# Tips on Removing This Bolt on Case 480F Backhoe



## tjb (Aug 18, 2022)

The hydraulic cylinder on the left upper controI arm on my backhoe needs to be re-built.  Below are some pictures.  The bolt and nut that hold the top of the bracket are locked solid - I can't get the nut to budge.  I sprayed it regularly for several days with penetrating oil and tried every trick I know to loosen it.  No luck.  My last resort was a pipe wrench with a two-foot long pipe extension and pushed on it with the bucket on my excavator.  Nothing.  That thing's on tighter than the seatbelt on Chuck Berry's 'baby beside him at the wheel'.

Any suggestions?

Regards


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## savarin (Aug 18, 2022)

I see no reason for it to be but could it be a left hander


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## Just for fun (Aug 18, 2022)

Do you have a torch?  If so, concentrate the heat right on one of the flats of the nut, and be somewhat quick about it so you don't heat the bolt up also.  Then before it cools try and loosen it.


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## Nutfarmer (Aug 18, 2022)

Heat just the nut with a torch hot enough for the paint to discolor. If that doesn’t work cut the nut off with the cutting torch. If careful you can just cut the nut saving the shaft. No cutting torch. Grind off the nut


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## keeena (Aug 18, 2022)

If you have a heavy duty impact gun: that's what I'd try first, swapping between loosen and tighten would hopefully knock it free. But I assume if you had one that you would have already tried that tho.   So after that I agree with the other guys: OA torch to help free it or cut/split the nut w/ a zip disk.

Also - I'd clean up any burs on the bolt before smashing it thru; don't want to ruin the bearing (unless you're planning on replacing). On that note: you may need/want an air hammer to push that bolt thru.


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## Firebrick43 (Aug 18, 2022)

Your the guy who puts the pipe wrench teeth marks on the equipment I have worked on!

You know they make 3/4" drive ratchets with 42" handles.  I have a snap on but wrights railroad ratchet is pretty good as well.  I have slipped a 6' pipe over mine and stood on it without bending anything. 

Don't do that with an SK or a craftsman 3/4 ratchet or you will just bend the handle on the sk and explode the head on a craftsman.


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## tjb (Aug 18, 2022)

savarin said:


> I see no reason for it to be but could it be a left hander


Already thought of that.  Definitely right-handed thread.

Thanks


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## MrWhoopee (Aug 18, 2022)

Split the nut with a zip disc. If necessary, split the nut AND the bolt.


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## Martin W (Aug 18, 2022)

I hear you. I own a 850 Case Dozer, so I sympathize with you. 
Heat it up and then use a 3/4” impact. Bigger tools,  and heat are a must!

Martin


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## pontiac428 (Aug 18, 2022)

Scarf the nut off with a torch, grind the dross off, and pound it out.

Don't want to scarf?  Push the bucket down and lift the front wheels up a bit to load the pivot in order to hold the bolt shaft tight while wrenching.  A rented 1" hydraulic impact would be nice, those can do 2500 lb-ft.  Your bolt is small potatoes compared to the big stuff.

I've done a lot of this work.  There are a few ways to get it, long as you don't make a mess of it by beating too hard with too small of a tool.


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## SLK001 (Aug 18, 2022)

tjb said:


> ...My last resort was a pipe wrench with a two-foot long pipe extension...


First off, use the proper tools.

A socket with a breaker bar with a two foot? - no, try a six or eight foot extension to break it loose.


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## pontiac428 (Aug 18, 2022)

I have a 48" inch-drive breaker bar that is rated for a 6' cheater, and believe me, even that has its limitations.  That's why the service truck for the yellow iron has an auxiliary power unit and a hydraulic impact on board.


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## Gaffer (Aug 18, 2022)

Have you tried using an impact wrench, giving it a quick hit clockwise and then counterclockwise? Rinse and repeat, over and over and over. This has worked well for me on stubborn nuts and bolts.  It also helped me discover a left-hand thread I didn't expect to find. Years ago was removing all the wheels on my 70 Cuda. All but the left front came off easily except the left front. After applying penetrating oil, I used this technique, and off it came with ease - the first time! A previous replaced the studs with left threads!


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## Manual Mac (Aug 18, 2022)

Gas Ax


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## great white (Aug 18, 2022)

Torch.

You can also try a trick I use for really rusted bolts on vehicles. And I mean rusted to the point where you can't even tell if it has threads or not.

Heat the nut red hot, then quench with water. It shocks the nut/bolt and breaks it loose. I've yet to come across an exhaust stud or other rotten nut and bolt that that technique wont work on.

I've never tried it on such a big fastener before though.

I'd say a lot of your problem is the tools you are using. The heavy equipment mechanics use obscenely large tools for reason......


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## Just for fun (Aug 18, 2022)

I swear it doesn't look that bad, lots of heat in one small location, quickly so you don't heat the bolt.  Hopefully you have an air wrench and a socket.  If not, I hope you at least have a big socket and breaker bar.  Last resort a boxed end wrench.  If all you have is a box end wrench you can take another box end and slip it over the open end of the first wrench and extend it a bit.   Give that box end wrench a test run before heating it up.


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## great white (Aug 18, 2022)

Just for fun said:


> I swear it doesn't look that bad, lots of heat in one small location, quickly so you don't heat the bolt.  Hopefully you have an air wrench and a socket.  If not, I hope you at least have a big socket and breaker bar.  Last resort a boxed end wrench.  If all you have is a box end wrench you can take another box end and slip it over the open end of the first wrench and extend it a bit.   Give that box end wrench a test run before heating it up.


Double wrenching isn't going to do it. He's already tried a pipe wrench and a 2 foot cheater....


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## Just for fun (Aug 18, 2022)

great white said:


> Double wrenching isn't going to do it. He's already tried a pipe wrench and a 2 foot cheater....



I meant after heating it up.  The only reason I said to try it first was just to get a handle on how it all goes together.  So, he doesn't fumble around with the wrench's when the nut was hot.


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## great white (Aug 18, 2022)

Just for fun said:


> I meant after heating it up.  The only reason I said to try it first was just to get a handle on how it all goes together.  So, he doesn't fumble around with the wrench's when the nut was hot.


I still wouldn't double wrench that. heck, I wouldn't double wrench anything. Double wrenching is a crap shoot at best. It's just as likely to go flying off into the stratosphere as it is to give more leverage.

Never double wrench, it's just not a safe practice. It's a short cut instead of using the proper tool for the job.


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## pontiac428 (Aug 18, 2022)

Guilty, I double wrench sometimes... if it's smaller than a 1/2" bolt head.  Never larger, doing it at all is bad enough.



great white said:


> I've never tried it on such a big fastener before though.


It works on 3" lug nuts for sure!


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## great white (Aug 18, 2022)

pontiac428 said:


> Guilty, I double wrench sometimes... if it's smaller than a 1/2" bolt head.  Never larger, doing it at all is bad enough.
> 
> 
> It works on 3" lug nuts for sure!


I'm no saint either, but I avoid it as much as I can...more than one instructor (vehicles and aircraft) has beat it into my head many many times....


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## tjb (Aug 18, 2022)

Removed the other cylinder a few months ago using the exact same tools the exact same way.  Challenging, but it worked.  This afternoon, I used a four foot section of thick wall square tubing with the pipe wrench.  That moved it, but only along with the bolt.  A friend of mine has a 1" impact wrench.  We're going to try that next week  I will try heat first.  Might get lucky.

And thanks for all the ideas you guys have sent.  Sooner or later, something will work.

To be continued...


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## tjb (Aug 18, 2022)

Three habits I've developed over the years:
1.  Never throw anything away.  You never know when it might come in handy some day down the road.
2.  When working on a piece of equipment, ALWAYS buy more hardware than you need.  Make sure you get both longer and shorter bolts, and extra nuts, washers, etc. because you never can tell when the job may call for something a little either way of what you think you need.
3.  And when the project is completed, don't take the extra hardware back for a refund.  As in Habit #1, you never know...

Well, these habits have paid off in a big way.  I wanted to give myself a warm-fuzzy that what I'm dealing with is indeed 1" bolts, right hand thread, so I went to the barn to measure.  I knew I had some 1" hardware somewhere, so I went down to the shop to take one or two with me for size comparisons.  And look what I found:




The hardware on the backhoe is indeed 1", and they are 5-1/2" bolts.  I have two 1" x 6" bolts, three 1" nuts, and one flat washer - all brand new that I kept from several years ago when working on another piece of equipment.  The extra half-inch won't interfere with anything, but if it does, I can machine what I have down to 5-1/2".

I will try again tomorrow to remove the nuts with heat and/or the 1-1/2" box wrench in the picture, the four foot square tubing and the excavator.  If that doesn't work, I'll cut them off and be done with it.  Probably wouldn't hurt to put new hardware on anyway.  The most I'll be out is one flat washer, but the ones on the backhoe will probably be fine.

Think I'll sleep a little better tonight.

Regards


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## tq60 (Aug 18, 2022)

Big chisel and biggest hammer that you can find.

Place chisel in line with the bolt across center of a flat.

Use a vise grip or better extended vice grip to hold it.

With sledge hammer give it a good and solid whack.

The chisel should but a dent in the nut which will stretch the side of the nut.

Repeat on other flats.

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## tq60 (Aug 18, 2022)

We had pin on back hoe that bonded I place, would not come out or turn.

Had to cut with sawsall and place cylinder in mill to drill out pin, pain but done.

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## tjb (Aug 18, 2022)

tq60 said:


> Big chisel and biggest hammer that you can find.
> 
> Place chisel in line with the bolt across center of a flat.
> 
> ...


That's worth a try.  Thanks.


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## Chewy (Aug 19, 2022)

tq60 said:


> Big chisel and biggest hammer that you can find.
> 
> Place chisel in line with the bolt across center of a flat.
> 
> ...


That is a method I used in the field.  I would suggest that you heat the flat with a torch first.  That soffens the metal at that point and allows it to strech or crack and expand.  They actually make nutcrackers on this principal, but the cold chisel works better.


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## tjb (Aug 19, 2022)

Rained out today.  Got out there long enough to get wet.  They're saying we may be out of commission for a couple more days.

I'll post when weather permits.

Thanks for all the input, guys.  Something will work.

Regards


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## tjb (Aug 20, 2022)

Mission accomplished!!

tq60, you're a genius!  Never heard of that method before, but figured it's worth a try before resorting to heat and impact which would be a royal challenge to get to where the backhoe is parked.

I'm not sure I did it according to your instructions, but I used my biggest chisel, a large pair of vise grips, and the heaviest dead blow hammer I have.  Then I used the same 1-1/2" box wrench, 4' piece of heavy gauge square tubing and excavator I had tried earlier.  Worked like a charm!  First three pix are the upper bolt.  Last is the lower bolt.

Thanks, and go get yourself a beverage of your choice on me.  You earned it.

Regards


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## mmcmdl (Aug 21, 2022)

That's what I call a good size cheater bar !


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## tq60 (Aug 21, 2022)

You did it different from instruction but it worked!

What you did impacted against the nut possibly causing it to shift maybe and possible expansion.

The normal place is on the flats where the wrench goes, either war it stretches the nut and makes it bigger.



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## tjb (Aug 21, 2022)

mmcmdl said:


> That's what I call a good size cheater bar !


Yep.


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## tjb (Aug 21, 2022)

tq60 said:


> You did it different from instruction but it worked!
> 
> What you did impacted against the nut possibly causing it to shift maybe and possible expansion.
> 
> ...


Okay, now I see what you meant when you said "Place chisel in line with the bolt across center of a flat."  I read 'in line' as meaning 'parallel' to the bolt; but now I understand that you meant 'perpendicular' but as close to dead center diameter as I could get.  In the grand scheme of things, I'm glad I misinterpreted.  It's hard to tell from the photos, but it would have been near impossible to get a good whack on every face of the nut doing it that way.  I very likely would have walked away frustrated because I couldn't reach every face.  But anyway, it worked; and I'm a happy camper.

Thanks again, and enjoy your beverage of choice.

Regards


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## tq60 (Aug 21, 2022)

You usually only need one or 2 faces.

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