# Would someone kindly take a look at this lathe for me?



## Christine 1953 (Apr 11, 2017)

Hello newbie Chris here,

I was wondering if I could get an opinion on this lathe. Seems like the price is right. I've been looking for a SB 9", but I'm a little concerned about buying used, as I pretty much know nothing about them.  The only experience at metal working is a few semesters in High School and that was a long time ago... Right now just looking for a machine to get started on that has the essentials. $1500 is pretty much my limit.  Any help would be most appreciated

Thank you,
Chris
http://www.grizzly.com/products/8-x...768?utm_campaign=zPage&utm_source=grizzly.com


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## brino (Apr 11, 2017)

Hi Chris,

First, Welcome to the site!

Second; while I do NOT have direct experience with that lathe I have a few comments.

It does look like a great entry level model. In many ways similar to an older SouthBend, but all shiny and new with some warranty!
Also, Grizzly should have parts for a number of years if you need them.

It should give you enough of a step into "at home" metal working and provide capabilities for years to come. 
Then if you ever need something larger, you will have learned what your specific needs are.

With the current sale on you would have some money left for more tooling.
Many folks would want a quick-change tool post (QCTP), likely an AXA size would fit.
I have this one on my SouthBend 9":
http://www.kingcanada.com/detail/tool-post-kit-KQCT-0012/625?cid=147&mid=10
and it works well.

Best of luck, and please let us know what you decide!

-brino

PS: By the way, I bet someone else with direct experience on this model will be by shortly to add their knowledge.


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## fradish (Apr 11, 2017)

What do you want to do on the lathe?   I would list out what you want to do and see if that
lathe has the features you want.

After a quick look, here are some of the features it has and others that it doesn't that might influence
how easy it will be to do certain operations:

1) I don't see a quick change gearbox (QCGB).  This means if you want to cut threads or change your feedrate
    you'll need to change out gears.  You mentioned a SouthBend 9".  A 9A or 9B had a QCGB the 9C did not.
    If you don't see yourself doing much threading, or aren't put off by swapping out gears, this might not
    matter to you.
2) I think feeds are only possible via the lead screw.  Again, if you want to change your feed rate
     this involves changing gears.   Some lathes have a separate feed rod allowing for slower feed rates and
     less lead screw wear.   Like #1 this might not matter that much to you, it depends on what you want to do.
3) An 8x16 would be fine for smaller work, but the 16" is generally the center-to-center distance.  That can
     get eaten up quickly when you add a chuck and a tailstock drill chuck and bit.  If you're mostly interested
    in producing parts that fit into that work envelope, then this could be a good match for you.
4) It has variable speed which I like.  I have found when I am parting off I will increase the speed as I get
     closer to the center of the work to keep up my surface feet/minute up as the diameter decreases.
5) It has a knob for feed reverse.  That is a nice feature to have.  With my SouthBend and my PM1228,
     I have to change that by going inside the gear cover.
6) It is a new lathe with a fair amount of accessories (3 and 4 jaw chucks, faceplate, steady rest, centers, etc...). 
     In my opinion this can be an advantage over an older lathe which may not come with all of the attachments
     and where finding them may be difficult.
7) This lathe has a slightly larger than 3/4" through bore on the spindle.  This is about what
the SouthBend has.  This means that anything larger than around 3/4" won't pass through
the spindle.  This may not be a big deal, but it was one of the things which bothered me with
my SouthBend.  Being able to pass larger work through the spindle means you don't have to
saw off longer stock (within reason) when you work on it.

Finally if you have an older lathe you might need to spend some time doing some work on it.  I have a 1939 SouthBend 9C
which I like because it was my Dad's, but it is almost 80 years old and needs some attention.  I recently bought a PM1228
which is a much tighter machine but even with that I had to do a few minor tweaks.   But the SouthBend needs to really be
stripped down and rebuilt at this point.  Not to say you couldn't find an older lathe in really great condition, but it might
be difficult and it would probably take time.


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## markba633csi (Apr 11, 2017)

One nice thing I noticed on that Grizzly is how they put the compound gib/screws on the side facing you.  Many lathes put them on the "wrong" other side. 
A small thing, but an improvement in my opinion.
Mark S.


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## Nogoingback (Apr 11, 2017)

Welcome to the forum Chris.

I have no experience with Grizzly lathes, but I had a look at their site.  Another machine you might compare with this one is the G4000 9 x 19" lathe.  It has a little more swing, more bed length and comes with a quick change
gear box and more tooling for only a little more $$$.  It isn't variable speed which is a bit less convenient, and the bottom of the speed range is a bit faster, but overall it seems to have  some  advantages.  It also is 
a bit heavier, which in lathes is a good thing.  Grizzly generally has a good reputation for customer service.  

If you're just getting started, you'll need to budget for other tools as well: calipers or micrometers, drills, cutting tools for the lathe etc., etc.   When I got my first lathe a few years ago I bought a batch of High Speed Steel insert type 
lathe tools from Arthur R. Warner Company (http://www.arwarnerco.com) and I'm glad I did.  Some people may advise you to learn to grind your own tools, which is a very valuable skill.  But in the beginning, starting with 
tools from Warner will help you get going easily without having to learn another set of skills right away.  They are dirt simple to sharpen as well, and a grinder isn't required.  High speed steel is also somewhat easier to 
live with for beginners when compared with carbide.  One of their 5 piece turning kits and a boring bar would get you started nicely.


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## markba633csi (Apr 12, 2017)

I'd take the variable speed over the quick change gearbox. It's so handy.  And you won't be doing a lot of threading right away probably.
Also do keep an eye out for a cheap used bench grinder at a yard sale or on Craig's list.


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## Silverbullet (Apr 12, 2017)

Add my welcome to the site. For your first lathe it should work well for you. If you really get bit by the machining  bug. You 'll soon be looking for other machines to go with it.  There's a few on craigslist selling a nice mill and more. So keep looking there when your ready for more. May I just add please wear SAFTEY glasses , no loose clothing or rings , keep your hair up if long. Machines don't care what they grab and can hurt for a lifetime.


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## Nogoingback (Apr 12, 2017)

Chris,  in case you didn't notice, there's a Grizzly Industrial sub-forum on this site that should be helpful in evaluating their lathes.  Also, if you have an idea about the kinds of projects you
plan on working on, it will help in recommending a machine.    Don't hesitate to ask more
questions.  And yes, in general a machine like that would be fine to start with.


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## Christine 1953 (Apr 12, 2017)

Hello Everyone,
Thank you so much for the warm welcome and wealth of information. You all bring a nice complementary mix of viewpoints to the table and the time you took to contribute is much appreciated.

I think either one of these machines would really work well and is probably a really good starter machine because of 1, I'm a beginner, and 2, the machine will probably behave.

So now I'm armed with ideas and I'll need a day or two to take this all in, and probably will generate more questions!

Again, Thanks so much for the help, and I'll be in touch soon!

All the best,
Christine

PS Feel free to chime in if any other ideas come up.


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## mikey (Apr 12, 2017)

fradish said:


> What do you want to do on the lathe?   I would list out what you want to do and see if that
> lathe has the features you want.



Christine, let me add my welcome to the site. 

Fradish has the right of it. It is helpful to decide what your goals are before spending money on a machine. If you just want to dabble in this to see if you'll like it or if you only plan to work on the smaller end of things then you should look at high quality small lathes. Sherline comes to mind here, and there are many research and prototype labs that agree. On the other hand, if you intend to work on larger pieces then you need to look for lathes that will enable that. Much of the time our machines are used to enable or support other hobbies or lifestyle needs so look at the other things you do and envision how the machine will support those activities and that will tend to push you toward a smaller or larger lathe. 

My best advice is to take some time to define your needs and then look for machines that will meet those needs. The guys will then be able to tell you about the nuances for those machines.


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## Paxx (Apr 16, 2017)

I was also a noob many years removed from my high school shop classes and just recently  went through this process of trying to decide if to buy a new 8x/9x lathe or find a decent used machine. I looked long and hard at the very same Grizzly lathes that you are considering for many of the very same reasons as you. All the while, which spread over a period of a couple months, I also kept checking the local Craig's Lists and Kijiji searches for lathes that might come available for a great deal. I'm glad that I did that. I was able to get my hands on a mid 70's Standard Modern 11x20 Utilathe in immaculate condition. It is a solid 1300 lb lathe with V way, separate feed screw with power cross feed, and QC gearbox. Also has a QCTP and came with a selection of tools with it. So far I do not wish I had variable speed and one of the 1st projects I undertook had me threading several different threads. I like that it has a through spindle of 1.375 and I spin D1-3 fitted chucks etc. The best part is I picked it up for $800 Cnd......... ($600 us).

Having said all this, I also may have been just as happy if I had gone with one of the new Grizzly's instead. Hard to say. I just know that I don't regret at all the fact that I bought a good used machine. I have had a great re-learning process with it and have made what my family has rated as "some really cool stuff."

Good luck in your search and decisions Christine.


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## Tozguy (Apr 17, 2017)

Welcome to HM.
Your dilemma is familiar to me. I bought a new lathe a few years ago but had found it daunting to choose where to start. My needs were based on what I wanted to learn. I went with the largest lathe (12x36) that I could install alone and that would fit the space available. I also chose to get as much basic equipment and accessories  included as possible (except for cooling system and lighting) for the lowest price. The guarantee on a new lathe was reassuring. There was no particular use or work required of the lathe from the outset but I wanted a QC gear box, power feeds and thread cutting capability. My attitude was to write off the money as an investment in learning but it took a bit more $ than expected. Every step was a fun learning experience (installing, using, discovering shortcomings and correcting-upgrading the lathe, etc.) It took a while for me to start discovering everything I could make instead of buy.  I was not in a hurry and enjoyed every minute of it. The folks here at HM were and are a great help.
Looking forward to reading about how you proceed.


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## Christine 1953 (Apr 17, 2017)

Hello Everyone,
Lots of really good information and insight. As I'm looking around it only seems to generate more questions, but here's a couple of things that are a little clearer. I still really like the idea of buying an older US made machine, but I'm open to anything at this point, and I especially Paxx's comment to heart, that finding a good fit is really important. One project I want to make at some point is a pizza sheeter.  (Pizza making is a long term hobby of mine). If you don't know what that is, it's the machine you feed the dough through to produce a very thin crust pizza. Kinda looks like a wringer from an old wringer washing machine.  The two rollers should be 20 inches across ideally plus an axle on each side that is around 2 in.each for the bearings, sprockets etc.  So I think I'll need a little bigger machine to do this. Other than this all I have on my plate at the moment is to make an awesome T-Square fence for my saw. Really I just need a decent machine to learn the basics, and if I find I need more, I'll buy something else. I also feel I'd like a machine with lots of hands on, so if I have to change gears by hand I see that as part of learning a new skill. Same thing with variable speed.
So that being said, I found a couple of lathes and I'd love to hear what you think about them. here they are...

Thanks for hanging in there, and I really appreciate and enjoy your insight, comments, and support!

All the best,
Christine

http://www.machinetoolonline.com/PM1030.html



And, I thought this looks interesting, although it's a little more than I wanted to spend...

https://rockford.craigslist.org/tls/6081738050.html


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## 4GSR (Apr 17, 2017)

That South Bend lathe is not worth nearly the money they are asking for it.  Plus, it has moderate to heavy bed wear in my opinion.  It's well tooled and thats just about it. That one only has about 21" of center distance, not really enough for what you need.  If you going to spend that kind of money and need to be able to handle around 30" between centers, look at one of the 14 x 40" lathes out there.


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## Paxx (Apr 17, 2017)

Christine........concerning the 2 lathes you posted I agree with Ken about the SB. It looks in pretty rough shape to me.......well........ at least for the money being asked for it. If looking for a used machine I would keep looking. Precision Mathews has made a great name for themselves with the machines, both lathes and Mills, that they put out and the service that they provide to their family of customers. I've been kinda eyeing one of their Milling machines.  I am sure the PM1030 would meet your needs for a long time to come. 

As for used, there are really good machines that come along for decent money, but it takes checking the ad sites everyday and responding to them quickly. I watched for months and when my Standard Modern came along I had to jump on it or lose getting it. Here's what mine looks like for $600 US.


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## Paxx (Apr 17, 2017)

PS...........I forgot to mention that the thing that the SB has over the PM lathe is......mass. I love my heavy machine. Things are flat and level and there is absolutely no flex in it at all. While 395 lbs may sound heavy for a machine in a shop, in my slimmest of experience with different machines, I have seen machines of even up to that weight develop resonance vibration and lose squareness from having a shop cool down or heat up too much. So far my heavier machine is still true.


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## TakeDeadAim (Apr 18, 2017)

Welcome Christine, you and I are not far apart!  Im just south of Hartford.  I don't think you could go wrong with the 1022 from Quality Machine tools, all the extras are with this machine so your outlay for a quick change tool post and such need to be factored in.   If budget is more critical and it were me Id give up the variable speed, and power cross feed for the quick change feed gear box on this model in the same price range.
http://www.grizzly.com/products/11-...72Z?utm_campaign=zPage&utm_source=grizzly.com

 In either case having a good idea of what you want to do with your new lathe is a good place to start, using that to help decide which features you want/need really helps clarify your choices. If you want to see some of the lathe features first hand you are welcome to stop by my shop and I can show you what does what are and how they might effect your decision.

In general, used machines go for high prices in our area.  I looked at both lathes and milling machines for quite some time,  I was trained as a machine tool rebuilder so spotting condition is something I am pretty good at, and I finally bought new as I felt it was a better value, especially when you consider if you want a project before you start to work on the things for which you are buying your tools


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## Nogoingback (Apr 18, 2017)

Hi Christine,

The question of whether to buy a new machine vs. old American iron is a sort of never ending topic around here with advocates in both camps.  The old machines were generally very well made, but most of them are getting pretty gray around the muzzle: my Logan is 73 years old. SO they tend to become projects in their own right.   Unless you are very lucky and find a relatively unworn machine, tooled up and ready to go in your price range, you'll spend time and $$$ 
getting the machine up to speed.  Some folks enjoy that.  Will you? and do you have the mechanical skill to work you way through an older machine?   Depending on the brand, getting parts can be problematic for old machines as well.  If your goal is to just get to work and start learning to make parts a new machine is a better choice in my opinion.  

PM machines have a good reputation and are a step up from a Grizzley.  The folks that sell them have a good reputation for customer service as well.  You might consider posting on the PM sub forum to learn more about them.


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## Uglydog (Apr 18, 2017)

Christine 1953,
Just saw your post on looking for a lathe.
I've got a 1947 Powermatic (Logan) 10" which I will be selling as I still have 4 lathes and need the space.
She has a completely rebuilt headstock with OEM bearnings, not the cheap stuff.
The bed is perfect.
She has a QCGB, collet system, 3 jaw, 4 jaw, chip pan, heavy shop made stand with drawer system, live and dead centers, spindle and tailstock chucks, metric change gears, the original lantern tool post and Armstrong holders, in preparation for resale, I've just added a vintage Armstrong piston QCTP, I still need to make or buy tool holders, I'm also finally fitting the taper attachment.

I'm just NW of Mpls. I really want to find her a good home. If this is your first lathe I'd be excited to help you explore her features and potential. Delivery might be negotiable if you don't have a way to haul her.

Daryl
MN


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## rtp_burnsville (Jul 20, 2017)

I have a SB 9A (also have a 7x10) and it is very over rated by the masses IMHO......  My SB 9A came from the original owner, had scene very little to no actual use and it still needed lots of TLC just to make is usable.  The addition of a VFD, and QCTP greatly helped in making the lathe usable rather than a boat anchor.    I think either the Grizzly or the PM posted above would be just as capable or better than the SB less the hassle of finding a used machine worth dragging home.   

Robert


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## TakeDeadAim (Jul 20, 2017)

Robert, I would tend to agree.  I think when you look at the quality of new machines in the market. Modern features, warranty available parts and accessories the prices are reasonable and (if you do your homework) quality is good.

There is a romance some have with old machines and there is nothing wrong with that.  Most however need some work and simply don't have the features of newer machines.

I think for some the decision comes down to buying a tool that you want to restore as part of your hobby or buying a machine, that with the addition of tooling, will let you pursue your hobby.

For me I wanted tools to make parts not a machine which required repair so I could pursue my hobby.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## RHayes (Jul 20, 2017)

Like so many, I started out with a South Bend 9".  I got a lot of use out of it but never liked the tiny bore through the headstock.  Just saying, you might want to consider what  the bore through the headstock allows or prevents you from doing.


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## Eddyde (Jul 20, 2017)

TakeDeadAim said:


> Robert, I would tend to agree.  I think when you look at the quality of new machines in the market. Modern features, warranty available parts and accessories the prices are reasonable and (if you do your homework) quality is good.
> 
> There is a romance some have with old machines and there is nothing wrong with that.  Most however need some work and simply don't have the features of newer machines.
> 
> ...


That's true to a point. However, most secondhand machines don't need any repairs at all and work just fine, straight away. For many it's the only way to get a quality machine at an affordable price.


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## Mikebr5 (Jul 20, 2017)

Brand new machines sure look pretty.   If I were to be gifted a brand new machine I'd hide it out in the woods for a few years so that it became a rusty challenge. 

I kid, I kid. Kinda. I like the new tools. ... and love the old tools. 

I occasionally get stuck deciding on a purchase if it is in a new area to learn- Analysis Paralysis. 
If I get stuck for too long I put the few top choices in a hat and pull one out. Take the plunge and learn on it. Adjust from there.


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## woodchucker (Jul 20, 2017)

markba633csi said:


> I'd take the variable speed over the quick change gearbox. It's so handy.  And you won't be doing a lot of threading right away probably.
> Also do keep an eye out for a cheap used bench grinder at a yard sale or on Craig's list.


I strongly disagree. I use my gearbox way more often than I change speeds. Yea, I only have 3 high and 3 back gear speeds, but the feed rate is always changing for roughing vs finishing. So I change the gears so often.

To me change gears would be a cumbersome pain in the rear.


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## woodchucker (Jul 20, 2017)

RHayes said:


> Like so many, I started out with a South Bend 9".  I got a lot of use out of it but never liked the tiny bore through the headstock.  Just saying, you might want to consider what  the bore through the headstock allows or prevents you from doing.


I have a 9 and I too struggle with the small bore.
While I like the machine, it is a problem.


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## bss1 (Jul 20, 2017)

I also started out with a South Bend. First an old worn  9" that I fully restored (except for 50+years of wear on the ways) and then a like new 10K. I really like the look and simplicity of the South Bends and the American heritage, but.. if I knew then what I know now I think it would have been better to start out with a new or more modern machine. Don't get me wrong the South Bends were great machines and all but some of the features like the screw on chucks, small through bore, felts, and leather drive belts that were typical on these smaller swing lathes I found to be frustrating and/or limiting.  I guess a lot depends upon your budget and what level of used equipment may be available in your area.  At any rate you have to start somewhere and very few drivers start off with a Ferrari as their first car.


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## Hozzie (Jul 20, 2017)

I started in a similar situation as you and my experience has been as follows.  Keep in mind I had no previous lathe experience, but am very mechanically capable.
I debated new vs used and all of the normal questions asked.  I liked the idea of having an old machine as well so my first machine ended up being a South Bend Heavy 10.  I ran it before buying and it worked well.  I like a project so I decided to refurbish it and change the felts, etc and in the process stripped it to the metal and put it back together.  That all went good.  I added a VFD to it and it worked well.  I had it for 6 months.    I sold it and just bought a new "chinese" machine.
You may ask why.  First, as much as I think the lathe was working perfectly, I was just never 100% sure.  I was always questioning something and I agree with the above that the screw on chucks were kind of a pain.  The basic reason for all of it, inexperience and not knowing what was right and not right (which I don't think was anything).

I bought a brand new, albeit much bigger Chinese machine because 1) quality, even Chinese is 100 times better today than it was 30 years ago.and 2) I know that I am starting with a machine that should be working perfectly at the start (ok, nothing is guaranteed, but you get the idea).  I will not have that lingering thought of should it be making this noise?
My view on it is, unless you have someone who you know personally that knows lathes well, I would go new.  As much as this group is great with giving advice, what is clear for them is not as easily clear to someone with no experience.  I would recommend buying bigger than you think you need, but I believe you will be happier going new and having the piece of mind of a warranty. 
I am getting a Precision Mathews 1440GS, so a lot bigger, but I have one of their Mills as well.  I highly recommend their products for quality and value.


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## machPete99 (Jul 20, 2017)

The quality of the Chinese machines really jumps up a bit when you get into the 12" lathes; I understand that the price may be an issue.
I started out with a mini-lathe but it needed a lot of work before it became a semi useful machine.
Now that I have a 12" (old American iron) the mini-lathe sees little use, although it was needed to get the big lathe up and running.
You will take a beating on the resale value of the smaller lathes.


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## TakeDeadAim (Jul 20, 2017)

Eddyde said:


> That's true to a point. However, most secondhand machines don't need any repairs at all and work just fine, straight away. For many it's the only way to get a quality machine at an affordable price.



Not in my area, I looked at many used vertical mills and found none that did not need some level of work.  Those used ready to run Bridgeport mills in this area command a premium.   Ive a friend in machine tool sales and his experience is that the decent ones end up at employee home shops or people otherwise connected to ownership.

I looked at an "excellent condition" SB heavy 10 a few weeks ago that needed a motor and a carriage gearbox rebuild.   A very clean Grizzly surface grinder had a non negotiable price $500 below new and the magnetic chuck activation arm was frozen in the off position.  The unit was sealed in epoxy.

I hear stories of these clean used machines all the time but have yet to find one.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## ezduzit (Jul 20, 2017)

Look for a quality used lathe in excellent condition with a comprehensive set of tooling. Bigger/heavier is better. I found my 12" x 35" Logan 2557V (with several boxes of tooling) plus my Index Super 55 mill for $2,000.


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## Splat (Jul 20, 2017)

For a newbie who's been in your shoes, Christine, I would definitely buy a new machine. If you don't know enough about a lathe (or mill, etc.) then you can definitely get burned buying used because you don't know what to look out for. If you have an experienced person that will evaluate a machine in person then you have a resource to take advantage of. However, with a new machine there's a better chance that you'll have less to worry about from the beginning. If you happen to find something amiss with the new machine you can always call tech support or get warranty work done. That Grizzly G0768 is a nice little machine but I would highly suggest their *G0602* model instead. A lot of folks have that machine and love it. I think there's a Yahoo group dedicated to it. That is the minimum amount of machine I would go with. Variable speed is nice but I'll take a QCGB (quick change gear box) over variable speed any day. You can always change over to a variable speed setup down the road if you feel you need it. Start saving up now....for all the tooling you'll want down the road. Often the tooling winds up costing much more than the machine they're for!


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## BROCKWOOD (Aug 2, 2017)

A Pizza Sheeter!  Never knew the name of it.  We had & used 1 daily back in 1980 as I worked through college.  Sure, making rollers on a lathe is a given.  But have you considered the gears?  That is horizontal mill & dividing head territory right there.  As I recall, the housing & cover plates are a thick sheet steel.  Cutting the contours on the sides to meet the front covers is easy with a band saw.  Adding bearing blocks to those sides can be done by hand, but you want it to run true.  Yep, need a vertical mill to ensure accuracy.  No need to mention that your rollers & exit tray must be made of food quality stainless. I admire your goals & will gladly buy your 1st Stromboli; but feel you would best be served by a used pizza sheeter. 

I believe the logical start for inquiry is simple:  Do you want to build stuff in a machine shop or build pizza?  I for 1 cannot imagine recreating a proper dough sheeter with even the Grizzly G0773 combo lathe / mill that I started with. It is double your budget.  Now, I would gladly pay up to $800 for a decent used pizza sheeter.  It is within your budget & refurbishment is a snap!


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## Downwindtracker2 (Aug 13, 2017)

Those colours on the little PM, are the factory colours of  XIMA. mmm interesting . Here is my post on buying one.  http://www.hobby-machinist.com/threads/why-no-small-high-quality-lathes.9570/page-6 My son really likes it.


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## Aukai (Aug 14, 2017)

Christine I am doing the exact same thing here, I had been looking at the G0602 Grizzly, and the PM 1030. After long searches, and asking here I am over budget, but will be getting a machine that will keep me happier longer. I have made budget purchases for other items that worked, but ended up having to get something of better quality in the long run. It's good to start with a fixed budget, but you may have to bite the bullet, or save a little bit longer to be happier in the long run. I will be buying a PM machine. My discussion is here....
http://www.hobby-machinist.com/threads/looking-at-2-lathes.61043/


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## BogusSVO (Sep 5, 2017)

Christine, Aukai, seems like all 3 of us are in the same boat and thinking of the same lathes.

After being on this forum for just a couple hours, and a night of looking at youtube
also finding out that "Matt" from Precision Matthews hangs out here, and offers a 3 year warranty even tho the price is a few hundred more than the Grizzly G0602

I will have to say the PM-1030V is at the top of the list, and seems most likely  the one I will get

At this point only 2 things would push me away from it
one, I come up with an extra grand to spend, then I would step up to the PM LB lathe
two, one heck of of a deal on a used 12 or 14 swing machine falls in my lap


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## Aukai (Sep 5, 2017)

The new batch of lathes are in country per Matt, not sure what is free to sell, or what is already sold, but you may be able to get one now.


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## juiceclone (Sep 5, 2017)

If u look up "sumore tools" in Shanghai, most of that pattern  are made by them.  That said mine still runs good and does what i need.


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