# PM45-CNC OWNERS



## zr8cnc (Feb 25, 2014)

I am looking for people who have purchased the cnc version of the PM45 mill from Precision Matthews? I recently purchased the cnc version and i am having some trouble getting it up and running on the MACH3 software. Well I have have managed to get all three axis's moving but cannot seem to turn the spindle on. if you have any input please chime in


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## Boswell (Feb 27, 2014)

zr8cnc said:


> I am looking for people who have purchased the cnc version of the PM45 mill from Precision Matthews? I recently purchased the cnc version and i am having some trouble getting it up and running on the MACH3 software. Well I have have managed to get all three axis's moving but cannot seem to turn the spindle on. if you have any input please chime in




I recieved my PM45-CNC about  a month ago. It tool two full days to get it un crated and mounted on the cast iron stand. Another full weekend to figure out how to get Mach3 talking to the motion control board and then another couple of weekends learning CAMBAM, Mach3 and machining enough to produce my first part (a 6061 Lego block). I broke two end mills in the process (well three as I just waisted a 1/2" 4 flute end mill by overheating it. I am sure it could be sharpened but that is yet another thing I have to learn) and just yesterday finally got it so that when it gets a speed command list S2000 it turns something close to 2000 rpm. 

So, are you still have problem with getting the spindle to turn on? I would be happy to share my Mach3 configurations if it will help.


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## Ray C (Feb 27, 2014)

Boswell said:


> I recieved my PM45-CNC about  a month ago. It tool two full days to get it un crated and mounted on the cast iron stand. Another full weekend to figure out how to get Mach3 talking to the motion control board and then another couple of weekends learning CAMBAM, Mach3 and machining enough to produce my first part (a 6061 Lego block). I broke two end mills in the process (well three as I just waisted a 1/2" 4 flute end mill by overheating it. I am sure it could be sharpened but that is yet another thing I have to learn) and just yesterday finally got it so that when it gets a speed command list S2000 it turns something close to 2000 rpm.
> 
> So, are you still have problem with getting the spindle to turn on? I would be happy to share my Mach3 configurations if it will help.



Myself and zr8 would probably benefit.  I just got mine put on the base today.  I spent an hour setting up Mach 3 and got XYZ & A to work.  I just set the two pulley speeds and tried the spindle calibrate function and it didn't fire up.  It was my first try at spinning the spindle and not even sure if that's the right way to do it.  I'm new to Mach 3...

It would be great if you could pass along any tips you might have. 

Ray


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## Boswell (Feb 27, 2014)

Ray C said:


> Myself and zr8 would probably benefit.  I just got mine put on the base today.  I spent an hour setting up Mach 3 and got XYZ & A to work.  I just set the two pulley speeds and tried the spindle calibrate function and it didn't fire up.  It was my first try at spinning the spindle and not even sure if that's the right way to do it.  I'm new to Mach 3...
> 
> It would be great if you could pass along any tips you might have.
> 
> Ray




Just read your post. I do not believe that there is a spindle speed feedback to Mach3. What this means is that Mach3 will output a PWM signal for the speed you select but has no way of knowing what the actual speed is. Another side effect is that this would prevent the spindle calibration from working.  I have only used the higher speed gearbox selection and have no problem running the mill from low RPM like 100rpm to slightly over 3000rpm. I find I am cutting at the high end. Of course that would change when I need to Tap some holes. As a result I have not made any attempt at getting the lower gearbox pulley setting to work. I would love to see a picture of the control box open on your system that has an A axis. I want to know if I have the the control hardware for the axis and all I need is a rotary table to connect or if I have to also install additional control hardware.


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## Ray C (Feb 27, 2014)

Boswell said:


> Just read your post. I do not believe that there is a spindle speed feedback to Mach3. What this means is that Mach3 will output a PWM signal for the speed you select but has no way of knowing what the actual speed is. Another side effect is that this would prevent the spindle calibration from working.  I have only used the higher speed gearbox selection and have no problem running the mill from low RPM like 100rpm to slightly over 3000rpm. I find I am cutting at the high end. Of course that would change when I need to Tap some holes. As a result I have not made any attempt at getting the lower gearbox pulley setting to work. I would love to see a picture of the control box open on your system that has an A axis. I want to know if I have the the control hardware for the axis and all I need is a rotary table to connect or if I have to also install additional control hardware.



I'll take a pic tomorrow and post it.  In a nutshell, if you look at the lower rack of equipment, the motor controllers are lined-up in a row.  They are black with heat sinks and built-in fans... about 1.5" wide and 5" square (roughly).   If you have 4 then you're set for 4 axis.  

This machine is pretty sweet.  I put it in safe z-mode and ran some test g-code programs.  -Makes really cool noises.  Sadly, though, I need to work past the little issue of turning on the spindle... -details, details...


Ray


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## zr8cnc (Feb 27, 2014)

Update...tonight I deleted the 1.58 jamen driver and installed the other driver 1.56 and bingo the spindle started up. The only problem is that the mach3 program is in Chinese and not English. I hope to fix this tomorrow.

- - - Updated - - -

Boswell, thanks for replying to my thread. Its good to know a few people with these mills. Did you set your axis motors up at 320 steps?

Also how do you like the mill so far?


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## drs23 (Feb 27, 2014)

zr8cnc said:


> Update...tonight I deleted the 1.58 jamen driver and installed the other driver 1.56 and bingo the spindle started up. The only *problem is that the mach3 program is in Chinese and not English*. I hope to fix this tomorrow.



Really? Is that something Google Translate can do, accurately?

I looked for the opcorn: emoticon but there's not one. 

I will certainly be following this one.


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## AlanR (Feb 27, 2014)

drs23 said:


> Really? Is that something Google Translate can do, accurately?


Nah, he's going to learn how to read Chinese and translate it himself. Tonight. :whistle:


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## Ray C (Feb 28, 2014)

zr8cnc said:


> Update...tonight I deleted the 1.58 jamen driver and installed the other driver 1.56 and bingo the spindle started up. The only problem is that the mach3 program is in Chinese and not English. I hope to fix this tomorrow.
> 
> - - - Updated - - -
> 
> ...



Ah yes, there's a language setting -or possibly you download a different copy for different languages.  Mach 3 is available in many languages.

Just so folks know, this thing was plug-and-play in prior models.  They recently added the handheld "pendant" controller and the software was updated -and as usual, software glitches are ruining all the fun...  Matt is sending email back/forth with the integrator guy in China and I'm told he's really, really smart but hard to understand.

Just for grins, if I have time today, I'm going to install the version of Mach that comes with the CD.  I bet it has the proper profile files and will work right away.  So far, I think we've all fallen into the trap of downloading the latest version of Mach from the ArtSoft website.

Anyhow, I got my machine going (minus the spindle control) in about 1 hour...  One little glitch to resolve and I've been in contact with someone who knows how to update the spindle configuration to make it work.  He's going to send me a screenshot rather than transcribe the information.

As stated, I'm taking notes and pictures to help the future generation of "CNC'ers"...




Ray


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## Boswell (Feb 28, 2014)

Thanks for the description of the motor controllers. I will check but I think I have 4 but was not sure if one was for the spindle or not.

Also Screens are easy to change in Mach3. I am using a screen set called Multi Interface ScreenSet 2013 from Per Bjorn Jeppeson.     http://www.sten-kunst.dk/PBJ-Multi-Interface-2013.htm

My X,Y and Z are set to 8000 steps per revolution.

I will not be able to get out to capture screen shots until lunch time or this evening.

- - - Updated - - -

You asked how I like the Mill. Well by one measure of success if have found that I can screw things up much faster and more efficiently than ever before.  :whistle:.  I have also discovered how many more tools that I "Need" so my kids inheritance is at risk. I have spent almost all of my free time over the last 5 weekends setting it up and learning and making scrap. 
So in other words. I love it !


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## Ray C (Feb 28, 2014)

First, thanks for all the great cooperation on helping one another.  Again, I'm sorry for being late to the game as I was hoping to blaze this trail months ago (but I cut my fingers and had to hang things up for a month or more). 

I will find time later today to revert to the older driver to see (for grins) if that makes the spindle work.  If that does not pan-out, I would greatly appreciate seeing your screen shots.

As for the spindle controller.  That is a 3 phase motor and it's powered with the VFD.  It cannot use a digital motor controller.  It must use an analog signal to control the VFD.  BTW:  That particular VFD is designed for good low-end torque.  The thing is really expensive so don't mess it up.


FWIW:  The mill is fine but, I am obviously biased.  I already had a PM45 (it's 5 years old) and with the exception of limiting the gearbox to two speeds, it's the same machine.  My old unit is perfect after 5 years of heavy use...  Never skips a beat.  I never thought to question.

I am a little baffled about the one-shot oil pump.  I thought it had a timer setting and I'm trying to better understand it.   Anyhow, whatever you do, DO NOT unhook one of the lines and turn it on to see if it works.  -Trust me, it works.  It's got a LOT of pressure.  Trust me...  (it shot an amazing amount of vactra #2 all over me and the shop in about 1.5 seconds).  It works....


Ray

- - - Updated - - -

First, thanks for all the great cooperation on helping one another.  Again, I'm sorry for being late to the game as I was hoping to blaze this trail months ago (but I cut my fingers and had to hang things up for a month or more). 

I will find time later today to revert to the older driver to see (for grins) if that makes the spindle work.  If that does not pan-out, I would greatly appreciate seeing your screen shots.

As for the spindle controller.  That is a 3 phase motor and it's powered with the VFD.  It cannot use a digital motor controller.  It must use an analog signal to control the VFD.  BTW:  That particular VFD is designed for good low-end torque.  The thing is really expensive so don't mess it up.


FWIW:  The mill is fine but, I am obviously biased.  I already had a PM45 (it's 5 years old) and with the exception of limiting the gearbox to two speeds, it's the same machine.  My old unit is perfect after 5 years of heavy use...  Never skips a beat.  I never thought to question.

I am a little baffled about the one-shot oil pump.  I thought it had a timer setting and I'm trying to better understand it.   Anyhow, whatever you do, DO NOT unhook one of the lines and turn it on to see if it works.  -Trust me, it works.  It's got a LOT of pressure.  Trust me...  (it shot an amazing amount of vactra #2 all over me and the shop in about 1.5 seconds).  It works....


Ray


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## Boswell (Feb 28, 2014)

Ray C said:


> I am a little baffled about the one-shot oil pump.  I thought it had a timer setting and I'm trying to better understand it.   Anyhow, whatever you do, DO NOT unhook one of the lines and turn it on to see if it works.  -Trust me, it works.  It's got a LOT of pressure.  Trust me...  (it shot an amazing amount of vactra #2 all over me and the shop in about 1.5 seconds).  It works....
> 
> 
> Ray




Twice I have emptied the reservoir by turning on the pump and forgetting to turn it off until I noticed the large puddle of oil on the floor. for now, I turn it on and count to 10 slowly then turn it off. I do this once per day. if someone has a suggestion for a better process, please share. This is a candidate for a push button with a timer.


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## Ray C (Feb 28, 2014)

Boswell said:


> Twice I have emptied the reservoir by turning on the pump and forgetting to turn it off until I noticed the large puddle of oil on the floor. for now, I turn it on and count to 10 slowly then turn it off. I do this once per day. if someone has a suggestion for a better process, please share. This is a candidate for a push button with a timer.



It's got wires that go into the control box and I can hear relays when I turn the switch; therefore, it can be programmed...  :thumbsup:  I'll get to it...



Ray


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## Boswell (Feb 28, 2014)

I created a new thread on PM45-CNC configuration. I uploaded my Mach3 xml config file to that thread.
I have also put screen captures of the MACH3 config pages


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## zr8cnc (Feb 28, 2014)

Boswell said:


> Thanks for the description of the motor controllers. I will check but I think I have 4 but was not sure if one was for the spindle or not.
> 
> Also Screens are easy to change in Mach3. I am using a screen set called Multi Interface ScreenSet 2013 from Per Bjorn Jeppeson.     http://www.sten-kunst.dk/PBJ-Multi-Interface-2013.htm
> 
> ...




when you dial the stepper motors in the axis really crank! I was shocked at how fast table moved once I started adjusting the speeds. Also thanks for posting the site for the different screen sets because i wasnt aware that you could change them


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## Boswell (Feb 28, 2014)

zr8cnc said:


> when you dial the stepper motors in the axis really crank! I was shocked at how fast table moved once I started adjusting the speeds. Also thanks for posting the site for the different screen sets because i wasnt aware that you could change them



Not have any real experience with machining I have been running very low feed rates. I have been playing with 6061. Yesterday I did some pocketing with a 1/2 square endmill and was using 15ips with a plunge rate of 9ips. I was taking .05 inches in Depth and when it plunged each time you could hear the motor take up the load and the RPMs would drop slightly. After several cycles of this I could tell something was not right (not nearly as fast as I should have). When I stopped it, the end of the cutter was completely blocked up with aluminum that had welded itself. I removed the aluminum but you could see the cutting edges were very damaged. I am going to try again and back off the plunge rate by more than half and probably some on the XY rate as well


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## ajg308 (Feb 28, 2014)

zr8cnc said:


> I am looking for people who have purchased the cnc version of the PM45 mill from Precision Matthews? I recently purchased the cnc version and i am having some trouble getting it up and running on the MACH3 software. Well I have have managed to get all three axis's moving but cannot seem to turn the spindle on. if you have any input please chime in



I have a new PM45-CNC and am in the same boat.  It is the new one that came with the handheld controller.  Can get everything to move but the spindle.  It has twitched a few time, but no spinning.  Also have the Mach3 in Chinese, and that is a giant pain trying to do anything.

I tried both versions on the CD, tried both drivers and no luck on the spindle or Chinese.  I downloaded the most current version from the website and it was still in Chinese.  After I uninstalled and deleted the Mach3 folder it came up in English.  No matter what I did configuration wise it would not run the machine like the Chinese version did.  Now I am back to Chinese.  I have an email to Matt, one of many this week.  Waiting to hear back.  

I was getting super frustrated and then I found this thread.  I am glad it is not just me!


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## Boswell (Feb 28, 2014)

ajg308 said:


> I was getting super frustrated and then I found this thread.  I am glad it is not just me!



Welcome to the forum AJG308.

I started a seperate thread for configuration information. I put screen shots of all of the Mach3 Config pages there. 
To get english, you just need to load an english screen set. 

select the "View" tab on the top (4th from left)
then "Load Screens"  (first choice)
the select the default screen set which is 1024.set   (not 1024cn.set)

there are many screen sets available some for free other for a small charge. do some searches and find one that you like.
I am using the PBJ 2013 screen set.

let us know if this helps or if not there are several of us all with new PM45-cnc mills going through this at about the same time.
I mostly have mine working and am happy to help out any way I can.


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## zr8cnc (Feb 28, 2014)

ajg308 said:


> I have a new PM45-CNC and am in the same boat.  It is the new one that came with the handheld controller.  Can get everything to move but the spindle.  It has twitched a few time, but no spinning.  Also have the Mach3 in Chinese, and that is a giant pain trying to do anything.
> 
> I tried both versions on the CD, tried both drivers and no luck on the spindle or Chinese.  I downloaded the most current version from the website and it was still in Chinese.  After I uninstalled and deleted the Mach3 folder it came up in English.  No matter what I did configuration wise it would not run the machine like the Chinese version did.  Now I am back to Chinese.  I have an email to Matt, one of many this week.  Waiting to hear back.
> 
> I was getting super frustrated and then I found this thread.  I am glad it is not just me!



AJG308,

I wish in your same exact boat. I remember loading the chinese version first and thinking oh this must be the wrong one and then installing the 1.58 driver. then once i went back the mto the chinese 1.56 driver in chinese my mill ran awesome. I will try changing my Mach3 from Chinese to English and post my results last night. i found a link to change that said go to view and click Load Screen...browse to the mach 3 folder and select 1024.set and this will bring it back to English. i have not tried it yet but i will tonight.

I agree this should have been a much easier setup from PM. I was frustrated because i am noobie with CNC and was looking for a simple mill to get me started. once we figure out all the issues this should go smoothly.


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## ajg308 (Feb 28, 2014)

Got an exciting update!

My buddy just came over and we were looking at it and I was explaining the problem to him.  He said it sounds like a clutch problem.  So he starts messing with the spindle and gear selector and said it was just out of gear.  By turning the spindle it allowed the clutch to engage and when I hit the spindle power button it worked!  

So it may be as simple as it not being fully in gear.  Hope this helps someone.









- - - Updated - - -



Boswell said:


> Welcome to the forum AJG308.
> 
> I started a seperate thread for configuration information. I put screen shots of all of the Mach3 Config pages there.
> To get english, you just need to load an english screen set.
> ...



This is what I was hoping for.  I kind of felt like I was alone in this, glad to help and be helped.  Thanks.



zr8cnc said:


> AJG308,
> 
> I wish in your same exact boat. I remember loading the chinese version first and thinking oh this must be the wrong one and then installing the 1.58 driver. then once i went back the mto the chinese 1.56 driver in chinese my mill ran awesome. I will try changing my Mach3 from Chinese to English and post my results last night. i found a link to change that said go to view and click Load Screen...browse to the mach 3 folder and select 1024.set and this will bring it back to English. i have not tried it yet but i will tonight.
> 
> I agree this should have been a much easier setup from PM. I was frustrated because i am noobie with CNC and was looking for a simple mill to get me started. once we figure out all the issues this should go smoothly.




I will try changing this right now and report back.   Hopefully Matt comes up with better instructions for future users.

- - - Updated - - -




Got English!  Thanks for the fix.


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## Boswell (Feb 28, 2014)

Great news. 
Now you have English and a working Spindle. Go make some chips and let us know how it goes.


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## ajg308 (Feb 28, 2014)

Boswell said:


> Great news.
> Now you have English and a working Spindle. Go make some chips and let us know how it goes.



No doubt!  I am freaking giddy at the moment.


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## Ray C (Feb 28, 2014)

ajg308 said:


> Got an exciting update!
> 
> My buddy just came over and we were looking at it and I was explaining the problem to him.  He said it sounds like a clutch problem.  So he starts messing with the spindle and gear selector and said it was just out of gear.  By turning the spindle it allowed the clutch to engage and when I hit the spindle power button it worked!
> 
> ...





Yeah!!!

BTW:  I'm on the hook for the updated 45CNC user manual and I'll be working on it all weekend -no doubt.


Ray

- - - Updated - - -



zr8cnc said:


> AJG308,
> 
> I wish in your same exact boat. I remember loading the chinese version first and thinking oh this must be the wrong one and then installing the 1.58 driver. then once i went back the mto the chinese 1.56 driver in chinese my mill ran awesome. I will try changing my Mach3 from Chinese to English and post my results last night. i found a link to change that said go to view and click Load Screen...browse to the mach 3 folder and select 1024.set and this will bring it back to English. i have not tried it yet but i will tonight.
> 
> I agree this should have been a much easier setup from PM. I was frustrated because i am noobie with CNC and was looking for a simple mill to get me started. once we figure out all the issues this should go smoothly.



Guys,

I thank you for being so reasonable about this...  Matt has been calling and exchanging emails with the fellow in China about this for a long time.  I've mentioned before, the guy over there is really nice, very smart -but doesn't speak our language -nor does Matt speak Chinese.

Again, I thank you all for ganging together on this...


Ray


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## zr8cnc (Feb 28, 2014)

Ray you owe us a steak dinner for figuring out all these spindle problems.....lolol. This will make the problem solving section of that work instruction a little easier.


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## Ray C (Feb 28, 2014)

zr8cnc said:


> Ray you owe us a steak dinner for figuring out all these spindle problems.....lolol. This will make the problem solving section of that work instruction a little easier.



PM's sent.  Your help and patience is recognized and will be rewarded...


Ray


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## ajg308 (Feb 28, 2014)

Today I ran the PM45-CNC in all the gears as described on the website.  I thought I should turn on the lube pump and when I did, bang!  A loud pop and from the pump and a tripped circuit breaker in the breaker box.  I tripped it back, and everything seemed ok.  When I had the balls again I hit the pump again, but nothing happened, I was not sure if it was even working.  I determined it was working because the oil went from new and semi clear to dark brown and then black.  I also have quite a leak coming from somewhere in the table.

My questions.

What freaking happened?  Is the pump ok?  Can I test it besides Ray's method?  How do I find the leak?  What is the best oil to replace it? 

Thanks, everyone.


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## Ray C (Feb 28, 2014)

ajg308 said:


> Today I ran the PM45-CNC in all the gears as described on the website.  I thought I should turn on the lube pump and when I did, bang!  A loud pop and from the pump and a tripped circuit breaker in the breaker box.  I tripped it back, and everything seemed ok.  When I had the balls again I hit the pump again, but nothing happened, I was not sure if it was even working.  I determined it was working because the oil went from new and semi clear to dark brown and then black.  I also have quite a leak coming from somewhere in the table.
> 
> My questions.
> 
> ...



I don't know what went pop but, I'd start by looking at all the connecting wires under the cap.  It's possible the oil pump got tugged on during shipping because it was tacked with plywood to the shipping crate.  Unplug the unit before checking the wires, of course...

It sounds like it's working if you've got oil leaking all over...  That's what you can expect.  The oil gets pumped into the table way areas and it drips down all over the place.  It also gets slathered onto the leadscrews etc...  Under normal circumstances you'll just wipe the excess off.

Mobile Vactra #2 way oil is the appropriate lubricant.  

Ray


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## Boswell (Mar 1, 2014)

ajg308 said:


> Today I ran the PM45-CNC in all the gears as described on the website.  I thought I should turn on the lube pump and when I did, bang!  A loud pop and from the pump and a tripped circuit breaker in the breaker box.  I tripped it back, and everything seemed ok.  When I had the balls again I hit the pump again, but nothing happened, I was not sure if it was even working.  I determined it was working because the oil went from new and semi clear to dark brown and then black.  I also have quite a leak coming from somewhere in the table.
> 
> My questions.
> 
> ...




this may be stating what you already know but the one-shot lube system as implemented on the PM45-CNC is not designed to be turned on and left on. I turn mine on for 10 seconds before I use the mill each day that I use it. I am not sure if this is long enough, I plan to experiment with longer and longer times until I see excess oil. 

Also a note of caution. Twice, I have realized that I forgot to run the lube until the Mill was running a program so I reached up and did my 10 second routine while it was running. When I turned the lube switch off, the spindle turn off also. Mostly likely some electrical noise or voltage drop that caused a relay to trip or fall out. Regardless, you have to hit the stop switch quick or bust something. The only way I could get the spindle going again was to turn the Mill OFF and back ON.


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## zr8cnc (Mar 1, 2014)

Anyone know what the rpms limit is for the two different gear selections?


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## Boswell (Mar 1, 2014)

zr8cnc said:


> Anyone know what the rpms limit is for the two different gear selections?



I have only used the high setting so far and based on the specifications it should be around 3000. Although that is not necessarily the Limit of the gears.  While I was working out spindle configurations Mach3 would occasionally run the spindle at the Maximum (what ever that means)  and the RPM readout on the Mill would show about 3150 plus or minus a bit. All I am working with right now is 6061 aluminum and so have not tried to run slower than 1500. I do run the edge finder at about 1000  and some times when I turn the spindle on it will start at around 100 RPM. Again, all in the higher Gear setting.


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## ajg308 (Mar 2, 2014)

Ray C said:


> I don't know what went pop but, I'd start by looking at all the connecting wires under the cap.  It's possible the oil pump got tugged on during shipping because it was tacked with plywood to the shipping crate.  Unplug the unit before checking the wires, of course...
> 
> It sounds like it's working if you've got oil leaking all over...  That's what you can expect.  The oil gets pumped into the table way areas and it drips down all over the place.  It also gets slathered onto the leadscrews etc...  Under normal circumstances you'll just wipe the excess off.
> 
> ...



Thanks Ray,

so what is the appropriate process for lube?  When do I turn on the pump and for how long?  If done correctly will excess lube return to the tank?  I assume it is as mine turned colors.

Thanks,

- - - Updated - - -



Boswell said:


> this may be stating what you already know but the one-shot lube system as implemented on the PM45-CNC is not designed to be turned on and left on. I turn mine on for 10 seconds before I use the mill each day that I use it. I am not sure if this is long enough, I plan to experiment with longer and longer times until I see excess oil.
> 
> Also a note of caution. Twice, I have realized that I forgot to run the lube until the Mill was running a program so I reached up and did my 10 second routine while it was running. When I turned the lube switch off, the spindle turn off also. Mostly likely some electrical noise or voltage drop that caused a relay to trip or fall out. Regardless, you have to hit the stop switch quick or bust something. The only way I could get the spindle going again was to turn the Mill OFF and back ON.



Good info here, thanks.


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## zr8cnc (Mar 2, 2014)

Has anyone had any experience with varying the spindle speed after if it already set. If I set the spindle speed I can only change it if I stop the spindle and restart it at another speed. If I try to change it while it is set for a given speed it will automatically go to the max at 3000 rpm.


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## Ray C (Mar 2, 2014)

zr8cnc said:


> Has anyone had any experience with varying the spindle speed after if it already set. If I set the spindle speed I can only change it if I stop the spindle and restart it at another speed. If I try to change it while it is set for a given speed it will automatically go to the max at 3000 rpm.



Yes, I'm having similar weirdness and all the problems go away if you stop and restart Mach 3.  If you've tried using the "Auto Calibrate" function, things will get really weird.  Wish I had answers but this is the best I have.

BTW:, no matter how weird it behaves, if you enter a S command, it always goes to the right speed.  I really think this is some kind of weirdness in Mach 3 that I just can't put my finger on.

Ray


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## JimDawson (Mar 3, 2014)

I'm not going to badmouth Mach3, but I too have been through the weirdness experience with it.  It seems to work ok on slower speed machines, like the plasma cutter I converted from it's dedicated Chinese computer.  When I tried to apply Mach3 to a high speed CNC router, it was a complete disaster.

I wound up writing my own CNC control software, to get around the problem.

In this case, it also sounds like there are some electrical issues in the controls.  One thing to check is that all of the wire terminations are tight, and that the system grounds are solid.  Normally all of the machine grounds should come back to a single point in the control panel.  This helps prevent ground loops, and helps with cross talk.

I have also seen some problems with the parallel interface boards, and even the computer parallel interface.  I fixed one system by installing a PCI parallel board, and shut down the on-board parallel port in BIOS.

Good luck!

Edit:

If you are running a Windows computer, run MSconfig.exe and shut everything down that is not needed to run Mach3.  A clean Windows install, only loading what is needed to run Windows works best.


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## Ray C (Mar 3, 2014)

ajg308 said:


> Thanks Ray,
> 
> so what is the appropriate process for lube?  When do I turn on the pump and for how long?  If done correctly will excess lube return to the tank?  I assume it is as mine turned colors.
> 
> ...



Sorry... Didn't see this till now...   Lube:  Eventually, I'd like to hook-up a timer for the permanent solution but for now, I've been hitting the switch for 5-10 seconds a few times a day while the ways are in motion.  When the machine starts cutting metal, I'll give it a 5 second shot before starting a job and again every 30 minutes while it's running.

No, the oil does not circulate back into the pump. Mine changed colors because it seems to get aerated by the internal motion of the pump inside the plastic bowl.

Ray


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## Ray C (Mar 3, 2014)

JimDawson said:


> I'm not going to badmouth Mach3, but I too have been through the weirdness experience with it.  It seems to work ok on slower speed machines, like the plasma cutter I converted from it's dedicated Chinese computer.  When I tried to apply Mach3 to a high speed CNC router, it was a complete disaster.
> 
> I wound up writing my own CNC control software, to get around the problem.
> 
> ...



Hi Jim... The machine is stripped down to the bare software minimums and it runs blazingly fast -outfitted with 4G Ram, solid state drive (really fast access) dual core Atom @ 1.9 GHz.  I'm also running over USB with a JAMEN soft stepper.  CPU utilization has never gone beyond 5-7%.

My instincts are telling me it's a peculiarity in Mach 3 or, the way I'm using it.  The spindle can be operated from a variety of screens and the issue surfaces after switching among them.  The good news is that the mill always properly responds to M3, Snnnn, and M5 commands when entered manually so, this is a minor annoyance now as, properly written G-code won't show the problem.   I also think the PWM settings for the spindle speed control need to be tweaked but, that's low on the priority list now.

Prior to running the machine, I checked all the wiring and connector screws for proper torque.  It's a properly designed cabinet and properly grounded.  I found a couple terminal screws that were a tiny bit loose but nothing alarming.


Ray


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## Boswell (Mar 3, 2014)

JimDawson said:


> I'm not going to badmouth Mach3, but I too have been through the weirdness experience with it.  It seems to work ok on slower speed machines, like the plasma cutter I converted from it's dedicated Chinese computer.  When I tried to apply Mach3 to a high speed CNC router, it was a complete disaster.
> 
> I wound up writing my own CNC control software, to get around the problem.
> 
> ...




I am running Mach3 on a 5 or 6 year old laptop that is anything but speedy. I did go through and un-install almost all other software though. Because the PM45-CNC has a motor control board (JNC-40M) there is no reliance on a parallel port.  

When troubleshooting spindle (and feed ) speeds. Be aware that the actual spindle speed is the result of two values multiplied together. There is the actual called for spindle speed and the Spindle Overide %.  If the spindle overide % is set to a very low number such as 1%, then any changes in the called for speed via Sxxxx commands will be very small and hard to notice. On the "Program Run" screen of Mach3 you can see and set these values.  In the bottom right is the Spindle control section.
If you press the "Reset" button it should set the Spindle Overide % to 100% (SRO %).  Then click on the Spindle Speed value at the very bottom and enter a speed such a 1000.  Now press the Spindle CW F5 button and the spindle should spin clockwise at 1000 rpm.  Using the up and down arrows will adjust the SRO%. If you adjust the SRO% to 90 then you should see the actual RPM go to 900. In the display you can see this because the spindle speed reading stayed at 1000, the SRO% is 90% and the S-ov shows 900. The S-ov is the result of applying the Spindle Overide % to the Spindle Speed.

At least his is how it is working on my system. Also the Feed rate has the same algorithm. However I don't see how any of this will cause or fix an issue where you can't change the speed after it is initially set.


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## zr8cnc (Mar 4, 2014)

has anyone got to the point where they have trammed the head to the table? just curious how close it came from the factory.


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## Ray C (Mar 4, 2014)

zr8cnc said:


> has anyone got to the point where they have trammed the head to the table? just curious how close it came from the factory.



I did some tram checking yesterday.  When just running the table in full X and Y with a fixed test indicator on the spindle, it was dead on and did not move.  This simply tells you that the table is flat.  I also did circular testing with a 6" circle at the center of the table.  Both directions were within 1/2 thou (total 1 thou deflection).  I did not do circular testing at the extremes of the table (I rarely ever bother with that anyhow).

These were all quick tests and I need to look more closely.  

I have not tested Z tram yet since I can't find my cylindrical square.  It's here somewhere but I cleaned my shop and can't find a darn thing...


Ray


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## Boswell (Mar 4, 2014)

zr8cnc said:


> has anyone got to the point where they have trammed the head to the table? just curious how close it came from the factory.



I noticed that mine seem to be out of TRAM last week. I had just purchased a DTI and was able to quickly TRAM it. There is a scale mounted to the head on the right side that shows the head angle. Even that showed to be non-zero. I don't see this as a criticism of the PM45.  I had no expectations that the Mill could be shipped half-way around the world and maintain TRAM. From what I have read hear and other places, TRAMing the Mill is a standard part of setup and regular maintenance for all Mill's. Over on the Practical Machinist forum there are threads where people say they check the TRAM every day as part of their morning routine before starting to work.


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## ajg308 (Mar 5, 2014)

I am still learning the software and getting the mach3 configuration correct, but I had to try something.

So I got some aluminum and made my first chips.  I manually jogged the machine, but exciting nonetheless.


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## Boswell (Mar 7, 2014)

ajg308 said:


> I am still learning the software and getting the mach3 configuration correct, but I had to try something.
> 
> So I got some aluminum and made my first chips.  I manually jogged the machine, but exciting nonetheless.




Great news. It won't be long before you have it humming along while all you do is watch.


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## Ray C (Mar 7, 2014)

In case you're interested, I've had a non-CNC PM45 for about 5 years.  They're darn rugged!  I did my first tram on the old machine about 6 months after I got it and it went for about 2 more years before it needed another.  About 6 months after that, I pushed a hill climb accidentally and busted a 3/4" carbide endmill that tore the piece out of the vise and sent it flying.  Big bright flash when it blew.  Oddly enough, the tram was barely effected and I didn't bother re-tramming it for another few months.   That said, I usually take careful/conservative cuts and usually use carbide hogger bits because they remove material so well and put less stress on the machine... Still though, I use this machine several times a week and it's holding-up just fine.

The point being, these are rugged machines and last a long time if you're smart about how you use them.

Ray


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## zr8cnc (Mar 15, 2014)

Does anyone know how to run the mill as a manual mill with the spindle on but without the stepper motors active? I have tried in unchecking them in the configuration page but that didn't work.


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## Ray C (Mar 15, 2014)

zr8cnc said:


> Does anyone know how to run the mill as a manual mill with the spindle on but without the stepper motors active? I have tried in unchecking them in the configuration page but that didn't work.



My guess is that you'll need to find the breaker in the panel and kill the power to them.


Ray


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## Boswell (Mar 26, 2014)

I changed the oil in the gear head this evening. It went easier that I expected. There is a little black plat on the bottom side that hid the drain plug. It was easy to remove and the drain plug came right out. Took about 15-20 min before it stopped dripping. When I pulled the plug out there was remnants of some kind of gasket or sealant. It was a little like old Teflon tape but not quite and not much survived. I tried to put some Teflon on the plug before re-inserting it but it bound up after only one turn or so. I pulled the tape off and put the plug back in and it seated after several turns still seeming to not go back in as far as it was so I was a little concerned about it leaking (so far no leaks). The fill plug is under another cover plate next to the top of the spindle where the Draw bar goes in. Big 17mm bolt. I had to "modify" a metal funnel to get between the spindle and the sides of the enclosure but it worked fine. Filled it up to just a tad over the middle of the sight glass. Took a little less than a gallon of ISO 32 hydraulic fluid I got from the local auto parts store. A big thank you to Ray for guidance on this. I guess I should be good for awhile now.


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## ajg308 (Mar 26, 2014)

Boswell said:


> I changed the oil in the gear head this evening. It went easier that I expected. There is a little black plat on the bottom side that hid the drain plug. It was easy to remove and the drain plug came right out. Took about 15-20 min before it stopped dripping. When I pulled the plug out there was remnants of some kind of gasket or sealant. It was a little like old Teflon tape but not quite and not much survived. I tried to put some Teflon on the plug before re-inserting it but it bound up after only one turn or so. I pulled the tape off and put the plug back in and it seated after several turns still seeming to not go back in as far as it was so I was a little concerned about it leaking (so far no leaks). The fill plug is under another cover plate next to the top of the spindle where the Draw bar goes in. Big 17mm bolt. I had to "modify" a metal funnel to get between the spindle and the sides of the enclosure but it worked fine. Filled it up to just a tad over the middle of the sight glass. Took a little less than a gallon of ISO 32 hydraulic fluid I got from the local auto parts store. A big thank you to Ray for guidance on this. I guess I should be good for awhile now.



I am getting close to doing this to mine.  Thanks for the tips.


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## Ray C (Mar 27, 2014)

You guys are making me feel bad... I haven't been able to use mine enough to warrant the 1st oil change.  -Been too busy with other things...  

Anyhow, your machines should be good now for a year or two depending on how much you use it.


Ray


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## Boswell (Mar 31, 2014)

Today I noticed a few drops of oil on the table. It looks like I did not get the drain plug seated well. I did not tighten it too much because it did not feel quite right and I did not want to strip it. It was very awkward to get the right angle and no matter how long I let it drain (over night) it still seemed like it was dripping oil on my hands while I was trying to get it put back in. Anyway it is a very slow drip so I am going to let it be until it gets below the 1/2 way mark on the sight gauge and then I guess I will drain it and try to get the drain plug in better. For now, I am just putting a shop towel on the table to catch the drips


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## lim1wph (Oct 2, 2014)

Is anyone still monitoring this thread? I just received my PM45-CNC a couple of days ago and have not been able get Mach3 to accept the Jamen driver. It says bad .dll file when I start Mach3 after installing the Jamen. I suspect it's a Windows 8.1 problem because Matt sent me an older version of the driver and I still get the same message. Has anyone else had such a problem?   Thanks, Bill


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## lim1wph (Oct 16, 2014)

Hi All,  I finally got my machine working except for the MPG. I think I'll take another look at Boswell's screen shots and see what I can figure out. Also I downloaded the manually for the Grizzly G0761. There is a lot of good info in there (like where the drain plug is) and it looks like the same machine. If anyone has any ideas about my MPG I'd be grateful. Thanks, Bill


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## zr8cnc (Oct 16, 2014)

I scraped my MPG that came with the machine and purchased a VISTA CNC mpg wheel and never looked back. Make your like easier and buy one. its USB and plug and play without any issues.


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## lim1wph (Oct 16, 2014)

Thanks zr8,   I'll do just that. Which model did you buy. I want to make sure that I don't have any more issues with it.  Thanks, Bill


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## zr8cnc (Oct 16, 2014)

I purchased the iMach P2-S and I will tell you i think it is a nice quality tool. the p1-s might do it for you but I went with the P2-S. in minutes you could be manually cutting chips with your mill. i like the e-stop right on the hand held unit. very convenient for a novice machinist like myself =)


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## lim1wph (Oct 16, 2014)

Thanks, zr8.    I was just shopping on their page.


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## lim1wph (Oct 18, 2014)

Hey Fellas,   Where is the best set of instructions for tramming my mill?   Thanks, Bill


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