# Is The Shop Good Enough?



## Janderso

I’m sure many of you envy someone‘s shop. It’s bigger and has better machine tools.
The home is nicer in a better part of town.
My wife and I settled for a home in a suburb in Chico Ca. It’s a growing College town. We have a housing shortage so prices are high.
Land is very high.
The home we lost in 2018 was on an acre in the foothills. We miss the space but don’t miss being evacuated for fire drills.
I retire in two years. My wife is a retired educator.
We have struggled with the decision to invest more money n this house to make it more comfortable to our needs.
You know, tear out the bathroom in the master bath and install a walk in shower with new sinks, toilet, cabinetry.
The kitchen has good appliances but needs stone counters and a new sink.
The house needs to be painted. We put on a new roof.
I love my shop. The more I make it my own, I don’t want to start over. I have some really nice used machine tools.
We have invested in professional Landscaping and the grandkids love the pool.
We are debt free. If we move we would only do it to upgrade, which means more money.
I kind of like putting a big hunk of money in savings every month.
Is it good enough? I’m beginning to think so.
Thanks for listening.


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## Dhal22

Decisions decisions........


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## benmychree

You've answered your own question, Jeff ---


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## NortonDommi

End of the day are you comfortable? Does your walls and roof keep out wind and water? Are you warm in Winter?  Do you eat well every day? Do you have some nice toys to play with so you don't get bored?  If you can say yes to these things count your blessings and enjoy life.


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## Winegrower

In these weird times, with all the stress created by politics, virus, unemployment and social isolation, not adding financial worries seems like an extremely wise path.


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## DavidR8

I believe you and your beloved are well sorted. 
Time to enjoy what you’ve worked so long to accomplish. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## hman

Janderso said:


> We have struggled with the decision to invest more money n this house to make it more comfortable to our needs.


Jeff - it really sounds like "you've got it made," especially being debt free.  The good news for the future is that, having decided not to move again, you don't have to be worried that your proposed home improvements will pay off when you sell the house.  You and your wife are doing it for your own comfort - investing in yourselves, as it were.  That's a nice place to be.


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## Janderso

I am comforted by your comments.
Life will throw you a curve when you were expecting a knuckle ball


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## Dhal22

Janderso said:


> I am comforted by your comments.
> Life will throw you a curve when you were expecting a knuckle ball



Or a change up, or a fastball, or a slider, or an eephus pitch...........................................  It's a wonderful life, just handle the pitches as best you can.


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## projectnut

I learned long ago that there's always someone who has something bigger, newer, fancier, and with more space.  The key to me is live within your means, and be happy with what you have.  My wife and I have lamented from time to time that we didn't buy some acreage out in the boonies and build a big house with a detached shop and garage for the toys.  Then we quickly come to our senses and realize that we're luckier than most to be able to live where we do and do the things we like.  Like you we still sometimes dream, but then realize that if we really did want to do anything more than dream we would be doing it.

There are lots of guys around here that have bigger shops with bigger and newer machinery.  They don't seem to be any better machinists for it, and certainly don't seem to be any happier.  There's an old saying "He who dies with the most toys wins".  I'm not sure I subscribe to that theory.  I'm more inclined to believe "He who has the most fun with those machines is the winner".

As for the house, we built our current one 33 years ago thinking it would be  all we'd ever need.  As time goes on "needs" and interests change.  I never considered a machine shop at the time.  I had all the machining I could handle where I worked, and we had plenty of other projects and interests to keep us busy for the limited time we had off the job.  We've done most of the things that were on our "bucket list", long before anyone thought of calling it a bucket list.  Being retired and spending more time at home we went through a small remodeling phase a couple years ago.  Mainly a new kitchen, dinette, and master bath.  We're happy the way it turned out and will probably not need any more "improvements" for several more years.

Rising prices are something you'll probably never get used to.  Across the board most things have doubled, tripled, or more since we bought our first of anything.  As a kid my parents first house cost around $5,000.00.  Today you can't buy a cheap car for that price.  The "average" price for a new home around here today is in the $400,000.00 range.  Speaking of cars, the first new one I bought was less than $2,500.00.  I was at the Ford dealer yesterday getting some work done on my truck and see the New Expeditions go for over $75,000.00 and the Lincoln Navigators are over $95,000.00. 

Bottom line is at some point you have to be happy with what you have.  Spend within your means, and have enough of a cushion that if something does go wrong you won't be on the street wondering what happened.  You've already survived more than most people will ever want to go through.  Enjoy what you have and learn from what you went through.


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## Janderso

Projectnut, you bring up some good points.
The more I think about it, I really like the idea of living within our means especially as we approach retirement. I've always heard, you want to be debt free when you retire. These days, that's not an easy thing to accomplish. With home prices like you mentioned, college for the kids, property taxes, the ever increasing cost of health care etc.
The home we have now is in a very quiet neighborhood. it's well built and well insulated. Built in 2000 and I have a 200 amp service!!. The neighbors stick to themselves for the most part. The landscaping can be mowed, trimmed, blown and cleaned up without taking up the whole day. I have a Horror Freight within two miles, close to downtown, good restaurants, bars, Lowes-Home depot, shopping etc. We have our travel trailer parked at a storage place about 5 miles away for $65 a month.
Why would I want to dig into hard earned savings to pay for a larger piece of property with a home and shop space that will need updating for sure. ( = more money)
To buy a new home with a one acre lot in our area is close to a cool million. Of course the home is a custom. Too big with high ceilings, huge kitchen, four bathrooms etc. no pool yet.
Why does a couple need four bathrooms?
We would have to leave California if we wanted to upgrade space wise if we wanted it to be in our budget. Heck, you can buy 5 acres in the middle of nowhere for a very reasonable price. We like living close to our grandchildren, my mother and our kids.
I started this thread to hear myself think. It's good therapy to discuss this with my friends.

I think I'm about ready to say, sweetie, let's get the kitchen done then look into that master bath.  Let's stay a while.


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## Janderso

Dhal22 said:


> or an eephus pitch


?


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## Papa Charlie

Janderso,
I can understand the questioning of should I or shouldn't I. If for no other reason to hear ourselves out loud and confirm our previous decisions. It is always nice to dream of that huge shop with your RV in one bay, machine shop in another and wood working shop in still another. But how often would we actually use all that space.

As I approach retirement in a couple of years, we have to make these decisions as well. We don't have a home at this stage and will have to buy something that will be our forever home. It is just the two of us and we don't have kids so no grand kids as well. I want a shop, all my tools have sat in storage far too long after we lost everything from 2008. Have worked hard to build up a nest egg since, living on our boat to keep expenses down and be close to Boeing and work.

I find myself looking at homes that are on property with shops and dream of them, then run the numbers against my retirement budget and question the logic. Most of the existing houses in the rural areas we want to be in would require a huge investment to bring up to date. We are contemplating buying some property and instead of a custom home, thinking about a manufactured and a metal shop. We are constantly pulled between what we want, what we need and what we can afford. It is a juggling act for sure. One thing I would like to be able to do is to do small jobs in the shop to help with finances. So the shop is not only a play area for me but a potential income. Nice to think about but is it practicable or cost effective.

The answer, no idea, still working on it. But it is good that we ask ourselves these questions.


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## projectnut

As one of the guys I used to work with always said.  "At this stage of my life I can afford anything I want!  Fortunately I don't want anything"


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## HarryJM

Debit free retirement was our goal and we made it. This November will be the second anniversary of my retirement and my wife had to quite her nursing career about three years prior to my retirement due to health issues. I keep working until she was 65 and retired at age of 71.

We both have a monthly guilt free nominal allowance that works for use. Though of moving several times over the past 20+ years and just did not want a bigger house/mortgage. So we are both quite pleased with our decision and grateful that things worked out as planned for use.

If its not broke then don't fix it so site back and enjoy retirement!


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## projectnut

I got lucky when it came to retirement.  First off there were no kids, so those expenses never happened.  Not spending the money was a positive, but no kids could turn into a negative some years down the road.  Both the wife and I had good jobs and decided we would retire at 55.  As it turned out she did retire at 55, but spent some long hours and long days taking care of her parents before they passed away.  As for me when 55 came I really wasn't ready to go.  

There were rumors of buyouts down the road so we talked it over and decided I should "stay until they paid me to leave".  It took another 2 years before we were presented with a buyout.  The choices were 1.  Stay with the company in my current capacity and hope I didn't get laid off ( a layoff would negate any previous buyout offer).  2.  Take a position at another facility where the Engineering Manager "hated people from corporate" and hope I could survive.  3.  Take the money and run.

It took almost 3 seconds to make my decision.  Needless to say I took the money and ran. The monetary offer was great, that and any accumulated pension (accumulated before the advent of 401 K's) could be taken as a lump sum.  In addition we could take control of our own 401K and invest as we saw fit. The only downside was that I had to earn (either from new employment or investments) enough to make it from age 57 to 62 when Social Security became available.

Looking back leaving at that moment was the right thing to do.  It wasn't long after that the company decided to move it's headquarters to Chicago.  The people that stayed had the choice of going to Chicago or being terminated with minimal severance.  About 4 years after the HQ functions moved the company was sold and the new owners decided to close the remaining production facility permanently.  I've been "retired" 14 years now and haven't once been bored because of a lack of things to do.  Working there was a great experience, and I enjoyed every minute of it.


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## BGHansen

Janderso said:


> ?


Didn't google it, from memory of B&W baseball films on ESPN.  There was a major league pitcher who throw a high lob to home plate.  Little energy in the ball, so tough to knock it out of the park.  Ted Williams did in an All Star game stepped toward the mound to get a little more into the swing.  It never caught on, probably because hitters decided knocking it into the gap to 2 bases was good enough.


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## pontiac428

Don't make the mistake of thinking that moving out of California will save you money on the cost of a house.  No, sir.  Lots of areas are expensive these days if for no other reason than being places that are nice to live.  I live in the Seattle area, outside of the city but within the public transportation footprint.  My house is 90 years old, 600 square feet, with a damp basement (I built the shop, so that's not factored in), and I am embarrassed by my house's high appraisal value.  But that's not my comment.  I think you should remodel and update the things about your current place that you want to change.  A set of granite(like) countertops probably wouldn't cost more than the cost of rental vans and trailers to move to a new location.  Bring your house up to your standard, and if you still decide to leave you can recoup some of those expenditures.  Seems better to me than just walking away.


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## mickri

When I retired years ago for health reasons I moved onto my sailboat and my son moved into what we called the family home.  I got rid of everything that wouldn't fit on the boat except for my car.  After a couple of years the car went to.  I was living on the boat down in Mexico.  Life was good and the living was easy.  $325 per month covered all of my living expenses.

Even when I brought the boat back up to San Diego I still didn't get a car.  Everything I really needed was within walking distance.  Or accessible on the excellent public transit system in San Diego.  During this time period I realized that you really don't need that much to be happy.  That true happiness comes from an inner peace.  Not from what you have.

When my mom needed a place to live I moved off the boat and bought a comfortable home on 5 acres in the foothills east of Fresno. Debt free.  Now I have acquired a house and garage full of stuff.  All my stuff gives me something to do.  Sometimes too much.  Yet I could easily live without any of it.  Who knows how long my mom will be with me.  She turned 102 this month.  After she passes I will most likely downsize again.  And probably move closer to my daughter.  That may not be possible.  As Jeff said home prices have skyrocketed in most of California over the last several years.

Still have the boat.  It is in Morro Bay.  Close to my daughter and her family in Cambria.  When the time comes if I can't find a place to live debt free somewhere close to them I will use the boat as my beach house and stay where I am. 

One of our friends in Morro Bay suggested to my mom once when talking about moving that we could always rent.  My mom's response was classic.  We'd rather live in a tent on our own land then rent.  If I am able to move I will downsize to a small 1 bedroom single wide manufactured home with a 2 to 3 car garage for a shop.  There are a couple of areas where I think that I could do this and still stay debt free.

Life is still good and the living is still easy.


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## Janderso

mickri said:


> When I retired years ago for health reasons I moved onto my sailboat and my son moved into what we called the family home.  I got rid of everything that wouldn't fit on the boat except for my car.  After a couple of years the car went to.  I was living on the boat down in Mexico.  Life was good and the living was easy.  $325 per month covered all of my living expenses.
> 
> Even when I brought the boat back up to San Diego I still didn't get a car.  Everything I really needed was within walking distance.  Or accessible on the excellent public transit system in San Diego.  During this time period I realized that you really don't need that much to be happy.  That true happiness comes from an inner peace.  Not from what you have.
> 
> When my mom needed a place to live I moved off the boat and bought a comfortable home on 5 acres in the foothills east of Fresno. Debt free.  Now I have acquired a house and garage full of stuff.  All my stuff gives me something to do.  Sometimes too much.  Yet I could easily live without any of it.  Who knows how long my mom will be with me.  She turned 102 this month.  After she passes I will most likely downsize again.  And probably move closer to my daughter.  That may not be possible.  As Jeff said home prices have skyrocketed in most of California over the last several years.
> 
> Still have the boat.  It is in Morro Bay.  Close to my daughter and her family in Cambria.  When the time comes if I can't find a place to live debt free somewhere close to them I will use the boat as my beach house and stay where I am.
> 
> One of our friends in Morro Bay suggested to my mom once when talking about moving that we could always rent.  My mom's response was classic.  We'd rather live in a tent on our own land then rent.  If I am able to move I will downsize to a small 1 bedroom single wide manufactured home with a 2 to 3 car garage for a shop.  There are a couple of areas where I think that I could do this and still stay debt free.
> 
> Life is still good and the living is still easy.


San Diego, Morro Bay, Cambria. Talk about expensive!!
I love San Diego. Unfortunately so does everyone else. 
November 9th 2018, my wife and I had my 2017 F-150 and the clothes on our backs. Yes it was terrifying but in some ways, there was a sense of freedom. I get it.
Minimalism has merit.


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## Janderso

pontiac428 said:


> Don't make the mistake of thinking that moving out of California will save you money on the cost of a house.  No, sir.  Lots of areas are expensive these days if for no other reason than being places that are nice to live.  I live in the Seattle area, outside of the city but within the public transportation footprint.  My house is 90 years old, 600 square feet, with a damp basement (I built the shop, so that's not factored in), and I am embarrassed by my house's high appraisal value.  But that's not my comment.  I think you should remodel and update the things about your current place that you want to change.  A set of granite(like) countertops probably wouldn't cost more than the cost of rental vans and trailers to move to a new location.  Bring your house up to your standard, and if you still decide to leave you can recoup some of those expenditures.  Seems better to me than just walking away.


Bremerton, I really like it there. We have friends in Port Orchard.
Visiting a couple years ago on July 4th was memorable. In Washington you can buy really cool fireworks.
A Pyromaniac like me was like a kid in a candy store. They sell all the good stuff out at the reservation.

When the sun is out, it's one of the most beautiful spots on earth looking over the Sound.


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## Papa Charlie

I am right with the thinking of most here. I am almost debt free. I owe a small amount on my boat and that will be sold for the down on the retirement home. No way around making payments on a home and I will never rent (God Willing!). Sadly, I will take on a mortgage when I retire, but that isn't all bad. If all goes as planned, what I end up with and what it costs me will be two different things, since I will be the overseeing as contractor on the project.

I really don't need a lot. Living on the boat for the last 10 years I have found that out. But I still have my hobbies which seem to use up a sizeable amount of money, which is my competition shooting and of course my tools. Beyond that I really don't have any other interests that redirect my funds. 

If I had a home, and was happy with the area and general home itself, I would not be contemplating moving. Much cheaper to update than to buy and move which will result in changes to that home as well.


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## Papa Charlie

Janderso said:


> Bremerton, I really like it there. We have friends in Port Orchard.
> Visiting a couple years ago on July 4th was memorable. In Washington you can buy really cool fireworks.
> A Pyromaniac like me was like a kid in a candy store. They sell all the good stuff out at the reservation.
> 
> When the sun is out, it's one of the most beautiful spots on earth looking over the Sound.



Bremerton is getting very expensive. If I were to stay in Washington, I would look at Sequim, WA. Farther away from everyone. But this state is tax happy and getting worse. I could not afford to stay here after retirement. My money will go farther in Oregon than here. It is as bad if not worse than when we lived in Antioch, CA.


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## Janderso

Papa Charlie said:


> My money will go farther in Oregon than here


We have friends in Medford. I really like the Jacksonville area. Beautiful. It's kind of a tourist area though.


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## tjb

Janderso said:


> Thanks for listening.


Thanks for sharing.  Things we all need to reflect on from time to time.

Blessings.


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## Papa Charlie

Janderso said:


> We have friends in Medford. I really like the Jacksonville area. Beautiful. It's kind of a tourist area though.



I grew up in Tillamook on the coast will probably end up in Tillamook County. But we have looked extensively in the Medford and Grants Pass areas. If I had to make a choice between the two, I would pick Grants Pass area. Nicer area, more wooded and prices are a little bit better. You can still buy some pretty good pieces of property in the area within 20 minutes of town or less. If it were me I would go to the West of I-5 instead of East. Getting the cooling air from the coast at night. Not a lot but enough that can at times make a difference. Temperatures are similar to your area now. But I don't deal well with hot weather and the older I get the less I do.

Oregon has some pretty favorable tax laws for retirees. The difference for me between Washington (very similar to CA) and Oregon is about 10 years on my retirement money. I am 64 now and don't plan to retire until 66 and won't take SS until 67 based on my calculations which prolongs things the farthest. Even with planning on the same income I have now (income less the money I am putting into my 401 and other investments), that means I will be able to maintain that spending with escalation well into my 90's. Of course assuming I make it there.

Now if you want to get out of the I-5 corridor then there are other options which include the coast or inland like Klamath Falls up to Bend. For the coast, the largest city is Coos Bay/North Bend. Very nice area. But beyond that you get into very small towns that often look very run down, especially since the lumber business died. Without the lumber, there is little to sustain the townships unless it is tourism and that has its own problems like Lincoln City. I hated it back in te 60's and 70's. Hasn't gotten any better.


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## mickri

San Diego and Morro Bay weren't expensive living on my boat out on a mooring. $125 and $175 per month.  Cambria is another story.  My daughter married into a ranching family and lives 3 to 4 miles out of town on the ranch.  I have no idea how much land the family owns or how many head of cattle my son-in-law runs.  He takes very good care of my daughter and grandkids.

Be careful about counting on your 401K to support you in retirement.  I thought that I was pretty well set.  Then the crash of 2009 occurred and I lost almost 70% of my life savings.  Not working I had no way to replace that money and had to pull money out to live.  The only thing that saved me was we still had the family home in San Clemente.  That is the only reason why I am debt free today and am able to care for my elderly mother.


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## BGHansen

Hoping my wife thinks of me as "her shop"; I'm pretty sure she's not looking for a bigger, younger or better equipped shop.  Been married 29 years, and still going strong.  I probably run across gals every day who could be considered better looking than my spouse, but I don't care.  I'm happy with the one I have not looking for an upgrade or any changes.

I think of my shop much in the same tone.  Sure, would be nice to have a hoist if I wanted to wrench on a car.  Sure, would be nice to have a Haas VF2 VMC instead of my Tormach 1100 and Bridgeport CNC.  Sure, would be nice to have a little more space.  But I'm grown to be very comfortable with the shop I have.  Maybe looking for a minor upgrade here or there, but continually comment to my wife, "You know, I really like the way our shop is coming together".

We're spoiled and know it.  We've both had very good jobs for many years and haven't done anything too stupid with our money.  Got our daughter through law school a couple of years ago, son is about finished with a computer engineering degree.  The house has been paid off for 8 years, haven't had a car payment in 20 years.  Good to be us at this point.  We got there by not buying too many what could be called frivolous things.  I remember my wife being soo ****** at me when she opened up Christmas gifts of a 5-carat tennis bracelet, 1-carat solitaire necklace and 1-carat stud earrings.  She didn't appear mad when she opened the ice up in front of her sister and sister-in-law.  But I heard about it when we got home.  She wanted a Case 580 backhoe to develop our property.  Yeah, she does have a sister, but they couldn't be more different, I got the pick of the litter.

Bruce


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## projectnut

BGHansen said:


> Hoping my wife thinks of me as "her shop"; I'm pretty sure she's not looking for a bigger, younger or better equipped shop.  Been married 29 years, and still going strong.  I probably run across gals every day who could be considered better looking than my spouse, but I don't care.  I'm happy with the one I have not looking for an upgrade or any changes.
> 
> I think of my shop in the same tone.  Sure, would be nice to have a hoist if I wanted to wrench on a car.  Sure, would be nice to have a Haas VF2 VMC instead of my Tormach 1100 and Bridgeport CNC.  Sure, would be nice to have a little more space.  But I'm grown to be very comfortable with the shop I have.  Maybe looking for a minor upgrade here or there, but continually comment to my wife, "You know, I really like the way our shop is coming together".
> 
> We're spoiled and know it.  We've both had very good jobs for many years and haven't done anything too stupid with our money.  Got our daughter through law school a couple of years ago, son is about finished with a computer engineering degree.  The house has been paid off for 8 years, *haven't had a car payment in 20 years. * Good to be us at this point.  We got there by not buying too many what could be called frivolous things.  I remember my wife being soo ****** at me when she opened up Christmas gifts of a 5-carat tennis bracelet, 1-carat solitaire necklace and 1-carat stud earrings.  She didn't appear mad when she opened the ice up in front of her sister and sister-in-law.  But I heard about it when we got home.  She wanted a Case 580 backhoe to develop our property.  Yeah, she does have a sister, but they couldn't be more different, I got the pick of the litter.
> 
> Bruce



Only 1 time did I ever buy a vehicle on time.  It was a 1978 Ford Bronco.  At the time I was selling my repair shop and my daily driver was a 1977 Ford F150 full time 4 wheel drive.  I loved the truck, but at 11 mpg it was expensive to drive.  My accountant suggested I buy another vehicle on time to minimize monthly expenses, sell the other truck with the business and use the proceeds to pay off the new truck.  It took a few months to work out the details as to what the buyer was interested in.  When we finally settled the deal I decided that rather than pay off the new truck I would use the money for some home improvements and new furniture.

All seemed well and I just kept sending in the monthly payments.  When the thing was finally paid off I got a final statement from the bank.  That's when I realized that all the time I'd spent negotiating the price of the new truck was for naught.  I could have paid list price cash and spent less money.  The interest on the loan had more than negated the discount I'd negotiated wit the dealer.  Lesson learned.  I've never bought a vehicle on time since then.  I just put an amount that would be equal to the monthly payment in the bank each month and pay cash when it's time for a new vehicle.


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## Janderso

Total of payments over the term is a scary number.


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## Mini Cooper S

I'm in a very similar situation, I have a very complete machine shop in my walk out basement, a 2 1/2 car garage with a lift to work on our British and race cars,  but would love to have a shop building.  I have plenty of land to build it, but always ask myself "What's the up side?".  More room, yes but I have enough room now.  Wouldn't have to go up and down the stairs and through the kitchen going back and forth between the garage and basement shop, but it's good exercise.  Oh yeah, one other thing,  I don't have to go outside to get to the shop, you know like when it's -10 Deg. out or when it's raining or snowing.  

I'm settled in and like it just fine thank you.

Richard


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## Janderso

Mini Cooper S said:


> I'm in a very similar situation, I have a very complete machine shop in my walk out basement, a 2 1/2 car garage with a lift to work on our British and race cars,  but would love to have a shop building.  I have plenty of land to build it, but always ask myself "What's the up side?".  More room, yes but I have enough room now.  Wouldn't have to go up and down the stairs and through the kitchen going back and forth between the garage and basement shop, but it's good exercise.  Oh yeah, one other thing,  I don't have to go outside to get to the shop, you know like when it's -10 Deg. out or when it's raining or snowing.
> 
> I'm settled in and like it just fine thank you.
> 
> Richard


I think it's human nature to improve your situation. It all comes down to money also. It is a limited supply. We make these decisions with our eyes open hopefully.
Sounds like you are set as well.
Cheers


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## Janderso

When I got home from work last night, I shared my thread and your comments with my wife.
When I got home tonight, my wife, Glenda is out with the girls.
I was surprised to see samples of stone and tile for the kitchen remodel on the counter.
I guess she was waiting for my/your approval.
Bravo.


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## matthewsx

When I saw the title of you thread I wanted to just reply

Yes

But I was on my way out the door for work and figured I'd catch up with it later. This is really timely for me now as we find ourselves in an odd if not fortunate position. Years ago I shared with my wife that I couldn't take living in rural northern Michigan for the rest of my life for a whole bunch of reasons. I'm a California boy and she wanted me to earn a good living after being freelance and self employed for the past 15 years so I set my sights on getting back out here where the weather is nice and good paying tech jobs are plentiful.

We were able to make that happen, but Covid came along and messed up our plans of going back and forth between Michigan and California. We have one large house back there and a small one here, both a short walk to the beach 
Now we need to figure out what to do, she wants to stay there but my job is here and so is my 90-year-old mom. 

We are on track to retire pretty much debt free, I do have some I'm working on paying down but both houses have way more equity than mortgage and they're both in great locations. One thing that threw us for a loop is after she got laid off from her job we had to start paying out of pocket for health insurance at $1800/mo. I now have insurance through my employer for a lot less but we know that could always change so we keep the other policy going at a minimum just in case. She's closer to Medicare age than I am and I've got 10 years to go if things don't change.

I do like my work and have gotten back to a regular office type position that I should be able to do for 20 more years as long as my mind holds out. Right now we're talking about fixing this place up a little (already did a ton of work on the Michigan house). But, if the healthcare thing was ever worked out in this country we could sell both places and semi-retire somewhere that was only a little farther from the beach.

The pandemic has certainly helped a lot of people to think about what's really important to them, I know it has for me. 

John


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## Dhal22

Janderso said:


> ?



An *eephus pitch* (also spelled *ephus*) in baseball is a very low-speed junk pitch.[1] The delivery from the pitcher has very low velocity and usually catches the hitter off-guard.


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## Janderso

I have to admit, now that I have voiced my opinions, concerns, uncertainty and confusion over our living conditions, my wife and I have found a sense of freedom.
The joint decision to stay a while has come with a sense of direction and freedom.
I didn’t think I was ready to make this decision. Once I voiced my desire to stay a while, my wife Glenda embraced the decision.
Thank you for your heart felt comments and opinions.
Jeff and Glenda


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## Papa Charlie

Uncertainty can be very unsettling. My wife and I both are going through that now as we don't know exactly where we will end up in retirement. Since we are living on the boat (I know I say that all too much), we have no roots so we feel like we are transients. 
I will be happy when we find a piece of property. Even if it is just land, we know where we will be. That, especially for the wife, will help the situation a lot.
Glad that you guys made your decision, it didn't sound like you really wanted to leave your current home. You have the shop, pool, friends and family all there. Moving would disrupt all of that and disconnect you from many of those you hold close.


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## Janderso

Charlie,
I can relate, at one time my wife wanted to sell our Paradise home when I retired. Buy a motor home and travel around the country.
I said, let's compromise. let's buy a travel trailer and take trips then come HOME.
How do you sell and travel? I have to have a place for my stuff. Besides, traveling gets old.


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## Papa Charlie

Janderso said:


> Charlie,
> I can relate, at one time my wife wanted to sell our Paradise home when I retired. Buy a motor home and travel around the country.
> I said, let's compromise. let's buy a travel trailer and take trips then come HOME.
> How do you sell and travel? I have to have a place for my stuff. Besides, traveling gets old.



I hear you. Have had several friends that did that exact thing. From what they told me, it got very old but as they had sold everything, they had no place to go. Some were going to use the travel to find new homes somewhere in the country. Only one I know of did, the rest ended up missing friends and family (not necessarily in that order) and ended up back in the same place they started from, but had to settle for less as prices had gone up.


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## Janderso

Exactly, besides, she could never leave her grand kids for very long.


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## projectnut

Papa Charlie said:


> I hear you. Have had several friends that did that exact thing. From what they told me, it got very old but as they had sold everything, they had no place to go. Some were going to use the travel to find new homes somewhere in the country. Only one I know of did, the rest ended up missing friends and family (not necessarily in that order) and ended up back in the same place they started from, but had to settle for less as prices had gone up.



Like many others I have to have a home base.  We love to travel, and on occasion have been gone as long as 4 months.  Near the end we both get tired of being on the road, and are looking forward to getting home.  Our last long trip was last summer to Alaska.  We started in late June and got back home early in September.  We passed on going south this winter so we could catch up on all the things we let slide while we were gone.  As it turned out we still haven.t done more than a couple days "camping" this summer.  We're currently packing for a 2 week trip to the UP of Michigan.  If all goes as planned we'll leave early tomorrow morning.

Traveling is a good thing, but to me it has to be a predefined time period and destination.  I can't just go wander around for weeks or months on end.  During my working years I spent literally months at a time on the road.  If I recall correctly the longest stint was 260 days in a single year.  It did get old, but at least I felt as though I was accomplishing something.  Either  building an entire new production facility, remodeling one from the ground up, or installing new production lines.  

It was a good life and paid well.  What I can't believe is that my wife encouraged me to do it.  Come to think of it she always mentioned that "uncle Bill" would come around regularly to help her out.  Bill must have been a lot of help because every time I came home she was smiling.  I'm still a little confused though.  Over the years I swear I've met all her aunts and uncles, but I've never met one named Bill.  Oh well.


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## 7milesup

^^^ I was gone for 50% of my life for 15 years. Unfortunately during the time my kids were growing up.  I kept seeing charges for Juan the pool man.  I don't think we ever had a pool.  *Shrug* ^^^
Traveling gets old real quick for me. I love my home.


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## DavidR8

projectnut said:


> Like many others I have to have a home base.  We love to travel, and on occasion have been gone as long as 4 months.  Near the end we both get tired of being on the road, and are looking forward to getting home.  Our last long trip was last summer to Alaska.  We started in late June and got back home early in September.  We passed on going south this winter so we could catch up on all the things we let slide while we were gone.  As it turned out we still haven.t done more than a couple days "camping" this summer.  We're currently packing for a 2 week trip to the UP of Michigan.  If all goes as planned we'll leave early tomorrow morning.
> 
> Traveling is a good thing, but to me it has to be a predefined time period and destination.  I can't just go wander around for weeks or months on end.  During my working years I spent literally months at a time on the road.  If I recall correctly the longest stint was 260 days in a single year.  It did get old, but at least I felt as though I was accomplishing something.  Either  building an entire new production facility, remodeling one from the ground up, or installing new production lines.
> 
> It was a good life and paid well.  What I can't believe is that my wife encouraged me to do it.  Come to think of it she always mentioned that "uncle Bill" would come around regularly to help her out.  Bill must have been a lot of help because every time I came home she was smiling.  I'm still a little confused though.  Over the years I swear I've met all her aunts and uncles, but I've never met one named Bill.  Oh well.


I can relate to this....I spent three years working on the road. The company promised trips home every five weeks but after three years it averaged out to be every 10 weeks. Longest stint was three months. I was newly married and it took a real toll.


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## 7milesup

Jeff... it seems you answered your own question by airing it out.  Family is important to you (and me) and to leave your current home just to have something bigger would not make you happy. I find that the more stuff I have and the bigger the house does not equate to happiness. 
I am retired but have an income for another 12 years.  We will (must) have everything paid off by then (i will be 67).  We sold our house last year and built a new house and shop on 22 acres.  I love it here but having a small home and no debt would have been nice. unfortunately I am not the only one making decisions.


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## Janderso

7milesup said:


> I find that the more stuff I have and the bigger the house does not equate to happiness.


Amen to that.


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## Janderso

DavidR8 said:


> ..I spent three years working on the road


I made it one year. You did better than I.
Working/living out of a suitcase sucks.


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## Papa Charlie

When I first graduated from college, I was a field service rep for Transamerica Delaval Engine and Compressor Div. They manufactured large industrial engines. The largest was a 20 Cyl diesel engine with 15" bore and 21" stroke, turning 450 rpm and producing about 15K BHP. I traveled around the world working on these engines either in power plants where they generated electricity for municipalities or onboard ships where they were used as main propulsion. Spent 90% of my time traveling. The last assignment I had as a service rep was 1.5 years in St Croix in the Virgin Islands. Great life for someone straight out of college but it gets real old.

For Boeing as a Procurement Financial Analyst I traveled to Japan 2-4 times a year for 1-3 weeks at a time which stopped about 3 years ago. At my age, traveling is not something I enjoy doing any more. I like to be home at night. Although this lock down is pushing that a bit too far.

Living on board our boat for the last 10 years feels a lot like traveling for that same period of time. It was great for the first 3-4 years but the longer we are on board, the less I enjoy it and the less we use the boat. Use to spend 2-3 weeks a year cruising the San Juan Islands. Now we go to the fuel dock once a year for our big trip. We dream a lot about having a house again and don't talk much about traveling at all. But I am sure that will change with time also.


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