# Heavy 10L:  Cutch assembly removal



## Splat (Feb 2, 2013)

Finally getting off my butt to finish restoring my 57 Heavy 10L. I've got the apron and the headstock left....yep, the hardest jobs I saved for last. :nuts:  I had a lot happen in my life over the summer and things just fell by the wayside, like restoring the lathe. Funny how things can seem so important and then something happens and puts it all into proper perspective. 

Aaaaanyway, enough of that. :slapping:    So everything was going good with the apron until I got to the upper rack pinion gear and cannot get the damn drift pin out! I tried whacking both sides and it just laughed at me. I even wedge a piece of wood so the gear wouldn't move. Still it retained its evil mocking grin. :banghead:      So,  I left that and moved onto removing the clutch assembly. I got the star handle/knob off but for the life of me cannot figure how to get the nut that was underneath the star knob off the shaft. I have the rebuild manual and it says to somehow grip the gear but that doesn't make sense because the shaft spins anyway with the nut on it. Guys, any tips you'd care to throw my way I'll appreciatively take. Thanks.


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## woodtickgreg (Feb 3, 2013)

I'm not sure what to advise on the clutch as you have the manual and I'm not really sure what it is not doing to come loose, it has been a long time since I did mine, wasn't one of the nuts on that shaft left hand thread? As far as the stuck taper pin I found that if you make your own punches they work better. take a large short punch and grind the tip down to the size of the taper pin diameter. That way the energy from wacking the punch is transfered to the pin fully without the punch bending and loosing it's energy. Alls you need to do is break the pin loose and then you can finish driving it out with a smaller pin punch. I also used a large ball peen hammer for the mass and wedged the gears with hardwood wedges to hold them. Good luck! And I'm happy to see you working on your lathe again!


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## Splat (Feb 4, 2013)

Greg!  I see in your restore thread things shaping up nicely for you. Good for you, brother! I'll be referring to your thread as I go along. Ain't this place great with all the great helpful guys we got here? :thumbsup:   So, I got some new punches today... I was using a 1/8" and now have a 5/32" that looks like it might fit the gear pin better for me. Hopefully I can get the gear shored up enough to not move around so the full force of the punch/hit will transfer to the pin and out she'll come...hopefully. We'll see. I was looking at the clutch shaft again and still can't see how to get the nut off but we'll see.... right now I've got time to do this so just gonna take it slow...


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## woodtickgreg (Feb 4, 2013)

Splat said:


> Greg!  I see in your restore thread things shaping up nicely for you. Good for you, brother! I'll be referring to your thread as I go along. Ain't this place great with all the great helpful guys we got here? :thumbsup:   So, I got some new punches today... I was using a 1/8" and now have a 5/32" that looks like it might fit the gear pin better for me. Hopefully I can get the gear shored up enough to not move around so the full force of the punch/hit will transfer to the pin and out she'll come...hopefully. We'll see. I was looking at the clutch shaft again and still can't see how to get the nut off but we'll see.... right now I've got time to do this so just gonna take it slow...



Don't be afraid to take a large punch, like 1/4" or so and grind down just the tip to the size of the pin, it works great and it will really transfer the energy when you wack it! All you need to do is break it loose with the big punch and then you can drive it out with a smaller one. And your right, there is a great group of people here sharing their knowledge and giving helpful advice.


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## Splat (Feb 4, 2013)

woodtickgreg said:


> Don't be afraid to take a large punch, like 1/4" or so and grind down just the tip to the size of the pin, it works great and it will really transfer the energy when you wack it! All you need to do is break it loose with the big punch and then you can drive it out with a smaller one. And your right, there is a great group of people here sharing their knowledge and giving helpful advice.



Well, I tried a 3/32 and a 5/32 punch and no luck. The only thing left is to move it to my buddy's garage. He's got a sturdy metal bench and I'm using a wooden bench and it may be giving too much. I tried the clutch again. I still can't figure how to remove the nut on there. I'll get it...probably later than sooner but I'll get it.


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## Bugsyweasel (Feb 4, 2013)

I just took mine apart with the star hand wheel and I know what you are talking about.  First I took all the clutch plates out keeping them in order.  Then I was able to put a big deep socket on it.  I think it was actually a spark plug socket then I was able hold it enough to remove the nut.

I can't say that is correct way or that it didn't marred up the surface cause I still need to remove the internal snap ring to take the rest of e clutch a part.

maybe if you made a tool to hold the part the same as the pattern of the clutch that engages it would be the correct way 

kelly


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## Splat (Feb 5, 2013)

Bugsyweasel said:


> I just took mine apart with the star hand wheel and I know what you are talking about.  First I took all the clutch plates out keeping them in order.  Then I was able to put a big deep socket on it.  I think it was actually a spark plug socket then I was able hold it enough to remove the nut.
> 
> I can't say that is correct way or that it didn't marred up the surface cause I still need to remove the internal snap ring to take the rest of e clutch a part.
> 
> maybe if you made a tool to hold the part the same as the pattern of the clutch that engages it would be the correct way



Now you got me stumped, Kelly! :thinking:  I gotta get my eyes checked if I missed that.  How'd you get the clutch plates out without removing the nut and shaft first?  Thanks.


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## Bugsyweasel (Feb 5, 2013)

You trying to remove the nut under the star hand wheel?  Or the screw in the center of the star hand wheel? 

You need to remove the star hand wheel to take the clutches out and get the nut off from under the star hand wheel.

i can post some pictures if you think it will help.

kelly


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## Splat (Feb 5, 2013)

Bugsyweasel said:


> You trying to remove the nut under the star hand wheel?  Or the screw in the center of the star hand wheel?
> You need to remove the star hand wheel to take the clutches out and get the nut off from under the star hand wheel.
> i can post some pictures if you think it will help.



I got the star handle off. It's the nut that sits between the star handle and the apron housing that I can't figure how to get off. I was looking at it today again and still no luck. I'll take any and all help anyone's kind enough to give, Kelly. Thanks.


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## Bugsyweasel (Feb 6, 2013)

If you got the star hand wheel off the shaft the star was screwed on pushes right out the back.  Maybe yours is stuck in the shaft here some pictures of mine apart.  There is three shafts in the clutch assembly.  The one with the star hand wheel and left hand thread is the very inter one #1   Then the one with the nut your trying to remove is the middle one #2. After remove the nut (like i said earlier how i did it) the whole clutch assembly comes right out.  To remove the middle shaft need to remove the snap ring to remove shaft #2 from shaft #3.  I haven't removed the snap ring yet

hope I'm help you here

kelly


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## Splat (Feb 6, 2013)

OK lemme see if I got you right. After removing the top thumb screw and star knob I should be able to push the whole shaft and assembly out the back of the apron, then I should be able to take the nut off?


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## woodtickgreg (Feb 6, 2013)

No, but you can't get the nut off until you remove the screw and the star knob, after you remove the nut then the shaft will slide out. Do you have the rebuild manual?


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## Splat (Feb 6, 2013)

woodtickgreg said:


> No, but you can't get the nut off until you remove the screw and the star knob, after you remove the nut then the shaft will slide out. Do you have the rebuild manual?



Yeah I got the manual but it's somewhat vague on this part. There's more on the lever type clutch handle than the star. I got the screw and the knob off I can't get the shaft out...and IIRC it's supposed to come out the back...but the nut is still on and I can't figure how to get it off.  Catch 22 here. :thinking:

 BTW I'm still monkeying with that damn pin securing the upper pinion gear on the shaft in the apron. That SOB ain't comming out for nothing. :angry:  Only thing I can guess is the PO put the tapered pin in the wrong way.  So, I gotta decide whether to leave it or keep trying. Maybe tomorrow I'll leave the pinion gear alone and work on getting the clutch out again. Sorry but I'm just ticked about the pinion gear. I haven't had a bugger like this that I couldn't get in a looong time.


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## Splat (Feb 6, 2013)

Went outside and put the blow torch to the gear, got her nice and hot. Now I got the pin about 1/2 out but I gotta get some new punches. I'm crossing my fingers that tomorrow with a smaller punch..3/32 maybe and more heat I'll be able to get the pin finally out.

I was looking at the clutch again. I tried shoring up the inner gear ..don't know what it's called but the gear that moves left/right right above the clutch .. I guess it's for the horizontal feed?... and then put a wrench on the nut but still no go. I'll get there. One of these days.


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## Bugsyweasel (Feb 6, 2013)

Did you engage the power feed lever on the right of the star hand wheel? It should be all the way down i think.  The up position powers the cross feed i think but could be wrong just try down and then up to see which one engages the left hand wheel

I think the gear right above the clutch is actually the power cross feed

Don't know how far you got taking the apron apart but if you haven't removed to many of the gears or just re assembly if needed, you should be able to engage the power feed for left and right on the apron then that engages the shaft you are trying to remove the nut from to the hand wheel on the far left that moves the apron manually left and right.

then you hold the left right hand wheel and use a wrench remove the nut.  Sounds like your stuff is all froze up, is it real rusty?  but maybe a little heat on that nut to.


that nut isn't some weird left hand thread so it loosens up by turn wrench counter clockwise.  

If you can't remove the shaft that the star hand wheel screws onto it is stuck.  Nothing else holds in in place just use penetrating oil on it and press it out.

Last resort grind or cut the nut off and the make or buy a new on.

maybe some pictures would help

Kelly


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## Splat (Feb 7, 2013)

Kelly thank you. I just got back from taking a friend to her Dr's appointment....not sure if we have to go to another one today so I might not get back with results until later or tomorrow. Just wanted to say thanks man. I'll let you know.


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## Splat (Feb 7, 2013)

Finally got the tapered pin out from the upper pinion gear! :rocker:  Only thing is I think I bent the shaft ever-so-slightly in the middle from all the hammering trying to get the darn pin out.  I started working on the clutch again but just got called in for the phone so taking a break until tomorrow. Today was hectic all day. NYC and me do not get along. Time to kick back with some BBQ'ed chicken, green beans with almonds, smashed potatoes and :drink2:  See you guys later.


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## Bugsyweasel (Feb 8, 2013)

If you did bend the shaft I bought a apron off eBay I haven't received yet, it has that shaft in it. Don't know condition but going to use the least of the wore parts for mine but worn parts is easy to fix , a bend is another story.  We could make a deal. Probally

kelly


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## Splat (Feb 8, 2013)

Kelly lemme get back to you on that and I thank you for the offer. :tiphat:


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## Splat (Feb 13, 2013)

Finally got the clutch out. Whew! I had to reinstall the upper pinion gear whose shaft I slightly bent (moves carriage left/right) and jammed a piece of wood shimstock beside it so it wouldn't move. Switching the power feed lever all the way up to engage that shimmed gear gave me the hold on the clutch I needed to finally remove the darn nut. The clutch looks in pretty good shape from what I can tell. I can't get over how much swarf and grease or oil gets into everything. Well, that's my happy update. Now back to your regularly scheduled program.


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## woodtickgreg (Feb 14, 2013)

Splat said:


> Finally got the clutch out. Whew! I had to reinstall the upper pinion gear whose shaft I slightly bent (moves carriage left/right) and jammed a piece of wood shimstock beside it so it wouldn't move. Switching the power feed lever all the way up to engage that shimmed gear gave me the hold on the clutch I needed to finally remove the darn nut. The clutch looks in pretty good shape from what I can tell. I can't get over how much swarf and grease or oil gets into everything. Well, that's my happy update. Now back to your regularly scheduled program.



Glad to hear you finally got it! Now forward progress can resume. It's all part of the process of restoring one of these old machines, finding problems and persevering and fixing them. It's very rewarding in the end. Patience is definitely key when working on something that hasn't been apart for 50 or more years.


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## Splat (Feb 14, 2013)

woodtickgreg said:


> Glad to hear you finally got it! Now forward progress can resume. It's all part of the process of restoring one of these old machines, finding problems and persevering and fixing them. It's very rewarding in the end.



Yes, I agree. It is rewarding. Plus I'm the kinda guy that likes to do things myself. There's a satisfaction there, and I know you know what I'm talking about with how your lathe came out. :thumbsup:



woodtickgreg said:


> Patience is definitely key when working on something that hasn't been apart for 50 or more years.



I'm definitely learning that, Greg!


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## Bugsyweasel (Feb 14, 2013)

Glad to hear you finally got the apron all apart.  I got that apron from e-bay but haven't had a chance to see if that taper pin you had trouble with is going to give me problems too.  Mine came out real easy.  I will let you know in pm when I get it apart.

kelly


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## Splat (Feb 14, 2013)

Bugsyweasel said:


> Glad to hear you finally got the apron all apart.  I got that apron from e-bay but haven't had a chance to see if that taper pin you had trouble with is going to give me problems too.  Mine came out real easy.  I will let you know in pm when I get it apart.



I think my problem resulted from the PO putting the pin in wrong.... I can't imagine the factory doing that but you never know. Hopefully you'll be ok.


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## Bugsyweasel (Feb 14, 2013)

I got the extra apron apart and I sent a PM to you about the shaft 

kelly


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