# TIG torch choices?



## graham-xrf (Apr 23, 2021)

My welder is a 200A MIG, with the option for Lift-TIG, and was not supplied with the TIG torch, so I have to purchase that separately to get a setup that works. Please allow that I don't yet know anything about TIG other than the working principle, so I am fumbling around a bit.

I have established that for TIG, the gas and the power do not come out the same socket on (my) welder, as like for MIG.
The end of the cable to the torch has to end up with two tails, one for gas, the other for the current - or have some adapter, or Y-Junction arrangement.

I use here some example images from eBay, for illustration..
Going for 200A may not be entirely necessary, unless one day I get into TIG on aluminium, but it seems sensible to get one that matches the capability of the welder. Also, If I went for 4m (about 12ft), it would mean I need not drag cylinders around.

The Polish manual says the type needed is "TIG 17V". I assume this means "WP-17V, but I see some candidates labeled WP-17FV. I have guessed the "V" means there is a little gas valve tap knob on the torch handle. I don't know what the "F" means.

*Simple separates*


The first picture shows what amounts to two separate pipes put up one rubbery overjacket. The electrical connector looks the right style for the welder. only 10ft long, it has the valve, OK for 200A, and the gas connection is 3/8" BSP. This one costs £55 (£76.32)
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
*Denim?*
Then you get another style, This one also has the separate pipe and electrics, and the sheath cover looks as if made from charity blue jeans denim. This one comes with a caution about Jasic new version fittings, but here I note there is an "extra" connection. Is that for ON/OFF control or something?



- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
*Superflex??*
The next one is "CK" brand, and is much more expensive. It will require some kind of extra adapter to get the connection and the gas going up it. This red thing at least does not sport feature denim.  Cost is £79 ($109.18).


	

		
			
		

		
	
 - - 
	

		
			
		

		
	



I have to assume that this kind has power and gas available all in one socket receptacle on the welder, though might be usable with some kind of adapter.

*An adapter!*
I had thought that this Parweld adapter was just the thing. There is what looks like a place to put gas up, and I can see the electrical connection. Then I see one mentions water cooling. Another does not mention water, and has a strange push-on connection  though in either case, I still have no idea how it gets up to the torch. Is that screw thread "standard"?



	

		
			
		

		
	
 - - 
	

		
			
		

		
	




- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
*The "extra" cable.*
We come to a "Parweld" brand setup.  This may be all I need, but I see the extra cable in there .This one is less costly, £40 ($55.28)
The designation is WP17-12-2SW-TELF, which may imply the grey cable perhaps for a handle-mounted ON/OF switch.
Whatever it is, it does not seem to have a valve knob.




So far, I am mostly striking out. These choices leave the questions..
1. Is the super flexible a good thing? Sure, but how good does it need to be for the price?
2. So far, I have not seen a setup that would simply connect up to in a working arrangement. What should I be aiming for?
3. What does "F" mean in WP-17FV ?
4. All the TIG torches I see look much the same, and are basically simple things. What features are worth taking the price beyond $120 or so?

I have not even started on all the other consumables. I see sets of quartz cups, and little pink cups, and "shorter" looking collet thingys, and I am thinking .. Hmm, do ceramic cups things actually "wear out"? At least I know tungsten is tungsten, but I am sure there will be types with additives.

This stuff may seem obvious to many, but I don't want to have to buy everything in the shop before I come up with the subset that works.


----------



## DavidR8 (Apr 23, 2021)

I can only comment on the CK torch. I have a CK WP-17FV flex torch on my Primeweld. It's a great torch. The flexible neck is useful when working in tight quarters. 
The superflex hose is exactly that, it doesn't feel like an unwieldy snake trying to wrest control of the torch. It's about as flexible as a soft rope of similar size.


----------



## graham-xrf (Apr 23, 2021)

DavidR8 said:


> I can only comment on the CK torch. I have a CK WP-17FV flex torch on my Primeweld. It's a great torch. The flexible neck is useful when working in tight quarters.
> The superflex hose is exactly that, it doesn't feel like an unwieldy snake trying to wrest control of the torch. It's about as flexible as a soft rope of similar size.


Aah Ha! Thanks for the reply David. That is likely what the "F" means - it stands for "flexible".
So the CK in the pictures is exactly like the one you have?

I begin to have hopes that the coupling on the end of the hose, which apparently takes the gas up to the torch, as well as making the connection to the power, would fit onto one of the adapters, which gives a way of introducing the gas from the side port.


----------



## DavidR8 (Apr 23, 2021)

Yes, mine is exactly like the CK torch in your picture. 
I can't offer any guidance on hose connections unfortunately. Perhaps a call/email to CK would yield benefits. I hear their customer service is excellent.


----------



## General Zod (Apr 24, 2021)

Go for the 200A torch.  A 17 series will get very hot, even at moderate levels.  The 26 Trimline from CK with a superflex and don't look back.  It is beefy, but use a short back-cap and stubby consumables and it is quite manageable.


----------



## graham-xrf (Apr 24, 2021)

DavidR8 said:


> Yes, mine is exactly like the CK torch in your picture.
> I can't offer any guidance on hose connections unfortunately. Perhaps a call/email to CK would yield benefits. I hear their customer service is excellent.


I am at the point where I think a bit of careful reading can get me to the point I get stuff that will go together.
In the extreme, I am sure I can fashion my own adapters, if I have to.

On the point from @General Zod , do you find the size 17 torch gets real hot to handle?
Most of the welding stuff  I ended up with was driven by his advice anyway, so I am minded to keep on going that way.


----------



## graham-xrf (Apr 24, 2021)

This piece, I think, is the very first part I need.



It gets the electricity and the gas onto what looks like a "standard" 3/8 BSP connection, which can then feed a single tube to torch. I don't really fancy sheaths with multiple pipes and cables going up it, though I can see that triggers, and switches could be handy. I am looking to add a foot switch.

If i get far enough into this, then I will consider a dedicated TIG welder, but not yet.


----------



## markba633csi (Apr 24, 2021)

So regarding the adapter above, what carries the current to the torch? Is there a braided sheath over the hose made of copper strands? 
Just wondering
-Mark


----------



## graham-xrf (Apr 24, 2021)

markba633csi said:


> So regarding the adapter above, what carries the current to the torch? Is there a braided sheath over the hose made of copper strands?
> Just wondering
> -Mark


One gets purpose-made round tube, like the CK brand, which contains the current conductors, and the gas pipe. I don't think it is a braid, More like the normal spiral of flexible fine wires, but around a central gas tube, and all in a single sheath. If one wants to use this kind, then the welder needs to have a dedicated TIG feature to deliver gas up the middle of the connector.
Such would not seem compatible is using the high current plug-and-twist type with the lug.

Thus, we have the need for "adaptors".  Some complete purchased hoses with torches and conductors have that type of adapter already part of the assembly, providing a way to introduce the gas.

I see there are arrangements where the conductor cable is just separate to the gas pipe all the way, both being contained in some kind of sheath. To keep them soft and flexible, various fabric sheaths are used - hence the picture of the "denim" cover, but they also come as plastics, braids, or coverings. In these cases, there is no need for adapters, because the gas and conductor are already separated, and can go directly to welder, or bottle.

When one has switches or triggers up at the torch, it can mean an "extra cable in the sheath.

All the above is my understanding of what I have found so far. I am sure some members have purchased all kinds of combinations that did not go together. The complete offerings from China into eBay runs about £40 to £65 ($55 to $90).
The "flexible" types 4m long, with CK17F torch come out at about £80 (about $110).
The CK Trimline TL26 Flex Head 200A with 4m SuperFlex Cable 3/8"BSP asks for £125 (that's $173).

The range between about £45 and £90 seems hard to justify, because the lower cost end from China is not at all crappy. These are not complicated things.

The suggestion is that for the sake of air-cooled comfort and convenience, the beefier size CK 26 series will be more appreciated than anything size 17 series, even at moderate current levels. The bigger size, with the super-flex hose, when used with short back cap and  "stubby" size torch parts, is apparently as useful as a 17-series without getting so overheated.
Of course, it is significantly more expensive, but I guess it is something you won't need to replace for a long time.


----------



## General Zod (Apr 24, 2021)

graham-xrf said:


> do you find the size 17 torch gets real hot to handle?


 the day you tempt fate, and don't want it get hot, it will.


----------



## DavidR8 (Apr 24, 2021)

I personally don’t find it gets too hot but I rarely run over 100-120 amps.


----------



## GunsOfNavarone (Apr 24, 2021)

Flex head for sure (not flex loc)...CK hoses are so light and flexible, anything else drives me nuts now.


----------



## General Zod (Apr 24, 2021)

DavidR8 said:


> I personally don’t find it gets too hot but I rarely run over 100-120 amps.


 Yea I agree those levels on DC won't get it very warm.  But once you start knocking on 150A and especially AC for aluminum, totally different story.


----------



## DavidR8 (Apr 24, 2021)

General Zod said:


> Yea I agree those levels on DC won't get it very warm. But once you start knocking on 150A and especially AC for aluminum, totally different story.



I have a feeling that there’s a 26 in my future (or water cooled) as I have some aluminum projects in mind.


----------



## kb58 (Apr 24, 2021)

I had the first-gen Miller EconoTig along with an air-cooled torch. It got hot as hell a few times, so they're really only good for short (time) welds. I ended up trading it in on a Syncrowave 250 with a watercooled torch, and never looked back. It's the difference between touch up work and real work; you should let your planned usage make the decision for you.


----------



## jwmelvin (Apr 24, 2021)

A water cooled torch is great for aluminum.


----------



## graham-xrf (Apr 25, 2021)

DavidR8 said:


> I have a feeling that there’s a 26 in my future (or water cooled) as I have some aluminum projects in mind.


One thing I came across is that when researching TIG on aluminium, one can easily be running 150A to 200A, and seemingly needing more, but the addition of 5% or 10% helium in the gas makes a massive difference. They say it can be like having a much higher power welder! Either way, if you want to TIG aluminium, you need cooling, or you do it in short bursts. Of course, helium is also very expensive!

The decision, as mentioned by @kb58, will be driven by the actual torch down welding times. For me, I guess using a size 26 series torch, brought down to more petite dimensions with stubby bits, is a reasonable half-way house between a 17-series that gets readily overheated, and investing in the whole water-cooled shebang.

TIG on aluminum looks beautiful, but I guess for most of us folk, we have to stay with welding on thinner bits.


----------



## Janderso (Apr 25, 2021)

Looking forward to see what you choose.
I would love to have a cooler.


----------



## General Zod (Apr 25, 2021)

For air cooled:

2nd best choice:  CK 26 Trimline

Best choice:  Heavy Hitters TIG Torch

The heavy hitter torch is a big sucker, but you would be able to use a CK 26 style air-cooled 1pc Superflex cable (12 ft (46V28RSF) or 25 ft (46V30RSF)) up to 200A.  If 200A Aluminum welding is in your future, it will outperform the others.  Lots of brass, and a revised argon-flow path provide for much better cooling than standard cooling.

Compared to generic "200A" Ebay 26-series torch

























generic 26 vs Heavy Hitter 350 vs CK 17 w/valve.



















A word about stubby consumables. While they do shorten up the size of the torch head for better visibility, and maneuverability, the lesser mass and the reduced distance to the arc/weld pool will cause the torch to heat up much more/faster.  It is worse on AC due to the reverse-cycle (DCEP), so this is where standard 13N series consumables, or 45V-series medium/large gas lens parts have an advantage.   IMO the main difference is how hot the tungsten will get/stay.   That will play a factor with just how much argon post-flow you need to run to protect the tungsten from oxidation.  If you are stingy with the argon-post flow, then this is something to consider.


----------



## ericc (Apr 25, 2021)

General Zod said:


> the day you tempt fate, and don't want it get hot, it will.


I have a 17.  If it gets hot, the first thing I think about is my wallet.  At the cost of argon refills, it will end up getting a hole burned through it.


----------



## graham-xrf (Apr 25, 2021)

ericc said:


> I have a 17.  If it gets hot, the first thing I think about is my wallet.  At the cost of argon refills, it will end up getting a hole burned through it.


You have a point!
It seems the shield gas is also, wastefully, also the cooling breeze. Sure - there is the water cooled sort, which will also definitely impact the wallet. I have had the thought that by now, we might have seen invented some passive heat dissipation tricks, heat sink fins, the creative use of heat pipes, etc.

Blowing argon back into the atmosphere in the cause of providing an inert gas shield, is a 100% total loss system (just like my lathe oilers), and the fuel energy expended in dragging the argon out of the air is a major cost, not only to us, but to the environment. This is a pity! There seems no realistic practical way to contain and recover the shield gas from around the various shaped stuff we weld on.

What we are discussing are the (overheated hand) comfort benefits of using bigger torch size, higher flow, more resource-hungry kit, all because of the inability to extract and dissipate the heat. This is an unfortunate strategy when a smaller, less costly consuming torch, would be more appropriate, and very much desired, if only the darn thing would not get so hot!


----------



## General Zod (Apr 25, 2021)

You can't have your cake and it eat too.  In this game gotta pay to play.


----------



## graham-xrf (Apr 25, 2021)

General Zod said:


> You can't have your cake and it eat too.  In this game gotta pay to play.


That be so true - so long as you are not interested in a game-changer! 

If you had the choice of a tiny torch (for some things), that stayed stone cold, or indeed a range of torch sizes, would you not choose to expend only the argon you needed to keep your weld happy?


----------



## General Zod (Apr 25, 2021)

Both.  There are times you need a tiny torch to reach into crevices...








and there are times you need a big 500A water-cooled torch with 1/4" diameter tungstens...







It's whatever the occasion calls for.


----------



## G-ManBart (Apr 26, 2021)

graham-xrf said:


> So far, I am mostly striking out. These choices leave the questions..
> 1. Is the super flexible a good thing? Sure, but how good does it need to be for the price?
> 2. So far, I have not seen a setup that would simply connect up to in a working arrangement. What should I be aiming for?
> 3. What does "F" mean in WP-17FV ?
> ...



I'm not sure all these have been answered directly (may have missed it).

Yes, super flexible is a good thing.  Less flexible hoses are simply annoying and sometimes they can interfere with being able to move your torch hand smoothly.  

The "F" in WP-17FV stands for "flex head" meaning you can adjust where the tungsten is pointed, which is very useful.  It can save a lot of fatigue by putting the torch at just the right angle when you can't get it there with a natural hand/arm position.  The "V" stands for valve and is required for welders that don't have an internal gas solenoid.

The quartz cups are nice when you want/need maximum visibility since you can see through them, and they also seem to reflect light back into the weld puddle as an added benefit.  The downsides are that they cost more and can't handle as much heat as the pink ceramic alumina cups.  Cups don't generally wear out, but they're pretty fragile and will often break if dropped on the ground/table, so you really want to keep spares.  Cup size is mostly about amperage, material and stick out.  For aluminum many people like a medium cup....say a #6.  For steel 7 or 8 is a nice general purpose size.  For stainless you want a big cup...8 or even bigger.  Gas lenses are a popular option...shorter, fatter cups with diffusers.  They give better gas coverage for a given flow rate and let you run less gas volume, greater stick out (or both).  I like them because they're shorter and let me get closer to the work.

As far as tungsten selection goes, it's easy....buy some 2% Lanthanated in 3/32" and 1/16".  You can weld anything with them using any machine and they'll be fine.  At some point you might want to try something else, or add 1/8" for higher amperage work, but you won't be limited in any way for a long time (maybe never) with those first two on hand.

Later in the thread you mention cooling and there are solutions which don't require a cooler with a fan/radiator/pump.  Some folks have hooked their machine to a fresh water supply with a solenoid controlled by the machine so water flows when there is an arc and the return line just runs to a drain.  Others have used a pump and a larger reservoir so the volume of water in the reservoir acts as the heat sink.  Imagine a 55 gallon barrel full of water being recirculated continuously....it would take a long time to get that much water hot.  With that said, a dedicated cooler is a wonderful addition and I can't imagine every going back to an air-cooled setup unless I wanted to do something outside of the shop.


----------



## General Zod (Apr 26, 2021)

I used 2% lanthanated 1/8" diameter, on my Invertig 221 torture test @ 220A, and it did round off quite a bit, but then again it was an Ebay cheapie.  Just FYI.


----------



## graham-xrf (Apr 26, 2021)

@G-ManBart  :

Thank you for the very complete explanation, and stepping through the list of stuff one needs at the beginning. From all that I have gathered so far, I am thinking the expense of the super-flexible hose on-piece combined conductor and gas pipe seems justified. If I initially get the "separate-services-in-a sheath", or some heavy, hard to handle setup, then in the end, I can see myself purchasing again.

I can see how using a WP-26 gives some advantage over WP-17 in respect of a cooling strategy, but the WP-17 size is entirely adequate for the largest thicknesses I envisage, and is petite enough for the small size things I normally expect to be the usual fare.
It is also the recommended size of torch mentioned in the manual. Before I resort to something that is going to gobble gas, I am going to more deeply research water cooling.

The idea of pumping water around into a heatsink radiator solves the heat issue, hopefully not entirely at the expense of flexibility. I have already ordered the adapter. So far as I can tell, there may not be any much physical difference between a hose/conductor setup that can connect a WP-17 torch, as compared to a WP-26 torch. The bore in the hoses may be the same, even if the bores through the fittings are different. Can one have a hose/conductor that can accept either WP-17 or WP-26, just so long as the current carrying capacity is adequate?

I note that CK brands do not use the "WP" designation. They call it CK 17 instead.
I see WP-18 and WP-20  in there also
I am guessing that CK 9 is a smaller thing than WP-17.

We get pink cups, and we get quartz cups. So far, it seems the quartz advantage is see-thru which comes with fragility.
We get "stubbies".  Is that a shortened assembly, cups and all?

Then there is gas lensing!

At least for now, I am checking out what it tales to have a water-cooled torch. It would be something involving plastic tubes, an aquarium-type pump, and some kind of radiator. I expect @DavidR8 may be considering a similar research 

I can already guess that water cooling comes with the built-in assumption that it is always associated with  bigger kit (bigger than WP-17). What exactly is the difference between WP-17 and WP-18?
I see for the first time, designation "SR-20", and water-cooled "NR-9"

Water cooling seems to revolve around WP-18, and WP-20. Does one use separate forward and return hoses? Can one get coaxial water hoses? Already, the loved flexibility is being traded off against the need not to burn the hand!


----------



## G-ManBart (Apr 26, 2021)

Water cooled torches typically have the power cable in the line that returns hot water from the torch and a cold line that goes from the output of the cooler to the torch, so yes to separate lines.

Prefixes on torch model numbers....CK, WP, etc are just brand/style identifiers, not sizes.  The common air-cooled torch sizes are 9-series, 17-series and 26-series going from smallest to biggest.  Common water-cooled torches are normally 20-series and 18-series going from smaller to bigger (yes, backwards from air-cooled).

The interesting thing is that the 20-series torch is the same size as a 9-series, so much smaller than even the 17-series and yet it can handle 250A.  I'm running 20-series torches on two machines (one is 210A max and the other 310A max) and they never even get more than a touch warm.

For general hobby use I think you'd be hard pressed to find a better combination than a 20-series setup....small enough to get in tight spaces, but can handle some pretty serious amperage.


----------



## graham-xrf (Apr 26, 2021)

Again - thanks much for all the straight info.

Indeed, I was surprised that the "20" was so small, and that the "18" was bigger. The times I would get into welding aluminium fatter than about 3mm would be rare, and the welder is rated 200A, but I think the times one would be using 200A would also be few and far between.

I was thinking that if the torch (say a WP-17FV) got so hot it was getting hard to hold, even through a welding glove, then internally, there would be rubber and plastic parts starting to burn up.

I do like what I have discovered about the 20 series setup so far. Also, I note that one gets a much better deal if the whole water-cooled bundle is purchased at the same time.  I am now trying to get some idea of the costs. Provided these are not stratospheric, then a water-cooled 20 series does seem to be the sort of kit one need only purchase once, and expect it to serve all I ever expect to do with it.


----------



## General Zod (Apr 26, 2021)

the 17 and 26 use completely different fittings.   Also the internal conductor within the superflex cables are different sizes.  So no, you won't be able to switch torches back-and-forth.

The difference between a 17 and an 18 is the 17 is an air cooled torch, rated at usually 150A.  The 18 is a larger water-cooled torch, rated usually at 350A.

The difference in the names, as was stated, are just there to mix you up.  In terms of physical sizes, for the most part:

WP9 = WP20  (for some odd reason, some people may call a 20-series a "water-cooled 9").
WP26 = WP18  (similar to above)

The 17 has no equivalent in the water-cooled realm, generally speaking.  That's because the 20 and 18 cover a very wide variety of needs.  No need for something in-between.

"Does one use separate forward and return hoses? Can one get coaxial water hoses?"

The coaxial aspect is with the conductor and the hot water return.  The cool water cannot be coaxial with the hot water return, for it would negate proper functionality and cause a heat-exchange between the two. The heat exchange should naturally occur at the cooler.

A 20-series is all most would ever need.  I use a weld-tec i-head Roto-head, but CK sells them as 'flex-loc's.   110% awesome.  You can even change the head style to your liking:  Either with the small 9/20 series consumables for smaller size, or the larger 17/18/26 consumables for a more robust package.


----------



## General Zod (Apr 26, 2021)

graham-xrf said:


> The times I would get into welding aluminium fatter than about 3mm would be rare, and the welder is rated 200A, but I think the times one would be using 200A would also be few and far between.



Just try welding even 3mm aluminum with less than 150A on the start up.  We'll be expecting a post soon after about how you're having issues welding aluminum. 

See it ALL the time on the welding forums.  It is the #1 problem for new welders attempting aluminum.  Same thing happened to me.  Thinking you can weld 3mm aluminum with something ridiculous like 75-100A.  Even with just 3mm alum, you need to POUR on the power, especially on the start-up.   In the end, it all adds up to a smoking hot (air cooled 17 torch), that can get hot enough to damage the silicone hose material right at the fitting as it starts to heat up from the thermal transfer.  Ask me how I know.


----------



## DavidR8 (Apr 26, 2021)

General Zod said:


> Just try welding even 3mm aluminum with less than 150A on the start up. We'll be expecting a post soon after about how you're having issues welding aluminum.
> 
> See it ALL the time on the welding forums. It is the #1 problem for new welders attempting aluminum. Same thing happened to me. Thinking you can weld 3mm aluminum with something ridiculous like 75-100A. Even with just 3mm alum, you need to POUR on the power, especially on the start-up. In the end, it all adds up to a smoking hot (air cooled 17 torch), that can get hot enough to damage the silicone hose material right at the fitting as it starts to heat up from the thermal transfer. Ask me how I know.



Been there, done that. Briefly though so didn’t cook my torch.


----------



## Asm109 (Apr 26, 2021)

If Al welding is in your plans you NEED a HW20 water cooled torch.  Once you use one you will never want to use an air cooled torch again, for anything.


----------



## graham-xrf (Apr 27, 2021)

Asm109 said:


> If Al welding is in your plans you NEED a HW20 water cooled torch.  Once you use one you will never want to use an air cooled torch again, for anything.


I hear ya - and I agree!
After binge-watching YT on all things TIG torch related on YT, and taking the good advice and explanations from @General Zod, I now think the best choice that matches my needs is a 20-series water cooled, even if I have to save up for it! The excellent pictures from @General Zod are also much appreciated.

To some extent, I am "future-proofing". The 20-series can handle a very wide range, and is small and handy. Lay on top of that things like "flexible", etc, and we end up looking at the CK range. The China imports come much cheaper - but likely less flexible in the cables/hoses.

One thing to keep in mind is that the presence of water cooling in WP-20 kit has meant that the build quality and design around some brands got scaled to heavily depend on it. The amount of conductor wire gets reduced to something smaller than could reasonably handle (say) 200A without the water. The size of the torch, and the internal constructions also have to have guaranteed water

*Coolant failure!*
To have the cooling pump fail, or forget to turn it on, will scorch everything immediately! You need closed cycle pure distilled water, likely with corrosion inhibitors, or one of those non-aqueous coolant fluids, and a flow sensor with interlock to stop the TIG if anything to do with coolant integrity is compromised. If you are adding water-cooled kit, expect that it needs with it's own control kit box, and this extra is non-optional!

Of course, this would be my initial purchase, hence all this research and discussion, for which I have to thank you all very much.
@Janderso  and @DavidR8 will have purchased TIG kit already, and may be up to their ears in cables and hoses. Very clearly, in everything I have found, folk who have invested in 20-series water cooled kit have not regretted it. For some, it has made the difference to have TIG become their favourite weld choice method.

Here is a very useful video, with lots of actual welding, illustrating how all the torch sizes and types behave.


----------



## DavidR8 (Apr 27, 2021)

TIG is definitely my favourite welding process. I'm out of practice because I don't do it every day though.


----------



## slodat (Apr 27, 2021)

I have a water cooled Weldcraft (before Miller bought them) water cooled Crafter with a Coolmate 3 cooler on a Sycrowave 180SD. I’ve had it over ten years and it’s great. 

On my Primeweld 225 I have the CK 17 air cooled that came with it. I plan to add the same Crafter water cooled setup that’s now made by Miller.


----------



## ericc (Apr 27, 2021)

A water cooled torch is great, especially for aluminum, but don't let the lack of one stop you from getting started and practicing a bit.  You might be able to score a 17 size torch for less if you see it on craigslist or ebay.  The thickest aluminum I have welded with my 17 torch is 1/4", and it gets hot fast.  You need tricks to make it work.


----------



## graham-xrf (Apr 27, 2021)

ericc said:


> A water cooled torch is great, especially for aluminum, but don't let the lack of one stop you from getting started and practicing a bit.  You might be able to score a 17 size torch for less if you see it on craigslist or ebay.  The thickest aluminum I have welded with my 17 torch is 1/4", and it gets hot fast.  You need tricks to make it work.


My choice was the CK 20 on 4m of cable. It's on it's way.  
I am, of course, nowhere near fully equipped yet. I need the cooling system. I need some "consumables"

I do not intend to simply pipe chlorinated tap water through it and lead the warmed water into the garden. Now it is time to figure out flow rates, pressures, and whatever it takes to make that happen. I know I can rig up an effective cooling system, but at this stage, I start by looking for a unit that would connect to the pipes. So far - a surprising absence of them (UK).

Tungsten is tungsten - an element. So is lanthanum. So here we start asking, what exactly is Lanthanated Tungsten?
A straight alloy of tungsten and lathanum? Perhaps not! It is something called "lanthanum oxide doped tungsten". It seems the powder oxide is mixed into the tungsten, then the combination is sintered together.

I think I get it that the oxide lanthanum in the tungsten lowers the work function, very like thoriated tungsten, but without the radioactivity. You can do it with Cerium and Ytrium also.

2% (ish) lanthanated rods in a couple of sizes, I guess.


----------



## General Zod (Apr 27, 2021)

2%La Tungsten is a great all around choice for AC and DC.  So is 2% Ceriated which I'm liking more and more.  Then there is the CK LaYZr (Lanthanum-Yttrium-Zirconium) mix,  and THEN there is the HTP QUAD tungsten with FOUR small alloy additions!    And of course the tried "tri-mix" purple or E3 as it's sometimes called.  All of them work pretty good, some favor arc starts, some favor higher amperage.  Of course Thoriated is great for DC, sucks for AC, IMO.


----------

