# Oxy/acetylene rig



## DavidR8 (Sep 1, 2020)

I’m looking to add an oxy/acetylene rig to my shop. 
I’m looking at two used rigs. One has Victor torches the other doesn’t, they have similar size tanks. 
The rig with Victor torches is $50 more. 
All things being equal, is the set with the Victor torches the preferred route?

Here are the two ads:









						Oxyacetylene kit
					

Oxyacetylene kit with Victor torches on cart




					r.used.ca
				












						oxygen and acetylene cutting set up
					

oxygen and acetylene tanks with regulators and head. comes with citing and welding tips and a little dolly.  Acetylene tank is currently empty, but can show operational with propane tank.




					r.used.ca
				




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## matthewsx (Sep 1, 2020)

I can't tell what the regulators on the $400 one are but all things being equal I would go with the Victor torch. Good regulators are probably more important than the torch though and are more likely to go bad if they are used. No idea when Sears Craftsman stopped selling welding equipment but I'm gonna bet it was a while ago.

I don't know what a good deal up there is but I paid $200 for a similar sized rig with much newer regulators and torch (Victor) not long ago. 

John


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## DavidR8 (Sep 1, 2020)

Thanks John, I appreciate your experience!
Everything tends to be more expensive it seems. 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## matthewsx (Sep 1, 2020)

Yeah, with oxyacetelene just assume you will either need to rebuild or replace regulators, torch, or both eventually. If you can lay hands on both you will have a better idea assuming the sellers will let you fire them up.

John


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## AGCB97 (Sep 1, 2020)

You should check with your local welding supply store to make sure they will refill them for you.


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## Aukai (Sep 1, 2020)

Tanks can be problematic, hydro-static dates are stamped on the neck, good for 5 years. Then will your gas supply store exchange, or do you need to wait for a refill on your personal tank?


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## cathead (Sep 1, 2020)

All things are not equal, especially when it comes to  gas welding setups. 
You would have to look them both over(analyze) and test each one before
making your decision.  I have a small set similar to the ones pictured but
wish I had bigger tanks.  Oh yeah, tanks... check the dates and fillability
so you can refill them at your local supplier.

PS: If all things were equal, you could just pick one..... it wouldn't matter.


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## HarryJM (Sep 1, 2020)

Might be able to get some good advise at the WeldingWeb forum. I joined a few years ago and posted a few questions about used O/X equipment and got a good education. And if I remember correctly those Craftsman regulators can be rebuilt although posting that question on their site or searching will help with your decision.





						WeldingWeb - Welding Community for pros and enthusiasts
					

Community Forum for Welding Professionals and Enthusiasts To Interact and Learn - Free



					weldingweb.com


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## Liljoebrshooter (Sep 1, 2020)

The tanks might be worth zero if they don't have a bill of sale for the owner.  My local airgas would not touch them. 

Joe


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## Manual Mac (Sep 1, 2020)

Get the Victor set.


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## DavidR8 (Sep 1, 2020)

AGCB97 said:


> You should check with your local welding supply store to make sure they will refill them for you.





Liljoebrshooter said:


> The tanks might be worth zero if they don't have a bill of sale for the owner.  My local airgas would not touch them.
> 
> Joe





Aukai said:


> Tanks can be problematic, hydro-static dates are stamped on the neck, good for 5 years. Then will your gas supply store exchange, or do you need to wait for a refill on your personal tank?


Thanks gents, I'm going to call my LWS today and see what their policies are.


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## tjb (Sep 1, 2020)

David, I don't know if the way we do it around here is common practice or not, but most of my friends and I buy gas and oxygen from one of the local welders on essentially an exchange basis.  On the first purchase, pay for the tank and gas.  Every other purchase after that is done on an exchange basis.  Bring back an empty tank, and for the going rate of the gas, get a full tank of the same size.  There are obvious advantages of convenience, plus you never need to worry about tanks malfunctioning or being out of date.  My source has all sizes of tanks, but the oxy-acetylene tanks I have are about twice the size of the ones you're looking at - probably bigger than I need but definitely convenient.

Perhaps there's an outfit near you that offers the same service.

Regards,
Terry


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## DavidR8 (Sep 1, 2020)

tjb said:


> David, I don't know if the way we do it around here is common practice or not, but most of my friends and I buy gas and oxygen from one of the local welders on essentially an exchange basis.  On the first purchase, pay for the tank and gas.  Every other purchase after that is done on an exchange basis.  Bring back an empty tank, and for the going rate of the gas, get a full tank of the same size.  There are obvious advantages of convenience, plus you never need to worry about tanks malfunctioning or being out of date.  My source has all sizes of tanks, but the oxy-acetylene tanks I have are about twice the size of the ones you're looking at - probably bigger than I need but definitely convenient.
> 
> Perhaps there's an outfit near you that offers the same service.
> 
> ...


There's a place like that near me, Barrel Hamel. They do exactly that. 
One thing i need to consider is that if the tanks are not refillable then I've basically bought an expensive used torch set.


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## gr8legs (Sep 1, 2020)

With the active components (torch and regulators) go for the well-respected brands: Victor, Smiths, Harris. Avoid 'knock-offs' from Trashcanistan.

Repair parts are generally easily available as are rebuilders through a LWS.

Tanks are slightly iffy. If you purchase a set of tanks with no owner's name cast into the valve ring then they are 'customer owned' and not a problem. Easily exchanged at most LWS operations. If there is a cast-in name like 'Airco' at the valve ring the at one time the cylinder was 'leased' meaning 'not yours' and ownership is problematic. When buying used, check there is no supplier name cast into the bottle and always get an exchange tank that is similarly unowned.

Worst case with a 'customer owned' bottle is that if it goes past the hydrostatic test date then you pay for the test when you exchange the bottle.

This may depend on the policy of the LWS. Shop around if neccessary. BTDT.

Stu


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## C-Bag (Sep 1, 2020)

This issue of tanks is a new one to me as all the welding shops I deal with stopped renting tanks 20-30yrs ago. And like Terry said I used to just go in swap tanks for full one. It would be worth it to ask the owner to come with you to see if they’d swap the tanks before you buy.


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## DavidR8 (Sep 1, 2020)

gr8legs said:


> With the active components (torch and regulators) go for the well-respected brands: Victor, Smiths, Harris. Avoid 'knock-offs' from Trashcanistan.
> 
> Repair parts are generally easily available as are rebuilders through a LWS.
> 
> ...


Thanks Stu, I will definitely check the tanks for any names and dates.


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## lis2323 (Sep 1, 2020)

The first step would be ask the seller who he deals with for tanks. 

If he is vague pass. If he names one of the 4-5 vendors in our area....investigate.


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## Ken from ontario (Sep 1, 2020)

About a year ago I started a similar thread and got good info , then went on the welding web and got more info with a difference, over there you need to emphasize that you are a hobbyist and you're not making money off your O/A rig, everyone (with good intentions) direct you to get the biggest tanks, or get multiple tanks to lessen the chance of ever running out. bigger is always better over there.

I on the other hand as a retired fitter/welder only needed  the biggest tanks I could* own , not rent*, that's the big difference, if you are more like me and just want to braze here and there , heat cast iron for small brazing projects, then in my opinion you are better off going to your local welding store and buy the biggest size tanks from them that you can own, and when you run out, drive there and give the empty ones back and get a full one, that's all there is to it. if you don't want to ever run out of either gases, get a spare tank(s)later.

As for the torches, find places that repair /clean torches and ask if they have a USA made set for sale, it will be money well spent , or buy a new set, just don't buy Fake Victor, smith, Harris as others pointed out,..
For you information, I had a chance to buy a seemingly good used rigs for $450-$550 but paid $710 locally and got a new victor and two tanks with their name on the bottles. for $200 more you will have a great set without worrying about  hydro-static tests or ,LWS exchange policy and so on.

I'm not saying do what I do , just letting you know that,  buying new torch with supplier's old "buy to own-tanks",  is an option .


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## DavidR8 (Sep 1, 2020)

Ken from ontario said:


> About a year ago I started a similar thread and got good info , then went on the welding web and got more info with a difference, over there you need to emphasize that you are a hobbyist and you're not making money off your O/A rig, everyone (with good intentions) direct you to get the biggest tanks, or get multiple tanks to lessen the chance of ever running out. bigger is always better over there.
> 
> I on the other hand as a retired fitter/welder only needed  the biggest tanks I could* own , not rent*, that's the big difference, if you are more like me and just want to braze here and there , heat cast iron for small brazing projects, then in my opinion you are better off going to your local welding store and buy the biggest size tanks from them that you can own, and when you run out, drive there and give the empty ones back and get a full one, that's all there is to it. if you don't want to ever run out of either gases, get a spare tank(s)later.
> As for the torches, find places that repair /clean torches and ask if they have a USA made set for sale, it will be money well spent , or buy a new set, just don't buy Fake Victor, smith, Harris as others pointed out,..
> ...


Thanks Ken, 
I am exploring this option also as my needs are pretty much exactly like yours.
A new Victor torch set is $400 locally, and a pair of full tanks is approx. $400.


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## Ken from ontario (Sep 1, 2020)

DavidR8 said:


> Thanks Ken,
> I am exploring this option also as my needs are pretty much exactly like yours.
> A new Victor torch set is $400 locally, and a pair of full tanks is approx. $400.


I suppose the prices must have gone up a bit .
Most Local welding stores either repair torches for their customers(welders) or know establishments that repair torches for them on regular bases, they usually have older sets with upgraded parts, fine tuned and ready to go, ask them, you may get a surprise how many is available.


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## tjb (Sep 1, 2020)

DavidR8 said:


> There's a place like that near me, Barrel Hamel. They do exactly that.
> One thing i need to consider is that if the tanks are not refillable then I've basically bought an expensive used torch set.


Yep.


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## aliva (Sep 1, 2020)

DavidR8
Check TSC Stores they have the Hobart set for around $450. I bought that set last year.  Princess auto now carries  a similar torch but I think its their own brand Power Fist. Chineeseium.
Hobart has a 3 year warranty.
When I was working all we had was the Victor torch style thru out the whole company. Great product. Since your a hobbyist you probably won't abuse it like we did. There were  well over 300 mechanics using that Victor style.


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## pontiac428 (Sep 1, 2020)

@DavidR8, I can't visit your foreign sites from this computer, but I can recommend the Victor.  Same reason as ever, you can go get parts for your old Victor setup at your local welding store, but Sears isn't offering support any longer.  Makes the decision a no-brainer.

You really ought to get on the web and check out the Ca DOT laws and whatever else covers compressed gas cylinders and ownership where you live.  I've heard a few horror stories about not being able to get tanks filled, and am left to wonder what the deal is.  I own a pallet of CGCs and fill through Praxair (in California, Nevada, and Washington).  Sometimes I pay for expired hydrostatic testing, sometimes I don't get charged.  I think I'm ahead on expired hydro overall.  All of my tanks are clean and fresh, so I've never dropped a lump of caca on the counter and demanded a fill, which is why, I'm assuming, I've never been told no.  I bet that has something to do with it.  I hope folks can post the different (backwards) rules that different jurisdictions have on compressed gas cylinders here so that I don't look bad for not understanding why it is a difficult issue (I'm not saying it isn't).


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## DavidR8 (Sep 1, 2020)

aliva said:


> DavidR8
> Check TSC Stores they have the Hobart set for around $450. I bought that set last year.  Princess auto now carries  a similar torch but I think its their own brand Power Fist. Chineeseium.
> Hobart has a 3 year warranty.
> When I was working all we had was the Victor torch style thru out the whole company. Great product. Since your a hobbyist you probably won't abuse it like we did. There were  well over 300 mechanics using that Victor style.


KMS has a Victor Medalist 250 set for 399, Harris 801 set for 379 and PowerWeld for 229. 
Princess Auto has "Victor-style" for 219


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## aliva (Sep 1, 2020)

Stick to new, at least you know the cylinders have passed a hydro test, and can be exchanged. If their out of date, the filler will want to test them. You'll have pay for the test, if they pass, your good to go, if they fail you'll have to but new cylinders.


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## lis2323 (Sep 1, 2020)

I’m pretty certain Victor has different levels of quality these days. 

Best bet would be to buy an older Victor set in good cosmetic condition. Worst case scenario you send them out for rebuild and end up with a quality set for life. 

My stuff is all Air Liquide


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## DavidR8 (Sep 1, 2020)

Just talked to Barry Hamel and they just got rid of all their used torches 
But I have found a used set of Victor torches and regs for $250. 
An 80 cu ft O2 and 40 cu ft fuel bottles from Barry Hamel would run $400.


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## lis2323 (Sep 1, 2020)

DavidR8 said:


> Just talked to Barry Hamel and they just got rid of all their used torches
> But I have found a used set of Victor torches and regs for $250.
> An 80 cu ft O2 and 40 cu ft fuel bottles from Barry Hamel would run $400.



I have an O2 bottle for you that apparently Barry Hammel will exchange. Probably a 110cu ft


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## gr8legs (Sep 1, 2020)

Ken from ontario said:


> then in my opinion you are better off going to your local welding store and buy the biggest size tanks from them that you can own, and when you run out, drive there and give the empty ones back and get a full one, that's all there is to it. if you don't want to ever run out of either gases, get a spare tank(s)later.



This is excellent advice.

If you're a hobbyist and have to have gas welding capability RIGHT NOW then buying a new setup with tanks is one route. If you can wait for something to turn up on craigslist or a garage sale then waiting is a good option and be sure the tanks are customer owned as described above.

The only time you run out of gas is Saturday afternoon after the LWS closes and it is an urgent job. DAMHIKT. Once you have a torch and a set of tanks you can take your time acquiring a spare set of tanks from garage sales, craigslist, etc.

Once you have a set the 'right price' one will show up. I got one nice complete set at a garage sale (Victor torches, customer owned tanks and all accessories) for $80. Yes, I stole it. Not embarrassed at all, seller didn't want/need and was only asking $50.

Also, bear in mind that the LWS will usually exchange a same size bottle for another same size bottle of another gas, so if you don't need two argons but want an extra oxygen you can usually exchange for just the difference in gas price. A bottle is a bottle to them.

YMMV and all that

Stu


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## ericc (Sep 1, 2020)

The Victor set looks old.  There doesn't seem to be flashback arrestors on the torch.  That does not mean avoid.  It just means that they are not current, and you'll have to be more careful.  I am paranoid.  If there is a tiny flicker of side flame, I will clean or replace my tips.  If there is any popping, I will increase the flame size, back off the metal, or quit.  You just have to be super careful without the PPE.  Those are Prostar regulators, which our LWS says are private label (for Praxair) Victor.  The second set looks like Craftsman.  They are rebranded Smith, which was well regarded with a lifetime warranty.  Times have changed, and fellow blacksmiths tell me that not only do they not honor the warranty anymore, there are no longer replacement parts.  Victor torches have replacement parts.  My OA torch is an import clone.  It is flimsy, only came with one tip (no replacements available) and when it dies (soon), I expect to replace it with something decent.  In my defense, an estate sale dealer came and twisted my arm to buy it.  Offering it to me for $25 helped (tanks included).  Listen to the other guys: watch out for printed or ground neck ring.  Clean ring on an owner tank is good news.

Most of my work is done with oxy-propane.  Hey, I can't help it, I'm a blacksmith.  I know, I know, welding store salesmen always tell you that oxy-propane wastes oxygen, but so do a lot of salesmen .  Just having to worry about an oxygen tank saves a lot of hassle.  People always say you cannot weld without acetylene.  Technically, that is correct, but the more precise statement is that you cannot gas weld steel without oxy-acetylene.  I recall you have an arc welder, which is arguably a superior process.  Also, you can weld brass, copper (although it is very hot short), and cast iron with oxy-propane.  Also, you can forge weld either with a forge or with oxy-propane.


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## DavidR8 (Sep 1, 2020)

Keep the great suggestions coming!

I have also found a "flashback arrestor" torch for $80. Looks to be a Victor but not sure.
So I'd have to add regs and hoses. But maybe for safety's sake new hoses are a given on a complete used rig?


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## DavidR8 (Sep 1, 2020)

ericc said:


> The Victor set looks old.  There doesn't seem to be flashback arrestors on the torch.  That does not mean avoid.  It just means that they are not current, and you'll have to be more careful.  I am paranoid.  If there is a tiny flicker of side flame, I will clean or replace my tips.  If there is any popping, I will increase the flame size, back off the metal, or quit.  You just have to be super careful without the PPE.  Those are Prostar regulators, which our LWS says are private label (for Praxair) Victor.  The second set looks like Craftsman.  They are rebranded Smith, which was well regarded with a lifetime warranty.  Times have changed, and fellow blacksmiths tell me that not only do they not honor the warranty anymore, there are no longer replacement parts.  Victor torches have replacement parts.  My OA torch is an import clone.  It is flimsy, only came with one tip (no replacements available) and when it dies (soon), I expect to replace it with something decent.  In my defense, an estate sale dealer came and twisted my arm to buy it.  Offering it to me for $25 helped (tanks included).  Listen to the other guys: watch out for printed or ground neck ring.  Clean ring on an owner tank is good news.
> 
> Most of my work is done with oxy-propane.  Hey, I can't help it, I'm a blacksmith.  I know, I know, welding store salesmen always tell you that oxy-propane wastes oxygen, but so do a lot of salesmen .  Just having to worry about an oxygen tank saves a lot of hassle.  People always say you cannot weld without acetylene.  Technically, that is correct, but the more precise statement is that you cannot gas weld steel without oxy-acetylene.  I recall you have an arc welder, which is arguably a superior process.  Also, you can weld brass, copper (although it is very hot short), and cast iron with oxy-propane.  Also, you can forge weld either with a forge or with oxy-propane.


Yes, I have MIG, TIG and arc available to glue metal together. The oxy setup is really for heating and bending and maybe cutting.
Perhaps a dumb question: for propane do you just use 'regular' propane tanks?


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## pontiac428 (Sep 1, 2020)

I guess I'm okay, since some of my tank collars say "Union Carbide" on them, and they stopped calling a long time ago.

I have two Victor super range sets, one old with discrete flash preventers and the newer one with them built in.  IIRC, the flash preventers were $15 apiece 20 years ago.  They should still be cheap enough, but will add to the cost of your torch set.

ProStar regulators are decent.  I have a couple, maybe three.  Your Praxair dealer can get rebuild and replacement parts for these.  I would not hesitate to pick up more ProStar regulators.  Commercial grade beats China golden dragon brass any day, IMHO.

And Stu makes a great point about swapping COCs (customer owned containers) size-for-size for other gases.  This has always been possible for me, and I have done it several times.  Yes, you can trade your empty Crush bottles for a Coke!

Edit: @DavidR8 YES get new hoses!  Old hoses get stiff and eventually can crack.  The oxygen side of an old hose might be contaminated with hydrocarbons.  Not worth it!  Of course, the other side of the coin is sticker shock when you buy a new one...  If you find a deal, let me know- I need a new hose set or two myself!


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## Al 1 (Sep 1, 2020)

David,  I'm with Eric,   I also use oxy-propane.  Al.


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## Al 1 (Sep 1, 2020)

I went with Harris Oxy-propane --  KIT,8525FGX-510P LPGw/NX BAG, Harris Calorific Had to purchase a few other items,  Your can call Harris, They were very helpful.  Al


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## erikmannie (Sep 1, 2020)

If it were me, I would buy the largest cylinders that I could afford directly from the LWS where I plan to refill them.

Considering the worst case scenario of what can happen with faulty parts, I would only buy Victor and only buy new. Harris and Smith are also fine, but I always buy the most common quality brand because I am looking ahead to easily finding replacement parts.

My LWS charges an arm and a leg for Victor equipment; I can find them online for less than half of what the LWS charges.

Even if you buy a quality new, complete Victor set online, you will still have to go to your LWS to buy one bushing to connect all of your goodies.

O/A is so fun. Gas welding makes welding thin steel pretty darned easy, and brazing is the easiest process that I have ever learned.

Sometimes I prefer brazing because you don’t melt the base material (which has always been steel for me). This makes it very easy to fill a crack or hole without worrying about damaging your weldment.

I have never messed with propane or propylene. I understand that acetylene provides the most heat.


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## erikmannie (Sep 1, 2020)

If you want to weld (or braze) in shorts and a T-shirt, you can get away with this with O/A If you don’t mind a few burns on your arms (and holes in your clothing).

I would not have thought to ever do (or say) this, but when I took a brazing class, the instructor wore short sleeves and shorts every single day. The same instructor had long pants and a welding coat on for the TIG class.

Also, with O/A, you can just wear shade 3 or shade 5 glasses or goggles. No welding helmet required.

A 40 cu. ft. acetylene cylinder is not going to last you very long. I have a 120 cu. ft., and I am still annoyed how often I need to refill it.


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## erikmannie (Sep 1, 2020)

You will probably get a combination torch for your welding and brazing. The cutting attachment (on the combination torch) could last you the rest of your life. If, however, you were going to do a lot of torch cutting then you would want to get a dedicated cutting torch. Dedicated cutting torches leave nothing to be desired.

If you are going to be doing a lot of torch cutting then you will probably want to get a larger oxygen cylinder.

If you can become adept at torch cutting, then you will never need to buy a plasma cutter.


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## erikmannie (Sep 1, 2020)

I started off with a HD (i.e. large) combination torch. I enjoyed the process so much that I bought a medium torch later.

The medium torch obviously weighs less, so that is less fatigue on your back while you are holding it for hours.


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## DavidR8 (Sep 2, 2020)

erikmannie said:


> My LWS charges an arm and a leg for Victor equipment; I can find them online for less than half of what the LWS charges.


Thanks for the additional insight Erik. 
Who are you buying from online?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## erikmannie (Sep 2, 2020)

DavidR8 said:


> Thanks for the additional insight Erik.
> Who are you buying from online?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I bought the Victor medium duty torch on Amazon for only $99, and I shopped around for the best price on the Victor heavy duty kit. I bought from the place with the cheapest price.

 I will post some representative links.


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## erikmannie (Sep 2, 2020)

This medium duty torch includes a cutting attachment:





__





						Victor Medium Duty Torch Handle 100FC and Cutting Attachment CA1350 Kit 0381-1936 - - Amazon.com
					

Victor Medium Duty Torch Handle 100FC and Cutting Attachment CA1350 Kit 0381-1936 - - Amazon.com



					www.amazon.com


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## erikmannie (Sep 2, 2020)

Note that a medium duty combination torch will require different welding and cutting attachments than an HD (i.e. large) combination torch.

I do not own a cutting attachment for my medium torch.


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## erikmannie (Sep 2, 2020)

This is the torch kit that I bought:

https://www.weldingsuppliesfromioc.com/victor-journeyman-welding-and-cutting-outfit-0384-2100

You will also find that Victor is owned by ESAB. You can go on the ESAB website and look at the selection of kits available.

I know it is a lot of money, but those flashback arrestors have some important safety upgrades, and the hose is high quality. All of this is much cheaper than burning your house down.

Also, I guarantee that you will get your money’s worth of fun with any O/A setup.

I spent hours and hours researching torch kits, and I concluded that I wanted a Victor Edge 2.0. The regulators have some good safety upgrades with regard to preventing regulator blow out.


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## erikmannie (Sep 2, 2020)

Also, time spent gas welding will improve your TIG skills.

I enjoy gas welding more than TIG because gas welding moves along more slowly. The flipside of this is that the project will take longer if you gas weld it. Personally, I am one to enjoy the ride (as opposed to emphasizing productivity).

There are numerous videos on Victor Edge 2.0 products on YouTube. I watched most of them many times before I made my purchase.

I have posted on this forum my favorite processes. Lathe work is easily in first place, gas welding & brazing is second, stick welding is third, and then much further down is TIG, MIG and (sorry) mill work in last place.


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## matthewsx (Sep 2, 2020)

David,

You have a lot of good information here. For what you're planning on doing either one of the rigs you posted will work, since there are two you can work the sellers against each other provided they both will let you test them out.

Your LWS will do their best to make you scared to buy used tanks or gear but will they really send you away when you show up with that stuff? You're already a customer from your MIG/TIG setups so IMHO the risk with used tanks is minimal, and the savings is worth the risk. You're gonna end up with their tanks eventually and they know you'll keep coming back as long as they don't pi$$ you off.

Ask the sellers when the last time they got a refill was and where they got it. If they say that they own the tanks and can remember when the last time they were filled I wouldn't be afraid, worst case is you have to buy new ones which you're already talking about. I could have easily spent $600 more for my rig if I bought new and the flame wouldn't have been any hotter.

Oxy is nostalgia for me since my dad built his airplane with the setup I learned on. He used to wax poetic about the guy he knew who could weld beer cans... I know my next purchase for gas welding will be a very small, very high quality torch so I can start practicing with beer cans through a blue lens.

This really isn't something to overthink, oxygen + acetylene = hot a$$ flame, don't touch it 

John


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## cathead (Sep 2, 2020)

While visiting the scrap yard, I found some forklift forks that needed to be cut out of an overturned forklift machine.
They let me use their portable gas cutting torch to do the job and I was surprised how well it cut off some solid 1.5 inch
rods using propane and oxygen.  I plan to get a tank of propane to use for cutting, brazing and general heating and
save on my acetylene for welding steel.  The LH threads on the propane tank are the same as on the acetylene tank
so easy to change back and forth when needed.


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## Ken from ontario (Sep 2, 2020)

If you are looking for an alternative to (small to medium size) Victor, Smith, Harris  torch, you could consider a MECO (or Meco Midget) torch, I have not read a bad review on this brand ,it is a good choice for medium size projects:








						Meco Torch and Accessories by TM Technologies
					

TM Technologies: Tools, Sheet Metal Shaping Machines, Gas Welding Supplies, Articles & lWorkshops for Better Metalworking



					www.tinmantech.com


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## DavidR8 (Sep 2, 2020)

Ken from ontario said:


> If you are looking for an alternative to (small to medium size) Victor, Smith, Harris  torch, you could consider a MECO (or Meco Midget) torch, I have not read a bad review on this brand ,it is a good choice for medium size projects:


Thanks Ken, that is an interesting option. It's too bad there's no cutting torch.


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## ericc (Sep 2, 2020)

DavidR8 said:


> Yes, I have MIG, TIG and arc available to glue metal together. The oxy setup is really for heating and bending and maybe cutting.
> Perhaps a dumb question: for propane do you just use 'regular' propane tanks?



Yes.  I use the commonly available BBQ tanks.  The problem is that they are too expensive to hydrotest, so they just get thrown away.

Somebody said acetylene has more heat than propane.  This factoid suggests an Internet check.  Spoiler alert: they are about the same.  It often appears that acetylene is hotter when starting a cut, but that is caused in a large part by using the cooler part of the propane flame due to lack of training.  Youtube videos are a lot of help here.  I do very little cutting with my torch.  I do most of my cutting with a striker and a set of top tools.


----------



## lis2323 (Sep 2, 2020)

If you aren’t planning to weld then I would seriously consider oxy / propane. Way less hassle and cost than acetylene. Propane is available everywhere every day. 

Don’t forget that oxygen bottle that is available closeby


----------



## DavidR8 (Sep 2, 2020)

lis2323 said:


> If you aren’t planning to weld then I would seriously consider oxy / propane. Way less hassle and cost than acetylene. Propane is available everywhere every day.
> 
> Don’t forget that oxygen bottle that is available closeby


I'll definitely take you up on the tank!


----------



## lis2323 (Sep 2, 2020)

DavidR8 said:


> I'll definitely take you up on the tank!



No pressure. ( oops no pun intended ) I’m here to help you figure out the best plan to suit your needs.


----------



## FlyFishn (Sep 4, 2020)

For what it is worth - I didn't research a whole lot before I got my O/A torch kit. I was doing a lot of work on my 1 ton truck and gearing up for it I wasn't going to start in to the project without a torch by my side. What I ended up doing was I bought the Harbor Freight kit with the bottles for around $350. 

If I had researched things further I would have bought a torch kit then the next size up bottles from the LWS.

The place I deal with here was a bit picky on the bottles from the HF kit. What they do is run an exchange service. So you bring empty tanks to them then they exchange a filled and certified set. So they wanted me to swap my brand new tanks. That ****** me off, but we worked it out and they agreed to put them in their cycle to check them out and if they checked out they filled them - which they did. It took about 8 or 9 days to get the tanks back. 

If I get in to more gas cutting or welding then I will need bigger tanks. At that point I can go to the LWS and get a set of exchange tanks of what ever size. Then I can keep the small set as a back-up. Maybe run the small set empty, then refill and not use. 

One other point to make (I didn't read every reply in the thread so someone may have already covered this) is that Acetylene is dissolved in a material in the tank. The acetylene tanks are NOT hollow tanks. When you use acetylene it has to bubble up from the material it is dissolved in. Think of carbonated drinks, like tonic. The carbonation bubbles come up to the surface when you unscrew the cap and let the pressure out. This is very similar. 

The reason the dissolved acetylene concept is important is that you can only draw the volume of acetylene that has accumulated at the top of the bottle. If the rate of refilling that is slower than what you are consuming with your torch you are going to run out. So you can think of this as being the "duty cycle" of the acetylene bottle. Once you max out what you can draw you need to let the bottle sit so more acetylene can come out to the top. 

You can draw a lot more acetylene quicker the larger the bottle you have. This is the #1 reason a bigger bottle set is a good thing to have. 

Your gas supplier can fill you in on more specifics and actual numbers. If you know what you are going to be doing with your torch kit (heating up auto/farm equip parts for service work, cutting duty, metal bending duty, welding duty, etc, etc - and what size tips you will want to run for each application) you can have a better baseline from which to base tank sizes off of. Other than that, figure up what you think you need and get the next tank size bigger. 

In any case, the best thing to do with tanks is to do the exchange deal. Its convenient and a heck of a lot less hassle from the get-go. 

There is also a thread on Welding Web that has links to a google doc where people are posting their gas prices. It is an interesting document to look through. The thread started out of some discussions about how much people were paying for gases in different parts of the country and the world. Some people were getting quite ripped off whereas other seemingly were getting gas for the taking. Might be worth a look to see if anyone has posted anything in your region. 





__





						The DEFINITIVE Welding Gas Costs Thread.
					

Click here to enter your welding gas cost information:  ► Survey ◄    Then click here to view everyone else's responses:  ► Responses ◄



					weldingweb.com


----------



## erikmannie (Sep 4, 2020)

At one point, I considered the idea of gas welding steel with oxypropane or oxypropylene; this idea didn’t last long.




Here Google says that propylene is okay for non-structural welding:


----------



## erikmannie (Sep 4, 2020)

With oxyacetylene (as opposed to oxypropane or oxypropylene), the heat comes faster. This makes for great puddling when gas welding.

I have never worked with oxypropane or oxypropylene, but I have done a lot of O/A and it has always done what I needed it to do.


----------



## Lo-Fi (Sep 4, 2020)

What do you want to do with the rig? 

I don't own a setup, but use frequently at the steam  railway. In 20 years, I've never seen or had cause to gas weld. If there's a MIG or stick set around, it's an entirely redundant process. If brazing, a TIG set also makes it obsolete. The O/A rig gets used purely for heating and cutting, with a propane setup being quite good enough and cheaper. Worth thinking about what you really need it for against what else you have available or plan to buy into. Plasma has pretty much taken over cutting plate too.

A mate of mine has a tiny little Micky Mouse size oxy/Mapp setup that he uses for occasion automotive stuff (mostly heating stuck bolts), which is surprisingly capable and super cheap also.


----------



## Liljoebrshooter (Sep 4, 2020)

Years ago I worked in an auto salvage yard and we cut literally hundreds of tons of large thick steel with propane.
I would never even think about gas welding when you have electric welders available.
Not sure about the cost of acetylene but I heard it got very expensive.   I can have a 20lb propane tank filled for less than $10 right now. You can do a lot of work with that. 
Joe


----------



## Janderso (Sep 4, 2020)

gr8legs said:


> The only time you run out of gas is Saturday afternoon after the LWS closes and it is an urgent job.


You can take that to the bank!


----------



## gr8legs (Sep 4, 2020)

erikmannie said:


> My LWS charges an arm and a leg for Victor equipment; I can find them online for less than half of what the LWS charges.



Be very wary of these online claims. Often what they mean is 'Victor style' i.e. knockoffs from Trashcanistan. Genuine Victor (or any other good gear) is worth the price. If price is an issue (when isn't it?) keep watching craigslist and garage sales as welding stuff shows up pretty regularly as long as you don't have an urgent need.

Good luck

Stu


----------



## DavidR8 (Sep 4, 2020)

I’ve located a set of used Victor torches and regulators and a kind H-M member has a used O2 tank for me to buy. 
I’ll need a set of grade T hoses as I plan to go with propane but those are easy to source. 
I will have the torches and regs looked at to make sure they’re sound. 

What a fantastic place this is!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Janderso (Sep 4, 2020)

David,
I bought the Miller-Smith Oxy/Ac kit from my LWS. The complete package you see is brand new as I had to replace everything.
I only use it to heat treat small parts and heat things as needed. I'll probably do some brazing with it soon. 
 MIG, ARC,  Tig and Plasma have replaced the Oxy/Ac set up for welding/cutting. IMHO


----------



## Janderso (Sep 4, 2020)

gr8legs said:


> Trashcanistan


----------



## DavidR8 (Sep 4, 2020)

Janderso said:


> David,
> I bought the Miller-Smith Oxy/Ac kit from my LWS. The complete package you see is brand new as I had to replace everything.
> I only use it to heat treat small parts and heat things as needed. I'll probably do some brazing with it soon.
> MIG, ARC, Tig and Plasma have replaced the Oxy/Ac set up for welding/cutting. IMHO



If the used Victor torches don’t work out I may opt for a new set of Victors from my LWS as I can buy torches, regs, and hoses for a reasonable price. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## lis2323 (Sep 4, 2020)

DavidR8 said:


> If the used Victor torches don’t work out I may opt for a new set of Victors from my LWS as I can buy torches, regs, and hoses for a reasonable price.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Be careful. Brand new authentic entry level Victor may not be as good as older pro refurbished Victor. Just a thought and JMO of course.


----------



## DavidR8 (Sep 4, 2020)

lis2323 said:


> Be careful. Brand new authentic entry level Victor may not be as good as older pro refurbished Victor. Just a thought and JMO of course.



Definitely hear you there.
Only thinking that I'd go new if the used torches are really beat up.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## f350ca (Sep 4, 2020)

I bought the Princess Auto Victor copy about 8 or 10 years ago. I doesn't get used a lot, occasional cutting where the plasma won't do it, warming up a frozen nut and some silver soldering and brazing. Its worked great for what I need, no problems what so ever.
I did the purchase route from TSC, take them in for instant exchange, if they have them in stock. If I ever get rid of them they give you back your deposit.

Greg


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## Ken from ontario (Sep 4, 2020)

This ad for a Victor Medalist has been on Kijiji for almost a month (asking $300) , I only posted it here so you can compare prices or at least it'll give you an idea about the price of the new /old stock, I think he's asking too much but it is new so I would offer $250 if I were interested. I paid $330 for my Victor from LWS .








						Kijiji - Buy, Sell & Save with Canada's #1 Local Classifieds
					

Visit Kijiji Classifieds to buy, sell, or trade almost anything! New and used items, cars, real estate, jobs, services, vacation rentals and more virtually anywhere.




					www.kijiji.ca


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## DavidR8 (Sep 4, 2020)

Ken from ontario said:


> This ad for a Victor Medalist has been on Kijiji for almost a month (asking $300) , I only posted it here so you can compare prices or at least it'll give you an idea about the price of the new /old stock, I think he's asking too much but it is new so I would offer $250 if I were interested. I paid $330 for my Victor from LWS .
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That set is $389 locally so he’s definitely asking for top dollar. 
The used set I’m looking at is $250. 
Two torch bodies, one with flashback arrestors, oxy and fuel regs, brazing, rosebud and cutting heads. 







Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## erikmannie (Sep 4, 2020)

gr8legs said:


> Be very wary of these online claims. Often what they mean is 'Victor style' i.e. knockoffs from Trashcanistan. Genuine Victor (or any other good gear) is worth the price. If price is an issue (when isn't it?) keep watching craigslist and garage sales as welding stuff shows up pretty regularly as long as you don't have an urgent need.
> 
> Good luck
> 
> Stu


I was definitely comparing apples to apples. I would never buy a Chinese torch.

For my Victor medium combination torch, the LWS wanted over $250 and I bought the same exact (Victor!) torch on Amazon for $99. Same brand, same part number. I have found that you can buy name brands online for a lot less than at the LWS.


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## Liljoebrshooter (Sep 5, 2020)

And some of the brand new Victor stuff is made overseas.

Joe


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## John O (Sep 5, 2020)

Can you use the same cutting and heating tips with acetylene and propane?


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## DavidR8 (Sep 5, 2020)

John O said:


> Can you use the same cutting and heating tips with acetylene and propane?



According to my research the cutting tips are different, two pieces to accommodate more orifices. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Liljoebrshooter (Sep 5, 2020)

Yes the tips are different.

Joe


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## ericc (Sep 6, 2020)

The tips will kind of work, using hacks like the rusty plate trick.  If you do much cutting at all, just buy the correct tip.  The clones are not expensive over the Internet.  I used a cheap hack when I first tried out my cutting torch.  I used a homemade soldered adapter to connect to a MAPP disposable tank.  This will light more like acetylene and you can try it to test out the torch if you only have the acetylene cutting tip.  This does work, but it is fairly dangerous.  You cannot shut off the fuel gas at the torch, and if you accidentally plug your tip with some cutting debris, you could get back flow into your oxygen hose.  The test succeeded, and I made some nice artistic cuts in some junk plate for keychains.


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## DavidR8 (Sep 6, 2020)

@ericc I expect I’ll go with the proper tips.


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## DavidR8 (Sep 11, 2020)

Picked up the torches and regulators this morning. 





(Top to bottom)
Victor Medalist 350 regulators
Victor 315FC
Victor 315C
Victor CA2460 cutting head
UM-350 brazing tip
10A rosebud (?)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## pontiac428 (Sep 11, 2020)

That is a fine collection there!  Covers your basic needs- cutting, welding, and heating.  You could feasibly stop collecting now and never need another tip for most practical purposes, unless you really get down the rabbit hole of O/A welding.  It's like you got the three most popular tools in one swiss army knife.


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## DavidR8 (Sep 11, 2020)

pontiac428 said:


> That is a fine collection there! Covers your basic needs- cutting, welding, and heating. You could feasibly stop collecting now and never need another tip for most practical purposes, unless you really get down the rabbit hole of O/A welding. It's like you got the three most popular tools in one swiss army knife.



Thanks!
I’m pretty stoked that I found them. 
I need to pick up a proper propane cutting tip. Already bought new Type T hoses. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Buffalo21 (Sep 11, 2020)

Always get the LWS tank policy, before buying any used tank, preferably in writing. Locally for me, 3 out of the 4 LWS, will not fill any customer owned tanks under any circumstances, if it does not have their ownership ring around the neck, to them, the tank is a worthless piece of scrap metal. Basically, no lease, no gas. The last LWS will fill customer owned tanks, if they have absolute positive proof of ownership, but they send the tanks out to be filled, as you will get the same tanks you give them back, the turn around time can vary greatly, sometimes  2 to 5 weeks. Our area no longer has an active local acetylene filling facility, most of the acetylene tanks are sourced out of a facility in Canada.

A couple of friends have purchased tanks from TSC, they will gladly swap out the tanks for you, but because of storage limitations/regulations, you need roughly a weeks notice on bringing tanks in, so they have filled tanks for you, to take home. I’m not sure if they will fill tanks, that were not purchased from them.


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## DavidR8 (Sep 11, 2020)

Just home from the LWS, Barry Hamel. 
Exchanged the tank I bought from @lis2323 no problem. 
Bought a propane cutting tip and scoped out the store. 
Really nice folks there. They just earned a customer. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## NC Rick (Sep 11, 2020)

lis2323 said:


> I’m pretty certain Victor has different levels of quality these days.
> 
> Best bet would be to buy an older Victor set in good cosmetic condition. Worst case scenario you send them out for rebuild and end up with a quality set for life.
> 
> My stuff is all Air Liquide


That cart is bad-azz!  I like it a lot!!


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## Buffalo21 (Sep 11, 2020)

Good!!


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## DavidR8 (Sep 11, 2020)

NC Rick said:


> That cart is bad-azz!  I like it a lot!!


Yup, @lis2323 has great eye for design!
I'm fortunate to have made his aquaintance a while back. Gave me a shop tour. Complete shop envy!


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## pontiac428 (Sep 11, 2020)

I've never run oxy-propane before.  I just had a moment when pondering and wondered how different the change would be.  I know acetylene's quirks and hazards.  I use the black smoke as an indicator for setting my gas and to observe for proper heating conditions.  Would I miss those properties of acetylene on propane?  

I won't need to switch anytime soon, it's as easy for me to swap a bottle of acetylene as it is to swap propane.  Just suddenly curious about how the gas behaves.


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## DavidR8 (Sep 11, 2020)

pontiac428 said:


> I've never run oxy-propane before. I just had a moment when pondering and wondered how different the change would be. I know acetylene's quirks and hazards. I use the black smoke as an indicator for setting my gas and to observe for proper heating conditions. Would I miss those properties of acetylene on propane?
> 
> I won't need to switch anytime soon, it's as easy for me to swap a bottle of acetylene as it is to swap propane. Just suddenly curious about how the gas behaves.



It’s all new to me so I’ll be sure to report back on how it goes. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## lordbeezer (Sep 12, 2020)

I’ve been using propane 5-6 years. Works fine for me. Cylinder of propane (20 pound) last along time. Mostly cutting,heating with brazing st times.


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## erikmannie (Sep 12, 2020)

If you ever decide to buy a different sized brazing tip, I have had poor experiences with the import Victor clones. Fortunately, the genuine Victor tips work nicely.

I would say the same about gas lenses for TIG welding. CK Worldwide = great. Import = leaves room for improvement.


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## DavidR8 (Sep 12, 2020)

erikmannie said:


> If you ever decide to buy a different sized brazing tip, I have had poor experiences with the import Victor clones. Fortunately, the genuine Victor tips work nicely.
> 
> I would say the same about gas lenses for TIG welding. CK Worldwide = great. Import = leaves room for improvement.



Yes, I’m not inclined to gamble with something involving 6000 degrees of fire! 

Likewise TIG consumables. My Primeweld came with import consumables and I switched them out for a CK stubby kit. 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## DavidR8 (Sep 19, 2020)

Well I got an estimate for propane compatible torch nozzles for my current torch bodies.
New #6 rosebud $239.55
New brazing head $87.08
Two brazing tips $87.79
Total including tax is $462

A 20 lb propane tank swap is $30 at my corner Esso.
A B tank is $52 to fill.
$462 is a heck of a lot of acetylene at $22 difference per tank fill.


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## lordbeezer (Sep 19, 2020)

Only thing I changed was cutting tip insert. 12.00 here 5-6 years ago. Twenty pound cylinder refill here is 15.00.


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## erikmannie (Sep 19, 2020)

DavidR8 said:


> Well I got an estimate for propane compatible torch nozzles for my current torch bodies.
> New #6 rosebud $239.55
> New brazing head $87.08
> Two brazing tips $87.79
> ...



So you have an acetylene rosebud, torch and welding tips now? I am going to look back over the thread.

Edit: I see it now in Post #77.


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## erikmannie (Sep 19, 2020)

With regard to the items shown in Post #77, which items can only be used with acetylene? It looks the regulators are for oxygen and acetylene.

You got a quote for a rosebud, brazing head and brazing tips, so that may answer my question. What do you mean when you say “brazing head“?

As you know, it is recommended that you use a regulator specific to propane. Very last paragraph of:









						Converting from Acetylene to Alternative Fuels
					

The Acetylene Shortage Acetylene has been the cutting fuel of choice for oxy-welding, brazing, and cutting because it reaches the highest possible temperature, provides clean, efficient cuts, and offers versatility. While most welders would prefer to continue using acetylene for their oxy-fuel...




					bakersgas.com


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## erikmannie (Sep 19, 2020)

With my O/A setup, I have a combination torch. ASIDE FROM the cutting torch (that is, for welding & brazing), there is a “brazing/welding torch” and welding tips (in 000, 00, etc.).

Put another way, if we realize that we are not talking about cutting, we could just say “torch” and “welding tip” for acetylene, with the understanding that you would use the welding tip for brazing.

Similarly, we could talk about a “torch” and “brazing tip” for propane.


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## DavidR8 (Sep 19, 2020)

erikmannie said:


> With regard to the items shown in Post #77, which items can only be used with acetylene? It looks the regulators are for oxygen and acetylene.
> 
> You got a quote for a rosebud, brazing head and brazing tips, so that may answer my question. What do you mean when you say “brazing head“?
> 
> Wouldn’t you need a regulator specific to propane?


By brazing head I mean one of these:



The Victor rep said that I needed a propane reg also. So that's an additional expense.


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## erikmannie (Sep 19, 2020)

DavidR8 said:


> By brazing head I mean one of these:
> View attachment 337573
> 
> 
> The Victor rep said that I needed a propane reg also. So that's an additional expense.



Thanks for clarifying. I call that a “welding tip”. Mine do not have threads at the end, so I have different welding tips for 000,00,0, etc.


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## erikmannie (Sep 19, 2020)

So it sounds like you can use the torch for any fuel. That is good news!


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## DavidR8 (Sep 19, 2020)

erikmannie said:


> Thanks for clarifying. I call that a “welding tip”.


Ah yes, I went brazing as I can't weld with propane.
Yes the torch body can be used with any fuel. But with the exception of the cutting head the propane nozzles are different. The cutting head just gets a different tip.
I may just start using the cutting torch with the propane tip and see if it meet my needs for the heating and bending I want to do.


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## erikmannie (Sep 19, 2020)

DavidR8 said:


> Ah yes, I went brazing as I can't weld with propane.
> 
> Long story made somewhat short is that I'm likely going to go oxy/acetylene. I cannot see dropping near $500 to save $22 on a tank of fuel.



That is fantastic news because gas welding (to me, at least) is extremely satisfying!

Like I have said, gas welding plays out like TIG in slow motion. It is extremely good practice for TIG!

Of course, if you are in a big hurry, you wouldn’t choose gas welding.


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## DavidR8 (Sep 19, 2020)

erikmannie said:


> That is fantastic news because gas welding (to me, at least) is extremely satisfying!
> 
> Like I have said, gas welding plays out like TIG in slow motion. It is extremely good practice for TIG!


Indeed, So I'll find a used B tank or I may spring for a tank. My LWS quoted me $200 for a full, exchangeable B tank.


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## erikmannie (Sep 19, 2020)

I have already said that gas welding is THE way to go on thin (e.g. .020”) steel. This is because you get more time to do the work.

Honestly, anything under .040” and I am choosing the gas welding cart.

I hope you find gas welding as relaxing as I do.

Brazing is even more low stress because you  never have to worry about blowing a hole in the steel.


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## DavidR8 (Sep 19, 2020)

erikmannie said:


> I have already said that gas welding is THE way to go on thin (e.g. .020”) steel. This is because you get more time to do the work.
> 
> Honestly, anything under .040” and I am choosing the gas welding cart.


I was trying to TIG some 16 ga tubing today and it was darn hard to do...


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## erikmannie (Sep 19, 2020)

DavidR8 said:


> I was trying to TIG some 16 ga tubing today and it was darn hard to do...



So .0625” (what I call .063”). Yep, getting into “blowing holes” territory.

Most students go all the way through welding school and never see anything under .120”.

Have you ever extensively practiced on .120”-.250” coupons doing stringers and butt, lap, fillet, Tee, edge and corner joints? That is good to build confidence due to the increased margin for error.

Is your machine capable of pulse? That is a great strategy for thin material. 1.7 PPS, 25% on time and 10% background current is a good starting point. You set the max Amperage pretty high. For example, 150A for .063”. Obviously, you wouldn’t mash the pedal; you would regulate and use only what you need. I use the laywire technique with pulse.


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## DavidR8 (Sep 19, 2020)

erikmannie said:


> So .0625” (what I call .063”). Yep, getting into “blowing holes” territory.
> 
> Most students go all the way through welding school and never see anything under .120”.
> 
> ...


In truth I have not. I will do though as I've I just finished wiring up my shop including adding a 40A 220v receptacle for my TIG machine (which does do pulse)


----------



## erikmannie (Sep 19, 2020)

DavidR8 said:


> In truth I have not. I will do though as I've I just finished wiring up my shop including adding a 40A 220v receptacle for my TIG machine (which does do pulse)



We all need to walk before we can run. Consider flat and horizontal welding only on .120” and up for now. I like .120” because you can skip beveling (for practice joints).

I also have a 40A breaker. Using up to 210A, I have never tripped the breaker.


----------



## DavidR8 (Sep 19, 2020)

erikmannie said:


> We all need to walk before we can run. Consider flat and horizontal welding only on .120” and up for now. I like .120” because you can skip beveling (for practice joints).
> 
> I also have a 40A breaker. Using up to 210A, I have never tripped the breaker.


Thanks for the encouragement Erik, it is greatly appreciated!


----------



## erikmannie (Sep 19, 2020)

I start with stringers. Once I am happy with those, I go to butt joints. I won’t move on to fillet or T-joints until I am satisfied with my butt joint beads. And so on and so forth on to edge and corner joints.


----------



## erikmannie (Sep 19, 2020)

DavidR8 said:


> Thanks for the encouragement Erik, it is greatly appreciated!



You’re welcome. Are you going to listen to music for those many, many hours? The rhythm will definitely help you with your tempo.


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## DavidR8 (Sep 19, 2020)

erikmannie said:


> You’re welcome. Are you going to listen to music for those many, many hours? The rhythm will definitely help you with your tempo.


That's a good idea. I would never have thought of that!


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## erikmannie (Sep 19, 2020)

DavidR8 said:


> That's a good idea. I would never have thought of that!



Spending long hours in a helmet, welding 90+% of the time wearing headphones is an amazing experience! Take a trip without leaving the house.


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## lis2323 (Sep 19, 2020)

DavidR8 said:


> Well I got an estimate for propane compatible torch nozzles for my current torch bodies.
> New #6 rosebud $239.55
> New brazing head $87.08
> Two brazing tips $87.79
> ...



Sorry but that is just messed up. 

These are my immediate thoughts only and by no means intended to be the best way. 

Rosebud. Skip it. Just use the propane tip in your cutting torch. I have a rosebud torch and NEVER use it. Keep in mind you may not be able to use a rosebud safely and efficiently with a B acetylene tank. 

Try brazing with your existing torch and tips. I can’t comment accurately on this as I have never used propane. 

Go either route (propane or O/A) but I do know for certain you don’t need to spend that $462. I will find better stuff for you to spend your hard earned bucks on... just give me a budget.


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## DavidR8 (Sep 19, 2020)

lis2323 said:


> Sorry but that is just messed up.
> 
> These are my immediate thoughts only and by no means intended to be the best way.
> 
> ...



Yup I was pretty stunned when I got the prices. 
Tells me that I got a good deal on my torches. 
I’m going to do exactly as you’re suggesting. Use the propane tip in the torch and see how the brazing nozzles work with propane. 

If it’s not great on propane then I’m all set for acetylene. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## pontiac428 (Sep 19, 2020)

erikmannie said:


> Spending long hours in a helmet, welding 90+% of the time wearing headphones is an amazing experience! Take a trip without leaving the house.



Choosing the right music is like choosing the right wire or setting.  I prefer Front 242 or Juno Reactor for getting into the zone and up tempo.


----------



## pontiac428 (Sep 19, 2020)

Oh no, don't skip the rosebud!  It's the most often used tip in my cart.  I can cut with plasma and weld with electricity most of the time, but the torch is the only method I have for heating material.  Whether I'm heating and quenching tool steel, making a heavy bend, breaking loose a tight bolt, or pre-heating for a weld, it's a job for a rosebud.


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## DavidR8 (Sep 19, 2020)

pontiac428 said:


> Oh no, don't skip the rosebud! It's the most often used tip in my cart. I can cut with plasma and weld with electricity most of the time, but the torch is the only method I have for heating material. Whether I'm heating and quenching tool steel, making a heavy bend, breaking loose a tight bolt, or pre-heating for a weld, it's a job for a rosebud.



I’m going to try all of what I have with propane and see how they go. 


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## pontiac428 (Sep 19, 2020)

Any tip that mixes gas should work with any gaseous fuel, you dial the mixture with your valves.  The cutting tip is different, because the proportion of oxidizer to fuel is partially controlled by the proportion of the gas orifices in the tip because cutting torch heads have two gas circuits.  Propane requires 3x more oxygen than acetylene by volume.









						Propane vs. Acetylene Cutting and Welding - Rexarc
					

A Brief Discussion on Key Differences between Propane Welding and Acetylene Gas Welding




					www.rexarc.com


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## lis2323 (Sep 19, 2020)

pontiac428 said:


> Any tip that mixes gas should work with any gaseous fuel, you dial the mixture with your valves. The cutting tip is different, because the proportion of oxidizer to fuel is partially controlled by the proportion of the gas orifices in the tip because cutting torch heads have two gas circuits. Propane requires 3x more oxygen than acetylene by volume.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Agreed. David should only require purchasing a propane tip for his cutting torch (if he goes the propane route. ). Ten dollars or so. Maybe a second tip if he intends on cutting heavier stock. 

His existing welding tips will work fine for brazing. His tig will look after the items typically gas welded.


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## DavidR8 (Sep 19, 2020)

lis2323 said:


> Agreed. David should only require purchasing a propane tip for his cutting torch (if he goes the propane route. ). Ten dollars or so. Maybe a second tip if he intends on cutting heavier stock.
> 
> His existing welding tips will work fine for brazing. His tig will look after the items typically gas welded.



And I already purchased the tip. 


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