# SB9 Spindle Oil leakage



## ShagDog (Apr 14, 2021)

Recently acquired a 1942 SB 9A. It is running well. However, one of the spindle bearing (outboard) oil cups needs refilling often. I can see that the oil is leaking out both sides of the outboard bearing only. The spindle nose bearing seeps very little oil, if any.  Both bearings appear to only warm up a little, with the outboard one maybe slightly warmer.

Is this oil leakage an problem or indicative of a problem? I am reluctant to remove the spindle since the lathe is operating and cutting so well.
.


----------



## Manual Mac (Apr 15, 2021)

My ‘38 SB9 has the spindle oilers on the top.
It has felt in the oil cups, but it needs oil regularly.
and after all, it does operate on the constant loss principal.
It’s been working fine this way for 83 years.
Cheers


----------



## martik777 (Apr 15, 2021)

My 75 year old 9A uses about 2-3 drops/hour, never gets warm. Spindle re/re takes less than 20 mins

My 61 year old 9A uses 1-2 drops/hour

My last ICE car, a 2003 Accord used 1qt/week (~ 200 miles) or about 3800 drops/hour


----------



## SLK001 (Apr 15, 2021)

Oil use that high indicates a problem.

During the war years, a lot of SB lathes went from bronze bearings to segmented cast iron bearings.  I'm not sure if the 9" lathes did this also.  If they did, then your high oil consumption may be due to missing a small brass (or steel) clip (shown below).  During a rebuild or maintenance, it will often not be put back, or lost, because people don't understand its function.  This clip breaks the surface tension of the oil draining back into the sump and prevents it from building up and flowing over the edge of the bearing (and onto the floor).  

Another possibility is that the return hole is either partially or fully clogged and giving the returning oil no other place to go but on the floor.


----------



## ShagDog (Apr 15, 2021)

Thanks for the replies. 

Martik, are your older SB's  top oilers like the type described by Mac, or are they on the side like mine where they are meant to drain back into the reservoir?

SLK, I guess the only way to tell if the clips are there is to remove the spindle, right? Also, is there any harm in letting it leak oil out the sides if the clip is missing or if the drain hole is clogged? Also, where would one find such an oddly shaped clip?


----------



## SLK001 (Apr 15, 2021)

ShagDog said:


> Thanks for the replies.
> 
> Martik, are your older SB's  top oilers like the type described by Mac, or are they on the side like mine where they are meant to drain back into the reservoir?
> 
> SLK, I guess the only way to tell if the clips are there is to remove the spindle, right? Also, is there any harm in letting it leak oil out the sides if the clip is missing or if the drain hole is clogged? Also, where would one find such an oddly shaped clip?



The lathes with the top GITS oilers were completely flow-thru lubrication systems (no sumps).  The side GITS have a sump, so oil isn't used up as quickly.

As for the clip, you, a piece of wire and a pair of pliers can give you all that you need!


----------



## ShagDog (Apr 15, 2021)

Does anyone know whether the described leakage with no heating of the bearings is an indication that the spindle bearings are not getting adequate oiling? My only concern is whether it will cause problems down the road. I am hesitant to remove the spindle, only because I am of the mindset that "if ain't broke don't fix it".


----------



## craptain (Apr 15, 2021)

The oil feed should have felt wicks in them which soaks up the oil and essentially wipes the spindle. Those felts harden and wear out. I know  I need to replace mine. The answer you apparently don't want to hear is to pull the spindle and replace the felts. You will also get the opportunity to examine the bearing surfaces while it's out. The kits are available on eBay or you could make your own. For me, buying the whole kit made more sense. Now I just need to get motivated to do the job. 

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk


----------



## martik777 (Apr 15, 2021)

ShagDog said:


> Thanks for the replies.
> 
> Martik, are your older SB's  top oilers like the type described by Mac, or are they on the side like mine where they are meant to drain back into the reservoir?


On the side


----------



## ShagDog (Apr 15, 2021)

Craptain, you are right about not wanting to hear that I should pull the spindle   . Not quite ready to do so yet; but, today, I did order the rebuild book and kit (ILION), to have on hand.

By the way, I did put a dial indicator on the outboard spindle and measured the amount of lift, coming in at about .0015". I tightened down to a little over .001" The verdict is not in yet; however, it looks like after running it for about 10-15 minutes, there is not as much leakage, and the oil vat does not seem to have lost much oil. Time will tell.


----------



## Manual Mac (Apr 15, 2021)

Shag Dog, i would think if the headstock is not getting adequate oil it would get hot, not the other way around.
I also subscribe to the theory “If it ain’t Broke don’t fix it”. 
But I know nothing about the side oiler machines.
If you need to add oil to the gits & it’s leaking from the headstock bearings my guess is it’s getting enough oil.
This is just my opinion, & I am no expert.
Cheers


----------



## SLK001 (Apr 15, 2021)

Your wicks are working just fine.  This is indicated by the fact that you are losing oil.  Your problem is that the oil isn't returning to the sump.  If you don't want to take the spindle out (and I understand that), then just keep the oil level topped off and you'll be fine.


----------



## ShagDog (Apr 15, 2021)

Thanks for the responses. 

And I can now report that the left side oil port refilled itself about an 1/8" after settling which would mean the drain is working at least to some degree.  It again seems like a less leaking after I tightened the bolt slightly, as described above.

I will stop being concerned about it, because it sounds like a non-issue. I will at least have the rebuild guide to study  , and the kit for when I am ready. I will use the new felt way wipers from the kit immediately.


----------



## Surprman (Apr 17, 2021)

If the bearing is leaking oil, the felt wicks are working fine (otherwise the oil would never get up from the well to the bearing).  I have a ‘41 SBc.  I agree it is probably a missing wire.  Remove the spindle and see - maybe the wire is present in the front bearing and you can use that as a model to make a new one of the right shape/size.  If you have not already bought one, there is a SB rebuild book available on ebay (with felts etc).  Might as well replace all the felts and wicks while you are at it.

Rick


----------



## Surprman (Apr 17, 2021)

Surprman said:


> If the bearing is leaking oil, the felt wicks are working fine (otherwise the oil would never get up from the well to the bearing).  I have a ‘41 SBc.  I agree it is probably a missing wire.  Remove the spindle and see - maybe the wire is present in the front bearing and you can use that as a model to make a new one of the right shape/size.  If you have not already bought one, there is a SB rebuild book available on ebay (with felts etc).  Might as well replace all the felts and wicks while you are at it.
> 
> Rick


Haha - maybe I should have read the OP’s last post!


----------

