# Almost lost everything I own today



## alloy (May 8, 2021)

Was in my shop working on my nova and my wife came in mad as hell.  She came out and smelled smoke and walked to the side of my shop and the neighbors yard and a piece of plywood was on fire just 10 ft from the side of my shop and house.  The plywood was up against their little garage and flamers were 10ft in the air.  She grabbed a bucket of water we have for the dog and threw it at the fire and that give her time to go get the hose.  Their kids (boy and little girl) were standing there watching it and she yelled at them go go get their parents.

Their mom came out ****** at my wife.  Didn't even say anything to the kids.  The dad came out and it turns out the kids got a torch out of the back of his pickup.  We have the kids on video earlier in the year coming over and trying to door to the shop to get in.   Showed them the video and nothing happened.  We also have them coming over and getting on some exercise equipment my wife has on our patio.   Nothing happened then either.  We don't blame the kids, we blame the parents.

We aren't sure what to do.  This was serious and they don't seem to care.   Wife want to get more cameras for the shop door and side of the shop towards their house.  I don't think camera will stop them.  They don't give a damn.


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## Nutfarmer (May 8, 2021)

Glad someone was on the ball. That could have went very bad very quickly. Quick action on your wife's part saved a lot of damage and grief. Your thought that you could have lost your home is correct. This is just an observation from over thirty years of fire fighting. Thank God your wife was on the ball. When things go wrong they happen quick. Happy there was only minimal damage.


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## Z2V (May 8, 2021)

Good to hear that there was no major damage to your property 

You could bring it to the attention of the local fire marshal and the police department.
Make formal complaints with photos. You can’t have too many cameras. I have 10 

Hope you can resolve the problem and still have a good relationship with your neighbor


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## vtcnc (May 8, 2021)

Z2V said:


> Good to hear that there was no major damage to your property
> 
> You could bring it to the attention of the local fire marshal and the police department.
> Make formal complaints with photos. You can’t have too many cameras. I have 10
> ...


I'd send everything to the local authorities. This neighbor doesn't appear to care about themselves or their kids let alone you, your wife or your shop.


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## Braeden P (May 8, 2021)

How old are these kids! I bet their parents tell them to and reward them in some way what makes someone do that! Your local authorities might not help long story short my dads work truck was stolen crashed into a gun-store they did barely anything the person who was investigating went on vacation and nothing happened we heard nothing back from them.


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## SLK001 (May 8, 2021)

Of course, had you let the fire burn (and used the water hose to keep _*your*_ shed safe), the neighbors would have been burned out and they would no longer be a problem.


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## Flyinfool (May 8, 2021)

Arson is serious, especially if the parents condone it. I would get the local police involved. Once the kids actions start hitting the parents in the wallet they will have more interest in controlling their kids.

You already tried to be nice and that did not work.


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## rabler (May 8, 2021)

Another option in addition to the police is to contact whatever the Washington state’s version of child and family services.  They can press various  legal penalties against the parents for these type of things.  Doing this can be even nastier than filing police reports, as family services can press for fostering the children

Unfortunately, the only real way to win this is to move away.  Anything you do is just likely, at least in the short run, to cause more incidents.


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## alloy (May 8, 2021)

My wife thinks the boy is around 8 or so, the girl is probably 5-6.  We are thankful it rained yesterday.  If not it would have been all over.  No way to control it with our hose.

As an afterthought I kinda wished there had been more damage to their structures.  Maybe that would have been a wake-up call to them.  But my wife did the right thing and put the fire out.  If I were them I'd buy my wife something really nice for her quick thinking and actions.  I'm going to take her out to a very special lunch tomorrow (yes I know it's mothers day also) but I want to treat her to something special.  She's just wonderful. Works her butt off and takes good care of me and our home.

We have discussed turning them in, but as rabler said we can't win this. It will escalate into something more serious.  I'm not going to move.  I worked years to buy this place and get a shop.  I'm not going to let the ******** neighbors run us off.

This brings back how I felt seeing the pics on here from the california fires and the devistation it caused and how it affected peoples lives..  I didn't think I coud be threatened with something like that, but apparently I can.  And fire season is just about to ramp up again.


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## Ken from ontario (May 8, 2021)

I also think escalating the bad situation is not in your best interest in the long run, I do believe the neighbors must already feel defensive about the whole ordeal .


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## markba633csi (May 8, 2021)

If there are any abandoned houses or sheds in the neighborhood that will be the next thing to go up when the kids start playing with matches and riding around on their bikes looking for mischief
Let's hope they don't start a big grass fire
-M


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## kb58 (May 8, 2021)

You know, "sometimes" the opposite tact works. One time we came home and there was a neighbor kid standing next to our backyard pond. Instead of yelling at him, I quietly asked where he lived, then said that he can come visit the pond anytime he wants, as long as we're home. "Maybe", if you invite the kid over to see what you're doing in your shop, it could defuse the entire situation.

Maybe.


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## strantor (May 8, 2021)

I wish I had something positive to say. Some helpful hint. But I don't. I have the same problem with some neighbor kids and parents (no examples as bad as yours) and I still haven't figured out how to deal with it. 

The 13 y/o boy I have video of him prowling around my property on multiple occasions. He didn't take or damage anything, but he didn't look like he was there to clean up or fix anything either. It was kinda weird, maybe he was just bored? The conspiracy theorist in me says he was casing the place.

The 8 y/o boy has thrown rocks at my shop, chipping the paint, and thrown rocks at my cameras, and sprayed my cameras with a can of superlube I left sitting by the door. My inner conspiracy theorist tells me that he did this at the direction of his older brother after I presented video evidence of his trespassing, although the the events were far separated on the timeline. He probably thought I was inside and was just escalating his attempts to get my attention. He's obviously starved for attention and intrigued by what I do in there. If I don't lock the door he'll walk right in and start asking 1000 questions and moving levers on my machines, pushing buttons, walking across metal chips in bare feet, etc. Usually I can get him to leave by handing him a broom and telling him he can stay if he does something useful. He knows I have a video surveillance monitor in there and I can see if someone is outside.

These kids live with their grandparents as their father is in prison and the mother is prowling the streets of Houston selling herself to fund her vices. The grandparents don't have the vigor (and/or, I think, the interest) to control 4 feral kids. Well, 3 are feral. The oldest, 15 y/o girl is the only responsible parent in the house. When I confronted the grandparents about the 8y/o tampering with my cameras, the oldest girl was the one who immediately scolded him on the spot. All I got from the grandparents was a half-hearted apology and a feigned promise to "do something about it." Same response I got each of 3 times their dog got out and killed several of my chickens.

The other kid I have trouble with is actually my nephew. My sister lives down the street from me and she is 100% sold on this "new style" of parenting. Ask the child nicely not to do bad things, try to reason with someone who has an undeveloped capacity for reasoning, explain to them why they shouldn't dig holes in other people's years and throw mud at their windows, and expect that they'll feel remorse and be hesitant to do do it again, ignoring the 18,000 times that didn't work in the past. No less than a dozen times He's taken the keys to their golf cart and rutted up my yard. 

There is no way (that I've found) to deal with these people. They either don't care (like my neighbors) or they do care but they're true believers in NOT doing anything (or not doing anything effective) about the problem (like my sister). There is absolutely nothing to be done about the second group. You can't dissuade a true believer and you can't criticize someone's parenting style without doing more harm than good. Combine those two things into one issue and it's unsolvable. I'm 100% convinced of this.

The first group (people who don't care), well, they don't care. You could help them to care by getting the law involved, but that's more likely to just make them hate you and do everything in their power to pass you off. In my experience, the people who don't care are the low quality human specimens who would devote more energy to irritating you than they would to fixing their own glaring deficiencies. 

So, unless someone here has better advice, all I can offer is my own coping mechanism, install cameras for the worst case, and then bury your head in the sand hoping for the best case. Maybe talk to the kids, not in a scolding manner, but as a friend, as an example figure. Try to get them to look up to you. You shouldn't have to do this, but maybe try being a supplemental friend/parent figure whose approval they seek out. They would be less likely to cross if you that way. It's a suboptimal suggestion but it's the best I've come with after years of pondering.


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## Ulma Doctor (May 8, 2021)

unfortunately we can't make people care about what we care about.
the parents of the lil duo had bad parents too, i'll bet $50.

locked gates and 8ft fences make for good neighbors.
a menacing breed of dog will keep all but the stupidest from entering your property
(don't put up a beware of dog sign, if the dog bites, your knew the dog was a liability- no sign= plausible deniability )


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## vtcnc (May 8, 2021)

OK, the issue is boundaries. I have an ex sister-in-law story that I cannot go into. It is at least five years long. However, I called it from the beginning with her - trouble was dripping off from her. Here is what I did EARLY on, in the protest of my other in-laws despite their protests and appeal to me to be "nice" and not to "jump to conclusions".

The FIRST time she did something that either was criminal or borderline criminal: violence, theft, lying. I clearly stated what MY boundaries were with her. 1) Not allowed to be in house, 2) Not allowed to be around my kids alone, 3) No, don't ask to get together.

For about three years, I was the villain. I patiently waited for her to systematically violate everybody in the family. She got us once, around year two or three and I had set the boundary. I then watched her violate the rest of family for a few more years before they finally wised up, never setting any boundaries.

Tell the kids and your neighbors in as plain language as possible the following: there is NO trespassing on my property. Anything that looks like criminal activity WILL get reported to the authorities and tell them who you are going to call. Then when it happens, make good on your promise. You have to do this or they will keep doing it. They don't know what boundaries are, having never learned them. You are doing them a favor.


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## extropic (May 8, 2021)

Sorry for your troubles.

Absolutely contact the authorities and get the incident on record while there is some evidence to be seen.

You were lucky this time. Consult an attorney. The situation is very possibly going to continue escalate.


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## jbobb1 (May 8, 2021)

vtcnc said:


> Tell the kids and your neighbors in as plain language as possible the following: there is NO trespassing on my property. Anything that looks like criminal activity WILL get reported to the authorities and tell them who you are going to call. Then when it happens, make good on your promise. You have to do this or they will keep doing it. They don't know what boundaries are, having never learned them. You are doing them a favor.


This.
If you don't follow through, you become a joke.
Unfortunately, some people have to feel if they won't listen.


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## alloy (May 8, 2021)

I think we are in a no win situation.  Damned if we do, damned is we don't.   We are thinking of splittng off our hose with a t fitting and just leaving it by the side of my shop.  Wife had to unwind the hose from the new hose minder she just bought.  Took time to do that.  I'm glad it was her that saw it, after my stroke I can't move that fast anymore and the outcome could have been much different.  The guy repairs ATV's, snowmobiles, watercraft, and boat motors and I'm sure he has flammables in the little garage.

There was one abandoned house  on the street, but it was torn down and a new is being built for the last year or so in it's place.  The poor old guy comes everyday hoping someone will show up to work on it. I feel bad for him.  Sits in his pickup and waits.

Thankfully there are no open fields near us.  But there is a vacation home across the street.  The owners come every summer, except last summer because f the pandemic.  Hopefully they come this year.  I have seen the kids over there before.  And somehow "magically" their fence got hit hard by a car I'm assuming.  And the strange thing is the damage is directly across from the neighbors driveway.  But they swear they didn't do it.  Go figure  

We call them the "redneck" neighbors.  Nothing wrong with a redneck, but from the garbage pile in their font yard, to the overwhelming smell of pot smoke, and their lack of parenting skills they deserve some kind of derogatory name. I have another name for them, but it's not politically correct.

View from my side of the fence 5 minutes ago.

Did I mention the dump is 5 minutes away and is free to residents in my small town?

Did I also mention we also feed their cats?   They were starving and I can't let that happen not when I have the power to save lives.  The one stays over here all the time now.  He gets food and love.  I can't let him in the house because they would see him through the windows and I'm sure he doesn't have any vaccinations and could spread something to my pets.



And d


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## NC Rick (May 8, 2021)

I like the high road and taking a positive approach but have also had good results with the opposite.  In our old neighborhood some kids stole a toolbox out of our garage.  I wasn’t  sure who did it but i was pretty sure and saw them sitting on the curb one day when no one else was around.  They were young teenagers and i was no angel at that age…. I had words with them about them never needing to worry about me calling the cops or talking to their parents should i catch them.  I went into some colorfully worded, vailed hints at the problems which may occur should such an event ever happen.  Funny, never saw those kids near me or our house for the rest of my years there.  I hope they may have also reconsidered their actions in future due to the odd possibilities of running into some really crazy vengeful person ;-)

in the case of your neighbor kids parents being uncaring and not providing the parental guidance all kids need, assuming that was your plywood, they would receive a letter in about a day from my attorney (who is a good friend) suggesting they deliver a brand new piece of plywood along with  an apology or need to consider the full legal action with regards to property damage and arson being addressed.   Couldn't be friends with those kind of neighbors anyhow.

maybe inviting the kids over to build bird houses would work but to me is sounds like becoming the surrogate roll model for them could be quite the time consuming project.  Id chose you spend that effort on my own grandkids


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## NC Rick (May 8, 2021)

I think it was a very early ”Saturday night Live”. Where the importance of “neighborhood nuclear superiority“ was discussed.


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## Shootymacshootface (May 8, 2021)

Ulma Doctor said:


> unfortunately we can't make people care about what we care about.
> the parents of the lil duo had bad parents too, i'll bet $50.
> 
> locked gates and 8ft fences make for good neighbors.
> ...


I totally agree. The only thing that you can do right now is secure your property with fencing, visible signage, and cameras everywhere. If this continues and you have evidence of it, take legal action. A dog is a great idea!


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## alloy (May 8, 2021)

That is their plywood and garage.  My shop sits 10 feet from it, and my house beside the shop 10 more feet away.


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## MrWhoopee (May 8, 2021)

I wish the only danger to my property was my neighbors, none of whom I can see from my house. Living in the middle of a forest, kids living ten miles away (or some fool driving to Reno) can burn my house down.


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## sdelivery (May 8, 2021)

Flyinfool said:


> Arson is serious, especially if the parents condone it. I would get the local police involved. Once the kids actions start hitting the parents in the wallet they will have more interest in controlling their kids.
> 
> You already tried to be nice and that did not work.


I would like to add to this by saying this is a building block to prove things in the future, be sure to document it with the authorities that includes children's services


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## sdelivery (May 8, 2021)

alloy said:


> That is their plywood and garage.  My shop sits 10 feet from it, and my house beside the shop 10 more feet away.


Damn it just occurred to me ...that's a 65.00 dollar sheet of plywood!


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## markba633csi (May 8, 2021)

Sorry to hear about the starving cats too.  I'm real sensitive about animals being abused.  Good on you for feeding and caring for them, they'd probably rather be living with you than them
-Mark


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## sdelivery (May 8, 2021)

This is tough stuff to deal with BUT many of these kids are starving for REAL attention,  this includes failure and hurt.
I have given some time to some boys/young men that if left unchecked would have cost me grief.
Even the boys that weren't interested in working on stuff became friends that at least halfway respected my property and kept others from mischief.
All walked away with a little self respect after they accomplished a task and  I would tell them they learned and experienced something no one can take away from them, they know how to do something.


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## kb58 (May 8, 2021)

The "mean old man yelling 'get off my lawn'" has always provided entertainment to neighborhood children, and the consequences of escalation need to be carefully weighed. Yelling at kids just makes them want to do it more. Things can get really bad, like your mean guard dog suddenly dying for suspicious reasons, or stuff happening to your car from afar (like having the windows shot out). Both situations may not be solved by having cameras, so yeah, actually inviting the kid over to talk about something neutral, or showing him how to make something, can vastly improve things by defusing any future activity he and his buddies might be entertaining.


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## Braeden P (May 8, 2021)

An 8 year old boy can have crazy ideas and they will love playing with fire but what makes someone do that that’s just crazy a fence sounds like a good idea


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## Dave Smith (May 8, 2021)

alloy said:


> I think we are in a no win situation.  Damned if we do, damned is we don't.   We are thinking of splittng off our hose with a t fitting and just leaving it by the side of my shop.  Wife had to unwind the hose from the new hose minder she just bought.  Took time to do that.  I'm glad it was her that saw it, after my stroke I can't move that fast anymore and the outcome could have been much different.  The guy repairs ATV's, snowmobiles, watercraft, and boat motors and I'm sure he has flammables in the little garage.
> 
> There was one abandoned house  on the street, but it was torn down and a new is being built for the last year or so in it's place.  The poor old guy comes everyday hoping someone will show up to work on it. I feel bad for him.  Sits in his pickup and waits.
> 
> ...


I look at your delema and see how you wish it would get better by the neighbors solving your situation. I have found that the best way to solve problems to your satisfaction, is to solve them yourself. your wife didn't like your neighbors cat hungry so she fed it and was happy. telling her neighbor to feed their starving cat would not had been as effective for the poor cat. you have to solve each problem that bothers you yourself, so you are sure it is solved. you cannot make others solve the problems that bother you. you can present you and your wife as nice caring neighbors to their kids and their parents for good examples  to admire and be glad you are their neighbors. my advice is for you and your wife to eliminate your concerns, and not to expect the neighbors or their kids to fix what is bothering you.
Now the route you take will help the children in the long run and the present. I spent many hours daily in my shop explaining to the neighbors nosey little girls--6 and 3 years old--what each of my machines were for and what they could do---at least a million questions each time they came over. yes it was time consuming for me at times but they needed a lot of questions answered and their folks were busy on other things and I was there. I fixed all their broken toys when they asked me for help and they were fun to watch grow. now they are in their twenties and have their own lives to cope with. they still remember fondly how nice and friendly their neighbor was in their younger years. their memories of my shop full of machines and tools are still fresh in their minds.
as far as the trash you show in your picture that bothers you can be fixed real easy and not much of your time.  first off, realize that it may not bother your neighbor as much as it does you and maybe other neighbors. I see a lot of good wooden pieces in the bed items that you could salvage for craft projects. ask your neighbor if you can have them and also tell them you are taking a trip to the nearby dump and would be happy to throw his stuff on your trailer or pickup. sure it is a little work for you but remember you said the dump was close and free. now you solved your problem easily and didn't have to involve your neighbor at all. years later you and your wife will be highly thought of the good neighbors their kids will remember. I realize it would be nice if all neighbors were up to all of our expections, but that is not the case and we will never know why not. the best we can all do for our neighbors and their children is to pray that Jesus will come into their lives to solve their problems;  and for you and your concern about fire-- is to pray for your protection. it has worked for me all my life, and I have no fear.
Dave


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