# Edge finder,do you use one?



## Ken from ontario (Jan 30, 2017)

I just installed an inexpensive DRO on my mini mill and now am thinking if I get myself a decent edge finder it would go hand in hand with my new DRO , so far none of my projects needed  such precision that a tool like an edge/center finder would be handy , I managed to lightly scrape the x or y sides  of the workpiece with the end mill to feel the edges and then go from there.
So my question is , whether you find using this tool essential  for your type of milling/ precision work , if you do, what make is better ? do you use the electronic type or still use the old style?


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## Jim T (Jan 30, 2017)

Ken from ontario said:


> I just installed an inexpensive DRO on my mini mill and now am thinking if I get myself a decent edge finder it would go hand in hand with my new DRO , so far none of my projects needed  such precision that a tool like an edge/center finder would be handy , I managed to lightly scrape the x or y sides  of the workpiece with the end mill to feel the edges and then go from there.
> So my question is , whether you find using this tool essential  for your type of milling/ precision work , if you do, what make is better ? do you use the electronic type or still use the old style?



I started my machining journey about a year ago. An edge finder was one of the first tools I purchased. I use it all the time............can't imagine having to work without one. Mine is a standard Starret. Works fine. I'm sure other brands do also.

Jim


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## David S (Jan 30, 2017)

For things where accuracy is not critical I will just "touch off" at the edge with the cutter.  However for things that require more accuracy, or I don't want to touch the edge I use a Starret combination edge / centre finder.  It is mechanical not electronic.

David


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## Tony Wells (Jan 30, 2017)

I use a couple of different mechanical edge finders, as well as a wiggler from time to time. If you are poking holes in a part and you need accurate placement, they are a must, IMO. If you don't want to buy one right away, a poor-man's edge finder can be a good straight 1/2" dowel pin with a light spray of Dykem or even Sharpie on it. But a real edge finder is better. Just always remember to comp for half the diameter. I don't know any machinist that hasn't been bitten by that little gotcha.


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## talvare (Jan 30, 2017)

Tony Wells said:


> Just always remember to comp for half the diameter. I don't know any machinist that hasn't been bitten by that little gotcha.



And, the older you get, the more often you get bit 

Ted


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## rgray (Jan 30, 2017)

I have a couple of mechanicals and a couple of electronic.
Thought the electronics would be so great , but I always just use one of the mechanicals after the initial playing around with the electronicals I just don't like them as well.


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## Ken from ontario (Jan 30, 2017)

I could be wrong but based on what I read or watch on youtube ,most machinists or hobbyists that use  edge finders,  don't have good things to say about the electronic type, it seem that the older mechanical version is more favoured.
I just ordered a Fowler (52-575-025) mechanical edge/center finder, I am sure I'll be using it often, it should help speed things up a bit as well as keeping the sides of my project intact.

Thanks for all your comments so far, please keep it coming.


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## JimDawson (Jan 30, 2017)

Sterrett mechanical is my weapon of choice.  Accurate and you never have dead batteries.


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## T Bredehoft (Jan 30, 2017)

I'm with Jim (above) on that. I've been using mechanical edge finders since 1972.


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## stupoty (Jan 30, 2017)

JimDawson said:


> Sterrett mechanical is my weapon of choice.  Accurate and you never have dead batteries.



I use a Sterrett one, it was fairly cheep and from tests I've done it repeats well.  

Stuart


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## Cobra (Jan 30, 2017)

I have a selection of 3/8, 1/2 mechanical that are mostly Starrett but the finder I use most is electronic.
Use the mechanicals mainly for plastics.


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## RJSakowski (Jan 30, 2017)

Mechanical edge finders have one distinct advantage over other types of position  locators ( electronic, Haimer taster, touch probe, optical, dial indicator, etc.).  Properly used, they compensate for runout and so are independent of any spindle runout.  The edge finder will automatically center itself on the spindle axis.

I run the edge finder at a medium spindle speed.  I initially approach an edge relatively rapidly to get a rough location.  I then back off to recenter the edge finder and approach the edge at around .0002"/second.  I will repeat the measurement several times until I get a consistent reading to .0001".  If you approach too quickly you can kick the trip out prematurely or you can shoot past as it's hitting the edge giving an inaccurate reading but my experience is that it is very repeatable.  

For finding the center of a circular boss or hole, I will set the edge finder approximately at the the center of the boss/hole and find one edge in the Y direction and note the position.  When using a DRO, I usually zero the DRO at  that point.  I then move to the opposite edge and locate it.  The center of the boss is then 1/2 the distance of that reading.  My DRO's re capable of making the calculation so I don't have to do the math.  I then move to the center in the X direction and repeat the process to find the edges in the Y direction.  If I want to be super accurate, I will repeat the X axis using the Y axis center although I usually find no change from the first position.  I now have the true center coordinates of boss/hole.  I do use care when moving the edge finder over a boss to return to the same z height for each measurement.

The mechanical edge finder takes longer than some other methods but IMO, it is the most accurate method of locating an edge.  It works extremely well with a DRO but I used it for many years with just the crank dials.  You do have to take into consideration any backlash in that case.


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## Bill Gruby (Jan 30, 2017)

I have a Starrett mechanical 1/2. I use it to get hole #1. after that I use hole #1 as zero.

 "Billy G"


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## BGHansen (Jan 30, 2017)

I have a couple of electronic and a couple of mechanical, use them both.  The mechanical ones have a 0.200" and 0.500" ends.  I tend to use the 0.500" one.

My mill is a Jet JVM-830, uses step pulleys for changing spindle speeds.  I've read someplace that the mechanical edge finders should be used between 500 - 1000 RPM's.  If I'm doing something where the spindle is already set to a speed outside of that range, I an electronic edge finder to avoid having to change spindle speeds. 

My electronic ones are Fowler's, mechanical ones are a Starrett and an Enco.  You can pick up a mechanical one for under $20 off eBay/CDCO/Shars; very handy to have.

Bruce


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## gheumann (Jan 30, 2017)

Gunrunner you need to order a set of these for the Z axis hand crank. Bill did you just spit coffee on your monitor? :rofl:

View attachment 253356


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## Uglydog (Jan 30, 2017)

Not much for any electronic gizmos. No DRO in my shop. No digital mics, etc.
Run a wiggler, 1/2" center finder, and a center scope.
Depends on the accuracy I need/want.
Count my handwheel turns. I'm consistently holding .001.
Reduce error wherever you are able on critical parts. 

Daryl
MN


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## ch2co (Jan 30, 2017)

My used lathe and minimill came with 4 different edge finders along with a laser finder. when I found them in a box of misc stuff, I didn't know what to think of any of them.
Trial and error as well as YouTube "classes" caught me up quickly with what these things were.  I use them in one way or the other on just about anything that I mill.
The laser I use primarily for aligning the centerline of the mill with the position that I want to drill or tap. I find all of them invaluable especially if your mill isn't all that 
accurate at location finding through the hand dials or even a DRO. This is coming from a really newbish kind of guy.


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## darkzero (Jan 30, 2017)

I use a double ended 1/2" edge finder most of the time, .500" on one end & .200" on the other end. I have 2 other mechanical edge finders  in different configurations but I don't use them often. Mine are all PEC. Many people over look PEC Tools. Not as nice as Starrett or Mitutoyo but still great tools at lower prices & made in USA.

I have an import Fowler electronic edge finder, the kind that lights up. I don't like the audible ones cause I can't hear them with fans or AC running. I do use it now & then when I have to indicate something where I don't want to mar the finish or if I'm lazy & want to set something up very quick. That's about all I think they're good for as they're easy to damage. Just have to remember that they don't work on plastics or if I'm holding a part using paper or tape. I'm not a fan of the laser ones though.


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## Ken from ontario (Jan 31, 2017)

Thank you again for all your comments and your help, I read every one of them and learned a few tips and tricks .my edge finder is on its way.it was in fact cheaper than Amazon usa,paid $22 CDN dollar hope is not going to fall apart on first try.


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## Doubleeboy (Jan 31, 2017)

Threw out my Fowler electronic one years ago.  Brown and Sharp edge finder, manual model has me within a few tenths with little effort.


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## Fabrickator (Feb 1, 2017)

I have a double-ended 1/2" edge finder, electronic finder and a wobbler set.  They all have a place in the grand scope of things.  I sort of prefer the laser finder for quick setups to zero the DRO's.


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## cathead (Feb 1, 2017)

Fabrickator said:


> I have a double-ended 1/2" edge finder, electronic finder and a wobbler set.  They all have a place in the grand scope of things.  I sort of prefer the laser finder for quick setups to zero the DRO's.




I made an edge finder a while back with 0.2 diameter on one end and 0.5 on the other end.  The other day I decided
disassemble it and heat treat the ends.  When done, I decided to measure the ends and found them wider in diameter
by .0015 on each end.  It's possible I made them oversized but I don't think so.  Anyway, I thought it worth mentioning.  
I have somewhat of a distrust for the laser units as I would think that if the collet wasn't perfectly true, one would get
that much error in the readings.  I like the manual ones and usually use my DRO to set centers and edges as that has 
been proven to be quite accurate.  Also, I just made a wobbler but havn't had much experience with it so far, an interesting
tool.  Maybe someone in machinist land knows if case hardening causes parts to expand slightly.


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## prasad (Feb 4, 2017)

I use edge/center finder from LMS. I am happy with the edge finder part which works fine. My attempts to use the center finder have not been the best however. I think I achieved accuracy within 2 or 3 thousandths and I want it to be better. Recently I watched a video series by Dan Gelbart, and in #15 he shows a laser edge/center device that he made. As a hobby machinist I thought it is an interesting project for making in my little hobby shop. I am working on it. I have gathered the laser and the electronics. I hope to finish the machining part of it soon.
Link for Dan Gelbart's video is here.

Prasad
Eastern PA


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## Ken from ontario (Feb 4, 2017)

prasad said:


> I use edge/center finder from LMS. I am happy with the edge finder part which works fine. My attempts to use the center finder have not been the best however. I think I achieved accuracy within 2 or 3 thousandths and I want it to be better. Recently I watched a video series by Dan Gelbart, and in #15 he shows a laser edge/center device that he made. As a hobby machinist I thought it is an interesting project for making in my little hobby shop. I am working on it. I have gathered the laser and the electronics. I hope to finish the machining part of it soon.
> Link for Dan Gelbart's video is here.
> 
> Prasad
> Eastern PA


That man (Dan Gelbart) is a wealth of information, I sometimes wish he was my neighbour, I would be pestering him every day.lol.
Let us know how your laser edge finder build goes.


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## Ed ke6bnl (Feb 4, 2017)

slightly off topic, I have an edge finder Sterrett with a pointer cone on one end. I have used this to place in a center punched hole and and then feel around the fit up of the cone to the cylinder and move the table till I no longer feel and miss alignment to the cylinder and cone.  Also have used in while spinning  to hover over a scribe mark to find cross of the scribed marks.  Am I wrong in the way I am using this end of the tool.


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## epj (Feb 4, 2017)

I've tried mechanical edge finders, and just cannot get repeatable results from them. I bought a cheap electronic one, and it isn't much better. Bought a Fowler and get the results I need. I get the two sides and let the DRO calculate the center. As an aside, on my Grizzly mill/drill (G1007), the Y axis dials are very accurate. They match the DRO almost perfectly over a couple of inches of travel. The X axis dial is absolutely useless for trying to measure anything. Without the DRO, I'd be completely screwed.


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## Profkanz (Feb 4, 2017)

Ed ke6bnl said:


> slightly off topic, I have an edge finder Sterrett with a pointer cone on one end. I have used this to place in a center punched hole and and then feel around the fit up of the cone to the cylinder and move the table till I no longer feel and miss alignment to the cylinder and cone.  Also have used in while spinning  to hover over a scribe mark to find cross of the scribed marks.  Am I wrong in the way I am using this end of the tool.


You're doing just fine. You can also stick the point in an existing hole and use like you do with the center punch. But you must be sure that any deburring or countersink is on center with the hole to do this.


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## Profkanz (Feb 4, 2017)

Over decades of teaching machine shop I have found mechanicals to be very useful. When using in a drill chuck the spinning compensates for any runout.
First time I used an electronic I turned on the spindle to use like with a mechanical and ruined the tip since it was not hardened.

I prefer the ones that are assembled with a small wire clip through the tip connected to the spring. These tend to be more forgiving when you forget to raise the quill before moving to the workpiece to a required hole location. They also have more travel of the tip sideways when finding an edge and are repairable in case of an unfortunate event. Those where the tip and spring attachment screw was one piece have less travel and are not repairable.

A recent development by Brown & Sharpe is a small flat ground on the contact tip. This makes an audible ticking sound when the edge is found. Especially useful for 68 year old eyes.

I use 800 to 1000 RPM. The higher speeds seem to make the movement of the tip more fluid. But a speed much above 1000 RPM could make them fly apart.

My students often bought imports with strong springs or less than smooth sliding faces which resulted in stiff movement.


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## Ed ke6bnl (Feb 4, 2017)

Just turned 68 this week and find that same age issue makes hearing the click on the one with the flat grind on the end hard to hear. I have one and find it difficult to hear the clicking, that is just me though.


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## Profkanz (Feb 4, 2017)

Ed ke6bnl said:


> Just turned 68 this week and find that same age issue makes hearing the click on the one with the flat grind on the end hard to hear. I have one and find it difficult to hear the clicking, that is just me though.


Even without the clicking, it's still a very good tool. BTW I find that my right ear has better hearing than my left LOL. (Probably the result of rifle fire early on.)


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## ranch23 (Feb 4, 2017)

What everyone else said, I also have a touch probe on my DRO, very handy.


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## PorkBarrel (Feb 4, 2017)

Super-Jump @ 1500 RPM


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## Ken from ontario (Feb 4, 2017)

I used my mechanical one yesterday and it was dead accurate on square  pcs, Although  I'm having a hard time finding the center  of 2" x 2" x 1"  piece that's tapered on two sides,  how would I use an edge finder on the tapered edges? no matter what I did , I wasn't sure of it's accuracy.


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## 4GSR (Feb 4, 2017)

Uglydog said:


> .................snip..............Count my handwheel turns. I'm consistently holding .001.
> Reduce error wherever you are able on critical parts.
> MN


I remember doing that in my younger years.  Been spoiled to digital readouts since 1980 on my mills.  And I still use my Starrett edge finders to zero in on a edge.  And I still forget to add/subtract for the .100" on setting zero in the readout!


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## todd774 (Feb 4, 2017)

For what it's worth, if your asking what other people do. I go down to the local convenience store & purchase the thinnest  rolling papers they sell.
Then I usually use a pretty accurate .250" dowel rod that I have. About 2" long. I just pinch the rolling paper & zero it in from there (of course I do the
math and adjust accordingly). I do have a wiggler that I use occasionally, but I seem to use the rolling paper trick out of habit. It works good setting zero
on my lathe tools also. I just built a new bench top cnc milling machine & started experimenting with a ground probe that I might have to make an insulated probe
because the work appears to be grounded through the machine to the tool always. I have to do more homework. In the mean time, the the trusty old
rolling paper trick works for me.


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## jmarkwolf (Feb 4, 2017)

I once found a pack of Zig-Zag rolling papers in my dad's Gerstner machinist toolbox when I was a teenager in the 70's, before I knew how machinists use them.

I briefly thought my dad was "rolling his own" and hiding the evidence in his toolbox!

But knowing my dad, there had to be another reason for them, Found out years later. 

I use this method now sometimes when I don't want to chuck up my edge finder.


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## eugene13 (Feb 4, 2017)

My high school Machine Shop teacher, Mr. Traester,


talvare said:


> And, the older you get, the more often you get bit
> 
> Ted


taught me how to use an edge finder and offered this advice, "Set your dial at 100, and remember to move it to 0." I've still messed up and been .1" off.


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