# Hey hey let's do a treadmill motor thread!



## Hukshawn (Dec 8, 2017)

I'm sure I'm gonna beat a dead horse here... I did a search and found a bit about treadmill motors and whatnot, but not enough specific info to get me running.

I was given a treadmill. It's in fine working condition. If my wife had her way, I'd use it for running and lose weight, buuuuuuut, I'm gonna put it on my lathe. Which will be good cause the bearings are shot in my 1hp lathe motor.


Soo, here are some pictures and info... Where do I even begin to have a simple on off switch, forward reverse, and speed control.
It's a horizon ct9.3, the reviews state it's HIGHLY overpriced. Sweet. Lol.








This is a picture of the cable from the control pad to the motor controller. There is also a lift motor wired into the DC controller.




I'm not opposed to scrapping this controller for something reasonably priced and easier to use. However, I don't see any digital signal stuff, like a serial cable. It seems there should be enough here to get some level of control.


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## Hukshawn (Dec 9, 2017)

I fired up the treadmill. Played around with the controls and tried to meter out some outputs, I can't make heads or tails of anything. 
The user interface is very treadmill like. Slow ramp up speeds, count downs to motor starts, no immediate stop, even if you pull the safety switch.
I was wondering if it would have been simple enough to just take the start stop and speed control buttons and seperate them from the control panel and use the system as is, but there's too much interface. Each time you turn the unit on it wants user info. And the 3 second countdown to start is annoying. 
The motor also has a sensor on it so I assume using a switch to switch the polarity to reverse wouldn't be possible. 

So, I assume it's looking more towards getting a different DC controller. 
So I'll take recommendations on something like that.


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## Z2V (Dec 9, 2017)

Do you have a schematic diagram that you can post? It might help others offer up some suggestions to get you going in the right direction.


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## Hukshawn (Dec 9, 2017)

I sure don't. I tried looking for one earlier with no success but I'll try again. 

Which would you be looking for? The whole unit or just the controller?


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## Z2V (Dec 9, 2017)

Well, the more the merrier but at least the motor control. Are you sure you want to replace a 1 hp motor with a 2.5 hp? That might be big overkill on a lathe.
It might be easier to just put new bearings in your lathe motor and use the treadmill motor to make a belt grinder or some other tool for your shop.
Just a thought


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## Hukshawn (Dec 9, 2017)

Looking for the schematic. Not going well. The number on the board is mlh0910pd.

And yes, I'm fine with swapping the motors. I dont turn anything heavy enough to put my lathe at risk, and the 10" lathe is heavy duty enough to handle it. It's vbelt driven, which would slip before anything. I more so want the DC motor for the speed control and the higher speeds. The high speed pulley on the motor is not balanced very well and shakes and vibrates in high speed. So bypassing the high speed pulley on my lathe would be an advantage.


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## Glenn Brooks (Dec 9, 2017)

I bought a 1.5 hp DC treadmill motor with an aftermarket controller recently. It runsmof a pot and has an RPM meter to help determine speed.  I’ll look around the shop tomorrow and see if I kept the box and wiring diagram for themcontroller. If so will post. I think the guy who put it all together didn’t pay more than 20 bucks for the controller, and another 8-9 $ for the speed gauge,  very simple and cheap components now days.

Glenn


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## Hukshawn (Dec 9, 2017)

Glenn Brooks said:


> I bought a 1.5 hp DC treadmill motor with an aftermarket controller recently. It runsmof a pot and has an RPM meter to help determine speed.  I’ll look around the shop tomorrow and see if I kept the box and wiring diagram for themcontroller. If so will post. I think the guy who put it all together didn’t pay more than 20 bucks for the controller, and another 8-9 $ for the speed gauge,  very simple and cheap components now days.
> 
> Glenn


Perfect!


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## Z2V (Dec 9, 2017)

I agree with the speed control.
If you can’t figure out the board you have you can get a MC-60 for a resonable price. 
That seems to be the most common control board and very user friendly. I have that on my buffer stand with a 1.5 hp and a 3 hp on my belt grinder.


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## Hukshawn (Dec 9, 2017)

Not too many mc60’s on eBay right now, and not terribly cheap either. Especially to Canada. But I’ll keep my eye out.


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## Hukshawn (Dec 9, 2017)

I emailed the company to see if I can get a schematic


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## PGB1 (Dec 9, 2017)

I don't know if this will help same you some research time, Hukshawn, but I have a different model Horizon treadmill with the same motor. Being a 'registered owner' I tried calling Johnson Fitness (Owners of Horizon) to see if they'd send me a control schematic that I could send to you. No Luck. Maybe they sub these out and each lot is different?

Also of note is that the existing control won't let the motor stop immediately. It ramps down when the safety key is pulled so the runner doesn't get launched.  The motor also ramps its speed up and down very smoothly. Speed change requests are fuflilled gradually, but I believe that is a feature of the control board, not the motor itself.

On the good side, that motor does an outstanding job of maintaining speed when the load changes. After noticing the smoothness of speed change requests and stride changes, I tried adding a second person to the running deck to see if the motor would lag. It didn't hesitate a bit. I think it will behave well when you send a tool into the work piece, thus increasing the load on the motor.

I believe you will like having this motor on your machine, but using the existing Horizon control board 'as-is' may be hopeless.

Hope This Helps!
Paul


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## Hukshawn (Dec 9, 2017)

Also, finding a DC controller that will have that sensor integrated is unlikely. So I will probably lose that speed control feature


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## ttabbal (Dec 9, 2017)

If you can't find someone who has used the control board outside of the treadmill, or a schematic, it's going to be tough. I suspect the input is digital on the pins marked DA/DB. That notation is often used for RS485. But then you need to determine the protocol. And I could be wrong about the signaling. 

I've seen a few people use a cheap AC SCR based control, then run that into a bridge rectifier to get noisy DC, which the motor doesn't seem to mind.


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## PGB1 (Dec 9, 2017)

_Also, finding a DC controller that will have that sensor integrated is unlikely. So I will probably lose that speed control feature_
Forgot about that part!


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## Hukshawn (Dec 9, 2017)

I suspect you're right. There's too many functions going through too few wires back to the control board. That cable needs to bring power to the user board, and bring signaling back for the drive motor and the tilt motor. 
I have been trying to find a DC motor controller on eBay but I'm not finding anything heavy duty enough that's not hundreds of dollars. 

I have a DC motor and drive on my stroke sander from an industrial conveyor in the basement. It's older, relatively simple, and works great. 
If I could find something like that, that'd be perfect. 

If all else fails, I'm sure I could swap this out for a 2hp AC motor I have, but I like the speed control on the sander. And it would be a shame to waste that nice treadmill motor.


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## markba633csi (Dec 9, 2017)

The KB brand SCR controllers have current sensing so they do maintain constant speed under varying loads. Maybe try to find one of those
on Ebay- there are other brands too like Dart controls and Dayton.  All very similar and would work fine with your motor.
Mark S.


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## Ulma Doctor (Dec 9, 2017)

a lot of the treadmills were powered by the MC60 controller as the OEM controller
they are robust and fairly inexpensive to get.

+1 on the KB controllers, they are very nice too!!!


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## MontanaAardvark (Dec 9, 2017)

Are there 1 to 1-1/2 HP treadmill motors?  

I'm interested in replacing the spindle on my Grizzly mill (704) but I'd like to stay in that power range.  My main reason for wanting to change is really just to get faster spindle speeds and CNC control of Motor On/Off and speed.  

I have 220 available, but just like a dryer outlet - not 3 phase.   I run the Grizz on a 110 outlet with lots of other stuff so I know it could handle the load without popping breakers at inconvenient times.


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## Bob Korves (Dec 9, 2017)

MontanaAardvark said:


> Are there 1 to 1-1/2 HP treadmill motors?
> 
> I'm interested in replacing the spindle on my Grizzly mill (704) but I'd like to stay in that power range.  My main reason for wanting to change is really just to get faster spindle speeds and CNC control of Motor On/Off and speed.
> 
> I have 220 available, but just like a dryer outlet - not 3 phase.   I run the Grizz on a 110 outlet with lots of other stuff so I know it could handle the load without popping breakers at inconvenient times.


I am no expert on this, but my understanding is that you need a fairly high HP DC motor of the type used in treadmills if you want decent torque at low RPMs.  1 1/2 HP sounds like a lot, but you might be able to stop that motor from starting with your hand, depending on what you have.  Also, many of those motors are not rated honestly.  If you will not be going to use really slow motor speeds, then a smaller motor is probably just fine for many applications.  Again, I am certainly no expert on this.


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## ttabbal (Dec 9, 2017)

Treadmill motors in particular seem to be rated creatively. Mine says 2.5HP, but I don't buy that for a second. Compared to motors that have been tested to deliver that level of power, it's about 1/4 the size and weight. If you want reliable performance at the nameplate rating, you are better off with a good 3 phase motor and VFD if you want variable speed. I'm using this treadmill motor because it's free and good enough to spin a belt grinder about. I wouldn't put it on a a lathe bigger than a mini lathe.


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## ThunderDog (Dec 9, 2017)

I have done 3 of these conversions using the mc60 variety.  My first conversion was done to a Craftsman wood cutting band saw, so I could cut metal.  My second conversion was to a Delta drill press.  And the third was adding variable speed to my small/rare Jefferson horizontal mill.  That one used an older treadmill with a true 1hp Leeson motor.  It was the ugliest treadmill I had ever seen, but it was a beast of a treadmill.  FWIW, here is a video for wiring them up that I did several years ago.




And after I came to realize that treadmills are everywhere, I never pay more than $30-$40.


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## Hukshawn (Dec 9, 2017)

What are we considering as "not very expensive" for these mc60 cards? I've been seeing them between $100-200


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## ThunderDog (Dec 9, 2017)

I buy completely functioning treadmills for that price or pick them up for free.


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## Hukshawn (Dec 9, 2017)

Would this work?

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/132253305166


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## markba633csi (Dec 9, 2017)

Yes that would work; I've seen comparable units like KBIC-120 for around 40$, some new
Mark


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## Hukshawn (Dec 9, 2017)

Where?! 
But also American I assume.


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## Hukshawn (Dec 9, 2017)

Well, I bought that kbic-125...

Hopefully someone here can help me wire it. 
I’ve been reading they need some kind of plug in horse power resistor... what’s that all about?


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## f350ca (Dec 9, 2017)

Would a router speed controller like this work?

https://www.busybeetools.com/products/router-speed-control-115v-15a.html

You'd still need to add switching for raeverseif required.

Greg


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## Hukshawn (Dec 9, 2017)

I know those controllers are good for brushed motors, but what about DC...?


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## RJSakowski (Dec 10, 2017)

Many years ago, I designed a PWM controller for a DC motor, using MOSFET transistors for the output.  It was designed for a 12 volt trolling motor system system but the current capability was around 50 amps.  It has served me well for more than 30 years, requiring only a replacement of the control potentiometer and of the MOSFET's when I accidentally reversed the power supply voltage once. 

It could easily be modified to handle much higher voltages by simply choosing different MOSFET transistors.  It was drawn up on paper (no computer back then) but I should still have the schematic around somewhere.


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## Glenn Brooks (Dec 10, 2017)

Shawn,

Here are some pics of the treadmill controller schematic and model number.  This works very well so far.  The guy I bought it from said the controller and generic RPM meter, with potentiometer are readily available on line.  The controller is a KBIC Model 125.


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## Hukshawn (Dec 10, 2017)

I just bought a kbcc 125 on eBay. I'll need help figuring out how to wire it up.

What is this plug in horse power resistor I keep reading about?


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## Hukshawn (Dec 10, 2017)

Here's what I bought.

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/132253305166

Has a nice screw terminal setup.

On the kbcc 125...
What's the inhabit switch? Would that be a run/stop? How quickly does it stop?

What's the ramp up/down speeds like?

The horse power resistor, I see it now on the board. Glenn, on the other side of that sheet you pictured, it looks like it lists the horsepower resistors. Can you picture that? So I know what my board is rated for.


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## Z2V (Dec 10, 2017)

Here’s a link to the different plug in resistors. Different value depending on motor hp rating.

http://www.walkerindustrial.com/KB-Electronics-Plug-In-Horsepower-Resistor-s/845.htm


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## Hukshawn (Dec 10, 2017)

Z2V said:


> Here’s a link to the different plug in resistors. Different value depending on motor hp rating.
> 
> http://www.walkerindustrial.com/KB-Electronics-Plug-In-Horsepower-Resistor-s/845.htm


So I see they only have resistors up to  1 1/2 ho @90v. My motor is 2.5 HP. Will that overload the board or is it just lost horsepower? Which really would be fine, actually. It doesn't need that much power.


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## Z2V (Dec 11, 2017)

I’m not familiar with this controller but it looks like an auxiliary heat sink is required for 1.5 hp use. Hopefully your controller will have it. It also looks like there is an aux armature fuse. The chart for the arm fuse list a 15 amp fuse for 1.5 hp motor. If it were mine I would use that size fuse. It looks like your motor was rated at 20 amps.
Here’s the manual for that controller I believe .
Hope this helps 

https://www.kbelectronics.com/manuals/kbic_manual.pdf


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## Hukshawn (Dec 11, 2017)

My model is kbcc-125 not kbic. But I found my exact manual on the website. For once, a website that’s easy to find exact manuals. This control board seems like a dream come true! I NEVER find exactly what I’m looking for to make something work. Never happens! This is gonna be great!


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## Z2V (Dec 11, 2017)

Sorry for giving you a wrong link. 
I didn’t look but does the  kbcc125 support your 2.5 hp?
Glad you found what you need.


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## Hukshawn (Dec 11, 2017)

No worries. I didn't notice at first either. 
This kbcc goes up to 1.5 HP. My motor is 2.5.
I HIGHLY doubt I will ever turn anything that will require that amount of toque. 
But more importantly, can I assume that extra hp will just be lost? The board will only push what it's rated for and not burn out? Or will the motor ask more than the board can offer?


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## Z2V (Dec 11, 2017)

To be on the safe side I would fuse it for the max that the board supports,1.5hp, 15 amp. That will protect the board if you push the motor too hard. 
Im not an electrical engineer but to answer your questions, yes, no, and yes. You will in a sense loose the ability to use all 2.5hp.
Without the fuse the board would probably burn out if you pushed that motor full out because it would try to supply the power needed to run the motor.
This is my opinion, I’m sure others will have more to add.


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## Hukshawn (Dec 11, 2017)

Thank you for your ideas. I'm not knowledgable in this area. I can wire a house all day, but electronics aren't my forte.


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## markba633csi (Dec 11, 2017)

Hukshawn: the "horsepower" resistor is just a low value power resistor, used for the current sensing; you can make one or buy one. The ohm value is determined by the horsepower of the motor you have. Here is a chart that lists the resistor values vs motor HP.  Treadmill motors are typically way overrated in terms of horsepower, which means you'll have to make an educated guess as to the power resistor required.  I'd say start at about 3/4 hp. so you would need about a 0.015 ohm resistor at about 5 watt.  
Mark


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## Joe in Oz (Dec 13, 2017)

These motor speed controls are controlled by pulses from the 'increase' and 'decrease' buttons. The more puses from the former, the faster the motor will run - and the more pulses from the latter the slowere it it go.
Disconnect the head unit wiring altogether and find the 'up'  'down' and 'grd' terminals (usually labelled) and hook ap a loose wire to the 'grd', then hook up the power and the motor. The touch the 'up' (or 'incr' terminal multiple times until the mptpr runs - then test the speed range by touching it more often. Each touch should increase the speed a fraction more. When you stop touching the terminal with the ire end, the motor should continue running at the speed its at.
Once its running, touch the 'down' (or 'decr') terminal and see if that will slow it down again. Most controllers will work just fine like that.
I'm working on a simple circuit that will allow those pulses be sent in reponse to a potentiometer, but not quite there yet....
Watch this space. 
If anyone know how to do that, please chip in.


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## Hukshawn (Dec 26, 2017)

For the treadmill motor installed on my lathe. Had to fabracobble a new mounting bracket to go on the lathes motor plate, but that was simple enough cause I TOOK MY TIME....... Which I never do then wind up with a substandard item...

I have it temp wired into the m60 controller with a 1k pot. 
Runs like a dream... My goodness. Where has this variable speed been all my life! 
It's sooooo much quieter than the stock motor, but I think the bearings are shot in it. Very noisy. Now it's like running a lathe in a library. 
I still have 50% of the pulley speed selection as before including back gears, so I have a pretty serious range of speeds and torques. I'll have to get an rpm reader and make some new labels. 





	

		
			
		

		
	
I'll do up all the electrics tonight or tomorrow. And I'll need to make some kind of a guard to protect the motor. Since it's a permanent magnet motor, it'll collect all kinds of chips. 
Preeetty pretty happy.


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## Hukshawn (Dec 27, 2017)

Got most of it wired up in boxes. I have main ac power, an indicator light, and the speed pot in a box I'll mount beside the drum switch I will still use for fwd/stop/rev, I have that just intercepting the leads directly to the motor. And the controller mounted inside a box. The heatsink is screwed to the metal box, so I shouldn't have heat problems but if I do, I have a fan lined up.

I wish I had an electric stop/brake, but there's nothing on here for that. So I still have to let the motor wind down.

I accidently blew the dc motor fuse in the controller trying to see how quickly it will change directions. Turns out it doesn't like to be jammed into reverse. Lol
The horse power resistor in there is rated for 1hp, so I'll have to look into changing that likely. But for now I'll run it like this and see how it goes.
I'm gonna buy a tachometer cause i have no idea on speed anymore. I'll have to make new charts.

I'll replace the fuse tomorrow and button all this up hopefully and move onto the next project.


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## Silverbullet (Dec 27, 2017)

I have a treadmill saved from the trash , yes it's good my daughter wanted a different one . So I figured it will or may go in my enco little Bridgeport model . It has a 1 or 1 1/2 HP on it but the cap is burst all the continuity is good so I'm sure it's ok I also had already bought the cap prior the treadmill coming to me. So not sure but ill have options to use it . May be strong enough for my planer if it's a 2 1/2 HP should be lighter up on the super structure with the overhead pulleys to run it. To many things to do and being screwed up don't help.


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## Hukshawn (Dec 28, 2017)

This change to DC with the controller has gone reasonably well enough I'd almost like to find another one and change my Bridgeport clone to DC too.


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