0" near my knob,so I can easily set it. Basically similar to older lathes that already had them. Today,they think it is more "streamlined" or something,to stick those hard to move leaf springs under the dials. They are always WAY too frictioney to move easily.


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## zmotorsports (Oct 14, 2014)

george wilson said:


> One thing I have done to a couple of Taiwan lathes,is get rid of those cheap looking sheet metal cursers for the dials. I made up new ones with long,tapered,hollow ground(sort of) very thin needle tips,rather than those fat inked marks. It's easier to split thousandths with a nice,fine tipped needle to look at,which is no thicker on the ends than the width of the markings on the dials. Make them nice and close to the surfaces of the dials to eliminate parallax,and to not get anything caught on them. I have never caught anything(like clothing or a rag,on mine,yet,they do not actually touch the dials and scratch them.
> 
> Another thing I do is get rid of the too hard to move springs under the dials. I drill and tap a hole in each dial,and make a knurled knob. When the knob is loosened,the dials rotate effortlessly to reset to zero,etc,without nudging the crossfeed or compound feed screws.



Great tip George.  I thought about that because I like the knurled locking screws on the Hardinge lathes.  I wasn't quite sure how to go about it but never had time to tear one of my handles/dials apart.  Looks like I will have to make time now.  Do you have any pictures of said knurled lock screws?

Thanks.


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## chuckorlando (Oct 14, 2014)

I done the same thing to my 9x20 dials. They did not have a spring that was hard but rather an alan head in the front. I drilled them through the 0 and tapped them. No room elsewhere. It makes it so much easier to set or reset. Awesome tip man


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## zmotorsports (Oct 14, 2014)

george wilson said:


> I ought to post pictures when I get some made. Nothing special about the knurled knob though. Just about a 10/24 threaded shank with a flat top knob 1/8" thick,knurled before cutting off. 1/2" in diameter. Be careful WHERE on the dial you put yours. I like to see the "0" near my knob,so I can easily set it. Basically similar to older lathes that already had them. Today,they think it is more "streamlined" or something,to stick those hard to move leaf springs under the dials. They are always WAY too frictioney to move easily.



George, do you put the lock screws in the face of the dial or the outside diameter?  I have seen them in both, just curious.

Thanks.


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## Rbeckett (Oct 14, 2014)

I am soooo jealous.  I want one, but unless Matt gave em away for free, I would be out.  Oh well I still have a 7X10 and 9X19 so I don't really have a lot to complain about anyway...

Bob


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## maker of things (Oct 14, 2014)

Caution:  Some people may find the following pics too revealing.




A shot behind the apron



Bottom of the bed from tailstock end.


No sand.


Under the bed and apron from headstock.


Up through the bed with the carriage centered over the opening.


A view of the tailstock through the bore.  Red fuzzies are from me swabbing with a cheap shop rag.


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## JimDawson (Oct 14, 2014)

Machine porn, I love it.:roflmao:


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## richl (Oct 14, 2014)

What a daunting task it must seem to keep her that clean from this point forward :nervous: 
(Said with a vbg)
Rich


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## maker of things (Oct 15, 2014)

richl said:


> What a daunting task it must seem to keep her that clean from this point forward
> (Said with a vbg)
> Rich



Yes, especially given the high standard set by Darkzero!  But I'm going to try, but not with cheap red shop rags anymore.


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## zmotorsports (Oct 15, 2014)

george wilson said:


> I ought to post pictures when I get some made. Nothing special about the knurled knob though. Just about a 10/24 threaded shank with a flat top knob 1/8" thick,knurled before cutting off. 1/2" in diameter. Be careful WHERE on the dial you put yours. I like to see the "0" near my knob,so I can easily set it. Basically similar to older lathes that already had them. Today,they think it is more "streamlined" or something,to stick those hard to move leaf springs under the dials. They are always WAY too frictioney to move easily.



A HUGE thank you to George Wilson on this tip.  I did the mod last night.  I have always liked the dials on the Hardinge lathe and wanted to duplicate it but didn't put as much thought into it until yesterday reading George's post.  In my head I thought about whether to put the thumbscrew on the face or the perimeter of the dial.  Well after looking more closely at my lathe the perimeter was the only place.  The Hardinge has a ball crank style of handle which is what allows the room/area to put the thumbscrew on the face of the dial to lock it down.  I really didn't want to change from the wheel style handles to the ballcrank just for this so the perimeter it was.

Thanks again to George for the idea and to light the fire under my a$$ to do it.


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## trukker (Oct 19, 2014)

Would love to see a quick picture or pictures of how ya'll did this mod!  
Maker of T - I have a Griz 0709 which looks very similar to your PM1440E LB.  I know there are differences but, I have been very happy with mine so far.  I did the change to the link type belts on mine after I started to get some vibration.  Seems I struggled to get them tight enough as I get a good squeak when I kick it on.  At least the vibration is gone.  You will need 2 of the Harbor Freight belts.  
Have Fun!


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## maker of things (Nov 1, 2014)

Did the first oil change now.  As recommended by RayC I took the cover off the head and pumped the oil out.  I got this pump at my local auto parts store along with 1 gallon of hydraulic oil ISO-32 with anti wear additives.  I think they carry it for floor jacks.




I was a little surprised at first to discover that the cover is just a thick piece of plastic.  I guess it won't rust ever. The only metal shavings I found inside were made when the factory installed the chuck interference cover.



The pump worked well to drain the tank with little mess till near the bottom.



A few more shots of the gear box




After pumping the oil till sucking air, I opened the drain and per DarkZero suggestion used a form-a-funnel to catch some of the remaining oil (not the most coordinated whenever draining oil is occurring). 


Headstock drains.  The lower gearbox drain went about the same as the end of the main gearbox.  Someday I will have epoxy floors so it will be easier to clean up.


Lower gear box fill.


Apron drain (underneath).  With the chip pan pulled this is almost a straight shot to the catch container.  Just dribbles on the front stand rail a bit.


Apron fill. 

Do the lower gear box and apron first.  The hose that comes with the pump fits both of the fill holes perfectly so the inside of the hose will be clean.  Once you pump the main gearbox out, there will be some metal shavings that stick to the inside of the hose.  I was able to fill all three reservoirs with less than one gallon of oil. 

FYI the sight glass on my main gearbox was leaking and I backed it off about 3/4 of a turn and now it does not leak anymore.


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## maker of things (Nov 1, 2014)

Did a little upgrade this week as well.  Matt gave me really good pricing on a Bison chuck.  Really the only reason I wanted a new chuck was for the 2 piece jaws.  I can't figure out all the Bison model-catalog-style number stuff, it seems like they are mid-stream switching numbering systems.  This is a plain back 8" 3 jaw steel scroll chuck with matching D1-5 back plate.  Not the adjustable kind.


Freshly mounted (sorry about the mess).  Mounted a couple times and verified less than .002" (about halfway between the .001 and .002 mark) TIR 1" from chuck. 





Original vs new.


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## mgalusha (Nov 1, 2014)

Very nice, no doubt a worthwhile upgrade.

Sent from my SM-P600 using Tapatalk


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## coolidge (Nov 2, 2014)

That chuck looks nice!


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## maker of things (Nov 2, 2014)

BTW.  If you ever get a new chuck, no matter how well you clean it, don't stand directly in line with it when you turn the lathe on.  Or if you do be prepared to wipe some oil off your face.  Guess how I know.

I was having a slight chirp when starting the lathe in high gear so I had to tension the belts more.  I pulled out this high precision tensioning device.




Now she runs smooth and no chirps.


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## maker of things (Nov 6, 2014)

I overlooked the coolant system as I don't have an immediate desire to use it.  The sump is located in the tailstock cabinet.


Drain in the removable chip tray tail stock end.



Drain visible in the back lines up over this trough when slid in normal position.  


Trough directs the coolant down to the sump.


Overview through access panel on the side furthest from the headstock.


Pump name plate.


Impeller (inside sump)


Flexible metallic hose mounted to the back of the carriage


End nozzle to adjust flow is plated plastic.


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## tmarks11 (Nov 8, 2014)

maker of things said:


> I was having a slight chirp when starting the lathe in high gear so I had to tension the belts more.  I pulled out this high precision tensioning device.



Good idea.  I generally just stick a chunk of wood in there to get leverage.  Wish they would make mounting plates with screw adjusters for tensioning.  It is difficult to keep the motor pulley and the spindle pulley parallel when tightening, and not doing so adds vibration and belt wear.


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## maker of things (Nov 17, 2014)

OK, I think I have cataloged almost everything now.   Here is the light:


Base mount and ratings.



The elbow with tension adjustment.



Top adjuster and reflector.  On/off switch is on the black handle.



Throws a good amount of light on the cut area.
I actually like this light a lot compared to any other adjustable arm type I have used.  It is easy to adjust and doesn't drift.
It is powered with the machine main switch.  I may change that at some point so the light can be on to setup the lathe chuck while the main power is off,  but for now I just hit the e stop.

I also did a RPM test.  I used a $14 portable optical tach that has NOT been calibrated to anything, so this is for reference only.


Put the reflective tape on the spindle nut and ran through all the speeds with these results:
Indicated   Read
   70           84.6
  115         138.5
  190         229
  300         362.2
  460         408
  760         665
  1225       1095
  2000       1720


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