# 'Very' heavy 10



## davej (Apr 9, 2011)

Hi,

Today I have collected the heavy 10 that I unexpectedly won with a speculative bid on e-bay after (placed after to much beer). I must say it is a very aptly named machine, especially when you need to take it out of a small cellar up a narrow stair. With a 4'6" bed it is probably rather to big to fit in my garage without a major re-design, or evicting my wifes' car (a definite non starter) but it did seem like a good idea at the time.

I can't say I have examined anything too closely yet, as there is a fair amount of degreasing/cleaning to do (at least there is not to much rust) but I am sure the tailstock is a lash up from a different type of lathe, and I am not convinced that the the tailstock end foot is original as it seems a bit lightweight compared to the rest of the castings and the way it attached to the chip pan and lathe bed seems a bit shoddy. I suppose it is not overly important as long as the foot is the right length to set the lathe level; there was no way of telling in the cellar as the floor was very uneven and seemed to slope. Other potential problems include the gear train- where someone seems to have made some 'compound' gears by 'welding' (best guano standard) some of the wheels to short bushings, additionally the gear case cover and the bull gear cover are missing but I guess that is not surprising or particularly unusual.  The good bits are that there does not seem to be an obvious wear ridge on the bed where the saddle stops and just about everything turns freely with no noticeable play in any of the bearings, there was even oil in most of the oilers. The back gear eccentric is the exception and is reluctant to move but I have not tried that hard yet, just applied some penetrating oil. The saddle/apron seems to be ok, split nuts engage etc and the clutch moves and the single tumbler QC box all moves OK, everything it's just grubby. 

I already owe a number of you my thanks for the many useful posts, without which I would have had no idea how to get the thing apart, but I am looking for some more advice. While trying to get the under-drive apart I could not get the cradle shaft out (no doubt adding significantly to the weight of the understand). The parts list in the downloads area indicates that there is a locking collar and grub screw securing the shaft (form 917-C parts 15&amp;16) but I could not see one and I did not want to break anything by excessive application of tool no 1. It may be the the lathe pre dates the parts list, if so does anyone know how the shaft is secured, is there a taper pin or grub screw in the cradle or do I just need to heat up the cradle where the shaft passes through (probably not to much there seem to be some alloy bushings in the understand at either end of the shaft) and beat it out? If it helps the bed-way no is 96736 and a tally plate on the under-drive door claims that the lathe was supplied in 1941 (I have no idea if this is consistent with the bed way serial no), the under-drive housing has 1153B stamped on the top.  Any and all advice gratefully received.

Thanks


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## davej (Apr 10, 2011)

Hello all,
I am not sure if this is the right way to do this, or if I should have started a new post. However, I have taken a few photos of the V-heavy 10 and I am hoping some of you will be able to shed some light on the history of this lathe. I am staring to think that it has a mixed ancestry having now read around the subject a little more.

As mentioned in the original post, my immediate headache is removing the under-drive cradle shaft, the attached (I hope) photos may help explain the problem. 
This the part no stamped in the top of the housing.
The cradle shaft viewed from the RHS as you face the lathe.
Same thing from the front
And the top

I can't see a locking collar and grub screw as detained in the parts list or for that matter any other form of mechanical fastening. I am a little nervous about just trying to drive the shaft out using brute force as the bearing bushes seem to be made of something resembling carburetor alloy and As you can see from the first photo I have already proven that it is brittle!

This is the bush at the LHS of the under-drive housing.

Has any one had similar problems getting this shaft out? I was contemplating cleaning the visible shaft with some emery and heating the cradle castings in way of the shaft to try to free things up a bit, but I really don't want to get anything too hot until I have some idea what sort of heat the shaft bearings will stand. Any help or advice will be much appreciated.

Some other bits, This is the tally plate on the door unfortunately I have not managed to get a useable picture of the bed serial no, but it is 96736 and also has J.F.P and D.W.W stamped in the same area.

Here is a shot of the gear banjo showing the welded compound gears. The parts list seems to suggest that the banjo has come from a later lathe with a twin tumbler gearbox, it as the single tumbler version. I haven't counted the teeth on the wheels so i have no idea why this was done.

The headstock
I could not get the chuck off when I dismantled the lathe so I just removed the chuck from the mounting plate to reduce the weight. Having looked at it in a bit more detail I am not sure that it is not a camlock type spindle which I assume is much more recent than the rest of lathe. There are 3 equi-spaced square drive holes behind the faceplate which appear to be 5/16" square, but with the lathe sitting in the lounge of my digs at work, rather than at home, I don't have anything to hand that will turn them. Strangely, if is is a much later spindle it only seems to have a ~0.9" hole rather than the ~1.3" one I have seen quoted for the later machines. Has anyone seen anything like this previously? 

Kind regards 

Dave

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## oscer (Apr 12, 2011)

I can't help with the counter shaft, I've never had mine apart but the serial # and date sounds right mine is a 1943 serial # 135*** it has the 1.375 spindle bore.


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## davej (Apr 12, 2011)

Thanks for the replies

Well I managed to get the cradle spindle out. Liberal application of penetrating oil and 'working' the cradle up and down produced relative movement between the spindle and the cradle so, assuming that there was no fastening I managed to move the spindle with a drift and some percussion maintenance. For anyone else trying to strip an early underdrive there IS actually a grub screw in bottom of the Right hand bush of the housing. I only noticed once I had moved the spindle about 2 inches and found that there was a locating hole in it, it still took me about 10 minutes to find the grub screw even then. It is a standard grub screw which was absolutely flush with the bearing housing and covered with half a century's worth of muck, it is also reluctant to come out (more penetrating oil). Even if I do get it out intact it will be replaced with a socket headed bolt that I can see.  

I have also taken the faceplate off the head spindle and it is definitely a camlock spindle of unknown vintage. Does any one know when south bend started making them?

Shifting targets a bit, the tailstock is a real lash up so I need to find something that actually fits the lathe. Does anyone know if the south bend bed way is compatible with some of the other 10" American lathes, Atlas, Seneca falls or Logan? If so it would allow me a few more options to find something that fits, a south bend one would be ideal but beggars can't necessarily be choosers.

Regards

Dave


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