# at the scrap yard......



## cathead (Feb 10, 2017)

Yesterday I took a trip to the local scrap yard and found what I think is a 9J Gorton vertical mill
and a South Bend lathe with about a 12 foot bed.  I have some interest in the mill as a restoration
project.  I think the main motor is 460 volt 3 phase, not sure about the feed motor.  If the motors could
be rewired for 230, it might be worth the effort.  Also, the quill has an unknown to me taper in it.  I think it
could possibly be a Brown & Sharpe taper but not sure.   I need to take another look at this stuff. 
It's kind of a shame to see these machines sitting outside uncared for.


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## FOMOGO (Feb 10, 2017)

I'm thinking there is a special place in machinist heaven for folks who bring old machines back to life. Hope it pans out for you. Mike


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## Chuck K (Feb 10, 2017)

cathead said:


> Yesterday I took a trip to the local scrap yard and found what I think is a 9J Gorton vertical mill
> and a South Bend lathe with about a 12 foot bed.  I have some interest in the mill as a restoration
> project.  I think the main motor is 460 volt 3 phase, not sure about the feed motor.  If the motors could
> be rewired for 230, it might be worth the effort.  Also, the quill has an unknown to me taper in it.  I think it
> ...


Gorton used a proprietary collet in their machines....at least the ones I've had.  I still have a set of them somewhere.


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## Uglydog (Feb 10, 2017)

Any chance you could get them home on billet, greased, and tarped for a someday rebuild or resell?
And while I would always prefer that the entire machine be saved, even some misc parts might be valuable to someone.
Depending on condition. And price. I might be interested in one as a summer project.

Daryl
MN


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## Chuck K (Feb 10, 2017)

Most scrap yards won't resell the scrap to people off the street anymore.


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## Uglydog (Feb 10, 2017)

Chuck K said:


> Most scrap yards won't resell the scrap to people off the street anymore.


Still happens here.
Well at least at the rural scrap yards I frequent.
Certainly not in the metro.

Daryl
MN


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## 4GSR (Feb 10, 2017)

Cathead,

The Gorton 9J mill used to be a nice mill in it's time.  The precision of the mill was at least double that of a Bridgeport mill.  The spindle quill only has 3-1/2" of travel.  The taper in the spindle is a No. 10 Brown & Sharpe taper.  Look for the tooling, too if you buy the mill.  The mill weighs around 3400 lbs.  It is stout!  The spindle motor is a two speed motor and if 440v it will have to be rewired for 220v unless you set up a step up transformer.  The feed motors are dual voltage for 220v or 440v.  My family owned three of these mills back several years ago.  I've since given away my manuals and stuff I had on the mills.  I can get my hands on anything you may want.  Also, there is a website run by a Gorton family member that is loaded with all sorts of information.  

Ken


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## GarageGuy (Feb 10, 2017)

Chuck K said:


> Most scrap yards won't resell the scrap to people off the street anymore.



None of the scrap yards in my area will sell anything.  Someone said it has something to do with not having a sales tax number, but that sounds like an excuse.  Also heard there might be liability issues.  I would think that would be as simple as signing a release form.  "Sign this and we can sell you scrap metal".  I would do that in an instant.

I would LOVE to buy metal from the scrap yard, and I would gladly pay more than they get for sending it in to be melted down.  Oh, the sadness...   

GG


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## cathead (Feb 11, 2017)

Uglydog said:


> Any chance you could get them home on billet, greased, and tarped for a someday rebuild or resell?
> And while I would always prefer that the entire machine be saved, even some misc parts might be valuable to someone.
> Depending on condition. And price. I might be interested in one as a summer project.
> 
> ...



I'm waiting for spring for the snow to go away.  Then I can get to my tandem axle trailer and do some hauling.  
Road conditions won't allow it at present due to ice and snow.  I like the grease and tarp idea for temporary storage.


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## Uglydog (Feb 11, 2017)

In the event that you score the 9j and are unable to source #10 collets/tooling I wonder if you could turn an arbor #10BS on one end and a more common cheaper collet system on the other. 
Does the #10 use a nut or a drawbar? That might determine what the set up would look like.=

Daryl


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## 4GSR (Feb 11, 2017)

Uglydog said:


> In the event that you score the 9j and are unable to source #10 collets/tooling I wonder if you could turn an arbor #10BS on one end and a more common cheaper collet system on the other.
> Does the #10 use a nut or a drawbar? That might determine what the set up would look like.=
> 
> Daryl



Daryl,

I did exactly that for the mill I had.  Made a adapter with a No. 10 B & S shank for the spindle end, the other end made for ER-32 collets.  Worked like a charm.  The Gorton 9J mills had a drawbar with 5/8-11 thread.

Ken


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## cathead (Feb 11, 2017)

Uglydog said:


> In the event that you score the 9j and are unable to source #10 collets/tooling I wonder if you could turn an arbor #10BS on one end and a more common cheaper collet system on the other.
> Does the #10 use a nut or a drawbar? That might determine what the set up would look like.=
> 
> Daryl



I will have to take a closer look at it to find out the details.  I didn't look to see if there was a draw bar hole but did check out the
taper and it was about Morse #4 in diameter at the wide end but seemed like a lesser angle taper.  I will consult with my
Machinist's handbook and see if what I saw would agree with a #10BS taper.   Apparently the BS10 needs a draw bar.
Also will look in my tooling and see if I have anything resembling a BS10.


EDIT:   Ken, Thanks for the draw bar information!


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## Uglydog (Feb 11, 2017)

Cathead,
Should you make the pick and appreciate a day going through the geometry and and scraping out any rust.
Please let me know, Bemidji isn't really that far (3.5hours).
I am certainly no expert. But, would humbly share what I know. On the other hand your expertise and experience may far outweigh mine.
Note: it'd cost you coffee and a sandwich!!

Edit: just spoke with my bride. She identified that if we waited until it was warmer we'd tow our 16foot Scamp (http://www.scamptrailers.com/) and stay at Lake Bemidji State Park. 
Sorry if it seems like I am inviting myself to your shop. I get excited about this sort of conservation of vintage.

Daryl
MN


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## 4GSR (Feb 11, 2017)

Cathead,

Gorton only made the  9J with a No. 10 B & S taper. No other option was offered!  Without using a adapter.

Ken


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## cathead (Feb 11, 2017)

Daryl, 

You are welcome to visit my shop any time.  You could kill two birds with one stone if you bring the Scamp.  I don't consider
myself an expert either but have learned a few things over the years.  

Burt


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## brino (Feb 11, 2017)

GarageGuy said:


> None of the scrap yards in my area will sell anything........... Also heard there might be liability issues.



I am __SO__  lucky I can go and walk thru my "local" scrap yard and paw thru piles and pick up stuff.

I saw a B&S#10 to something smaller adapter at my local used tool place. (...maybe to B&S #9 or 7, maybe.....)
Those kinda things usually run ~30 $CAD.
Let me know if you're interested and I'll see if I can swing a discount; it's been there for months.......

-brino


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## cathead (Feb 11, 2017)

brino said:


> I am __SO__  lucky I can go and walk thru my "local" scrap yard and paw thru piles and pick up stuff.
> 
> I saw a B&S#10 to something smaller adapter at my local used tool place. (...maybe to B&S #9 or 7, maybe.....)
> Those kinda things usually run ~30 $CAD.
> ...




Brino, 

I'm not really sure what I need yet but I do thank you for offering.


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## KBeitz (Nov 19, 2018)

South Bend lathe with about a 12 foot bed .... Wow would I have loved to have gotten my hands on that...


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## bhigdog (Nov 19, 2018)

Moses Glick scrap yard near Reading, PA will let you browse the yard and buy whatever you want. Steel .45 pound, tool steel 1.00, alum 1.65, plastics 1.50. Motors, gears, electricals, machines, gear reducers, process equipment and anything you can imagine constantly changing.............Bob


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## dlane (Nov 19, 2018)

The south bend lathe bed is probably now Chinese razor blades.
Long gone


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## 8mpg (Nov 20, 2018)

Apparently I need to check out some scrap yards


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