# Chinese  7x12" lathe, tailstock centers 1/8" above head stock center.



## wahooo (Sep 9, 2021)

I know I have to level, check the ways, etc, but I got a new tailstock, same issue. So I gather that I have to mill down the base plate of the tailstock, to include deepening the V groove. I have no mill and the local shop wants a crazy $150to so this.  I can probably get it done in a day  with my height gauge, calipers, surface-block, angle griner, Dremel grinder, layout blue and files,  I"m looking for an electric scraper for the ways and for finishing this base plate. Any other ideas and can I get such a scraper for  sub $100? Source? Thanks, guys.


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## macardoso (Sep 9, 2021)

wahooo said:


> I know I have to level, check the ways, etc, but I got a new tailstock, same issue. So I gather that I have to mill down the base plate of the tailstock, to include deepening the V groove. I have no mill and the local shop wants a crazy $150to so this.  I can probably get it done in a day  with my height gauge, calipers, surface-block, angle griner, Dremel grinder, layout blue and files,  I"m looking for an electric scraper for the ways and for finishing this base plate. Any other ideas and can I get such a scraper for  sub $100? Source? Thanks, guys.


Power scraper will run out $1000-1500+ and require a *lot *of practice to do a good job. Also taking that much off by scraping would be insane. Does the lathe have a warranty? If you want a hand scraper, a Sandvik scraper runs about $85 on MSC with (1) carbide scraper blade. As a reference from a newbie, my first scraping job was leveling a 4" mill vise with 0.005" out of flatness. Took me probably 40 hours of work - for 5 thou!







Honestly if the shop will do a decent job (especially if they'd grind it after milling), $150 is a steal. If the tailstock is split to allow lateral adjustment, it would be a lot easier to take material off of there. I wouldn't touch the V ways on the tailstock bottom unless there was no other way.

But #1, I'd be after the manufacturer to replace a defective component


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## wahooo (Sep 9, 2021)

yeah, but i screwed up and got it bargain basement on E bay.  I ve been on other forums that indicate that even if  you DO pay almost twice as much for the Grizzly, there's still massive issues. I 've got a couple of one-off issues and then I'll sell the lathe. It makes me sick how effed up it is. I had one of their millls and after I set the gibs, it was fine! GD them. Thanks for your reply. I'll have to do it with the grinders, file and layout blue.


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## TomKro (Sep 9, 2021)

Is there enough grip length on the headstock mount bolts to allow you to pad up the headstock? 

Maybe use some old parallel bars?

TomKro


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## macardoso (Sep 9, 2021)

wahooo said:


> yeah, but i screwed up and got it bargain basement on E bay.  I ve been on other forums that indicate that even if  you DO pay almost twice as much for the Grizzly, there's still massive issues. I 've got a couple of one-off issues and then I'll sell the lathe. It makes me sick how effed up it is. I had one of their millls and after I set the gibs, it was fine! GD them. Thanks for your reply. I'll have to do it with the grinders, file and layout blue.


Yeah, you get a mixed bag of issues. The larger machines tend to be better quality, but the problems (where there are problems) are usually more involved to solve. 

Sorry to hear about the lathe. Do share how you get it fixed up.

Also, use hi-spot blue NOT layout blue if you are going to be scraping. Hi-spot transfers between parts, layout does not.


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## WobblyHand (Sep 9, 2021)

Having similar issues on the mini-lathe, (higher tailstock), make sure you measure as many things as possible before altering your tailstock.  I found that the top surface of the bottom casting was strangely machined.  I measured 4 zones of the casting and found 4 different heights.  It's tough to figure out your reference surfaces.  Nothing on my tailstock seemed to be square.  You are trying to align (or keep in alignment) many things.   Vertical alignment, pitch, and yaw of the ram taper.  I'm sure it can be done, although I haven't yet figured it out.  

Before I do anything though, I'm going to completely disassemble my tailstock, clean and inspect it.  No point of going through machining to correct errors, if something simple is awry.


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## wahooo (Sep 9, 2021)

i've had TWO tailstocks, same issue, and one of them is one piece, no removable baseplate.  I"ve been told that shimming up the headstock can cause massive problems, too.


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## WobblyHand (Sep 9, 2021)

A one piece tailstock?  Can't adjust the horizontal offset then.  A mini-lathe tailstock is typically 2 pieces.  The base, and main casting.  The base has the pyramidal section and the flat that rides on the ways.  The base also has a key.  The main casting can adjust horizontally along the keyway.  Typically there is a lock screw underneath.  I modified mine so the locking screw comes in from the top.





Shimming the headstock could work, but is less forgiving than working on the tailstock.  If the headstock is not aligned, your lathe won't work well, you will cut a taper when you don't want to.  Having a misaligned tailstock doesn't change how the lathe cuts UNLESS you are using a dead or live center.  Then the misalignment will cause taper.  You will have a terrible time drilling from the tailstock as well.

What makes it tough is the tailstock isn't really true anywhere.  On the picture on the right, you can see 2 numbers, 31.6 and 23.  That's the height difference in thousandths from the back left corner.  If I recall correctly, the back right corner was 10.  So you need to measure stuff and take some off in the right places.  One good thing is if you go too far, height-wise, you can always shim it back.  The other good thing is the tailstock castings are not hugely expensive if you screw it up.  All I can suggest is to take a little off at a time and reassemble and see what happened and make your next move.


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## addertooth (Sep 10, 2021)

For 86 bucks, I would skip all the irritation, and buy this instead.  In doing so, you upgrade to cam-lock for the tailstock too!
You should confirm your headstock is at the right height, and not aiming downward.  Put a rod in it, and see if the distance between the ways and the rod remains consistent the full length. 









						Tailstock Assembly, Mini Lathe, Cam Lock 2502
					

7x10/12/14 Mini Lathe (C2/C3) Assemblies 2502 This is the tailstock from the HiTorque mini lathe. It has a factory-installed cam lock mechanism. It ho...




					www.littlemachineshop.com


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## markba633csi (Sep 10, 2021)

I would have called my credit card company and gotten my money back- no way you should need to fix stuff like that
Don't buy imported junk without a company behind you (like Grizzly or PM)
-Mark


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## WobblyHand (Sep 10, 2021)

Speaking only for myself, my lathe and tailstock are from LMS.  The tailstock is quite high.  It needs to be lowered.  My horizontal offset is controlled by a differential screw tailstock adjuster that I made and documented.  The horizontal offset has been trimmed practically to zero.  My headstock has been adjusted to pretty low runout in the horizontal direction.  The vertical tilt, while not great, is acceptable.

The OP got their lathe from an entity who may have assembled it from a bin of rejected parts.  If it was me, I'd first try buying the tailstock assembly from LMS.  It's likely to be high, as the factory makes them this way on purpose to accommodate wear.  However, 0.125" high could mean that the tailstock is made totally wrong, or assembled wrong, or the tailstock is riding on top of the locking plate, instead of the ways.


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## WobblyHand (Sep 10, 2021)

markba633csi said:


> I would have called my credit card company and gotten my money back- no way you should need to fix stuff like that
> -Mark


A 1/8" higher tailstock, if real, should cause the OP to try to get their money back.  Not made correctly.


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## WobblyHand (Sep 10, 2021)

markba633csi said:


> I would have called my credit card company and gotten my money back- no way you should need to fix stuff like that
> Don't buy imported junk without a company behind you (like Grizzly or PM)
> -Mark


If you are within the time window, eBay will stand up for you.  But you need to tell them the lathe is not functional and not as described.  Barring that, go direct to your CC company.  The CC companies want happy consumers and can claw back funds if necessary.

@wahooo , First make sure everything is as you think.  Why don't you post a couple of pictures here and let other HM members take a look?  Maybe there is something overlooked, or simple?  We can't tell without a photo or two.  We like pictures here


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## wahooo (Sep 10, 2021)

WobblyHand said:


> A one piece tailstock?  Can't adjust the horizontal offset then.  A mini-lathe tailstock is typically 2 pieces.  The base, and main casting.  The base has the pyramidal section and the flat that rides on the ways.  The base also has a key.  The main casting can adjust horizontally along the keyway.  Typically there is a lock screw underneath.  I modified mine so the locking screw comes in from the top.
> View attachment 377852
> View attachment 377853
> 
> ...


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## wahooo (Sep 10, 2021)

WobblyHand said:


> If you are within the time window, eBay will stand up for you.  But you need to tell them the lathe is not functional and not as described.  Barring that, go direct to your CC company.  The CC companies want happy consumers and can claw back funds if necessary.
> 
> @wahooo , First make sure everything is as you think.  Why don't you post a couple of pictures here and let other HM members take a look?  Maybe there is something overlooked, or simple?  We can't tell without a photo or two.  We like pictures here


I can try that. Thanks everyone.


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## wahooo (Sep 10, 2021)

addertooth said:


> For 86 bucks, I would skip all the irritation, and buy this instead.  In doing so, you upgrade to cam-lock for the tailstock too!
> You should confirm your headstock is at the right height, and not aiming downward.  Put a rod in it, and see if the distance between the ways and the rod remains consistent the full length.
> 
> 
> ...


i did buy that one, and it's high, too. I don't know hth the headstock can be low?


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## wahooo (Sep 10, 2021)

markba633csi said:


> I would have called my credit card company and gotten my money back- no way you should need to fix stuff like that
> Don't buy imported junk without a company behind you (like Grizzly or PM)
> -Mark


it's been over a year. It never occurred to me that the thing could be THIS messed-up. I used a debit card back then.


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## WobblyHand (Sep 10, 2021)

Can you post some pictures?  It helps a lot.  We can't see what you see, unless you post them.


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## wahooo (Sep 10, 2021)

markba633csi said:


> I would have called my credit card company and gotten my money back- no way you should need to fix stuff like that
> Don't buy imported junk without a company behind you (like Grizzly or PM)
> -Mark


according to MANY forum posts and lots of yt vids, the grizzly is all messed up too, so you just waste $300 more on it.


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## WobblyHand (Sep 10, 2021)

wahooo said:


> it's been over a year. It never occurred to me that the thing could be THIS messed-up. I used a debit card back then.


Well, you own it now.  Sorry.  Well, post some pics and we will try to offer some suggestions.


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## wahooo (Sep 10, 2021)

macardoso said:


> Power scraper will run out $1000-1500+ and require a *lot *of practice to do a good job. Also taking that much off by scraping would be insane. Does the lathe have a warranty? If you want a hand scraper, a Sandvik scraper runs about $85 on MSC with (1) carbide scraper blade. As a reference from a newbie, my first scraping job was leveling a 4" mill vise with 0.005" out of flatness. Took me probably 40 hours of work - for 5 thou!
> 
> View attachment 377795
> 
> ...


thanks I guess I'll have to grind it.


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## WobblyHand (Sep 10, 2021)

wahooo said:


> according to MANY forum posts and lots of yt vids, the grizzly is all messed up too, so you just waste $300 more on it.


All of these mini-lathes are a kit...  Some worse than others.  Overall, I still like mine, even with a high tailstock.  I still can make stuff.


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## WobblyHand (Sep 10, 2021)

wahooo said:


> i did buy that one, and it's high, too. I don't know hth the headstock can be low?


How about some basic measurements, so we can help figure this out?  What is the height of the headstock spindle axis over the ways?  What about the tailstock?  Can you take a picture of the tailstock mounted on the lathe?  Can you post a few other pictures of the lathe?  Sorry to sound like a broken record, but, even a single picture can convey a LOT of information.  We can eventually sort you out, but we do need some more info.


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## wahooo (Sep 10, 2021)

WobblyHand said:


> All of these mini-lathes are a kit...  Some worse than others.  Overall, I still like mine, even with a high tailstock.  I still can make stuff.


It looks like I have no choice but to correct a lot of problems. If I go thru all that, i wont be selling it, unless somebody really wants it badly. enough to pay me for all of that tedium.


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## WobblyHand (Sep 10, 2021)

Fix the lathe for yourself to use.  Not to flip!

Made this recently on my mini-lathe.  It's a practice piece, but it taught me a lot.  About 2" high and 1.5" in diameter, made of 1045 steel.  Bored it and single point cut the threads inside the bore and on the cap.  Will make another one, but out of 304 stainless.  Didn't need an accurate tailstock for this piece.  It's far from perfect, but was fun making it.  The o-ring makes it water-tight.


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## homebrewed (Sep 12, 2021)

If you mostly want to drill holes, an alternative would be a toolpost-mounted chuck.  I got a chuck that mounts with a 1/2" threaded hole, and a tool holder for a 1/2" boring bar.  I screwed in a long-enough 1/2" bolt, mounted it in the BB holder and was good to go.

It takes a little time to line up the chuck but  a couple lengths of 1/2" drill rod make it easy.  I faced the end of each one so I can install one in the headstock chuck and the other in the drill chuck.  Run them parallel to each other to align the axes, then face-to-face to align the X and Y.  A QCTP makes it easy to zero-out the vertical offset, but shimming the OEM tool holder works too -- and in fact mine is now dedicated to the drill chuck.

One advantage of a toolpost mounted chuck is when you're enlarging a hole by step drilling, since you can easily move the chuck back to accommodate larger (and longer) drill bits.

That 1/8" vertical offset is terrible!  It would be interesting to see a photo of that tailstock.


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## Ultradog MN (Sep 13, 2021)

No way you are going to hand grind/scrape that much material and have an accurate piece of equipment when you are done.
Pay the $150 and have it done. It will still likely be inaccurate even then but maybe you can use it to make some taper pins.
Threads like this make me realize why  PM forum doesn't allow posts about China made machinery.


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## addertooth (Sep 13, 2021)

If you are going to get it machined, be clever, send your headstock too.  This way they can be matched.  
And to answer an earlier question.  Yes, it could be that the headstock is off it's expected dimensions too.
Remember, there are TWO reference points here... headstock center AND tailstock center.  If either is wrong,
then you do not get alignment.  It is easy to blame the tailstock, but it could be the headstock, especially if 
two tailstocks show the same error.


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## WobblyHand (Sep 13, 2021)

If you haven't done _anything_ like this before, I have to agree with @Ultradog MN on the chances of having an accurate lathe when you are done. 

Pretty easy to screw it up badly.  Hard, but not totally impossible, for a non-expert to make it good.  But, if you have a spare, why not?  Maybe you can learn something.  If you do try it, please share the experience, both your triumphs, or your (hopefully not,) tragedies.  We try to share both triumph and tragedies of a machining sort here, so we can all learn from the experiences of others.

To be successful you will have to measure a lot of stuff, in the correct way, so you can understand what you need to take off and where.  You need to correct the height, and make sure the quill stays coaxial with the spindle, not pitching up or down, nor yawing to the right or left.  Horizontal movement would be adjusted via movement of the tailstock base relative to the main casting.  Good luck with whatever you try.

What @addertooth just said.  If you bring it in, bring the whole thing!  No way can you get it right by just lopping some metal off.  You need the whole lathe.  Since you haven't posted any pictures, we don't even know if the lathe is assembled correctly, or remotely aligned.


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## homebrewed (Sep 14, 2021)

You need to post some photos of your tailstock -- at least a side view and bottom view, and one showing how the base sits on the lathe bed.  You never know, your problem could be due to something that's a much easier fix than removing .125" somewhere (and perhaps requiring less than $150 to fix).


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