# Recieved the PM1236 metric to imperial kit today



## Morgan RedHawk (Sep 22, 2014)

For all yall that are awaiting the change-over kits for the metric PM1236's from Matt, I received mine today.

The tube contained a new main lead screw, new half nut, new cross slide dial and lead screw, new compound dial and lead screw, new tailstock dial and lead screw, and a new threading chart.  The new screws all came with a new nut attached already (except the half nut, obviously).  

Big thanks to Matt!!

Just thought yall would like to know that they are shipping!


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## wrmiller (Sep 22, 2014)

Very nice!

If Matt is not asking for the metric screws back, you might want to hang onto it in case someone overseas get a imperial lathe by mistake. 

Bill


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## ricsmall (Sep 22, 2014)

Mine came today as well, but only the main leadscrew and threading chart were in the tube.:holdphone:No fault of QMT, ups had managed to bust the end caps out of tube and lose most of it. I wonder what the people thought when there were heavy pieces of steel rolling out? Aww, it's ok just send it on out. They'll file a claim.:angry:Oh well, I'm sure Matt and crew are on top of it. Glad u got urs Morgan. Do u know of the video Matt was gonna do up for the changeover? 

Richard


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## zmotorsports (Sep 22, 2014)

Great, glad to hear you received your imperial components.

No doubt Matt would take care of you but I am sure it was frustrating on the time it took to get.


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## darkzero (Sep 23, 2014)

ricsmall said:


> Mine came today as well, but only the main leadscrew and threading chart were in the tube.:holdphone:No fault of QMT, ups had managed to bust the end caps out of tube and lose most of it. I wonder what the people thought when there were heavy pieces of steel rolling out? Aww, it's ok just send it on out. They'll file a claim.:angry:Oh well, I'm sure Matt and crew are on top of it. Glad u got urs Morgan. Do u know of the video Matt was gonna do up for the changeover?
> 
> Richard



Makes you wonder..... I just purchased a Matco 3/4-7/8 box wrench off ebay last week, package came with a hole on the end with no wrench inside of course. Very clear that the package was absolutely empty, yet every postal worker who touched it moves it right along to complete delivery as if nothing was wrong. You'd figure someone would notice a 13" wrench hit the ground or appear somewhere. Of course I don't know what goes on internally at most shipping facilities (like automated facilities) but still makes you wonder when they actually go through people's hands. They just don't care....


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## zmotorsports (Sep 23, 2014)

darkzero said:


> *They just don't care.*...



Ding, ding, ding.  We have a winner.  I hate to say it but not caring is not just related to postal workers or freight delivery for that matter.  It's funny because flip the tables and people would be livid.  I gave a talk to my mechanics at work a few months ago asking them why they think we are still in business and doing well?

Most didn't respond because as long as they are getting their paychecks they really don't care why or how.  I explained that it is because of customer service and the customer is WHO matters, they are the ones keeping the lights on and money going into their pockets.  They can get what we offer anywhere, they come to us because of the customer service.  If that customer's wants, needs or desires change, we need to change as well.  Most looked at me like I was speaking a foreign language.

I then asked a couple of them about products that I knew that they had recently purchased related to their hobbies, guns.  I asked them if they walked into their supplier and they didn't carry the supplies you needed for your "new" gun would you still shop there?  They obviously responded in "hell no".

Exactly, I told them.  So you can't have it one way as a consumer and then expect to come to work and not care about the customer while performing your job, or have it the other way.  I think it at least made them think a little, don't know for how long.

I think as a society we have become lazy and self centered and care less and less about doing quality work and taking pride in our work.  I am not reflecting to all, I don't want to ruffle any feathers as there are still many who DO take pride and will go the extra little bit, but in "general" as a society people seem to care about what affects them personally but not so much in their day to day jobs or duties as they are just there for a paycheck.


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## wrmiller (Sep 23, 2014)

I was reading something about a week or so ago that said that millennials are the most narcissistic (as in self-absorbed, e.g. "selfies") generation yet. But it's not just them.

Bill


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## zmotorsports (Sep 23, 2014)

wrmiller19 said:


> I was reading something about a week or so ago that said that millennials are the most narcissistic (as in self-absorbed, e.g. "selfies") generation yet. But it's not just them.
> 
> Bill



I agree.  Just look at how facebook has exploded and it isn't just the millennials.  I think I am the only one in my shop at work that DOESN'T have a facebook page.  My wife's sisters are so self absorbed they think everyone is just sitting on the edge of their seat waiting to see what they are doing or where they are going.  EVERYTHING they do and EVERY thought they have ends up on facebook.  Then they get upset (read crying and poor me) when someone makes an unkind statement or criticizes them for some stupid thing or another.

I will admit I have a tendency to get on my "high horse" once in a while as I am proud of what I have been able to accomplish considering my lack of education and background, but I also know that most people don't give two $hit$ about what I am doing nor what I have to say.


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## wrmiller (Sep 23, 2014)

zmotorsports said:


> I agree.  Just look at how facebook has exploded and it isn't just the millennials.  I think I am the only one in my shop at work that DOESN'T have a facebook page.  My wife's sisters are so self absorbed they think everyone is just sitting on the edge of their seat waiting to see what they are doing or where they are going.  EVERYTHING they do and EVERY thought they have ends up on facebook.  Then they get upset (read crying and poor me) when someone makes an unkind statement or criticizes them for some stupid thing or another.
> 
> I will admit I have a tendency to get on my "high horse" once in a while as I am proud of what I have been able to accomplish considering my lack of education and background, but I also know that most people don't give two $hit$ about what I am doing nor what I have to say.



Well in the context of this board and machining in general, I care what ya say Mike.  )

Bill


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## zmotorsports (Sep 23, 2014)

wrmiller19 said:


> Well in the context of this board and machining in general, I care what ya say Mike.  )
> 
> Bill



Thanks Bill.  When I start "rambling" on to my wife I will tell her that someone out there cares what I have to say. That should stop her in her tracks and seal the deal.:thanks:


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## GA Gyro (Sep 23, 2014)

zmotorsports said:


> Ding, ding, ding.  We have a winner.  I hate to say it but not caring is not just related to postal workers or freight delivery for that matter.  It's funny because flip the tables and people would be livid.  I gave a talk to my mechanics at work a few months ago asking them why they think we are still in business and doing well?
> 
> Most didn't respond because as long as they are getting their paychecks they really don't care why or how.  I explained that it is because of customer service and the customer is WHO matters, they are the ones keeping the lights on and money going into their pockets.  They can get what we offer anywhere, they come to us because of the customer service.  If that customer's wants, needs or desires change, we need to change as well.  Most looked at me like I was speaking a foreign language.
> 
> ...



I thoroughly agree!  Well written BTW!
IMO in the case of the missing wrench... I have little doubt it went home with someone at the USPS... but that is another thread.  

IMO there is a flip side to this...

There ARE folks out there who make and have made a TON of $$$.... and want to spend it on their hobbies.
They will seek out folks (like you and me) who listen, respond, and deliver what they want.  If we live in a world full of folks who are 'coasting'... it is easier to be the one who is outstanding in the services they provide... In other words: One can be as busy as they want to be... if they have the initiative to do so... 
IMO this simple attitude is the heart of a successful small business... and anyone can STILL do it in America. All they have to do is look at themselves with an objective eye, and get busy...


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## GA Gyro (Sep 23, 2014)

wrmiller19 said:


> Well in the context of this board and machining in general, I care what ya say Mike.  )
> 
> Bill





zmotorsports said:


> Thanks Bill.  When I start "rambling" on to my wife I will tell her that someone out there cares what I have to say. That should stop her in her tracks and seal the deal.:thanks:



The sad thing is... it seems not many folks understand.  It is just not 'correct' (whatever that is), to not be lazy and self absorbed.  For the life of me, I just do not understand... I guess peer pressure rules many folks lives... Shame.  

BTW: I do not have a facebook page either... albeit I do have a membership.  The ONLY reason is... there are a few pages I need to visit for information concerning my business.  
I think it is kinda like a bunch of middle-school girls (no offense meant to anyone; referencing childish behavior that IMO should be outgrown) to spend all one's time ooogling at pictures and stories online.  
Having said that... at one of the trade forums I frequent (heating, AC, refrigeration), we have a political section... I 'waste' too much time there... :LOL:
(Probably good there is NO politics here... I would waste more time there...  )


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## Morgan RedHawk (Sep 23, 2014)

heh heh


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## JayBob (Sep 25, 2014)

I just got mine today, but I didn't get a chance to really look at it that well, since I was on my way out the door to go to work.  Morgan, would you mind taking a picture of everything that was included in your package?  One of the end caps was busted out of mine as well, but it seems like all the small stuff was located at the other end, intact.  Just want to verify I got everything.

Are there any instructions out yet?  Or were there supposed to be some inside the package?


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## zmotorsports (Sep 25, 2014)

JayBob said:


> I just got mine today, but I didn't get a chance to really look at it that well, since I was on my way out the door to go to work.  Morgan, would you mind taking a picture of everything that was included in your package?  One of the end caps was busted out of mine as well, but it seems like all the small stuff was located at the other end, intact.  Just want to verify I got everything.
> 
> Are there any instructions out yet?  Or were there supposed to be some inside the package?



It would be great if you could photograph and do a written installation here on the forum as well.  Maybe that would benefit people who either have to exchange their components or just have to do a repair and/or disassembly.


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## Morgan RedHawk (Sep 25, 2014)

Here are some pics of the parts that I received, as requested.  There were no instructions included, but most of it looks pretty straightforward (at least it seems that way looking at the parts diagrams of the machine).  I am wondering what the best way to replace the lead screw and half nut is.  I would rather not take the apron off if I dont have to.  

I think RayC said he would post up some instructions and that it was not difficult and only took about a half hour or so.  Speaking of RayC, he cut his fingers really badly on the underside of his cross slide when he was removing it a while back.  Good leather gloves would probably be a good idea when removing the slides to get at the screws.

If I get a chance to do it soon, I will be more than happy to document my switch over and post up some pics and a writeup..though I have been so busy with stinkin homework lately that I have not had any time to play with my machine.  Hopefully I can find some time this weekend, but I can't make any promises, much as I wish I could.:whiteflag:


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## zmotorsports (Sep 25, 2014)

Pictures look great and I am sure it would be beneficial to someone if you could/would post up a step by step or procedure on the forum.

As far as Ray cutting his finger, if memory serves it wasn't just due to working around sharp edges/corners/machined corners, it was the fact that he set the carriage/apron on a stool and bumped the stool and the carriage started to fall, he then grabbed for it rather than let it crash to the ground.  That is when it cut his finger but I could be mistaken, that just seems to stick in my head.

There are certain tasks/jobs that wearing a good quality leather glove can be beneficial.  Other tasks or times not so much.  I think lifting a heavy cast steel part off of the bed of a lathe is one where they would be.


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## thlee72 (Sep 25, 2014)

I received mine yesterday as well. I just finished replacing the cross slide, compound, and tail stock. Note that in the picture above, the label on the tailstock and compound are flipped. its obvious which is which as you take the thing apart. Next I'm tackling the lead screw. this will be fun with no instructions -- but the manual has pretty decent diagrams to go by. should be straight forward.

Couple of things to be aware of:

Its a little tricky re-installing the compound, to get the screw at the right hight and angle -- if its off by even a little bit, the slide will move very hard and not smooth. 
also -- you'll need to drill a dimple into the shaft of the cross slide screw so that the feed gear set screw will recess into. make sure its in the same relative location as the metric screw that is removed and it should be no problem. 
Also -- the nut for the tail stock screw was not drilled with holes for the three retaining screws which attach the screw to the tail stock itself. so those need to be drilled.

since I've never replaced a lead screw before, can someone tell me if the saddle/carriage needs to be removed in order to replace it and the half nut? I'm assuming that its not just going to "slide out"

Thanks to Matt for getting these shipped out.

-Tom


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## Henrymac (Sep 25, 2014)

Morgan, glad you got your conversion for your lathe. I am almost finished with my shop, so I will be expecting a visit from you in the near future. Get that thing installed and let's see some projects!! )


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## vballard (Sep 26, 2014)

I'm glad that you recieved all the parts to your kit.  I didn't.  I'm missing the half nut and the dials for the compound and the tailstock.  Nicole tells me that they found one of the dials which she say has shipped, but they don't have the half nut.  It looks like I will be waiting for part from China. My parts were shipped in a wood box wih cardboard ends. I didn't think about pieces being lost in shipment until I read ricsmall's comments in this thread. The ends of my box were tapped closed so I thought that was the way Matt shipped them.


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## vballard (Sep 26, 2014)

thlewe72---The lead screw is easy to change. Just pull back the spiral cover at the left end of the shaft and punch out the brass shear pin, then close the half nut on the screw and use the carrage to supple the force needed to extract the screw from the coupling. Also you need to be sure you have about 4 feet of clearance on the right side of the lathe to allow the screw to come all the way our.


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## thlee72 (Sep 26, 2014)

vballard -- thanks for the advice. that does sound easy. I had started taking the apron apart, and that didn't seem right. now I just have to move the lathe as the right side of my machine is too close to the wall. of course. thanks again.


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## thlee72 (Sep 27, 2014)

Update to my progress -- the lead screw swap went well. I had to drill a 5/32 hole in the end for the shear pin which holds it to the gear box. Note -- there are TWO pins on the "left" end of near the gearbox. remove the one farthest from the gearbox -- mine was brass. dont try to remove the closer pin -- it wont come out.

I had to remove the apron box in order to change the half-nut, but that is pretty easy, once I realized that there are two pins which drop down from the top saddle (between the bolts). it takes a bit of wiggling to get the apron off around the various gears. But going together was much easier than apart.

I ran into an issue with the gear set however. the documentation which RayC has posted shows the 127t gear inside of the 120t gear. and a spacer/bearing behind the 127t. makes sense so that you can put the top 24t gear inline with the 127t and the bottom 48t, or move the 48t to to outer 120t for staggered turning. that configuration also matches the new feed chart plate that came with the conversion.

However -- on my lathe, the middle gear set is reversed -- the 120t is inside near the spacer/bearing and the 127t is on the outside. that configuration matched my old chart for the metric setup. 

So it appears that the 120/127 gears are backwards between metric and imperial. Am I missing something here? should there be a new 127/120 gear set with the conversion kit? or do I have to press that bearing out and reverse it? (I'm worried about damaging it in the process).

so I'm almost done -- but now I'm confused about the gear setup.  any advice would be appreciated.

-Tom


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## darkzero (Sep 27, 2014)

Yes that is correct, the 120/127 would be reversed on the metric/imperial versions. So yes, the 127 would be on the inside (closest to the headstock). I just took a peek at mine, I don't see any reason why it couldn't just be flipped by removing the nut & washer then slid off the shaft. How does yours look like? The bearing for that gear looks different on both sides or does it sit offset or something? I never took mine off but the bearing looks the same on both sides & it's centered on the gear set.


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## thlee72 (Sep 27, 2014)

Darkzero, my gearset has a spacer on one side. so it can't just be flipped over. I put it into a press to try to slide it out and reverse it, but it would not budge. maybe I just need to press harder?


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## darkzero (Sep 27, 2014)

Can you post a pic of it so I can compare it to mine?


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## Lynrob (Sep 28, 2014)

I also received my cardboard tube of imperial parts earlier this week.  Luckily, the ends were still intact and it appears that nothing had fallen out.  I started with the tail stock since I thought it would be the simplest of the conversions which it was with one exception.  The brass nut for the lead screw has a flange on it that fits over the end of the tailstock quill.  On the original, there are three SHCS (5mm, I think) that connect the nut to the quill.  The new nut does not have holes for these screws.  I have a mill so I thought it wouldn't be a problem to replicate the bolt circle on the new nut.  After an hour of futzing around with it I finally came to the conclusion that the pattern on the old nut is not a bolt circle at all.  I am not sure what the pattern is but it is not a bolt circle.  It is also not symmetrical.  My first thought was to put the two nuts flange to flange and use a transfer punch to mark the centers of the new holes.  That wouldn't work though since the holes were not symmetrical and putting the parts face to face makes a mirror image not a true replica.  After thinking about it for a while, I realized that there really isn't that much precision needed.  There is a flat milled into the flange to allow the flange to clear the key/keyway that prevents the quill from turning in the tailstock.  As long as that flat is roughly in the right place, the orientation of the flange is not really critical. I ended up taking careful measurements of the original using the DRO on the mill and located the holes on the new part that way.  It was not difficult but it was time consuming.  After the holes were drilled and the new nut installed in the quill I was able to put everything back together.  My quill was very tight going back in and getting the key aligned with the keyway was a little tricky as a result.  After a while I was able to get it to slide into place and the rest of the assembly was relatively uneventful.  Hopefully, this will save some of you some time.

thlee72, I will be interested to see what you figure out with the gears since I am pretty sure I will have the same situation.  Thanks for posting what you have done so far I am sure it will help me when I do the remainder of my conversion.


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## thlee72 (Sep 28, 2014)

Success. I was able to remove the center bearings and spacer from the gear set and reinstall them the other way around. There are actually two bearings and a snap ring in between -- which is why I was unable to press them out as a unit. you have to press just spacer first. that will pop out the space and one bearing. Press from the side OPPOSITE the space (away from the center). then the second bearing came right out after removing the snap ring. This was not obvious from looking at it.
anyway -- its back together and working great. 

here are some pictures of my gear set and the spacer bearing.


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## qualitymachinetools (Sep 28, 2014)

Hey guys, was just about to reply, but looks like you have it all figured out, you guys are amazing!  No need to send any parts back, just keep them in case they ever would come in handy for you.

  I am working on a set of instructions, but looks like everyone beat me to it!

 And Val yes I got your email, I will take care of it. I do not know how they were missing, I packed that one up, personally, it was the first one. I set the dial on the desk beside it, but everything else was in there when sent, so no idea on that one. And for Richard, I have those ordered too, no big deal though on either, they will come by air, right after the chinese holiday coming on Oct 1st. They get more time off than we do, that is for sure!


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## Lynrob (Sep 29, 2014)

Thanks thlee72!  I am still not clear what needs to be done on the gears.  Is the desired end result that the shaft protruding in the first two picture needs to be flush as shown in the third picture?  If I understand you right you must press it out from the flush side and then reinstall it from the big gear side?  Is that right?  That seems to indicate that the shaft has a shoulder on it that prevents it from being pressed flush from the protruding side.  Does any of this make sense? 

Also, on the leadscrew, I assume you had to remove the spiral covers to get the apron off.  When you disconnected then did they unwind like a spring?  Once you had the shaft unpinned on the left, was it free to push out the right side or did you have to take the right side loose somehow?  did you have to drain the oil from the apron to change the half nut or just move it back enough to get space to work?

Do you have any advice on getting the angles right on the compound leadscrew?  I have mine adjusted pretty well but it could be better I think.  It is smooth as butter going clockwise but a little tight in spots coming back the other way.  It is not terrible, just not as smooth as the other way. I am not sure how an angle being off would cause different behavior in different directions.  I was thinking maybe one of the pairs of thrust bearings was messed up somehow but they seem to be fine.  The only way to adjust it seems to be to take it nearly apart, tweek the nut a little then reassemble and try again.  Did you find a better way?

I found I had to temporarily loosen the back-splash and push it back out of the way in order to get the cross slide back far enough to get the nut out.  There are two small grub screws on the nut that I assume are for taking out backlash.  I just screwed them in until they touched the main part of the nut but didn't put any pressure on.  Do you know the correct procedure?  The cross slide is working great but I want to make sure I get the nut adjusted correctly.

Sorry for all the questions.  Thanks for blazing the trail!  Matt, obviously I am not as experienced as thlee72, I wouldn't mind seeing your instructions!!


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## thlee72 (Sep 29, 2014)

Lynrob,

Glad to help. the pictures that I posted are of the gear BEFORE swapping them. you are correct -- push the spacer out from the flush side. that will remove a bearing as well. then if you flip the gears over, you will see the snap ring. remove that, and then push the other bearing out. flip the gears, reinstall the single bearing in the 120t gear, and the snap ring in the middle, then press the spacer and its bearing into the 127t gear. I put the whole thing into the press, and squeezed until it was flush.

as for the apron -- yes I had to remove the spiral covers. mine opened up a bit, but did not fully unwind. RayC mentioned that once the pin on the left was removed, you could close the half-nut and use the apron to pull the leadscrew out to the right. that worked perfectly. once it was loose, I released the half-nut and gently pulled the leadscrew out. nothing had to be loosened on the right side.

I did remove the apron in order to get at the half-nut, but I did not drain the oil -- didn't spill a drop (lucky?)

I do have a bit more backlash on my main feed knob than I did before -- I think I need to readjust it a bit. I also found that the gib on the compound slide went in very tight and its tighter than before I did the swap. no backlash at all though. Its not surprising that a bit of adjustment is going to be needed after taking everything apart. Next weekend I plan on re-measuring everything, etc. I did verify the dials with my DRO and its pretty accurate -- I dialed in 4 inches of travel back and forth and the dial was dead on -- maybe within 2 10thou. good enough for my purposes.

hope that helps.


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## Lynrob (Sep 29, 2014)

That's a great help, thlee72!  Thank you for taking the time to help me out!

Lyn


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## darkzero (Oct 7, 2014)

How are you guys going with this? Anyone complete theirs yet & if so, working fine, confirmed test cuts, etc? Just curious.


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## ricsmall (Oct 7, 2014)

Still waiting on replacement parts that were lost in transit. I did take crosslide off just to make sure I didn't have any problems. Went ahead and replaced the cheap compound bolts with SHCS and nuts that I turned down. Thinking hard on replacing the carriage lock bolt with a handle. Although it is handy to have the Allen wrench needed for compound hanging out right below in the carriage lock. I think I got these ideas from some of your posts will. Thanks

richard


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## darkzero (Oct 8, 2014)

Thanks for the update Richard. Can't wait to hear you guys getting this completed.

Yup I really love the SHCS for the compound. I use the handle for the carriage lock quite often & it's very convenient but even before I put that handle on, just the fact tbat both the compound SHCS & the carriage lock were the same size was nice too. I picked up one of those Bondhus stubbie hex wrenches also with a ball on the long end for just under $2 at my local MSC & it's much easier to reach under the tool post when it's oriented in certain positions.


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