# PM-45M-CNC Setup and Configuration with Mach3



## Boswell

I figured we could use a thread specific to configuration of the Precision Mathews 45M-CNC. This will make it easier for people to find from searches in the future.

I have attached my XML configuration file. I am not sure if it is directly interchangeable with other systems but likely it is with the one issue that I have the PBJ Multi Interface ScreenSet 2013 installed.
Just put this in the MACH3 directory and it should show up in the list of systems when you use the Mach3 loader.
	

		
			
		

		
	

View attachment PM-45M-CNC.xml


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## Ray C

Boswell said:


> I figured we could use a thread specific to configuration of the Precision Mathews 45M-CNC. This will make it easier for people to find from searches in the future.
> 
> I have attached my XML configuration file. I am not sure if it is directly interchangeable with other systems but likely it is with the one issue that I have the PBJ Multi Interface ScreenSet 2013 installed.
> Just put this in the MACH3 directory and it should show up in the list of systems when you use the Mach3 loader.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 71216



Boswell...

Hi...  Found a few moments and tried this profile. It doesn't seem to be compatible with my system.  When I select that profile, the Mach 3 crashes...

I'll try the older driver in a few moments...

Ray


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## Boswell

Ray C said:


> Boswell...
> 
> Hi...  Found a few moments and tried this profile. It doesn't seem to be compatible with my system.  When I select that profile, the Mach 3 crashes...
> 
> I'll try the older driver in a few moments...
> 
> Ray



for whats it worth, I am pretty sure I used the newer driver. but I have not heard if you can move XML files between systems or what the gotcha's are.
It is an ascii file so you can open it with a text editor but it is not formatted to make it easy for humans to read.

- - - Updated - - -

Here are some screen shots of my MACH3 configuration pages.
it may take several post to get them all, not sure what the limits are.


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## Ray C

Boswell said:


> for whats it worth, I am pretty sure I used the newer driver. but I have not heard if you can move XML files between systems or what the gotcha's are.
> It is an ascii file so you can open it with a text editor but it is not formatted to make it easy for humans to read.
> 
> - - - Updated - - -
> 
> Here are some screen shots of my MACH3 configuration pages.
> it may take several post to get them all, not sure what the limits are.




Much thanks...  It's working fine.  Now I need to go back and make sure I understand everything.  Most of it makes sense in hindsight but there's a few things that don't make sense. 

Anyhow... A million thanks for the jumpstart!


Ray


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## ajg308

How did you get to these settings?  I just used the settings out of the PDF on the disk that came with the mill.  Yours look different.


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## Boswell

ajg308 said:


> How did you get to these settings?  I just used the settings out of the PDF on the disk that came with the mill.  Yours look different.



I started with those, at least where I could make sense out of them. one difference is that I am NOT using the supplied pendent so that is not enabled in my config screens. If I remember the steps per revolutions was not specified or was wrong in the documentation so I worked it out by using the built in calibration mode and adjusted slightly to be a logical number (8000). I then tested this with an indicator. I don't remember what else is different but I know that the screen shots supplied with the red circles did not always have the right information in areas that were not in the circle.

If you have a question about a particular parameter, I can explain how i came to it.

and in full disclosure, know that I am computer geek with no cnc or really much machining experience so I could easily have something wrong here.


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## Ray C

Hi all...

Once again, a big thanks to everyone for helping out.  I'm in the process analyzing all the configuration information as I'm privy to some of the stuff that came from China.  Some of that stuff was not working when Matt tried it or, it worked but was in Chinese only...

I shall spend the rest of this weekend researching, reviewing and validating all available information about the basic CNC config parameters.  I'll compile it in some reasonable format and share it (by request only) to interested parties here for review and comment.  A copy will also to go the fellow in China who integrated the system.  It will take a little while to converge on an agreed-upon configuration but, it will be worth the effort.  In parallel with that effort, I will also write-up a user manual that describes the basic physical setup and mechanical aspects.

Ok, standby...  We're making good progress...

Ray


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## ajg308

That is great, it will be a huge help to all those that follow.

I spent almost this whole week on this setup, some good instructions would have cut off a couple days.


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## Boswell

ajg308 said:


> That is great, it will be a huge help to all those that follow.
> 
> I spent almost this whole week on this setup, some good instructions would have cut off a couple days.




I spend several hours trying to understand why when I told it to HOME the Z-axis would go down instead of up. Took some time to learn about how this is configured in MACH3. I never would have figured it out if it were not for the great you-tube tutorials on Mach3. I highly recommend them them for anyone that is new to Mach3. They cover a lot of ground, not all of it relevant overall worth the time.


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## Ray C

Boswell said:


> I spend several hours trying to understand why when I told it to HOME the Z-axis would go down instead of up. Took some time to learn about how this is configured in MACH3. I never would have figured it out if it were not for the great you-tube tutorials on Mach3. I highly recommend them them for anyone that is new to Mach3. They cover a lot of ground, not all of it relevant overall worth the time.



Absolutely...   I viewed all the videos several weeks ago and they are invaluable.  Keep in-mind folks, there's a huge learning curve ahead -actually, several of them.  One for the machine itself.  One for Mach 3.  Another for your CAM software...  

As I take notes, I'm writing things in a logical progression so that future newcomers can hone-in a little faster...

EDIT:  FWIW, I am re-reviewing the Mach 3 tutorial videos this morning...  There are 4 or 5 and each is about 30 minutes long.

Ray


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## ajg308

Ray C said:


> Absolutely...   I viewed all the videos several weeks ago and they are invaluable.  Keep in-mind folks, there's a huge learning curve ahead -actually, several of them.  One for the machine itself.  One for Mach 3.  Another for your CAM software...
> 
> As I take notes, I'm writing things in a logical progression so that future newcomers can hone-in a little faster...
> 
> EDIT:  FWIW, I am re-reviewing the Mach 3 tutorial videos this morning...  There are 4 or 5 and each is about 30 minutes long.
> 
> Ray



I am wishing I would have started on the software long ago.  Now I have a functional mill in my garage and don't know how to use it. Doh!  The videos have been very useful so far, some I had to watch 2-3 times to grasp everything.


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## Ray C

All,

So far, I've created a step-by-step set of instructions for installing Mach 3, the driver and, the initial configuration parameters.  It is in rough, draft format and seems to work.  I did a dry run on the sample G-code for the "roadrunner" program supplied with Mach 3.  By dry run, I mean the spindle had no cutting tool and the head was raised artificially high and, the table was centered under the spindle.  That sample program is not intended to really cut anything as it only spins the spindle to 60 RPM.  It only tells you if your machine seems to be functioning properly.  -The good news... It seemed to do everything properly the very first time.  I ran the same program several times repeatedly and it ran perfectly each time.

Fellow member "Boswell" was very helpful in getting the motor control parameters setup -much thanks goes to him.

I'm going to have a few people review the document before sharing it with wider distribution and I state right-up front, this is in draft format and the integrity of the parameters have not been fully tested and it is "u*se at your own risk"*. 

I will say this...  The hardware as it arrived was perfectly setup.  The limit switches were correct, the motors and all electrical cabinet switch settings were perfect.  The integrator who distributes the machine assumes the user knows how to use Mach 3 and how to set the parameters -and that is a HUGE learning curve with much room for user-error...

I did some very precise measurements with the step function -and much to my surprise, when you tell it to move 0.0001" (one ten-thousandth of an inch) -that's exactly how far it moves!  -WOW!  I'm impressed.

My goal is to develop a set of basic instruction on how to install the software, drivers and do a basic sane configuration of the motor parameters.  How to use CNC software and learning the ins/outs of Mach 3 is something we'll all have to experience together...

My goal is to have that basic set of instructions done in the next few days...  I'm working on this practically around the clock...


Ray


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## Ray C

All,

Here is a first draft of the PM 45 CNC software setup manual...  This works well on my machine but, it does not cover machines with manual speed selector gearbox heads.  This only covers the variable speed units.  The only difference will be that you'll need to setup multiple "Spindle Pulley" configurations whereas, this document only shows one Spindle Pulley configuration.  It will be easy to replicate the information for a multi-step machine.

Again, I'd like to thank all the folks I've been on the phone with who helped me and solved some of the basic configuration mysteries...  They shall remain nameless for now as I don't have permission to use their real names.  

Ray

View attachment PM45CNCBasicSoftwareSetup-1.pdf


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## ajg308

Ray C said:


> All,
> 
> Here is a first draft of the PM 45 CNC software setup manual...  This works well on my machine but, it does not cover machines with manual speed selector gearbox heads.  This only covers the variable speed units.  The only difference will be that you'll need to setup multiple "Spindle Pulley" configurations whereas, this document only shows one Spindle Pulley configuration.  It will be easy to replicate the information for a multi-step machine.
> 
> Again, I'd like to thank all the folks I've been on the phone with who helped me and solved some of the basic configuration mysteries...  They shall remain nameless for now as I don't have permission to use their real names.
> 
> Ray
> 
> View attachment 71511



Thanks, I will work on this tonight.  I have to setup multiple Spindle Pulley configurations.


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## Ray C

ajg308 said:


> Thanks, I will work on this tonight.  I have to setup multiple Spindle Pulley configurations.



For now, just set up one and only set the spindle speeds in the range of that one gear.  Once you see how to do one of them, you'll see that it's the same thing for the others.

If for some reason your spindle won't fire-up, I think you'll probably need to change PWM setting on page 21 to something more suitable.

There's another user here named Zr8cnc who has the same machine as your and his is working.  Since I don't have that machine, there's no way I can test it.

All the other controls are the same...


Ray


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## zr8cnc

Ray,

Great job with the work instruction!


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## Ray C

Guys,

Right now, I'm about to flip my wig on getting the table dimensions and soft limits set straight.  I'm thinking of changing the home location to the South West corner instead of South East.

BTW, the setup instructions do not have table dimensions or soft limits properly set...

Ray


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## Ray C

What a difference a day makes...

Excellent progress with the machine today!  I got the homing and soft-limits working the way I want them.  The machine comes pre-configured for Home set at the South East corner of the table -which is apparently more common outside the USA and also in some of the really gigantic machines.  All the darn tutorials on YouTube etc have it set on the South West corner, making it hard to visualize/translate all the available instructional materials.

It didn't take long at all... -Just moved the position of some stop switches and twiddled the software configuration.  The soft limits need a tiny bit of tweaking but, it's all but a done-deal right now.  I also made progress on setting and using predefined offsets.  -Very valuable thing to do...  Wow, what possibilities!  

Very soon, I'll be ready to cut some metal.... probably by the end of the week.  I'm taking my time and learning EVERYTHING I need, to do this right and not screw things up...  Funny how you get that way when around 7 grand is at stake...


Ray


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## Boswell

Ray C said:


> What a difference a day makes...
> 
> Excellent progress with the machine today!  I got the homing and soft-limits working the way I want them.  The machine comes pre-configured for Home set at the South East corner of the table -which is apparently more common outside the USA and also in some of the really gigantic machines.  All the darn tutorials on YouTube etc have it set on the South West corner, making it hard to visualize/translate all the available instructional materials.
> 
> It didn't take long at all... -Just moved the position of some stop switches and twiddled the software configuration.  The soft limits need a tiny bit of tweaking but, it's all but a done-deal right now.  I also made progress on setting and using predefined offsets.  -Very valuable thing to do...  Wow, what possibilities!
> 
> Very soon, I'll be ready to cut some metal.... probably by the end of the week.  I'm taking my time and learning EVERYTHING I need, to do this right and not screw things up...  Funny how you get that way when around 7 grand is at stake...
> 
> 
> Ray



Good to hear you were able to get the Y axis Home switched around without trouble. I look forward to hearing about your results to see if if this is something worth doing on my machine.


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## Ray C

Boswell said:


> Good to hear you were able to get the Y axis Home switched around without trouble. I look forward to hearing about your results to see if if this is something worth doing on my machine.



Actually, Y and X. The change is easy and the soft limits are fantastic!  It keeps you from bumping a switch and then needing to go through all the rigamarole of resetting the condition...


Ray


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## ajg308

Ray C said:


> What a difference a day makes...
> 
> Excellent progress with the machine today!  I got the homing and soft-limits working the way I want them.  The machine comes pre-configured for Home set at the South East corner of the table -which is apparently more common outside the USA and also in some of the really gigantic machines.  All the darn tutorials on YouTube etc have it set on the South West corner, making it hard to visualize/translate all the available instructional materials.
> 
> It didn't take long at all... -Just moved the position of some stop switches and twiddled the software configuration.  The soft limits need a tiny bit of tweaking but, it's all but a done-deal right now.  I also made progress on setting and using predefined offsets.  -Very valuable thing to do...  Wow, what possibilities!
> 
> Very soon, I'll be ready to cut some metal.... probably by the end of the week.  I'm taking my time and learning EVERYTHING I need, to do this right and not screw things up...  Funny how you get that way when around 7 grand is at stake...
> 
> 
> Ray



This is where I am at right now.  I have the machine homed at the SE corner and I am trying to flip that to the SW.  I think I have the soft limits set as well.  

When I ordered this setup I visualized this all being so easy...


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## Ray C

ajg308 said:


> This is where I am at right now.  I have the machine homed at the SE corner and I am trying to flip that to the SW.  I think I have the soft limits set as well.
> 
> When I ordered this setup I visualized this all be so easy...



Surprise!

By any chance, did you look at the setup guideline that was posted and if so, was it readable/useful?

The machine itself is/was pretty well behaved.  No technical problems once the software was installed and configured.

Anyhow, yes... Everything looks easy when you see it on YouTube but when you're face-to-face with a sophisticated program like Mach 3, suddenly, the tail is between the legs, the head bows down and the ears hang to the sides...  I can see however that it will get easier once basic familiarity is established and the machine and Mach 3 "have one-ness".   It won't be long after that that we'll be bemoaning the hurdles to overcome with our respective CAM packages -and soon after that, we'll bump into the limitations of our economy CAM programs and we'll be bellyaching that we didn't spring for the more expensive software.  All of this will probably happen in the next 4, 6, 8 weeks...  Life is short.  Enjoy it.

Ray


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## ajg308

Ray C said:


> Surprise!
> 
> By any chance, did you look at the setup guideline that was posted and if so, was it readable/useful?
> 
> The machine itself is/was pretty well behaved.  No technical problems once the software was installed and configured.
> 
> Anyhow, yes... Everything looks easy when you see it on YouTube but when you're face-to-face with a sophisticated program like Mach 3, suddenly, the tail is between the legs, the head bows down and the ears hang to the sides...  I can see however that it will get easier once basic familiarity is established and the machine and Mach 3 "have one-ness".   It won't be long after that that we'll be bemoaning the hurdles to overcome with our respective CAM packages -and soon after that, we'll bump into the limitations of our economy CAM programs and we'll be bellyaching that we didn't spring for the more expensive software.  All of this will probably happen in the next 4, 6, 8 weeks...  Life is short.  Enjoy it.
> 
> Ray



Yes I printed the guide.  It was written in English and easy to understand and follow.  Excellent work there.  

I agree about the machine, no issues there and it does what it is told.  I am trying to learn at least 3 software programs at once, that is the struggle.


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## Ray C

Here's an updated version (Draft II) of the Software and Driver Setup manual and an additional draft document covering Homing and Setting Limit Switches.  There are two documents because of their large byte size.  The first document is just cleaned up a little with no changes to the technical content.

Please let me know if this stuff is helping you folks so I can get some idea if I'm knocking myself out for nothing...  Comments and suggestion for content and to improve readability are welcome.


Once again, I'd like to thank a nameless person for proofreading the latest doc...  Once we get beyond "draft" status, I'll put editor information in there.  I'm going to keep these in "Work Instruction" format as I hate pedantic manuals with all kinds of headings, titles, lists of figure -and all that crap.  Beef.  I want beef -no fluff.


Ray...

View attachment ADDENDUM-Homing-1.pdf


View attachment PM45CNCBasicSoftwareSetup-2 -.pdf


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## ajg308

Ray C said:


> Here's an updated version (Draft II) of the Software and Driver Setup manual and an additional draft document covering Homing and Setting Limit Switches.  There are two documents because of their large byte size.  The first document is just cleaned up a little with no changes to the technical content.
> 
> Please let me know if this stuff is helping you folks so I can get some idea if I'm knocking myself out for nothing...  Comments and suggestion for content and to improve readability are welcome.
> 
> 
> Once again, I'd like to thank a nameless person for proofreading the latest doc...  Once we get beyond "draft" status, I'll put editor information in there.  I'm going to keep these in "Work Instruction" format as I hate pedantic manuals with all kinds of headings, titles, lists of figure -and all that crap.  Beef.  I want beef -no fluff.
> 
> 
> Ray...
> 
> View attachment 71807
> 
> 
> View attachment 71808




Ray, thanks so much.  I am really new to all of this and have been banging my head against the mill table trying to get this sorted out.  I appreciate your efforts immensely.  I will report back after reading the updates.


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## Ray C

ajg308 said:


> Ray, thanks so much.  I am really new to all of this and have been banging my head against the mill table trying to get this sorted out.  I appreciate your efforts immensely.  I will report back after reading the updates.



LOL:  That makes two of us...  The original manuals were a doozie.  Do let me know if things make sense or not.  On the second document, I added a tiny bit of background.  Mainly though, I'm new to this and one way to challenge my understanding is to write it out in explanatory form.

BTW:  I'm not planning to cover how to use Mach 3 or any particular CAM software as there are hours of videos on YouTube and endless manuals covering those topics.

Ray


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## zr8cnc

Ray,

Amazing job with the limits and home switch document. I will be using it this weekend to set up my parameters. Your efforts are greatly appreciated and we are luck to have a dedicated member like you on this board.


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## ajg308

I am having a heck of a time getting this thing tuned up.  I have used Ray's documents and they are great.

I was all set to ref all home and when I did the LED lights for the home switches on the diagnostic page are no longer functional, and the home switches don't work.  Somehow I turned them off, so now I am back to watching videos and double checking everything to see where I went wrong.


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## Ray C

ajg308 said:


> I am having a heck of a time getting this thing tuned up.  I have used Ray's documents and they are great.
> 
> I was all set to ref all home and when I did the LED lights for the home switches on the diagnostic page are no longer functional, and the home switches don't work.  Somehow I turned them off, so now I am back to watching videos and double checking everything to see where I went wrong.



This happened to me too...  When you enter values in Mach 3, you must press the "Apply" button.  If you press "OK", the parameters you change are not saved -must press "Apply" first.

When you get to the Motor Tuning, there is a special "Save Parameters" button that you MUST press.

I fell for this trap a bunch of times!  (BTW:  The documents I provided mention these pitfalls but, there's so much to read, it's easy to pass over).


Hey ajg308, remind me again on what machine type you have (Variable or non-variable) and what options.  I'm trying to collect info from folks so I can make the manual complete for all machine types.


Ray


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## ajg308

Ray C said:


> This happened to me too...  When you enter values in Mach 3, you must press the "Apply" button.  If you press "OK", the parameters you change are not saved -must press "Apply" first.
> 
> When you get to the Motor Tuning, there is a special "Save Parameters" button that you MUST press.
> 
> I fell for this trap a bunch of times!  (BTW:  The documents I provided mention these pitfalls but, there's so much to read, it's easy to pass over).
> 
> 
> Hey ajg308, remind me again on what machine type you have (Variable or non-variable) and what options.  I'm trying to collect info from folks so I can make the manual complete for all machine types.
> 
> 
> Ray



Thanks Ray,

PM45-CNC 3 axis.  nonvariable motor, coolant, one shot lube, pendant unit.

I've been though the documents and the mach3 videos like 5 times each and can't put my finger on the problem.  If/when I figure it out, I will let you know.

Aaron


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## Ray C

ajg308 said:


> Thanks Ray,
> 
> PM45-CNC 3 axis.  nonvariable motor, coolant, one shot lube, pendant unit.
> 
> I've been though the documents and the mach3 videos like 5 times each and can't put my finger on the problem.  If/when I figure it out, I will let you know.
> 
> Aaron



For those of you watching this thread, we got it all worked-out in a few minutes.  Minor tweaking of the stop tab settings...

Life is good for ajg308...


Ray


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## ajg308

Life is good! We should all be thankful for someone like Ray. He gave me is personal cell 	and walked through it together with me. In his own time, pretty awesome. Thanks Ray. 

Aaron


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## lim1wph

Hi. I'm so new to this I haven't even received my machine yet. I will have many questions in the future but the only one I have now is, since my computer doesn't have a rs232 printer port, which one will I use? USB or VGA or HDMI or do I need to get a rs232 board to stick in the mother board?   Thanks, Bill


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## countryguy

Hi Bill.  welcome!   Been in the "so new I can spell Mach3" and it is exciting times!   The PM45 look awesome and you'll love it I'm sure!     On the Mach3 setup.  That is usually a parallel port connected item.      This is a long thread chain.  Was there something mentioned about the MTR's (min tech reqs) for the home computer somewhere?  happy to help.      Have you selected a CAM program and/or a CAD design tool?   

I use Draftsight from Dessault.  It is totally free.   for CAM I selected DolphinCam.    I have been really happy with it overall.  Parts and designs are getting done and the learning curve was pretty extensive and very fun to learn.  Just takes some time.    Ask away here! 



lim1wph said:


> Hi. I'm so new to this I haven't even received my machine yet. I will have many questions in the future but the only one I have now is, since my computer doesn't have a rs232 printer port, which one will I use? USB or VGA or HDMI or do I need to get a rs232 board to stick in the mother board?   Thanks, Bill


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## Boswell

lim1wph said:


> Hi. I'm so new to this I haven't even received my machine yet. I will have many questions in the future but the only one I have now is, since my computer doesn't have a rs232 printer port, which one will I use? USB or VGA or HDMI or do I need to get a rs232 board to stick in the mother board?   Thanks, Bill



Welcome to the forum. The PM45M-CNC will talk to MACH3 (or is it that Mach3 will talk to the PM45M-CNC) via a USB connection. of course you will need a VGA or HDMI to connect a monitor to the computer. I don't have a Parallel or RS-232 connection on the computer running MACH3 and have not missed them.


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## lim1wph

Hello Countryguy and Boswell!   Thanks for the info. I went ahead and sprung for Bobcad. I've had it for a few months and am starting to get the idea of how stuff works. The Mach3 how to videos on the Artsoft website either did not mention any connection other than rs232 or I just didn't hear it. The ports I listed were the ones not in use on the back of the computer so it's great to here that USB will work. I thought that there would a way other than RS232 because it's pretty antiquated as far as computers go. I retired in March and started metalworking as my new hobby and see that it's so interesting and I'll never run out of things to learn(especially since I know nothing). I have found that I am starting into a hobby that some people are retiring from but there seems to be a greater number of people who are metal workers by trade and have shops at home because it's so interesting. Again, thank you for helping   Bill


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## lim1wph

Countryguy,    I looked at all of the software packages I could find on the internet. The only people around here I could find to talk to were guys who used the software where they work. They each liked the software that they knew and they were using industrial strength programs $$$$$$. Solidworks, AutoCAD, etc. I really don't know why I decided on Bobcad but they have been great to me and I am getting the hang of it. The biggest mistake that I made was trying to figure it out on my own with no cad background. Once I got the instructional videos things took off. Talk with you later, Bill


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## countryguy

*Mach3 via USB-  side-bar.  PM-45M-CNC Setup and Configuration with Mach3*

I did not find much on Mach3 via USB from PC to controller outside of some external products (link to 1 attached).  Is there a plug in of some sorts?   Curious now.  


http://cncdrive.com/MC/UC100 datasheet/UC100 users guide.pdf


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## Boswell

*Re: Mach3 via USB-  side-bar.  PM-45M-CNC Setup and Configuration with Mach3*



countryguy said:


> I did not find much on Mach3 via USB from PC to controller outside of some external products (link to 1 attached).  Is there a plug in of some sorts?   Curious now.
> 
> 
> http://cncdrive.com/MC/UC100 datasheet/UC100 users guide.pdf




The PM45M-CNC comes with a Motion Controller. This is what translate  data from Mach3 to the Stepper and spindle motors.  The specific Motion controller that the PM34 uses comes with a "Driver/plugin" that you install on the Mach3 system. It will interface the Motion Controller that is in the PM45... Control cabinet to Mach3.  You might be able to find a little bit of info on the motion controller if you search around. It is a JNC-40M. Of course the PM45... will come with the instructions (mostly translated) to configure and install all of this. Any translations that you don't understand you can get clarification here. we have all been through it.


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## GaryL

Hello Ray, I have a pm-45m-cnc, variable speed motor, two speed gearbox, and a pendant. I was wondering if you could point me in the direction of someone who might have this same setup who might be willing to email me a working mach3 xml configuration file.


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## Boswell

Ray put together a document that describes all the settings needed to get a PM-45M-CNC up and running and I am sure he will see your request and reply soon. In the meantime, I can share what I have figured out through trial and error. I will take a look later on this evening for the config file and can post it when I have it.



GaryL said:


> Hello Ray, I have a pm-45m-cnc, variable speed motor, two speed gearbox, and a pendant. I was wondering if you could point me in the direction of someone who might have this same setup who might be willing to email me a working mach3 xml configuration file.


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## benb

I am in the same situation, with the Variable speed and Pendant. I have most things working, but spindle speed control is the main issue, along with a non-functional pendant. Matt said some users with new machines were also having issues with the pendant and he was going to get one setup next week and figure it out. FYI, the Motors on these new machines are running ~12800 steps per in, not the 8000 quoted in the "documentation"


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## lim1wph

Hi benb,  I had the same issue with steps per inch. You must have found that calibration button on the Settings page also. I don't have the spindle problem but my pendant is also non functional. I'm very new to this but if there are any settings you want to compare just let me know. Bill


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## GaryL

benb said:


> I am in the same situation, with the Variable speed and Pendant. I have most things working, but spindle speed control is the main issue, along with a non-functional pendant. Matt said some users with new machines were also having issues with the pendant and he was going to get one setup next week and figure it out. FYI, the Motors on these new machines are running ~12800 steps per in, not the 8000 quoted in the "documentation"



Hello Benb, I am having a heck of a time with the homing configuration page, I was wondering if you could tell me what you came up with?


----------



## Boswell

here is a screen capture of how I have my Homing and Limits set. I hope it helps.






GaryL said:


> Hello Benb, I am having a heck of a time with the homing configuration page, I was wondering if you could tell me what you came up with?


----------



## GaryL

Hello Boswell, thank you for your homing setup. Did you leave your system as set up at the factory or change the limit switches and home to the sw?


----------



## Boswell

Good point. Yes I did reverse the homing to it now homes to the SW. After having completed the change, i don't think it brought me any value. but also not worth putting back.

BTW, here is my homing setup before I reversed the X and Y homing corner.



BTW, I recommend that you take a screen capture of every single configuration page for later reference. This has come in handy more than once.



GaryL said:


> Hello Boswell, thank you for your homing setup. Did you leave your system as set up at the factory or change the limit switches and home to the sw?


----------



## lim1wph

Hello Boswell,  Are you using 12,800 spm on your machine and how did you come to find it? Was it that Calibration Button on the settings page? I just wondered why it's different than the Setup instructions.  Thanks, Bill


----------



## GaryL

Thank you Boswell, the before axis relocation home and limits screenshot helped me out, my machine is now functional and I am beginning to understand the Mach3 software.


----------



## Boswell

SPM ?  Steps per ?

I am using the 8000 Steps per inch



I have been experimenting with the acceleration and Velocity numbers.
Y and Z axis are the same except the Z I use 20 in/Min for Velocity and 10 in/Sec/Sec for acceleration





lim1wph said:


> Hello Boswell,  Are you using 12,800 spm on your machine and how did you come to find it? Was it that Calibration Button on the settings page? I just wondered why it's different than the Setup instructions.  Thanks, Bill


----------



## Boswell

Great to hear [GaryL]. it took me a while to get it all figured out. let me know if you have any more questions that I can help with.



GaryL said:


> Thank you Boswell, the before axis relocation home and limits screenshot helped me out, my machine is now functional and I am beginning to understand the Mach3 software.


----------



## lim1wph

Hi Boswell,  here is what I ended up with for my machine to produce full size tool paths. I wonder if I have something set differently somewhere that requires these settings. However, the motors sound much better since it started making full size tool paths. They use to kind of groan especially when homing Z.  I also noticed that the DRO, before the change, was indicating the correct dimensions from the g code but the actual tool movement was 1/2 scale.  Weird!  Thanks for helping out, Bill


----------



## Boswell

This seems very strange. With the Steps set at 12800 If you go into Mach3 and Set the x Offset to Zero then use MDI to enter G50 <enter> then G0 X2. Does it actually Move 2" ?  The G50 will set any scale factors in Mach3 to 1.0 and of course the G0 X2 will do a rapid move in the x plane of 2".


----------



## GaryL

I was having the same problem with my mill only traveling about 1/2 the actual distance. So I went to the settings tab, axis calibration, set steps per unit and after I measured and input actual distance traveled, it set the parameter to 12800. Now the mill is traveling the actual distance I tell it to.


----------



## zr8cnc

just out of curiosity how did was the 8000 steps derived at in the first place? Im trying to remember how I calculated my motors when I set them up.


----------



## zr8cnc

I believe I recall that the value of 320 was multiplied by the factor of 25 to get 8000. but I believe the factor is actually 25.4 and the would result in 8128 steps per


----------



## Boswell

zr8cnc said:


> I believe I recall that the value of 320 was multiplied by the factor of 25 to get 8000. but I believe the factor is actually 25.4 and the would result in 8128 steps per



I think that I got the number independently from others when I was experimenting. At the time I did not have very good measuring equipment so I taped a 12" steal rule to the table and put the smallest drill bit I had into a chuck. Then started moving back and forth using MDI while changing the values of the Steps per inch. I arrived at 8000. It is interesting because my measuring system was probably not good enough to resolve 128 steps per inch. I have not done much "precision" work and any errors I have attributed to my lack of skill and experience. It is very frustrating that this very fundamental number is not definitively published.  I guess I will get out the DTI and see if I can verify the number this weekend. There is still the question of what is causing a difference between 8000(ish) and 12800.


----------



## zr8cnc

Boswell said:


> I think that I got the number independently from others when I was experimenting. At the time I did not have very good measuring equipment so I taped a 12" steal rule to the table and put the smallest drill bit I had into a chuck. Then started moving back and forth using MDI while changing the values of the Steps per inch. I arrived at 8000. It is interesting because my measuring system was probably not good enough to resolve 128 steps per inch. I have not done much "precision" work and any errors I have attributed to my lack of skill and experience. It is very frustrating that this very fundamental number is not definitively published.  I guess I will get out the DTI and see if I can verify the number this weekend. There is still the question of what is causing a difference between 8000(ish) and 12800.



Boswell, 
I completely agree with your frustration as I thought that this mill would have been plug and play with directions included that leave no stone unturned. I was instantly overwhelmed with setting this mill up because of my lack of experience. But we all chipped in an got these mills up and running. The 12800 number has to have something to do with either stepper motors or the lead screws


----------



## lim1wph

zr8,
  I have gotten 2 buttons to work on the pendant. Z- moves Y+ and Y- mover Z+.  Still working on it as a matter of principle but will soon order an iMach. Not sure which model though. I really kind of like the layout of the Jamen pendant. Perhaps Mach4 will be better at interpreting this stuff. I think I'll give it a try when it comes out.


----------



## Boswell

lim1wph said:


> zr8,
> I have gotten 2 buttons to work on the pendant. Z- moves Y+ and Y- mover Z+.  Still working on it as a matter of principle but will soon order an iMach. Not sure which model though. I really kind of like the layout of the Jamen pendant. Perhaps Mach4 will be better at interpreting this stuff. I think I'll give it a try when it comes out.



I found the included pendent to be only slightly better than useless. I am currently using a "Wireless" pendent from China. It is OK but could be better.


----------



## zr8cnc

Boswell said:


> I found the included pendent to be only slightly better than useless. I am currently using a "Wireless" pendent from China. It is OK but could be better.



Like I have mentioned in the past I use the VistaCNC pendant it it is truly a nice piece of equipment. Well made and easy to use. Plug in the USB and cutting chips in minutes. Also I will prob throw my jamen pendant in the trash. That pendant feels like a cheap kids toy lolol


----------



## benb

I finally got my variable speed mill running close to the way it should. The pendant is still non-functional and I think I will just go with an Imach. (Thanks). I ended up using Ray's XML file as a base and then had to do some tweaking to the input pins, steps per, etc to make it match my machine. Be aware that apparently these machines do not all come wired alike or even to screen shot settings on the CD.

Now I'm down to spindle RPM. Using Ray's settings at least got mine turning, but not at the desired RPM. I do not have a tach (yet) to check, and apparently there is no actual RPM feedback into Mach3?, but it seems off at least at low rpm. Anyway, does anyone have pulley settings for both gears on variable speed machines that yield a fairly accurate RPM? I am drilling some 304 stainless and need around 240RPM with some torque behind it.


----------



## benb

My guess is the newer machines are coming with different stepper motors and the "Documentation" was not updated. The higher number should give better precision and possibly smoother operation in theory, but not sure if it is noticeable between the two. (Replying to the question about why the differnece between 8000 and 12800 steps per on some machines.)


----------



## lim1wph

Well fellas, I am really hesitant to ask but has anyone tried Mach4 yet? I"m just getting comfortable with Mach3 but if there is a better mouse trap out there what the hell.  Bill


----------



## GaryL

benb said:


> I am in the same situation, with the Variable speed and Pendant. I have most things working, but spindle speed control is the main issue, along with a non-functional pendant. Matt said some users with new machines were also having issues with the pendant and he was going to get one setup next week and figure it out. FYI, the Motors on these new machines are running ~12800 steps per in, not the 8000 quoted in the "documentation"



Ben, I have a pendant that is only partially functional, I was wondering if your were able to get yours working, and if so would be willing to share the setup to get it working.


----------



## GaryL

Well I discarded the pendant that came with my pm45m, and bought a Vistacnc P2-S. It appears to be well made and all of the function work well except for the velocity and continuous modes, which do nothing. Has anyone encountered this problem and know of a solution?


----------



## GaryL

GaryL said:


> Well I discarded the pendant that came with my pm45m, and bought a Vistacnc P2-S. It appears to be well made and all of the function work well except for the velocity and continuous modes, which do nothing. Has anyone encountered this problem and know of a solution?



VistaCNC sent me a link to an alternate plugin and now I have full function of my P2-S pendant.


----------



## lim1wph

Hey Fellas,  Has anyone hooked up a touch plate and a touch probe on their machine? I was guessing that you connect one wire to a blank spot on the Jamen board and the other to the 5 volt ground. Is this correct? Thanks, Bill


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## zr8cnc

sorry I cannot help you with that one, but I too would be interested in knowing how


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## lim1wph

This seems like something Boswell could solve if he hasn't already. Are you still out there Obie Wan Boswell?


----------



## lim1wph

Hello zr8cnc, 
       I finally got back to that height set tool plate. I got it right away. I don't think that I had the damn thing running before when I was trying to get the Digitize light to prove the circuit. Sometimes I amaze myself at how thick headed I can be. Here is the button script used with built in instructions for personalization.On the board I used I10 and the 5v ground.  Bill

CurrentFeed =GetOemDRO(818) 'Get the current feedrate to return to later
CurrentAbsInc =GetOemLED(48) 'Get the current G90/G91 state
CurrentGmode =GetOemDRO(819) 'Get the current G0/G1 state


If GetOemLed (825)=0 Then'Check to see if the probe is already grounded or faulty
DoOEMButton (1010) 'zerothe Z axis so the probe move will start from here
Code "G4 *P3*"' this delay gives me time to get from computer to hold probe inplace
Code "G90 *G31Z**-4*.*F4*"'probing move, *F4*is the feed rate here for the move and *-4*is how far spindle will move beforegiving up
While IsMoving() 'waitwhile it happens
Wend
ZProbePos = GetVar(2002)'get the exact point the probe was hit
Code "G0 Z"&ZProbePos 'go back to that point, always a very small amount ofoverrun
While IsMoving ()
Wend
Call SetDro (2, .*793*)' change .060 to your plate thickness and then adjust for finalaccuracy
Sleep 200 'Pause for Droto update.
Code "G1 *Z1.**F50*"' Z1 is the Z retract height you want here, must be greater than thetouch plate thickness   *F50**is the Feedrate after process*
While IsMoving ()
Wend
Code "(Z axis is nowzeroed)" 'puts this message in the status bar
Code "F"&CurrentFeed 'Returns to prior feed rate
Else
Code "(Z-Plate isgrounded, check connection and try again)" 'this goes in thestatus bar if applicable
End If
If CurrentAbsInc = 0 Then'if G91 was in effect before then return to it
Code "G91"
End If
If CurrentGMode = 0 Then'if G0 was in effect before then return to it
Code "G0"
End If


----------



## Boswell

Wow, it looks like I missed a bunch of post in this thread. I still have not figured out how to automatically subscribe to threads that I post in.

Did you connect the probe as lim1lph suggested ?


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## lim1wph

Hi Guys,  I'm going to try a touch probe next. I don't know if I can use the same connections or use another empty point on the card. I think that ProbeIt looks like a good addition to Mach3. I just read the manual for it and it seems as though there are quite a few settings to tweak, but that's what a hobby is all about.   See ya, Bill


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## lim1wph

Well, the touch probe has been a bust.  I've tried everything I can think of but there just isn't enough information from Jamen. Has anyone replaced it and, if so,  what did you replace it with?  Thanks, Bill


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## Boswell

I have not tried to use a probe yet but I have looked at the Jamen documents (such as it is). forgive me if you already figured this out and tried this, but it looks like the IN# need to be shorted to Ground via 10 Ohms of resistance in order to signal to Mach3 that there is a contact closeure.   Have you tried this without using the Probit to see if the control board is talking to Mach3 properly?


----------



## lim1wph

Hi,  I have a tool height block that works great without a resistor. The touch probe that I have requires the Input to be reversed,  as it is closed to start and then opens when it touches something.  It's been 2 weeks since I've played with it but it won't respond (the Probe LED won't clear) no matter what I try. Could this be because I am not using the resistor?  Thanks for responding,  Bill


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## Boswell

It should not mater if it is N.O. (normally open) or N.C. (Normally closed).  A typical tool height setter will have only one wire from the control board to the setter that is then shorted to ground via the tool and machine. This is a N.O. configuration. For a N.C. tool to work it most likely has two wires. One would need to go to Ground and the other to the control board. If the switching is 100% mechanical then it should not mater which. If it has some active component to it (internal circuitry) then that could be the issue and there is no universal answer on how to connect an "active" switch. You can find out which you have by using an Ohm meter across the two wires and then deflecting the tip to see what happens.  A N.C. switch should have a very low resistance (<3 ohms) until it is active (deflected in this case) then the resistance should go up into the > Multi Megaohms. Is there a place I can download the documentation for the touch probe ?

P.s. I doubt the resistor (or lack of resistor) is the culprit.


----------



## lim1wph

Here is a picture, http://www.ebay.com/itm/Touch-probe...-cnc-mill-lathe-router-engraver-/161352724525  It just came in a box with nothing else. I assumed that was because they are so simple, just 2 wires in a shielded  cable. For the touch probe I am using the same 2 connections that I use for the tool plate that I ran to a couple of mounted banana plugs. I just have to change the input, or so I thought.  Bill


----------



## Boswell

The connection instructions on the Ebay site seem pretty standard and should work with the Jamen controller.
I would break out your ohm meter to see what is going on "inside".  Might just be broken

Mount it on your mill, then 
1. Measure between the two wires when it is not touching something   (not deflected)
2. Measure between the two wires when it IS touching something (deflected)
3. Measure between one (RED or Positive first) of the wires and the table when it is NOT touching the table
4. Measure between the same wire and the table when it IS touching the table (or a metal part that is clamped to the table)
5. Repeat #3 and #4 with the Other wire.

Proper operation probably should be (assumes that the switching is "passive" (mechanical). If it is "active" then it will require some power to operate. Looking at the generic design info that I can find, it looks passive
1. High resistance
2. Low Resistance
3. High Resistance  (both wires)
4. High Resistance  (both wires)


----------



## lim1wph

Thank you, I'll try this tonight and let you know what I find.


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## lim1wph

It looks like the problem lies within ProbeIt. The machine will respond directly to Mach3 but it just won't respond to ProbeIt for some reason. It senses when the probe is activated but is unable to do anything with it. What a shame because that program looks really handy. I was exchanging emails with the author and he was at a loss to make it work with the Jamen card. He even refunded my PayPal account without me asking. I was hoping that I could figure something out and give him his money back because I really like the way his program could be used if functional. Now, since you sent me back to the beginning Mr Boswell I was able to find  an intermittent wire, of all things. Once the probe activated every time it was supposed to the Mach3 controls respond consistantly. Thank a lot for the tutorial, Bill


----------



## Boswell

That is great news and I am glad I could help. I broke my Fowler electronic edge finder a few week ago and have not replaced it so I just ordered one of these probes for myself. I am looking forward to getting it hooked up.


----------



## Boswell

Lim1wph,  were you ever able to get Probe-It working?


----------



## GaryL

Hello Boswell, I just bought a probe and have been setting it up, I wired it up and then set the input in mach3, do you know if there are any other settings in mach3 that need to be addressed?


----------



## Boswell

GaryL said:


> Hello Boswell, I just bought a probe and have been setting it up, I wired it up and then set the input in mach3, do you know if there are any other settings in mach3 that need to be addressed?



Is this on a PM45M-CNC ?  If not, what motion controller do you have? If so then I was able to get the probe working. I connected one wire to Input #7 on the JNC-40M and the other to one of the logic grounds that are on the control board.  I can go into the diag screens of MACHG3 and see the LED go on and off when I deflect the tip.  However I am having problems finding ANY software that can utilize the probe that will work. So far Probe-It will see the probe working but as soon as you command Probe-It to do anything like calibration, it fails and nothing happens.


----------



## lim1wph

Hi Gary,  I sure wish ProbeIt would work with our Jamen card but it just seems like it is not going to happen. If you find another program that will function please let us know. ProbeIt looks so useful it's really a shame we can't use it.  Bill


----------



## GaryL

Boswell said:


> Is this on a PM45M-CNC ?  If not, what motion controller do you have? If so then I was able to get the probe working. I connected one wire to Input #7 on the JNC-40M and the other to one of the logic grounds that are on the control board.  I can go into the diag screens of MACHG3 and see the LED go on and off when I deflect the tip.  However I am having problems finding ANY software that can utilize the probe that will work. So far Probe-It will see the probe working but as soon as you command Probe-It to do anything like calibration, it fails and nothing happens.


 
Hello Boswell, Yes I have the PM45M-CNC.  You are ahead of me, so far the mach3 led won't budge for me. Did you put a resistor in the path?


----------



## Boswell

I did not use a resistor. Check your port setup. here is a snapshot of mine. the "Probe" signal should be set to Pin #7 and that is where one wire from the probe should be connected. The "Active Low" will determine if the LED is on normally and goes OFF when deflected or vice-versa. 



There are three wires from the probe. Two signal and one for the Shield on the cable. I attached the shield to the ground block in the bottom right of the control box. you can see the metal block that is directly connected to the frame and has many wires going to it. The other two wires don't matter but one goes to the INPUT #7 and ther other goes to a logic GND that can be found on the motion control board. A test would be to just run a wire from the #7 input pin and then while watching the diag screen, touch it to the table. This should ground it and the LED should change On to Off or the other way around. This will let you know if the problem is with the probe or not.


----------



## GaryL

Hello Boswell, thanks for the pin inputs picture, any chance I could get a picture of the connect points on the JNC-40M card?


----------



## Boswell

GaryL said:


> Hello Boswell, thanks for the pin inputs picture, any chance I could get a picture of the connect points on the JNC-40M card?


 I can but it will probably be tomorrow.  Let me see if I can pull picture of the card that I can illustrate. if not, I'll take a picture tomorrow of my setup and post it.


----------



## Boswell

Here are some pictures

Overall view of Motion Control Board in bottom left and chassis ground block in lower right



A closeup of the Chasis ground block. This is where I connected the Shield wire.  You could also connect one of the signal wires here instead of to the GND connection on the board.



and finally this shows the motion control board and where I connected the two signal wires (GND in the upper right and IN7 in the bottom middle


----------



## GaryL

Boswell said:


> Here are some pictures
> 
> Overall view of Motion Control Board in bottom left and chassis ground block in lower right
> View attachment 96873
> 
> 
> A closeup of the Chasis ground block. This is where I connected the Shield wire.  You could also connect one of the signal wires here instead of to the GND connection on the board.
> View attachment 96874
> 
> 
> and finally this shows the motion control board and where I connected the two signal wires (GND in the upper right and IN7 in the bottom middle
> 
> View attachment 96875


 
Hello Boswell, and thanks again for the picture. Our boards are a little different but they have the same model number. My input # 7 already has a wire going to it. I guess I will try to trace it and see where it goes.


----------



## Boswell

See the thread I created in the Precision Matthews section on the G31 issues. While I can get the probe to indicate using the diagnostic LED display, the G31 command will not work at all. No Motion. I am asking for others to try a G31 command on the MDI to see if this is unique to my system or an issue with this Motion Controller.

GaryL. That is very interesting. By default Mach3 looks for the probe on Input #7.  There may be a way to use a different input and have Mach3 recognize it as the Probe input but I am not sure.


----------



## Jamespvill

Hi Gentlemen,
Sorry to take this off topic a little, but I'm having issues with my E-stop not working...I found out it didn't work seconds before snapping 3/8" endmill clean off...
Anywho, I have it set port 1, pin 8 and active low. When I set it to not be active low I can't click the reset button on mach to start everything up and am told to reconfigure estop.

Would someone kindly provide me with a little assistance as to how to configure the Estop properly? I have a feeling I'm going to want it working right in the future.

Thanks folks!


----------



## JimDawson

On a standard parallel interface, I think the default pin for an E-stop is 13.  Pins 10 - 13 and 15 are inputs.  Pins 1 - 9, 14, 16, 17 are outputs.  It sounds like you have the E-stop on an output pin, it should be on an input.


----------



## Jamespvill

Hmm...Swapped the pin numbers around and that didn't change anything. Even then though, When I take it off active low It locks up mach and won't let me restart it. 

All these fine details keep on nipping me in the butt!


----------



## Boswell

Jamespvill,  On my PM45M-CNC the E-Stop is wired to Input 8. you can see the picture of the board a few posts back.
Here is a screen capture of the Mach3 Ports and Pins config page.



If you have it set like this and things do not work, I would recommend that you go into the diag page in mach3 and see what the E-Stop LED shows.  It could be that there is a fault on the E-STOP circuit. It is (should be) setup so that if there is a broken wire then the system will be in E-STOP mode. In other words, all of the estop switches are Normaly Closed and OPEN when pressed. I hope this makes sense.


----------



## Boswell

Take it off of Active Low and then run a jumper from the Motion control board (Pin 8) to ground. See if this works. If it does, then you probably have a bad wire, connection or switch somewhere in the circuit.  You are using a PM45M-CNC, right ?


----------



## Jamespvill

Boswell said:


> Take it off of Active Low and then run a jumper from the Motion control board (Pin 8) to ground. See if this works. If it does, then you probably have a bad wire, connection or switch somewhere in the circuit.  You are using a PM45M-CNC, right ?



Hey Boswell, I am in fact using a PM45CNC - I at least managed to get that right! 

So when I turn active low off and go to the diag page the Emergency LED is flashing red regardless of whether I have the Estop depressed or not. 

Also, looking at the board, I wanted to double check where I am gonna be poking wires...I see two "8's" on there, In and out,  which of those do I want to jump? Also, I would assume one of them would be wired to the Estop, I'm sure I'm missing something here. 

Thanks for the help!


----------



## Boswell

It should be IN #8 and yes it should be wired to your E-Stop and possibly Limit (not Home) switches. can't remember if the Limit Switches are just part of the E-Stop circuit or if they have their own circuit. You can test this quickly by manually depressing a Limit Switch, like the one on Z axis 2/3 of the way up the column. if one of the other LED's light then they are separate (this is a good thing). I think they are typically wired in series and because it is a Normaly Closed circuit, if any of the switches gets activated (OPENED) then it breaks the circuit and causes an E-STOP signal. 

Step 1. Disconnect the Pendent. Does this solve the issue ?

Step 2. Disconnect the wire that is currently in I8.  Jump I8 to ground.  If the Emergency light goes out then you can be pretty sure that it is an E-Stop Switch or the wiring to and from it. I

Step 3. Reconnect the wire in I8 and then access the back of the E-Stop switch. Visually inspect for damage or loose wires. Be sure the E-Stop switch is in the RUN position and then use a jumper to Jump across the switch. There should just be two wires going to the switch and you want to "connect" Them.  If the Emergency LED goes out then you know the switch is bad. 

It is interesting that you circuit board is different from mine. Where does the smaller ribbon cable got to ?  I assume the larger one goes to the Pendent.


----------



## Boswell

It should be IN #8 and yes it should be wired to your E-Stop and possibly Limit (not Home) switches. can't remember if the Limit Switches are just part of the E-Stop circuit or if they have their own circuit. You can test this quickly by manually depressing a Limit Switch, like the one on Z axis 2/3 of the way up the column. if one of the other LED's light then they are separate (this is a good thing). I think they are typically wired in series and because it is a Normaly Closed circuit, if any of the switches gets activated (OPENED) then it breaks the circuit and causes an E-STOP signal. 

Step 1. Be sure that Mach3 is looking for E-Stop on Pin 8. See the image I posted above to verify.

Step 2. Disconnect the Pendent. Does this solve the issue ?

Step 3. Disconnect the wire that is currently in I8.  Jump I8 to ground.  If the Emergency light goes out then you can be pretty sure that it is an E-Stop Switch or the wiring to and from it. I

Step 4. Reconnect the wire in I8 and then access the back of the E-Stop switch. Visually inspect for damage or loose wires. Be sure the E-Stop switch is in the RUN position and then use a jumper to Jump across the switch. There should just be two wires going to the switch and you want to "connect" Them.  If the Emergency LED goes out then you know the switch is bad. 

It is interesting that you circuit board is different from mine. Where does the smaller ribbon cable got to ?  I assume the larger one goes to the Pendent.


----------



## Boswell

duplicate post


----------



## Jamespvill

Boswell said:


> It should be IN #8 and yes it should be wired to your E-Stop and possibly Limit (not Home) switches. can't remember if the Limit Switches are just part of the E-Stop circuit or if they have their own circuit. You can test this quickly by manually depressing a Limit Switch, like the one on Z axis 2/3 of the way up the column. if one of the other LED's light then they are separate (this is a good thing). I think they are typically wired in series and because it is a Normaly Closed circuit, if any of the switches gets activated (OPENED) then it breaks the circuit and causes an E-STOP signal.
> 
> Step 1. Disconnect the Pendent. Does this solve the issue ?
> 
> Step 2. Disconnect the wire that is currently in I8.  Jump I8 to ground.  If the Emergency light goes out then you can be pretty sure that it is an E-Stop Switch or the wiring to and from it. I
> 
> Step 3. Reconnect the wire in I8 and then access the back of the E-Stop switch. Visually inspect for damage or loose wires. Be sure the E-Stop switch is in the RUN position and then use a jumper to Jump across the switch. There should just be two wires going to the switch and you want to "connect" Them.  If the Emergency LED goes out then you know the switch is bad.
> 
> It is interesting that you circuit board is different from mine. Where does the smaller ribbon cable got to ?  I assume the larger one goes to the Pendent.



The limit switches are on a different LED's, so that's good. 

The Pendent took a short tumble when I first got the machine set up, it ended up in 3 or 4 seperate pieces so I decided I would get a higher quality one eventually and have never plugged it in. It was subsequently dismantled for the magnet and ironically, the E-stop on it...

I don't have any wire running into I8, the angle of that picture makes it look so, but I8 is empty. I'm going to assume this may be the root of my problem? 

Both the ribbons run to a smaller board that I would have plugged my pendant into. The smaller one is labeled "MPG" and the larger "EXP".


----------



## Boswell

Thanks Jimespvill.  At this point you need to confirm where the estop button is wired to and confirm what port Mach3 thinks is the Estop circuit.  Just because it is port 8 on my system does not mean that it is Port8 on yours.  I would check the Mach3 config first and verify what port Mach3 is looking for the E-Stop, then chase down to see where the Estop is actually wired. 

My system does not have the breakout board and I only have a place to directly connect the pendent (that I don't use) I also got a better one.


----------



## Jamespvill

Whoohoo! Looks like my Estop is finally working! Followed your advice Boswell and pulled out the big-boy tools to track down the wire locations. Looks like my Estop port is I11. Which Is odd because I could have swore that my Estop worked when I first set up the machine and haven't changed anything since.

Another odd thing is that It works backwards-- only when I set it to active low, otherwise it is on when I have it pushed in and Estop's when I pull it out. 

I sure do like my PM45CNC, but it has a lot of little quirks and idiosyncrasies! Although, perhaps I shouldn't be so quick to blame the machine, I am certainly not an experienced CNC owner. Either way, I'm learning quite a bit. 

Quick question though, So the wire coming from the Estop back the the main busbar (Green with all the cover plates, wrong word?) Is then swapped to stranded wire with each one going to a different port on the controller board. Is this so that It independently stops the X, Y, Z, and spindle motors? I ask because this confused me when I was testing for continuity to see where wires were going.

Thanks for all the help Boswell!


----------



## Boswell

Glad to hear that you got it working.  Are you saying that one wire from the switch goes to I11 and only I11, The other wire goes to the terminal block where it is broken out to 4 different wires that go to which specific ports on the controller?  I don't know, but I doubt that the signal needs to go to multiple places.   One side of the switch should go to I11 and the other should either go to a voltage source, to ground or to another E-Stop switch if you have multiple but in any of the three cases it would only be 1 destination, not split to multiple ones. did you determine the connection via an ohm meter?  If so you might test the connection to Ground. It could be that all these wires just have Ground in common and this would be the most likely connection for the other side of the E-Stop switch. 

The important part is that you have it working.  I have not had to press the E-Stop on the Mill panel but a couple of times but I was glad it was there when I did.


----------



## Jamespvill

Hey Boswell,

Here is a slightly accurate diagram of the Estop wires, colors not correct. I'll have to do some more checking with the ohm meter for grounded wire. Now I'm just curious. I like playing with electricity, but I lack far too much knowledge to call myself proficient in it in any way. 

I'm glad you've never had to use your E-stop! I've managed to snap two 3/8 endmills, and only attempted to use the E-stop during one of those, thus landing me here in this conversation.


----------



## bpratl

James, that's a great looking control panel, very neat and well thought out. I would be embarrassed to show you mine. Bob


----------



## Boswell

Jamespvill said:


> Hey Boswell,
> 
> Here is a slightly accurate diagram of the Estop wires, colors not correct. I'll have to do some more checking with the ohm meter for grounded wire. Now I'm just curious. I like playing with electricity, but I lack far too much knowledge to call myself proficient in it in any way.
> 
> I'm glad you've never had to use your E-stop! I've managed to snap two 3/8 endmills, and only attempted to use the E-stop during one of those, thus landing me here in this conversation.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 97445



Just to be clear, I have crashed my Mill many time. Most of the time, it is easier to get to the E-Stop on the Mach3 screen than the big button on the switch box.

As for you wiring. My assumption is that the terminal blocks are electrically connected from top to bottom. In other words, if a wire is connected to the screw on the top then it is electrically connected to any wire that is in the screw directly below it. This is a typical expectation for terminal blocks but I will go and check mine later today just to be sure.
Based on that assumption

Connections 1;2;3;10 are all connected together and then in turn connected to one side of the E-Stop switch ("From Estop").  You show that  the wire labeled "To Estop" is not connected to anything. I goes to the bottom of the terminal block but there is no second wire on the same screw and there is no wire on the screw directly above.   Not sure what to make of that.  

I would be curious if you go into Mach3 "Ports and Pins" config screens and look at the "Input" tab, do you see the entry for pins 1,2 & 3 ?  What does Mach3 think these inputs are for?
I don't think it would help for me to check mine as it is clear we have different controller boards.


----------



## Boswell

one more thing. Be sure that you have removed power including the USB cable when you are using the ohm meter to check connectivity. .


----------



## Jamespvill

bpratl said:


> James, that's a great looking control panel, very neat and well thought out. I would be embarrassed to show you mine. Bob



Hey Bob, I can't take a single ounce of credit for the look of the control panel, the good folks overseas did all the work for me! It looks as though you converted your own CNC. You sir deserve some kudos, I certainly don't have the brass for that kind of undertaking. Regardless of how neat and tidy things are I'm impressed either way!


----------



## Jamespvill

Boswell said:


> Just to be clear, I have crashed my Mill many time. Most of the time, it is easier to get to the E-Stop on the Mach3 screen than the big button on the switch box.
> 
> As for you wiring. My assumption is that the terminal blocks are electrically connected from top to bottom. In other words, if a wire is connected to the screw on the top then it is electrically connected to any wire that is in the screw directly below it. This is a typical expectation for terminal blocks but I will go and check mine later today just to be sure.
> Based on that assumption
> 
> Connections 1;2;3;10 are all connected together and then in turn connected to one side of the E-Stop switch ("From Estop").  You show that  the wire labeled "To Estop" is not connected to anything. I goes to the bottom of the terminal block but there is no second wire on the same screw and there is no wire on the screw directly above.   Not sure what to make of that.
> 
> I would be curious if you go into Mach3 "Ports and Pins" config screens and look at the "Input" tab, do you see the entry for pins 1,2 & 3 ?  What does Mach3 think these inputs are for?
> I don't think it would help for me to check mine as it is clear we have different controller boards.



I'm glad I'm not the only one crashing my mill like it's going out of style! (Okay, not really that much, just a few times)

You are correct that the tops and bottoms of the terminal connectors are connected. I will get back to you on what mach thinks those ports are. Unfortunately today was a no-shop, all final exam preparation day.



Boswell said:


> one more thing. Be sure that you have removed power including the USB cable when you are using the ohm meter to check connectivity. .



Guess what happened to my _*last*_ cheapy ohm meter


----------



## jumps4

I just tried to clean up the duplicate posts at the end of this thread.
there were 4 
2 that read exactly the same, and 2 that said just duplicate
I clicked delete on the last item and it took all 4
If I deleted your post Please re-post and I'm sorry
this new software is a learning curve
I think I'll wait until the bugs are worked out
Steve


----------



## Boswell

jumps4 said:


> I just tried to clean up the duplicate posts at the end of this thread.
> there were 4
> 2 that read exactly the same, and 2 that said just duplicate
> I clicked delete on the last item and it took all 4
> If I deleted your post Please re-post and I'm sorry
> this new software is a learning curve
> I think I'll wait until the bugs are worked out
> Steve


No worries. Thanks for all the work that you do for the forum !


----------



## totalyfrozen

Boswell said:


> I figured we could use a thread specific to configuration of the Precision Mathews 45M-CNC. This will make it easier for people to find from searches in the future.
> 
> I have attached my XML configuration file. I am not sure if it is directly interchangeable with other systems but likely it is with the one issue that I have the PBJ Multi Interface ScreenSet 2013 installed.
> Just put this in the MACH3 directory and it should show up in the list of systems when you use the Mach3 loader.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 71216



Do you think this would work for a converted PM-45M? New to this and picked up one that was converted to CNC using the Gecko G540. Mach 3 runs, but when I am just trying to engrave lettering the machine engraves it way too large from what I did in inkscape.. in Aspire it will only do a couple of letters.. so was curious if there was some settings in Mach 3 that I was missing from what I installed from the xml file from gecko for mach3 .I am totally new to this if you havent already figured that out haha!


----------



## Boswell

The configuration of Mach 3 (which is stored in the XML file) is very dependent on the Motion Control board, how the drive train is designed and other factors. So while you might save some time by STARTING with an established config (XML file) it would be unlikely that it will work without further modifications.
Have you done any calibration tests where you use the MSI to input simple movement gcode and then measure that movement?  In other words, if you issue a G0 X2.0 does it move exactly 2 inches (or cm)?  Be sure you have also tested things like the E-STOP and hope switches to be sure they are working properly.


----------



## totalyfrozen

Boswell said:


> The configuration of Mach 3 (which is stored in the XML file) is very dependent on the Motion Control board, how the drive train is designed and other factors. So while you might save some time by STARTING with an established config (XML file) it would be unlikely that it will work without further modifications.
> Have you done any calibration tests where you use the MSI to input simple movement gcode and then measure that movement?  In other words, if you issue a G0 X2.0 does it move exactly 2 inches (or cm)?  Be sure you have also tested things like the E-STOP and hope switches to be sure they are working properly.



Thanks,
Good point, I have not check to see if it travels in cm or inches. I will check that out tonight. E-STOP works. The Limit/Home switches where never setup got this second hand. I am working on those also.


----------



## Boswell

Once you verify that you are in the correct units (inches vs cm) then if that does not resolve it 
And
you have verified that G0 X2 moved 2 no more or less
Then
the I would look at the GCode for the engraving to verify if the issue is with the GCODE or the MILL.   In other words, if you are expecting 1" tall letters but getting 2" tall letters then you need to be sure where the issue is, With the GCODE or with the MILL.


----------



## totalyfrozen

Boswell said:


> Once you verify that you are in the correct units (inches vs cm) then if that does not resolve it
> And
> you have verified that G0 X2 moved 2 no more or less
> Then
> the I would look at the GCode for the engraving to verify if the issue is with the GCODE or the MILL.   In other words, if you are expecting 1" tall letters but getting 2" tall letters then you need to be sure where the issue is, With the GCODE or with the MILL.



Awesome thanks!


----------



## damo green

lim1wph said:


> Hello Boswell,  Are you using 12,800 spm on your machine and how did you come to find it? Was it that Calibration Button on the settings page? I just wondered why it's different than the Setup instructions.  Thanks, Bill


12,800 is dead on for me. By the way are these lead screws really ball screws? They look like delrin nuts to me....?


----------



## qualitymachinetools

Hey guys, Great Thread! Very helpful, I appreciate it! I even learn from you guys too, so its very, very helpful!

 To answer the last question, YES they are ball screws, the delrin is just on the end of the nut there, but yes, absolutely, ball screws on all 3 - X, Y, and Z Axis on the 45M-CNC and new 940 CNC thats coming out.


----------



## damo green

OK,  good to hear they are ball screws, fine pitch for a Ball Screw thanks for the quick reply.  
I have one  tip : Put a stop on the arm of the switch box, so it can't be rotated too close to the spindle head, otherwise it can catch on the quill's spring cover and when the Z axis raises....ouch,.....don't ask how i know, ,lol.  I just glued a small wooden block to prevent this happening again.


----------



## damo green

FYI , my PM45CNC has <= .001" backlash n the X axis ,nice work.


----------



## Jamespvill

Gentlemen, quick question...

What are your fastest rapids on your PM45CNC's? I seem to be maxing out at 20ipm and I'm starting to get this CNC thing down...which means I need to try and make things go faster and consequently break other things faster!

Joking aside, is everyone else in the same boat as I in respects to travel speed?

Also, sometimes when profiling and moving in a direction that requires the use of both axis at once my machine will start to get jerky and move one axis, then the other while going around radius and things of the like. (Imagine stair-stepping rather than a smooth radius). While not horrible, it is very, very annoying. It is also slowing down cycle times and giving me spotty finishes. 

Has anyone else noticed this? I'm curious if it is mach, bobcad, or the machine itself...perhaps the motion controller?


----------



## damo green

MUCH faster than 20 ipm,  can't remember where mine are at right now, but the horizontals are around 100 (or more), the Z can sometimes do 75 or so, but sometimes the steppers may skip going up, so I have it around 75 or 50 ipm right now.....i'm still a new user so have not settled on a number yet, just being conservative. Could counterbalance/spring the weight of the head to get faster Z's someday.  Don't forget to experiment with the acceleration rates also, (sliding friction is less than static,inertia..yada yad yada)


----------



## Jamespvill

Whoohoo!! We're cruising now! Obviously the "Velocity in IPM" in the motor tuning and setup is where to configure the speed. Not sure why I set it at 19.98... Thanks for the info Damo! Now I actually have rapids.

Unfortunately, as predicted, just like a teenager with a mustang; I've gotten myself in trouble with the speed! Something has gone horribly awry!


Actually this has happened before and I just put the gib back in place and tightened it without really giving it a good lookin'. But I looked close this time and the tension screw isn't actually engaging the gib at all, just sort of pushing on its side. Now it slides out every time I rapid North on my Y. Is anyone else's Y axis gib looking like this?


I looked at my PM45 932M and it is very different and is engaging fully.


----------



## damo green

lol, kind of funny, JUST yesterday i was tuning up my backlash and noticed that there is marginal overlap of the adjuster screw heads over the end of the gibs....especially since the fit of the OD of the screw head is not as precisely located radially by the hole I.D as it could be...vs screw pressure.  I modified a fender washer into a "tab" with a hole in it to provide better overlap, it's not necessarily worth starting with a fender washer as you may end up making the same from scratch easier.      An even better way may be to weld up the "point" of the gib to get it closer to the adjuster screw centerline.   Part of the problem is that at certain gib positions the screw head is past the outside of the hole entrance (axially and then radially) , then when tightened in this (erroneous) position it performs an unwanted chamfering procedure...


----------



## damo green

Right now, I'm trying to diagnose some Z  axis noise, I think it is just chatter from backdriving the unloaded  manual drive gear (backlash)  . I may try to grease the manual Z drive gear. This requires moving the CNC electrical cabinet. If so I may try to add a lubing port so that the cabinet does not have to be removed.  I tried putting some load on the manual shaft as a diagnostic aid , it does   help. Could possibly be the handle bearings also. I don't think it is critical, just annoying.  Even if it is chatter at the drive gear at least this part of the ball screw is never in contact with the ball screw bearing nut.   So wear here is not critical, but still would like to avoid any and the noise.
  For reference:
http://cdn1.grizzly.com/manuals/g0755_m.pdf   (see figure 52 p. 34 )


----------



## Jamespvill

damo green said:


> lol, kind of funny, JUST yesterday i was tuning up my backlash and noticed that there is marginal overlap of the adjuster screw heads over the end of the gibs....especially since the fit of the OD of the screw head is not as precisely located radially by the hole I.D as it could be...vs screw pressure.  I modified a fender washer into a "tab" with a hole in it to provide better overlap, it's not necessarily worth starting with a fender washer as you may end up making the same from scratch easier.      An even better way may be to weld up the "point" of the gib to get it closer to the adjuster screw centerline.   Part of the problem is that at certain gib positions the screw head is past the outside of the hole entrance (axially and then radially) , then when tightened in this (erroneous) position it performs an unwanted chamfering procedure...



Glad I'm not the only one with this issue, I figured it was something that needed to be modified but just wanted to confirm that it wasn't some sort of "Quick release gib feature" that I missed. I may just sink a small screw screw into the gib so the adjustment screw can engage on that or go your route and machine up something with a tab. I'm not familiar with welding cast so I'll leave for another day (I'm assuming the gib is cast iron?). 

As you stated, the chamfering procedure is interesting...Almost funny. Sure is efficient though!

I've also got some noise in my Z. Only while traveling up though. If you figure it out, would you mind passing on your findings?


----------



## damo green

VERY IMPORTANT WARNING: On MY Vista laptop when using <SHIFT>  to overide STEP Jog Mode into continuous....you MUST release the directional key BEFORE you release the shift key, otherwise the axis will continue moving at Rapid speed until it crashes or hits a limit .  This is problem is pretty easy to find on google...I believe some think the culprit   is the motion card and not Mach3....but I have not gotten that deep into it yet.  My PM45CNC was bought in Spring 2015...if that helps, I don't have the exact Controller date or other I.D yet.


----------



## Jamespvill

Hey Folks,

Is anyone running flood coolant with their machines and running it via Mach?


----------



## GaryL

Boswell said:


> See the thread I created in the Precision Matthews section on the G31 issues. While I can get the probe to indicate using the diagnostic LED display, the G31 command will not work at all. No Motion. I am asking for others to try a G31 command on the MDI to see if this is unique to my system or an issue with this Motion Controller.
> 
> GaryL. That is very interesting. By default Mach3 looks for the probe on Input #7.  There may be a way to use a different input and have Mach3 recognize it as the Probe input but I am not sure.



Well I did get a probe to work in Probe-it on my PM45M CNC, all I had to do is replace the Chinese motion/BOB with an Ethernet smooth stepper, a PMDX-126, and a PMDX-107. Now everything seems to be working as it should.


----------



## damo green

I suppose backlash compensation now works with the Smooth stepper?  Have you tried it yet?  I could not get it to have any effect with the chinese one that comes with the PM machine.


----------



## Boswell

GaryL said:


> Well I did get a probe to work in Probe-it on my PM45M CNC, all I had to do is replace the Chinese motion/BOB with an Ethernet smooth stepper, a PMDX-126, and a PMDX-107. Now everything seems to be working as it should.



Outstanding!  was it difficult to replace the motion controller?


----------



## GaryL

Well it took me about 2 weeks to get it all figured out, but now I could do it in about a day.


----------



## GaryL

damo green said:


> I suppose backlash compensation now works with the Smooth stepper?  Have you tried it yet?  I could not get it to have any effect with the chinese one that comes with the PM machine.


I have not yet got a chance to try the backlash compensation, but my hand held pendant (imach P2S) now works perfectly and so far the probe-it is working with my probe. I managed to get a bit behind doing the board swap so it might be a while before I can check out the backlash compensation.


----------



## Boswell

GaryL said:


> Well it took me about 2 weeks to get it all figured out, but now I could do it in about a day.


I have been considering the same sort of conversion. Was it as simple as identifying the wires on the existing board and then moving them to the same functional connection on the new break out board? Any Gotcha's to look out for?


----------



## GaryL

Boswell said:


> I have been considering the same sort of conversion. Was it as simple as identifying the wires on the existing board and then moving them to the same functional connection on the new break out board? Any Gotcha's to look out for?


Just about that simple. The estop did not work because the new bob was expecting a normally closed switch and ours is a normally open. To get around that just leave the jumper on the estop connections on the bob and hook the estop to the fault connection and it accomplishes the same thing. If you do try the conversion  I could get the  setup info to you and pictures of setup screens and the way I mounted the new boards. That is assuming you use the same boards.


----------



## Boswell

OK, any issues with wire lengths and mounting?  I am in the middle of a couple of big projects right now but I think I am going to order the parts and do the upgrade in a few weeks when I get "the Bench" clear. 
Thanks for pioneering this. I have long thought that the motion controller board was a weak part of the PM-45 and this seems like a great way to address this with a somewhat standard solution. Setup information and pictures would be great but no hurry as I won't get to this for a few weeks.


----------



## GaryL

Boswell said:


> OK, any issues with wire lengths and mounting?  I am in the middle of a couple of big projects right now but I think I am going to order the parts and do the upgrade in a few weeks when I get "the Bench" clear.
> Thanks for pioneering this. I have long thought that the motion controller board was a weak part of the PM-45 and this seems like a great way to address this with a somewhat standard solution. Setup information and pictures would be great but no hurry as I won't get to this for a few weeks.



The wires were all long enough, but as you can see from the attached photos, I had to add a few. I built the brackets out of aluminum.


----------



## Boswell

Thanks for the photo's. The aluminum brackets look like a good simple solution.


----------



## Boswell

GaryL said:


> The wires were all long enough, but as you can see from the attached photos, I had to add a few. I built the brackets out of aluminum.
> 
> View attachment 125658
> View attachment 125659
> View attachment 125660
> View attachment 125661



I ordered the Ethernet smooth stepper and the PMDX-126 and 107 boards. They should arrive early next week. I want to get my probe working and I want to check out Mach4 and this seems like the best way forward. I'll let you know how it goes.   Thanks GaryL for paving the way !


----------



## GaryL

Great, I think you will find these a definite improvement. You can set up the Smooth stepper with your computer without connection to the pmdx-126, then it will be ready to go when you hook it up.  If you have any questions, just ask.
I will be interested in how this works with Mach4.


----------



## jbolt

Boswell said:


> I ordered the Ethernet smooth stepper and the PMDX-126 and 107 boards. They should arrive early next week. I want to get my probe working and I want to check out Mach4 and this seems like the best way forward. I'll let you know how it goes.


 
I have this combo on my PM932 conversion and have been extremely pleased with it. I really like the PMDX products and their support is awesome. My only complaint is the manuals are written for someone who knows what they are doing and some of the terms are confusing. Once you get it setup it seems too simple. I will also be interested to hear what you think of Mach4. I'm about done fighting Mach3 randomly not turning on the spindle.


----------



## Boswell

The parts have shipped and I am just waiting for them to arrive.  I'll share my experience once I get it up and running.  What kind of Pwr supply did you both use for the SmoothStepper?   The manual recommends against using  a switching supply but I am having problems finding a linear supply for 5v other than a wall-wart.


----------



## GaryL

The one that I am using is the Mean Well PS-05-5. This is the one that is in the pictures. I have also successfully used (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01BN0GZKY/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o08_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1).


----------



## jbolt

Boswell said:


> The parts have shipped and I am just waiting for them to arrive.  I'll share my experience once I get it up and running.  What kind of Pwr supply did you both use for the SmoothStepper?   The manual recommends against using  a switching supply but I am having problems finding a linear supply for 5v other than a wall-wart.



If you mount the smoothstepper on the PMDX-126 and use the recommended ribbon cables the PMDX-126 will provide the 5v power for the smoothstepper.


----------



## Boswell

jbolt said:


> If you mount the smoothstepper on the PMDX-126 and use the recommended ribbon cables the PMDX-126 will provide the 5v power for the smoothstepper.



Well, if you did into the instructions some they say that if you are going to use a PMDX-107 daughterboard then you must power the Smoothstepper separately. 
Anyway, I found and affordable Linear 5v power supply so I am good to go. Just waiting for the parts and some time.  Hopefully this coming weekend I will have time to work on it. It does not look like a difficult installation. Probably more time spend on fabricating the brackets that wiring up the boards. (I hope)


----------



## jbolt

Boswell said:


> Well, if you did into the instructions some they say that if you are going to use a PMDX-107 daughterboard then you must power the Smoothstepper separately.
> Anyway, I found and affordable Linear 5v power supply so I am good to go. Just waiting for the parts and some time.  Hopefully this coming weekend I will have time to work on it. It does not look like a difficult installation. Probably more time spend on fabricating the brackets that wiring up the boards. (I hope)



Yep your right, I forgot about that. I used a power supply similar to this. 

https://www.amazon.com/uxcell®-Swit...1468354569&sr=8-13&keywords=5vdc+power+supply


----------



## Boswell

I have received the Ethernet Smoothstepper and the PMDX-126 and PMDX-107 and I hope to work on the upgrade this weekend. 

GaryL,   Do you happen to have a chart that shows what Connections on the PMDX-126 that you used for which functions?  I figured if you had this it would make it easier to compare and share if we both used the same I/O configuration. Sort of a Quasi standard if you will.  I can tell by your pictures that you used J1, J2, J3 and J4 for X-Y-Z-A axis.   Any other config documents that you have handy could be useful.


----------



## GaryL

I will work on it and should have it by the end of the day, along with some screen shots of the mach3 setup.


----------



## Boswell

Thank you very much Gary!

You Gotta Love online communities !


----------



## GaryL




----------



## GaryL




----------



## GaryL

Hello Boswell, I have changed my XYZ to start at the lower left corner. Also the 2 blue wires (017) that were connected on the upper left corner of the old card don't go on the new board they are just connected together.
If our cable numbering is not the same let me know and I will reference the function of each wire.


----------



## GaryL

I just noticed that our original boards are a little bit different, for example mine has no COM+ or COM-.
Here is a picture of my original board and the wire descriptions.


----------



## Boswell

OMG.   This is great. Thank you so much for taking the time to provide such detailed information. This should make short work of getting mine upgraded. 
I have powered both boards on my workbench and have a test configuration of both Mach3 and Mach4 talking to the smoothstepper board so all that is left is to build a mounting bracket and then move the wires over. I'll give an update this weekend on how it is going.   Thanks again for the wonderfully detailed notes and pictures


----------



## Boswell

I have finished comparing your configuration with mine and there are some differences in how our Mill's were wired but manageable.  In general the same wire numbers are used but the X and Y axis Step/Dir/+5  sets are swapped (no big deal) and I have the X-Y-Z Limit switches wired together and going into one Input where you have them as discrete wires. Also not a big deal.   I think I have it all planned out now. Tomorrow Morning I'll make the Brackets and get the physical work done and move on to swapping out the boards. 
Once again. Thank You Gary for your great documentation!


----------



## GaryL

Hello Boswell, I was curious about which power supply you ended up with to power the SmoothStepper.


----------



## Boswell

The warning against using a switching power supply for very low current levels is a valid one and generally with a switching supply it would be good to add and electrolytic capacitor on the DC side. I decided to avoid all of that and go with a Linear supply. I found one from Mouser rated at 100-240 VAC in and 5v DC at 1000mA out. It is also fully encapsulated and small. It cost $26. Part number 490-VSK-S5-5UA-T  and made by a company called CUI


----------



## Boswell

I completed the Bracket and mounted the power supply  and PMDX-126 with the smoothstepper on it. I used Locktite on the screws holding the standoffs onto the base plate and lock-washers on the screws holding the angle brackets.  Tomorrow Morning (when it is much cooler) I'll disconnect the old chinese board . I will have to drill 4 holes to mount the base plate to the equipment box and then start wiring it up. Hopefully by this time tomorrow I will have it all done and tested.


----------



## Boswell

Well, as I posted the picture of the backplate with the PMDX-126 mounted I realized I needed some way to get wires under the backplate. So I cut a large relief to allow wires to come in from below as well as above. I just cut it on the bandsaw by hand so it is a little rough looking  (rounded the edges with a file so wires will not nicked.)


----------



## GaryL

It looks like you are ready. On another point, once you get the Smoothstepper  configured properly you should shut down mach before removing power from the Smoothstepper and you should apply power to the Smoothstepper prior to launching Mach. If I don't do this on my setup I have to reconfigure it again.


----------



## Boswell

I got the Smoothstepper and the PMDC-126 mounted and wired in. I can see that they are getting power and Mach3 is talking to them OK but no motion. I ran out of time this weekend to work on it but I think it has to do with the E-Stop.  I don't think it will be a big deal to resolve once I can spend a little time to troubleshoot. I'll probably get to it one evening this week.


----------



## Boswell

Well,  I found 20 min that I could work on finishing up and got it working. Apparently Gary's E-Stop and mine are not the same. I was able to wire my Estop into the connector the way it was intended meaning that my estop button is Normally Closed as it common for E-STOP and Limit Switches. I also found that I had wired the Step and Dir wires backwards, not sure how I did that but it was easy to fix and it is all up and running and I am ready to make swarf.
*A Huge thank you to Gary for doing this first and for taking the time to document what you did. This made the job significantly easier and much less scary.*


----------



## GaryL

Hello Boswell, glad to hear that you got it all working.


----------



## Boswell

I went out at lunch today and hooked up the probe I had bought awhile back. It worked perfectly!  It just keeps getting better and better.


----------



## Boswell

Just wanted to say again how happy I am with the PMDX and ETHERNET SMOOTHSTEPPER combination.  With one exception it has worked perfectly and in fact two important features are now working, Backlash compensation and the Probe.   The one thing that I have had a minor issue with is that occasionally the Smoothstepper looses connection (buffer runs empty) causing it to (quite smartly) shutdown. Only once has this happened while actually making a part and the other few times have been when manually jogging during setup.  I did not install an isolated ethernet connection between the MACH3 system and the smoothstepper that is recommended in the Smoothstepper documentation so I have ordered a second Ethernet adapter (NIC) to install in the MACH3 system.


----------



## GaryL

Hello Boswell, I am glad that it is working out well for you. I have not seen the issue of the Smoothstepper loosing connection, but the Smoothstepper is the only device that connects to the Ethernet port on my computer. 
Also it is good to hear that the backlash works.
Have you tried using it with Mach4?


----------



## Boswell

I loaded Mach4 but did not do much because I did not like the default UI have not seen hardly any alternative UI's.  It short, I did not see any advantage at this point over my Mach3 with the MachMotion screen set. I'll check back in a few months but it is nice to know the system is now "Future Proof" to the extent possible.


----------



## rdean

Buffer run empty only happens to me when I have a huge program with the 4th axis(rotary).  It is caused by the video display of my computer not being fast enough to update the screen and send the pulses in a timely manner.  If I disable the Mach3 tool path display it works fine.  This is a known problem as are the other two you mentioned. 

Ray


----------



## Boswell

Ray, this is brilliant. I think the tool path display is a waste of monitor space anyway. I'll have to see if I can disable it in the MachMotion screen set I use.

thanks


----------



## joehardee

Ray C said:


> Here's an updated version (Draft II) of the Software and Driver Setup manual and an additional draft document covering Homing and Setting Limit Switches.  There are two documents because of their large byte size.  The first document is just cleaned up a little with no changes to the technical content.
> 
> Please let me know if this stuff is helping you folks so I can get some idea if I'm knocking myself out for nothing...  Comments and suggestion for content and to improve readability are welcome.
> 
> 
> Once again, I'd like to thank a nameless person for proofreading the latest doc...  Once we get beyond "draft" status, I'll put editor information in there.  I'm going to keep these in "Work Instruction" format as I hate pedantic manuals with all kinds of headings, titles, lists of figure -and all that crap.  Beef.  I want beef -no fluff.
> 
> 
> Ray...
> 
> View attachment 71807
> 
> 
> View attachment 71808



Thanks for the installation guide for  the PM-45-cnc. So here is my problem I bought a PM-45-cnc second hand from a guy that use it very little. He bought it from an auction.He set the machine up and it work for what he needed it to do. When I got the machine it would not home or continuous  jog. It steps jogs and runs g code just fine. When I continuous jog it just clunks not loud. When I try to ref any home it the same.   I have and still make part on it daily . The past owner (2 owner Im 3) had the same problem. I have went the all the install guide all my setting are the same as what it says. Except for the driver.   The only driver that I could find for the  jcn-40 was ver 1.42 and that is what is installed. I have see here that some machine are wired a little different. Could it bee that i need to switch some pins around? or could it be the diver ver. if so could you give me a link to the ver in the guide. or email  to me?


----------



## Boswell

Joehardee,   One thing I can think of to check is what your maximum RAPID speed is. Possibly it is trying to go too fast for the steppers to keep up and so they just don't do anything. As for the control board and driver, that has been a weak point of this mill. Once working it seems to work OK but the documentation is a challenge to understand and it does not look like they have or likely will release an updated driver. Both GarlyL and myself have replaced the motion controller that came with the mill with a Smoothstepper board with great success so that might be an option.  The fact that you can use the mill implies that the basics are working.   When you try to do a continuous JOG are you using the keyboard or the pendent that came with the unit? What if you slow the override down to 50% or 25% will it still not continuous Jog?  I assume that when you do a continuous JOG it does not move but MACH3 reports that it is moving, correct? If so, what is the IPS that MACH3 is saying it is moving when you do a continuous JOG?   I bet with some patience we can figure this out.


----------



## joehardee

Boswell said:


> Joehardee,   One thing I can think of to check is what your maximum RAPID speed is. Possibly it is trying to go too fast for the steppers to keep up and so they just don't do anything. As for the control board and driver, that has been a weak point of this mill. Once working it seems to work OK but the documentation is a challenge to understand and it does not look like they have or likely will release an updated driver. Both GarlyL and myself have replaced the motion controller that came with the mill with a Smoothstepper board with great success so that might be an option.  The fact that you can use the mill implies that the basics are working.   When you try to do a continuous JOG are you using the keyboard or the pendent that came with the unit? What if you slow the override down to 50% or 25% will it still not continuous Jog?  I assume that when you do a continuous JOG it does not move but MACH3 reports that it is moving, correct? If so, what is the IPS that MACH3 is saying it is moving when you do a continuous JOG?   I bet with some patience we can figure this out.



ok by the maximum rapid speed  are you taking about in motor tuning? or is there some other setting some were else. I have tuned the motors down as low as 10 velocity and .5 on acceleration but have no change on jog. all it dose is change the sound of the clunks .I have an imach pendent it works the same as the keyboard. I even removed it and the dll for it to see if it was the cause. Yes mach3 dose report back that it is moving. it reports back .o10 for each hit of the key and the unit/min for flash .26 for a second.


----------



## Boswell

Joehardee,   what happens if you hold down the movement key when in continuous jog mode (or continuously spin the dial on the pendent? Does the DRO show it moving (not 0.010 but continuously) even if the table is not?  Do you get the same response in all three axis?  If you look at the hand wheel when you try to do a continuous jog, does it move at all like a little movement when you here the Clunk?   If you can issue a G0 movement command and a G1 movement command then I don't see how it could be a Motor tuning issue.  I guess you could re-install MACH3


----------



## joehardee

Boswell said:


> Joehardee,   what happens if you hold down the movement key when in continuous jog mode (or continuously spin the dial on the pendent? Does the DRO show it moving (not 0.010 but continuously) even if the table is not?  Do you get the same response in all three axis?  If you look at the hand wheel when you try to do a continuous jog, does it move at all like a little movement when you here the Clunk?   If you can issue a G0 movement command and a G1 movement command then I don't see how it could be a Motor tuning issue.  I guess you could re-install MACH3



let me try to reword this, when I am on continuous jog (yellow light on the tab flyout screen) the dro only moves if i keep hitting the jog direction. It wont  move if I hold down. ctrl + jog key is the same. The pendent reacts the almost the same with spinning of the dial. If I have it on velocity mode and turn very slow it will move. It will not move on Continuous mode. If I send G0 it rapids fine. i reinstalled mach today with the same results. thats what is strange about this is that it all works but the continuous and homing the machine. it runs any g code  i send to it and performs great. if you have any other ideas let me know. how much was the smooth stepper upgarde?


----------



## joehardee

Hey guys im in the middle of doing the PDMX and stoomth steppper. I have a dumb question. where did you guys ground to the pc at? Im refereeing to the ground buss on the xyz stepper out. the one that Grayl has label ground to computer


----------



## GaryL

I just ran a wire to the back side of the computer case, but I should mention that was just a guess on my part.


----------



## joehardee

GaryL said:


> I just ran a wire to the back side of the computer case, but I should mention that was just a guess on my part.


Thank you


----------



## Boswell

I know I did not run any extra wires to my PC. It is connected to the AC Ground via the power plug and an Ethernet switch via LAN cable. We know Ethernet works fine with out running extra ground cables because it is used this way in millions of situations.  I think the concern for careful grounding is more important if you are directly connecting to the PC via Parallel Ports.  I don't remember exactly what I did with the ground connections on the BOB but probably connected them to the chassis ground of the Mill.


----------



## joehardee

Guys i think i need some help. i have no motion dros move but movement of xyz. Boswell my mill is wired like yours. Meaning that dir,steps, e stop, and limts were different then GrayL. so here are the symptoms. 1 the status light on the 126 flash a code that i cant find any info on. it just flash 2.  not a 3 then something like the manual codes refer to. this starts right after i hit the reset  in mach3. 2 when i jog from the key broad the steps light on the 126 by the status flash. it looks like there are leds by the output port of the 126. Do those flash to? 3 did you guy have to do any thing to the 126 before you installed it. like change jumper or install software.


----------



## joehardee

hey guys i got it what it was is my 126 shipped or i lost the jumper on jp6 so there where no outputs


----------



## Boswell

Joe, good to see you found the problem. Is it all working now?


----------



## joehardee

Boswell said:


> Joe, good to see you found the problem. Is it all working now?


yes and no lol. when I frist stast mach 3  it woks fine. meaning  in input x1 it moves 1" but as soon as i load a g code it. it scales up. x1 is like 3+ inches. this is gcode that is known to run before the card. i never had this happen before. but the mach was trun key when i got it. is the a mach 3 scale setting im misssing? or in the smooth stepper?


----------



## joehardee

joehardee said:


> yes and no lol. when I frist stast mach 3  it woks fine. meaning  in input x1 it moves 1" but as soon as i load a g code it. it scales up. x1 is like 3+ inches. this is gcode that is known to run before the card. i never had this happen before. but the mach was trun key when i got it. is the a mach 3 scale setting im misssing? or in the smooth stepper?


 nevermind i need to sleep or some thing! Had it on mm. and loading inch g code. lol


----------



## Boswell

Just keep the questions coming. It seems to be working


----------



## joehardee

Just like say after a couple of days running and playing around with the pmdx and smoothstepper on my mill, I am total happy with the upgrade. It is was well worth the couple of panic attacks I had. Just to confirm the backlash comp works , probe it works, my flood coolant works, my imach pendent works right for change. I would like to thank GaryL for the hard work he went through to make it so easy for me to do also a thanks to Boswell for noting the wiring differences in these machines and the quick replay time. Now on a new subject Has any one had any luck with a tool touch plate to auto Z0? what Im meaning is when i go to say g28 and change to a new tool it would come down and hit the plate or something and set zero for the tool.


----------



## TomS

joehardee said:


> Just like say after a couple of days running and playing around with the pmdx and smoothstepper on my mill, I am total happy with the upgrade. It is was well worth the couple of panic attacks I had. Just to confirm the backlash comp works , probe it works, my flood coolant works, my imach pendent works right for change. I would like to thank GaryL for the hard work he went through to make it so easy for me to do also a thanks to Boswell for noting the wiring differences in these machines and the quick replay time. Now on a new subject Has any one had any luck with a tool touch plate to auto Z0? what Im meaning is when i go to say g28 and change to a new tool it would come down and hit the plate or something and set zero for the tool.



Is this what you are looking for in the way of a tool setter?  




Dimensions are 2" x 2" x 1" thick.  Simple to make and easy to use.  I will copy the button script when I get to the shop later this morning.

Tom S.


----------



## TomS

TomS said:


> Is this what you are looking for in the way of a tool setter?
> View attachment 141418
> View attachment 141419
> 
> 
> Dimensions are 2" x 2" x 1" thick.  Simple to make and easy to use.  I will copy the button script when I get to the shop later this morning.
> 
> Tom S.



Here's the script.


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## joehardee

TomS said:


> Here's the script.


Thank you when I get caught up give it a try.


----------



## Boswell

Tom, Do you place your tool setter on top of your workpiece (or wherever Z=0 for the part you are making)  or do you zero to a known location and use the tool offset table?
Is the Z-Setter spring loaded? It does not look like it from the picture and if it is not spring loaded, how to you keep from having problems with over-travel when setting Z?

Thanks


----------



## Boswell

joehardee said:


> Just like say after a couple of days running and playing around with the pmdx and smoothstepper on my mill, I am total happy with the upgrade. It is was well worth the couple of panic attacks I had. Just to confirm the backlash comp works , probe it works, my flood coolant works, my imach pendent works right for change. I would like to thank GaryL for the hard work he went through to make it so easy for me to do also a thanks to Boswell for noting the wiring differences in these machines and the quick replay time. Now on a new subject Has any one had any luck with a tool touch plate to auto Z0? what Im meaning is when i go to say g28 and change to a new tool it would come down and hit the plate or something and set zero for the tool.




Joe,  I glad to hear that you got it a ll working. Just being able to use Probeit was work the effort  for me.


----------



## TomS

Boswell said:


> Tom, Do you place your tool setter on top of your workpiece (or wherever Z=0 for the part you are making)  or do you zero to a known location and use the tool offset table?
> Is the Z-Setter spring loaded? It does not look like it from the picture and if it is not spring loaded, how to you keep from having problems with over-travel when setting Z?
> 
> Thanks



I don't use the tool offset table, yet.  Haven't progressed to jobs that use more than 2 or three tools.  As I become more proficient and run more complex jobs then I'll need to learn how to use the offset table.  So to answer your question, I set the tool setter on my work piece to set Z zero.  Takes less than 30 seconds to set the tool height.  It is not spring loaded and I've not had a problem with over-travel.  To make sure I haven't lost connection I go to the Diagnostics screen and touch the tool setter to the tool and make sure the light comes on.  And I have the feed rate set low.  Can't remember the exact number but it's less than 10 IPM.  Also have my hand on the e-stop just in case. 

Edit:  There is script available on the net that not only sets your Z zero but also updates the tool offset table.  Can't remember where I found it and haven't tried it so don't know how well it works, if at all.

Tom S.


----------



## joehardee

Boswell said:


> Joe,  I glad to hear that you got it a ll working. Just being able to use Probeit was work the effort  for me.


I have a probeit question. When you do a basic xyz probe. from the basic xy page. dose it set the z at the half the diameter of the probe you entered. Meaning when i go to zero after im done the ball is below the z surface that i  just probe.


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## Boswell

Joe, I have never used Probit to set Z. Only x and y. I have a LED based z-setter that I use manually to set Z.  Unless you are going to use a Tool Table, there is no value that I can think of to use the probe to zero the Z. You will just have to redo the Z Zero when you put the tool in you are going to cut with.


----------



## Boswell

Yesterday I was in the process of re-calibrating my probe with Probit and I had an un-commanded spindle event.  2500 RPM  with the probe in a chuck.  Hit the Big Red E-STOP button to shut it down. Lucky I did not have my hand close so the only damage was to the probe. The wire was broken. I will spice it back but odds are the wire is damaged in places that are not obvious but we will see.  The real scare was the un-commanded spindle turn on. I don't know if this was a Mach3 issue, a Probit issue, a SmoothStepper issue or the BOB.  

I think that I will ensure that I have the E-Stop engaged anytime that I have my hands near the moving parts.  A good reminder that these are dangerous machines and it is easy to get complacent with them.


----------



## rdlanning

Ray C said:


> Here's an updated version (Draft II) of the Software and Driver Setup manual and an additional draft document covering Homing and Setting Limit Switches.  There are two documents because of their large byte size.  The first document is just cleaned up a little with no changes to the technical content.
> 
> Please let me know if this stuff is helping you folks so I can get some idea if I'm knocking myself out for nothing...  Comments and suggestion for content and to improve readability are welcome.
> 
> 
> Once again, I'd like to thank a nameless person for proofreading the latest doc...  Once we get beyond "draft" status, I'll put editor information in there.  I'm going to keep these in "Work Instruction" format as I hate pedantic manuals with all kinds of headings, titles, lists of figure -and all that crap.  Beef.  I want beef -no fluff.
> 
> 
> Ray...
> 
> View attachment 71807
> 
> 
> View attachment 71808



Ray,
Thank you for your very thorough PM-45M-CNC setup instructions.  I am an electrical engineer and mentor to a high school robotics team which purchased a PM-45M-CNC machine in June of 2015.  It took a year before the school was finally able to get the budget to get the machine wired with power.  Anyway, we are now in the process of trying to get the machine to work.  I have Mach3 installed on a laptop and the Jamen JNC-40M version 1.58 driver successfully installed.  I can run Mach3 and it recognizes the machine.  I was able to easily follow your instructions for configuration.  Unfortunately, the machine just does not work!  Here are some of the symptoms:
When I attempt to press the Mach3 "RESET" button, a message pops up that the Emergency Stop button or a limit switch is active which is preventing the machine from exiting the reset state.  I verified the machine was not at any limit switch and that the emergency stop buttons are not depressed and I still get the same message.  The warning said it could autoconfig the inputs to correct the issue (I assume this changes the active state settings).  Anyway out of frustration I told it to autoconfig the I/Os but unfortunately the machine behaves in the exact same way after attempting this.  Unfortunately, it scrambled the I/O settings, so I reconfigured the I/Os again per your instructions.  
When you look at the diagnostic screen in the Mach3 the input "lamps" are constantly flashing on then off then on then off etc.  I have a feeling this is not right.  The states should be static when the machine is not in motion.  So, is there a communication setting that is off?  I was concerned that maybe the USB cable was bad, but another one behaves the same way.  I then connected a ground wire from the machine ground block to the computer to see if there was a ground noise issue with no improvement.  Any ideas?  I'm hoping someone has seen this before and knows exactly what to do.  I have not been able to get the machine to move at all.  We also have a pendant which does not function either.


----------



## cut2cut

RD,

This may not be a solution but it may help narrow down whether you have an interference / ground issue.  There is a "debounce" setting in Mach 3 that delays false E-stop and limit switch signals.  By not recognizing short spikes of electrical noise it basically filters out the false signals.    The larger the number you set in the debounce settings the finer the filter.  The negative aspect of setting the debounce setting too high is it will delay the amount of time a real E-stop  is engaged by the user.    I used 200 recently and it solved an intermittent issue I had with false E stop / limits being triggered falsely while my nearby coolant sump pump was running.  Prior to using coolant I didn't have the issue.   
Anyway,  I believe the debounce setting is in the general settings upper right corner.  Do a YouTube/google  search and you'll see others explain the same issue I had.  Yours is more extreme, however.

If you have more issues I'd consider a different controller card that interfaces with Ethernet instead of USB.  I'm told USB can be very problematic for consistent CNC control.  

Ps. If the pendant was included with the mill,  it's known to have severe issues.  Probably best to remove it from the equation !  Sadly

Cheers,

Jake


----------



## Boswell

RD,  Glad to hear that you are starting to get it setup.  As Jake suggest, simplify things as much as you can to start with.  When you say that the input lamps are flashing on and off. Do you mean ALL of them or some of them. Are they random or is there a pattern. One step might be to only enable/configure the E-Stop in Mach3 and then troubleshoot it.  It should not be flashing under any normal condition and so if the e-stop input is flashing it could be an intermittent connection (random flashing), a Power Supply issue (it should be a Normally Closed circuit so the board is providing power) or a problem with the board or driver. 

Anyway these are some ideas to get started with. Please share your troubleshooting steps and results and we can brainstorm ideas.


----------



## rdlanning

Thank you for the quick reply to my dilemma.  I worked with the machine some more last night.  I tried playing with the debounce settings which unfortunately did not help the problem.  I had previously disabled all of the inputs to just E-Stop and the machine still behaved the same way.  I looked at all of the I/O to the Jamen JNC-40M card last night and the power supplies and everything looks just as it should be.  I briefly connected machine ground to the floating controller card ground it still behaved the same way.  I unplugged the pendant controls and Mach3 still behaved the same way.  I've literally traced and inspected every wire in this machine at this point.  It all seems to point to the Jamen JNC-40M controller card which is unfortunate since it is a brand new machine.  I'm using the latest version of Mach 3 and the latest JNC-40M driver version 1.58.  The PC is able to recognize the presence of the JNC-40M with no problem, just as documented.  So, how do you tell what version of firmware is on the JNC-40M card?  Can it be upgraded and how do I get the latest version?
I uploaded a short video clip of what the Mach3 diagnostics screen looks like to my google drive.  You can see it at the following link:  https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5qqT-Ir3vYXem1MbVYtSTBWbDA/view?usp=sharing


----------



## cut2cut

It ultimately sounds like a faulty JNC-40N or faulty power supply.  Barring that,  I'd create a new installation of mach3 on a different computer just to rule out a software gremlin.   Then it's either a software setting or  a faulty wire.  Maybe.  

Jake


----------



## rdlanning

Thanks Jake.  I'm going to use an oscilloscope tonight and look for noise on the power supplies.  The DC voltages are all correct when measured with a handheld meter. 

David


----------



## Boswell

I would agree that it looks like a problem with the JNC or the power supply to the JNC. An O-Scope will tell you quickly if you have power drop-outs that correspond to the flashing Inputs. Have you called and talk to Matt and Precision Matthews? I hear he is very responsive. One of the things that I disliked about the JNC-40N controller is that I could not find any updates to drivers or firmware and in addition the Probe input never worked. I eventually replaced it with a Smoothstepper board. 

One more suggestion for Isolation. Disconnect the wires for the Limit switches and the Home Switches and then see if you still get the flashing. If the O-Scope shows constant power and the inputs are flapping without any connection then you pretty much have it isolated to the JNC board.

Good luck and keep letting us know how you are getting along.


----------



## rdlanning

Inspection with the Oscilloscope showed no noise issues with the JNC-40M board I/Os.  It is looking like the JNC-40M controller was DOA.  I'm going to try to just get another I/O board.   I will try complete isolation tonight and see if it is happy under those conditions.  
If we were to upgrade to a Smoothstepper board, is the setup fairly straight-forward?  Is the board documentation better?  I assume I would just wire in the I/Os, connect the 24VDC power with Ethernet to a computer, configure Mach3/4 and we'd be rocking...  
Thanks for your support!


----------



## Boswell

You will need three things to install a smoothstepper Ethernet board.
1. The Smoothstepper Ethernet board
2. the PMDX-126 BOB  (Break out Board) with Spindle controller
3. a 12vdc Power Supply.

GaryL and myself have both made the conversion and if you scroll back a few posts in this thread you will see documentation and pictures of both of our work.  The documentation on the boards is in English and very detailed. I had to read some of several times to understand it, not because it was poor english but because it was technically dense.  Thanks to the work that GaryL did, it was a snap for me. Added benefit is that the Probe input works properly and so does the Backlash compensation.   You will not be able to use the pendent that was supplied with the PM-45-CNC but frankly that is no loss.


----------



## jbolt

I will second the PMDX-126 BoB, ESS motion controller &  PMDX-107 spindle controller combo. I have these on my PM-932 CNC conversion and they have been flawless. I agree with Boswell on the manuals being a little technical but that's a good thing. The PMDX customer support is top tier. 

I use an xbox 360 game pad for a pendant. Mach3 has plugins for it. Works very well.


----------



## lim1wph

Well fellas, I just ordered a PMDX424 and 407 along with Mach 4. There's going to be some difficult times ahead while _ figure all of this out._


----------



## Boswell

I was surprised at how easy it was to get the motion controller replaced. I spent more time on mounting and moving the wiring over than anything else.  I never did get Mach4 working. It fell into the category of "Don't fix what isn't broke" and Mach3 is doing everything I ask of it.


----------



## lim1wph

Boswell said:


> I was surprised at how easy it was to get the motion controller replaced. I spent more time on mounting and moving the wiring over than anything else.  I never did get Mach4 working. It fell into the category of "Don't fix what isn't broke" and Mach3 is doing everything I ask of it.


They inferred that this board is made easy for mach4. I guess I'll have to see how it works or


----------



## Boswell

Looking forward to hearing how the conversion goes for you. Please be sure to share some pictures of how you mount the motion controller and any issues you have to solve to help others that might go through this process in the future.


----------



## lim1wph

Sure will because if I can get through it anyone can.


----------



## chocadile

Hello everyone,

I have begun the process of getting my mill up and running.  Our shop purchased a PM-940M CNC.  Thanks to Gary and his documentation I've been able to get all my axis up and running and I have run the test g.code roadrunner.  The table(x,y) and z axis move as they should but, I'm not able to get my spindle to turn on.  I've reviewed the documents and I don't believe I've missed any steps or overlooked something.  I've tried both M3 and M4 codes to turn on the spindle but, no luck.  Does anyone have any ideas or suggestions that I could try to get my spindle turning.

Edit to add - When using M3 and M4 codes in MDI the VFD still has the "FWD" and "STOP" LED lit up.  Regardless of command used the VFD is not recognizing the spindle change in direction or allowing the spindle to function.


----------



## Boswell

Chocadile,  Will the spindle turn when you just select it on the Mach3 screen, not using any GCode?
It seems like I remember someone else having a Spindle issue on initial startup but I can't remember any details. 
Probably worth checking the wiring to make sure nothing came loose in shipping. 
If you still have issues, I encourage you to contact Matt. He has a good reputation for Customer Support.

Possibly others might have some suggestions.


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## chocadile

Thanks for the response Boswell, No my spindle will not turn when selecting it on the Mach 3 interface/screen.  There is another thread here on hobby machinist with another member having spindle troubles but, didn't post any results or what fixed their problem.  I'll look in the cabinet and see if anything looks out of place.  My gut is telling me it's something with the VFD.  I just wanted to see if anyone else had encountered this issue before and had some suggestions.  I will contact Matt and see if he can help me out as well.


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## tdfirearms

Greetings all. My name is Dan, I am a total nube. No mill experience, only a little lathe experience. Recently I purchased the PM45 CNC from Ray C of this thread. This machine has been sitting unused in his garage for a few years. He doesn't have much extra time anymore and what he does now he uses his manual mill. 

Before I can put it back together and set it up, I have to finish the shipping container shop I am building. I have already purchased the PMDX 424 and 407 along with Mach4 to upgrade the mill. Laying on my desk, I have connected the 424 and 407 to the computer and it seems to play well with Mach4 so far. I cant wait to get it all set up and start crashing things... I mean learn to use it. Spending time now learning Fusion 360.

I appreciate all I have learned from you all so far reading the posts on this board. Pictures will come shortly on the shop build if you are interested and the mill as I progress on the project.

Dan H.


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## Boswell

Welcome to the forum. There are lots of smart and helpful people here. I look forward to hearing about your experiences with Mach 4 go once you get it all up and running.


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## damo green

Has anyone gotten Mach3 to read the spindle RPM while using the Jamen controller board that comes with the Precision Mathews mill?


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## rdlanning

Has anyone been able to get a SmoothStepper, PMDX-106 & PMDX-107 working with Mach4?  I made the leap but have not been able to get the spindle drive or stepper motors working properly.  My setup is connected and tested per Gary's instructions.  The limit switch inputs and Estop are all working.  Our setup has a fixed speed spindle.


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## lim1wph

rdlanning said:


> Has anyone been able to get a SmoothStepper, PMDX-106 & PMDX-107 working with Mach4?  I made the leap but have not been able to get the spindle drive or stepper motors working properly.  My setup is connected and tested per Gary's instructions.  The limit switch inputs and Estop are all working.  Our setup has a fixed speed spindle.


PMDX has always been very helpful to me but I have the 424 & 407 which made it very simple even for me.


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## Boswell

I have installed Mach4 on a system that is not connected to the mill just to take a look at it. I have not yet tried to use it to talk to the smoothstepper and the PDMX-126 and PDMX-107.   Mach3 works well for me so I have not been to motivated on getting Mach4 working.


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## lim1wph

Here is what makes my machine go. These are the original numbers. Everything works fine with Mach4.


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## lim1wph

lim1wph said:


> Here is what makes my machine go. These are the original numbers. Everything works fine with Mach4.
> View attachment 261977
> 
> View attachment 261978


Sorry, as I look at the picture I see where 061 and 065 should be switched.


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## Boswell

[lim1wph] thanks for adding these pictures. It might help someone in the future.


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## salut_max

[QUOTE = "Boswell, сообщение: 566882, участник: 30083"]
[lim1wph] спасибо за добавление этих картинок. Это может помочь кому-то в будущем.
[/ QUOTE]
Приветствую всех на форуме, у меня есть проблема, которую я не могу решить самостоятельно. Я не могу настроить Mach3 выходной ШИМ 0-10v.
Плата новая, но не использовалась, настройка была выполнена согласно вашим инструкциям. Ссылка на видео:


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## Boswell

Welcome to the forum Salut_Max.

Below is a google translation to english  from the post from Salut_Max.  Your video shows the original controller board that was shipped with the PM45M-CNC. Many of us have replaced this with a Smoothstepper an the PDMX-126 and PDMX-107.  I don't see anything wrong with your setup though. 

Quote: _Greetings to all on the forum, I have a problem that I can not solve on my own. I can not configure Mach3 output PWM 0-10v.
The board is new, but not used, the configuration was performed according to your instructions. Link to video:_


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## salut_max

Я озадачен этой проблемой, потому что там абсолютно ничего нет, 0.3-0.4v кажется нормальным низким логическим уровнем.

Google Translation:

I am puzzled by this problem because there is absolutely nothing there, 0.3-0.4v seems to be a normal low logic level.


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## salut_max

Небольшой прогресс был достигнут, но мне не совсем понятно, когда я начал калибровку шпинделя, напряжение начало увеличиваться с 0 до 10 вольт, это означает, что ШИМ работает, но я все еще не могу отрегулировать и настроить шпиндель скорость с помощью ползунка или команд m3 s * *** Какие идеи?

Google Translation:
Little progress has been made, but it’s not entirely clear to me when I started the spindle calibration, the voltage began to increase from 0 to 10 volts, this means that the PWM is working, but I still can’t adjust and adjust the spindle speed using the slider or m3 commands s * *** What ideas?


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## salut_max




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## Ling Jing

hello, i am a little late to the party i just got ahold of my PM-45CNC this past Monday everything is all set up and its set to run its Original Mach3 program with Jamen Drivers the only problem is im having trouble finding these drivers if any one can help out with that?

i am running the Variable speed 2 setting speed drive with everything being original on it never been used just sat in some ones garage for years


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## Boswell

Ling Jing, Welcome.

I looked and can not find the driver files. I believe then name of the file was JNC-40M.  A few years ago, I was able to find a couple of versions floating around on the internet so a google search might help. If I remember, there were a couple of versions available and it was hit or miss on which would work for each user. Regardless, the motion controller that originally came with the PM45M-CNC was challenging at best. Several of us have swapped out the original motion controller for a Smoothstepper using Ethernet. The conversion was very easy and is a fully supported product. There is a section of this thread that goes into some details about the swap. I'll keep looking on my system to see if I can find the driver or any documentation. Good luck and let us know how things work out for you.


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## Ling Jing

Boswell said:


> Ling Jing, Welcome.
> 
> I looked and can not find the driver files. I believe then name of the file was JNC-40M.  A few years ago, I was able to find a couple of versions floating around on the internet so a google search might help. If I remember, there were a couple of versions available and it was hit or miss on which would work for each user. Regardless, the motion controller that originally came with the PM45M-CNC was challenging at best. Several of us have swapped out the original motion controller for a Smoothstepper using Ethernet. The conversion was very easy and is a fully supported product. There is a section of this thread that goes into some details about the swap. I'll keep looking on my system to see if I can find the driver or any documentation. Good luck and let us know how things work out for you.


Awesome, I'll take a look at the smothstepper threads i know there are quite a few with all the set ups. But I will keep the progress updated here.


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## Boswell

check out this current thread starting around post #132 by GarlyL and through about post #170. This is the conversation between GarlyL and myself discussing both of our converstions to using the Ethernet Smoothstepper.


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## Boswell

BTW, here is the documentation file I have for the JNC-40M. driver.


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## Ling Jing

Boswell said:


> check out this current thread starting around post #132 by GarlyL and through about post #170. This is the conversation between GarlyL and myself discussing both of our converstions to using the Ethernet Smoothstepper.


have you heard anything on the RATTMMOTOR Mach3 USB CNC Controller Board 4 Axis CNC 

I've seen a lot of videos on it and there is a lot of information. I'm just worried that ill end up messing up the wiring and ruin it all haha.


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## Boswell

just took a quick look. Seems like it is likely a Chinese built motion controller similar to what came originally with the PM45-CNC.  
Pro's: Price
Con's. little expectation that they will be around to provide updates or help solve problems (could be wrong here)

if your looking around, check out CNC 4 PC
they have several motion controllers that they resale. I have not bought anything from them but they have been around for many years.


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## Ling Jing

Boswell said:


> Well, as I posted the picture of the backplate with the PMDX-126 mounted I realized I needed some way to get wires under the backplate. So I cut a large relief to allow wires to come in from below as well as above. I just cut it on the bandsaw by hand so it is a little rough looking  (rounded the edges with a file so wires will not nicked.)
> View attachment 132522
> View attachment 132523


So, I noticed you have your smooth stepper, pdmx 126, and you have a little board stacked on top of the psmx i was wondering that that was?


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## Boswell

The board that is parallel to the PMDX-126 is the Ethernet Smooth stepper from Warp9 
The smaller board that is perpendicular to the PMDX-126 is the PMDX-107 Speed Controller that I use to control the spindle speed. 
It does not use a feedback loop so the speed control is not exact but has been plenty close enough in practice.


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## Ling Jing

So your using that controller to basically input the speed you need per tool and material. That was the problem I was seeing with most of the controllers is there isn't a spindle speed component. Ok, that makes sense. does the "daughter" controller then draw to much of the boards power? Otherwise if it is connected to the smooth stepper it could power it correct.


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## Boswell

I'll try to look it up tomorrow but I believe that there are two power sources. one via the available power that connects to the breakout (PMDX-126) and then I had to add a second power source for the smooth stepper. I need to look at my notes though to be sure how that worked. you can see in the pictures that there is a small power supply (DC to DC)


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## Boswell

OK, I looked at the user manual for the PMDX-126 and this is what it says regarding power (found on p8 of the PMDX-126 Revision C users Manual, Document revision 1.9 downloadable from the PMDX site"

"If you are using an Ethernet SmoothStepper (ESS), be aware that the PMDX can supply enough power only if the ESS is the only device drawing power from the PMDX-126. If you plan to use the PMDX-107 [...] or any other device that draws power from J1, J2, J3, J4, J5, J6 or J7 then the ESS MUST be powered from an external power supply"


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