# Rotary Table for PM935 Mill?



## Alan H. (Oct 20, 2017)

I am evaluating rotary tables for my PM935TV knee mill.  

I already have a Precision Matthews' BS1 Dividing Head w/6" chuck but would like a rotary table to round my kit out.

EDIT: I assume that an 8" model makes sense for the 935. 

I am interested in feedback and recommendations.


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## richl (Oct 20, 2017)

This is a phase2 on a 9x42 table



It weighs in at over 100 pounds, I put an 8" chuck on it and it brings the weight up another 80 lbs.

Ymmv


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## Alan H. (Oct 20, 2017)

richl said:


> This is a phase2 on a 9x42 table
> View attachment 244715
> 
> 
> ...


Rich, what size is that one?


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## richl (Oct 20, 2017)

Sorry, I forgot to mention, that's a 8".


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## dlane (Oct 20, 2017)

8" Vertex on 9x42 , pin is to center rt to spindle and center chuck on table,


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## Alan H. (Oct 20, 2017)

Thanks Derrick,
That's a nice looking top plate on that Vertex.   Where did you land that?


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## Alan H. (Oct 20, 2017)

richl said:


> This is a phase2 on a 9x42 table
> View attachment 244715
> 
> 
> ...


That's the problem with all this stuff - weighs too much!   The Phase II must weigh more than the Vertex.


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## richl (Oct 20, 2017)

I used to keep the rt and þhe vice on the table all the time, George Wilson cautioned me against it saying it can cause wear to the ways... so now I move the vice and rt around more, it's great for building muscles


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## richl (Oct 20, 2017)

I misspoke 70lbs, I just looked it up it sure feels like over 100 pounds lol


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## dlane (Oct 20, 2017)

Alan the top plate is aluminum 1.250 mic6 I got a 3'x3' tooling plate from a shop that was closing


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## darkzero (Oct 21, 2017)

A nice Yuasa would be my first choice if you can find a nice one. I couldn't at the time & couldn't wait much longer for the right one to pop up. I went with an 8" Vertex from Matt & couldn't be happier. My table is 9x39" so yeah I would definitely say go with an 8" unless you don't don't mind using a 6" on the outer table slots.

The 8" has so much more room. I have a 6.3" chuck for mine. In fact I would've like to have even more room  but a 10" RT is not something I would want to try moving around myself, they're heavy. My 8" is manageble but without the chuck on it. So with that said 8" is the perfect size for me.








I was going to say, I think you need a Super Spacer too but I see that you have a dividing head already. Just trying to help you spend more money whenever possible.


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## mksj (Oct 21, 2017)

I think Will has Sixitis, looks like almost all his chucks have six jaws. I would suggest looking at a Super Dex  Rotary table, there are various names. This is a combination of vernier handle, and indexing masking plates. This is not a Super Spacer, which just does indexing. I would recommend the 6" model 225-226 which comes with a Set-Tru 6" chuck, but also comes with an 8" slotted rotary table.  I have an old 8" 4J independent that I mounted on the table T slots, allows me to mount odd shaped stock or hold very large stock. The 6" model is 110lb with chuck mountted, the 8" is 185lb, another reason to go with the 6". I dead lift mine from the floor, it weighs almost as much as I do, but need to put it on a rolling cart so it is a lateral transfer onto my mill. Even the 6" is a bear to move and I have mine mounted to a 1/2" aluminum plate with various mounting holes. I would get a Phase II,  Yuasa or maybe a Vertex, it is worth paying a bit more for a bit more quality.  There are some eBay sellers, just make sure that the chuck has a Set-Tru feature.
http://www.phase2plus.com/details.asp?pr=SUPER_DEX&id=60 
https://www.ebay.com/itm/6-Deluxe-Super-Rotary-Index-F36-/171998098919


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## darkzero (Oct 21, 2017)

mksj said:


> I think Will has Sixitis, looks like almost all his chucks have six jaws. I would suggest looking at a Super Dex  Rotary table, there are various names. This is a combination of vernier handle, and indexing masking plates. This is not a Super Spacer, which just does indexing. I would recommend the 6" model 225-226 which comes with a Set-Tru 6" chuck, but also comes with an 8" slotted rotary table.  I have an old 8" 4J independent that I mounted on the table T slots, allows me to mount odd shaped stock or hold very large stock. The 6" model is 110lb with chuck mountted, the 8" is 185lb, another reason to go with the 6". I dead lift mine from the floor, it weighs almost as much as I do, but need to put it on a rolling cart so it is a lateral transfer onto my mill. Even the 6" is a bear to move and I have mine mounted to a 1/2" aluminum plate with various mounting holes. I would get a Phase II,  Yuasa or maybe a Vertex, it is worth paying a bit more for a bit more quality.  There are some eBay sellers, just make sure that the chuck has a Set-Tru feature.
> http://www.phase2plus.com/details.asp?pr=SUPER_DEX&id=60
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/6-Deluxe-Super-Rotary-Index-F36-/171998098919
> 
> View attachment 244834



Perhaps. I have a few 3 jaw chucks, I tend to use the 6-jaw & 4-jaw indy the most. I certainly didn't need a 6-jaw for the RT like i did for my lathe. It was a cheap import & with 6-jaws it's much easier to chuck up short parts straight which is why I went with it.

I considered buying a super indexer (Super Dex is what Phase II call is) to save space. As said it's a super spacer & rotary table but in one unit. Depends on your needs I guess. Super spacers aren't as common as a dividing head. I don't need the ability to have that many divisions, a super spacer was much more useful to me as it's so much quicker to use than a dividing head. Larger through hole & adjustable (TIR) chuck. There was a time for over a year where I used the super spacer more than my vise.

So I don't need to use a rotary table that often. For me having a super indexer was not ideal as the rotary table function wouldn't get used much. Having to lug over 100lbs onto the table was not something I wanted to do. My 6" super space weighs like 80lbs & sometimes I dread lugging that thing around. BTW, these 6" models actually have 6.5" chucks on them.

I also prefer to use indexing devices on the left side of my table when in the vertical position. Doing so with a super indexer places the RT handwheel on the backside of the table. I also don't have an adjustable ram on my mill, a super indexer is pretty beefy & can possibly interfere with my column. So in the end I opted to go with a super spacer & a seperate RT. I can lift these things now no problem but when I get old that might not be so easy. Things to consider for anyone looking at buying a super indexer. They look & function great, just not practical for me.


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## Alan H. (Oct 22, 2017)

Thanks Mark and Will for the insights.    

Weight is an issue that I have learned to look out for.  While I can handle 100 pounds, when it comes to shuffling all this stuff around the reality sets in.  Hope to build a dedicated cart to augment the handling of this heavy stuff! 

Gents, what are your views of the Taiwanese made Vertex in terms of quality?  How does it stack up against Phase II for example?


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## mksj (Oct 22, 2017)

I primarily use the rotary handle/vernier  scale on my rotary table and rarely use the indexer plates, but they do come in handy. On smaller stock I use the collet blocks for hex and square indexing. On a few occasions when scribing dial indexes (dial rings), I build a index table in excel as to degree/minutes/seconds, and use the rotary table handle.  I also use the rotary table on the mill for circular grooving on flat stock, flats and grooving on larger stock and a few other projects when I did not have a lathe. Thought of a dividing head, but I make due with what I have for the work I do and the frequency I use it.

Can't really compare Phase II vs. Vertex, as to which would be better. They both known for good quality and I have had no issues with their other products that I purchased from them. There is a tear down of the Vertex rotary table and overall it is well built and good attention to detail.  I have a generic Chinese version of the Super Dex which I purchased years ago, works OK, but the machining is a bit rough and I do not believe the tolerances are as good as the Vertex or Phase II rotary tables. The Yuasa are nice, but for the price and the amount of use, not really worth it. If I were going to buy one today, I would probably go with the Vertex.  I believe the Phase II RTs are made in China, hard to tell origin and quality these days on anything.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/NIB-PHASE-II-221-308-8-Horizontal-Vertical-ROTARY-TABLE-/232440288120
https://www.ebay.com/itm/VERTEX-HV-...L-ARTB-008-JUST-ONE-LEFT-IN-BOX-/322794755733

The Super Dex and Super Spacer are heavy, but part of that is the additional weight of the chuck. The alternative to consider is getting a good horizontal/vertical 8" rotary table and mount a 4J independent chuck to the rotary plate. A bit more time consuming to dial in the stock to center, but if you use it infrequently, it should not be an issue and a less expensive.


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## Alan H. (Nov 6, 2017)

Okay, landed on an 8" Vertex.  Matt @qualitymachinetools has one coming to me in the near future.

Mark @mksj , thanks for Stefan's video.  Looks like the quality will certainly meet my requirements. 

I am looking forward to seeing how I can adapt a chuck to it.    Kinda have my hopes up that Will @darkzero can loan me a 6 jaw for my efforts?    We all know he has multiples and very likely a spare or two. 

Thanks to all the help and thanks to Matt for being a dealer for these.


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