# Yet Another G4003g Delivery



## jmarkwolf (Mar 15, 2016)

I ordered it Wednesday, it arrived Monday.

Packaging was in quite good condition, and only some slight damage to paint on the pedestals, interestingly, in the top right corner on both pedestals. Simple fix (see photos below).

I will likely be bolting the pedestals to the floor and setting the lathe this weekend.

In the meantime, I've removed the pallets and done a rudimentary inspection, doing some low test lifts with my 2-ton shop crane, and eye balling how best to approach the pedestals with the crane.

One apprehension I've had was how to hook my wide 10,000lb lifting straps to the hook on my crane. The solution I came up with is a lifting clevis from Tractor Supply Company for under $20 (see photos). It's over kill in terms of capacity (16,000 lbs), and some smaller ones would've had adequate capacity, but this one allowed enough space for the wide lifting straps, and additional straps hooks.

The crane had no trouble with the low lifts, and gave me more confidence for when it comes time to lift to the pedestals.

Now I need to locate and bolt the pedestals down, set the lathe, do a good cleaning, get a better look at things, do the first "pre-flight" and break-in, and start 'er up!


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## coolidge (Mar 15, 2016)

I recommend you re-think bolting it to the floor. Even if your floor is perfectly flat I guarantee the bottom of the stands are not and won't be in the same plane with each other. You will have to shim them to keep from putting a twist into the lathe. Once shimmed you could then bolt it to the floor I guess.


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## jmarkwolf (Mar 15, 2016)

Hi Coolidge

I'm reading on the forums that it's better to shim  and level a "light lathe" between the bed and the pedestals, rather than between the pedestals and the floor.


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## dave2176 (Mar 15, 2016)

Congratulations, I love mine. I think I would put the shims between the pedestals and the floor. Just a thought.


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## jmarkwolf (Mar 16, 2016)

Can anyone advise how stable this lathe is without bolting to the floor?

The pedestals seem pretty robust.

It's the heaviest lathe I've owned, my previous lathe (Grizzly G9972Z 11x26) was half the weight and it was not bolted to the floor without any issues. I 'm inclined to follow the suggestion of the manufacturer, lacking any first hand experience with a lathe his heavy. But if others can advise otherwise I'm open to suggestion.

Also, is it really advisable to locate the machine 30in from the wall? And would that 30in be measured from the pedestal to the wall, or the chip tray to the wall?


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## Steve Shannon (Mar 16, 2016)

Here's the picture from page 18 of the manual. It shows 30" to the closest part of the lathe, which appears to be the electrical box behind the headstock:




 Steve Shannon, P.E.


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## rgray (Mar 16, 2016)

30 inches from the wall so you can get behind it to get at the coolant tank maybe.? I put mine about 12 inches from the wall. Just don't have the kind of room to be 30 inches.
If you shim between the lathe and the stands it will need sealed later if you want to run coolant.
Mine came with square cut o-rings that go on the bolts to seal the lathe, chip pan to stand area. I had no idea that they were for that and left them out. First time I ran coolant it ran into the stands and down the outside onto the floor. So I silicon sealed the lathe to the base.
This lathe is pretty stable.  Top heavy of course. I added adjustable feet to mine for leveling and to add a little stability as they are out wider than the base.


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## Profkanz (Mar 16, 2016)

Been teaching machine shop 36 years, worked in the trade for 10 years. We never bolted a lathe to the floor.
Assemble the lathe and pedestals first. Then level with the leveling screws it should have come with on top of leveling pads.
The weight of the machine should hold it in place just fine.


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## coolidge (Mar 16, 2016)

The stand for the G4003G is poorly designed imo. Its too shallow front to back and you can't use the holes in the stand for leveling feet because that would make it even shallower front to back. This would also raise it up even higher when its already too high off the floor for anyone shy of 6 feet tall. The stand is welded together and not exactly square, mine sort of lean to the right (face palm). While the tops of the pedestals have a ground flat area for the lathe to bolt to the bottoms are not ground flat in plane with the tops. If you bolted the pedestals to the lathe and suspended it in the air the bottoms of the pedestals are likely to be all cockeyed from each other. Then of course is your floor completely flat, unlikely.

You have two choices, set the stands flat on the floor and shim with thin metal squares to level the lathe (my current configuration), that will give you decent stability short of a medium strength earthquake. One could if they choose bolt the lathe to the floor once level. For leveling feet you will need to bolt or weld some angle or tubing to the sides of the pedestals as some have done, ideally extending the footprint front to back for improved stability. Ideally you would have 4 leveling feet under the headstock and 2 leveling feet under the tailstock.

Leave the lathe out from the wall at least for a while, you will need to get back there to install a DRO and probably deal with the motor mount issue. The lathe is not easy to clean from the front which is why I have mine sticking out from the wall at a right angle so that I can get back there to clean. I make use of that space behind the lathe for tool chests which I can roll out of the way if I need to get to the back of the lathe.

I'm out from the wall far enough to remove the tailstock when needed. Tip, note that I have secured the DRO cables to the top/center of the backsplash to keep them up out of the chip tray, I also removed the useless light and cord for the same reason.



Here you see how shallow the stand is front to back, 14.25 inches.



If you put leveling feet in these holes the footprint is further reduced to 8 inches front to back plus the diameter of your leveling feet.


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## abrace (Mar 16, 2016)

Don't know if you can weld or not, but this is my solution to adding stability while still being able to use leveling feet.

http://hobby-machinist.com/threads/g4003-stand-modification.42439/#post-368738


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## jmarkwolf (Mar 16, 2016)

Excellent input everybody. Thanks.

Coolidge, thanks especially for the pics. It's quite obvious from the end view that the lathe is a little "top-endy" without some "bolstering" to the stands.

My lathe isn't on the stands yet so I was unaware.


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## coolidge (Mar 16, 2016)

Look at the G0709 stand, that would have been a better design for the G4003G imo. Dream stand...a solid one piece cast iron stand.


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## jmarkwolf (Mar 17, 2016)

After rethinking the issue, I've decided not to bolt the lathe pedestals to the floor, and to bolster them to widen the stance front-to-back, similar to Abrace's solution.

Thanks to Coolidge for posting the pics that illustrate the issue, so I can deal with it before getting everything assembled.

Abrace's solution is similar to what I plan to do, although I won't be doing any welding. I'll be turning the angle iron inward under the pedestals, and gaining access to the nuts through slots that I will be milling in the side of the angle iron. I'll keep the slots smallish, and access will be tight but I'll likely only have to do it once in my lifetime.

I'm not concerned about "end-wise" lathe instability, just fore and aft. And I think 24in long angle iron bolted to each side of both the pedestals, with more "stickout" at the back than the front, as Abrace has done, is the ticket.

Inserting leveling shims at the ends of the angle iron will be easily accessible and adjusted. Inserting shims at the middle will help reduce or eliminate "drum-heading".

This solution only increases the height of the lathe by the thickness of the angle iron and whatever shims are required for leveling. I'm nearly 6ft and can tolerate the extra height. I'll likely drill holes in the ends so I can add feet later if so desired.

The remaining task now is to decide how thick the angle iron should be. Do you think 1/4in wall is adequate or should it be 3/8in?

I'm planning on 24in long angle iron which is 10in longer than the side of the pedestal. Whaddya think, offsetting the angle iron with 6in out the back and 4in out the front? Or 7in out the back and 3in out the front?


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## abrace (Mar 17, 2016)

jmarkwolf said:


> After rethinking the issue, I've decided not to bolt the lathe pedestals to the floor, and to bolster them to widen the stance front-to-back, similar to Abrace's solution.
> 
> The remaining task now is to decide how thick the angle iron should be. Do you think 1/4in wall is adequate or should it be 3/8in?
> 
> I'm planning on 24in long angle iron which is 10in longer than the side of the pedestal. Whaddya think, offsetting the angle iron with 6in out the back and 4in out the front? Or 7in out the back and 3in out the front?



I went with 3/8 angle iron. Seems like overkill, but the grizzly stand has pretty thick steel on the bottom so I wanted to try to match it. 5/16" would have been just fine to.

My gut tells me 1/4" would be marginal for my application, but since you are reversing the angle iron so it will cradle your stand you may be able to get away with thinner steel than myself. They way I did it reduces the attachment points down to just a couple of welds, versus your cradle approach, so thicker steel makes more sense for me than it does you.

I had considered doing what you are going to do, I just decided against it since I can weld, and felt  that I would also be increasing the effective 'width' of the stands with my method and felt it was worth it. I was also concerned about too much extra height. I am 6'4", so it probably would have been fine, but I saw too many people compaining about how high the lathe was and by the time I added leveling feet, and cradled the bottom, I would have added several inches of height.

Best of luck with your project!


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## frostheave (Mar 17, 2016)

Here is one more option that has worked well for me.  I could have welded but didn't want to paint so I riveted aluminum angle.

http://www.hobby-machinist.com/threads/new-g4003g-lathe-alignment-problem.18734/


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## coolidge (Mar 17, 2016)

Don't forget to round off the corners of the angle iron, I know about the first thing I'd do is stub my toe on that followed by cussing and throwing something.


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## abrace (Mar 17, 2016)

Let me add that I have still yet to actually set my lathe on the stands due to issues with my shop being completed, so my entire plan may turn out to be terrible once I get that far


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## tmarks11 (Mar 17, 2016)

coolidge said:


> Look at the G0709 stand, that would have been a better design for the G4003G imo. Dream stand...a solid one piece cast iron stand.


And a better design for the G0709 would have been a G0509G stand.


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## jmarkwolf (Mar 17, 2016)

coolidge said:


> Don't forget to round off the corners of the angle iron, I know about the first thing I'd do is stub my toe on that followed by cussing and throwing something.



LOL.

Yes, indeedy. Already considered that. Might even paint them Caution Orange!


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## jmarkwolf (Mar 19, 2016)

Made some progress on the pedestal legs today.

I had purchased some 5/8-11 flat head bolts to attach angle iron to the bottom of the pedestals but head of the bolts has a 1-1/16 in diameter which is a sizable amount of material to remove from the 2in wide angle iron, plus I didn't have a large enough countersink and would have to buy one.

I decided to fabricate some welding studs and counter bored the angle iron such that the bolts would be flush on the underside of the pedestals.

I've chamfered the ends of the angle iron to reduce the trip hazard.

Next thing is to mill access slots in the sides of the angle iron to fit a wrench for tightening the nuts, then welding the studs into place, and painting them.

Rustoleum makes some spray paint that looks like it will be a pretty good match to the Grizzly green.

Below I milled off much of the head of 5/8-11 grade 5 bolts.




Comparing the original bolt head to the new thinner "welding stud" head.




Dropping the welding stud into the counter bored angle. It's flush with the surface of the angle.




Trial fitting below. Note: pedestal is upside down.


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## abrace (Mar 19, 2016)

The rustoleum hammered green finish is pretty close. That is what I used, but I painted the whole stand to make sure it would match.


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## Ironken (Mar 19, 2016)

frostheave said:


> Here is one more option that has worked well for me.  I could have welded but didn't want to paint so I riveted aluminum angle.
> 
> http://www.hobby-machinist.com/threads/new-g4003g-lathe-alignment-problem.18734/



I'm seriousely eyeing a G4003.....I really like your solution. Can you get to the inside of the stands where you riveted to use nuts and bolts? Alternatively, how thick are the stands directly behind your Alum angles? When I finally pull the trigger on this machine, I was also considering a setup similar to yours with the exception of using steel angle and rosette/plug welding the angle to the stand. Lemme know what you think.


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## jmarkwolf (Mar 20, 2016)

abrace said:


> The rustoleum hammered green finish is pretty close. That is what I used, but I painted the whole stand to make sure it would match.



Couldn't find the hammered green. I think I read somewhere that it has been discontinued. I'll do some "Googling" and see what I come up with. Might even take a sample of the sheet metal down to the paint store and see what kind of match they can come up with.

The paint I found looks like it is just a flat color, but the "hue" looks pretty close.


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## Steve Shannon (Mar 20, 2016)

jmarkwolf said:


> Couldn't find the hammered green. I think I read somewhere that it has been discontinued. I'll do some "Googling" and see what I come up with. Might even take a sample of the sheet metal down to the paint store and see what kind of match they can come up with.
> 
> The paint I found looks like it is just a flat color, but the "hue" looks pretty close.


http://smile.amazon.com/dp/B0002YVWJW
The deep green is still shown. The silver looks light green to me, about the color of my Unimat SL.


 Steve Shannon, P.E.


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## abrace (Mar 20, 2016)

It is actually the deep green that I got. Ordered it from home depot in a 2 quart pack for $27.06 and had it shipped to the store for free. Just ordered it a couple of months ago, it was still an available item at that time.
It is a PITA to work with, requires Xylol for cleaning/thinning.


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## frostheave (Mar 20, 2016)

Gunrunner you need to order a set of these for the Z axis hand crank. Bill did you just spit coffee on your monitor? :rofl:

View attachment 253356


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## Ironken (Mar 20, 2016)

Gunrunner you need to order a set of these for the Z axis hand crank. Bill did you just spit coffee on your monitor? :rofl:

View attachment 253356


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## frostheave (Mar 20, 2016)

Ironken - Yeah, I'm actually not too worried about the rivets.  It has been a while since I did this so I checked my install again.  As it turns out, there is only about 1/2" of meat below the bottom of the stand.  Look at this picture from coolidge.


So, there is plenty of room for nuts & bolts inside the stand but only about a 1/2" available below the bottom on the outside of the stand.  This is because of the cutout seen in the picture.  Thanks for the picture coolidge.

jmarkwolf - Sorry for all the posts.  I hope I haven't hijacked your thread.


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## Ironken (Mar 20, 2016)

Makes perfect sense frost. Thanks again.


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## coolidge (Mar 20, 2016)

jmarkwolf said:


> Couldn't find the hammered green. I think I read somewhere that it has been discontinued. I'll do some "Googling" and see what I come up with. Might even take a sample of the sheet metal down to the paint store and see what kind of match they can come up with.
> 
> The paint I found looks like it is just a flat color, but the "hue" looks pretty close.



Ace Hardware carries a hammered green that is an exact match for the G4003G. Kilz brand Hammerite Rust Cap 41165 Hammered Deep Green


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## jmarkwolf (Mar 21, 2016)

coolidge said:


> Ace Hardware carries a hammered green that is an exact match for the G4003G. Kilz brand Hammerite Rust Cap 41165 Hammered Deep Green



Excellent, thanks Coolidge.


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## jmarkwolf (Mar 25, 2016)

Update from OP (original poster) here:

I fabricated the new angle iron "outriggers" to improve the lathe pedestal footprint and stability without bolting them to the floor. I'm pleased with the way they turned out. I drilled a 1/2in hole in the ends in case I ever want to add some feet.




The actual hoist went very well. I was apprehensive because this was to be the heaviest lift I've done with my 2-ton engine hoist. The lathe only weighs 25% of the specified capacity of the hoist, and I only needed to extend the boom to the 1.5ton (3000lbs) position, but after reading horror stories on the web I was nervous. In the end the hoist didn't even grunt. I installed temporary studs to align the lathe with the mounting holes in the pedestals, which worked extremely well. The hoist straddled the pedestal offset to one side, and only required a little lateral push to lower it onto the studs. The straps and 16,000lb capacity shackle worked very well.







The lathe and the sheet metal are in place below. Installed the power cord, filled the headstock with oil, and powered up the spindle without incident. Be advised, the apron was shipped full of oil, and it would've been easy to assume the headstock was also filled, but it was not.  Next thing is to finish cleaning it, level it and complete the break-in period, then check the chuck run-out and do some test turns.


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## abrace (Mar 26, 2016)

jmarkwolf said:


> Update from OP (original poster) here:
> 
> The actual hoist went very well. I was apprehensive because this was to be the heaviest lift I've done with my 2-ton engine hoist. The lathe only weighs 25% of the specified capacity of the hoist, and I only needed to extend the boom to the 1.5ton (3000lbs) position, but after reading horror stories on the web I was nervous. In the end the hoist didn't even grunt. I installed temporary studs to align the lathe with the mounting holes in the pedestals, which worked extremely well. The hoist straddled the pedestal offset to one side, and only required a little lateral push to lower it onto the studs. The straps and 16,000lb capacity shackle worked very well.



Thanks for the writeup and pictures. I have yet to put mine on the stands...been on the shop floor for about 75 days now.

What did you use for studs? You find some metric studs locally?


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## jmarkwolf (Mar 26, 2016)

Hi Abrace.

I just bought some cheap metric bolts at the hardware store, cut the heads off and chamfered the corners to make it easier to "hit the target" when lowering the lathe onto them. The bolts I started with were a little longer than the stocks one. Longer would've been better, maybe 1-1/2 times as long.


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## abrace (Mar 27, 2016)

jmarkwolf said:


> Hi Abrace.
> 
> I just bought some cheap metric bolts at the hardware store, cut the heads off and chamfered the corners to make it easier to "hit the target" when lowering the lathe onto them. The bolts I started with were a little longer than the stocks one. Longer would've been better, maybe 1-1/2 times as long.



Cool, thanks!


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