# Buying my first lathe, no experience and need help



## Gr1m3eaper (Mar 14, 2017)

Hey guys im hoping some people on here can help me out. Ive never done any type of machining before, ive watched a lot of youtube videos on lathes and have decided that i want to buy a lathe and have a crack at machining. Ive been looking on ebay for about 6 months+ keeping my eye out for a good deal, reliable, not too expensive and is a good first step in the door. ive attached some pictures and im hoping that somebody can tell me what its worth so i dont overpay. Also any maintenance tips, first tools i should buy etc would be a great help. Cheers guys


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## samthedog (Mar 14, 2017)

Here is an article I wrote that turned into a sticky:

http://www.hobby-machinist.com/threads/a-guide-for-selecting-the-right-lathe-for-beginners.25915/

This should help you to identify what to look for in a machine.

Paul.


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## ACHiPo (Mar 14, 2017)

Sounds familiar!  I'm afraid I can't help you with the lathe pictured--I don't recognize it, but someone else here might.  One piece of advice that I received when I started my search was to try to find an operational lathe with tooling, as it can be difficult to assess all of the issues of a non-operational lathe (not to mention that parts can be difficult to find if they're needed).  Good luck and welcome!


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## Gr1m3eaper (Mar 14, 2017)

Thanks for the responses guys, im not working with a lot of cash or space so i want to make sure its the right purchase for me before i spend hundreds of dollars. Ive seen the lathe in person, it works fine, is very smooth and quiet. It needs a few tweaks like bracing the motor with a steel plate to reduce the wobble but thats easily fixed. The guy im buying it from is a machinist with much bigger lathes and mills so that gave me confidence thats its been treated well and will work for years to come. Regarding tooling ive been looking at getting some basics just tobstart off with, been looking on ebay and wondering which would be a better first purchase. Investing in the carbide insert tools or getting a set of the blue tool things you can get off ebay with lots of different angles and cutters included, which one would be best to get first?


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## Gr1m3eaper (Mar 14, 2017)

Also one thing ive been concerned about, how easy is it to find spare parts for old lathes like this? What parts generally need replacing etc? I dont want to spend money on something old that i cant get spares for or replace parts when they break if i can spend a little more and get something new thats a lot easier to get spares for :/


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## Doubleeboy (Mar 14, 2017)

A lathe of unknown make with no leadscrew is not a prime candidate for a learning lathe IMO.  To each their own, but I would look for something in better shape with some tooling.  A motor flopping around on machine is not a sign its been taken care of or that the owner is straight shooter.   No gears obvious in photos so likely just a few speeds available via belt change on pulley, and limited feeds I would imagine, if any.  Keep looking unless its near scrap price.


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## Gr1m3eaper (Mar 14, 2017)

Ah bugger i wish I would've known that before hand, ive put a max bid of $500  im guessing thats way too much for what it is? The guy whos selling it bought it for a project but never got around to using it. Now im starting to second guess and wondering if i should try and retract my max bid and look for something else


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## talvare (Mar 14, 2017)

Gr1m3eaper said:


> Now im starting to second guess and wondering if i should try and retract my max bid and look for something else



YES ! Heed what the others here have said. No lead screw means you can't cut threads. If it doesn't have a good set of change gears with it, you'll have very limited spindle speed options. I see many head aches with that machine. Keep looking and do your homework. Ask lots of questions here.
Just my two cents.

Ted


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## Gr1m3eaper (Mar 14, 2017)

Alright guys will do, ill message the guy to see if i can retract the bid and shop for something better, ill definently be asking lots of questions especially here. You guys are awesome, thanks for all the help. Ill spend good money on a lathe as long as it worth it. Ive been looking at a few on ebay and my local machinery place, comparing features, size of work that can be done etc. What would be a good size lathe to get? Im not exactly sure what im going to be making with it yet, want to make sure i get a good size so i can do whatever project i want to do. Should i go for something a little bigger so ive got futureproofing for bigger projects, more complicated ones in the future? Also should i go and invest in carbide insert tools for my first set or go for the cheaper options for now?


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## wawoodman (Mar 14, 2017)

Those carbide tools work better on heavier equipment. Better you should learn to grind HSS. Lots of videos on the web.


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## jsh (Mar 14, 2017)

I will give what little advice I can, as I am just diving in to this myself. 
If that is what you think is the biggest you want, go at least to the next step bigger in size. I was told this repeatedly by everyone. I ended up with a really great lathe a bit larger than I had planned on. I also spent a fair bit more than I planned on. 
I had saved up a fair bit, as I looked for about 4 years before I took the plunge. Just put a bigger sent in what I was going to spend on tooling. Ramin noodles and hot dogs again for a while,lol. 
Now that I have a lathe I have been looking for tooling. Not much in my area, but have been finding the Logan and Atalas 9" lathes all over the place now!?  There was nothing showing up in decent shape in that size in my area for several years. 
Be patient and one will show up. 
Jeff


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## Gr1m3eaper (Mar 14, 2017)

Thanks for the advice mate, ive cancelled the bid on the lathe on ebay i was looking at put the money towards something better. Ive been wanting a lathe for a few years ever since i saw one being used when i went to welding school. That was my way of thinking too, might as well go for something bigger than what you think you will need so your not regreting your choice a few years down the track. Ive been looking at whats out there and i think im going to set my budget at about $1500 AUD max. Ive got one in my ebay watchlist thats about $1200. Its 180 x 400, 500W brushless motor, variable speed and a set of tools to go with it. Would something like that be suitable or go for something bigger?


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## jsh (Mar 14, 2017)

Dunno about you, but room and space was my biggest problem. That is the only reason I went with a 11x36. I found newer, larger 3 phase for a lot less money. The main thing on this one was the excellent well cared for shape it was in. 
Good luck to you. 
Just a heads up, but you will want a mill shortly, lol. 
Jeff


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## Glenn Brooks (Mar 14, 2017)

Looks like you might be in Oz?  If so, here is a list of model engineering clubs and live steam associations that might be a good resource for you.  Here in the US, Live steam clubs are full of like minded hobby machinists who build miniature locomotives - mostly 1.6" to the foot scale.  The big thing is there are always people in the various clubs so are helpful and willing to assist people ingested in learning about machine work.  

Maybe there is a local Group near you that you could contact for advice, also for used lathes for sale.  Look at the links page for the list of local Australian societies.  

http://www.aals.asn.au/

Glenn


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## Chipper5783 (Mar 15, 2017)

Gr1m3eaper said:


> Its 180 x 400, 500W brushless motor, variable speed and a set of tools to go with it.



In equivalent lingo that is about a 7" swing x 16" between centers with a 2/3rd HP motor.  That probably is a fine enough machine and one you would learn plenty of cool things.  You have not said very much about what you want to do with the lathe.  I think we all get it that you want to make cool stuff - machine a bit of "this & that".  Maybe you'll do some home gadgets, perhaps get some of the machining books and make a few of the projects described, maybe you'll buy a couple of the kits for tools or machine attachments, perhaps some parts for cars/tractors/bikes, . . . . .?

That is great.  Join the group here, there is plenty of that here (basically mostly what I do too).  7"x16" is a very modest machine.  The machine Jeff (above) describes is a lot more competent and is very well suited for misc. general purpose stuff.  I have 2 lathes, one is a little smaller than Jeff's (I have an 11"x24") and it would cover the vast majority of what I do.  My first lathe was 15"x60" - I still have it and I actually use it about 70% of the time - even though I could do most of that work on the smaller lathe.  They are both good machines, reasonably tooled - but I like the larger one for certain jobs.  15"x60" is not a "big" lathe.  11"x24" is not a "small" lathe.  I guess it is all relative.  Of course larger means more space, more trouble when you have to move it, tooling & accessories cost a bit more.  My usual advice is buy as much machine up front as you can (Jeff's advice is good) - he spend extra and ate cheap for a while - but he ended up with a much better set up.  Sounds like he never looked back.

When I bought that first lathe, the 15x60 - I way over paid, I spent every dime I had to get a good machine, good set of attachments (2 chucks, face plate, both steadies, TTA), but zero tooling, no good place to put it and not even the ability to plug it in (3 phase).  Okay, that was 34 years ago - sure it took a bit of time, I got the details sorted and I have never regretted that initial purchase.  I now have 5 more primary machines and several small machines - and all put together they cost the same as that first machine.  So what, the first machine got me started and I am very satisfied with how the hobby has worked out for me.  That is one approach.

There is nothing wrong with getting a modest machine and moving on to something else later.  I am just sharing what my experience was.  I didn't have to contend with a machine that did not work, when I was trying to learn the basics.  I have kept investing in that same machine and it is still a good part of my set up.

For general messing around 7" maximum swing is pretty small (again, depends on what you want to do).  Variable speed?  I'm pretty ho-hum on that.  If the variable speed is taking the place of gears then I suspect you'll run into bottom end torque issues.  When that brushless motor is dialed down, there isn't much power.  With reduction gearing, you get about the same power - so torque goes up as the speed goes down.

Tooling?  Buy based on what you are doing.  For general messing around, grind some highspeed steel.  I now have lots of tooling.  I still grind tooling.  All the fancy & special tooling in the world is not going to eliminate the need to grind tooling from time to time.  Get used to it.  I'll go out on a limb with this statement: If you are machining, you will be more successful if tool grinding is part of your repertoire.  Grinding tooling is not a big deal - get a 6" bench grinder and start messing around.

Try to find a machine like Jeff's (above) not more than 10 years old, something that all the basic features work - and don't sweat the price.  Regardless, start saving $$, work out your shop space, work out transport and consider sorting out 3 phase power (that really opens up machine options).

Of course, all comments above assume that you are putting safe operation as your first and primary concern for everything you do.


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## Gr1m3eaper (Mar 15, 2017)

Thanka for the advice mate, thats helped me out with a lot of questions and concerns ive had. For the work being done some of the first things i want to try are knobs for my car, cigarette lighter, dashboard lights etc. Motorbike, go cart, drift trike parts, computer watercooling fittings for a long awaited project ive been wanting to do. Ive read some reviews of the lathe im looking at and apparently the brushless motor in the lathe has torque control so it changes the torque levels depending on speed and load. Its called a SIEG SC3, ill attach an Ebay link at the bottom. I like the idea of getting a machining book for some projects to try, ive not had the best of luck finding maching books i have found one but got no idea how good it is or if it has projects, do you guys recognize it? Ill attach a picture. Im only 23 and still living at home so space is limited, ive got a bit to work with but not much. I wont be getting three phase power while im living at home, not worth the investment cost IMO, might be when i move so ill have to stick to single phase for now. Im a welder by trade and do a bit of it on the weekends so ill probabely be making stuff for that side too. Ive already started saving, decided ill save for a few months until i can get the money together to buy something i really want and wont be dissapointed with, something that will last for years to come. Thinking about getting a tool box and keeping my eye out for cheap tooling while im saving for the big one, ive seen a few lots pop up going for dirt cheap. Also what are people's opinions on the best knurling tools? Thanks heaps for all your help everybody, im starting to get that pit in my stomach of sheer, utter excitement that ill finally get my hands on a lathe

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/301735606253


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## Gr1m3eaper (Mar 15, 2017)

Ok so after doing a bit of looking on ebay ive come across a few other books, they look quite good says their geared towards the beginner and contain a fair few projects to help build skills. What do you guys think?


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## tomh (Mar 15, 2017)

All  books that Harold hall has  are good books and worth buying, also tubal Cain books will be good reading.
My  advice on buying a lathe for the first time user/buyer is to go new, the reason is that you don't have enough information or experience to know what you are getting or not getting with it and that can become very costly and frustrating. 
 When you go new you will get 95 % of what you need to get started, you get the 3 & 4 jaw chucks the centers tool holders and the necessary change gears, all you need then is the cutting tools and you are ready to get going.
Now when you do buy, if you go new DONT take it apart!!!!  wipe it down oil it up and start learning the lathe and give it time to break / seat itself in, that way if you encounter a problem you will know that the problem is in the lathe and NOT something you did,  and the seller will be more inclined to help you sort it out, plus you will have a warranty to back you up.


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## Gr1m3eaper (Mar 15, 2017)

Oh sweet i watch tubalcain on Youtube, was thinking of buying one of his shop lessons on USB that he makes. Yeah thats what ive picked up on from what the giys have said, just go new so theres not any headaches. Ok sweet thats one thing i was concerned about, ive heard with the cheaper hobby lathes they need to be taken apart to make sure the beds are level, everythings there but ill just leave it be. When you say wipe it down do you mean get all the oils that it came with off? Clean all the gunk fron shipping? Where abouts should i apply some oil after ive wiped it down? Headstock, tailstock, bedways etc? Also whats a good oil to use?


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## Al 1 (Mar 15, 2017)

One quick look at that machine:  It's a stay away.  
Al


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## richl (Mar 15, 2017)

take your time, there is no telling what could turn up in the next couple of months. When I was looking for a lathe back in 2003, I was positive I was going to get a new grizzly g0602, a 10x22 inch lathe... what happened was a 13x40 enco lathe turned up. Its been a bit of a challenge to get her working, but after getting her working well, and finally getting tooling for her, its really been a good lathe.
It does not mean you will find something bigger that fits into your budget, but letting lots of people know you are looking for a lathe, joining any machining groups reasonably close to you, networking with people on machining sites, scouring any and all classified ads around you... who knows what could turn up.
Most of what has been mentioned here is great info, especially buying something new... but, there are deals out there and if you dont mind getting dirty and fixing, a used machine may not be a bad deal...

hth
Rich


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## tomh (Mar 15, 2017)

Yes just wipe the oil/grease/ cosmoline  that is on it when you get it off. The manual  will show the points to oil and the type to use.   You will find some books on amazon that a  man from England  also called tubal cain  published. The workshop practice series #5 # 15 & #28 by tubal cain are just a few.


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## Gr1m3eaper (Mar 15, 2017)

Al 1 said:


> One quick look at that machine:  It's a stay away.
> Al



What do you mean by stay away? Yes i know its a chinese machine as a lot of the mini/smallish lathes are nowadays but the company who makes them has been in business for 25+ years, sells 30,000 machines a year and is Australian based so spares are easy to come past so i feel confident that theyre decent machines.

@richl yeah im taking my time, probabely going to be a while before i buy one will be doing lots of research beforw i take the plunge. Id love to get a big one but ive gotta be careful with space, thats the main concern ATM. Id much rather buy one that works straight off the bat but if i can find one that doesnt need much to get it going i might go that route. 

@tomh alright ill keep that in mind, im going to a place that sells the SIEG lathes i attached a link to in the previous post on the weekend to see what theyre like in person. I live in Victoria, Australia so im hoping to find more places that will help me, not too many clubs or business that sell lathes to suit my needs unfortunately  ah good ol tubalcain, been watching him for a while. Would his books be on ebay?


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## Chipper5783 (Mar 16, 2017)

Hi Gr1, I think you are taking the right approach with reading, spending time on the internet machining videos and saving your funds.  I get it that you probably come across some great tooling buys, but suggest you avoid most of them, because opportunities will still show up when you are better able to use the stuff you buy.  Don't get sucked into thinking you'll never find a deal like that again.  

Knurling tool?  Make a pinch style.  Several good plans on the internet.  I made the one in Lautard's book - it works great.  You can buy the pinch style pretty cheap, but I found I learned quite a bit - so my vote is still that you should make it yourself.  The cut style (perhaps it is "Kut" ?) are probably good, but expensive (never used one).  There are several bump style, which I have used successfully - but the pinch style just work so slick (apparently a game changer on a small machine, but work fine on a good solid machine).

I don't really understand your hesitation with putting 3 phase in at your parent's place (it is not a big deal, think of it a part of the lathe).  That's exactly what I did with my 15" lathe (and I was 21) - just hard wired the lathe right into the converter, hardwired the converter right to a breaker (its not any more difficult than wiring in a welding machine).  I only had the one machine back then (it was in mom & dad's basement for 12 years).  When I got another machine (15 years later) I made up a 3 phase distribution panel.  Obviously you take the phase converter with you when you go.  I am puzzled by your comment that getting 3 phase not being worth the investment (when you have not actually done it).  I have done it and it was a great investment.

Tom is right about going with a new machine.  Maybe not brand new - let someone else put the first scratch on it (which drops the price significantly).  My first machine was perhaps a year old - regardless, everything worked.  Now 34 years later, it is still new newest machine in the fleet.

Set yourself a goal of going and looking at one machine a month (at least one) and have a really good look, like you are actually going to buy it.  However, commit to yourself that you won't actually buy it - just look.  Do that for at least one year.  That will teach you what your local machinery market is like.  With that information you will be in a much better position to recognize what a "good buy" is for you.

Any chance you can get yourself into a community college / night class / weekend workshop?

Regards, David


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## 12bolts (Mar 16, 2017)

Hi Grim,
Another good forum, (and aussie orientated) to watch for is http://metalworkforums.com/

Cheers Phil


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## Gr1m3eaper (Mar 16, 2017)

@Chipper5783 yeah ive been looking at lathe videos for a few years but only been getting serious about learning the past 3 months. Ill leave the tooling a lone until i find a lathe and better understand the things i want to make, how to use the tooling etc. 

Oh really? Sweet ill have a look for some plans, would making a knurling tool be a good first machining project? When you say pinch style do you mean the ones where you have to tighten the wheels down as you make passes vs the ones that just roll along the work piece?  

Ah ive got no problem with getting a 3 phase lathe and using a converter as long as it fits in my shed, my problem is actually getting proper 3 phase power installed. Im just using an extension cord plugged into the house for power whenever i use the shed atm so ill be getting some 20A breakers and power installed before i get that, ill save getting proper three phase power for when i move and have much more space to work with. 

Yeah after reading the comments and all the input ill definently be going for something new or very close, something that has all the features i want and wont give me any headaches so that when i get my lathe i can just enjoy it and not get frustrated. Ive got 2 places im going to this weekend to look at lathes, measure some up, look at prices, features, quality, how i like them etc. Take some pics, ask some questions. Hmm ive not thought about it but if i can find something cheap that fits into my schedule ill definently give it a go.



12bolts said:


> Hi Grim,
> Another good forum, (and aussie orientated) to watch for is http://metalworkforums.com/
> 
> Cheers Phil



Cheers mate ill give them a look when i get home from work, want to try and find a local based hobbyist meeting or club to try and pic the brains of the gentleman with lots of experience, reckon id get a lot out of that  has anyone got pics of the lathes theyre using? Would love to see it.


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## 12bolts (Mar 16, 2017)

Grim,
Mine as purchased





Cleaning it up and painting



And back in working order



Not suggesting you should attempt this. But there is nothing wrong with old iron provided you know what to look out for. Depending on your experience and ability........But here in FNQ it can be few and far between machines. Need to take what you can get sometimes..... Your location should open up better opportunities. (I used to live in KooW.R. before I saw the light)
https://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/dandenong-south/miscellaneous-goods/cyl-grinder-hercus/1131393549
https://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/croydon-north/miscellaneous-goods/metal-turning-lathe/1138264695
https://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/wyndham-vale/miscellaneous-goods/hafco-1000d-metal-lathe/1138289767
http://www.lockwoodcompany.com.au/S2924.htm https://www.mgs.net.au/auction/catalogue.html?d=2296
I appreciate that most of these are gone, but thats jsut a quick look back over the past month or so.

Cheers Phil


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## ronny (Mar 17, 2017)

Gr1m3eaper said:


> Hey guys im hoping some people on here can help me out. Ive never done any type of machining before, ive watched a lot of youtube videos on lathes and have decided that i want to buy a lathe and have a crack at machining. Ive been looking on ebay for about 6 months+ keeping my eye out for a good deal, reliable, not too expensive and is a good first step in the door. ive attached some pictures and im hoping that somebody can tell me what its worth so i dont overpay. Also any maintenance tips, first tools i should buy etc would be a great help. Cheers guys
> 
> View attachment 228653
> View attachment 228654
> ...


 I may have some information to help.  If you are interested message me ron-lyn@bigpond.net.au.


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## markba633csi (Mar 17, 2017)

One thing I did like about the first old lathe was the t-slotted cross slide, and it was a gap-bed, both desirable features.  Also the carriage handwheel on the right makes me think it might have been an English lathe?  But without belt guards- not a great choice for a first machine.  You don't want to learn by getting hurt. 
For 100 dollars I would have bought it and fixed it up, but certainly not 500.
Mark S.


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## Silverbullet (Mar 17, 2017)

Keep an eye on craigslist , machinery auctions , farm sales. Lots of places to pick up a nice lathe. I just have agreed to buy a rusty junk lathe. I only want the legs to mount my planer on . If you look at it , looks like a rusty pile but add a little work and it would be what you had bid on.


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## Downunder Bob (Mar 18, 2017)

Gr1m3eaper said:


> Hey guys im hoping some people on here can help me out. Ive never done any type of machining before, ive watched a lot of youtube videos on lathes and have decided that i want to buy a lathe and have a crack at machining. Ive been looking on ebay for about 6 months+ keeping my eye out for a good deal, reliable, not too expensive and is a good first step in the door. ive attached some pictures and im hoping that somebody can tell me what its worth so i dont overpay. Also any maintenance tips, first tools i should buy etc would be a great help. Cheers guys
> 
> View attachment 228653
> View attachment 228654
> ...



 That machine looks very old and somewhat abused. I can't believe it's never been used, maybe by the person selling it. but it's got to be 60 or more years old, You'd be buying a can of worms at best. No lead screw, and probably near impossible to buy one. Why is the lead screw mising, was it crashed.

The first question I'd ask is how much can you afford, and what d you really want to achieve? Do you have any idea of the kind of things you want to make and or repair? 

After that I generally say buy the biggest and best you have room for and can afford.

I see you are living in Frankston, I assume Frankston Vic. if so, there a quite a few machine tool selling companies with good showrooms in Melbourne, they usually also sell second hand machines that have been traded in. Buying from them may cost a little more but you've got a better chance of buying something that actually works. 

Good luck.

Bob.


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## Laytonnz (Mar 18, 2017)

I was in the same boat about 2 years ago I looked for what felt like for ever, i ended up jumping on an old pile of pre ww1 junk because it was cheap. ... probably good for a museum !








dont have a picture of it complete ...!

I ended up selling it because being new I just couldn't figure out if it was me or the machine making the mistakes

Fast foward 6 months I was working at a local school and seen an old lathe coverd in sawdust and general shop dust I made a cheeky offer of $500 and took it home.




After a clean, paint wasnt stuck very well...

A few months later I started geting into it and realized I had made the same mistake a seemly good machine from the outside but under it all it has seen some fairly hard student abuse....  ground down gears damaged gib strips nasty crash damage greased bronze bush's resulting in exeptionally worn bush's. . Stuck backplate ect the list goes on























this is pretty much says it all, just abused.

but remember even if you buy a dud there is always hope and by the time youre finished with it you will know the whole machine inside out and its workings and have some skills you wouldnt otherwise have and made some fairly interesting parts

So I thought bugger it, brought a chineese HQ400 lathe/mill and started repairing the old girl so far I've rebuilt the apron, Norton gearbox just about finished the tailstock and various other bits and pieces the HQ400 is a fair lathe but a poor mill I purchased this second hand but this time I had a good idea what was a "acceptable " machine it turned out great exept for the electrical issue in the first week the on off switch stoped working so i just replaced the whole lot with a simple rocker switch.

 i built this bench to add mass to this small machine, its made of various scrap i had around but mostly 8mm+ thickness steel and a 18mm top the lathe is bolted to a 12mm piece of plate steel that is tek screwed to the ply top its fairly heavy it must weigh in heaver then the lathe, but it has definitely made a difference to the depth of cut i can make and the surface finish. 










I have found the $60 set of carbide indexable tooling found on ebay to be a good starting point for me,  the inserts are cheap also so if I make a mistake and chip or crack an insert it's no big deal

http://www.ebay.com/p/7x-set-of-12m...de-insert-y/1086869247?_trksid=p2047675.l2644

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Tungalo...733173?hash=item3f4c9464b5:g:zZkAAOSwstxVUaZ7

http://www.ebay.com/itm/291970653363?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT

I say if you can, get a buddy to go looking at machines with you so you don't impulse buy a worn machine that's been trated up.

I would definitely  buy second hand as I've made a few mistakes I would cringe to make on a brand new machine..

Sorry didnt mean to hi-jack youre thread just showing you my experence!
Layton


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## markba633csi (Mar 18, 2017)

Thank you for sharing, those pictures make it clear that you have to go deep into a machine to find the flaws within-  The Harrison (which I would also love to have) is a good lathe and would have been worth the trouble to fix up.  School lathes get quite a beating.  Hopefully your experiences will help others; forewarned is forearmed I always say. 
I've never been a fan of the combo machines, but there are those who like them and get a lot of fun out of them so whatever floats yer boat. 
Mark S.
ps I like the color scheme on the Harrison- very stylish!  BTW, what became of it?


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## Laytonnz (Mar 18, 2017)

markba633csi said:


> Thank you for sharing, those pictures make it clear that you have to go deep into a machine to find the flaws within-  The Harrison (which I would also love to have) is a good lathe and would have been worth the trouble to fix up.  School lathes get quite a beating.  Hopefully your experiences will help others; forewarned is forearmed I always say.
> I've never been a fan of the combo machines, but there are those who like them and get a lot of fun out of them so whatever floats yer boat.
> Mark S.
> ps I like the color scheme on the Harrison- very stylish!  BTW, what became of it?




Well... lets say, its a work in progress!
one fix at a time, and im buying the tools, odds and ends as i need them shipping takes a fair amount of time from china but it gives me time to research how to make the part i need and practise.
this is how it sits at the moment



















the latest one was a 10 TPI left hand acme thread in bronze for the tailstock quill, that was good fun.





looks abit scruffy, ill mask it all up and paint once all repairs are complete
this is just a few pictures i had on photobucket of odds and ends..
its slow but im enjoying the repairs, as much as i just want to turn it on and get making chips it should be rewarding once complete


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## markba633csi (Mar 18, 2017)

Looks great! I'm glad you dove in and started fixing it.  Very nice lathe when you get it done. 
Cheers,
Mark S.


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## Gr1m3eaper (Mar 18, 2017)

Silverbullet said:


> Keep an eye on craigslist , machinery auctions , farm sales. Lots of places to pick up a nice lathe. I just have agreed to buy a rusty junk lathe. I only want the legs to mount my planer on . If you look at it , looks like a rusty pile but add a little work and it would be what you had bid on.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 yeah mate will do, been looking for a few good auction pages and sales pages, keeping my eye out, still trying to work out the size i want, seeing what kind of things i want to make then go from there.



bobshobby said:


> That machine looks very old and somewhat abused. I can't believe it's never been used, maybe by the person selling it. but it's got to be 60 or more years old, You'd be buying a can of worms at best. No lead screw, and probably near impossible to buy one. Why is the lead screw mising, was it crashed.
> 
> The first question I'd ask is how much can you afford, and what d you really want to achieve? Do you have any idea of the kind of things you want to make and or repair?
> 
> ...


 im not sure, the guy who was selling it bought it for a project, i guess to try and fix up but didnt get around to it, yeah it was quite difficult trying to find one hence why i didnt buy it and looking for something better. Well as far as budget goes, im thinking of setting it at about $2000 so ive got breathing room and that should cover quite a few lathes that im looking at. i need it to be single phase, the three phase machines are too big for my workspace and getting a converter or paying to have 3 phase power wired to my shed is not worth it for me at this point in time. for what i want to achieve, i want to make some lathe projects to cut my teeth on as ive never used a lathe before, custom computer parts mainly for my watercooling setup, gokart/drift trike/motorised bike bits n pieces as im a welder as well so love making random stuff in my shed. Yeah ill definently be going for a decent sixed one, the SIEG SC3 i linked too in a previous message i went and had a look at this weekend, it was WAY smaller than i thought. ill definently be going for something bigger, just so i can turn bigger diameter things and have more flexibility for in the future. i also want to repair my bench drill press table cause its like 30 degrees out so need to machine some parts for it  ive got a few lathes written down that im keeping my eyes on and to look at

oh wow mate that looks awesome, looks like a hell of a lot of work but should be amazing once its up and running especially for $500


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## Laytonnz (Mar 18, 2017)

Gr1m3eaper said:


> yeah mate will do, been looking for a few good auction pages and sales pages, keeping my eye out, still trying to work out the size i want, seeing what kind of things i want to make then go from there.
> 
> im not sure, the guy who was selling it bought it for a project, i guess to try and fix up but didnt get around to it, yeah it was quite difficult trying to find one hence why i didnt buy it and looking for something better. Well as far as budget goes, im thinking of setting it at about $2000 so ive got breathing room and that should cover quite a few lathes that im looking at. i need it to be single phase, the three phase machines are too big for my workspace and getting a converter or paying to have 3 phase power wired to my shed is not worth it for me at this point in time. for what i want to achieve, i want to make some lathe projects to cut my teeth on as ive never used a lathe before, custom computer parts mainly for my watercooling setup, gokart/drift trike/motorised bike bits n pieces as im a welder as well so love making random stuff in my shed. Yeah ill definently be going for a decent sixed one, the SIEG SC3 i linked too in a previous message i went and had a look at this weekend, it was WAY smaller than i thought. ill definently be going for something bigger, just so i can turn bigger diameter things and have more flexibility for in the future. i also want to repair my bench drill press table cause its like 30 degrees out so need to machine some parts for it  ive got a few lathes written down that im keeping my eyes on and to look at
> 
> oh wow mate that looks awesome, looks like a hell of a lot of work but should be amazing once its up and running especially for $500





Gr1m3eaper said:


> yeah mate will do, been looking for a few good auction pages and sales pages, keeping my eye out, still trying to work out the size i want, seeing what kind of things i want to make then go from there.
> 
> im not sure, the guy who was selling it bought it for a project, i guess to try and fix up but didnt get around to it, yeah it was quite difficult trying to find one hence why i didnt buy it and looking for something better. Well as far as budget goes, im thinking of setting it at about $2000 so ive got breathing room and that should cover quite a few lathes that im looking at. i need it to be single phase, the three phase machines are too big for my workspace and getting a converter or paying to have 3 phase power wired to my shed is not worth it for me at this point in time. for what i want to achieve, i want to make some lathe projects to cut my teeth on as ive never used a lathe before, custom computer parts mainly for my watercooling setup, gokart/drift trike/motorised bike bits n pieces as im a welder as well so love making random stuff in my shed. Yeah ill definently be going for a decent sixed one, the SIEG SC3 i linked too in a previous message i went and had a look at this weekend, it was WAY smaller than i thought. ill definently be going for something bigger, just so i can turn bigger diameter things and have more flexibility for in the future. i also want to repair my bench drill press table cause its like 30 degrees out so need to machine some parts for it  ive got a few lathes written down that im keeping my eyes on and to look at
> 
> oh wow mate that looks awesome, looks like a hell of a lot of work but should be amazing once its up and running especially for $500



i know the HQ400 gets a bad wrap on these forums but for a novice like me its fine, i can still turn accurate things... everything i have turned and needed accurate has turned out perfect or damn close to it... i think its more the set up time is abit more involved and taking youre time to make sure you hit the correct numbers but we arnt in a job shop where time matters, well for me it doesn't its just a hobby for a small machine it can swing 400mm and 500mm between centers i dont know of other machines that can swing those numbers in that size range i think they are definitely worth a look especially for the right price.

as for the "mill head" well its rubbish only good for drilling holes and very light milling witch leads to frustration, i have broken more end mills and wrecked parts then i have made so i dont bother anymore but as for the lathe the only gripe i have is the motor, it could probably do with atleast a 1HP motor the 3/4 thats on it bogs down under a decent cut in steel but the chips are coming off blue and looking like they should so ill just keep pushing it untill the motor dies and replace it.

i am adding a little homemade "DRO" to the lathe to make it more user friendly the hand wheel dials are rubbish pretty simple mod with a cheap tyre tread depth gauge

im heading down the Varible frequency drive path due to 3 phase motors being more robust and powerfull plus theres a bigger selection of motors for a cheaper price and the varible speed would be nice aswell to dial everything in where you want it i actually have a .55kw VFD here im thinking of putting on the hq400 to make it more user friendly while threading.

anyhow have fun lathe hunting! keep looking and the right thing will pop up just when you least expect it.


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## Downunder Bob (Mar 19, 2017)

Gr1m3eaper said:


> yeah mate will do, been looking for a few good auction pages and sales pages, keeping my eye out, still trying to work out the size i want, seeing what kind of things i want to make then go from there.
> 
> im not sure, the guy who was selling it bought it for a project, i guess to try and fix up but didnt get around to it, yeah it was quite difficult trying to find one hence why i didnt buy it and looking for something better. Well as far as budget goes, im thinking of setting it at about $2000 so ive got breathing room and that should cover quite a few lathes that im looking at. i need it to be single phase, the three phase machines are too big for my workspace and getting a converter or paying to have 3 phase power wired to my shed is not worth it for me at this point in time. for what i want to achieve, i want to make some lathe projects to cut my teeth on as ive never used a lathe before, custom computer parts mainly for my watercooling setup, gokart/drift trike/motorised bike bits n pieces as im a welder as well so love making random stuff in my shed. Yeah ill definently be going for a decent sixed one, the SIEG SC3 i linked too in a previous message i went and had a look at this weekend, it was WAY smaller than i thought. ill definently be going for something bigger, just so i can turn bigger diameter things and have more flexibility for in the future. i also want to repair my bench drill press table cause its like 30 degrees out so need to machine some parts for it  ive got a few lathes written down that im keeping my eyes on and to look at
> 
> oh wow mate that looks awesome, looks like a hell of a lot of work but should be amazing once its up and running especially for $500



$2000 that's where I started looking, and I ended up spending $5000. Have you tried writing down some lists. Like for instance what kind of things do you want to make or fix. Do you want to work on cars, new or old. 

Think about machining brake drums, or discs on more modern ones What about making new axles for cars or trailers. You need to think of the length of items you will be working on, do they need to fit through the headstock, what diam. What about threads, metric, imperial or both. You will need a lead screw and suitable gearbox.  Preferably a feed shaft for long and cross feeds.

If you plan to buy an older machine and do it up, do you the necessary mechanical skills, if you don't, this is not the way to learn, you'll just end up with a wrecked lateh.

I would not buy a second hand lathe except from a reputable machine dealer and make sure you get a reasonable warranty, see it running get them to demonstrate that it acn do a sample of something you will want it to do.

My general recommendation is to buy the biggest you can fit in the space you have, preferably at least one size bigger than you think you need. and spend a smuch as you can afford, Preferably stay well a way from chinese machines Taiwanese is ok. I know there some guys who have bought chineses machines and are quite happy with them but it's a bit of a lottery, for every good one you'll find a few bad ones .

Good luck and happy hunting.

Bob.


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## scwhite (Mar 19, 2017)

Gr1m3eaper said:


> Ah bugger i wish I would've known that before hand, ive put a max bid of $500  im guessing thats way too much for what it is? The guy whos selling it bought it for a project but never got around to using it. Now im starting to second guess and wondering if i should try and retract my max bid and look for something else


Yes


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## Gr1m3eaper (Mar 20, 2017)

bobshobby said:


> $2000 that's where I started looking, and I ended up spending $5000. Have you tried writing down some lists. Like for instance what kind of things do you want to make or fix. Do you want to work on cars, new or old.
> 
> Think about machining brake drums, or discs on more modern ones What about making new axles for cars or trailers. You need to think of the length of items you will be working on, do they need to fit through the headstock, what diam. What about threads, metric, imperial or both. You will need a lead screw and suitable gearbox.  Preferably a feed shaft for long and cross feeds.
> 
> ...



Ah okey dokey well my sheds quite confined atm until i build something a little bigger, my sheds just storage atm. Na i more than likely wont be working on cars, not into them really. More into bikes, go karts, drift trikes etc so ill be making parts for those when i get the lathe, making watercooling parts for my computer as ive got a mercedes benz radiator cooling it down, picked it up for $5.50 off ebay the guys at my work had no use for their pretty much brand new raditor for their 4WD as it was too big so instead of chucking it in the bin they gave it to me, want to hook both the radiators to my PC with polished copper piping, guages etc make it look steam punk so will definently need custom machined parts

I probabely wont be cutting internal threads or doing anything fancy, just simple stuff for now but ill be getting the bars and tools i need for it just in case i do need to use them.

Na i wont be getting an old machine to do up, ill be getting one that has everything working properly, runs smooth and cuts accurately so i dont have to deal with any headaches. New vs old machines which one would be better to go with? I like the idea of older machines because of the reliability, accuracy and the fact that older stuff just lasts longer most of the time but one thing i am worried about VS new machines is the availability of spare parts for the older machines. Is it easy to find replacement parts or do they just not fail and last and last?


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## arcsnsparks (Mar 20, 2017)

I'm a fairly new hobby machinist who was like you about 3 to 4 years ago. I dove in at a machinery dealer who had an old Atlas TH42-28. Not much came with it but the price I thought was right at 300 bucks and trade for my little AA Dunlap lathe which was very incomplete. He'd never seen one and I paid 5 dollars for it at a swap meet two years earlier. Couldn't find any parts for it. The Atlas came with the pretty rare maple top cabinet, a steady rest, 2 original motors, drum switch with reverse, a dead tailstock center, a spooky 4 jaw chuck with MALE square adjusting bolts circa 1890, and that gawd awful lantern tool post. It also came with lots of wear on the bed ways near the head stock.
What it didn't come with was a full set of change gears (always $150 on eBay). Trust me, there will come a time when you will want to cut threads. It also didn't come with the necessary rigidity desired of a lathe or the respect of people who own other makes such as a South Bend, Clausing, Lodge and Shipley, Hardinge, Lablonde
What I don't like about it is that there isn't a flat place on it other than the ways. I can't set a dial indicator anywhere beside these areas. It seems that I am making parts for this lathe more than I am making parts for other projects. The reverse/forward transmission crashed and busted so I'm now remaking that from aluminum. The Atlas loves aluminum. The spindle hole is smallish, under  25mm. 
So I like your thinking about getting a newer machine. Something from the 1970's and newer. 

So looking back, Id look for a bit more swing, the largest through spindle I could find, a good (new!) 3 jaw chuck, a modern 4 jaw chuck, an Aloris toolpost with all the adapters and cutting tools,quick change gearing, a VERY slow lead screw travel for a fine finish, a DRO setup, and affordable/ available tooling. Also made in USA for me, anyway.


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## Gr1m3eaper (Mar 20, 2017)

Ah okey dokey ive been going to machinery dealers and keeping my eye out, i stumbled across this one on gumtree today. I like it cause its australian made, looks to be good condition and is a southbend clone so parts are easy to find from what ive read. What would be a fair price for something like this? I tried googling it to find the dimensions, swing, distance between centers etc but nothing came up


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## Downunder Bob (Mar 21, 2017)

Gr1m3eaper said:


> Ah okey dokey ive been going to machinery dealers and keeping my eye out, i stumbled across this one on gumtree today. I like it cause its australian made, looks to be good condition and is a southbend clone so parts are easy to find from what ive read. What would be a fair price for something like this? I tried googling it to find the dimensions, swing, distance between centers etc but nothing came up
> 
> View attachment 229309
> View attachment 229310
> View attachment 229311



Hercus a well regarded name. These lathes were very capable in their day providing they were in good condition. I did quite a bit of work on one of these during my apprenticeship, in the early 60's.  

The name AR 9 gives it away. A is for feed screw gearbox, R is for roller bearings on the main shaft. 9 is 9 inch swing. The lathe is a little small for my liking, but it may suit you. I think it originally came with a 1/2 HP single phase motor, and that is all it needs. 3 phase will give you reverse, but be careful if the chuck is screw on. The lack of motor and drive belt is of concern because you cant see and hear it run, I wouldn't buy it without that, it could be a basket case, in which case I wouldn't give it a value of more than a couple of hundred dollars. 

The serious collector and dedicated re-builder would probably consider it worth more, because of it's historical value.

I would be more interested in the Hercus 260 also advertised on Gum tree and in Melbourne, a much later model looks to be in fair condition, and better specs also with quite a few tools and accessories, A fair price in my book.


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## Gr1m3eaper (Mar 21, 2017)

Okey dokey well hes asking $1000 atm but says its negotiable, so would it not be worth buying with no motor? Id love to get it seeing as its made in australia but i dont want a crap lathe that im going to be fixing and getting frustrated with, im going to have a look at it this weekend what would you guys offer him for the lathe as is?


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## Laytonnz (Mar 22, 2017)

Gr1m3eaper said:


> Okey dokey well hes asking $1000 atm but says its negotiable, so would it not be worth buying with no motor? Id love to get it seeing as its made in australia but i dont want a crap lathe that im going to be fixing and getting frustrated with, im going to have a look at it this weekend what would you guys offer him for the lathe as is?


It's pretty damn hard to determine how worn a machine is if it can't be tested out.... it may look fine and be totally clapped out.. take the saddle to the headstock made sure it's all tight then try go towards the tailstock. .. at least that will give you an idea how worn the bed is if it gets tight there is a fair amount of wear, not to say it's unusable just given you an idea what you are buying maybe even chuck a piece of drill rod or something and try slip a feeler Guage in the front of the chuck jaws see how bell mouthed the jaws are might give you an indication how much use its seen

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


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## Gr1m3eaper (Mar 22, 2017)

Okey dokey will do, ill write that down and keep and eye out. Ive been watching a few youtube vids today on what to look out for wheb buying a used lathe and got lots of pointers so ill be checking all that when i have a look. The thing im concerned about is the price, ive got no idea how much these lathes are worth brand new or even what similair size/brands go for. If the bedways are in good condition, the tail stock, apron, cross slide etc all work smoothly and theres no binding what would it be worth? Note that it has no motor attached to the lathe atm, hes got a three phase motor hes chucking in that used to be on there, ill provs be going for a single phase or getting a 3 phase inverter whichever is the cheapest option


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## Laytonnz (Mar 22, 2017)

Gr1m3eaper said:


> Okey dokey will do, ill write that down and keep and eye out. Ive been watching a few youtube vids today on what to look out for wheb buying a used lathe and got lots of pointers so ill be checking all that when i have a look. The thing im concerned about is the price, ive got no idea how much these lathes are worth brand new or even what similair size/brands go for. If the bedways are in good condition, the tail stock, apron, cross slide etc all work smoothly and theres no binding what would it be worth? Note that it has no motor attached to the lathe atm, hes got a three phase motor hes chucking in that used to be on there, ill provs be going for a single phase or getting a 3 phase inverter whichever is the cheapest option



To be honest, I personally wouldn't want to spend anymore then $750 in fair condition, let's face is its seen 60?ish years of use? And abuse? Why did it have the motor taken off? Why did he stop using it? What was it used for? Why's he selling it? What tooling comes with it? Put you're finger in the tailstock and check how rough it feels if there's much scoring ...

I say around 750 due to here in new Zealand you can pick up a Boxford or similar in decent condition for $1500 with decent tooling there's many myford's they seem to fetch a good price...

But I'm sure somebody with better knowledge will chime in shortly

http://www.trademe.co.nz/business-f...ork/lathes-accessories/auction-1284915930.htm
http://www.trademe.co.nz/business-f...ork/lathes-accessories/auction-1286843058.htm
http://www.trademe.co.nz/business-f...ork/lathes-accessories/auction-1285087735.htm
http://www.trademe.co.nz/business-f...ork/lathes-accessories/auction-1285713928.htm
http://www.trademe.co.nz/business-f...ork/lathes-accessories/auction-1284960661.htm
http://www.trademe.co.nz/business-f...ork/lathes-accessories/auction-1284280042.htm
http://www.trademe.co.nz/business-f...ork/lathes-accessories/auction-1284474718.htm

The list goes on!

Ps.. check out prices for a decent single phase motor!


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## graham-xrf (Mar 22, 2017)

Gr1m3eaper said:


> Alright guys will do, ill message the guy to see if i can retract the bid and shop for something better, ill definently be asking lots of questions especially here.


Hi Gr1m3eaper
I am the Brit who broke the "don't have a beer with your buddies and go shopping on eBay at the same time" rule. Things worked out OK, but it shows the point that if the deadline has not passed, you can retract, and it "winds back" to the previous good bid. 
http://www.hobby-machinist.com/threads/the-147-71-green-south-bend-something.47491/#post-401546


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## Downunder Bob (Mar 22, 2017)

Gr1m3eaper said:


> Okey dokey well hes asking $1000 atm but says its negotiable, so would it not be worth buying with no motor? Id love to get it seeing as its made in australia but i dont want a crap lathe that im going to be fixing and getting frustrated with, im going to have a look at it this weekend what would you guys offer him for the lathe as is?


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## Downunder Bob (Mar 22, 2017)

Gr1m3eaper said:


> Okey dokey well hes asking $1000 atm but says its negotiable, so would it not be worth buying with no motor? Id love to get it seeing as its made in australia but i dont want a crap lathe that im going to be fixing and getting frustrated with, im going to have a look at it this weekend what would you guys offer him for the lathe as is?



I wouldn't even make an offer if I couldn't see and hear it run. the fact that it doesn't have  a motor or a drive belt rings very large bells to me. The seller is making sure you can't test it, That tells me he is looking for a sucker, don't you be the sucker. If you would spend $1000 on this why wouldn't you spend $1500 on the Hercus 260 also advertised on Gum tree and in Melbourne, a much later model looks to be in fair condition, and better specs also with quite a few tools and accessories, A fair price in my book. A much better deal all round. Go have a look at it.


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