# G4000 ELS Upgrade



## Cletus (Oct 22, 2021)

Back around 2005, I purchased my Grizzly G4000 Lathe and did quite a few very useful mechanical mods to it, leading to the publication with the help of others, two FREE handbooks *"Tricking out the Asian 9 x 20 Lathe"* and *"Rebuilding The Asian 9 x 20 Lathe"*.
Well, this lathe has served me well and continues to do so.  So it's time to do a little upgrade and I have chosen to implement the *"Clough42 Electronic Leadscrew"*.  
Here I I intend to log the developments of this build as Igo along.  So, far, I have ordered the boards on ebay and also the Omron Encoder and Hybrid Servo Motor and Controller from Amazon.

Hoping this may be of help to someone going down this rabbit-hole, here we go:

Tricking-out the Asian 9X20 Lathe

Rebuilding the Asian 9x20 Lathe


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## Cletus (Oct 22, 2021)

*What's done thus far:*
1) Viewed the entire series of @clough42 videos relative to this mod.

2) Determined the G4000 has a different Spindle to Idler ratio (1:2) than James' lathe, so I'm going with 80T and 40T GT2 pulleys to couple the idler to the encoder.

3) Decided on a NEMA 24 Servo Motor / Driver combo and ordered it along with the Omron encoder.


			https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B079CCPCPQ/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
		







						Amazon.com: WSDMAVIS 1 Pcs Rotary Encoder E6B2 CWZ6C E6B2-CWZ6C 1024P/R DC 5-24V for OMRON : Industrial & Scientific
					

Buy WSDMAVIS 1 Pcs Rotary Encoder E6B2 CWZ6C E6B2-CWZ6C 1024P/R DC 5-24V for OMRON: Switch Encoders - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases



					www.amazon.com
				




4) Opting to build my own electronics enclosure from 16gauge CNC plasma-cut sheet.


*Pulleys and Belts:*


			Amazon.com
		




			https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07T7VZ617/ref=ox_sc_act_image_5?smid=A1NQCH9MN8OPZG&th=1
		







						BZ 3D 40T GT2 Timing Pulley Bore 5mm 40 Teeth Synchronous Wheel Aluminum for Width 6mm 3D Printer Parts(Pack of 4pcs) (40Teeth Bore 5mm): Amazon.com: Industrial & Scientific
					

BZ 3D 40T GT2 Timing Pulley Bore 5mm 40 Teeth Synchronous Wheel Aluminum for Width 6mm 3D Printer Parts(Pack of 4pcs) (40Teeth Bore 5mm): Amazon.com: Industrial & Scientific



					www.amazon.com
				



The 5mm Bore will have to be re-bored and reamed to 6mm for the encoder shaft.






						Amazon.com: Bzocio 5mm Bore GT2 80T Pulley Synchronous Wheel 2GT Timing Belt Pulley 80 Teeth for Voron 2.4 3D Printer 6mm Width Belt : Tools & Home Improvement
					

Amazon.com: Bzocio 5mm Bore GT2 80T Pulley Synchronous Wheel 2GT Timing Belt Pulley 80 Teeth for Voron 2.4 3D Printer 6mm Width Belt : Tools & Home Improvement



					www.amazon.com
				



This will need to be bored out to mount over the boss on the G4000's 80 tooth idler gear and will be secured to said gear by three 3mm SHCS bolts on the periphery (details to follow).




			https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07T5B5WF7/ref=ox_sc_act_image_1?smid=A1NQCH9MN8OPZG&th=1
		




			Amazon.com
		


*Power Supplies:*


			https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B013EU4KNK/ref=ox_sc_act_title_4?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&th=1
		




			https://www.amazon.com/MEAN-WELL-RS-15-5-Supply-Single/dp/B005T6UJBU/ref=sr_1_6?dchild=1&keywords=5v+power+supply&qid=1634938431&s=industrial&sr=1-6


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## Cletus (Oct 23, 2021)

*Electronics Interconnections:*









						Stuff You'll Need · clough42/electronic-leadscrew Wiki
					

Lathe electronic leadscrew controller. Contribute to clough42/electronic-leadscrew development by creating an account on GitHub.




					github.com


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## Cletus (Oct 23, 2021)

With all the stuff ordered from Amazon, ebay and DigiKey, today I ripped out all the change-gear and "reverse tumbler mod" stuff from the lathe to make room for the ELS mechanics  _(all modifications I do to my machinery is kept reversible as far as possible and this one is no exception)_.
I guess some housekeeping inside that gear-case is overdue??


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## Cletus (Oct 23, 2021)

*I think this is evolving into a super-cool project!*
While doing all this, two thoughts popped up:
1) The Quick-change Gearbox will now need to reside in the #1 position to maintain a 1:1 relationship between the intended input shaft on the left to the leadscrew or, I will need to mechanically couple the Servo-drive motor directly to the leadscrew at the right.

2) the second thought has nothing to do with the ELS really, but it would be nice to have a foot actuated spindle-brake of sorts. I think I can implement this quite simply by a footswitch _(a bar across the base engaging a micro-switch)_ actuating a relay which de-couples the DC spindle motor from it's DC power supply and shunts the motor with a very high-power resistor _(read water heater element)_, effectively using the motor's back EMF to accomplish some "electronic braking"


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## Cletus (Oct 24, 2021)

....and this is what I have on the drawing-board for the new direction and braking system after the ELS is implemented.  The speed controller is already there (16 years), the direction switching is pretty straightforward and is a mod of the existing, and a mock-up of the foot-brake system proves successful.   Essentially, for braking, we're removing power from the motor and shunting the motor with a massive, low value resistor, dumping the back EMF of the motor into this load (regenerative braking).




*UPDATED DIAGRAM HERE:*


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## RJSakowski (Oct 24, 2021)

Cletus said:


> ....and this is what I have on the drawing-board for the new direction and braking system after the ELS is implemented.  The speed controller is already there (16 years), the direction switching is pretty straightforward and is a mod of the existing, and a mock-up of the foot-brake system proves successful.   Essentially, for braking, we're removing power from the motor and shunting the motor with a massive RC network, dumping the back EMF of the motor into the load (regenerative braking).
> 
> View attachment 382994



It looks like you have a great start on the ELS.  

Re: the brake, a coupl3e of points.  It appears that you have a bridge rectifier to handle the fwd/rev situation so the capacitor always see the correct polarity. The capacitor will essentially be a dead short when the brake circuit is energized.  As such the circuit can experience transient currents into the thousands of ohms which can destroy the bridge rectifier.  You will also create a large amount of EMF which could interfere with the ELS.  On a conversion of my lather to a dc PWM driven motor, I was destroying MOSFET transistors rated at 500 amps pulsed until I realized that I had to add a transient snubber to the motor.  I have a 3,000 mfd filter in my power supply, directly connected to the bridge rectifier and I was destroying switch contacts until I added a inrush current limiter to the circuit.

But the question that I have is why bother with the capacitor and bridge at all?  The capacitor will quickly discharge to zero volts after initial contact is made and really serve no useful purpose.   The resistor alone will do the job.  Transient current will be limited to a few tens of amps which will be easier on your relay contacts and reduce EMF. 

As to the wattage of the resistor, the duty cycle of the brake will be minimal so a 1000 watts is overkill.  You could do a calculation of the required wattage by assuming the the entire kinetic energy of the motor, spindle assembly, and work was being absorbed by the resistor and making a guess as to mass and its distribution and the maximum rpm. I did a rough calculation assuming 2,000 rpm and a mass of 20 kg located on a rim 4 cm in radius and calculated about 2,000 joules of energy.  A 50 watt resistor can safely dissipate 3,000 joules/min so a start /stop every 40 seconds would be permitted.  This should be a very conservative estimate.

I would venture to say that unless you were starting and stopping multiple times a minute, a 50 watt resistor with proper heat sinking would suffice.  Of course, if you already have a water heater element and you have the room to install it, why not?


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## Cletus (Oct 24, 2021)

You are quite correct, thanks for the reply.  I've been doing more testing this morning and ver 1.2 will lose the bridge and cap.  As for the resistor, I have quite a few heater elements laying around and space behind the lathe stand is not an issue for it.


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## Cletus (Oct 25, 2021)

Well, the foot brake system is well on the way.   Tomorrow I'll go and get me a bunch of relays.
Here's the trial fit:


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## Cletus (Oct 26, 2021)

Making some progress.  Got me a mess of DPDT 12V relays today and an enclosure suitable for repurposing. Also plasma-cut and fitted a new control panel, thus making ample room inside the lathe for the ELS stuff (I think).  Another enclosure (metal) will house the ELS electronics.  This will take care of the FWD - STOP - REV and the Foot-Brake part of it. Will deal with the left-over holes and neaten-up after it's all done.  Paint is the closest match I could find at the hardware store, I did not really try too hard  
I use this lathe a lot, so all the way through, I've got to keep it functional as I do the mods.


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## Cletus (Oct 26, 2021)

Will be retiring this tach and mounting the ELS control panel here. That fwd/rev switch is non-functional since I did the Treadmill motor/DC drive conversion years ago, so out it goes too.


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## Cletus (Oct 27, 2021)

Implemented the relay box and the braking system today,  works great. Used a 4-ohm 50W resistor and it's not even breaking a sweat.  Stopping time from 2300RPM is about 1 second with an empty 4" 3-jaw chuck.  It's configured to normally coast to a stop (FWD or REV to STOP) or I can apply the foot-brake at any time for immediate stopping.....  Pretty darned convenient.
Just waiting on my ELS parts to arrive, shipping these days is really slow, like about 14-days from my Florida forwarder to my door.


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## Cletus (Oct 27, 2021)

Here's the relay box completed and installed. I just could not resist punching out all the top holes and installing a red backlight for when the foot-brake bar is depressed.


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## Cletus (Oct 28, 2021)

On checking, for some reason, DigiKey canceled my LAUNCHPAD TMS320F280049C EVAL BD order without notifying me.  Just ordered it from Mouser. So there will be another delay.
Cleaned-up the lathe a bit:


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## Cletus (Oct 28, 2021)

So, while I wait for bits and pieces to arrive, I've decided to print mockups of the Encoder and Servo Motor drive systems and test for fit.  Here's the Encoder system. I think I can trust these enough to start making the mounts and deciding on hardware.


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## Cletus (Oct 28, 2021)

So far, me thinks it's looking pretty darned reasonable.


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## Cletus (Oct 29, 2021)

Here's today's encoder mock fit-up, a 300mm GT2 belt would do the trick


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## Cletus (Oct 29, 2021)

The Crossfire CNC Plasma-jet does a wonderful job of making the Servo Motor Mount. This trial was done in 16g, the actual will be done in 1/8"
Hey, and I found a stepper motor I could use as a trial fit!   .....this is coming together nicely!


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## Cletus (Oct 29, 2021)

Turns out just doubling the 16g plates is more than rigid enough for the motor mount.  Here's the fit-up for the pulleys and belts.   Encoder 80T and 40T  GT2 150T belt,  Servo Motor 24T and 72T  3M 149T belt.  As luck would have it, I guesstimated correctly and ordered all the right sized belts.
Just informed that the boards from @clough42 have arrived in Trinidad and I will have them on Monday. 
Enough work for the day, it's FRIDAY! .....time to cleanup the mess I made in the shop, and sip on a couple cold ones while doing so!


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## Cletus (Nov 3, 2021)

Well, the goodies have started arriving, not enough to accomplish anything tangible at this stage. It should all be here by mid next week.


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## Janderso (Nov 3, 2021)

Cletus said:


> *Electronics Interconnections:*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


What are you some sort of brain surgeon?
This is rocket science stuff, don't you know this is a hobby machinists forum??
Just kidding man, I'm so jealous.


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## Cletus (Nov 3, 2021)

Hahaha!   ..... Interestingly enough, funny you should say that, I just used my new PM935 mill to make a fixture adapter for a Neurosurgical Skull Clamping apparatus for one of the Operating Rooms I support     .....no kidding, the mill is earning it's keep.
I'm eager to get playing with this ELS, it will certainly breathe new life into my old faithful lathe!


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## Cletus (Nov 5, 2021)

Very minor progress today, Grizzly Green


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## Cletus (Nov 5, 2021)

Display and Boost boards completed


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## Cletus (Nov 5, 2021)

Quite a bit of wiring has now fallen into place. Printed @clough42 DIN rail mounts for the TI Launchpad Board, so it's mostly plug-n-play when the rest of the stuff gets here.
Tried to keep the data-lines away from power and keep high and low power components separated as best I can, from a layout standpoint.  Green pot scrubber across the air intake vents should keep crud out (secured in place by prickly velcro).
Of course I'm printing my own cable exits too!


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## Cletus (Nov 7, 2021)




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## Cletus (Nov 8, 2021)




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## Cletus (Nov 8, 2021)

Almost there, just the drive-belt and the micro-controller board to arrive now.


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## Cletus (Nov 8, 2021)

Control Panel in it's enclosure


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## Cletus (Nov 9, 2021)

The TI Launchpad board arrived today and I am just awaiting the last timing belt which is shipping out from Florida tomorrow, so hopefully next week.  With all the previous work done,it was truly plug-n-play, and no signs of blue smoke!
Now to neaten up the wiring a bit and clean-up the mess around the lathe!
Well It's alive and the pics below show such


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## Cletus (Nov 10, 2021)

So, while waiting for the belt, here's the Belt-Guard.  Cut on my Langmuir Crossfire CNC Plasma Table and bent on my Shop-Fox three in one bender. A little Grizzly-Green to follow!


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## Janderso (Nov 10, 2021)

Cletus said:


> Hahaha!   ..... Interestingly enough, funny you should say that, I just used my new PM935 mill to make a fixture adapter for a Neurosurgical Skull Clamping apparatus for one of the Operating Rooms I support     .....no kidding, the mill is earning it's keep.
> I'm eager to get playing with this ELS, it will certainly breathe new life into my old faithful lathe!


Do brain surgery adapters need to be made out of some fancy stainless steel?


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## Cletus (Nov 10, 2021)

....and, there we are!


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## Cletus (Nov 10, 2021)

Janderso said:


> Do brain surgery adapters need to be made out of some fancy stainless steel?


Generally, only if it is in contact with the patient or in the direct sterile field.  I stay away from making such due to potential liability issues. I will however, occasionally modify such at a Dr's request though.  The last two jobs for the OR I just completed were in 6061 Aluminum and 303 Stainless Steel and those worked out fine for all intents and purposes.


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## Winegrower (Nov 10, 2021)

I really applaud your attention to detail in the fit and finish areas.  I never seem to get around to caring what it looks like, just function…so I like your style.


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## Cletus (Nov 10, 2021)

Thanks man, I really appreciate the compliment!


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## Cletus (Nov 13, 2021)

New Bright Idea
Now working on an Electronic feed-stop for the carriage, that will work off the electronic braking relay box. A limit microswitch, attached to a movable/adjustable delrin mount between the ways, carriage shall activate such and a latching relay shall apply the "Brake" and keep it applied until a manual reset push-button is depressed. A piezo buzzer shall indicate when this is so activated.........  _more to follow_


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## Cletus (Nov 13, 2021)

Implemented and works a peach, probably could have been more elegant, less relay logic with an Arduino or something, but I just kept going at it and here we are:


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## Cletus (Nov 14, 2021)

Good news, just been informed the Toothed Belt has arrived at my forwarder's and is ready for collection tomorrow


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## Cletus (Nov 15, 2021)

Well, the belt just came in and fits perfectly.
Agreed, I used the wrong single point cutter for these 1st test threads, however, I can confirm the Electronic Leadscrew, Electronic Braking System and Electronic Carriage Stop are all working perfectly from the get go! 
Another fun project and learning experience accomplished


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## Cletus (Nov 15, 2021)

Notice the automatic carriage stop (electronic braking) at the preset position at the end  of the thread. this is where the microswitch gets triggered by the saddle.  This causes a relay (K5) to latch applying the brake and latching it on.  At this point, I back off the cross-slide put the spindle in reverse, and depress the reset button to unlatch the relay.  After the carriage reverses past the thread starting point, I throw stop, set the cross-slide back to zero, increase the compound as desired and throw the spindle in forward again to take another, deeper cut.  I do not need to disengage the half-nuts during threading.


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## Cletus (Nov 20, 2021)




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## Diaric (Jan 2, 2022)

Thank You so much for taking the time to simply show and describe how this is completed. Clough42 puts out some excellent videos and info, but once he starts describing a process, he quickly starts talking over my old man head. Your flow chart diagram, ‘Finially’ gives a clear description of where the TI launch board fits into all this. His instructions just keep telling me I need it, but not really a where or why if I’m buying his control board. And that TI board seems to be a tricky find.
IT MAKES SENSE NOW !
Did you you ever give any thought to connecting the ELS, to the shaft that in the Quick Change Gear Box ?  Or was it just to tight to hide the servo/stepper in there?
This whole project solves putting in a reverse threading gear and more importantly, the adjustable lever for the large metric/imperial change gears is always kicking free on mine under any tension and kicks my gears free.

Coincidentally, I just found your YouTube videos a little earlier and saved them into my ELS YouTube folder.   I can only dream of completing this enjoying the better surface finishes on my little lathe.  Thank you again for documenting this, I will start deciding on what to order, and collect the parts and pieces. 
now that you have some hrs on it, is this stepper motor proving adequate or do you feel another size would be better?  I have the same lathe, just a Canadian name instead of Grizzly.


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## Cletus (Jan 2, 2022)

I am happy with this servo motor / drive combination. It's got all the power needed and then some.
I found it was too much of a hassle connecting the ELS, to the shaft  in the Quick Change Gear Box and i'm comfortable with it out front. especially with my plasma-cut belt guard.  
Overall this a wonderful modification to the lathe, you won't regret it.


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## Diaric (Jan 2, 2022)

Guard looks great, I can pretty much do the same, whether it’s with my manual plasma or just the grinder.
Thanks again for the advice and quick replies, they attest to your professionalism !
Only reason I asked, was wondering about getting that chunk of gears out of the loop. They probably don’t cause much difference in noise or finish. I know the other multiple gears running together make quite a racket.


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## Cletus (Jan 2, 2022)

Diaric said:


> I know the other multiple gears running together make quite a racket.


it's pretty quiet really


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## Diaric (Jan 3, 2022)

Cletus said:


> *Electronics Interconnections:*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thank you a ton for this little link and parts diagram from Clough42.  Anytime I searched for info on this project, I got a link to the GitHub software page for the project. From there, on my tablet, it’s near impossible to navigate away and get real info. 
This simple post made it all so clear and simple to understand for me.


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## Cletus (Jan 3, 2022)

Glad to be of assistance!


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## Cletus (Jan 5, 2022)

Hey, keep me posted on how your build goes!


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## Ben17484 (Oct 4, 2022)

Cletus said:


> *What's done thus far:*
> 1) Viewed the entire series of @clough42 videos relative to this mod.
> 
> 2) Determined the G4000 has a different Spindle to Idler ratio (1:2) than James' lathe, so I'm going with 80T and 40T GT2 pulleys to couple the idler to the encoder.
> ...



Hi Cletus - very cool thread here. How did you decide on the spindle to idler ratio? I’m trying to figure out what pulleys I need. Thanks. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Cletus (Oct 4, 2022)

Ben17484 said:


> Hi Cletus - very cool thread here. How did you decide on the spindle to idler ratio? I’m trying to figure out what pulleys I need. Thanks.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Well, you need your encoder rotating at the exact same speed as your spindle.  So, whatever ratio your spindle to idler is, you need the same but opposing ratio from the idler to the encoder (in my case Idler 80T / Spindle 40T so 80/40=2:1).  Of course you'll need to decide on and select appropriate size toothed pulleys so it will all fit within the available space when the belt couples it.  Hope this helps.


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## Ben17484 (Oct 4, 2022)

Cletus said:


> Well, you need your encoder rotating at the exact same speed as your spindle. So, whatever ratio your spindle to idler is, you need the same but opposing ratio from the idler to the encoder (in my case Idler 80T / Spindle 40T so 80/40=2:1). Of course you'll need to decide on and select appropriate size toothed pulleys so it will all fit within the available space when the belt couples it. Hope this helps.



Thanks Cletus. To make sure I’m getting my naming of parts correct, I’ve got the following:







Highlighted red is the spindle gear at 24 teeth. Highlighted blue is the idler gear at 80 teeth. What I don’t fully understand is why choose the 80 teeth idler gear? That’s a change gear, so why do I care that it’s 80 teeth? 

I’m also not sure where the TPI of the lead screw comes in to it? (8 TPI for my lathe)

Sorry for so many questions! 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Cletus (Oct 4, 2022)

No problem.
Just about all of those gears will be coming out.  How many teeth is the gear immediately after the 24T (red) gear? That may be a good place to attach an encoder pulley.  TPI of the leadscrew and the gear ratio of the Stepper to Leadscrew pulleys will be input during the setup of the software.

This is my setup, and may make the concept a little clearer, 1:1 ratio between Spindle and encoder, 3:1 ratio stepper motor to leadscrew and a 16TPI leadscrew.  The stepper info, ratio and leadscrew TPI will be input into the software during setup:


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## Ben17484 (Oct 5, 2022)

Cletus said:


> No problem.
> Just about all of those gears will be coming out. How many teeth is the gear immediately after the 24T (red) gear? That may be a good place to attach an encoder pulley. TPI of the leadscrew and the gear ratio of the Stepper to Leadscrew pulleys will be input during the setup of the software.
> 
> This is my setup, and may make the concept a little clearer, 1:1 ratio between Spindle and encoder, 3:1 ratio stepper motor to leadscrew and a 16TPI leadscrew. The stepper info, ratio and leadscrew TPI will be input into the software during setup:
> ...



Thanks so much Cletus. So I just need a 1:1 relationship between the spindle gear and the encoder, and you chose to do that via your 80t idler gear, but it doesn’t matter how you acheive it, as long as it’s 1:1 eventually?

And then the ratio between the stepper and lead screw as well as the TPI is defined in the software/firmware. What made you decide to make it 3:1 in your case? Is that dependent on the speeds of your stepper?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Cletus (Oct 5, 2022)

Most welcome!
_So I just need a 1:1 relationship between the spindle gear and the encoder, and you chose to do that via your 80t idler gear, but it doesn’t matter how you acheive it, as long as it’s 1:1 eventually?_    Correct.

_And then the ratio between the stepper and lead screw as well as the TPI is defined in the software/firmware._ Correct

_What made you decide to make it 3:1 in your case? Is that dependent on the speeds of your stepper?_
Wanted to ensure I had lots of torque and resolution for turning the leadscrew, I'm using a servo-stepper and I know the motor has more than enough top-end speed.

Have a look at the James' ELS videos in particular these two on the subject, hope this helps


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## Ben17484 (Oct 5, 2022)

Thanks Cletus. I rewatched those today as well as another YouTube set of videos by ‘routercnc’ and I think everything makes sense to me now. I’ve got all of the equipment (other than pulleys, but I now know what I need) I just need to figure out how to fit it all together and to the lathe 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Cletus (Oct 5, 2022)

Great!    ........... you will like it. I use mine nearly every day


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## weejax (Oct 8, 2022)

hey cletus,  im in the process of this build.  ive got the same lathe as you (central machinery version).  Im probably going to set it up the same as you and clough did.  On the grizzly model clough has (0602) i believe it power feeds/threads via half nut.  on our models we have the keyed lead screw for the power feeds.  was wondering what your experience has been using the power feed with the ELS.  I think the program that clough wrote assumes you are using a half nut.  id like to not use the half nut for power feed to try and extend the life.


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## Cletus (Oct 9, 2022)

Oh absolutely!  I only use the half nuts when threading.  When power feeding, I'm using the keyed leadscrew mechanism.  You can change feedrate on the fly using the ELS.


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## weejax (Oct 9, 2022)

Cletus said:


> Oh absolutely!  I only use the half nuts when threading.  When power feeding, I'm using the keyed leadscrew mechanism.  You can change feedrate on the fly using the ELS.


thanks--im trying to figure out how you would calculate SFM--im a rookie so like to use the charts for that stuff.  i think the ELS gives you thou/rev right?  how do you figure out your feed rates?  thanks for any advice.


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## weejax (Oct 9, 2022)

weejax said:


> thanks--im trying to figure out how you would calculate SFM--im a rookie so like to use the charts for that stuff.  i think the ELS gives you thou/rev right?  how do you figure out your feed rates?  thanks for any advice.


this is referring to using the keyed leadscrew


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## Ben17484 (Oct 9, 2022)

Sorry for high jacking your thread with questions Cletus, but why didn’t you connect your spindle directly to the encoder? Could you not find the correct size pulley to match your spindle gear? I ask because I’m thinking of doing this myself. If my spindle is 24 teeth, could I not just buy a 24 tooth pulley to go on my encoder and connect them directly together (via a pulley obviously)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Cletus (Oct 9, 2022)

Ben17484 said:


> Sorry for high jacking your thread with questions Cletus, but why didn’t you connect your spindle directly to the encoder? Could you not find the correct size pulley to match your spindle gear? I ask because I’m thinking of doing this myself. If my spindle is 24 teeth, could I not just buy a 24 tooth pulley to go on my encoder and connect them directly together (via a pulley obviously)
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Sure you could. Whatever works to get the spindle and encoder running at the same speed (without slippage).  It was just convenient and simple for me to mount the toothed pulley on the idler.


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## Cletus (Oct 9, 2022)

weejax said:


> this is referring to using the keyed leadscrew


Lots of good info out there on feeds and speeds, but I don't use any charts and math for that, I do it on the fly and see what works at the time for a given material/tool combination (chip formation, chatter, surface finish, etc. being the indicators).



			https://www.autodesk.com/products/fusion-360/blog/speeds-feeds-new-cnc-machinists/#:~:text=Feeds%20specifically%20refers%20to%20the,Feet%20per%20Minute%20(SFM).


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## Cletus (Oct 20, 2022)

How's the ELS build coming along?


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## weejax (Oct 20, 2022)

Waiting for pulleys and wire to come in.  today im going to make a bracket for the stepper which ended up fitting nicely inside the piece of tube steel the lathe sits on (see pic).   Im going to use your idea of mounting the pulley to the 80T gear for the encoder (thank you very much for that).  while waiting for the parts I put on a DRO but display is still slowly making its way from china so havent had a chance to use it.  I have one question, maybe you could answer (i have A LOT to learn about electronics still):  i have this meanwell power supply (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00G8UDEQ8/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1).  Its 48v, 12 amps.  It appears to have multiple voltage output terminals but the documentation refers to it as "single output."  Ideally i would get power to stepper and the 5V to the TI Launch control board from this (to save having to use an extra plug).  Is that possible?  Also, thanks for the tricking out lathe and into pdfs--i knew nothing about lathes getting started and those were an immense help getting this one running!


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## weejax (Oct 20, 2022)

Forgot to post pics:


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## Cletus (Oct 20, 2022)

Ahhh, very nice and good progress.  That power supply outputs a single 48V supply only, all three "+++" are connected together and likewise all three "---" are connected together.  That said, yoy'll need a second power supply for the 5V supply for the control electronics and I recommend this one (the 115vac inputs could be connected together and go to a common fuse, switch,plug)  :



			https://www.amazon.com/MEAN-WELL-RS-15-5-Supply-Single/dp/B005T6UJBU/ref=sr_1_6?dchild=1&keywords=5v+power+supply&qid=1634938431&s=industrial&sr=1-6
		


I also like the idea of the second supply (5V) being completely dedicated to the control electronics, so as to mitigate any electrical noise from the stepper/driver getting into the control system.

Glad you also found the "Tricking out" PDFs of interest, it was done when I migrated from my original tiny Emco Unimat SL to the  Grizzly G4000. Would love to have a bigger lathe still, but there's just no room for it here in the shop. The G4000 is in use almost daily and does pretty much everything i need to do, so a bigger lathe is a "want" not a need.


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## Cletus (Oct 20, 2022)

Cletus said:


> Ahhh, very nice and good progress.  That power supply outputs a single 48V supply only, all three "+++" are connected together and likewise all three "---" are connected together.  That said, yoy'll need a second power supply for the 5V supply for the control electronics and I recommend this one (the 115vac inputs could be connected together and go to a common fuse, switch,plug)  :
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Just did some maintenance on mine. The 7-segment LED display lost a few segments, so just changed out to a new display.


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## weejax (Oct 20, 2022)

thanks cletus--so i can just split the 120v line coming in to power the 5v and 48V right?  If so i think ill get the part--one less plug to deal with.  did you get a different display or just replace original?


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## Cletus (Oct 20, 2022)

I simply replaced the original display.
Yes just split the incoming ac line (115vac or 120vac) into the two power supplies like so:
Please pardon the rough sketch!


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## weejax (Oct 21, 2022)

thanks for the sketch!  i ordered the part today.  appreciate the advice.


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## Cletus (Oct 21, 2022)

Glad to be of assistance.


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## RJSakowski (Oct 21, 2022)

One thing that I did on my ELS build was to split the line voltage for the stepper power supply and the 5 volt supply.  This allows me to disable the stepper and save wear and tear on the lead screw and gear box as well as the stepper power supply when I am not using power feed but still retain the tachometer function.  Much of the simple lathe work that I do doesn't require power feed do I am probably only using it about 10 - 15% of the time.


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## Cletus (Oct 21, 2022)

Good idea, but the "PWR" button on the ELS panel pretty much does the same thing, although the ELS, by default,  boots-up with the stepper on.


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## weejax (Oct 27, 2022)

Finally got all the electronics wired together, chip flashed, ready to go.  Everything lit up like its supposed to but when i moved the encoder the servo did nothing.  The flashing red light indicated position error.  Went back and confirmed all of the wiring was in the right place.  Same thing.  hooked the driver up to the computer and tried to run the servo that way.  Nada, showed position error.  Dark clouds descended.  In the midst of my depression I thought Id try to use the cable extension that came w the servo--previously was just attaching the serial plug directly from the servo to the driver.  And that was the problem.  I guess the pin out is different for the servo and driver.  Everything seems to work OK now.  One thing i did notice was if I gave the encoder a REALLY quick twist I would get a position error again.  Is that normal?  I guess ill put it on the lathe and see what happens.  One question about your build--it looks like you have a number of grounds going to the case.  The only ground i have going to case is the shielding from the encoder.  the rest go to the ground on the 120V.  Am I doing something wrong?  Thanks for all the help!


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## Cletus (Oct 27, 2022)

Good going!
My case is plastic. All the grounds go to one central post and thence to ground at the electrical outlet. 
I think you'll be fine.
@clough42 has an overspeed algorithm built into the software, that's probably kicking-in when you spool the encoder really fast.


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## weejax (Oct 27, 2022)

Cletus said:


> Good going!
> My case is plastic. All the grounds go to one central post and thence to ground at the electrical outlet.
> I think you'll be fine.
> @clough42 has an overspeed algorithm built into the software, that's probably kicking-in when you spool the encoder really fast.


thanks again cletus.  i think everything should be smooth sailing ahead.  just waiting on pulleys and belts.


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## weejax (Nov 11, 2022)

weejax said:


> thanks again cletus.  i think everything should be smooth sailing ahead.  just waiting on pulleys and belts.





Cletus said:


> Good going!
> My case is plastic. All the grounds go to one central post and thence to ground at the electrical outlet.
> I think you'll be fine.
> @clough42 has an overspeed algorithm built into the software, that's probably kicking-in when you spool the encoder really fast.


Hey Cletus--back again bothering you for some knowledge--you mentioned that you had a crossfire plasma cutter.  I have an opportunity to get a used crossfire pro for around 1700 bucks.  I was looking through the langmuir boards and someone named Cletus said he was using a primeweld Cut 60.  Is that you?  Im trying to find a good plasma cutter that is not as expensive as the hypertherm.


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## Cletus (Nov 11, 2022)

Yes that's me. Just love my PrimeWeld CUT60.  No issues with it at all. I have lots of posts on that forum with mods and tips for the Crossfire.  Another great plasma cutter is Everlast.  Hypertherm is of course the king of plasma cutters, though expensive.


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## weejax (Nov 11, 2022)

Cletus said:


> Yes that's me. Just love my PrimeWeld CUT60.  No issues with it at all. I have lots of posts on that forum with mods and tips for the Crossfire.  Another great plasma cutter is Everlast.  Hypertherm is of course the king of plasma cutters, though expensive.


awesome.  ill go digging through those posts.  do you think 1700 is reasonable for a used one?  seems to be in decent shape.


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## Cletus (Nov 11, 2022)

I bought mine used also, well, assembled but never used and I believe I paid $2000 for it, 2 years ago. Was a great investment for the shop.


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## weejax (Nov 12, 2022)

Cletus said:


> I bought mine used also, well, assembled but never used and I believe I paid $2000 for it, 2 years ago. Was a great investment for the shop.


thanks again!


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## weejax (Nov 18, 2022)

Finally got the belts in.  Everything appears to be working.  Have yet to make a thread but thrilled that nothing has puffed smoke.  Now on to screwing around with this used plasma table.  thanks for all the help cletus.


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## Cletus (Nov 18, 2022)

Very glad to be of assistance.  It came together well, have fun with it and your CNC Plasma Table.


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## Ben17484 (Nov 30, 2022)

Hey Cletus. Sorry to bombard your thread with more questions again, but I’m a bit stuck on the wiring for my Clough42 ELS. The diagram that Clough42 shares for wiring the encoder to the TI board doesn’t show which wire should go where (I’m sure it’s obvious to people in the know, but I’m a bit clueless). I’ve found a wiring diagram for my encoder (Omicron EB62…) but want to make sure I’ve connected to the right place on the board:







I believe you’ve a similar set up, do you lnow how to map wires to pins?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Cletus (Nov 30, 2022)

No problem, according to how mine is wired, switch your white and black wires around.


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