# Used indicators and other measuring tools, what to look for?



## Investigator (Dec 8, 2020)

I have the typical 'new guy' Chinese dial and test indicators.  I'm getting to the point that I want to buy some better quality.  I have seen items for sale on the bay or local groups as well as pawn shops.  My question is how do I know they are still in good shape?  Do they go out of spec, is there a way to test or tell before spending money on them?  Or is it more of if they function they should be fine?

How do I avoid buying damaged tools?


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## Winegrower (Dec 8, 2020)

My opinion is that, looking at how the internals actually work, if they move smoothly, return quickly and all the dials rotate as expected, they’re fine.


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## Aukai (Dec 8, 2020)

Ebay if the seller has a ton of good reviews, I also look for the brand, and type I'm looking for under "refurbished". Repair companies will often have refurbished metrology tools in stock.


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## pacifica (Dec 8, 2020)

Investigator said:


> I have the typical 'new guy' Chinese dial and test indicators.  I'm getting to the point that I want to buy some better quality.  I have seen items for sale on the bay or local groups as well as pawn shops.  My question is how do I know they are still in good shape?  Do they go out of spec, is there a way to test or tell before spending money on them?  Or is it more of if they function they should be fine?
> 
> How do I avoid buying damaged tools?


https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Calibr...773246?hash=item21716b397e:g:VEoAAOSwphFe7ok9 . I have bought several indicators from this ebay seller: hugomac13  and they work well are  calibrated but cost more. Lately he hasn't had too much variety. There are a few others that other members may be able to chime in as to their names.


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## C-Bag (Dec 8, 2020)

Winegrower said:


> My opinion is that, looking at how the internals actually work, if they move smoothly, return quickly and all the dials rotate as expected, they’re fine.


And return to zero. This is often the problem I find. If they don’t, I pass. All my DI’s and TI’s are used. And the best of them have old calibration stickers on them.


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## ericc (Dec 8, 2020)

I have had bad luck with name brand indicators and other measuring tools bought used.  They either have something wrong or something goes wrong quickly.  On the other hand, I have had good luck with import measuring tools bought new.  They look blocky, and can be a little balky, but they work.  The old name-brand stuff looks so much better, though.  If you send a Starrett in for repair, the cost is much higher than if you just bought a Harbor Freight or some other cheapie.


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## NCjeeper (Dec 8, 2020)

I like used Ames and Federal indicators. They seem to be built like tanks and usually have very few issues if any.


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## mikey (Dec 8, 2020)

I think your questions deserve serious answers because a lot of hobby guys have the same concerns. While I am not an expert at this stuff I have been buying tools on ebay almost since its inception so I'll offer some opinions.

If I could give a new hobby guy some sound advice it would be to buy a known good instrument new; buy it once and cry once.  If you need a source to determine which is the best for your needs, go to the Long Island Indicator Service site and do some homework. Then search for an authorized seller with the best price; the purchase will provide the documentation required for warranty coverage. Good tools can last a lifetime, will typically be accurate over that time and can be repaired and recalibrated if needed. I can tell you for sure that there is a difference in the feel, smoothness of action and accuracy between a good Swiss indicator and the rest, including Mitutoyo.

Okay, what to look for on ebay:

Know what you want and only buy that one thing. If it isn't there now, it will be soon so wait for it.
An indicator that is in really good condition will look that way. If it is dirty and the dovetails that the holder fits on are scuffed up and damaged then pass on it, even if the price is good. A filthy indicator has been used a lot and if it is filthy then it was used by someone who doesn't care about it. On the other hand, an indicator that is clean even in the smallest spaces and has pristine dovetails and a clear crystal is probably a good candidate. Contact the seller and ask if there are any issues with the indicator. If there are no issues then ask what his bottom line price would be; it will usually be lower than the listed price and you can make a deal, sometimes a very good deal.
Try hard to buy indicators that come in a case with all the accessories that usually accompany a new indicator. If the user sells it like this then he probably took good care of it during its working life. The guys who care about their tools will take the indicator from the box and use it, then put it back in the box when they're done. The box may show some wear but the tool should not. That is the kind of seller you're looking for.
Look hard for signs the tool was dropped. Good indicators are built to be used so the internals are pretty tough. However, they are not meant to be dropped onto a concrete floor so if you see signs of damaged dovetails, pass. The dovetails on a Swiss indicator are usually hardened steel and they can crack. On some, like Interapids, these can also be removed and replaced so an otherwise pristine indicator may not be a bad buy but only if the internals work as they should. I usually pass on dropped tools.
A calibration sticker tells you the tool was used in a professional shop. It tells you nothing about the user but it is likely that the tool was well used. That doesn't mean it isn't a good buy but it does suggest it saw some regular use. If it was treated well, it will look like it was. If the crystal is scratched up and there is oil around the bearing at the nose of the tool then it spent its life in an indicator holder and crap was just wiped off during use. Pass on these.
Buying on ebay is usually the best bet but don't overlook Amazon. Sometimes you can buy a brand new tool on Amazon for just a tiny bit more than a used one on ebay so make sure you look around. Typically, Amazon will beat Long Island Indicator for new tools of all makes.
Buy tools that can be repaired and calibrated. Most import stuff is not worth the repair cost but the good Swiss ones are. You can have a good DTI cleaned, serviced, calibrated and returned to full working condition for half of what a new one would cost.
Ebay favors the buyer, not the seller. If an indicator is sold as "used" or in "good" condition then by ebay's definition, the tool must work properly and fully. If it does not then you can return it at the seller's expense. Period. It is also wise to use Paypal because they will work to recover your money in the event of a dispute.
Always try to contact the seller to confirm the condition of a tool you are interested in. This leaves a trail for ebay and Paypal to follow a transaction. If the seller says the tool is in good condition and fully functional then it is on him to make sure it is. Otherwise, you can send it back at his expense, risk free to you. I have had contacts with guys who I got along with really well and more often than not, I got a better price than the listed price because I took the time to contact them. Don't overlook the power of an email.
*Be patient*. The tool you want is either on ebay or will be at some point. For example, this year alone I have found 3 Compac 215GA tenths reading indicators with extended travel and large dials. This tool sells for about $300.00 new. Each one I found sold for a third or less of that and all worked well and were in good condition. My best personal find on this tool was about 5 or 6 years ago; a mint condition 215GA that I got for $50.00. If you are patient and know what you want, you will eventually find it and it will often be less than a Chinese equivalent.
Okay, hope this helps.


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## Nogoingback (Dec 8, 2020)

Have a look at these folks under "Used/Demo".  I bought a refurb'd micrometer from them and was happy.









						Collections
					

Ideal Precision sells all major brands of precision measuring tools including Mitutoyo, Starrett, MahrFederal, and Brown & Sharpe.




					shop.idealprec.com
				




I also bought a used mic from eBay that was in perfect condition at a bargain price.  I would watch for a tool that looks
essentially new, especially if the description matches what you see.  It's a risk, but there are lots of good tools on eBay:
just aim for quality and not for a cheap price.   Be patient. I also believe that folks that pay for a good quality too in the 
first place will tend to take better care of them.  I don't know about where you live, but CL has lots of decent looking
tools to look at as well, although I know some folks think they're gold plated for some reason!


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## C-Bag (Dec 8, 2020)

Patience and knowledge. Know the quality names. I’ve gotten insanely lucky and bumbled onto deals. Like a guy came into work where there were few real mechanics and he’s got this junction box full of DI’s, a TI and a B&S 2-3” mic. He hit me up first because I was one of the few who even knew what they were. But the work we did(assembly) there was no use. He wanted $75 and I laughed, so he went around and asked the 50 guys on the floor and no hits. 

So he decided he was going to harangue me into it. I didn’t want or need them and he wouldn’t take no so I said $20, of course he acted offended, but took it. It would be almost 15yrs later in a thread on another site where somebody pointed out the TI was a .0001 Alina. Never heard of it but it is highly regarded. Dumb luck. The Ames was broken, 2 Starrett .0005’s, a Federal .0005, Alina and the B&S 202 mic. Starretts work perfect as does the Federal and the Alina. The 202 has something wrong with the clockwork and works intermittently. Not bad for $20.


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## mikey (Dec 8, 2020)

Alina was made by Compact/Tesa. You got lucky!


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## jcmullis2 (Dec 8, 2020)

If it hasn’t been said I’ll say it. Beware of counterfeit indicators. That deal you see on a Mitutoya probably isn’t a deal after all. I have a beautifully marked Mitutoyo TI that only cost me about $40 that even came with a magnetic holder. Thank goodness it did because the damned thing is Chinese counterfeit garbage but at least the magnetic holder works. I have Starrett’s now. Like the other fella said, buy once cry once. Get the best you can afford and remember buyer beware.


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## Jakedaawg (Dec 8, 2020)

mikey said:


> I think your questions deserve serious answers because a lot of hobby guys have the same concerns. While I am not an expert at this stuff I have been buying tools on ebay almost since its inception so I'll offer some opinions.
> 
> If I could give a new hobby guy some sound advice it would be to buy a known good instrument new; buy it once and cry once.  If you need a source to determine which is the best for your needs, go to the Long Island Indicator Service site and do some homework. Then search for an authorized seller with the best price; the purchase will provide the documentation required for warranty coverage. Good tools can last a lifetime, will typically be accurate over that time and can be repaired and recalibrated if needed. I can tell you for sure that there is a difference in the feel, smoothness of action and accuracy between a good Swiss indicator and the rest, including Mitutoyo.
> 
> ...



I am not the OP...with that said:  what are the brand names of the Swiss or other acceptable brands.  I assume starrett, brown and sharp and inter rapid.  But it appears there are other acceptable brands?


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## 7milesup (Dec 8, 2020)

Nogoingback said:


> Have a look at these folks under "Used/Demo".  I bought a refurb'd micrometer from them and was happy.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thanks for that link.  Added to my bookmarks.  I see they have a Mitutoyo caliper in their "demo" section that I have been looking for.


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## Nogoingback (Dec 8, 2020)

Jakedaawg said:


> I am not the OP...with that said:  what are the brand names of the Swiss or other acceptable brands.  I assume starrett, brown and sharp and inter rapid.  But it appears there are other acceptable brands?




Etalon and Tesa are the most common Swiss brands.  Brown and Sharpe is now part of Tesa, so some B & S tools are Swiss made
as well.  All are good choices.  Mitutoyo makes good tools as well.


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## mikey (Dec 8, 2020)

Jakedaawg said:


> I am not the OP...with that said:  what are the brand names of the Swiss or other acceptable brands.  I assume starrett, brown and sharp and inter rapid.  But it appears there are other acceptable brands?



Compac, Tesa, Brown & Sharpe, Etalon and Interapid are the best Swiss brands. All made by Hexagon.


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## C-Bag (Dec 8, 2020)

One that’s not mentioned a lot and was my main mic for 30yrs was Scherr Tumico, US made with some of their line German made.


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## DavidR8 (Dec 9, 2020)

I second @mikey counsel to be patient. 
I wanted a specific model Interapid tenths test indicator and it took a while to find one. When I did I lucked into one in the case with all the mounting bits and bobs. It is without question my best piece of metrology gear.


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## mikey (Dec 9, 2020)

I wanted to show you an example of what a dial test indicator that has lived its life at the end of an indicator holder looks like. 




Click on the photo to enlarge it. Note the dried oil around the edges of the crystal and the oil stains on the body. Note the oil residue and chips left at the base of the needle where the bearings are located. I cannot tell how functional this indicator is but the seller says it is in "good condition", which means it must be fully functional.

Note also that the crystal is dull. You can see this better in other views in this auction. This means the indicator had oil and chips on it and the user just wiped it off, leaving the crystal dull and scratched. Compac crystals are just that; glass under tension. You need a crystal press to change the glass, which will cost you, or find some way to polish it clear. Regardless, this indicator will need a careful and thorough cleaning.

This is the kind of tool that I pass on.


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## mmcmdl (Dec 9, 2020)

I'm surprised no one has mentioned Mahr indicators . To me , they're best of class .


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