# I have a problem...



## 682bear (Aug 30, 2022)

I've known for a couple of months now that I have a yellow jacket nest under my front porch...

I'm not interested in crawling under there to find them... I've taken the 'live and let live' approach. As long as they aren't bothering me, I won't bother them.

This morning I was in the basement machining a part for my Hendey project... and the yellow jackets started swarming... inside... around my machines... there was several dozen of them. Apparently, they have found a way inside...

My machines are just inside the wall behind (and below) the front porch. The basement wall is 12 inch block about 9 feet high, about 6 to 7 feet of that is below ground level.

Either they have found a gap between the blocks they can come through, or there is some way they can get between the top of the wall and the sill... IDK...

I really don't want to have to abandon my machines until cold weather...

Any ideas?

-Bear


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## pontiac428 (Aug 30, 2022)

Kill them!  Kill them with fire!

Or try wasp spray if you're a wuss.  Button up your collar and sleeves going in.


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## Just for fun (Aug 30, 2022)

Boy, that sucks. 

A mirror on a stick and a PVC angled connection for the garden hose and blast them out of there.

Or hang some yellow jacket traps.

Or hire an exterminator.


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## Boswell (Aug 30, 2022)

"Call a Guy"


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## mickri (Aug 30, 2022)

You need to get rid of them asap.  They are nasty creatures.  I would try the spray first.  If that doesn't work then call in the heavy guns.  A pest control company to take them out.


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## mksj (Aug 30, 2022)

Eventually they will swarm and go after you, I had a nest under a wood pile and one evening when getting some wood for my stove they decided to go on the attack. Everything was buzzing and I was stung all over my body and they followed me into the house. I tried spraying, but the nest was very deep so the first extermination round was unsuccessful. Eventually I put on layers of clothes, face mask and taped all the gaps, then dug up the nest, it was huge maybe 2' wide by about 3' deep. You also need to think of the safety of others and animals. So one way or another I would get rid of the nest. When I lived in Tucson we had the Africanized honey bees (killer bees), and every year a few people/animals died from their attacks.


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## IR-JEB (Aug 30, 2022)

My son had a very large nest of Yellow Jackets last year that had gotten into his foundation landscaping.

We tried numerous methods to eradicate them and finally ended up using a pyrethrum-based spray followed by a good dusting with Tempo Dust. The source we found and used is from https://diypestcontrol.com/yellowjackets.htm.

I have no connection with this site but know it did solve the issue and he has not had any issues with Yellow Jackets this summer. If desired look at the process and see if it may work for you. FYI, this is a relatively expensive venture. I believe my son got the products via Amazon as we could not find them locally.

Good luck as noted in the article the activity is minimal at night. We planned our attack a few hours after sunset.


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## Jake M (Aug 30, 2022)

What's the access like under the porch?  Those 20 foot plus spray foamer wasp and hornet killers are quite effective.  Specracide has a reasonably priced two pack, I'm a big fan of that one.  Not that it's the "best killer", not that anything's magic, but useability, aimability, effectiveness, overall it's just a bad day to be a hornet.

The biggest trick is to get in there long before the sun comes up, when they're all "at home".  Just hose the crap out of 'em, because an hour before sunup...  Nobody's sneaking up behind you.  Most die in the nest, just stay on it....  The ones that come out won't make it to you.

There's also some of the "bug bomb" type foggers that are effective on wasps and hornets.  I just recently discovered that.  Stingy things kinda get shuffled to me at work, (Prolly because I'm there way earlier than anybody else...) I really wonder if I could get away with taping a bug bomb to a broom stick and shoving them where I can not get to, under some of the sanders and other winter equipment that sits idle out back all summer.  Same thing, bright and early, let it spray right around the nest for long enough that "everybody" wakes up...  You would use the containment you get by using them inside of a house, where they're kinda made for, but if you knew where you were headed....  Never did it, but I'm sure I will soon enough, legend has it that the old loader is full of bald faced hornets (black yellow jackets) again.  Bug boms are not instant though I believe, so that'll tick 'em off a bunch.  You'd want to stick it in before daybreak, and be elsewhere for the next several hours.


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## Winegrower (Aug 30, 2022)

The local pest guys dug out a nest under a big Douglas Fir…really interesting nest, only about grapefruit size, but really elegant in construction.   it had resisted sprays and a misguided gasoline arson attempt.   Only cost $100.


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## 682bear (Aug 30, 2022)

Ok, I found the nest... sort of... 

They have dug the mortar out between two blocks and are nesting inside the wall. I can see the hole... it is about 8 feet from the end of the porch and a foot or so above the ground.

I'll go buy a few cans of Raid... I can spray the hole from the outside edge of the porch... I just don't know if I can get enough spray inside the hole to kill the entire nest.

But I'm gonna try...

-Bear


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## NCjeeper (Aug 30, 2022)

Send in the Honey badger.


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## Jake M (Aug 30, 2022)

682bear said:


> I'll go buy a few cans of Raid... I can spray the hole from the outside edge of the porch...



Make sure it's the foaming one.....  Night and day over those that don't.




682bear said:


> I just don't know if I can get enough spray inside the hole to kill the entire nest.
> 
> But I'm gonna try...
> 
> -Bear




Yes, yes you can.  First (and I can't say this enough), get 'em early in the morning, when they're all home.  If you don't get the vast majority of them,  they'll set up another nest/colony in no time.  And again, there's none outside too come up behind you while you do it.  That's a big deal.  These guys do communicate.

Spray from a modest distance (ten ish feet) hose the main opening they're using, and expect more.  When you see movement elsewhere, spray there too.  (Foam.....  Some of it stays where you were spraying before...).  There may well only be one way in, but there's a good chance there's multiple entrances.  (Inside the basement maybe?   ) After what seems like an eternity, but in reality is a couple seconds at best, you' can approach closer, aim right at the crack, and jam all of that stuff you possibly can inside the crack/cavity.

Further....  Put a sheet, old shower curtain, something inside the basement wall, centered about where that issue resides.  If they're coming in, you're not guaranteed, but could probably expect bug killer coming inside as well.  It won't be a violent spray by then, and may not be an issue at all, but it keeps it off of things that you don't want to be toxic.

And don't hesitate....  You have to go into it knowing you've got this.  If you stay on 'em, don't let up, a whole nest seldom outlasts the spray can.  And if it does, I did mention the two pack....  A second one at the ready is cheap insurance.  If you stay on 'em...  With the foam....  it goes pretty well.  They'll still be crawling when the first can is done, but they're not worried about you any more.  If you hesitate, stop half way through, or have poor or inconsistent aim with the "not foam"...  They'll get by.  How fast can you run?  Absolutely you need to have a plan for that of course in case of a worst case scenario, but honestly...  Before they're awake, when they're all there, and stay on 'em....  It's not too bad.

After that, an hour or two for any "barely sprayed" stragglers to finish straggling, and any survivors to settle back down to their normal peaceful coexisting selves, and it's done.


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## mullikinb (Aug 30, 2022)

I worked in a metal fab shop years ago and we had a yellow jacket problem.  A bee guy once told me, yellow jackets have 2 phases.  The trick is to bait them early on.  When they are first nesting and hatching, they like to eat meat. They will take it back to the hive to feed the young ones.  You can purchase and mix a bee poison with tuna and place it near the hive.  They will do the rest.  In phase 2 they tend to like sweet things like soda pop etc.  In phase 2 they get aggressive and ornery.


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## Reddinr (Aug 30, 2022)

Speaking as an 8-year-old with some experience with this, a fire cracker is a bad idea.


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## BGHansen (Aug 30, 2022)

We had them get under the vinyl siding, eat a 1' hole through our 1" Styrofoam sheathing, eat all of the wet-blown cellulose insulation, and burrow through the drywall.  I hadn't noticed them until they were in the house.  I shot them from the outside with hornet spray and heavily doused the area with Sevin dust.  The ones who were out foraging carried the Sevin into the nest and killed the rest of them.  One of my annual fall projects is walking around the outside of our house looking at where they are swarming.

Bruce


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## francist (Aug 30, 2022)

Hardly the most elegant thing I’ve ever made but it works and is a darn sight prettier than my prototype which was _really_ ugly! Anyway, I call it my “wasp rifle” and in case you can’t figure out the complicated mechanics this rig attaches to the end of a hollow aluminum pole (10’ long booming gaff) and with the suitably-long trigger cord allows the operator (me) to get right up and personal with the nest before deploying the killer jet stream. 




It actually works works great (really handy for yearly smoke tests of smoke detectors on high ceilings too) and because the can and nozzle can rotate at the head you can shoot a nest behind a gable, inside a pocket, etc from a safe vantage. I think this year is the first in a while that I have t had to use it, but it’s shot a lot of nests in it’s day and saves beating the hasty retreat down the extension ladder afterwards.




-frank


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## Eyerelief (Aug 30, 2022)

If they are in the walls, it can be tough.  Before I tried anything, I would try and figure out where they are entering your shop at.  Plug that first.  Any assault on them from the outside might force them inside.  If I can get to them, I use fire, but under a porch or in a wall, I would think bug bombs would be the way to go.......after I was sure I had blocked them from coming inside.  If their entrance hole into the shop was easily accessible I would consider rigging up a bug bomb to force the fog into that opening, killing or pushing them in the other direction.


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## Winegrower (Aug 30, 2022)

Another weird observation about yellow jackets that also applies to flies and other bugs is that this year, maybe just around here, don't know, there have been practically no flying insects of any kind.   I have  literally counted maybe 5 flies all summer at outdoor dinners.    This is a bit scary, isn't it? What does that mean for birds, bats, etc?

Anybody else see this?


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## Dabbler (Aug 30, 2022)

@682bear there is a great youtube channel where this guy primarily does mouse traps (really)  He took on several very nasty wasp problems.  his channel is at:





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					www.youtube.com


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## 682bear (Aug 30, 2022)

Eyerelief said:


> If they are in the walls, it can be tough.  Before I tried anything, I would try and figure out where they are entering your shop at.  Plug that first.  Any assault on them from the outside might force them inside.  If I can get to them, I use fire, but under a porch or in a wall, I would think bug bombs would be the way to go.......after I was sure I had blocked them from coming inside.  If their entrance hole into the shop was easily accessible I would consider rigging up a bug bomb to force the fog into that opening, killing or pushing them in the other direction.



This was something I had considered...

I went over the entire interior wall and filled any and all cracks and holes in the mortar with silicon caulk... I know they can chew through caulk if they want to, but if they do, at least I'll be able to tell where they are coming in.

I mainly did this to keep them from escaping into the basement when I start spraying the hole...

I bought 4 cans of Raid foaming wasp and hornet spray... if that doesn't do the job, I'll consult with a professional...

Thanks for all the suggestions...

-Bear


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## mcostello (Aug 30, 2022)

I have noticed the insect decline here also for several years, except for stink bugs.


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## 682bear (Aug 30, 2022)

Dabbler said:


> @682bear there is a great youtube channel where this guy primarily does mouse traps (really)  He took on several very nasty wasp problems.  his channel is at:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I just watched several of his videos... the one where he tears apart the live hornets nest is going to give me nightmares...

-Bear


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## Suzuki4evr (Aug 30, 2022)

Ask them to clean the shop when you are not there and switch off the lights when they are done....


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## rabler (Aug 30, 2022)

@BGHansen has the right idea.  A large yellow jacket nest is difficult to eradicate externally as the internal nest is challenging to get enough contact poison (such as any spray can stuff) into to kill the nest and larvae.  Those sprays are basically ineffective once they evaporate.  A new generation of hatched larvae will continue the nest even after wiping out all of the external activity.

Slow acting poison on bait is highly effective.  Yellow jackets are attracted to meat. Even more effective, powder that they crawl through will be distributed through the nest.  Both are spread before being toxic, very effective at wiping out the nest.  The best poisons for this are limited to licensed applicators, pest control professionals or farmers.  Dursban (chlorophyrofos, sp?) is a restricted pesticide that is highly effective for this type of use.  I would guess Sevin dust should work.


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## Ulma Doctor (Aug 30, 2022)

Boric acid in any concentration is lethal to ants, wasps, yellow jackets, etc.

If you add 2 tablespoons to half a can of soda and leave the soda out, easily partaken by the yellow jackets. They will return to the nest with a lethal treat for the hive. Since they share food, it will kill all of them

BTW: the sugar concentration in soda is too low for bees, there is no danger of killing honey bees with the above concoction


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## pontiac428 (Aug 30, 2022)

Wasp attacks don't occur often and they can typically be avoided if you take safety precautions.
If a swarm attacks you, you may want to play dead.
If a lone wasp attacks you, your best bet is probably to fight back — aim for the wasp's face. 
Recognize the signs of a pending attack.  Wasps signal attacks with the eyes.
Back away slowly.
Make some noise. Shrieks are not manly, but shouts are.
Make yourself larger- hold your arms out and up, and hop up and down.
Have a weapon to defend yourself.  Should be step #1, but ah, well.
Protect your neck, throat, and head. 
Curl up into a ball and place your head between your knees.
Congratulations, you survived!


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## MrWhoopee (Aug 30, 2022)

One of my favorite videos on the subject.






Personally, I've wired one of those electric raquet ball paddles to run off a wall-wart,  then taped the button down so it's always on. Put it over a bowl with some chicken bones in it. Entertainment for the whole family.


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## epanzella (Aug 30, 2022)

If the nest is above ground go in at night and they will all be tucked in and groggy. Spray with a bee spray that drops them quickly. If the nest is underground get about a 10 x 10 ft plastic sheet (tarp, drop cloth,  or even a shower curtain) and about a quart of gasoline. Pour the gas around the nest (don't light it) and cover it with the plastic. The plastic prevents the gas from evaporating and the fumes are heavier than air so they will kill everything in the nest even if it's 10 feet down. Yellow jackets and hornets are nasty and eventually they will decide that you are the enemy. On that day it will suck to be you.


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## MrWhoopee (Aug 30, 2022)

Shortly after I bought the house in the mountains, I was clearing some brush and disturbed an underground nest. I was stung three times right around my eye. It was swollen shut for 3 days. Once I'd recovered, I waited until night and took a sheet of clear plastic about 6'x6' and placed it over the nest, covering the edges with dirt all around. Since the little bastards could see light they just kept bouncing off the plastic instead of tunneling out.

It took a couple of weeks for them all to die. It was very gratifying.


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## ChazzC (Aug 30, 2022)

Boswell said:


> "Call a Guy"


2nd that recommendation: problem will be taken care of and you won’t have to worry about poisoning yourself or family.

A couple of years ago I found a Yellow Jacket colony inside a CMU wall in my garage (they found their way in through a chipped off corner). I used a bunch of cans of spray, then some powder off of Amazon and was lucky enough to wipe them out (piles of dead YJ on the garage floor).

Last year a new crop started showing up in my basement office, this time getting in through the siding. I waved the white flag and called Terminix: it took two treatments, but they got these and an underground nest cleared out for less $$ than I spent on spray previously. They come back every three months for prevention and whenever I see a problem, all for a flat quarterly fee.


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## tjb (Aug 30, 2022)

Just saw this thread, Bear.

We have the same problem around here - mainly because we're neighbors as far as yellow jackets are concerned.  This year we've eradicated two huge nests - one just off the back porch and one by the burn pile in the front pasture.  Obviously, it's a little scarier when they're actually IN the building instead of outside.

All the advice you're getting is great - on the farm, we deal with this almost annually - but what seems to work the best for us is getting to the nest early in the morning and spraying.  And I mean EARLY.  By six or six-thirty, they're already moving, but if you get out there early enough, they're pretty defenseless.  Spray them up real good, and if any are left over get 'em the next day.

Good luck.  I hate those things.  Keep us posted on your progress.

Regards,
Terry

Oh, and PS:  No matter what happens, if you're up close and personal, DO NOT swat at them and run from them.  Ask me how I know.


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## cathead (Aug 31, 2022)

Put on some protection(bee suit is best) and find the entrance hole under the porch.  Usually the hive is located under ground
and you can see activity where the entrance is.  Once you find that, it is an easy matter to shoot some hornet spray into that hole.


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## Bone Head (Aug 31, 2022)

I've witnessed something you do NOT want to try.  A neighbor took aim at a hornet's nest with his  shotgun.  He let off a round and did manage to pretty well destroy the nest.  They will track the damaging round right back to the source; it was like watching a buzzing rope grow right back to the source.  Shooter was almost instantly swarmed.  Another reason we moved out of the area.  Lack of common sense in neighbors.


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## 682bear (Aug 31, 2022)

Update...

This morning when I arrived home from work, I sprayed a full can of the Raid at the hole from as close as I could get... about 8 feet. I left it alone for a while...

I went into the basement and finished machining the part I was working on... I didn't see any yellow jackets in the basement at all.

So, possibly caulking all the cracks between the blocks may have worked... or maybe they just weren't interested in bothering me this morning...

After about 3 hours, I went back outside and checked on the hole... the spray didn't even slow them down... they are as busy as they were yesterday.

I called an exterminator... they are supposed to come out tomorrow and see what they can do...

-Bear


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## Eyerelief (Aug 31, 2022)

I always say that I don't mind wasp stings..........As long as they are on someone else.  I'm glad you are bringing in the big guns.


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## Janderso (Aug 31, 2022)

682bear said:


> I've known for a couple of months now that I have a yellow jacket nest under my front porch...
> 
> I'm not interested in crawling under there to find them... I've taken the 'live and let live' approach. As long as they aren't bothering me, I won't bother them.
> 
> ...


If you can pour about a 1/4 cup of gasoline down their hole, if it's a meat bee nest or spray some gas on the nest while they are quiet at night the fumes will kill them.
A bee keeper taught me that. We had wasp nests in the ground in Paradise. This method killed every one of those suckers. I hate them.


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## seasicksteve (Aug 31, 2022)

Because nothing is too good for our friends


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## pontiac428 (Aug 31, 2022)

Great.  Someone had to do it.  Now the fun's ruined for all of us, because drones equate to weapons for some dang reason.


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## Janderso (Aug 31, 2022)

pontiac428 said:


> Great.  Someone had to do it.  Now the fun's ruined for all of us, because drones equate to weapons for some dang reason.


I can’t fly my drone in very many places.
Not along the beach or in any state or federal park.
I don’t know why but I have a hunch. I don’t want to be filmed by a drone.


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## pontiac428 (Aug 31, 2022)

It's hard to manage these days without being filmed by someone somewhere without your knowledge.  The traffic cams, the security cams, transit cams, toll cams, whatever cams the company installed, your doorbell cam, the guy in front of you's dash cam system, the cameras installed all over  the Swift truck behind you, the one on the soda machine... yes, look closely at the touchscreen soda machine and tell me they're not using face recognition to compile a dossier of your consumer behavior...  Yeah, we're all on camera all the time now, whether we give permission or not.  That's good for a shiver!


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## stupoty (Sep 1, 2022)

Boswell said:


> "Call a Guy"


All that fun of being stung repeatedly you could be missing out on though?



Stu


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## Janderso (Sep 1, 2022)

pontiac428 said:


> It's hard to manage these days without being filmed by someone somewhere without your knowledge.  The traffic cams, the security cams, transit cams, toll cams, whatever cams the company installed, your doorbell cam, the guy in front of you's dash cam system, the cameras installed all over  the Swift truck behind you, the one on the soda machine... yes, look closely at the touchscreen soda machine and tell me they're not using face recognition to compile a dossier of your consumer behavior...  Yeah, we're all on camera all the time now, whether we give permission or not.  That's good for a shiver!


I never really thought about it.
Watching an Edward Snowden video a few weeks back had me thinking about the ever increasing speed and capacity of today’s super computers, makes one believe maybe big brother could keep an eye on us or find us if they had a wish to do so.
A cell phone is your tracker.


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## 34_40 (Sep 1, 2022)

Not sure how I missed this thread all this time but....   Some months ago I discovered a yellow jacket nest under our back deck and I also took a live & let live approach.  But then some weeks ago they decided to go on a rampage and attacked me & my 3 dogs!  I managed to get my 2 small dogs back in the house (all the while being stung) but my shepherd stayed in the yard and I had to hoist him over the fencing then enter the house from the front.  While I was waiting for the swelling from the stings to go down I made a plan of attack.  I used the lawn sprinkler - the kind that sweeps back and forth,  and set it up under the deck where I thought they might be at dusk.  Then every night I turned it on for 30 minutes and it wasn't long that they decided to move on.  I did get a couple cans of Spectracide, this one worked well - the Raid products - NOT!  So any strays that flew about got a zap and were done.  I still am not brave enough to have a look under there! LOL.  Maybe after the first freeze?


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## BGHansen (Sep 1, 2022)

Janderso said:


> I never really thought about it.
> Watching an Edward Snowden video a few weeks back had me thinking about the ever increasing speed and capacity of today’s super computers, makes one believe maybe big brother could keep an eye on us or find us if they had a wish to do so.
> A cell phone is your tracker.


About 20 years ago the #3 guy at GM wanted to drive a new at the time CTS-V wagon.  The plan was to drive one to his house with a chase car to transport the driver of the CTS-V wagon back to Lansing, MI.  They had the address, but were unfamiliar with the Detroit area.  So, one of the guys got on his computer and Mapquest'd how to get to the shooter's house.  

Our plant manager got a call from GM Security while the guy was on Mapquest, "You currently have an employee with this login ID sitting at this computer location Mapquesting how to get to #3 shooter's house".  "It's okay, he's driving a car to his house for him to drive".

I'd mention the story to folks when I'd see them surfing the web at "questionable" sites.  Think big brother is watching?  My former-workplace security knew the instant someone was looking up info on company executives, and probably other sites, and that was 20 years ago.  Now they're probably like the line I hear about wild turkey's eyesight; they can see you in line at the store buying a hunting license!

Bruce


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## pontiac428 (Sep 1, 2022)

Here's some more tin foil hat stuff for ya-  You know your late model car has cellular, wifi, and bluetooth radios that are connected to one of several computers in the vehicle and able to send whatever information to whomever is asking, as well as having the capability to shut the vehicle off,  lock the doors, and disable the switches with you in it.  It's getting spooky, man!


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## rabler (Sep 1, 2022)

pontiac428 said:


> Here's some more tin foil hat stuff for ya-  You know your late model car has cellular, wifi, and bluetooth radios that are connected to one of several computers in the vehicle and able to send whatever information to whomever is asking, as well as having the capability to shut the vehicle off,  lock the doors, and disable the switches with you in it.  It's getting spooky, man!


I also wonder how long before cars become a "service" instead of something you own.  So, like some of the CAD licenses, they can change their minds on next year start charging you extra for features that are already in your car.  Heated seats, yep, that's $10 per month.   You're already seeing some of that with the various self-driving aids.  Just wait, with a self-driving car, it will self-repossess itself.


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## Eyerelief (Sep 1, 2022)

pontiac428 said:


> Here's some more tin foil hat stuff for ya


I had to stop wearing tin foil hats because the propeller on my hat was generating too much static. “Every time the wife would rev up the microwave I’d pee in my pants and forget who I was for a half hour”

-Cousin Eddie from one of the vacation movies


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## 682bear (Sep 2, 2022)

Update:

The exterminator came out this morning. The dispatcher told him it was wasps... so he was expecting a nest hanging from the eaves... 

His truck is in the shop being serviced, so he didn't have all of his equipment this morning. Once he saw the situation, he determined that he would have to come back with his regular truck...

He said he could be back this afternoon, but I sleep in the afternoons... I have to work tonight... so I just rescheduled for next Tuesday.

I'll update again next week...

-Bear


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