# Best size lathe for home use / new import



## Junkman Noparts

Hi everyone I'm retired heavy equipment mechanic and a beginner at machining. I have put a deposit on a pm1236 lathe and could use some advice on the best size lathe for home use ( making parts for my old 50's tractor ,truck,so on ) i think i can call them and change my order to a pm1440E-LB so with not having a size reference only photos . So what do you guys think ?
My first lathe was from Toolots it was a 1330 ANMEC it weighed around 600lb it was ok more like a toy. I know the pm 1236 is twice that . Thanks


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## mikey

If I were making parts for trucks and tractors, the smallest lathe I would even consider would be a 14 - 16" lathe.


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## tjb

mikey said:


> If I were making parts for trucks and tractors, the smallest lathe I would even consider would be a 14 - 16" lathe.


Me, too.


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## mmcmdl

If it were me and $$$$ and space were no object , the 14" would be ordered . JMO . Big lathes can make small parts , small lathes can't make big parts .


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## kdecelles

I have a machine that is identical to the pm1440e-lb

It does everything I need with my only complaint being that you need to change gears to cut standard threads. Have a look at the manual and work out cutting 3/18-16 , 5/8-18, 1;2-13 and all three require changing gears. Just a pet peeve —- the quick change gears is limited

I also have a southbend 9c and find it does smaller things really well.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## mikey

Junkman, welcome to HM - forgot to welcome you.

If you can at all come close to affording it, look at the PM 1440GT or the Eisen 1440E. Both are Taiwanese lathes and will give you some serious bang for the buck. The difference in quality of Chinese vs Taiwanese lathes is significant and the collective experience on this forum strongly points to Taiwanese lathes as having much better quality. At this price point, it is a good idea to give Eisen and PM a call to discuss these lathes before buying.

I will offer one more bit of advice. Figure out what size lathe you need and then learn all you can about which features are important on those lathes and why they matter. Camlock spindles, bigger spindle bores, the type of gearbox, the travel of the cross slide and the tailstock ram, width between the rails, weight, HP of the motor and phase, and many other things matter. You cannot put these things on afterwards; they must be there to begin with so take your time, learn all you can, and then talk to the guys on the forum who own the lathe you are interested in. You cannot tell how good a lathe is from reading hype on a web page; the guys will tell you what's what for real.

If you cannot afford the lathe you really want then wait and save up until you can. Don't "make do" just because of money. You will not be happy in the long run.


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## rabler

Junkman Noparts said:


> i think i can call them and change my order to a pm1440E-LB so with not having a size reference only photos . So what do you guys think ?
> My first lathe was from Toolots it was a 1330 ANMEC it weighed around 600lb it was ok more like a toy. I know the pm 1236 is twice that . Thanks


If it's in the budget, go bigger!!!


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## Winegrower

I’d say, call them up.


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## markba633csi

Get the bigger lathe if you can afford it and have the space and a solid floor
-Mark


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## jbobb1

What everybody else says.
The last sentence in Mikey's last post sums it all up!


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## Junkman Noparts

mikey said:


> Junkman, welcome to HM - forgot to welcome you.
> 
> If you can at all come close to affording it, look at the PM 1440GT or the Eisen 1440E. Both are Taiwanese lathes and will give you some serious bang for the buck. The difference in quality of Chinese vs Taiwanese lathes is significant and the collective experience on this forum strongly points to Taiwanese lathes as having much better quality. At this price point, it is a good idea to give Eisen and PM a call to discuss these lathes before buying.
> 
> I will offer one more bit of advice. Figure out what size lathe you need and then learn all you can about which features are important on those lathes and why they matter. Camlock spindles, bigger spindle bores, the type of gearbox, the travel of the cross slide and the tailstock ram, width between the rails, weight, HP of the motor and phase, and many other things matter. You cannot put these things on afterwards; they must be there to begin with so take your time, learn all you can, and then talk to the guys on the forum who own the lathe you are interested in. You cannot tell how good a lathe is from reading hype on a web page; the guys will tell you what's what for real.
> 
> If you cannot afford the lathe you really want then wait and save up until you can. Don't "make do" just because of money. You will not be happy in the long run.


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## Larry$

I went with a PM1440HD about 5 years ago. I do some repair work on factory tools. But I'm retired so I don't have to do that stuff. I'm glad I went with the 1440 size. It is Chinese and has worked fine but you can tell quality control wasn't high on their list. Nothing that has affected the accuracy. Almost all imperial threads can be run with out change gear fooling around. Metric requires varying the change gears. The D1-4 spindle has been fine, quick, easy chuck changes. It only has a 1 1/2" spindle bore but that really hasn't been much of an issue for me. The # of spindle speeds from 40 to 1800+ has been fine. Threading works fine, easy to engage the half nuts. The DRO it came with has worked well. So have the tool holders and QCTP. I got a very nice collet chuck and set of collets as an accessory when I bought the lathe. The taper attachment has a minor issue that I still need to improve. The bed is wide and heavy, nicely ground. 3hp, 3 phase, plenty of power. I've added an 8" 3 jaw so I don't have to use the 8" 4 jaw unless I really need the accuracy or for odd parts. The jump from included 6" to the 8" is big.


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## Junkman Noparts

Thanks for your input and i agree with all  . I'm 60 and might settle with PM 1236 it's paid for and I'm waiting for them to ship it i think if i call Monday they might let me upgrade to PM 1440LB . If they do  it's just under two grand more that's it for me .
The other thing is at my age I'm trying to justifying the expense of a 1440 size machine .I do have some legit projects on my tractor i built a front end loader from scratch for it . i need to make a drive shaft and couplers for the HYD.pump and turn down some 1 1/2  - 1 3/4  steel pins after that it's a new hobby .
So anyone own a 1236 chinese machine and regret not getting the 1440 size chinese . Thanks JM


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## .LMS.

Junkman Noparts said:


> The other thing is at my age I'm trying to justifying the expense of a 1440 size machine .



I mentioned this in another thread.  Your age and the fact that you've made it this far through the rat race is all the justification you need to buy a nicer tool.  You earned it - now have some fun.


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## talvare

Junkman Noparts said:


> Thanks for your input and i agree with all  . I'm 60 and might settle with PM 1236 it's paid for and I'm waiting for them to ship it i think if i call Monday they might let me upgrade to PM 1440LB . If they do  it's just under two grand more that's it for me .
> The other thing is at my age I'm trying to justifying the expense of a 1440 size machine .I do have some legit projects on my tractor i built a front end loader from scratch for it . i need to make a drive shaft and couplers for the HYD.pump and turn down some 1 1/2  - 1 3/4  steel pins after that it's a new hobby .
> So anyone own a 1236 chinese machine and regret not getting the 1440 size chinese . Thanks JM


For the type of work you are describing, I would absolutely go for the 1440. Mostly for the extra mass of the machine. Mass generally equates to more rigidity which is one of the most important attributes of a lathe. Also, you will come to really appreciate that 2" spindle bore (especially when turning those 1 3/4" pins you're talking about). The D1-5 spindle mount is also a nice upgrade. Anyway, just my two cents.
Ted


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## Junkman Noparts

Thanks Again to everyone 
I sent an E'Mail to PM. asking if it was too late to change my order i will also call there's 3HR time difference . It's Sunday.
One thing that caught my eye was the max diameter of the follow and steady rest the 1236 is 1/4-3/4 and 1 1/2 the 1440 is 1in. and 3in. max .
To me something like this is big because i want and will use these also having a 2 inch through spindle bore . 
I was reading some post of the 1236 but wish there was someone that own a 1236 to give some input .

I also bought a Bolton zx45 mill base model  6 months ago and am not real happy with it wish it was a knee mill . It has 4 axis  DRO X axis  power feed have the parts for Z axis power feed off lead screw and power feed for the quill and when i get that done i want to add a two pulley belt drive for slower and higher speeds . One thing i found the keyway coupling to the motor pickup harmonics from using a 3in facing cutter . so i packed some grease in the shaft this support my belt drive upgrade .

On a side note i rode motocross all threw the years and I'm paying for it and know guys that bought UTV Razors 25 Grand or new mx bikes 8 to 10 Grand so to me this is not much different .Thanks Steve


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## 7milesup

Sounds like you are committed to the PM machines.  I purchased an Eisen 1440E a little while ago for $7500 delivered.  Taiwan machine.  Only possible down side is the 1-9/16" spindle bore. Their website lists a higher price but I called them and haggled it down.
As you have already discovered with the Bolton mill, too small of a machine costs money.

None of us know your financial situation, but if you can afford to go bigger, that is the route to pursue.  The Razors etc that you pointed out above will be worth nearly nothing in 10 years.  Your lathe will likely be worth what you paid for it, or more.  I just sold my PM1022 lathe for $700 more than I paid for it after owning it for 4 or 5 years.


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## Junkman Noparts

Ye I'm committed to precision matthews after making a deposit and like i said I'm going to go for the 1440 chinese machine it's like $7000 shipped. I would like the taiwanese one but i need to stop here.
Thanks JM


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## .LMS.

For that money, you can get a taiwanese machine.  1236T for sure, maybe 1340GT.


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## 7milesup

$500 more you can get an Eisen 1440E made in Taiwan with DRO installed and shipped to your door.

Not sure how you made the deposit but if by credit card it would be easy to get out of. I would not spend $7k on a Chinese lathe.  YMMV


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## 7milesup

Cripes.  I just looked at your location. Eisen is practically in your back yard.


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## Junkman Noparts

Eisen 1236 GH $7095.00 base price sold out Eisen 1440E $9195.00 base price sold out if i was going to spend $10000.00 i still might buy from PM
Found a add on EBay Eisen 1440  $11995.00 free shipping +tax  so PM 1440LB $6910.86 WLG service 
I like the PM 1340 GT $5999.00 base price sold out OCT 2021 time in


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## Junkman Noparts

So no one is going to stand up for the 1236 machine is it to small or to light or it' made in china (so is the 1440LB )
The 1236 w cast iron stand 1450 lb The 1440LB  w cast iron  1800 lb


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## Larry$

Interesting weight comparison. 1440LB @ 1800#, PM1440HD 2750#. Same capacity machine, 50% increase in wt. 
Where? Much of it probably due to the bed width. 7 3/8" to 10.25" a 40% increase. 
They didn't list the bed depth but it probably increases proportionately. Given the relationship of cross sections to torsional stiffness the HD model will likely have more than a 100% stiffer body. 
The only other big advantage for the HD is it's slowest spindle speed 40 VS 70. Top speed on a lathe doesn't count for much.
The LB has it's main advantage in spindle bore. 
There are many things you can't tell from reading spec sheets.


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## 7milesup

A few points..

1.)  When comparing lathe weights one needs to look at the base.  Many times a cast iron base accounts for a substantial increase in weight.  The PM1440GT does not have a cast iron base so weighs less than the PM1440HB or HD.  I would still pick the 1440GT.
2.) Spindle bore size is PM's claim to fame.  I believe my Eisen is made in the same factory as the PM 1440GT.

3.) Yes, the Eisen is $9100 on the website.  As I mentioned earlier, I talked them down to $7500.  My reasoning was they sell these on eBay too and eBay charges a minimum of 10% seller fee.  That is nearly $1000 so I figured that was a good place to start.
       a.)  The Eisen comes with the DRO.  The DRO is already installed.  Add $800 to the PM for that.
       b.)  The Eisen has free shipping.  Precision Matthews charges $400-$450 for delivery. 

If you want a lathe now, you will probably have to settle for Chinese.  Most of the Taiwan lathes are sold out.  

Without hands on experience, one may wonder what is the difference between a China mainland and Taiwan lathe.  Well, just one piece of anecdotal evidence from my experience is the tailstock.  On my Chinese PM1022, the quill on the tailstock was so sloppy that drilling a simple center hole was challenging.  In fact, the quill was so bad that I was going to make a new one that actually fit.  Then I decide to hell with it and  sold it.  The Taiwanese 1440 does not have that issue.  The quill is very precise.  Just one of a number of issues that I had.

I may sound like an Eisen fanboy, but what I am pointing out is that there are many more options than PM or Grizzly for good machines.  Acra, Acer, Kent USA are a few others.


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## Just for fun

Junkman Noparts said:


> So no one is going to stand up for the 1236 machine is it to small or to light or it' made in china (so is the 1440LB )
> The 1236 w cast iron stand 1450 lb The 1440LB  w cast iron  1800 lb


I think there are a few on here with the 1236, personally I'm looking at the 1236T.  I was originally looking at the 1236 precision but trying to avoid buying anything from China.

Sounds like it might be a little late but ask on the Precision Matthews section about the 1236 you are looking at.   

I don't know what kind of parts you are wanting to make,  but you know the story bigger is always better.

Tim


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## Janderso

Junkman,
It looks like you are getting lots of good advice. We are all pretty good at helping others spend their money!
There are so many threads that involve new machinists that are looking for advise on which machine tool to buy.
These threads repeatedly get lots of traffic.
I always read through the posts. The discussions always seem to include, buy the biggest machine you can afford and buy Taiwanese if you can.
The demand for machines right now must be high or production/shipping must be an issue.
So many products are on back order or out of stock.


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## .LMS.

Janderso said:


> We are all pretty good at helping others spend their money!



Ha - my favorite advice, both given and taken is "but for only $x more you can get..."


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## Hozzie

Only you can decide the money you are willing to spend, but regardless, I would find the largest Taiwanese machine in the price range I was willing accept.  If I couldn't get as big as I wanted now, I would save and wait.  Maybe the delayed availability is a good thing.


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## Larry$

Is there any value in the claim that a machine is made in a 9002 certified factory?


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## Junkman Noparts

Thanks for all advice i don't like that everything is made in china . ok when i agreed to the deposit for $1000.00 non refundable so going somewhere else was not an option . so i talk to PM they told me that the 1340GT does not come with all the stuff that the 1236 or 1440 come with and no foot brake ( brake is no big deal ) the GT's are ten grand i should of settled with the 1236 but i went with the 1440LB . i think i did ok .
So like i said i had a cheep 1330 toolots machine it was a little on the small side for me physical size so that's why i went with the 1440-the LB part i can't afford the best . Thanks to all


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## 7milesup

We all have different needs, wants and financial limits.  I am sure that you will enjoy your new lathe and PM is known for their great service.  

Congrats on the new lathe.
Also, once you get, per the forum rules (or at least the ones us members made up) requires that you post pictures.


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## Larry$

My guess is you will be happy with the 1440LB. The bigger capacity and those occasions when you'd like to have the big bore will make some things much easier. Like has been said, you can make small on a bigger machine but not the other way around. Just buy tooling and accessories as you need them. All the things you want to add mount up. It's OK to buy the Chinese accessory stuff. Some is perfectly serviceable some not so much. 

A lathe and a mill make a set. I'm guessing you don't have access to a mill - yet. I hate to say it but the same choices come up again when you start looking for a mill. New/used, bench or knee, Chinese/Taiwan/European and a lot more accessories. The rabbit hole is deep!


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## macardoso

Junkman Noparts said:


> Thanks for your input and i agree with all  . I'm 60 and might settle with PM 1236 it's paid for and I'm waiting for them to ship it i think if i call Monday they might let me upgrade to PM 1440LB . If they do  it's just under two grand more that's it for me .
> The other thing is at my age I'm trying to justifying the expense of a 1440 size machine .I do have some legit projects on my tractor i built a front end loader from scratch for it . i need to make a drive shaft and couplers for the HYD.pump and turn down some 1 1/2  - 1 3/4  steel pins after that it's a new hobby .
> So anyone own a 1236 chinese machine and regret not getting the 1440 size chinese . Thanks JM


I own a 12x36 and love the size. Granted I'm not doing truck/farm work, but I've turned some 5" blocks without issue. It was the fine line between big enough to do real work and small enough at 1000lbs to get into a basement.

The basement shop is a unique challenge for me. If I had a ground floor shop I wouldn't mind a 13 or 14" lathe.


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## bakrch

Junkman Noparts said:


> So no one is going to stand up for the 1236 machine is it to small or to light or it' made in china (so is the 1440LB )
> The 1236 w cast iron stand 1450 lb The 1440LB  w cast iron  1800 lb



I have the Chinese PM1236. It makes good parts, but the quality is very, well ... Chinese and I do regret not going 1236T or 1340GT. 

I also work with mostly Taiwanese lathes at work as well as old Monarch and LeBlond. The Taiwanese quality isn't magic or anything just another price point/expectation that is above the Chinese machines, yet still miles away from old American iron. 

If you are expecting a lathe that will be great out of the box, you may regret the 1440LB, but if you go in knowing a Chinese machine will need a little TLC to get it where it needs to be I think you will largely be happy with it.  Honestly, it sounds like you need the larger capacity with the kind of work you are doing, can always upgrade later on if the level of quality gets to you.  Either way, the 1440LB is going to pay for itself and then some, it really comes down to how you feel about it after spending time on it.


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## Junkman Noparts

Larry$ said:


> My guess is you will be happy with the 1440LB. The bigger capacity and those occasions when you'd like to have the big bore will make some things much easier. Like has been said, you can make small on a bigger machine but not the other way around. Just buy tooling and accessories as you need them. All the things you want to add mount up. It's OK to buy the Chinese accessory stuff. Some is perfectly serviceable some not so much.
> 
> A lathe and a mill make a set. I'm guessing you don't have access to a mill - yet. I hate to say it but the same choices come up again when you start looking for a mill. New/used, bench or knee, Chinese/Taiwan/European and a lot more accessories. The rabbit hole is deep!


I have a mill bought last year Bolton  zx45 base model and I,v added x power and 4 axis DRO and have the motors for Z and the quill and the materials to make a two speed belt drive minus the belt drive i might try to sell it and make some money on it to go towards a knee mill .


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## Junkman Noparts

bakrch said:


> I have the Chinese PM1236. It makes good parts, but the quality is very, well ... Chinese and I do regret not going 1236T or 1340GT.
> 
> I also work with mostly Taiwanese lathes at work as well as old Monarch and LeBlond. The Taiwanese quality isn't magic or anything just another price point/expectation that is above the Chinese machines, yet still miles away from old American iron.
> 
> If you are expecting a lathe that will be great out of the box, you may regret the 1440LB, but if you go in knowing a Chinese machine will need a little TLC to get it where it needs to be I think you will largely be happy with it.  Honestly, it sounds like you need the larger capacity with the kind of work you are doing, can always upgrade later on if the level of quality gets to you.  Either way, the 1440LB is going to pay for itself and then some, it really comes down to how you feel about it after spending time on it.


I wanted to know what size was best for most hobby guys at home . the lathe i bought last year was a 1330 no change box 12 speed gear head reel light duty so i sold it .If it was a HD USA made i would still have it . So ordering the 1236 i know is twice the weight w stand I'd be safe hope i didn't go to big and it would be nice to have the added cash back. from the 1440 .


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## Hozzie

There are thousands of similar machines out there.  Odds are it will work for you quite well.  It is certainly much more machine than the 1236 so I think you will be happy.  Congrats.


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## Junkman Noparts

A story 25 or so years ago i pass up a deal from my neighbor his dad died ( machinist with in the air craft ind.) a bridgeport mill and same color lathe like the size of a PM 1440 HD and all the tooling i could ever use $2500.00  didn't know how to move it and run power for it . well that's life
Thanks guys i will send some photos


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## Junkman Noparts

mikey said:


> If I were making parts for trucks and tractors, the smallest lathe I would even consider would be a 1


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## Just for fun

Congrats on the order.  I'm still just dreaming of one.  I need to complete my Hot Rod project and build a building to house the machining equipment first.  It will happen!

Again Congrats!  Looking forward to seeing that bad boy!


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## Junkman Noparts

PM said it might go out end of this week I,v been watching youtube and am happy i went with the 1440 size ther GT looks nice but if i did that i wouldn't be able to get a PM 935 mill or maybe a used one .it's just a hope right now and thanks for the help guys.
Thanks JM


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## Junkman Noparts

Ok so i looked at the Eisen looks nice but why is the price of the 1440E 3ph $6300.00  1440E 3ph two speed is $6700.00 and the 1440E 1ph is $9200.00 still the single phase is out of my price range guess cold get the 3ph and by a new motor of Ebay .
So in my case mine PM1440E-LB has shipped should of went with the PM1440GS looking at the add but read through the manual and don't see harden headstock gears i do think the quick change gear box and spindle bearings are better . PM still has good pricing compared to others with same specs.   Thanks JM


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## Larry$

Junkman, Don't look for perfection, it doesn't exist. The lathe you are getting will do fine. It is way better than trying to use some worn out 50 year old machine that got to the point the last guy didn't want to put up with it anymore. I bought a new Chinese lathe knowing I wasn't getting perfection. Turns out to be a far better machine than I am or ever will be a machinist. My personal failure is getting in a hurry. It will usually come back to bite me.


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## Junkman Noparts

Larry$ said:


> My guess is you will be happy with the 1440LB. The bigger capacity and those occasions when you'd like to have the big bore will make some things much easier. Like has been said, you can make small on a bigger machine but not the other way around. Just buy tooling and accessories as you need them. All the things you want to add mount up. It's OK to buy the Chinese accessory stuff. Some is perfectly serviceable some not so much.
> 
> A lathe and a mill make a set. I'm guessing you don't have access to a mill - yet. I hate to say it but the same choices come up again when you start looking for a mill. New/used, bench or knee, Chinese/Taiwan/European and a lot more accessories. The rabbit hole is deep!


Yes i am excited and have started down that hole I've been bitten by the bug.


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## Junkman Noparts

Hi everyone thanks for all your comments I know it's been a little while but I've been trying to wire up the shop with two 20 amp plugs one for the lathe and one for my new Mill and my place is a mess note that I know that's a 15 amp breaker in the subpanel
thanks again junkman


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## hanermo2

Congrats.
You probably made a great choice, and will likely be very happy with it.

PM has a great rep.
Their tools have a great rep.


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## Junkman Noparts

hanermo2 said:


> Congrats.
> You probably made a great choice, and will likely be very happy with it.
> 
> PM has a great rep.
> Their tools have a great rep.


Thanks Didn't want to deal with finding a good used lathe ( i looked ) or posable problems .  These are not cheep $ i was going to sell a truck i have and get a PM935s mill but came across Ebay add for the Mighty Comet  NOS got it for $3200 so wish i could of found a deal like that on the lathe . Still for two new machines of this size for ten grand is good . 
Thanks JM


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