# So Far 2018, Sucks, I Seriously Hope It Gets Better



## Buffalo20 (Jan 1, 2018)

I had a minor fire at the house, I was very lucky, all I lost was a furnace. I had a complete heat exchanger failure, and the furnace kept right on running. I had flames shooting out the air intake box, sides are distorted and obviously burnt. 

With the temp outdoors is about -11F, so at this point the heating system consist of (2) 23k btu Kerosun heaters. One in the living room and one in the basement,currently it about 65F in the house. 

So, first thing,tomorrow morning the quest for a new furnace, starts.

No real smoke damage, I put the fire out, disconnected the electric and the gas, now it’s just a damage hulk. I was very luck, absolutely no other property or possession loss, just a 20 yr old furnace. Looking back on this, if it’s just the furnace, maybe we were blessed.


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## Ken from ontario (Jan 1, 2018)

It sounds like the fire was quickly contained before it could spread and we all know how fast a home fire can spread and turn into a disaster or god forbid, a tragedy., the main thing to remember is  you and people around you are fine,I know it sucks to start a new year with such unexpected expense to deal with .


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## jmarkwolf (Jan 1, 2018)

Glad it wasn't any worse for you.

We replaced our perfectly functional 25-year old furnace a few weeks ago, for fear of a similar malfunction.


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## francist (Jan 1, 2018)

My only experience with Kerosun heaters was many years ago in the glass shop. Kept getting sleepy all the time, couldn't figure it out, until the penny dropped. Fortunately before I dropped. Please make sure you have fresh air available when using those things.

-frank


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## woodchucker (Jan 1, 2018)

Buffalo20 said:


> I had a minor fire at the house, I was very lucky, all I lost was a furnace. I had a complete heat exchanger failure, and the furnace kept right on running. I had flames shooting out the air intake box, sides are distorted and obviously burnt.
> 
> With the temp outdoors is about -11F, so at this point the heating system consist of (2) 23k btu Kerosun heaters. One in the living room and one in the basement,currently it about 65F in the house.
> 
> ...



You are quite lucky, so 2018 is not so bad after all. you could have lost your lives, your house...
I hope your good luck continues. Please be careful with that kero heater. Maybe go buy a couple of electric heaters for the bedrooms so you can sleep w/o the carbon monoxide. I hope you have carbon monoxide detectors so you can be warned if the level gets too high.


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## GA Gyro (Jan 1, 2018)

francist said:


> My only experience with Kerosun heaters was many years ago in the glass shop. Kept getting sleepy all the time, couldn't figure it out, until the penny dropped. Fortunately before I dropped. Please make sure you have fresh air available when using those things.
> 
> -frank



Yes... please be careful with combustion heaters that are not vented...
CO (carbon monoxide) is seriously dangerous...

As noted above... the first noticeable symptoms are feeling sluggish and drowsy...
If you sleep with too high a concentration... you may not wake up... 
Not meaning to throw out scare tactics... 
However I run a heating and AC company, and an certified in CO inspection.

Please be careful... and IMO just pay the $$$ and get a new furnace.

If you need some advise on what/when/where...
Here is a forum with an open area:
HVAC-Talk.com...
Look for the AOP (ask our professionals) area and post your situation...


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## Ulma Doctor (Jan 1, 2018)

Hi Buffalo20, 
i'm very sorry to hear that you had the fire, but i'm relieved that you are ok.


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## markba633csi (Jan 1, 2018)

Glad you're OK Buff, good thing you caught it in time
Mark


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## Terrywerm (Jan 1, 2018)

Happy to hear that everyone is doing okay and that you found the problem before it got worse. I recently lost an old friend to carbon monoxide poisoning. He lived in an old house with an old furnace and had little money due to health issues and being disabled. He and his dog were found in a chair in the front room of the house, they had both been dead for a number of days.

I believe 2018 is off to a better start than you might initially think. Keep your chin up, we're all thinking about you.


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## john.oliver35 (Jan 1, 2018)

Glad everyone, and all your stuff, is OK!  I replaced a 20+ heater and AC last year, which were working fine but definitely aging.  As a bonus though, I figure this year I saved $1000 in electricity and $500 in gas because of the higher efficiency!  Look at it as a way to lower your monthly costs for the next 20 years.


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## Buffalo20 (Jan 1, 2018)

GA Gyro said:


> Yes... please be careful with combustion heaters that are not vented...
> CO (carbon monoxide) is seriously dangerous...
> 
> As noted above... the first noticeable symptoms are feeling sluggish and drowsy...
> ...



Yes, I have a couple of CO monitors. I’m an industrial boiler service tech for over 40 yrs, I normally work on much bigger stuff, the guy who is going to replace the furnace, is scheduled to be here at 9 am, tomorrow morning.


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## Z2V (Jan 1, 2018)

Fortunately you were there to deal with it quickly and minimize damage. Hopefully the rest of 2018 will be good to you.


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## Latinrascalrg1 (Jan 1, 2018)

Mr Buffalo I can understand why you feel that 2018 got off to such a bad start but Take a look from a different perspective......Accidents happen and things will always break but think how bad it could have been had you not been there to put the fire out so quickly or even worse you and family fast asleep in bed!
I think that old saying "Never look a gift horse in the mouth" fits this situation perfectly.  I hope your year is Great and only gets better.


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## brino (Jan 1, 2018)

Very glad you are okay! That could have been so much worse........

-brino


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## texanjohn (Jan 2, 2018)

Not such a bad start to the new year, no ones hurt and you have a whole year to recoup your loss of a bad heater, if you had funerals to go to that would have been a bad start, you sir are blessed. Hope your luck holds for the rest of 2018


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## Groundhog (Jan 2, 2018)

Important Note on CO2 monitors.
*** The incident described here happened 7 years ago. The CO2 sensors were the same 5 years ago (the technology could have changed since but not to my knowledge). ***

CO2 monitors DO NOT WORK reliably after they have been exposed to temperatures below 32 degrees. It does not matter that they have been warmed up again. (how do you know they have not been exposed to low temps in shipping?)

We found this out at a ski area I worked at after having to send an employee by helicopter to an oxygen therapy tank for 2 days. Then therapy for 2 more months. We found him right next to a CO2 monitor in a propane heated lift shack. Thank God he eventually recovered with no apparent brain damage.
I did a lot of research after that and this is what I found after talking with several manufactures, engineers, OSHA, etc.

I am not going to respond/argue with anyone disputing this. I did enough research (not google type), talked to enough experts that I am satisfied this is true. If you don't agree, well I hope you don't bet anyone's life on your decision.
I almost lost someone by believing sales pitches saying they work after warming up.


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## 4GSR (Jan 2, 2018)

Groundhog said:


> Important Note on CO2 monitors.
> *** The incident described here happened 7 years ago. The CO2 sensors were the same 5 years ago (the technology could have changed since but not to my knowledge). ***
> 
> CO2 monitors DO NOT WORK reliably after they have been exposed to temperatures below 32 degrees. It does not matter that they have been warmed up again. (how do you know they have not been exposed to low temps in shipping?)
> ...


Excellent information to know.  

Thanks for sharing.

Ken


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## RJSakowski (Jan 2, 2018)

Groundhog said:


> Important Note on CO2 monitors.
> *** The incident described here happened 7 years ago. The CO2 sensors were the same 5 years ago (the technology could have changed since but not to my knowledge). ***
> 
> CO2 monitors DO NOT WORK reliably after they have been exposed to temperatures below 32 degrees. It does not matter that they have been warmed up again. (how do you know they have not been exposed to low temps in shipping?)
> ...


What type of CO monitor was it?  There are four different technologies used.


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## Groundhog (Jan 3, 2018)

RJ, I don't remember the technology but at that time is was all that was available for us to use in an un-powered location.

I stated that I do not want to respond or discuss this here. Please understand that we spent several months not knowing if our employee and friend was going to suffer brain damage. Meanwhile I was required to spent untold hours explaining and discussing this problem. It took a toll on me and I do not intend to do it again. I had to satisify not only the concerned public, but The National Ski Patrol, National Forest Service, National Ski Areas Association, our insurance company, the ski area owners, etc. I know what I found. All of those concerned insisted that CO2 could be monitored until they did their own in-depth research. Eventually, we jointly decided that there was not a reliable way to monitor CO2 in a below zero (or having been in a below zero), non-electrified situation. All those professionally involved (and there were many involved) agreed that we should remove our CO2 monitors because they gave a false sense of security in our situation.


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## Groundhog (Jan 3, 2018)

Also, I DO have CO2 monitors in my house.
What I experienced (to my knowledge) only applies to low temperature applications. It is listed in the operation parameters of your monitor's specifications. The specifications just forgets to tell you that cold temperatures can cause permanent loss of sensitivity.


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## Silverbullet (Jan 3, 2018)

I'd say you've had the best luck ever. Just think if you weren't home or dead in your sleep from carbon monoxide . God sure watched over you . I'd say YOUR LUCKY MY FRIEND.


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## Buffalo20 (Jan 3, 2018)

The company arrived 20 minutes late (9:20 am), apologized profusely and started to work, the new furnace was running at 2:55 pm. They finished up the air intake piping and cleaned up and was out the door, at 3:30 pm. They were professional and extremely neat, they left no evidence of the fact, they had even been here. We have good safe heat, the wallet is a little lighter, but there may be a $400 rebate from the gas company, which would be great.


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## woodchucker (Jan 3, 2018)

Buffalo20 said:


> The company arrived 20 minutes late (9:20 am), apologized profusely and started to work, the new furnace was running at 2:55 pm. They finished up the air intake piping and cleaned up and was out the door, at 3:30 pm. They were professional and extremely neat, they left no evidence of the fact, they had even been here. We have good safe heat, the wallet is a little lighter, but there may be a $400 rebate from the gas company, which would be great.



Sounds like you had a win win. You needed a new system anyway.  *Glad you are alright..* Maybe take the new  serial # and play the lottery with a few $$$.


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## GA Gyro (Jan 8, 2018)

While we are talking about CO monitors...
Please understand there are two standards:

UL listed monitors and low level monitors.

https://www.myhomecomfort.org/carbon-monoxide-levels-risks/

Note the level when a UL 2034 approved (regular) monitor blows... 70 PPM's... which is WAAAY too much exposure!!!

I strongly recommend LOW LEVEL CO monitors... it could literally be your life on the line!

Note the NSI 3000 low level monitor (I have one next to my bed)...
It will literally blow at 3-4-5 PPM's


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