# Packing up the Shop



## TomS (Feb 12, 2018)

The time has finally arrived so I'm packing up the shop, and the house, and moving to Sparks, Nevada.  It's amazing how much "stuff" you can accumulate when you have a place to put it.  I have several pieces of machinery that I didn't have when I moved in 5 years ago as well as tooling that goes with these machines.  The movers are showing up in three weeks so I've got to get going with packing.

Looks like I'll be out of the machining business for a few months so the wife and I can get the house together.  Lot's to do there with hanging stuff on the walls and arranging furniture to her liking.  My new shop space will be smaller so machinery placement will be important to maximize usable space.  Still, it should be ample room.  On a positive note the down time will give me time to think up new projects.

Wish me luck.  I'll need it.


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## brino (Feb 12, 2018)

Best of luck Tom!

It will also give you a chance to handle and sort everything. You might just find some tools that you misplaced years ago!

-brino


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## mikey (Feb 12, 2018)

Jeez, Tom, I cannot even contemplate trying to move my shop so I feel for you. Best of luck in Nevada!


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## Fabrickator (Feb 12, 2018)

brino said:


> Best of luck Tom!
> 
> It will also give you a chance to handle and sort everything. You might just find some tools that you misplaced years ago!
> 
> -brino



This came at a good time.  We are retiring in June and moving to No. Cal as soon as we can find a suitable property (acreage and large shop). I'm dreading having to pack up my garage after being here 20 years.  I have all of the tools and equipment to make anything in wood (including a 6ft cast iron wood lathe) welding/fab work and of course machining (mill/lathe), standing band saw & drill press and hand/power tools/airbrushing.

I was looking around the garage on Saturday and estimated I need about 30 apple boxes just for the smalls.  The power equipment needs a truck/trailer.  I'm planning on hiring a mover because it's just too much for me to handle @ 65YO with a bad back.  I'm thinking about making crates for my mini mill and metal lathe.  My iron wood lathe I don't know.  I'd hate to break one of the legs off it.  Last time I moved it 20 years ago, we only moved about a mile away. The movers got it in a large box truck with a lift gate and just tied it all down really well. Then they packed the rest of the house around it so nothing cold move.  They got it all there in one load w/o breaking anything!

I hired Cailfornia Machinery Movers to get my lathe in the garage and on the workbench.  They brought over a mini forklift that fit under the roll-up garage door by an inch.

If anyone has a suggestion for a good, long distance house moving company, I'd appreciate the referral.

Tom - you may want to give them a call if you need professional mover for you equipment.  I'm sure they would cover western Nevada.

Brino_- I'm absolutely sure I'll find some lost treasures.  I saw a few things the other day I forgot I have. I still have some tools & equipment I've had for 50 years now.

Rick


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## Fabrickator (Feb 12, 2018)

Tom- I just noticed that you live in Redding, and are moving to Sparks.  Any particular reason (if you don't mind).  We're planning on moving to Corning, south of Red Bluff because we have family there.


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## mmcmdl (Feb 12, 2018)

Omg Tom , I wouldn't want to even think about packing my mess !


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## Grumpy Gator (Feb 12, 2018)

_Best of luck to you guys.
All I can say is better you than me.
On the plus side, you will find things you forgot you had.
On the minus side, you will ask yourself why did I save that.
And just remember whatever you get rid of you will need it when you get to your new home.
Personally, I would rather take a butt whipping than move. I've been here for 35 years. 
When I die I want to be buried in the backyard. Dig a large hole dump in my ashes and push all my junk on top.
Who say's you cant take it with you.
**G**_


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## MikeInOr (Feb 12, 2018)

TomS said:


> Looks like I'll be out of the machining business for a few months so the wife and I can get the house together.  Lot's to do there with hanging stuff on the walls and arranging furniture to her liking.



Nuts!  You aren't going to pay full retail on a nail when you could easily turn one out of scrap for nothing if your lathe was running... are you?  

What ever the movers "estimate" they are going to charge you... double it!  There is a standard rate that comes down to basically Weight x Miles.  So all movers pretty much charge the same.  The standard scam is to estimate the weight way low.. then they take the truck to the scale after it is loaded and the weight is double the estimate so your cost is double the estimate.  At Least this is the way it was when I last moved.  I had done some reading on the moving business so I was prepared for the scam when I last moved.

Good luck!  Patients... patients... patients!


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## MikeInOr (Feb 12, 2018)

grumpygator said:


> _When I die I want to be buried in the backyard. Dig a large hole dump in my ashes and push all my junk on top.
> Who say's you cant take it with you.
> **G**_



I don't have a choice in the matter... my daughter has already told me that this is exactly what she is going to do when I die... with the exception she is going to leave my butt sticking up about a foot out of the ground so she has a place to park her bike!


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## mattthemuppet2 (Feb 12, 2018)

good luck Tom, moving is no fun but it'll be worth it once you settle in. I've moved my shop twice in 3 years, good way to cut down on the crap, that's for sure. I'm happy not to be moving again, fingers crossed, for many years!


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## dlane (Feb 12, 2018)

Redding Gets hot in the summer, but I guess sparks dose also,
When I moved weight did not matter that and lower price is why I used allied, but I was staying in this state .
They also let me screw 2x4s into the floor of the lift gate trailer to keep things from shifting.
Movings no fun. Let me know if I can help I’m down the road a bit.


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## TomS (Feb 12, 2018)

Thanks everyone for your advice and support.  This is my second move in 5 years.  This move is more of a PITA because I'm moving out of state.  Vehicle registration is more difficult and auto and home insurance requires a stack of documentation.  And I don't want to get into trying to sell a house in California and building another 200 miles away.  My wife is in tears almost everyday dealing with everyone that wants your time, money and first born.  When it's over it will be worth it but at the moment we're not having fun.

Thursday we have a follow up meeting with the moving company.  At the first meeting the comment from the estimator was, "Wow!  You got a lot of stuff".  Not very comforting.  This time the owner is coming out.    I'll fill you in on our progress and let you know how the move goes.


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## TomS (Feb 13, 2018)

Fabrickator said:


> Tom- I just noticed that you live in Redding, and are moving to Sparks.  Any particular reason (if you don't mind).  We're planning on moving to Corning, south of Red Bluff because we have family there.



You want to buy a house?  2600 Sq. Ft, 2000 Sq Ft shop, on 3 acres.  I'm kidding but it is a nice area.

Corning is about 45 minutes south of us.  Nice area too.  We've been to Rolling Hills Casino many times.

Our original intent was to move to the Reno area five years ago but instead we decided to move to Redding to watch our two oldest granddaughters play their junior high and high school sports.  The oldest of the two is now away at college and the youngest is a senior in HS.  The time we spent with them is irreplaceable.  Mission accomplished!  Now it's our time to go where we've wanted to go for quite some time.


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## TomS (Feb 13, 2018)

dlane said:


> Redding Gets hot in the summer, but I guess sparks dose also,
> When I moved weight did not matter that and lower price is why I used allied, but I was staying in this state .
> They also let me screw 2x4s into the floor of the lift gate trailer to keep things from shifting.
> Movings no fun. Let me know if I can help I’m down the road a bit.



Yeah, Redding does get hot in the summer.  Last year we had 73 straight days of 100 degrees plus.  At times we were hotter that Phoenix.  Go figure.  A hot day in Sparks is high 90's and it cools off at night.

Thanks for your offer to help.  I'll know after Thursdays meeting with the mover what I need to move.


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## TomS (Feb 13, 2018)

Fabrickator said:


> This came at a good time.  We are retiring in June and moving to No. Cal as soon as we can find a suitable property (acreage and large shop). I'm dreading having to pack up my garage after being here 20 years.  I have all of the tools and equipment to make anything in wood (including a 6ft cast iron wood lathe) welding/fab work and of course machining (mill/lathe), standing band saw & drill press and hand/power tools/airbrushing.
> 
> I was looking around the garage on Saturday and estimated I need about 30 apple boxes just for the smalls.  The power equipment needs a truck/trailer.  I'm planning on hiring a mover because it's just too much for me to handle @ 65YO with a bad back.  I'm thinking about making crates for my mini mill and metal lathe.  My iron wood lathe I don't know.  I'd hate to break one of the legs off it.  Last time I moved it 20 years ago, we only moved about a mile away. The movers got it in a large box truck with a lift gate and just tied it all down really well. Then they packed the rest of the house around it so nothing cold move.  They got it all there in one load w/o breaking anything!
> 
> ...



When I moved 5 years ago the moving company brought machinery dollies to move my mill drill and 12x36 lathe.  These are in essence small fork lifts.  They use wood blocking to protect the machinery and strap a machinery dolly to it on each end.  The hydraulics are pumped up and the equipment is lifted a few inches off the floor.  A couple of people can then easily wheel it into the moving van.  Same dollies will be used for this move.


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## Cadillac STS (Feb 13, 2018)

MikeInOr said:


> Nuts!  You aren't going to pay full retail on a nail when you could easily turn one out of scrap for nothing if your lathe was running... are you?
> 
> What ever the movers "estimate" they are going to charge you... double it!  There is a standard rate that comes down to basically Weight x Miles.  So all movers pretty much charge the same.  The standard scam is to estimate the weight way low.. then they take the truck to the scale after it is loaded and the weight is double the estimate so your cost is double the estimate.  At Least this is the way it was when I last moved.  I had done some reading on the moving business so I was prepared for the scam when I last moved.
> 
> Good luck!  Patients... patients... patients!



We got burned with the weight estimate last time we moved.  They said they estimated the weight but the machinery was much heavier than they thought.  We ended up having to pay another $1500 or so on top of the move before they would unload the stuff.  Get a firm commitment on the cost and mention it is machinery and not furniture, heavier than they might think for the space it takes up in the trailer.


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## mattthemuppet2 (Feb 13, 2018)

we've used  one mover who charged by weight and one by space. First one cost ~$6500 to move from PA to WA, second one cost ~$3000 to move from WA to TX with alot more stuff. The second one was neat - they dropped off the trailer and you had 3 days to fill it, then they boarded up your stuff, took a note of the linear feet used and then filled the rest with whatever needed going in that direction. With some creative packing (it was like a 3D tetris puzzle) I managed to get all of our stuff, including all my tools into 3ft less linear feet than quoted, so we saved a few 100 bucks. Took a day or two longer than we took to drive down with our cats.

Tom, I hear you on the stress. It sucks big time and the lead up to the move is the worst. Once you're in the process it will feel better and once you arrive it'll feel great. I'm sure you know this already, but it never hurts to hear it again


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## stioc (Feb 13, 2018)

Good luck with the move! Moving and the planning that goes into it is an adventure that can be fun and challenging both. I keep thinking if/when I retire and move to another state I'd likely get a flat-bed trailer and move the Mill/Lathe and the car lift on it myself. The rest of the stuff (tool chests etc) will just go in the Penske/Uhaul along with the other household stuff. Granted my machinery is probably not nearly as heavy as your's.


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## Firestopper (Feb 13, 2018)

God speed Tom and best of luck in NV.


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## Uglydog (Feb 13, 2018)

Shiny side up!!

Daryl
MN


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## TomS (Feb 14, 2018)

Thanks guys.


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## jbolt (Feb 21, 2018)

Good luck Tom and congrats on the new house. I'm a couple of years away from pulling the plug on the bay area but probably going north.

Safe journey and may all your stuff arrive in one piece.


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## TomS (Feb 21, 2018)

jbolt said:


> Good luck Tom and congrats on the new house. I'm a couple of years away from pulling the plug on the bay area but probably going north.
> 
> Safe journey and may all your stuff arrive in one piece.



Thanks Jay.  It's funny that just last month I was looking for projects.  Now that my machines are out of service I've got four waiting and a couple more in the works.


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## Cadillac STS (Feb 21, 2018)

Did you have any thoughts of selling some of the big things and buying new machines when you got there?


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## TomS (Feb 21, 2018)

Cadillac STS said:


> Did you have any thoughts of selling some of the big things and buying new machines when you got there?



Yes I did.  Then reality set in.  Spent too much on the house so no money left for machinery.


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## tq60 (Feb 21, 2018)

Look ad pods or shipping container. 

They drop off a container ON THE GROUND then you get your machines in first and place well then pack everything arround them as ballast.

The containers have unloaded weight on them but they can cheat you as it is on a truck and who knows how weighed.

So first insist that the weight of container is posted on container.

Also know where the nearest scale is and there are CAT scales all over as well as other ones.

Ask to meet the truck with container at the scale and pay for a weight measurement.

After they drop it off follow back to weigh again.

Repeat after loading.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337Z using Tapatalk


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## Cadillac STS (Feb 21, 2018)

TomS said:


> Yes I did.  Then reality set in.  Spent too much on the house so no money left for machinery.



Yea, and the thought it takes years to get what you have and could risk not finding similar machines to replace.


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## TomS (Feb 22, 2018)

tq60 said:


> Look ad pods or shipping container.
> 
> They drop off a container ON THE GROUND then you get your machines in first and place well then pack everything arround them as ballast.
> 
> ...



Thanks for the tip but I have no desire or energy to load and unload our belongings.  I'm too old for that.


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## tq60 (Feb 22, 2018)

TomS said:


> tq60 said:
> 
> 
> > Look ad pods or shipping container.
> ...


If you have "heavy steel" you may be better off with the container then hire a rigger to load and secure the machines.

Here local we have an interesting company called meat head movers that are college students so there could be something local that could do same.

Moving companies move furniture and general property but terrible at shop stuff. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337Z using Tapatalk


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## wrmiller (Feb 28, 2018)

You're giving me nightmares TomS.

I went through a unplanned, forced move about a year and a half ago. I was minus my shop for about 6 months.

I hope your move goes better!


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## TomS (Feb 28, 2018)

wrmiller said:


> You're giving me nightmares TomS.
> 
> I went through a unplanned, forced move about a year and a half ago. I was minus my shop for about 6 months.
> 
> I hope your move goes better!



Unlike you our move is planned but as we get closer to the move our anxiety level is increasing.  We signed the contract with the mover yesterday and now working on insurance.  I'm not surprised but there is a minimum $ amount of coverage based on the total weight and priced accordingly.  It's not cheap!  

I'm planning that my shop will be down for several months too.  My machines have been shut down for two weeks already.  It's driving me crazy not being able to use them.


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## jbolt (Mar 6, 2018)

TomS said:


> Thanks Jay.  It's funny that just last month I was looking for projects.  Now that my machines are out of service I've got four waiting and a couple more in the works.


Its like going on vacation from work, Nothing abnormal going on until the Friday your about to leave and then everyone needs something.


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## Aaron_W (Mar 7, 2018)

Good luck with the move.  

I got married in 1999, because of my work we moved 5 times between then and 2012. 4 out of 5 were significant distances. My wife and I decided the last move was our last move. If we move again it will be due to California falling into the sea and we are going down with the house.  

I hate moving, we are still unpacking from the move in 2012.


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## TomS (Mar 8, 2018)

Aaron_W said:


> Good luck with the move.
> 
> I got married in 1999, because of my work we moved 5 times between then and 2012. 4 out of 5 were significant distances. My wife and I decided the last move was our last move. If we move again it will be due to California falling into the sea and we are going down with the house.
> 
> I hate moving, we are still unpacking from the move in 2012.



I'm feeling your pain.  We've got boxes stacked everywhere in the house and shop and trying to keep it presentable for potential buyers.  This past weekend our builder told us that our new house completion has been moved back two weeks.  This is not fun.


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## TomS (Mar 11, 2018)

Originally our move date was March 1 so we packed up the house and shop about three weeks ago.  Shortly after getting everything ready for the movers our contractor moved the house completion date to March 23.  Great!  We've been living out of boxes for three weeks now and yesterday our move date got bumped again to April 13.  My shop has been out of service for a month now and I have another month to wait.  My patience is running thin.


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## wrmiller (Mar 11, 2018)

Murphy strikes again...


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## Cadillac STS (Mar 12, 2018)

We had something like that some years ago, tools in storage not available.  A couple times I needed to buy a tool I knew I had in storage but needed to do something..


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## TomS (Mar 24, 2018)

Will it ever end?  The builder calls me on Friday afternoon saying we have to pay another $4,000 for kitchen cabinet materials they didn't order and that the completion date would be extended if I didn't approve this amount immediately.  This is after we paid for "all options and upgrades" as specified in our contract.  Evidently their subcontractor didn't give them a complete materials list.

After ripping his head off he agreed to $2,500 (his cost).  Wow!! Now I feel better.  Not!!  He loses no money and I have to cough up $2,500.  That's what I get for his supplier screwing up.  Oh, and because of this my loan lock will expire I have to pay $1,200 to extend it and the $1,000 discount I negotiated with the moving company goes away.

Meeting with the builder on Monday.  It won't be pretty.

Thanks for letting me rant.


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## Bob Korves (Mar 24, 2018)

TomS said:


> Will it ever end?  The builder calls me on Friday afternoon saying we have to pay another $4,000 for kitchen cabinet materials they didn't order and that the completion date would be extended if I didn't approve this amount immediately.  This is after we paid for "all options and upgrades" as specified in our contract.  Evidently their subcontractor didn't give them a complete materials list.
> 
> After ripping his head off he agreed to $2,500 (his cost).  Wow!! Now I feel better.  Not!!  He loses no money and I have to cough up $2,500.  That's what I get for his supplier screwing up.  Oh, and because of this my loan lock will expire I have to pay $1,200 to extend it and the $1,000 discount I negotiated with the moving company goes away.
> 
> ...


Extortion.  You could help him find out the meaning of the word "contract."


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## Cadillac STS (Mar 24, 2018)

Usually the building contract on the end side is not considered going in.  You trust what the builder says and should but so many times things get late and there is nothing to do but wait, pay more as needed and wait more..

Seems like it would be better to have penalties for not completing on time like many municipal contracts are for roads, etc..

I know a family that was promised to get in the new condo before Thanksgiving and just got another 2 week delay after many delays.


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## TomS (Mar 24, 2018)

Bob Korves said:


> Extortion.  You could help him find out the meaning of the word "contract."



I did contract negotiation for the last 16 years of my career.  If it wasn't spelled out in the scope of supply then it wasn't included.  I have a contract that says I paid for all upgrades and options but that doesn't seem to matter the them.


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## TomS (Mar 24, 2018)

Cadillac STS said:


> Usually the building contract on the end side is not considered going in.  You trust what the builder says and should but so many times things get late and there is nothing to do but wait, pay more as needed and wait more..
> 
> Seems like it would be better to have penalties for not completing on time like many municipal contracts are for roads, etc..
> 
> I know a family that was promised to get in the new condo before Thanksgiving and just got another 2 week delay after many delays.



Like I said in my response to Bob I did contracts for a while.  I wanted to put an end date in the building contract but they didn't want anything to do with that sort of language.  I've considered talking with an attorney but after thinking it through there's not a lot to gain.  Probably will cost more than what's on the table now.  It's more of a "principle" thing with me at this point.

Off to my son's 40th birthday party and play with the grandkids.  Today will be a good day.


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## jbolt (Mar 28, 2018)

Sorry to hear about your troubles Tom. Having been in construction for 32 years and a general contractor for the last 26 years I have been on both sides of the table.

I have had subcontractors do the same thing and it is always a difficult situation. On one hand you have negotiated a fixed price with the client and on the other had the mistake not occurred the cost would have been included. If it was a small amount I would work it out between myself and the subcontractor and not involve the client. If not then I would negotiate with the sub and client to come to a compromise. In those cases nobody wins with the subcontractor loosing most if not all of their profit, my profit is reduced due to the subs fault and the client is less than happy.

As for deadlines that's a tough one. Sometimes you're a hero sometimes a zero. We loose sight of the fact that homes are built by hand by people of all different backgrounds, skills, and ethics. Construction has a lot of moving parts with people, suppliers, manufacturers and good old mother nature which can be difficult for even the best of construction professionals to keep a handle on. I refer to it as adult day care.

I'm not trying to take the side of the contractor since I know nothing about them, only trying to point out it is a complex process and some people do it better than others. I now do construction consulting for construction defect litigation and I have seen the worst of the worst. In the past I have taken over several problem projects that were behind schedule and over budget and most of the time it was due to poor communication and/or business skills of the contractor. Unfortunately it is too easy to become a contractor. Other times the client was just batsh*t crazy. Nothing like walking into a situation where everyone is p*ssed off.

Unfortunately right now the contractor has the advantage knowing you need this to be done as soon as possible. Hopefully you have a retention at the end of the job you can use as leverage to negotiate the final payment since it will be a portion of the contractors profit and the ball will be in your court. When things start going south I keep a log of all the conversations, promises, dates etc. that they occurred That can help at the end when memories get cloudy.

Hopefully your new home will be done soon and this will all be a distant memory.


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## Cadillac STS (Mar 28, 2018)

Would just be nice to have a clause that the contractor would pay $100 per day not completed on agreed upon day.  That would pay for a hotel room or extended storage unit costs, etc..


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## TomS (Mar 28, 2018)

jbolt said:


> Sorry to hear about your troubles Tom. Having been in construction for 32 years and a general contractor for the last 26 years I have been on both sides of the table.
> 
> I have had subcontractors do the same thing and it is always a difficult situation. On one hand you have negotiated a fixed price with the client and on the other had the mistake not occurred the cost would have been included. If it was a small amount I would work it out between myself and the subcontractor and not involve the client. If not then I would negotiate with the sub and client to come to a compromise. In those cases nobody wins with the subcontractor loosing most if not all of their profit, my profit is reduced due to the subs fault and the client is less than happy.
> 
> ...



Thanks for your comments.  The field superintendent is a poor communicator and when he does communicate he does it without thinking it through.  In other words he opens mouth, inserts foot, then tries to explain his way out of a bad situation.  He's passionate about construction (he does build a quality house) but his people skills are weak.

All this being said our meeting went well.  We had the field superintendent, the sales/real estate agent, and two other principles there (all four are partners in the development).  After dragging out a tentative completion date from the superintendent and defining the final scope the other partners drug us away and said it will get worked out.  We'll see.


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## TomS (Mar 28, 2018)

Cadillac STS said:


> Would just be nice to have a clause that the contractor would pay $100 per day not completed on agreed upon day.  That would pay for a hotel room or extended storage unit costs, etc..



That would be good but it's not something they would consider.  I've asked.


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## jbolt (Mar 28, 2018)

TomS said:


> Thanks for your comments.  The field superintendent is a poor communicator and when he does communicate he does it without thinking it through.  In other words he opens mouth, inserts foot, then tries to explain his way out of a bad situation.  He's passionate about construction (he does build a quality house) but his people skills are weak.
> 
> All this being said our meeting went well.  We had the field superintendent, the sales/real estate agent, and two other principles there (all four are partners in the development).  After dragging out a tentative completion date from the superintendent and defining the final scope the other partners drug us away and said it will get worked out.  We'll see.



Glad to hear the meeting went well or at least as well as it could. It sounds like you are working with a small development company so they may have a little more wiggle room on the bottom line than a sole proprietor contractor.

Construction, especially residential, is a funny game where people with good construction skills get promoted to management positions with no management training and are left in the wind to figure it out on their own or hang themselves.


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## jbolt (Mar 28, 2018)

TomS said:


> That would be good but it's not something they would consider.  I've asked.



The reality is, in residential construction, a performance clause usually has little value. They are hard to enforce and if present in a contract the builder will add time to the back end of the original schedule as a buffer. This just extends the duration of the project, i.e. Parkinson's Law. "Work expands to fill the time available for its completion." A savvy builder will insist it goes both ways with cash incentives for finishing early and a clear definition of what constitutes a delay.


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## TomS (Mar 28, 2018)

jbolt said:


> Glad to hear the meeting went well or at least as well as it could. It sounds like you are working with a small development company so they may have a little more wiggle room on the bottom line than a sole proprietor contractor.
> 
> Construction, especially residential, is a funny game where people with good construction skills get promoted to management positions with no management training and are left in the wind to figure it out on their own or hang themselves.



Yes, the meeting went well but the outcome not so good.  They are insisting we pay $2,000 for their oversight.  Seems they have an open check book by claiming that they didn't charge us enough for the agreed upon work scope.  So I buy a car.  I go down to the dealer to pick it up and there are no wheels and tires on it.  I ask what gives with no tires and wheels.  The response is, "Oh, you wanted wheels and tires?  Those are extra".  That's where I'm at with these so-called building contractors.


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## TomS (Mar 28, 2018)

jbolt said:


> The reality is, in residential construction, a performance clause usually has little value. They are hard to enforce and if present in a contract the builder will add time to the back end of the original schedule as a buffer. This just extends the duration of the project, i.e. Parkinson's Law. "Work expands to fill the time available for its completion." A savvy builder will insist it goes both ways with cash incentives for finishing early and a clear definition of what constitutes a delay.



And to add to what Jay said all good contracts will have a force majeure (spelling?) clause which means weather delays, material deliveries, strikes, military actions, acts of god, and many other exclusions means missing a completion date is difficult to enforce.


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## Cheeseking (Mar 28, 2018)

Having built a custom home and dealing with a GC, his contractors and some of our own Subs, Jbolt has the proper perspective. 
Know the game going in and even then its exciting


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## jbolt (Mar 30, 2018)

I think Tom needs a little distraction.






















We're here for ya buddy!


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## TomS (Mar 31, 2018)

jbolt said:


> I think Tom needs a little distraction.
> 
> View attachment 263741
> 
> ...



Thanks.  I needed that.  The wife and I decided we needed to get away for a few days so we hooked up the RV and are spending a few days on the road.  Back home tomorrow but rested.


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## DougD (Mar 31, 2018)

Believe it or not it will work out (just remembered the look I used to give when I was told that!). But you know it will, and you have all of us pulling for you!  Good luck.  
doug


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## TomS (Apr 1, 2018)

DougD said:


> Believe it or not it will work out (just remembered the look I used to give when I was told that!). But you know it will, and you have all of us pulling for you!  Good luck.
> doug



Thanks.  I appreciate the support.


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## westerner (Apr 4, 2018)

John Smith said:


> Best of luck to you guys.
> All I can say is better you than me.
> On the plus side, you will find things you forgot you had.
> On the minus side, you will ask yourself why did I save that.
> ...


I read this, and thought "That is exactly how it would and should go for me".  Then I read Mike in Oregon's post! After I get the screen clean enough to read again, all I can say is "Best Wishes, and Deepest Sympathy". I'll bet Mike's daughter knows mine!


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## TomS (Apr 5, 2018)

An update.  The builder finally realized he was responsible and agreed to settle the dispute for $500 and the mortgage company is splitting the loan lock extension cost with us.  That is behind us now.  Made the trip to check on progress (400 miles round trip) and was pleasantly surprised to see lots of activity.  Evidently the butt chewing we gave him worked because the island was being worked on, the electrician was installing fixtures, plugs and switches, gutters were being installed, tile setters were doing their thing and landscapers were there too.  Looks like we will close escrow late next week and moving the following week.

It cost us some money to get things moving but it was worth it.


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## jbolt (Apr 21, 2018)

Hey Tom,

I hope they got er done and the move is underway.

Earlier this week we put an offer on a place in Oregon. Beautiful piece of property. The seller countered our offer and tried to slip in an amended disclosure. Turns out the small guest house and the NEW septic system were never permitted. Had we known we never would have made the offer. My agent was livid since he had specifically asked them about it. Even worse was the listing agent didn't give us a heads up. Not cool. People suck sometimes.

It's too bad being such a nice property but no way was I willing to take the risk or expense of getting it permitted IF even possible not to mention the potential for fines. I have dealt with enough septic systems for clients over the years to know they are not to be taken lightly with the local authority. I'm tempted to rat them out to the county.


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## TomS (Apr 21, 2018)

So you are moving to Oregon.  Good for you.  Where about in Oregon?  I have a couple of friends that live there.  One in Central Point and the other in Jacksonville.  Too bad this property didn't work out for you but another will come along.  Yeah, people do suck at times.  Ask me how I know that.

Yes the move is underway.  As a matter of fact I'm sitting in my new house writing this post.  The only furniture we have are folding chairs out of our RV and an air bed.  Not complaining though.  We packed up the house last Sunday and waiting for our belongings to show up on Wednesday.  We had snow in the mountains last Sunday and Monday so the moving trucks couldn't make it.  Prior scheduling commitments delayed them until this coming Wednesday. 

While some people try to take advantage there are still those out there that are good people.  I was telling the owner of the moving company that once he got our household belongings moved I was going to have to make another trip to get one of our classic cars.  He offered up his covered car hauler, truck and a driver at no additional cost.  Saved me 10 hours of driving, an overnight stay and $100 in fuel.  Nice guy!!

Once I start setting up shop I'll post some pictures.

Good luck with house hunting.


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## Z2V (Apr 21, 2018)

Glad to hear you are in your new house. Looking forward to some pics


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## jbolt (Apr 21, 2018)

TomS said:


> So you are moving to Oregon.  Good for you.  Where about in Oregon?  I have a couple of friends that live there.  One in Central Point and the other in Jacksonville.  Too bad this property didn't work out for you but another will come along.  Yeah, people do suck at times.  Ask me how I know that.
> 
> Yes the move is underway.  As a matter of fact I'm sitting in my new house writing this post.  The only furniture we have are folding chairs out of our RV and an air bed.  Not complaining though.  We packed up the house last Sunday and waiting for our belongings to show up on Wednesday.  We had snow in the mountains last Sunday and Monday so the moving trucks couldn't make it.  Prior scheduling commitments delayed them until this coming Wednesday.
> 
> ...



Excellent! Glad to hear you got your house done. Hopefully life will be back to normal soon.

I have been wearing down my wife for several years to move out of California. A month a go a house next to her cousin in Merlin OR, (Grants Pass area) came up for sale and my wife suggested we take a look at it. No hesitation on my part. Unfortunately my schedule didn't allow us to see it in time before the owners accepted an offer but we already had plans to visit with her cousin so we went anyway. My wife's cousin is one of the last remaining members of her family which we are close to and she likes the idea of being nearer to them. We spent several days driving around the area and talking with the locals. The area is a good fit for us. The only negative is with the legalization of pot in Oregon there are a lot of small pot growers around which comes with some less than savory people. Nothing compared to the Bay Area though.

Our current plan is to purchase the property and rent it for a few years until our kids are done with college then move. We will keep our home in California as a rental.


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## TomS (Apr 21, 2018)

jbolt said:


> Excellent! Glad to hear you got your house done. Hopefully life will be back to normal soon.
> 
> I have been wearing down my wife for several years to move out of California. A month a go a house next to her cousin in Merlin OR, (Grants Pass area) came up for sale and my wife suggested we take a look at it. No hesitation on my part. Unfortunately my schedule didn't allow us to see it in time before the owners accepted an offer but we already had plans to visit with her cousin so we went anyway. My wife's cousin is one of the last remaining members of her family which we are close to and she likes the idea of being nearer to them. We spent several days driving around the area and talking with the locals. The area is a good fit for us. The only negative is with the legalization of pot in Oregon there are a lot of small pot growers around which comes with some less than savory people. Nothing compared to the Bay Area though.
> 
> Our current plan is to purchase the property and rent it for a few years until our kids are done with college then move. We will keep our home in California as a rental.



Grants Pass is a nice area.  Been there several times.  If you haven't done it yet you've got to try the Hell's Canyon boat trip down the Rogue River.  Lot's of other fun stuff to do too.

Marijuana is legal in Nevada as well.  Not quite sure it will grow well in the high desert.  We'll see. 

Happy property hunting.  In time you will find the perfect place.


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## TomS (Apr 28, 2018)

Finally got moved into the new house.  Yesterday the internet provider and satellite TV technicians were here.  Finally able to communicate and relax in front of the TV.  The movers showed up this past Wednesday.  The first picture is before they started moving my tools and equipment into their new home.  The second picture shows what it looks like after they got done.  This is going to be as test of my organizational skills.


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## wrmiller (Apr 28, 2018)

Oh boy, that looks familiar! 

One day at a time is all you can do. And eventually it will be done.


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## TomS (Apr 28, 2018)

wrmiller said:


> Oh boy, that looks familiar!
> 
> One day at a time is all you can do. And eventually it will be done.



Yeah, one day at a time with a dumpster sitting outside the shop.  I started sorting through some of the boxes today and and ended up with a sizeable pile of junk.  I'll get there.  Just need to have some patience.


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## cvairwerks (Apr 29, 2018)

Tom, at least you are unpacking...... I’m starting to pack two houses and some stuff from a friend’s shop. Looks like it will be 3, 40’ box vans and a 53’ flat bed when it’s time to go!


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## TomS (Apr 29, 2018)

cvairwerks said:


> Tom, at least you are unpacking...... I’m starting to pack two houses and some stuff from a friend’s shop. Looks like it will be 3, 40’ box vans and a 53’ flat bed when it’s time to go!



Now that's a lot of stuff!  I filled up a 53' enclosed trailer and one 26' box van.


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## cvairwerks (Apr 29, 2018)

TomS said:


> Now that's a lot of stuff!  I filled up a 53' enclosed trailer and one 26' box van.



I'll bulk out two of the box trailers with airplanes...The two fuselages will take up nearly one by them selves. The welding table, sheet metal tools, mills, the big drill press and the riveters will come close to filling the deck of the flat bed. Add the tractor and it's stuff, the motorcycle and sidecar and 7 vehicles, and it's a lot of stuff that's not in the house. Fortunately, I've got a while before it all has to move.


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## stioc (May 30, 2018)

Hi Tom, so who did you use for the move and what did it end up costing? was it estimated by weight? I'm a few years away from such an adventure but curious what it would cost for an out of state move.


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## zmotorsports (May 30, 2018)

Looks good.  Congrats on getting moved and looking forward to seeing the new shop all set up.

Mike


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## TomS (May 31, 2018)

stioc said:


> Hi Tom, so who did you use for the move and what did it end up costing? was it estimated by weight? I'm a few years away from such an adventure but curious what it would cost for an out of state move.



We used North American Van Lines out of Redding, CA.  Not cheap (~$10K) but they did an excellent job.  Cost was based on estimated weight.  At the end there were no added costs for miscellaneous packing materials or labor unlike some other movers.  They also provided an enclosed trailer, truck and driver at no additional cost to move one of my cars.

A word of caution though.  My shop equipment was loaded in a separate 28' box van along with miscellaneous potted plants.  The inside of the van was like a hot house and the moisture given off by the plants left a nice uniform coating of surface rust on my machine tools.  Not a big deal as steel wool and skotch brite cleaned it up but it was a bit of extra work on my part.


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## TomS (May 31, 2018)

zmotorsports said:


> Looks good.  Congrats on getting moved and looking forward to seeing the new shop all set up.
> 
> Mike



Thanks Mike.  The shop is a bit more organized and I'm working on getting my machine tools set up.  Had a new drip pan made up for my CNC mill and worked yesterday on getting it fit to the support frame and laying out the mounting holes.  I finished up the air system last weekend so that is out of the way.  I'll post more pictures as I move along.


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## stioc (May 31, 2018)

TomS said:


> We used North American Van Lines out of Redding, CA.  Not cheap (~$10K) but they did an excellent job.  Cost was based on estimated weight.  At the end there were no added costs for miscellaneous packing materials or labor unlike some other movers.  They also provided an enclosed trailer, truck and driver at no additional cost to move one of my cars.
> 
> A word of caution though.  My shop equipment was loaded in a separate 28' box van along with miscellaneous potted plants.  The inside of the van was like a hot house and the moisture given off by the plants left a nice uniform coating of surface rust on my machine tools.  Not a big deal as steel wool and skotch brite cleaned it up but it was a bit of extra work on my part.



That's great info Tom, thanks! I keep thinking that when the time comes I should just sell all my current (starter sized) machines and upgrade to larger ones at the new location and avoid the hassles of moving them long distance.  I'll still have to move my toolboxes but those aren't as big of a problem. I'll just have to plan/budget for the time and cost of getting the new machines. Time to skip the Starbucks lattes lol


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## TomS (Jun 18, 2018)

TomS said:


> Finally got moved into the new house.  Yesterday the internet provider and satellite TV technicians were here.  Finally able to communicate and relax in front of the TV.  The movers showed up this past Wednesday.  The first picture is before they started moving my tools and equipment into their new home.  The second picture shows what it looks like after they got done.  This is going to be as test of my organizational skills.
> 
> View attachment 266297
> 
> ...



Remember these pictures?  I finally got to the point where I can use my machines.  It's been since mid-February.  I still have some organizing to do but I now have a functional work space.

Next project is to build a mezzanine in this back corner for storage.


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## mattthemuppet2 (Jun 18, 2018)

nice. on the plus side at least you have plenty of space to move things around until you find the layout you like.


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## stioc (Jun 18, 2018)

That's awesomel Tom! I'm very curious to see how you setup your new shop. BTW, I had no idea you had a RF30/31 with what looks like some cool upgrades...do you have them documented anywhere?


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## TomS (Jun 18, 2018)

stioc said:


> That's awesomel Tom! I'm very curious to see how you setup your new shop. BTW, I had no idea you had a RF30/31 with what looks like some cool upgrades...do you have them documented anywhere?



The shop is coming along.  The machines are where they are going to stay.  The rest of my "stuff" will get moved around (maybe to the dump) to maximize space.

You've got a good eye.  Yes, I've done a few mods; quill DRO, X axis power feed, Z axis power feed, quill power downfeed and upfeed, Y axis travel extension, and a one shot lube system.  What you can't see is the mods I made to minimize chip and coolant intrusion into the spindle bearings.  I've posted some of these mods in various threads on this forum, mostly in response to others requesting info on this type of mill.

If you have an interest in any of my mods/upgrades ask away.  I'll be glad to share.


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## stioc (Jun 19, 2018)

Nice RF mods, of course,I'd love to see/read whatever you care to share about it. The chip/coolant in spindle prevention sounds good as does the the one shot lube system. Thanks!


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## TomS (Jun 19, 2018)

stioc said:


> Nice RF mods, of course,I'd love to see/read whatever you care to share about it. The chip/coolant in spindle prevention sounds good as does the the one shot lube system. Thanks!



Here's a couple of pictures of the chip intrusion prevention mods I did.  I can't find my pictures of the one shot lube system.  I'll take some pictures in the morning.

This is the cover plate I made to close off the hole under the head.  If chips and coolant get into the space behind this plate they can get into the rack gear on the quill and the fine downfeed mechanism.  Chips could also cause problems with the head vertical movement.   




This picture shows the visible portion of the sleeve I made to block off the drill drift slots.  These slots are directly over the lower spindle bearing which has no seal thus allowing chips and coolant easy access.  This mod is a bit more involved because the quill is quite long and hangs out of the chuck a long ways.  I had to take light cuts at low RPM to keep the quill from moving in the chuck and to keep chatter under control.      



The sleeve has worked out great but was a lot of work.  When I converted my PM-932 to CNC I had the same concerns with the drill drift slots and I didn't relish the idea of boring the quill and pressing in a sleeve.  I did some internet surfing and found where someone had filled the slots with epoxy.  Seemed like a good idea so I disassembled my spindle, thoroughly cleaned the quill interior paying particular attention to the slots.  Using duct tape as a backer I filled the slots with epoxy (can't remember the specific type or brand) and let it dry overnight.  That was about two years ago and the epoxy is still there, and no chips or coolant are getting into the bearing.

Hope this is helpful and I'll be posting pictures of my lube system tomorrow.


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## stioc (Jun 20, 2018)

Thanks Tom! I never thought about it, very helpful.


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## TomS (Jun 20, 2018)

stioc said:


> Thanks Tom! I never thought about it, very helpful.



I didn't get around to taking pictures of the lube system.  Hopefully tomorrow will be a better day.


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## jbolt (Jun 21, 2018)

TomS said:


> The machines are where they are going to stay.



Did you run out of money for a stand for that sander? Maybe we can pass the hat around for ya.


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## TomS (Jun 21, 2018)

jbolt said:


> Did you run out of money for a stand for that sander? Maybe we can pass the hat around for ya.



Yeah, that's it.  Donations gladly accepted.  LOL.  I'm still organizing and I needed space on the work bench so on the floor it went.  I got the CNC mill running today, finally.  Still have some tweaking to do but it's close.


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## TomS (Jun 21, 2018)

TomS said:


> I didn't get around to taking pictures of the lube system.  Hopefully tomorrow will be a better day.



I'm going to post the pictures in the Enco Forum.  Seems the most logical place for them.


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## stioc (Jun 22, 2018)

Glad you got the CNC running again


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## TomS (Jun 22, 2018)

stioc said:


> Glad you got the CNC running again



Me too!  I've got a bunch of projects waiting to be started.


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