# Need help wiring Clausing 8520



## JPigg55 (Oct 26, 2013)

Trying to wire my Clausing 8520 for 220v. Previous owner had it wired for 110v.
I've added pictures of the Clausing manual wiring diagram, motor wiring diagram, & motor wires.
I've wired the switch per the manual for 220v single phase, but when I got to the motor (wires had been disconnected for shipping by previous owner) none of the wire colors matched the manual or the motor wiring label.
The 4 wires coming out of the motor are: 1-Red, 2-Black with white stripe (both same color), and 1-Green. The green wire is a smaller gauge wire.
Previous owner labeld the wires as follows: 1-Red, 2-one of the Black with White stripe wires, & 3- the other Black with White stripe wires. As previously stated, it was wired for 110v.
How do I connect the wires and/or test the motor wires to figure out how to connect them ???


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## Bill Gruby (Oct 26, 2013)

I had mine wired by a professional electrician. I will co down to the cave tomorrow and take pictures for you. I don't do any electrical work myself. It's the only thing I farm out.

 "Billy G"


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## CluelessNewB (Oct 26, 2013)

That motor appears to be a Delta or Rockwell motor which I would guess is not original equipment for a Clausing machine.  Personally I would not depend on the diagram in the Clausing manual for motor connections.  I would guess the green wire is a ground.  Are you sure there aren't some other wires taped up and stuffed in the box you can't see?


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## the gentleman (Oct 26, 2013)

That is a Rockwell / Delta motor . . . look on the motor tag and put the colored wires where indicated on the motor terminals for 220 volts . . .


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## JPigg55 (Oct 27, 2013)

NO, the tag is for the motor and Yes, I have a DMM and know how to use it.
The wiring part wouldn't be a problem except for figuring out which wire is which on the motor since the motor wires colors  don't match the motor tag colors.
There are 4 wires coming out of the motor. One is a green, smaller guage wire than the other three that seems more like a ground fault wire to me, one red wire, and two wires that are black in color with a white stripe.
I know with 220v, you don't necessarily need a ground wire as with 110v and would then guess that one of the two black wires with the white stripe is the blue wire referenced on the tag.
That assumption being correct, I would then guess that one power lead connected to the B/WT wire and the other connected to the Blue would result in one direction of rotation and interchanging the B/Wt with the Red would result in the other direction of rotation.
Is there a way to test this with my DMM ???


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## Rbeckett (Oct 27, 2013)

JP.
The drawing that they had up is the one from the Clausing owners manual and it appears to be about as simple as it gets.  I am "electrically" challenged and feel like I could get that to work if need be.  Green is the standard for earth ground.  Black with white stripes are coded as legs of a voltage.  The red wire is either the cap or starter circuit switch.  Some motors employ a cap to help them spin up, and others use a set of coils the are de-energized once the motor spins up to speed.  use your DMM and measure the continuity to ground.  One should be a dead short to ground and be green.  The two black w/white shold show some resistance and be fairly close to each other in reading and the red wire will either show some resistance and hold or show a reading that diminishes to zero over time.  Hope this helps, because that is about the sum total knowledge I have for electrical, but it should help you get er goin and enjoying some chip making too.  Good luck and let us know how it works out.

Bob


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## JPigg55 (Oct 27, 2013)

Bad news for me. I think the motor is bad.
Resistance reading were as follows:
All wires to casing showed oper circuit, so green wire wasn't a ground fault wire.
Blk/W to Blk/W was 0.1 ohms and all others showed open circuit except Red to Green was fluctuating between 50 & 100 ohms for a short time before going open circuit (upon cliser inspection, Red wire shows severely cracked insulation and wire badly corroded).
Some good news is that I have another dual voltage, reverable motor with, I believe, the same shaft size and speed rating (will have to verify).
Bad news is that it's a 1.5 HP vs the 0.5 HP that's on the mill now.
Anyone foresee any problems with using the 1.5 HP motor ???


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## Bill Gruby (Oct 27, 2013)

Yup, that motor is probably shot. I upgraded to a 1 HP on my 8520. It's more than enough.


"Billy G"


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## CluelessNewB (Oct 27, 2013)

JPigg55 said:


> Bad news for me. I think the motor is bad.
> Resistance reading were as follows:
> All wires to casing showed oper circuit, so green wire wasn't a ground fault wire.
> Blk/W to Blk/W was 0.1 ohms and all others showed open circuit except Red to Green was fluctuating between 50 & 100 ohms for a short time before going open circuit (upon cliser inspection, Red wire shows severely cracked insulation and wire badly corroded).
> ...



Personally I would not be so quick to condemn that motor but I have been playing around with motors since I was about 12.  If you don't feel comfortable working on it please pass that motor on to someone else who is rather than scrap it.   I believe that is a Rockwell 62-610 and probably dates to the 1960's.  If that is correct the shaft size is 1/2" and most probably will not match the 1.5hp motor.  The mounting base will also probably not match.


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## Rbeckett (Oct 27, 2013)

On a positive thought a little extra oomph might be a good thing too.  Going from 1/2 to 1 1/2 as long as you can bolt it up and aligh the pulleys is fine.  You could even bore the pulley for a larger shaft or make a sleeve to go smaller.  If it will run on 220 and switch directions it is a home run.  Most of our small machines could use a bit more power, but that seems to be one of the places they cut short to save a little money.  I would expect the motors to be physically larger in dialeter, but the important measurement is the shaft diameter and available length.  You can always but a belt  a tad longer or shorter once you get it mocked up and being assembled.  I personally would not hesitate to adapt that motor if I could do it without making any permanent change to the basic machine.  Motor plates and mounts are easy to drill and tap on the motors.  Definately don't forget to post some pics up because according to the manual I ordered for the 8520 it originally was shipped in 1964 with no motor and you were supposed to supply one when you got the machine.  They included the hardware and even the rubber grommets, but no motor on the originals.  

Bob


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## JPigg55 (Oct 27, 2013)

CluelessNewB said:


> Personally I would not be so quick to condemn that motor but I have been playing around with motors since I was about 12.  If you don't feel comfortable working on it please pass that motor on to someone else who is rather than scrap it.   I believe that is a Rockwell 62-610 and probably dates to the 1960's.  If that is correct the shaft size is 1/2" and most probably will not match the 1.5hp motor.  The mounting base will also probably not match.



I'll probably see if I can find someone locally who can rewind it if it's not too $$$$$.

- - - Updated - - -



Rbeckett said:


> On a positive thought a little extra oomph might be a good thing too.  Going from 1/2 to 1 1/2 as long as you can bolt it up and aligh the pulleys is fine.  You could even bore the pulley for a larger shaft or make a sleeve to go smaller.  If it will run on 220 and switch directions it is a home run.  Most of our small machines could use a bit more power, but that seems to be one of the places they cut short to save a little money.  I would expect the motors to be physically larger in dialeter, but the important measurement is the shaft diameter and available length.  You can always but a belt  a tad longer or shorter once you get it mocked up and being assembled.  I personally would not hesitate to adapt that motor if I could do it without making any permanent change to the basic machine.  Motor plates and mounts are easy to drill and tap on the motors.  Definately don't forget to post some pics up because according to the manual I ordered for the 8520 it originally was shipped in 1964 with no motor and you were supposed to supply one when you got the machine.  They included the hardware and even the rubber grommets, but no motor on the originals.
> 
> Bob



I'm thinking I'll give it a try while I wait to see if I can get the other rewound.
The 1.5 horse motor I have is an old Dayton and at a glance looks to have similar diameter, but quite a bit longer housing. I'll have to pull it off my old milkhouse vacuum pump and check the shaft diameter. I was more worried about overpowering the mill where I'd run the risk of damaging the mill head instead of stalling out the motor. Figure the tooling would go first, but one never knows.
I don't think I'd risk it, but I happened to find and buy another complete mill head for an 8520. Price was too good to pass up I thought and it's not like they're something you can find every day.
I'll take pictures and post it if it works out.
Thanks everyone for all the help and advice.


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## Bill Gruby (Oct 27, 2013)

ARKnack said:


> I agree with you. The motor doesn't sound like it is goo. Even if it was, I would be concerned about the quality of the insulation. Being cracked and brittle, I would just use it as a boat anchor unless it is looked at by someone that really knows motors.
> 
> Personally I would think a 1 hp would be to big if it fits. The 8520 did recommend a 1/2-3/4 hp.




 My 1 HP had the exact same mount. Bolted right in place with no mods. Best move I ever made. I am rebuilding another 8520 for a friend, it will also have the 1 HP.

 "Billy G"


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## JPigg55 (Oct 28, 2013)

CluelessNewB said:


> Personally I would not be so quick to condemn that motor but I have been playing around with motors since I was about 12.  If you don't feel comfortable working on it please pass that motor on to someone else who is rather than scrap it.   I believe that is a Rockwell 62-610 and probably dates to the 1960's.  If that is correct the shaft size is 1/2" and most probably will not match the 1.5hp motor.  The mounting base will also probably not match.



Well after checking, my 1.5 HP motor shaft is quite a bit larger. Machining out the pulley may be an option, but I don't think I'll go theat way.
After a few call, it seems getting the original motor repaired wouldn't be cost effective, so if anyone is interested in it, send me a PM.
Think I'll end up looking for a new motor either 3/4 or 1 HP.

Here's a couple pictures of my motor label plate for those who may be intersted in it.


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## JohnAspinall (Oct 28, 2013)

I'm currently (slowly) wiring my 8530 for 220V.  A few general observations:

 If you've got a dual voltage, reversible, motor that can function in all four ways (low voltage forward, low voltage reverse, high voltage forward, ...) then it _must_ offer you three separate windings, meaning six wires, (not counting ground).  If you know nothing more about the motor, you should be able to group them into three pairs by checking with an ohmmeter.  (Original Poster JPigg55 clearly knows this, and I agree that it doesn't look good to find so few pairs conducting.)   

Second, you can usually pick out the starter winding in a couple of ways: look for the rising resistance over time due to the capacitor, or if you can spin the motor up to speed mechanically, you can see the winding cut out due to the centrifugal switch.

There's still one missing piece of information: the relative phase of the two main windings.  These are the windings that you wire in parallel at low voltage, and in series at high voltage, but either way you need one more bit of information so that you get their magnetic fields adding inside the motor, rather than cancelling out.  I don't know of an easy way to get that information without try-it-and-see; I'd love to hear about a way, if anyone knows one.

Now as to the Clausing manual wiring diagram.  (I think I have the same manual, if it's the reprint available on the net in various places.)  The way they show the drum switch wired is for when you _don't_ have a contactor/starter.  I prefer having a contactor, and the drum switch wiring is quite different.  (I'll post a notebook sketch when I can find a working camera.)


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## JPigg55 (Oct 28, 2013)

Bill Gruby said:


> My 1 HP had the exact same mount. Bolted right in place with no mods. Best move I ever made. I am rebuilding another 8520 for a friend, it will also have the 1 HP.
> 
> "Billy G"



Hey Billy G,
Shopping around for a new motor, I remembered and old post of your when you aquired your 8520 and was rebuilding it.
You had to get a new motor as well and got the Grizzly G2532 Motor 1 HP Single-Phase 1725 RPM TEFC 110V/220V - $149.95 + shipping. http://www.grizzly.com/products/G2532
Sounds like a good way for me to go as well, but also saw the Grizzly H5377 Motor 3/4 HP Single-Phase 1725 RPM TEFC 110V/220v - $173.95 + shipping. http://www.grizzly.com/products/Motor-3-4-HP-Single-Phase-1725-RPM-TEFC-110V-220V/H5377 
Not sure why the H5377 costs more than the G2532 and is a lower HP motor. Anyone know why ???
Sounds like you've been happy with the motor.


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## Bill Gruby (Oct 28, 2013)

I am extremely happy with it. It was a snap to install and my electrician had no issues with it. It runs extremely quiet. My mill is in the cellar and you cannot hear it running upstairs. I run the mill an average of 12-14 hours per 5 day week. I recommend that 1 HP motor anytime someone asks.

 "Billy G"


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## JPigg55 (Oct 29, 2013)

I took Billy G's advice and ordered the Grizzly G2532 Motor.
Since I'm not very familiar with drum switches thought I'd get some advice.
Here are a couple picures of the drum switch with the terminals numbered.





I want to wire the motor for 220v single phase. I'd also like to add a 110v plug much like the original power cord had (mine was totally FUBAR) I assume for powering the optional power feed (mine didn't have one, but want to add one).
How should I wire the switch giving reference to the terminals as numbered ???


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## Bill Gruby (Oct 29, 2013)

The plug, male and female. 

 "Billy G"


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## JPigg55 (Nov 1, 2013)

Never mind, I figured it out.


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## JohnAspinall (Nov 16, 2013)

Sorry for the delay.  Here's my wiring diagram, for my 8530 with contactor.  Motor wiring is for 220V, i.e. the higher voltage on a dual voltage motor.
One pic is straight from the shop notebook, I've marked up a second copy with the major components.




Hope this helps someone.
 - John


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