# Tailstock on grizzly g0602 very stiff



## bstanga (Oct 21, 2014)

The tailstock on my g0602 is very tight and is a pain to use on fine drill operations. I've taken it apart several times and cleaned and lubed. It seems that when I drive a screw driver in the gap to wedge it open a little it works smoothly. Any ideas on a fix?

I don't have a lot of experience working with metal, but I was wondering if I did get a proper wedge and not just a screwdriver and drove it in a few times do I run the risk of splitting it open ? Is this cast iron? It is a grizzly g0602 I notice other parts of the lathe will chip very easy this is why I am hesitant to just "wedge away at it"_.

_If I had one of them old cylinder hones might be able to bore it out a little.

_Brian

_


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## fastback (Oct 21, 2014)

Yes, I was going to suggest a brake cylinder hone.  Can you polish up the shaft?  You could inset it in the lathe a use maybe a 1,200 grit paper and clean it up.  I would not keep wedging with the screwdriver you are asking for trouble.  Another thing you could try is to make your own flapper type sander for the tailstock.  Take a rod and slice it down the center and insert a piece of fine paper, maybe a piece 1 x 2 inch or so and roll it till it fits in the tailstock now use a hand drill to spin in an out. 

Maybe, someone else has some better advice.

Paul


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## Rbeckett (Oct 21, 2014)

I would go to my local Napa and get a brake cylinder hone and give the tail stock a good bore cleaning.  Prying open the slot will break the casting for sure so don't even stick a screwdriver in it anymore.  The brake hone with a little oil will work wonders on it pretty quick and leave a nice smooth polished looking finish too.  Lube everything up and re-assemble, should be smooth as glass when you extend or retract it.

Bob


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## NightWing (Oct 21, 2014)

I would certainly confirm that the bore in the casting was smooth and free of bugs.  However, I would be very reluctant to start opening up the bore because that casting is the more expensive of the two parts; casting and ram.  The ram can be polished easily with fine emery cloth.  If you screw it up, a replacement will be cheaper than the casting.

Also, verify that the anti-rotation dog screw isn't bottoming out, the milled keyway in the ram isn't bugged and that the tailstock feed screw is a smooth fit in the ram.  These are several reasons why a tailstock might be too snug.


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## bstanga (Oct 21, 2014)

NightWing said:


> I would certainly confirm that the bore in the casting was smooth and free of bugs.  However, I would be very reluctant to start opening up the bore because that casting is the more expensive of the two parts; casting and ram.  The ram can be polished easily with fine emery cloth.  If you screw it up, a replacement will be cheaper than the casting.
> 
> Also, verify that the anti-rotation dog screw isn't bottoming out, the milled keyway in the ram isn't bugged and that the tailstock feed screw is a smooth fit in the ram.  These are several reasons why a tailstock might be too snug.



This makes sense, I'll hold off on honing out the bore. as for the dog screw I made sure it was not to tight. The bore is very smooth and shinny.  What I will do when I get home is pull it apart and see if the dog screw fits in the anti-rotation groove. if it does I'll chuck it up and lightly sand the quill. Oh the feed screw is a good fit and turns with no resistance

Thanks to all for the reply's
Brian


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## Rbeckett (Oct 21, 2014)

Keep us posted on how the project goes and some pics would really help a lot too. I also did not advocate removing a lot of material. just a thousandth to see if that helps.  If you put the ran in the tail stock it should drop smoothly to the bottom, keep adding parts till  it gets stiff and go from there.


Bob


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## NightWing (Oct 21, 2014)

You say the feed screw is a good fit and turns with no resistance.  It may spin freely in the tailstock casting but how does the thread fit in the ram?


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## bosephus (Oct 21, 2014)

My g0602 is the same way ... smooth as glass and easy the first few times i used the tail stock .. after tightening it a few times using a center its a bit stiff ... not overly stiff but it does take a bit of effort to crank it with the small handles .

I am going to fix mine with a bigger wheel and handle .. leverage is the key


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## higgite (Oct 22, 2014)

Not trying to be a smart alec, but you aren't over tightening the handwheel center nut are you? (Don't ask why that came to mind. :whistle

Tom


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## bosephus (Oct 22, 2014)

i havent over tightened mine .. but then i dont feel my quill is extremely stiff either , a bit bigger wheel and handle to help out is all it needs , mostly to help the old arthritus


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## fastback (Oct 22, 2014)

Maybe, you need to disassemble the complete unit and check each piece for fit.  What I mean is take threaded section out and check the threads.  I would then thread it into the quill and check to see how they mate (both pieces are out of the tailstock). Next I would see how the quill slides into the tailstock.  See if it slides easily, if so, you may have an alignment problem (threads to quill when installed).  If you break it into steps I think you will be able to determine where the problem lye's.   Tail stocks should work freely, almost moving by itself with were little resistance. 

Hope this helps.

Paul


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## xman_charl (Oct 22, 2014)

*tailstock was hard on mine because of that threaded screw on top.

Threaded screw fits in slot/groove of tailstock. keeps it from rotating.

Closely looked at threads that fit in groove, show mangled threads
near bottom where it could contact groove.

Replaced it, then honed tip as flat as possible, sort of like a set screw part.

Like I go to use the machine, simple turning, then drill hole...tailstock is useless.

Why should I need to fix something, each time I use that lathe?

Charl




*


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## JimDawson (Oct 22, 2014)

xman_charl said:


> *tailstock was hard on mine because of that threaded screw on top.
> 
> Threaded screw fits in slot/groove of tailstock. keeps it from rotating.
> 
> ...



Charl, did cleaning up the screw fix that problem?


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## george wilson (Oct 22, 2014)

If there is a slit in the bore,using a cylinder hone would likely get the bore out of round or off center. Be careful. Check everything else first.

It is possible that the cast iron closed a bit after boring,though. This is a bit of a tricky problem.

I rebuilt lathes years ago. One lathe was not bad looking at all. But,it was completely worn out from only using it to polish candlesticks at a foundry. I had to recut the bed. The tailstock ram was worn too small,and the bore no doubt bellmouthed too. I put the tailstock,lightly clamped in FRONT of the carriage,so the power feed would move it along. I put a heavy boring bar in the chuck,and carefully took light cuts in the bore. Then,I made an oversize ram(quill,actually) that fit the bore. I made a left hand Acme tap and tapped the end of the quill. I used a #2 MT reamer to finish ream the quill in situ. The tailstock worked fine after that.


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## Bill Gruby (Oct 22, 2014)

The G 0602 has a set of binders the lock the ram on the tailstock. Remove them and see if the problem still exists? If the problem goes away your problem is this set of binders. They are not letting the ram completely loose.

 "Billy G"


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## swatson144 (Oct 22, 2014)

What Paul said earlier is the exact way I'd go about it. After locating what is binding the quil then a fix should be easy.

Steve



fastback said:


> Maybe, you need to disassemble the complete unit and check each piece for fit.  What I mean is take threaded section out and check the threads.  I would then thread it into the quill and check to see how they mate (both pieces are out of the tailstock). Next I would see how the quill slides into the tailstock.  See if it slides easily, if so, you may have an alignment problem (threads to quill when installed).  If you break it into steps I think you will be able to determine where the problem lye's.   Tail stocks should work freely, almost moving by itself with were little resistance.
> 
> Hope this helps.
> 
> Paul


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## george wilson (Oct 22, 2014)

I think Bill might be onto something here. I'm not familiar with the model of the lathe,but it is entirely possible that binders might not be free enough in their holes  to be letting go of the quill. Or,there could be a misalignment in the bolt holes in the binders,causing them to get stuck on the bolt,not freeing the quill. I have seen this happen before.

I assumed this tailstock had a slit from what post #1 said about wedging the slit open.


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## Andre (Oct 22, 2014)

xman_charl said:


> *tailstock was hard on mine because of that threaded screw on top.
> 
> Threaded screw fits in slot/groove of tailstock. keeps it from rotating.
> 
> ...



Don't modify things unless you know the problem. Measure the OD of the    ram for any large spots, if so, address them. Then inspect and measure    the bore ID. If there are any high spots in the bore, then hone. Don't    go at the bore if the tailstock ram is the problem, it may not be    perfect round after all.


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## bstanga (Oct 23, 2014)

Bill Gruby said:


> The G 0602 has a set of binders the lock the ram on the tailstock. Remove them and see if the problem still exists? If the problem goes away your problem is this set of binders. They are not letting the ram completely loose.
> 
> "Billy G"



I have had it apart many times now and have not seen any "binders". I did use the hone lase night and it is much better, but not acting as a precision tool by any means. I was very sparing with the master cylinder hone and kept it moving at ll times.

brian


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## chuckorlando (Oct 23, 2014)

The problem with a hone is it leaves scratches. Well the cylinder hones I have do any ways. You dont want scratches.

Dykum the whole thing and find where it's rubbing if rubbing is the issue


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## higgite (Oct 23, 2014)

bstanga said:


> I have had it apart many times now and have not seen any "binders". I did use the hone lase night and it is much better, but not acting as a precision tool by any means. I was very sparing with the master cylinder hone and kept it moving at ll times.
> 
> brian



The "binders" are operated by the locking handle on top of the tailstock. Grizzly may call that part something else, but if your quill lock works, they are there. Without them you wouldn't be able to lock the quill down.

 When you had it apart, did you take the quill lock and leadscrew out to see if the quill would slide freely by hand? Don't unscrew the quill locking handle all the way or you could leave the binder behind in the tailstock body. Just pull it straight up after you remove the quill and the binder should come out with it.

If you have already done all that and I'm preaching to the choir, ignore me and go back to regular programming. )

Tom

ETA: I forgot to mention, when testing the quill to bore fit, also remove the set screw that keeps the quill from twisting in the bore.


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## Bill Gruby (Oct 23, 2014)

The locking handle on top has two binders on it. The have a slot on the OD back. This slot keeps them moving in a straight line. The upper binder is not threaded the lower one is. The lower one climbs the threaded handle and tightens on the Ram to lock it in position. If the slot is damaged the binders will not work correctly. They will not unlock properly causing the Ram to become stiff when it is moved.

Grizzly refers to the binder as a Barrel Nut. It is reference number 307 in your parts list for the tailstock.

 "Billy G"


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## bstanga (Oct 23, 2014)

I just pulled up the  parts list and looked at 307, when I get home I will have a look at it.


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## jumps4 (Oct 23, 2014)

I have the same lathe, the Wholesale Tools version and my tailstock was stiff also.. I found it to be rust and dirt inside. before disassembling I squirted oil in the open mt3 end to oil the threads and kept blowing it out, sand and grit came out off the casting. I kept working it until everything would move then I disassembled it and cleaned everything.
 I think mine sat around before painting and rusted, once cleaned it was fine.
Steve


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## RJSakowski (Dec 10, 2016)

bstanga said:


> I just pulled up the  parts list and looked at 307, when I get home I will have a look at it.


I have a 602 which I bought three years ago and it doesn't have part 307.  Instead, it uses the levered bolt to tighten the gap formed by the partial slit between the upper and lower halves of the tailstock housing.

Earlier this year, I was doing some heavy drilling on the lathe, something like a 7/8" drill.   The drilling process had seated the MT adapter fairly well.  Enough that it took a rap with a bras hammer while applying force with the tailstock screw to break it free.   Afterwards, the quill on the tailstock was difficult to move.  I assumed at the time that I had somehow swaged the tailstock quill which caused the binding.

Taking Billy G's lead above, I did some investigating.  I removed the lock bolt and inserted a wedge in the slit and it did indeed free up the quill.  However, it was not sufficient to restore the original freedom of movement.  I removed the DRO and pulled the quill to examine it and noticed a shiny area on the back edge of the keyway slot.  A few strokes with a diamond hone and the free  movement of the quill was restored.  

The process of heavy drilling had rotated the quill against the set screw key and had swaged the quill enough so an interference was created resulting in the difficult feed.  The set screw makes a poor key in that contact is essentially on the points where the screw threads touch.  Some time ago, I ran across a modification of the 602 tailstock where the OEM setscrew was replaced with a larger diameter set screw with a dog point.  The dog point was a slightly smaller diameter than the keyway width.  This provides a line of contact instead of the one or two points.  Now that I have seen the problem with the original design, this modification is going high on my to-do list.


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## RJSakowski (Dec 10, 2016)

Here is the link for the tailstock modification. https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/10x22grizzlyandthelike/conversations/topics/6258


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## cookj320 (Dec 10, 2016)

I have a 602 and part 307 is not on mine either. My tailstock is much easier to move when set screw is removed.......I'm in agreement,  the set screw is causing binding. Can someone explain a dogpoint?


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## RJSakowski (Dec 10, 2016)

cookj320 said:


> I have a 602 and part 307 is not on mine either. My tailstock is much easier to move when set screw is removed.......I'm in agreement,  the set screw is causing binding. Can someone explain a dogpoint?


A dog point set screw has a cylindrical point with a smaller diameter than the minor diameter of the thread.  The OEM setscrew needs to be backed off slightly from full contact.  Some Loctite on the screw threads will keep it from working in to make contact with the bottom of the keyway.


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## xman_charl (Dec 11, 2016)

another problem with that flimsy tailstock

Using drill chuck tail stock, drill chuck, morse taper will start rotating occasionally.

Have tried another drill chuck mounted to another morse taper.

Still rotates!

another problem to solve

Charl


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## paulymorph (Aug 28, 2019)

RJSakowski said:


> The dog point was a slightly smaller diameter than the keyway width. This provides a line of contact instead of the one or two points. Now that I have seen the problem with the original design, this modification is going high on my to-do list.


I know this is an older thread but THANK YOU RJSakowski.  This was exactly my problem.  The original grub screw threads scored the upper edge of the keyway on the quill and under heavy drilling it always seemed to get worse.  After smoothing the inner edge and smoothing the top with a fine file, it was completely free again and so I machined a custom dog point grub thumb screw and that seems to have done the trick.  Thanks again!


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