# Replacement Oxy/Ac hoses



## sophijo (Dec 1, 2012)

Got a HF Oxy/Ac torch and hoses. I read that the hardware was Victor and OK. The hoses have "checkered" after a couple years....when I bend them there are cracks up and down the outer hose material. I'm assuming that's bad and want to replace them and need your recommendation for good hoses.
Regards
Dave


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## 7HC (Dec 1, 2012)

sophijo said:


> Got a HF Oxy/Ac torch and hoses. I read that the hardware was Victor and OK. The hoses have "checkered" after a couple years....when I bend them there are cracks up and down the outer hose material. I'm assuming that's bad and want to replace them and need your recommendation for good hoses.
> Regards
> Dave



Victor are a good quality brand, I'd be surprised if HF hardware was genuine Victor.  

As for your hoses, I'd suggest going to your local welding supply specialist.  
Take your old stuff with you and have him evaluate it.


M


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## v7guy (Dec 2, 2012)

welding supply will probably set you up with a real good pair of hoses,  you might be able to get the name brand stuff at one of the big box stores and there's always harbor freight. I do believe they sell replacement hoses.


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## GlenF (Dec 2, 2012)

I got a O/A set of Victor type torches from discount store 25 years ago. The hoses cracked after the second year. Got quality replacements from a welding supply store that have lasted over twenty years now. I would avoid getting replacements from HF, they are just going to crack again. It's worth a few extra bucks to get the quality, especially considering you're dealing with highly flammable gasses.


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## jjs4x4 (Dec 2, 2012)

I had a set of HF torches for 5 years or so. Never had an issue just with the hoses like you. If I remember correctly I had to replace them in the first six months. I just went over to air gas, I think and bought a set of the house brand hoses. They were surprisingly cheap! I was using them just about everyday since I bought them and they worked perfectly!! I gave them to a friend of mine when I came across a smokin' deal on a brand new set of Victors!


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## FrankW (Dec 2, 2012)

I agree with GlenF, get a good set of hoses.  I worked for Victor Equipment 50+ years ago in Denton, TX.  I purchased a Journeyman set and a "J" series torch back then and they are still in great shape today.  Nothing like good equipment, if you plan to keep it forever.

Frank


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## macrnr (Dec 2, 2012)

You might want to consider purchasing " Flash Back Arrestors " while you are at it. These devices screw on to the end of the torch head where the hoses attach and prevent the flame from going back into the hose. These are required in commercial applications these days.


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## 7HC (Dec 2, 2012)

macrnr said:


> You might want to consider purchasing " Flash Back Arrestors " while you are at it. These devices screw on to the end of the torch head where the hoses attach and prevent the flame from going back into the hose. These are required in commercial applications these days.



x2 if you don't already have them.


M


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## paulweldit (Dec 3, 2012)

macrnr said:


> You might want to consider purchasing " Flash Back Arrestors " while you are at it. These devices screw on to the end of the torch head where the hoses attach and prevent the flame from going back into the hose. These are required in commercial applications these days.



I agree with installing these, However you need to drain the lines and back the regulator T-handles "off" every time you close the bottle valves. If you open the bottle valves with the regulators set, it will often times trip the "Flash Back Arrestors". That is a good safety precaution anyway since when the bottle valve is opened with  a preset regultor it can blow the regulator diaphram, pop off valve or even the case. You should also stand to the side of the regulator instead of directly in front when turn on the bottles. That is also true on Argon, 75/25 and CO2 bottles a on. MIG and TIG welders. 

 Another point I would like to mention especially to a new user, Is the Gas is "ALWAYS FIRST !!". Meaning the Gas is turned "ON"  First for lighting and Turned "OFF" First when shutting down. This allows  fresh Oxygen push the remaining gas from the mixture chamber there by reducing flash back explosion. 

                           Paul N.


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## Ray C (Dec 3, 2012)

Totally agree about the flashback valves.  BTW:  GlobalIndustrial.com has them for around 7 bucks each instead of the 20-30 from welding supply stores.  I have them directly on all my OA torches and not back at the regulator.  Also have them on the argon and helium tanks to prevent contaminating the contents.

Ray





macrnr said:


> You might want to consider purchasing " Flash Back Arrestors " while you are at it. These devices screw on to the end of the torch head where the hoses attach and prevent the flame from going back into the hose. These are required in commercial applications these days.


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## sophijo (Dec 3, 2012)

Ray, I checked that site out, Global......., for the $7 arresters and couldn't find them........they're $27 and up.


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## Ray C (Dec 3, 2012)

Look here and find the size you need.  Prices range from 5 to 20 bucks.  Mine were 7-8 bucks:  http://www.globalindustrial.com/sea...7665~~ncPCSMGR16E##2##u&q=check valve&x=0&y=0

I'm sure you're aware the gas side needs LH thread.  Usually B size 9/16.  Oxy takes RH thread -same size.

Ray

EDIT:  I have some of the "expensive ones".  These are no different...  I use them on Argon, Helium, Oxy and Polypropolene,  Acy and also put one on my propane heater setup.  

EDIT AGAIN:  This manufacturer calls them welding handle check valves and not arrestors.





sophijo said:


> Ray, I checked that site out, Global......., for the $7 arresters and couldn't find them........they're $27 and up.


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## macrnr (Dec 3, 2012)

I found these on E Bay for 12.50 buy it now
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Welding-Cut...766?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35bb9f5ba6


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## Ray C (Dec 3, 2012)

Just so you don't think I'm hallucinating, here they are.  One's marked oxygen and the other Gas.  At first, I thought they weren't rated for flammable gas but, the mfg calls them welding handle check valves.  Still leery, I called the Global rep and indeed they're rated for flammable gas.  And yes, before someone says something, the line in the bottom pic is Vinyl but it's only carrying 20PSI argon, Helium and CO2 -nothing flammable.


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## paulweldit (Dec 4, 2012)

Ray C said:


> Just so you don't think I'm hallucinating, here they are. One's marked oxygen and the other Gas. At first, I thought they weren't rated for flammable gas but, the mfg calls them welding handle check valves. Still leery, I called the Global rep and indeed they're rated for flammable gas. And yes, before someone says something, the line in the bottom pic is Vinyl but it's only carrying 20PSI argon, Helium and CO2 -nothing flammable.




Oh I believe you. I bought mine 30+ years ago. I have seen them hanging on vacumn pack cards in the welding supplies for 25-30 buck a piece +tax. It does not surprize me a guy can buy them on the internet cheaper. Local welding supplies have gotten rediculously high.I have seen them on the regulator and the torch handle also. In my mind, like yours, the torch handle is the best place. 

                                        Paul N.


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## Ray C (Dec 4, 2012)

Yeah, I figure it's best to catch that backflash as soon as possible to spare the hoses of undue pressure.

For the inert gasses, I put them by the regulator just to prevent the tanks from getting contaminated.  I use simple T-valves to join/mix different gasses.  A bit of a pain but helium really helps and also increases heat output and spares the electronics from doing all the heavy lifting.  Sadly though helium prices have doubled in the past year or so.

Ray




paulweldit said:


> Oh I believe you. I bought mine 30+ years ago. I have seen them hanging on vacumn pack cards in the welding supplies for 25-30 buck a piece +tax. It does not surprize me a guy can buy them on the internet cheaper. Local welding supplies have gotten rediculously high.I have seen them on the regulator and the torch handle also. In my mind, like yours, the torch handle is the best place.
> 
> Paul N.


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## November X-ray (Dec 4, 2012)

You may want to consider a set of flashbacks at both the torch and the regulators as I once saw a hose get burned in two when a piece of angle iron fell on it and it was rapidly burning back towards the bottles. Thank goodness someone had enough sense to turn the acetylene and oxygen bottles off quickly. Since the oxygen bottle valve is double seated I always open it wide open until it tightens, on the acetylene bottle I only open it until it registers pressure on the gauge and then just a little bit more, that way if you must shut off the bottle quickly, it is a fairly short turn.

Something else you may consider is the Koike type Quick Connectors  http://www.bibowindustries.com/Gentec_KOIKE_Style_Quick_Connectors.htm , especially if you change torches frequently. These also contain a flahback built in as well as a check valve so you can remove/change the torch without shutting off the bottles.


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## sophijo (Dec 4, 2012)

Heads-up!
Ray et al, Global Industrial has those "back-flow" ( I'm a plumber!) units on sale for $5.70ea.


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## jfcayron (Dec 4, 2012)

Ray C said:


> This manufacturer calls them welding handle check valves and not arrestors.


They are 2 different things:

Check valves block the reverse flow of the gases so there is no risk of mixing Oxygen and fuel in the hoses or regulators. 
Flash back arrestors snuff any flame running back through the hoses. 
 
I strongly recommend having both as they serve different purposes. Many good quality torches have one or the other or both built in. It is still a good idea to add a set at the regulator end.


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## jfcayron (Dec 4, 2012)

paulweldit said:


> I agree with installing these, However you need to drain the lines and back the regulator T-handles "off" every time you close the bottle valves. If you open the bottle valves with the regulators set, it will often times trip the "Flash Back Arrestors". That is a good safety precaution anyway since when the bottle valve is opened with  a preset regultor it can blow the regulator diaphram, pop off valve or even the case. You should also stand to the side of the regulator instead of directly in front when turn on the bottles. That is also true on Argon, 75/25 and CO2 bottles a on. MIG and TIG welders.



You are absolutely right. 
This procedure should be followed every time you stop welding with gas:

Turn off the Fuel at the torch 
Turn of the oxygen at the torch 
Close both Tank valves. 
Release the pressure at the torch for both gases; the gauges should now read zero. 
Close the torch valves. 
Back out the T valves on the regulators until they turn freely. (be careful not to unscrew them completely) 

The order of operations is important.

When starting to weld you need to

Verify the torch valves are closed 
Verify the regulator handles are backed out (VERY IMPORTANT) 
Stand sideways to the gauges AND TURN YOUR HEAD AWAY. 
Open the Acetylene no more than 3/4 of a turn 
Open the oxygen all the way 
Adjust both regulators. 
Open the oxygen torch valve for a second or two to purge it, then close. 
Open the fuel torch valve for a second or two to purge it, then close. 
You are ready to light up!


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## Ray C (Dec 4, 2012)

Good point on the dual check valves and I'll get to that.  As always I treat the gas hoses as carefully as my fingers, arms & legs.  And yup, I never crack the Acy valve all the way.  Did you know that freely vented Acy self ignites when it gets much past 15PSI?  Also, they add about 1 gallon of naptha to a 300 size tank to stabilize it.   Who ever thought something as volatile as naptha could stabilize something...

Haven't done much Acy ever since I got a plasma cutter.  Used it mainly for cutting and heat treating small parts.  When there was an Acy shortage a few years ago, I switched to polypropolene and found out it's only good for cutting -not heat treating.  It won't produce a carburizing flame and the part gets contaminated.  It cuts better than Acy though -runs at 3x the pressure -and that's why you can't weld with it either.





November X-ray said:


> You may want to consider a set of flashbacks at both the torch and the regulators as I once saw a hose get burned in two when a piece of angle iron fell on it and it was rapidly burning back towards the bottles. Thank goodness someone had enough sense to turn the acetylene and oxygen bottles off quickly. Since the oxygen bottle valve is double seated I always open it wide open until it tightens, on the acetylene bottle I only open it until it registers pressure on the gauge and then just a little bit more, that way if you must shut off the bottle quickly, it is a fairly short turn.
> 
> Something else you may consider is the Koike type Quick Connectors http://www.bibowindustries.com/Gentec_KOIKE_Style_Quick_Connectors.htm , especially if you change torches frequently. These also contain a flahback built in as well as a check valve so you can remove/change the torch without shutting off the bottles.


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## Ray C (Dec 4, 2012)

Jeff,

Would you please add those steps to the Sticky shop saftey list? It's here: http://www.hobby-machinist.com/showthread.php/9537-Specific-Rules-of-Thumb-for-Shop-Safety!


"Tanks" in advance.

Ray





jfcayron said:


> You are absolutely right.
> This procedure should be followed every time you stop welding with gas:
> 
> Turn off the Fuel at the torch
> ...


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## paulweldit (Dec 5, 2012)

Ray C said:


> Good point on the dual check valves and I'll get to that. As always I treat the gas hoses as carefully as my fingers, arms & legs. And yup, I never crack the Acy valve all the way. Did you know that freely vented Acy self ignites when it gets much past 15PSI? Also, they add about 1 gallon of naptha to a 300 size tank to stabilize it. Who ever thought something as volatile as naptha could stabilize something...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## FrankW (Dec 5, 2012)

There is an angle that you can tilt the acet bottle and it operate ok.  Beyond that angle it will draw acetone out with the acet and fowl up the works.  I have forgotten that angle.  Anyone remember the angle?  You see it on service trucks where the bottles are at angles.  :nono:

Frank


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## 7HC (Dec 5, 2012)

FrankW said:


> There is an angle that you can tilt the acet bottle and it operate ok.  Beyond that angle it will draw acetone out with the acet and fowl up the works.  I have forgotten that angle.  Anyone remember the angle?  You see it on service trucks where the bottles are at angles.  :nono:
> 
> Frank



Don't know, but for practical purposes there is absolutely no need to tip the bottle at all while in use.  When moving it, just tilt the cart the minimum necessary to be able to push it.


M


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## November X-ray (Dec 5, 2012)

> Acetylene will Ignite on its own at 28 PSI so what is inside the bottle  is a blanket of fiber
> soaked with liquid A*cetone* which absorbs the acetylene in solution. Originally they used asbestos but it was Outlawed.



Don't be fooled into thinking there is no more asbestos in any products nowadays, as many imported items such as sheetrock may still contain it. Also asbestos is a natural occurring mineral and can be dug up during normal everyday excavations, but typically not as most deposits were known. Also some of the sheetrock mud mixes still says something like, "contains natural mineral fibers", which can be asbestos.


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## jfcayron (Dec 5, 2012)

Ray C said:


> Jeff,
> 
> Would you please add those steps to the Sticky shop saftey list? It's here: http://www.hobby-machinist.com/showthread.php/9537-Specific-Rules-of-Thumb-for-Shop-Safety!
> 
> ...



Done!


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## Ray C (Dec 5, 2012)

Thank you!




jfcayron said:


> Done!


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## FrankW (Dec 6, 2012)

7HC,

I agree that in the shop there is no need to tilt bottles, but when mounting on a service truck, sometimes it is convenient to mount tilted.  Which was my intended reference. 

Frank


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## Uglydog (Dec 7, 2012)

jfcayron said:


> They are 2 different things:
> 
> Check valves block the reverse flow of the gases so there is no risk of mixing Oxygen and fuel in the hoses or regulators.
> Flash back arrestors snuff any flame running back through the hoses.
> ...



This is all accurate. But, please continue to be carefull. Sometimes we become less vigilant with all the safety devices. Even good flash back arrestors fail. Also, be carefull if changes torches. It's possible to get contaminants inside the arrestor eliminating its safety benefits.


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