# Buying mill and lathe one by one or together?



## umnik (Aug 15, 2019)

I am considering to buy mill and lathe for myself (currently researching for what models). I am thinking to buy milling machine first and lathe later. I see a lot of people buys lathe + mill together. Any special reasoning for that? I understand if some pro does that setting up his/he shop. But for hobby persons?
I thought that I buy mill first, clean it, mount on stand and set it up and get familiar with it. Once it is done and everything settled I can get lathe and do the same with it.


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## Boswell (Aug 15, 2019)

Welcome to the forum. I purchased in table top Mill first and used it to get familiar with basic metal work. Then purchased a larger lathe that is probably more than enough for my lifetime, then came back and replace the little table top mill with a larger Mill that also should last my remaining lifetime.  All this over about 1-2 years. It really comes down to your finances, space and what you want to make.


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## mmcmdl (Aug 15, 2019)

What came first , the chicken or the egg ? The answer here is buy what you need/want in your price range .


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## Flyinfool (Aug 15, 2019)

Finding a deal on a good machine is hard enough, trying to find a good deal on 2 good machines as a package is extremely hard to do.

If you have a current use for one or the other then that is the one you should concentrate on first. 

If you are looking to just getting started making chips then get whichever you find a good deal on first. and pick up the other when that deal shows up. You will learn a lot from either machine that will help you in getting the next machine.


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## umnik (Aug 15, 2019)

Oh, when I said buy 2 at once, I meant new machines. Typical situation here is buy both from Matt.


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## Nutfarmer (Aug 15, 2019)

With a lot of us it depends on what we can find at the right time and price. I looked for over two years and found both a lathe and mill from the same seller. They were both in good condition and at the right price. Have been happy with both. Some one was selling out an estate and wanted the machines gone.


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## mmcmdl (Aug 15, 2019)

Exactly what are you looking for ? What size etc .


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## umnik (Aug 15, 2019)

As for buying new VS used, that is big issue for me.

New one is presto, just call Matt and get whatever your mind set on. Done. You know in advance what you will get, can read full specs of the machines and place you order. Only thing is waiting a little bit if machine is back ordered. May be you will get not best per your buck, but it is all predictable.

As for used one. Only real thing I see is Craigslist. But in vicinity where I live I do not see much stuff popped up frequently, and even if there is something it is in condition you do not want buy at stupidly high price. I do not know any used machinery dealers in my area and do not know how to hunt for auction at which people buy at. Sure, I want heavier better build old american machinery, but it is pretty difficult to find a good deal.


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## mmcmdl (Aug 15, 2019)

You're in Md and can't find equipment ? You're looking in the wrong places .  This stuff falls in my lap everyday .









						wanted: Metal Lathe
					

Good Day I am looking for a used (but not too crappy) metal lathe. Something between 7x16 and 10x28.2 with around 1,000 watts power (1.34 HP), Can be in inches or metric (would prefer metric, but will take inches). Good rigidity and weight (250 to 400 lb) basic tools in good shape would also be...




					www.hobby-machinist.com


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## umnik (Aug 15, 2019)

mmcmdl said:


> Exactly what are you looking for ? What size etc .


mmcmdl,
Now I thinking about PM-929M-PDF and PM-1236 from Matt.
Do not mind old used machinery, but it depends on if I can find good one. Sure I can do little bit of TLC but not in the mood to spend half or year restoring bit up machine. I prefer to make something else.


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## rzw0wr (Aug 15, 2019)

Who is Matt? How can I get hold of him.


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## mmcmdl (Aug 15, 2019)

There is good top notch equipment everywhere these days . Most from hobby shops that the owners have passed on . Shoot me a pm if you want , I know where a lot of stuff is and I'm not persueing it at the moment .


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## umnik (Aug 15, 2019)

mmcmdl said:


> You're in Md and can't find equipment ? You're looking in the wrong places .  This stuff falls in my lap everyday .
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That's for sure. Where should I look for?
Then just forward the stuff from your lap to me? I'llappreciate it.


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## umnik (Aug 15, 2019)

rzw0wr said:


> Who is Matt? How can I get hold of him.


Precision Matthews


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## umnik (Aug 15, 2019)

mmcmdl said:


> There is good top notch equipment everywhere these days . Most from hobby shops that the owners have passed on . Shoot me a pm if you want , I know where a lot of stuff is and I'm not persueing it at the moment .


I will.


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## mikey (Aug 15, 2019)

umnik said:


> I am considering to buy mill and lathe for myself (currently researching for what models). I am thinking to buy milling machine first and lathe later. I see a lot of people buys lathe + mill together. Any special reasoning for that? I understand if some pro does that setting up his/he shop. But for hobby persons?
> I thought that I buy mill first, clean it, mount on stand and set it up and get familiar with it. Once it is done and everything settled I can get lathe and do the same with it.



There is no right answer as to which to get first. A lathe and mill are entirely different kinds of machines that do most things differently.

With that said, and thinking of this from the perspective of a new guy to the hobby, I would opt for the lathe first if finances require only one machine at a time. The lathe is, by far, the best teacher for metal working that I know of. It will teach you about speeds, feeds, how metal likes to be cut, lathe tools, drilling, boring and how to work with precision. I have two lathes and two mills and I use the lathes far more than the mills in my shop. You will eventually need to have a mill, too, but it won't teach you what a lathe will. Just an opinion.


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## mickri (Aug 15, 2019)

Welcome to the madness.  Don't be afraid to ask any question no matter how simple you may think it is.  The are great people on this forum who will go out of their way to help you out.

I was in your position 3 years ago.  A complete newbie looking for a lathe and a bench top mill.  My advice is to look for both and buy which ever one you find first.  That's what I did.  I had been looking for over a year.  Just happened to find the mill/drill first.  Then a couple of weeks later I found a lathe.  Both came from Craigslist and were estate sales.  I have also found some good used equipment at auctions and in thrift stores of all places. 

 The mill and the lathe are just a small part of the cost.  The tooling you will need often costs more than the lathe or the mill.  Used equipment often comes with lots of tooling.  My mill/drill had never been used and only came with a huge 15" rotary table that would not even fit on the table.  A local machine shop snapped it up for more than I paid for the mill/drill.  My lathe was just the opposite.  It came with every accessory offered by craftsman except for a taper attachment, multiple 3 and 4 jaw chucks, dial indicators and more.  I didn't need to buy anything to start using the lathe. 

One great way to get some chips under your belt is to make tooling instead of buying.  I made a norman style QCTP and an ER32 collet chuck for my lathe.  I have since made a boring head.  One of my next projects is going to be a parting tool holder that mounts on the back side of the cross slide.

Start with easy projects and move up to more complex stuff as you gain experience.


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## Winegrower (Aug 15, 2019)

You need both.  Don’t kid yourself.


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## Bob Korves (Aug 15, 2019)

Matt (owner of Precision Matthews) is a good supplier, highly regarded, known for standing behind his products.  Matt is also a member and commercial member on this site.  That said, they are still Chinese or Taiwanese machines, built to a lower price point than something from, say, Europe.  You WILL find things wrong with them, mostly stuff you can easily fix yourself, live with it like it is, or get help from the seller.  When we take apart a Chinese machine, there are invariably plenty of signs of cutting corners to save time and money so they can sell them to you cheaper.  You get what you pay for.  Well, actually, you do not get MORE than you paid for.  Not trying to put down Asian machines, lots of hobby machinists, including me, make good parts with them and are happy to have that decently usable equipment at that low price point.  Remember that *machinists* do good work to their limitations, *machines* just do as they are told to their limitations.


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## RobertB (Aug 16, 2019)

Which ever one you buy first, the next part you have to make will inevitably require the other machine


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## mksj (Aug 16, 2019)

I started out with a mill, found it more useful for the type of work I was doing. Eventually bought a lathe and can see a good argument to get both if you can afford it. I have gone with new machines, in particular if you are a newbie and do not know how to thoroughly check out the machine. I eventually upgraded to a larger knee mill and heavier lathe, looked at a few used mills and most needed repairs/parts were expensive. If you have the time and experience then the used machine market is a viable option depending on location. It is also an economical decisions and the scope of work you want to do. If I was buying on the used market, I would look for a mill as opposed to a lathe, they are easier to check out.

QMT/Matt has a new mill in the works which is the PM-728V-T which looks like a very nice (smaller) mill made in Taiwan. Otherwise the 727V/30MV are popular models with positive reviews. Going 230VAC in machines is preferred, and the variable speed is very nice. If you plan on doing larger work,  maybe look at the used market for a knee mill. As far as lathes, the 1236 is a good all around size, I would look for a standard D1-4 spindle mount and get a QCTP. Combining the purchase may save some on freight costs. Tooling/accessories on the lathe is more expensive than a mill.


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## Mitch Alsup (Aug 16, 2019)

umnik said:


> I thought that I buy mill first, clean it, mount on stand and set it up and get familiar with it. Once it is done and everything settled I can get lathe and do the same with it.



Why not get a mill big enough you don't need to put it on a stand?


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## ezduzit (Aug 16, 2019)

mmcmdl said:


> You're in Md and can't find equipment ?...



This.

If you're a lazy shopper, or just have a lot of money to blow and don't care about quality, then just order a new Chinese one. If you care about quality, want to save a lot of money and get much more bang for your buck, look for a quality used machine in good condition with comprehensive tooling included. This usually means avoiding machine resellers, as they most often offer only rather bare machines.

I bought my lathe and mill together with several boxes of tooling for $2,000. No repairs were necessary, just some cleaning. It doesn't matter which one you buy first--you'll need both machines. So watch for the right deal.


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## Firstgear (Aug 16, 2019)

I bought both at the same time from PM.  I was able to get one price shipping for both since I was close enough and could pick it up at a terminal local to me.  Given your locale you might be able to as well.  Ask!


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## davidcarmichael (Aug 16, 2019)

I bought a small lathe first and found out its limitations and why I needed a mill. I then bought a small mill and learned a lot from it, eventually realizing I needed a much larger mill (a knee mill). I bought both the larger lathe and the mill from Matt at Precision Matthews and I'm sure I would have got a better deal if I had bought both at once.
Second-hand equipment is great if you are lucky and knowledgeable, but otherwise I wouldn't risk it


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## Firstgear (Aug 16, 2019)

davidcarmichael said:


> I bought a small lathe first and found out its limitations and why I needed a mill. I then bought a small mill and learned a lot from it, eventually realizing I needed a much larger mill (a knee mill). I bought both the larger lathe and the mill from Matt at Precision Matthews and I'm sure I would have got a better deal if I had bought both at once.
> Second-hand equipment is great if you are lucky and knowledgeable, but otherwise I wouldn't risk it


Exactly why I didn’t buy used.  I figured I had enough challenges making parts without compounding the issue with machines that needed work.  I didn’t want to waste my time....money I have, time I do not.


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## westerner (Aug 16, 2019)

Winegrower said:


> You need both. Don’t kid yourself.


Yup. What he said. As you start using one, you will quickly find you need the other. Matters not which is first. Welcome to the party.


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## umnik (Aug 17, 2019)

ezduzit said:


> This.
> 
> If you're a lazy shopper, or just have a lot of money to blow and don't care about quality, then just order a new Chinese one. If you care about quality, want to save a lot of money and get much more bang for your buck, look for a quality used machine in good condition with comprehensive tooling included. This usually means avoiding machine resellers, as they most often offer only rather bare machines.
> 
> I bought my lathe and mill together with several boxes of tooling for $2,000. No repairs were necessary, just some cleaning. It doesn't matter which one you buy first--you'll need both machines. So watch for the right deal.


I wouldn't say I am lazy shopper, may be uneducated. I monitored Craigs List and eBay listing for last month in my vicinity and did not see much good machines with right price tag. May be I do not know where to look for.


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## jdedmon91 (Aug 17, 2019)

umnik said:


> I wouldn't say I am lazy shopper, may be uneducated. I monitored Craigs List and eBay listing for last month in my vicinity and did not see much good machines with right price tag. May be I do not know where to look for.



On the issue of buying both at the same time, in theory it’s a great idea if you have the funds. 

I’ll give you my story to see if it helps. I’m on my 3rd lathe. Started out with the el cheepo mini lathe, decided to up grade to a bench lathe,so I did my research look around and decided on an Asian import from Lathemaster. Great little lathe however I decided I wanted other features like a QC gearbox and cross slide feeding.

Tried for a long time to find a 12 inch swing lathe used within a 2 hour one way drive, no luck. So I decided to purchase another Asian machine, I decided on a Grizzly G0750G. My reasoning was the larger company with hopefully better parts availability. I did look at a PM equivalent machine and just decided to go with Grizzly. 

After I had the 2nd lathe. I wanted a mill, my shop was small at the time so I needed a bench-top mill. I didn’t want a round column mill because of the positioning drawbacks, so that lead me to dovetail way machine. Based on the the research I went with a PM 25 mill from Matt. Great machine. I mounted a DRO on it and used it for several years.

I now have a larger shop space and out grew the little PM 25. Again I did my research, I wanted the following, long stroke in the z axis for drilling, at least a 30” inch table, power feed in the x axis. After I priced the PM and similar large bench top machines, I also started looking for a knee mill local. 

I found a Lagun FT 3 local from a machine repair guy, that took the mill in on trade, it was used in an airline repair shop, obsoleted out and he traded for the machine. Then he done some minor repairs on the mill and put it up on CL for sale. The price was fair, and then I actually hired the machine to be moved here for a fair price.

My advice is, what is your budget? Next how serious are you on machining as a hobby? What kind of space do you have to set your shop up in? Are you someone who wants to make chips or is the challenge of fixing little flaws your thing? Do you enjoy searching for deals, or you want to get started?

The point is most of us have went through a process of elimination to get the machines we using. Unless your a experienced machinist with a good understanding on the direction that you want your shop to go in I’d be careful on buying both. If that is the direction your wanted because you want to get started, then find a vendor like Precision Matthews and buy the largest best equipped lathe and mill you can fit in your shop space and the budget will allow


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Downunder Bob (Aug 17, 2019)

My general advice is get the biggest that will comfortably fit in the space you have available, and buy the best quality you can afford. My reasoning for this is that just about everyone has either upgraded from their original purchase or would like to

Of the Asian machines the Chinese ones are generally the cheapest in the new market, Taiwanese machines are much superior in quality and only about 20% dearer,. The best bang for your buck if you can afford it.

Consider if you will likely be screwcutting threads, and are most likely to be cutting metric or imperial threads, you can order a new lathe accordingly with imperial leadscrew and quick change gearbox for the threads. Likewise you can get the same machine with a metric leadscrew and QCGB for metric threads. 

Most new machines can be ordered with a conversion gear, usually on the medium to larger machines a 127 x 120 T gear set and on smaller machines often a 63 x 60 T set. there are some others that are used but these are the most common.


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## MrWhoopee (Aug 17, 2019)

If you aren't already, use Searchtempest to search multiple CLs at once. 




__





						SearchTempest: Search all of Facebook Marketplace, craigslist & more
					

Search by state, driving distance, or just search all of Facebook Marketplace*, craigslist*, eBay and more. The most trusted classifieds search engine. *Not affiliated with Facebook or craigslist.




					www.searchtempest.com
				




Decide how far you are willing to drive and it will  search all CLs within that radius. Rather than trying to figure out the right keywords, I just search the Tools category with no keywords. You see everything listed that way. You are likely to get a large amount of valuable tooling included in a used purchase, particularly in estate sales.


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