# Did Logan put shims under the headstock?



## duffman1278 (Mar 7, 2022)

Like my title says, did Logan put shims under their headstocks? I took my lathe apart to rebuild it and noticed that there was a 0.005" shim under one corner of the headstock on the flat sides. I'm trying to figure out if someone who owned the machine before did this or if it was from factory.


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## woodchucker (Mar 7, 2022)

They may have to get the machine in spec? No telling now.  Let's assume someone knew what they were doing.  Run a precision rod in a collet and see.  Measure from front and top.


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## benmychree (Mar 7, 2022)

No reputable manufacturer would use shims to correct alignments; having said that, I have personally done so to correct for taper on a couple of lathes that I have owned.


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## Shiseiji (Mar 7, 2022)

FWIW. I've had two Logan's and  been following Logan information for going on 6 years now. Have not once read of factory shims.


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## Clipper (Mar 8, 2022)

duffman1278 said:


> Like my title says, did Logan put shims under their headstocks? I took my lathe apart to rebuild it and noticed that there was a 0.005" shim under one corner of the headstock on the flat sides. I'm trying to figure out if someone who owned the machine before did this or if it was from factory.


I  had an  820 years ago that had been  bolted to a concrete floor and it had shims under the back left corner of the headstock.  I asked about it on the Logan forum  and received  some not so nice answers.
The machine came from a machinists estate so I can only guess the shims were for headstock alignment? Don't remember the thickness..


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## duffman1278 (Mar 10, 2022)

I leveled the machine with a starrett 98A, put the headstock back without the shims and I cannot for the life of me get the taper less than 0.004" over 5.5". I haven't tried putting the shims back in but I'm starting to consider it.


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## wa5cab (Mar 11, 2022)

That is one of the first things that I would have tried.


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## HiltzVW (Apr 4, 2022)

I have restored two Logans - a 922 and a 6560. Neither had any shims under the headstock. I vote with the others that this was definitely something the lathe acquired along the way.


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## Oldvetteman (Aug 2, 2022)

duffman1278 said:


> Like my title says, did Logan put shims under their headstocks? I took my lathe apart to rebuild it and noticed that there was a 0.005" shim under one corner of the headstock on the flat sides. I'm trying to figure out if someone who owned the machine before did this or if it was from factory.


Have you checked to see if shims were added between the tailstock base and the upper casting?  If yes, I'll give you a possible reason why.


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## benmychree (Aug 2, 2022)

Oldvetteman said:


> Have you checked to see if shims were added between the tailstock base and the upper casting?  If yes, I'll give you a possible reason why.


It's called wear down.  Mostly shims would be added under the vee ways at each end of the headstock on opposite sides to eliminate taper, this by lazy people who don't want to go to the trouble of scraping to alignment, count me in their numbers. I have seen lathes with over 1/8"of shims between toe top and bottom of the tailstock, and as much wear down under the saddle, not fun to get acceptable work out of.


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## Oldvetteman (Aug 3, 2022)

My previous post was a bit cryptic, so I'll elaborate.  When I added an AXA QCTP to my Logan 10" lathe I found that the 1/2" indexable tool holders that came with the QCTP sat slightly too high on the compound, even when adjusted all the way down.  Not wanting to buy an additional set of 3/8" indexable tool holders, I decided to raise both the headstock and the tailstock by approximately .040" using shims.  This would lower the compound in relation to the headstock and tailstock.  This solution worked fine and enabled me to align the tool holders correctly on the work piece.  After I got my Rockwell mill I decided to fix the problem by removing the shims and milling .050" off the bottom sides of the tool holders, lowering the cutter.  Again, this worked as hoped for and I was much happier with the solution.  

So if you find that a 10" lathe has shims under BOTH the headstock and tailstock, a previous owner might have employed the same fix that I did for a "too high" AXA QCTP, especially if the lathe is Logan/Montgomery Ward.  This problem with AXA tool height is apparently fairly common.


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## wa5cab (Aug 4, 2022)

I have never understood why this was such an issue with so many people unless one already had a BXA QCTP and a bunch of BXA holders and no ready market for them.  Or a drawer full of unused assorted 1/2" square cutter holders.  Or both.  The AXA was obviously designed for 3/8" square cutter holders as the row of four set screws are centered 3/16" from the vertical wall of the slot.  The price differential for both holders and cutters is usually substantial.  And if the machine was designed for AXA running BXA to the limits will shorten its life.


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