# Honden L-450 info needed



## Hogden 8

Hi,  I just picked up a 1984 Honden L-450  mini bench lathe. Looks to be 8 x 18". It's in great condition, minimal-  maybe no wear. Having an issue where I cannot get the  small V belt to reach across the pulleys for the higher spindle speeds.  Seems like the belt is too short or something? Also, there is no information for threading on the front placard that shows spindle speed's. Does have power feed, does anyone know if this is capable of doing threads and if so – I need gears- seems about impossible to find parts for this. Any ideas? Does anyone have one of these? I pulled a manual on line  for an "Emco  compact 8"  looks to be very similar.


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## Hogden 8

Hogden 8 said:


> Hi,  I just picked up a 1984 Honden L-450  mini bench lathe. Looks to be 8 x 18". It's in great condition, minimal-  maybe no wear. Having an issue where I cannot get the  small V belt to reach across the pulleys for the higher spindle speeds.  Seems like the belt is too short or something? Also, there is no information for threading on the front placard that shows spindle speed's. Does have power feed, does anyone know if this is capable of doing threads and if so – I need gears- seems about impossible to find parts for this. Any ideas? Does anyone have one of these? I pulled a manual on line  for an "Emco  compact 8"  looks to be very similar.


--- so, I've done a couple of hours of research and have found nothing. It seems like this is the only Honden L – 450 in the world .


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## Hogden 8

Update. This lathe is quite capable of cutting many different US and metric threads. So, I bought a full set of metal gears from Little machine shop.com – excellent product. The ID bore was a little undersize which was fine, bored the smaller ones on the lathe and the larger ones on my jet-16 mill. Also bought a wedge type (Steele) OXA quick change tool post.  Having fun and loving it but shopping for something a little bigger, maybe up to 12“ x 36“.


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## Hogden 8

I’ve gone bigger. Picked up an Enco Turn-Pro 13x40. Sold the great little Honden- I’ll miss it! I have a scanned copy of the Honden L-450 manual if someone needs it. Message me with your email address and I’ll send it.


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## The_Apprentice

That is quite a noticeable increase in size. I do feel a little sorry the Honden did not work out for your needs. I will confess I rarely hear much about those lathes.


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## DAT510

You can always upload the Manual to the "Downloads" section of the forum for all to share.

https://www.hobby-machinist.com/res...-catalogs-drawings-alpha-sorted-by-brand.435/


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## Hogden 8

DAT510 said:


> You can always upload the Manual to the "Downloads" section of the forum for all to share.
> 
> https://www.hobby-machinist.com/res...-catalogs-drawings-alpha-sorted-by-brand.435/


I will do that. Have to figure out how!?!. I have it as a PDF in my phone.


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## Cheryl

Hogden 8 said:


> I’ve gone bigger. Picked up an Enco Turn-Pro 13x40. Sold the great little Honden- I’ll miss it! I have a scanned copy of the Honden L-450 manual if someone needs it. Message me with your email address and I’ll send it.


Hi. I was wondering if you still had a pdf copy of the manual for the Honden L-450. My Dad has inherited one and has noticed that one of the gears is missing. He is hoping to get details so he can have one made or find one to purchase. Thanks.


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## Mick San

I too am in need of info for L450 please? How can I get pdf or similar? Mines actually branded Bransby but my research says same thing. Thanks


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## Bi11Hudson

Good morning, Sir:

Your machine is _almost_ identical to one of mine. Excepting color and lack of an external change gear adjustment. Belts were a big issue at one time. 

They are specifically a *Gates 5M* series. Mine is a Gates 5M710. The ...710 is the length in millimeters. I have had interaction with other lathes that had other lengths, up to ...730. The big issue is finding a source for the Gates brand that can measure yours and will source the 5M series in _small quantities_. 

For what it's worth, I have used Motion Industries and purchased several smaller sizes for generic use. The 5M series has some surprisingly stout characteristics for its' size.

And finally, I just realized how long this post has been up, and apologize for being late, again, as usual.

Bill Hudson​


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## Thunderstruck87

Gday all i have just joined and after some info on the honden, i also have a manual if anyone needs
I need to get a new motor for mine but the talley plate is stuff. Can anyone give me the rpm specs and shaft diameter please


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## Bi11Hudson

*As a rule, not hard and fast*.

*Most* lathes in the smaller sizes run 1/3, 1/2, and 3/4 Horse power. Physical size of the motor will roughly indicate which one, as will your preferences. I have a Craftsman 12X36 running on 1/3 HP, but I do light work. Sears recommended 1/2 HP long ago. My Grizzly G-1550 has a 3/4 HP motor.

Frame is *usually* NEMA-56, shaft is *usually* 5/8, although a 1/2 shaft occasionally turns up. That should be easy to measure. 5/8 inch will show up as an even metric measurement, 16mm I *think*.

Speed is usually 1800 (1745) for 4 pole motors. That's in the states at 60 cycles. In areas with 50 cycle power(the rest of the world), the speed will be a little slower. Nominal speed at 1500, actual speed is less slip at 1450 RPM, more or less. Horsepower is pretty much unchanged from 50 to 60 cycles.

There are occasional 2 pole motors at 3600(3450) RPM used on machine tools, but that is *rare*. Using the 4 pole motor is safe for those rare machines. They'll just run slowly.

.


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## Mick San

Thunderstruck87 said:


> Gday all i have just joined and after some info on the honden, i also have a manual if anyone needs
> I need to get a new motor for mine but the talley plate is stuff. Can anyone give me the rpm specs and shaft diameter please


Can I please get a copy of the manual? Thanks.


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## Mick San

Mick San said:


> Can I please get a copy of the manual? Thanks.


miksan323@gmail.com


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## Thunderstruck87

Here is the manual this way its available for everyone, let me know if it works


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## Mick San

I'll try it thanks.


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## brino

@Thunderstruck87 

It works for me!
I also put it on the "downloads" section here:
https://www.hobby-machinist.com/resources/honden-lathe-l-450-and-l-450e.3313/

I gave you credit. 
Thanks for sharing it!

-brino


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## Mick San

Thunderstruck87 said:


> Here is the manual this way its available for everyone, let me know if it works


Yep that worked thankyou very much


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## silverchips

brino said:


> @Thunderstruck87
> 
> It works for me!
> I also put it on the "downloads" section here:
> https://www.hobby-machinist.com/resources/honden-lathe-l-450-and-l-450e.3313/
> 
> I gave you credit.
> Thanks for sharing it!
> 
> -brino



Not to stir the pot and this is an old thread but that copy of the manual being distributed on this site posted above is actually my copy and scan. I can tell by the pencil notes written in that manual and the last pic is my Starrett square where I used a lacquer pencil to paint the logo, I must have sent him a link to my manual in the past. I hope people find the manual useful. Here's a pic of both together on page 7 with pencil marks.






If someone wants to see the original manual online without downloading it, go to this imgur photo album of the manual. click on any page to enlarge it.



https://imgur.com/a/zPjbs


This is my lathe (old pic) and have been using it a lot lately, it's been a very good little lathe. Great info above about finding a set of gears at little machine shop. I already have a full set but nice to know where I can replace if needed.

If your looking for a quick change tool post (QCTP), the perfect size for it is OXA (#250-000); many sell this size and definitely recommend the wedge type over the piston type. However, having said that I did mill off .125" off the top of the compound rest and tapped it with a M8 thread to accommodate the QCTP. I cant recommend it enough and have been very happy since adding it.

One of the biggest issues with this lathe is the spindle thread, it's far from standard and you won't find any chucks or backplates with that thread at
Little Machine Shop. The thread is a EU DIN type standard and most likely you will need to mill your own thread onto a new backplate on a lathe to accommodate a new check, please correct me if I' wrong. If you have a source for chucks with this thread that doesn't cost more than the lathe, please share it!

Another problem to keep an eye on is the Lead Screw shear pin (see page 15 in manual), keep an eye on it but more the bronze bushing that the pin fits into, the slot on mine was shattered because previous user installed a steel pin and had crashed it and had to make a new bronze keyed bushing. If your having problems with the lead screw moving the carriage and it's not always turning, check the shear pin bushing inside the gear.

Having said that I've come across many lathes in this approx size and find the Honden a much higher quality build and been happy with the final finish I get when using the correct carbide tool and set up.





Pic of QCTP and finish


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## brino

silverchips said:


> ot to stir the pot and this is an old thread but that copy of the manual being distributed on this site posted above is actually my copy and scan. I can tell by the pencil notes written in that manual and the last pic is my Starrett square where I used a lacquer pencil to paint the logo, I must have sent him a link to my manual in the past. I hope people find the manual useful. Here's a pic of both together on page 7 with pencil marks.



Well then thanks to you @silverchips for providing the scanned copy of the manual!
It is great when people help out others.

You sure got a great finish on that shaft!

-brino


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## silverchips

Thanks Brino,

Wanted to add this in case anyone with a Honden lathe has had the same problem and for reference if needed to make one. The lead screw has a sacrificial shear pin hidden inside the gear turning the lead screw that is suppose to be made of brass and the pin breaks when there's a crash. If the shear pin is brass, then the brass could break under normal & proper use completely on its own after use because of the all hardening from use (pressure) making it brittle over time and hopefully also breaks when (if) you crash the carriage and not damage the bushing. I cant find any of these bronze bushings and had to make one myself.

My lead screw shear pin diameter measured at 3.11mm x 13.5mm long. I recommend making several brass pins at a time and keep them close by for when they fail, it's fairly easy to swap out. The previous owner of my lathe had used a steel pin and it had partially shattered the bronze keyed bushing that the pin locks into. It would sometimes work moving the carriage when engage and then sometimes it didn't; I would scratch my head wondering why it was doing that until I noticed the damaged bushing. I suspect several other Honden lathes will have this same problem when the same cowboy fix job was utilized with non brass material laying around the shop. Thankfully, its not hard to fix.

The size of this bronze bushing is OD: 14.00mm x ID: 10.05mm x 14mm-16mm long and slotted to accept the shear pin, the keyed portion is 3.95mm wide, the interesting part is the height of key, the keyed spacer that that goes in after the gear is only approx. 1.5mm above the OD radius of bushing but the keyed slot in the gear is much taller, approx 3mm. Yours may measure slightly differently as mine has taken some abuse. The keyed bushing and shear pin has to fit inside the gear and a keyed washer/spacer. I hope you find this useful.

Here are several pics for reference of the old busing in this photo album:



https://imgur.com/a/Szano1J


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## silverchips

Question: Do other Honden 450 lathe owners have the same spindle thread as mine?

Mine measured at OD (major thread dia.) approx. 39.41mm/1.551" and the pitch measured best at 10TPI and in metric it was close to 2.5mm pitch but it was not exact, slightly bigger than 2.5mm. Anyone else have this spindle with these measurements?

Three pics of thread and OD measurement


https://imgur.com/a/aT6sQWo


Was told it was a DIN800 M39 standard spindle but mine does not measure the 4mm pitch.


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## silverchips

silverchips said:


> Thanks Brino,
> 
> Wanted to add this in case anyone with a Honden lathe has had the same problem and for reference if needed to make one. The lead screw has a sacrificial shear pin hidden inside the gear turning the lead screw that is suppose to be made of brass and the pin breaks when there's a crash. If the shear pin is brass, then the brass could break under normal & proper use completely on its own after use because of the all hardening from use (pressure) making it brittle over time and hopefully also breaks when (if) you crash the carriage and not damage the bushing. I cant find any of these bronze bushings and had to make one myself.
> 
> My lead screw shear pin diameter measured at 3.11mm x 13.5mm long. I recommend making several brass pins at a time and keep them close by for when they fail, it's fairly easy to swap out. The previous owner of my lathe had used a steel pin and it had partially shattered the bronze keyed bushing that the pin locks into. It would sometimes work moving the carriage when engage and then sometimes it didn't; I would scratch my head wondering why it was doing that until I noticed the damaged bushing. I suspect several other Honden lathes will have this same problem when the same cowboy fix job was utilized with non brass material laying around the shop. Thankfully, its not hard to fix.
> 
> The size of this bronze bushing is OD: 14.00mm x ID: 10.05mm x 14mm-16mm long and slotted to accept the shear pin, the keyed portion is 3.95mm wide, the interesting part is the height of key, the keyed spacer that that goes in after the gear is only approx. 1.5mm above the OD radius of bushing but the keyed slot in the gear is much taller, approx 3mm. Yours may measure slightly differently as mine has taken some abuse. The keyed bushing and shear pin has to fit inside the gear and a keyed washer/spacer. I hope you find this useful.
> 
> Here are several pics for reference of the old busing in this photo album:
> 
> 
> 
> https://imgur.com/a/Szano1J




Just adding that I made a new keyed bushing for the lead screw with material I had laying around the shop (brass and copper) and it wasn' too difficult to make if you need to do the same and have a mill.
I also found that .125" brass rod fits perfectly in the lead screw for a sacrificial pin. To to get the best fit for the keyed portion into the gear and also accompanying keyed spacer, I had to mill the key to two different heights. This lead screw bushing is not the prettiest as I had to rush it but you'll get the idea. When my bronze stick arrives, I'll make another one and replace this one.

What a difference my finish was when using the feed again and nice to be able to thread again. Cheers and enjoy your Honden.



https://imgur.com/a/RDtX4gl


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## markba633csi

"You meet the nicest people on a Honden"


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