# Mt2 ==> Mt3 Adapter (step Up, Not Down)



## tfleming (Oct 6, 2016)

Has anyone ever used one of these?  I was given some NOS MT3 Cleveland twist drills, and my QC54 tailstock is MT2.  I know I'll have to keep the feed rate down, but I expect this should be fine.

Comments?  Experience?  Thoughts?


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## stupoty (Oct 6, 2016)

My old lathe had an MT2 tail stock, the step up adaptor i have was rediculously heavy and long, although that was quite handy for some difficult situations when I neaded more reach to get over the sadle it never felt totaly groovy maybe a little prone to sagging, and made the tail stock more difficult to slide up and down the lathe bed because it wanted to tip forward when the nut was lossened.

If you have a lot of drills might be worthwile though .  My old lathe was a 9x20 so the tail stock wasn't massive and the addaptor i have is quite long.  I was thinking of getting a 3 to 2 sleve for it to use just as an extender in my mt3 tailstock 

Stuart


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## tfleming (Oct 6, 2016)

Thanks Stuart, that is what I am thinking as well.  The set starts at 0.500 and goes to 1.000 by 64ths.  I couldn't believe the guy just gave them to me.....he was going to throw them in with a pile of scrap he was taking to the salvage yard  .  They were all still in the wax wrap and boxes.........ie. NOS.


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## stupoty (Oct 6, 2016)

tfleming said:


> Thanks Stuart, that is what I am thinking as well.  The set starts at 0.500 and goes to 1.000 by 64ths.  I couldn't believe the guy just gave them to me.....he was going to throw them in with a pile of scrap he was taking to the salvage yard  .  They were all still in the wax wrap and boxes.........ie. NOS.



Thats a pritty awsome score,  

Drilling big ish holes might be ok as the size of the drills will help suport it a bit.

My main droop issues were with using an Mt3 chuck  and center drills , being taper shank you will be a good deal shorter than that and you will already have a starter hole for the drill to centre in.

Stuart


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## roadie33 (Oct 6, 2016)

I have one I use on my 12" Craftsman Commercial Lathe and works great.
I only have a few of the MT3 Larger Drills but they come in handy when drilling the 1" or over holes.


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## brino (Oct 6, 2016)

...and don't forget you may be able to use them in your drill press too if it has an MT-taper with a stub arbor for the existing 3-jaw chuck.

I was given a bunch by a guy who said he couldn't use the taper shank type.......until I showed him how to remove it from his drill press.




from here:
http://www.ereplacementparts.com/article/3425/How_to_Remove_and_Reinstall_a_Drill_Press_Chuck.html

-brino


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## tfleming (Oct 9, 2016)

Thanks guys.   I have already taken the chuck out of my drill press, and it is MT2, so this adapter will have to be used on it as well.


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## kd4gij (Oct 9, 2016)

Another option would be to turn the shanks down to MT2


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## 4GSR (Oct 9, 2016)

kd4gij said:


> Another option would be to turn the shanks down to MT2


Either that or turn down the shanks to 1/2" or 3/4".  I have a near full set of drills from 1/2" to 1" that most of them were turned down to 1/2" shank.  Back years ago when S & D shank drill bits were not as popular as they used to be in the beginning, we always took taper shank drills and turned down the shanks to some dimension as 1/2" and used them that way. Ken


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## tfleming (Oct 9, 2016)

Interesting thought.  So, can someone answer this.  These are HSS and no doubt heat treated.  Wouldn't the MT3 taper have to be ground vs. machined?  I would also think that so that the finish is appropriately smooth as well.  I have a Dumore tool post grinder, so I could certainly consider that.  I have already purchased the MT3==>MT2 adaptor, so that part is complete.  Obviously, there are options.  I think at this juncture, I'll kick the tires on the adaptor.  If it mis-behaves, I'll look into possibly grinding the MT3 to MT2.   That is definitely a cold winter project......


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## 4GSR (Oct 9, 2016)

tfleming said:


> Interesting thought.  So, can someone answer this.  These are HSS and no doubt heat treated.  Wouldn't the MT3 taper have to be ground vs. machined?  I would also think that so that the finish is appropriately smooth as well.  I have a Dumore tool post grinder, so I could certainly consider that.  I have already purchased the MT3==>MT2 adaptor, so that part is complete.  Obviously, there are options.  I think at this juncture, I'll kick the tires on the adaptor.  If it mis-behaves, I'll look into possibly grinding the MT3 to MT2.   That is definitely a cold winter project......


The shanks on all drills including one's with Morse tapers on them are somewhat soft.  They are not hard.  You can cut on them with most cutting tools.  Just don't get carried away.  You could work harden them in the process of cutting on them.  Grinding on one of them would take all winter to do just one.  Ken


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## tfleming (Oct 9, 2016)

Ok, I just learned something, which is always a good thing.  Thanks Ken.  So, the shank end on these has been center drilled where the tang is.  3 jaw on the headstock, and live center on the tail stock to hold these puppies?  I also have the taper attachment for the lathe, so getting the MT2 taper should be straight forward.  I am thinking that the approach might be to turn them down, and get them close, then take a finish pass with the Dumore with a fine stone.  Should give a nice finish on them.  I could also turn them, and use fine emery paper as well for the final polish.


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## 4GSR (Oct 9, 2016)

When you chuck up on the drill, try to bit on it right there past the flutes next to the tapered shank. That's the only place you can grip the drill bit and get it running true in the chuck.  And yes, the center in the end of shank will help in alignment too.  Word of caution, the tang on some drill bits are slightly hard but you can still cut on them.  No need to grind a nice finish on the taper shank, just use some emery to polish it a little.  What you are going to be doing at first is getting the taper attachment set to cut the proper taper.  No matter how close you get it, it's almost impossible to get it perfect.  Just shoot for the larger end of the taper grabbing in the socket and get it as close as you can get it.  If you have a spare No. 2 Mores taper socket, cut the tang end of the socket off, debur, and use this for a gage.  Also use it for blueing the shank and making impressions with.  Have fun! Ken.


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## 4GSR (Oct 9, 2016)

Here's a picture of some that I turned down from no. 4 MT to no. 3 MT.  One thing to keep in mind, these bigger drills don't stay locked in on the taper and tend to spin.  I've had to use certain wrenches to hold them in place to keep the drill from spinning.  Ken


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## brino (Oct 10, 2016)

@4gsr : Hi Ken, 

For an MT-2 taper you'd likely not have enough compound/top-slide travel to allow this, and would need the taper attachment.......but just trying to understand the process of copying an existing "sample" taper in general.

I have never done it, but from thinking about it can you set the top-slide or taper attachment to the proper sample taper angle like this:

mount your sample taper (an MT-2 shank drill bit, in this case) and chuck it up as stated above using the tailstock centre in the shank end hole
put a dial indicator in the lathe tool holder adjusted so the tip is at the lathe centre line height

with no taper attachment: adjust the compound/top slide angle until the indicator sweeps the length of the sample taper with near zero offset (using top slide feed)

with taper attachment: adjust the taper attachment angle until the indicator sweeps the length of the sample taper with near zero offset (using carriage feed)

chuck up one of the "oversize" drill bits and take cutting passes until the minor and/or major diameter equals that of the the target MT-2 shank
Thanks for any feedback.

-brino


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## 4GSR (Oct 10, 2016)

brino said:


> @4gsr : Hi Ken,
> 
> For an MT-2 taper you'd likely not have enough compound/top-slide travel to allow this, and would need the taper attachment.......but just trying to understand the process of copying an existing "sample" taper in general.
> 
> ...


Brino,
That is exactly the way I did mine. 
Ken 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk


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## Chipper5783 (Oct 10, 2016)

Hi tfleming, very good score on a set of larger drills.  I suggest caution with using good sized drills in the tailstock.  As other have pointed out, this can be hard on the tailstock (many tailstocks do not have a slot for the tang and rely on the taper - not good if it spins, also hard on the little drive key or the slot).  You could certainly add a torque arm.  I believe a better option is to hold the drill in the tool post.  Many tool post systems (i.e. Phase II) will offer a MT holder.  You can also make a block, bored for MT, that you can hold in the tool post.

Drilling from the carriage is very nice, you can rapidly clear chips, you get power feed and the length is reduced.  The MT2 ->3 adapter will work fine in the drill press.


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## bfd (Nov 6, 2016)

my frejoth lathe came with a number 2 mt. but when I went to grizzly in Washington I found a number 3 mt spindle that fit my tailstock so I upgraded to a larger spindle in my tailstock. the only problem I had with the upgrade is that the anti rotation pin in the tailstock bore would not take the increased load so I had to remove the pin and broach a keyway in place of the pin this worked to handle the increased rotational load. bill


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