# Fire suppression



## DavidR8 (Nov 20, 2019)

Hi all, I'm not sure how many of you have multi-purpose shops. I do some welding and a ton more grinding  and am only now thinking about fire suppression.
What do you have for extinguishers in your shops? Where are they mounted?


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## eugene13 (Nov 20, 2019)

I have one dry chemical ex that I got from costco, it's mounted by the sink.  Fire prevention is more important then fire suppression, I take out the trash every day and never allow fire hazards to develop, sparks from welding or grinding are always directed in a safe direction, and flammable liquids are kept in a special cabinet.  A clean shop is a safe shop.


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## pontiac428 (Nov 20, 2019)

I have ABC extinguishers in every corner, and keep a fresh bucket of water nearby when I weld that doubles as a quench.  I am preparing to sheet the interior walls in my new shop, and will be putting a hardie board skin over the finished walls in the corner where the welding and grinding hot work stuff goes.  Drywall would work equally well, but the hardie is cheaper.  A fire would be devastating, especially if it hits the oxygen bottles or stoddard solvent tank (I cover the latter with a fire retardant sheet to prevent spark entry).  Stoddard is hard to light, but once it's lit it is fuel.  I also have a flammables locker.  The most important part of my fire prevention scheme is being 400' from the fire station...


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## Bob Korves (Nov 20, 2019)

The best places for fire extinguishers is near the doors.  Your first thought should be your personal safety.  When you get to the extinguisher, you can choose to grab it and fight the fire, or to get the hell out of there...


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## francist (Nov 20, 2019)

Two 5-pound dry chems, one at the bottom of the stairs to go up and out, and one by the exterior door to get straight out. Two smoke detectors, one on each side of a partial glass partition wall. My shop is in my basement. I have all-round vinyl curtains that I can magnet to the ceiling for when I weld, but I try to avoid serious grinding indoors if I can.

-frank


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## f350ca (Nov 20, 2019)

I've seriously considered installing a sprinkler system in the shops. I keep the building heated and have a water line running from the house, so its doable. Haven't thought about it for a while, but when I looked into it the sprinkler heads aren't that expensive.

Greg


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## Superburban (Nov 20, 2019)

I have over a dozen 20 LB CO2 fire extinguishers, a few smaller ones, and for backup, several dry chems.I have them located outside every door of the house, and shop. One in the kitchen, and several located strategically throughout the shop. Every year, I pick an old CO2 ext, and use it for training everybody in the house on its use, and give them all a chance to use it. then I get it tested, and refilled.


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## Nutfarmer (Nov 20, 2019)

House keeping is the most important thing to do. In the shop hot work and rags can be a problem. Fire extinguisher is every helpful. A small fire by the time the fire department arrives is a big fire. Be careful with fire sprinklers. Water damage can be worse than the fire damage. Most of house fires I have been to have been kitchen fires ,wood stoves not properly installed,or the home looks like a hoarder  lives there. One thing a lot of people forget is the outside defensable area. Keep a hundred foot area around your house clear of dry grass or other flash fuel. Here in California in the summer home are more at risk from wild fire than from a fire starting inside. I have been on strike teams sent out to protect homes.  If there are twenty or thirty homes in the fires path and only one fire engine you are going to try and save as many homes as you can. The sad truth is there are times if a house is already on fire or has dry brush or grass right up to it


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## Aaron_W (Nov 20, 2019)

I have a 5lb ABC mounted by the door, there is a second ABC and a 2-1/2 gallon pressurized "water can" that will be mounted on my welding cart when it is done. I do all welding outside the shop, so I like the extinguishers to follow the welder. 

I have a basement shop so I added a smoke detector in a location under the living room / dining room with the hope that it might be heard up stairs.

Since there is only one exit from the shop I'm thinking about mounting a second extinguisher near the back just in case, and now that they have "smart detectors" I'm looking at adding another smoke detector that will send an alarm to my phone. 


I try to be really good about shop housekeeping, at least in regards to combustibles / flammables storage and disposal. When I'm doing something that could potentially leave hot stuff hidden away, I make a point to hang out for a bit in the shop to hopefully catch anything that got where it shouldn't have got. I covered over the crummy (and more combustible) particle board wall covering with 5/8 sheet rock. Not only more appealing to look at, but also more fire resistant. Flammable liquids cabinets are very expensive, so I haven't done that, but I do keep them stored in in one area where they don't get exposed to potential ignition sources and it would be obvious if they were leaking. 

In addition to the fire extinguishers there is the fire engine in the driveway... what doesn't everyone keep a fire engine by their shop?


As a retired firefighter, a fire would not only be devastating, but also professionally embarrassing.




eugene13 said:


> Fire prevention is more important then fire suppression,



Absolutely, and it is a boring chore that seems an utter waste of time and money when it works (and no fires occur).


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## Boswell (Nov 20, 2019)

I am getting ready to rework some of my shop and want to use 3/4 Plywood as the wall covering. Any suggestions on how to make it more fire-retardant?  Is there a fire retardant paint that can be used?


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## matthewsx (Nov 20, 2019)

Boswell said:


> I am getting ready to rework some of my shop and want to use 3/4 Plywood as the wall covering. Any suggestions on how to make it more fire-retardant?  Is there a fire retardant paint that can be used?


 Borax


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## Ken from ontario (Nov 20, 2019)

Other than the two fire extinguishers , I have 4 fire retardant blankets hanging from the ceiling like 4 walls, around my welding table so when I weld or grind/cut, no sparks get out of the area, I never liked those orange welding screens and do not think they are as functional as the full length blankets.


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## Aaron_W (Nov 20, 2019)

Boswell said:


> I am getting ready to rework some of my shop and want to use 3/4 Plywood as the wall covering. Any suggestions on how to make it more fire-retardant?  Is there a fire retardant paint that can be used?



5/8" sheet rock, hardie board?   

3/4" plywood in good condition takes some effort to get burning, the biggest issue is that unlike sheet rock, hardieboard etc in a fire the plywood will contribute to the fire load where the "rock" boards won't.

There are some paint on fire retardants but I don't have any experience with them.

Intumescent paint


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## Cadillac (Nov 21, 2019)

Boswell said:


> I am getting ready to rework some of my shop and want to use 3/4 Plywood as the wall covering. Any suggestions on how to make it more fire-retardant?  Is there a fire retardant paint that can be used?


Yes there is unfortunately I don’t have a recommendation but I do know you can get at the big box stores. I had just seen some at menards but can’t remember the name sorry


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## dbq49 (Nov 21, 2019)

It comes to mind that the cement board that is used for under layment for tiles would be great.  They can be cut with utility knives, 4 1/2" diamond blade mounted on a battery saw or a right angel grinder.  Mount with screws and paint if you want.  It will not burn.


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## ELHEAD (Nov 22, 2019)

Is there a fire retardant paint that can be used?

Yes! Go to a paint store, ( as S&W, Pittsburgh, Eric.) Don't waste your time w/big-box.
Dave


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## cjtoombs (Nov 22, 2019)

One of the recurring themes above is housekeeping, which I wholeheartedly agree with.  My neighbor years ago nearly burned his shop down because he had done a bunch of woodworking and then decided to weld near the shavings pile.  I tend to like to do grinding, oxyfuel and plasma cutting outside if I can, the dust bothers me.  I general wet down any vegetation (it's always dry here) before I start to prevent setting the yard on fire.


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## gr8legs (Nov 22, 2019)

I like a combination of tidiness and CO2 extinguishers. At least 10 pounders.

I put the extinguishers on the wall by the door *outside *the shop. In a pinch I can get out safely, close the door and evaluate the situation - then re-enter if it seems prudent or call 911 if not. Hasn't come to that yet. No shop fires at all, yet. Operative word: 'yet'.

Also, if welding or cutting I do it early and wait at least 30 minutes before leaving in case some ember decides to cause trouble.

Stu


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## MontanaLon (Nov 22, 2019)

Dry chemical is very abrasive so if you have to use one in the shop you will need to tear everything down to clean it out. It gets everywhere and inside everything. CO2 extinguishers are good and leave no residue. 

I have a friend who has a shop who has 2 big CO2 tanks plumbed to a system of pipes that go throughout the ceiling of the shop much like sprinklers. He has had a fire and when he got outside the door he popped the tanks open and called 911. We are out in the sticks so it takes the fire dept a little while to get there. I was one of the guys on the fire truck. Usually a fire call where he is would be a fully involved fire by the time we got there. When we arrived there was fire but it was in the smoldering stage and we were able to knock it down with a 5 gallon water extinguisher. We had to tear out some walls to make sure the fire wasn't in there waiting for us to leave but it did very little damage compared to what we would expect to see.

Be careful with chips from the bandsaw. You cut steel and aluminum and when the steel rusts you have thermite. If it gets burning it causes serious problems. The band saw makes chips fine enough to allow the thermite reaction to happen.


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## zuhnc (Dec 15, 2019)

I use 4x8x1/2" concrete backer board for the first 4' on the walls.  1/2" drywall above that.  I have covered the floor with the same material (20x24 shop), and put a skim coat of thin-set mortar on it.  Levels the floor, and fills in the joints.  Wooden framed, with steel siding.  6" insulation in walls.  If I damage the floor, a little bit of thin-set repairs the damage.    zuhnc


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## rwm (Dec 15, 2019)

I never thought about this but I should probably cut the hose on the argon tank and turn it on as I run out the door!
Robert


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## Tim9 (Dec 18, 2019)

f350ca said:


> I've seriously considered installing a sprinkler system in the shops. I keep the building heated and have a water line running from the house, so its doable. Haven't thought about it for a while, but when I looked into it the sprinkler heads aren't that expensive.
> 
> Greg


Yes...google “ home sprinkler systems “
I too looked at them....purchased a single head...and it’s on my list. In the mean time, I installed a couple of smoke detectors which tie into my alarm. At least that should help with smoldering weld debris.
Totally agree with CO2. Dry chemical destroys stuff. It works...but is super messy. When I had my auto repair we kept couple of the CO2 extinguishers. They wouldn’t mess up the under hood engine compartments after minor gasoline fires. And when working on cars all day long...you’re going to have an engine fire at some point. 
  Still keep one nearby in the shop.


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## Aaron_W (Dec 18, 2019)

Tim9 said:


> Yes...google “ home sprinkler systems “
> I too looked at them....purchased a single head...and it’s on my list. In the mean time, I installed a couple of smoke detectors which tie into my alarm. At least that should help with smoldering weld debris.
> Totally agree with CO2. Dry chemical destroys stuff. It works...but is super messy. When I had my auto repair we kept couple of the CO2 extinguishers. They wouldn’t mess up the under hood engine compartments after minor gasoline fires. And when working on cars all day long...you’re going to have an engine fire at some point.
> Still keep one nearby in the shop.




Just keep in mind CO2 has little effect on class A fires (wood, paper etc). As soon as the CO2 disperses if there is still heat left in the material it can reignite. We have demonstrated this for people during extinguisher training using a CO2 on piles of leaves or waste paper basket. Dry chem absolutely is messy, you will spend days if not weeks cleaning your shop afterwards, but the powder forms a crust on burning material smothering the fire and giving it a longer term effectiveness.

Not commonly a problem in home shops, but be aware that most "C" (electrical) extinguishers are not certified as safe to use on electricity greater than 600v. Just in case your pole transformer outside catches fire, best not to engage with that.


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