# Box of Kwik Switch holders that came with mill



## Mikebr5 (Jul 18, 2017)

So not only do I have to re-learn vertical milling after a few decades off, the sight-unseen mill came with about 200 pounds of various Kwik Switch stuff. I searched and found a few posts on here and learned a bit already. Thanks to you guys for sharing your experience. 
The mill and the tooling had the kind of surface rust that mostly comes from neglect... Might have been left in an unheated humid shop, or possibly rained on a few times and then stored under cover. 
This first pic is about 90% of them.


My method is to grab an old SS pan from the wife's stash and make it my own when she is not looking, and then pour a bit of bulk WD40 in it as a rinse agent. 

This is about the worst of the collet type holders for rust. 


After massaging some WD40 into the nooks and crannies and a bit of rubbing on the rust I stand them up in the corner of the WD40 pan to drain a bit, then they get wrapped in newspaper to sit for a few days. 
Later I will get back in there and repeat the massage process before I get serious about it and use some fine abrasive or a wire wheel. Maybe that's a bad idea so that's why I am posting this so one of you Kwik Switch experts can grab me by the nape of the neck before I make a big blunder.  (Well, I already made the big blunder of buying a mill unseen and none of you guys stopped me in time.) 

I have heard that there are machinists who HATE WD40 (I even know a few.) I love the stuff, probably because I am an ignorant cuss. I have used it for everything from a rust loosener, penetrant, cutting fluid, bug killer to fishing lure dip (in the old days.)  
Are there reasons not to use it as I have on these Kwik Shift tool holders?


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## Uglydog (Jul 18, 2017)

Looks like a cool surprise.
Please let me know if you happen to have a 40NMTB taper to kwick switch master and an extra set of kwick swithch holders?
Also looking for other 40NMTB....

Daryl
MN


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## RandyM (Jul 18, 2017)

I don't know, it sure looks like you are having fun.

OH, we never stop anyone from spending money, good or bad purchase.


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## Rootpass (Jul 18, 2017)

We need pictures of the mill to make a accurate recommendation. Lol. That doesn't look bad as far as the rust goes. I've had great luck with Arm & Hammer  washing soda, a bucket of water and a battery charger. It removes rust effortlessly. The real work comes when taking the parts out and using a HAND wire brush to clean them and then wipe them down etc. mrpete on YouTube has a video as do many other people. 
Nice score.


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## Mikebr5 (Jul 18, 2017)

Uglydog said:


> Looks like a cool surprise.
> Please let me know if you happen to have a 40NMTB taper to kwick switch master and an extra set of kwick swithch holders?
> Also looking for other 40NMTB....
> Daryl
> MN


I will catalog what I have and let you know Daryl... I should warn you early though- I didn't even understand what you said. That's how ignorant I am. 


RandyM said:


> I don't know, it sure looks like you are having fun.
> OH, we never stop anyone from spending money, good or bad purchase.


Any day that I get to fondle thick rusty steel and get rusty/oily is a good day. You read me well sir. haha


Rootpass said:


> We need pictures of the mill to make a accurate recommendation. Lol. That doesn't look bad as far as the rust goes. I've had great luck with Arm & Hammer  washing soda, a bucket of water and a battery charger. It removes rust effortlessly. The real work comes when taking the parts out and using a HAND wire brush to clean them and then wipe them down etc. mrpete on YouTube has a video as do many other people.
> Nice score.


I will try your soda method... I used to keep two lidded pots in my workshop- one with vinegar and the other with soda for neutralizing, then I'd rinse the item outside in water. 
I made the grand error of leaving a rusty bolt in the vinegar and forgot it for about two weeks. I was reminded about galvanic corrosion at the end of the 2 week soak by the scent of Old Italy around that area as the remnants of the vinegar dribbled out the bottom of the thick pan that had been riddled with corrosion. It was a good thick pot and matching lid too.


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## woodchucker (Jul 18, 2017)

Just understand he recommended WASHING SODA not baking soda. There is a difference for electrolysis. BTW electrolysis does work great.


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## Uglydog (Jul 18, 2017)

Mikebr5 said:


> I will catalog what I have and let you know Daryl... I should warn you early though- I didn't even understand what you said. That's how ignorant I am.



Mikebr5,
Welcome to HM. 
I came here several years ago with a sincere desire to learn stuff. With the extreme patience of HM members I asked questions, made lots of mistakes, and learned heaps. I'm not a machinist. However, I enjoy trying learn the skill set. We are all on a learning curve. It's ok not to know stuff. 
Welcome to HM.

Daryl
MN


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## Mikebr5 (Jul 18, 2017)

My internet searches for Kwik Shift tools doesn't return much... Are they made anymore?  
Is there a catalog that describes what each head is used for? 
I finished massaging my new babies, wrapping them in paper and partially sorting them into boxes for further sorting and cleaning next week. The variety is interesting... Some are threaded for a drawbar some are not. Looks like at least 2 different size drawbars.


Some of those threaded for a drawbar have a screw filling the threads, most do not. 
Some of the collet type holders have hex tighteners, the rest have spanner type- seems to be size related. The larger of the collet types are all spanner type.
Some of the taper types have the slot to the top of the holder, the others are the type that I recognize from shop class for popping out drill bits... drift pin slot is "enclosed." 


I am surprised by the tool holders that rely on socket set screws to hold the cutter... Doesn't that offset the cutting tool?

I looked up "tool HEAD 95299" and it lead me to tools-n-gizmos but every tool that I have so far checked comes back "unavailable. "
Does anyone know of a good write-up or catalog for Kwik Shift tool holders?


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## brino (Jul 18, 2017)

Hi Mike, I have no knowledge of those tool holders, but wanted to stop in and say.....Welcome to the Hobby-Machinist!

-brino

Hey mike, by the way I just noticed that you "switched" from using the name "Kwik Switch" in post #1 to "Kwik Shift" in post #8.

I did a net search on the first one and found this:
http://toolholderexchange.com/kwik-switch/

maybe it'll help.......


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## brino (Jul 18, 2017)

......oh and just found this page:
http://www.collistoolholder.com/cgi-bin/items.cgi?cat=CAT_9

that says "Collis Rapid Switch Tool Holders are completely interchangeable with Universal Kwik-Switch®." 

-brino


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## Mikebr5 (Jul 18, 2017)

Thank you kindly Brino! My search was for Kwik Switch but I use an off-brand search engine. 
Your results are just what the doctor ordered.


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## T Bredehoft (Jul 18, 2017)

Drawbar threads must be for something else. If memory serves they are locked in place with a cover which remains on the spindle. [ Just remembered, the cover locks open when you remove a tool. When you insert the next one it releases the cover which snaps shut locking the tool in the taper. ] Use a spanner to loosen the cover/cap. Their literature says the tool sockets are machined offset from center to accommodate the set screw pressure. Treasure them, set each one up with its own tool, Should lyou h ave CNC you can establish each tool's length and diameter and record it in the software.


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## cvairwerks (Jul 20, 2017)

Don't see an adapter head or a drawbar head in the pictures. They are available new. An adapter is about 650$, new price, not sure on the drawbar type. Quick estimate from the photos, is that you've got somewhere around 5-6K$ worth of tool heads at evilbay average prices.


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## 4GSR (Jul 20, 2017)

The thread that you are referring to as a "draw bar" thread is not.  The set screw down in the thread is used for an adjustment for setting the height of your cutting tool in the holder.  Beware, the thread maybe left handed!  I had a few straight shank holders that held "Acura Flex" collets, which you have several holders shown in your pictures.  Somewhere in my collections of stuff, I have a old Universal Engineering catalog showing all of the different holding systems that they made including the "Kwik-Switch" tooling.  

Don't toss any of it or sell any of it off.  You will need all of it for your mill soon!


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## Mikebr5 (Jul 20, 2017)

Things are starting to make sense- thank you, gentlemen. Brino's links, a bunch more PDFs, and these knowledge bombs delivered in here have me feeling almost knowledgeable enough to break something, and soon! 
The cutting table went out the shop door yesterday and the milling machine goes in next to the lathe today. Maybe tomorrow I'll work up the energy and the courage to insert a tool.


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## Silverbullet (Jul 20, 2017)

Hi Mike , welcome, you did good on the mill buy . I'm one of the WD40 haters when used as protecting. It's only claim to fame is a water displaced for metal. I've done a bit of gunsmithing over the years and a beautiful Browning barrel came in rusty top to bottom some on the choke inside. Why cleaned and stored with wd40. Admitted it was for a year in the closet. If it had been rubbed down with oil it wouldn't have needed more then a wipe down. The bore cleaned up easy but the bluing took time to get back to the deep bluing it had. If you use your tooling it won't rust but if try storing it please oil it up and cover with an oily rag. I like gear oil it sticks and stays .


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## brino (Jul 20, 2017)

@Mikebr5 
I'd still like to see some "full view" pictures of that mill........
-brino


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## Mikebr5 (Jul 20, 2017)

brino said:


> @Mikebr5
> I'd still like to see some "full view" pictures of that mill........
> -brino


I will do it sir!  In the process of moving the mill inside I had to move about 10 tons of other stuff, including a diesel fuel tank. I wasn't thrilled about slinging a tank with 175 sloshing gallons in it, so was topping off machines with a manual pump and the pump "died".  Weirdest thing... Pumped 10 gallons fine, came back in and only pumped air! Checked the depth in the tank and my intake was well below. 
So this morning I took the whole thing apart right down to the springs and pins. Nothing... Must have been as simple as a joint leaking on the suction side, but there were no bubbles for those 1st 10 gallons. 

Now I await 4 hours for Form-A-Gasket to cure.


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## brino (Jul 20, 2017)

Too often one thing does lead to another......be careful with all those moves and we'll be here when you can post some pics.
Thanks,
-brino


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## Mikebr5 (Jul 21, 2017)

Under cover finally, but not in it's final spot.


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## cvairwerks (Jul 22, 2017)

Mike: If you hadn't figured it out, that's the adapter in your mill head. With it cleaned up and lubed, you should be able to switch tools with a twist of the knurled ring to unlock the adapter. The mill that I used to run with KS adapted tooling never needed the spanner to unlock. It was nice to be able to switch tooling within about 10 seconds and carry on.


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## brino (Jul 22, 2017)

That is a great looking mill.
Congratulations!
-brino


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## Mikebr5 (Jul 23, 2017)

Thank you Brino. It feels tight to the untrained hand. I was advised that if I don't have $1k ready to convert back to CNC that I shouldn't even start. I am in the middle of building a house so I will have to hold off on that job for now. 



4gsr said:


> The thread that you are referring to as a "draw bar" thread is not.  The set screw down in the thread is used for an adjustment for setting the height of your cutting tool in the holder.  Beware, the thread maybe left handed!  I had a few straight shank holders that held "Acura Flex" collets, which you have several holders shown in your pictures.  Somewhere in my collections of stuff, I have a old Universal Engineering catalog showing all of the different holding systems that they made including the "Kwik-Switch" tooling.
> Don't toss any of it or sell any of it off.  You will need all of it for your mill soon!


That is great info about the set screw... Thanks. That brings up another question- how is the Kwik Switch master holder held in the machine? There is no drawbar. Did the old CNC versions come from the factory with the Kwik Switch master installed? I'd expect that there is a way to change the tool system.



Silverbullet said:


> Hi Mike , welcome, you did good on the mill buy . I'm one of the WD40 haters when used as protecting. It's only claim to fame is a water displaced for metal. I've done a bit of gunsmithing over the years and a beautiful Browning barrel came in rusty top to bottom some on the choke inside. Why cleaned and stored with wd40. Admitted it was for a year in the closet. If it had been rubbed down with oil it wouldn't have needed more then a wipe down. The bore cleaned up easy but the bluing took time to get back to the deep bluing it had. If you use your tooling it won't rust but if try storing it please oil it up and cover with an oily rag. I like gear oil it sticks and stays .


Thanks SilverBullet. 
I read this and figured I'd think on it a few days before I replied because the story confused me. hah
We're heavy into guns here, and have put some away with WD40 for more than a year. There simply MUST be more to his story than he told you. 
As I was cleaning out the shop it started to sprinkle (I think the emptying of the shop must be the cause) and I ran out and put bulk WD40 to its best use as a water displacer. Works great. 
Maybe a discussion about WD40's properties should be in another thread... Probably already been discussed a couple of million times. 



cvairwerks said:


> Mike: If you hadn't figured it out, that's the adapter in your mill head. With it cleaned up and lubed, you should be able to switch tools with a twist of the knurled ring to unlock the adapter. The mill that I used to run with KS adapted tooling never needed the spanner to unlock. It was nice to be able to switch tooling within about 10 seconds and carry on.


I finally pulled a tool holder out of my temporary storage box (still wet with WD40) and slipped it up in the master. *click* 
Worked like a champ. No tool needed yet.


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## Rich Carlstedt (Jul 23, 2017)

Mike
Kwik Switch are some of the finest tool holders out there
They come in several sizes, like 200,300,400 etc
The number is the diameter in millimeters on the small end. Yours look like 200's
Universal Engineering went out of business back around 2008 when the crash hit as I recall
They were bought out by a large tool manufacturer who still offers the product at this location
http://www.universaldevlieg.com/ 
You have quite a stash , as most 200 's have sold on ebay for 25-50 each. retail they were 200 each.
I use them and have bought collets and holders from a guy in your neighborhood named Steve at 

http://tools-n-gizmos.com./

Rich


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## hatch789 (Mar 20, 2020)

Mike, I have a Tree Journeyman 200R with a Kwik-Switch II holder (200 series) and I like them very much, but they're all I have ever used really. Outside of a bit of tinkering at other places. Are you still using yours? I have pictures of 10 years ago when I got and totally rebuilt my machine. And my YouTube channel has videos of it working now with LinuxCNC on X,Y&Z axis. Yes I added a working Z to that old 1982 machine! So if you're still out there give me a shout and we can chat.


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## Silverbullet (Mar 21, 2020)

Mikebr5 said:


> Under cover finally, but not in it's final spot.
> View attachment 238040


Very nice - good luck with your new baby. She looks in great condition.  Congratulations


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## DavidR8 (Mar 21, 2020)

Holy thread revival!


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## hatch789 (Mar 21, 2020)

I'm curious if Mike is still kicking or not?


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## Mikebr5 (Oct 30, 2020)

hatch789 said:


> I'm curious if Mike is still kicking or not?


Howdy Hatch, et al.  I escaped from my computer for a few years.  I just logged in for the first time and saw your email. 
Have been working out of state and out of the USA for a bit. Nice to be home in time to see the cities burn down and the level of public discourse descend to tribal warfare.

I apologize if this counts as an unholy thread revival... Just replying.   
Kind regards friends.


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## Rich Carlstedt (Oct 30, 2020)

Welcome Home Mike !

Don't know if you ever got a Kwik-Switch catalog ?
Pretty Sure I have one and can scan it if you wish ?

Rich


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## Mikebr5 (Nov 1, 2020)

Rich Carlstedt said:


> Welcome Home Mike !
> 
> Don't know if you ever got a Kwik-Switch catalog ?
> Pretty Sure I have one and can scan it if you wish ?
> ...


That's a kind offer Rich, and Thanks! 
I wouldn't want to trouble you with such a big job.  When I get done with the few years of catch-up Honey-dos, then I can get back into the machine shop enough to learn and relearn enough to make that worthwhile. 
If we do get to that, I'll be glad to pay you for your time or barter for something, either way. 

If I concentrated on my machine /welding/wood/electronics hobbies right now, you'd never hear from me again.


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