# My first lathe - don't laugh



## jaredbeck (Aug 20, 2017)

Hi y'all, I got my first lathe. It's pretty exciting for me but it's very basic, probably not too interesting for other people. It doesn't even have a chuck, just a faceplate and dead centers!

Like I said in my intro. post last week, I'm looking to get a real machine, like a Grizzly G4003 or a PM-1236. But, in the meantime, I found this lathe for free (no motor) on the Syracuse craigslist and I thought I could learn something about how to operate a lathe while I wait to get a real machine.




I took apart the carriage and tailstock, dunked everything in degreaser and ran every part through my new parts washer. I oiled everything, put it back together, and I don't have any parts left over, so that's good! 

Side note: I wanted to replace a taper pin, then I looked up what an assortment of pins costs, and just reused it as is.   The assortments don't even cover the really small pins like this machine has (0.090", size #5/0) so .. well I know this is going to be an expensive hobby! 




The lathe is at least as old as me because when I was a kid, Sears and Roebuck was already just called Sears.

I borrowed a 1/3 hp motor from my dad. I have a feeling it'll be enough to turn little stuff, but I don't know, what do you think?







It has a forward/reverse switch right on the motor, so that might come in handy.




Now I just need to mount everything to my bench. I have a belt, and both machines have cone pulleys .. so .. will the belt fit both? I don't know anything about belts. I probably need some advice about that.

Well, I hope that wasn't too boring. It's exciting for me. I've been watching machining videos on YT for at least a year, so I'm stoked to finally get a lathe to play with. Maybe you can relate to getting your first machine tool?


----------



## jaredbeck (Aug 21, 2017)

Oh, I forgot, I took some measurements:

from ways to center: 2.5" (does than mean "swing" of 5"?)
distance between centers: 16"
compound travel: 1.7"
cross-slide travel: 4"
tailstock spindle travel: 1.5"

Based on the model number, it was probably a Dunlap Modelmaker's Lathe. (http://www.vintagemachinery.org/pubs/detail.aspx?id=4575) Could be as old as the 1940s.


----------



## tweinke (Aug 21, 2017)

Belated Welcome! I'm sure no one will laugh at you because that is not how we roll around here. I share your excitement and hope your "new" lathe works out for you. Probably a good way to start because the intimidation factor wont be as high as a large machine. Get your hands on some lathe bits and jump in and please ask questions if needed!   Also feel free to ask anyone here about the cost of this obsession, I mean hobby, seems expensive at times but for me at least the smile on my face and satisfaction of finishing a project big or small makes it worth it.


----------



## Bob Korves (Aug 21, 2017)

http://www.lathes.co.uk/craftsman/page5.html


----------



## francist (Aug 21, 2017)

Hey Jared, that's a cool little lathe! Nothing wrong with starting out small and building from there. It'll cut metal, it'll teach you things, and you'll learn lots. And really, that's the name of the game.

And for total giggles, here's a (small) pic of my first woodworking lathe 40 years ago! Yup, four pieces of wood, two dowels, some ill fitting screws and candle wax for lubricant. Power was supplied by my left hand pulling a cord wrapped around the blank and running to a clothesline pulley hanging from the ceiling. Uglier than sin, but it got the job done. Sometimes it's not what you've got but what you do with it that counts.

Happy turning!

-frank


----------



## dlane (Aug 21, 2017)

I like it the 1725 rpm 1/3hp motor should be good for it, find a chuck and start making chips. 
And you can't beat the price 
Frank I'm at a loss for words on your first lathe except ok , do you still have it.


----------



## francist (Aug 21, 2017)

Derek -- yeah, still have it. Pretty brutal isn't it? its been in the scrap box more than once but I keep dragging it out. My mom always remembered it, I think she liked the "make do with what you have" feel about it.

-frank


----------



## Mark_f (Aug 21, 2017)

Welcome and congratulations. Wow ...... I had a little Sears lathe just like that once (about$10,000 ago) that I got for free from a friend. Now I have a complete home shop where I can build almost anything I want ( and have done so). Even though I have been a machinist all my life, l didn't start it as a hobby until I retired about 10 years ago. You will start upgrading as you learn more.


----------



## Charles Spencer (Aug 21, 2017)

francist said:


> Uglier than sin, but it got the job done. Sometimes it's not what you've got but what you do with it that counts.



Do what you can, with what you have, where you are.  _Theodore Roosevelt_


----------



## Ulma Doctor (Aug 21, 2017)

congratulations jared on the new lathe!
you'll need to make or get some drive dogs, but that is easy enough.
you'll learn how to turn between centers first off, and that will turn the most accurate work possible on your new joy!
have lots of fun learning!


----------



## markba633csi (Aug 21, 2017)

As far as 109 series go that is a rare one I think, not many around 
very collectible, congrats
Mark S


----------



## brino (Aug 21, 2017)

Hi @jaredbeck 

Welcome to the group!

Your lathe photo brings back memories. My first lathe was _very _similar. I wrote a little about it here:
http://www.hobby-machinist.com/thre...s-some-work-where-to-start.35669/#post-302842

I found it a great way to learn. I hope you do too.
Don't hesitate to ask anything here.

-brino


----------



## dalvorius (Aug 21, 2017)

jaredbeck said:


> Hi y'all, I got my first lathe. It's pretty exciting for me but it's very basic, probably not too interesting for other people.
> 
> <snip>
> 
> Well, I hope that wasn't too boring. It's exciting for me. I've been watching machining videos on YT for at least a year, so I'm stoked to finally get a lathe to play with. Maybe you can relate to getting your first machine tool?



Absolutely - and jealous.

For the many of us 'watching' and without (yet) a lathe or mill, this is very exciting.

Congratulations


----------



## wrmiller (Aug 21, 2017)

The pistolsmith I worked for had a small Craftsman lathe (made by Atlas?) on a bench right next to the handwork station. We used that lathe all the time for things like screws, firing pins, barrel bushings, etc., etc.. On some days, it would get used a half-dozen times or so, while the big lathe was never even turned on.

I built my first competition pistol on a smaller lathe than that.

Enjoy what you have, and have fun learning about your new lathe and what you can do with it. You will surprise yourself. I did.


----------



## higgite (Aug 21, 2017)

> *My first lathe - don't laugh*



I'm sorry, but I had to laugh. Of course, I always laugh when I'm jealous. 
Good find. Looks like a fun project. Welcome aboard.

Tom


----------



## richl (Aug 21, 2017)

One thing is for sure, if you ever decide to get a bigger lathe, you will completely love what it offers over this one. Congrats on the Lathe! I really hope you get as much fun outta this hobby as I do.

Rich


----------



## dontrinko (Aug 21, 2017)

Have fun! you can have big fun on a little lathe.  bigger is not necessarily better. Don


----------



## Douglas F. (Aug 21, 2017)

1/3 HP is as much as it can handle, so the motor will fit it great. You can't beat free! Congratulations and have fun! Ps. Take very very light cuts with the machine while you get the hang of it. The 109.xxxx series of lathes need to be treated with care of the spindle may bend.


----------



## dulltool17 (Aug 21, 2017)

No laughter here, Jared.   Hang out here long enough and you'll be amazed what you can do with a small lathe like yours.
Go forth and make chips!


----------



## kvt (Aug 21, 2017)

It looks bigger than my first one,  It was a little hand me down Sherline 4000,   Bu it would cut stuff if you took light cuts.   So yours should also.   Sit back and have some fun.   Find a bunch of scraps, and just turn them down to get the hang of it.    then start having more fun.


----------



## ericc (Aug 21, 2017)

Check out my post in shop made tools.  These lathes can make stuff.  You just have to work within their limitations.


----------



## Old junk (Aug 21, 2017)

Not the size of the tool but what you can do with it.good luck and enjoy


----------



## T Bredehoft (Aug 21, 2017)

Once you get used to  hand cranking to feed the tool,  you'll not want to give it up when you get a larger lathe.


----------



## jaredbeck (Aug 22, 2017)

Bob Korves said:


> http://www.lathes.co.uk/craftsman/page5.html



Wow, thanks Bob, what a wealth of information!



francist said:


> .. for total giggles, here's a (small) pic of my first woodworking lathe 40 years ago! Yup, four pieces of wood, two dowels, some ill fitting screws and candle wax for lubricant. -frank



Awesome. Reminds me of the stuff Matthias Wandel does (https://www.youtube.com/user/Matthiaswandel) That guy can do anything with wood. Check out the  bandsaws he designs and makes.



dlane said:


> .. find a chuck and start making chips.



I found this list of people who sell chucks: http://www.lathes.co.uk/craftsman/index.html

But, how do I remove the faceplate? Does it thread on, or just jam in a taper? Is there a spindle lock? I can post some close up pictures if that would help.



markba633csi said:


> As far as 109 series go that is a rare one I think, not many around
> very collectible, congrats
> Mark S



Huh. I did not consider that lathes could be collectibles, interesting. I guess there's a collector for everything, huh?



Douglas F. said:


> 1/3 HP is as much as it can handle, so the motor will fit it great. You can't beat free! Congratulations and have fun! Ps. Take very very light cuts with the machine while you get the hang of it. The 109.xxxx series of lathes need to be treated with care of the spindle may bend.



Thanks for the words of caution. Glad to hear the motor's a good choice.


----------



## jimbob (Aug 22, 2017)

One like it was my 1st lathe. Made a lot of money rebuilding motorcycle starters with it. Paid $75.00 for it and sold it some years later for $300.00 my asking price. 
Moved on to a Craftsman 12" which does everything I need and still have it.


----------



## Bob Korves (Aug 22, 2017)

jaredbeck said:


> But, how do I remove the faceplate? Does it thread on, or just jam in a taper? Is there a spindle lock?


It should be just threaded on.  I would soak it from the front and back of the faceplate with penetrating oil and see if you can free it up.  Let the penetrant sit overnight, then turn it first in the tighten direction, followed by the loosen direction, counter clockwise.  Do not force it or you might bend the spindle.  If it does not come free with moderate force, do the penetrant thing again, try to work it loose, lather, rinse, repeat until it comes off, and it will eventually come off.  It had decades to get stuck on there, you have days or weeks or whatever to get it loose if necessary.  Patience, grasshopper...


----------



## dlane (Aug 22, 2017)

If no spindle lock , might try wedging wood between pulley and casting being careful not to bend or break anything , or a strap wrench on pulley , are there any gears in there ?. Might get a couple pics of headstock pulley set up.


----------



## markba633csi (Aug 22, 2017)

It's threaded Jared;  1/2"-20 thread or 3/4"-16 but probably the former.
Try grabbing the belt and twist it up tight with one hand and tug on the faceplate with the other, that might get it. 
Also use the penetrating oil (like Liquid Wrench) or similar like Bob suggested. 
I don't think there is a spindle lock on this machine
Mark S


----------



## bfd (Aug 22, 2017)

my first home lathe was a 6" craftsman ( atlas) basket case I got it at a salvage yard in downey ,ca  the guy at the salvage yard asked me what I was looking for and I answered what have you got he said wait a minute and returned with a shopping cart with a lathe torn apart in a shopping cart I bought it and took it home minus the cart. rebuilt it and used it for a couple years then sold it to a boss at work. at that time sears still had some parts for it. the best part was a new headstock that used tapered roller bearings, the old headstock used bronze bushings. best upgrade to that lathe ever. bill


----------



## Bob Korves (Aug 22, 2017)

Lathes UK said 1/2"-24 spindle thread for Jared's model.  Oddball...  And small!  It will not take much to bend that spindle.  Be careful with it!


----------



## core-oil (Aug 22, 2017)

Jaredbeck,

Great that you have got yourself a little lathe, It is a beginning, and when you manage to get her set up you can pick up on experience as you move on, It may only be a small simple lathe, but many a man has achieved excellent outcomes on such a machine, Remember these little lathes were constructed in the days before folks were tearing off metal using "Throw away tool tips " and creating blue chips , at a supersonic speed,   For a home craftsman , What the hell is the point, Is one on bonus at home?  I think most of my contemporaries nowadays , are high speed merchants and believe using high speed  (stellite ) tool steel is mostly for the Dinosaurs, I believe learning to sharpen your own tools & learning the basics is a good beginning , You will no doubt go on to a bigger and more complex machine as you develop .
 you will look back in a few years time , & think how you got on with that simple little machine, Do not be in a hurry to send it packing as you modernise, Keep it for the little simple tasks , Especially when your hopefully bigger and more modern machine has work set in the chuck you do not want to disturb, Have fun that is the name of the game.


----------



## itsme_Bernie (Aug 22, 2017)

Hey Jared

Welcome to the forum, and congrats on getting started! I started on a similar machine about 20 years ago, and haven't looked back. I kept it until about five years ago, still loved it! 


I had an Atlas 618 (similar machine, slightly heavier).  Awesome starter, and lots of people never want to get rid of them, they're really great little machines.  Nice high rpm as well.

Lots of parts available online, but you willl usually pay a bit of a premium as there are a lot of them around, And they are easy to move so people aren't afraid of them.

Motor switch will be great, you might eventually want to go with a switch in front of the machine so you have easier access to switch off the machine

Do you have the jack shaft set up? Is it entirely separate set of Palese with a little lever arm on a cast iron stand that reduces the speed by a factor of 8 or so.  

Good luck and keep letting us know what you're up to! Don't be afraid to ask a lot of questions if you want to.  Everyone here had to ask somebody at some point in their past.


Bernie 


.
Bernie


----------



## jaredbeck (Aug 22, 2017)

Bob Korves said:


> It should be just threaded on.  I would soak it from the front and back of the faceplate with penetrating oil and see if you can free it up.  Let the penetrant sit overnight, then turn it first in the tighten direction, followed by the loosen direction, counter clockwise.  Do not force it or you might bend the spindle.  If it does not come free with moderate force, do the penetrant thing again, try to work it loose, lather, rinse, repeat until it comes off, and it will eventually come off.  It had decades to get stuck on there, you have days or weeks or whatever to get it loose if necessary.  Patience, grasshopper...



Thanks Bob, I did exactly what you said, soaked it overnight in penetrating oil, and it came off with only hand-strength. There are also holes in the faceplate for a two-pin spanner wrench, but I don't own one.



markba633csi said:


> It's threaded Jared .. Try grabbing the belt and twist it up tight with one hand and tug on the faceplate with the other, that might get it. .. Also use the penetrating oil (like Liquid Wrench) or similar like Bob suggested.
> I don't think there is a spindle lock on this machine
> Mark S



Thanks Mark, grabbing the belt like that worked well.



bfd said:


> my first home lathe .. the best part was a new headstock that used tapered roller bearings, the old headstock used bronze bushings. best upgrade to that lathe ever. bill



Thanks for the upgrade tip, Bill. I'm pretty sure mine has plain bearings, not sure what the material is.



Bob Korves said:


> Lathes UK said 1/2"-24 spindle thread for Jared's model.  Oddball...  And small!  It will not take much to bend that spindle.  Be careful with it!



Yes, it looks like the spindle is 1/2"-24 outside. Inside it may be MT0, I'm not sure.






core-oil said:


> .. these little lathes were constructed in the days before folks were tearing off metal using "Throw away tool tips "  .. I believe learning to sharpen your own tools & learning the basics is a good beginning .. Have fun that is the name of the game.



Thanks, I've watched a few videos on grinding HSS (the one by This Old Tony was great) and I have some 1/4" blanks on order from Grizzly. After watching videos for at least a year, I'm having a blast putting what I've learned to work finally!



itsme_Bernie said:


> Do you have the jack shaft set up? Is it entirely separate set of Palese with a little lever arm on a cast iron stand that reduces the speed by a factor of 8 or so.



Oh neat, no I haven't got that part. I hope I can get it running reasonably slow without it. The motor is 1725 RPM and the slowest ratio between the two cone pulleys is 2" input / 3.25" output, which would be about 1060 RPM? I'm not at all certain about that math.


----------



## Bob Korves (Aug 22, 2017)

jaredbeck said:


> The motor is 1725 RPM and the slowest ratio between the two cone pulleys is 2" input / 3.25" output, which would be about 1060 RPM? I'm not at all certain about that math.


Your math is good.  Unbelievably, I can still do that in my head...


----------



## Bob Korves (Aug 22, 2017)

For aluminum or brass, which would be about 400 surface feet per minute (SFPM), 1 1/4 to 1 1/2" would be about the maximum diameter you might try at that speed to get started.  With steel at 100 SFPM, about 1/2" would be a useful work diameter.  Start even slower than that, or should I say smaller diameter until you get a feel for it.  These numbers are for high speed steel (HSS) tools, which I recommend you use with that lathe.  A jack shaft to lower the speed would give you a lot more options for work diameter and speed.


----------



## silence dogood (Aug 22, 2017)

Hey guys, remember your first car that you owned.  Mine was a 61 Ford Falcon station wagon, three speed on the column.  Always had to fiddle with her, but she always got me home.  I guess for many of us the first lathe is like that.


----------



## benmychree (Aug 22, 2017)

core-oil said:


> Jaredbeck,
> 
> Great that you have got yourself a little lathe, It is a beginning, and when you manage to get her set up you can pick up on experience as you move on, It may only be a small simple lathe, but many a man has achieved excellent outcomes on such a machine, Remember these little lathes were constructed in the days before folks were tearing off metal using "Throw away tool tips " and creating blue chips , at a supersonic speed,   For a home craftsman , What the hell is the point, Is one on bonus at home?  I think most of my contemporaries nowadays , are high speed merchants and believe using high speed  (stellite ) tool steel is mostly for the Dinosaurs, I believe learning to sharpen your own tools & learning the basics is a good beginning , You will no doubt go on to a bigger and more complex machine as you develop .
> you will look back in a few years time , & think how you got on with that simple little machine, Do not be in a hurry to send it packing as you modernise, Keep it for the little simple tasks , Especially when your hopefully bigger and more modern machine has work set in the chuck you do not want to disturb, Have fun that is the name of the game.


Stellite and HSS are completely different formulations; Stellite is a alloy of cobalt and chromium only, there are other formulations, but that is what Stellite is, as opposed to HSS which may contain small additions of either element, it is as it's name indicates, is mostly steel.  Stellite is pretty much only for cutting cast iron, where HSS will cut most anything within certain hardness limits.


----------



## jaredbeck (Aug 22, 2017)

Bob Korves said:


> For aluminum or brass, which would be about 400 surface feet per minute (SFPM), 1 1/4 to 1 1/2" would be about the maximum diameter you might try at that speed to get started.  With steel at 100 SFPM, about 1/2" would be a useful work diameter.  Start even slower than that, or should I say smaller diameter until you get a feel for it.  These numbers are for high speed steel (HSS) tools, which I recommend you use with that lathe.  A jack shaft to lower the speed would give you a lot more options for work diameter and speed.



Thanks Bob. I'll stick with those sizes, and take light cuts.



silence dogood said:


> Hey guys, remember your first car that you owned.  Mine was a 61 Ford Falcon station wagon, three speed on the column.  Always had to fiddle with her, but she always got me home.  I guess for many of us the first lathe is like that.



Mine was a 1990 corolla and I drove it into the ground because I didn't know how to take care of machines then and I was broke.  But, yes, despite that it's still a good memory.



benmychree said:


> Stellite and HSS are completely different formulations; Stellite is a alloy of cobalt and chromium only, there are other formulations, but that is what Stellite is, as opposed to HSS which may contain small additions of either element, it is as it's name indicates, is mostly steel.  Stellite is pretty much only for cutting cast iron, where HSS will cut most anything within certain hardness limits.



Interesting, I hadn't heard of Stellite before. I guess there are a lot of alloys out there. What's a good place to learn about them? I'll check my machinery's handbook. I need to learn the numbering system for steel.


----------



## Bob Korves (Aug 22, 2017)

benmychree said:


> Stellite and HSS are completely different formulations; Stellite is a alloy of cobalt and chromium only, there are other formulations, but that is what Stellite is, as opposed to HSS which may contain small additions of either element, it is as it's name indicates, is mostly steel.  Stellite is pretty much only for cutting cast iron, where HSS will cut most anything within certain hardness limits.


The Stellite company made tool blanks in decades past.  I have some, different models.  I did some research on them and looked at what they were used for some years ago.  I cannot remember the details, but most of them had incredibly high cobalt and chrome content (I have some that are more than 50% cobalt), which would give them really excellent hot hardness, but would also make them stupidly expensive.  Mine are probably worth more as scrap as for anything else, and I really would not want to breathe the dust while grinding them...
The first good link I just found confirms that:  http://www.chemistrylearner.com/stellite.html
http://www.conradhoffman.com/stellite.htm


----------



## benmychree (Aug 22, 2017)

The Stellite tools that I have and have seen were blanks brazed onto high carbon steel shanks, like carbide, but the usable blank was much longer than a typical carbide tool, and could be sharpened back very much further.
It seems to me that it was invented and made by the Haynes Company, I think the same company as made the Haynes automobile.


----------



## benmychree (Aug 23, 2017)

Just came to  mind that Stellite can be applied to steel by oxy acetylene welding or TIG and used as a wear surface; I have a quantity of Stellite cast rod for the purpose.


----------



## Bob Korves (Aug 23, 2017)

benmychree said:


> The Stellite tools that I have and have seen were blanks brazed onto high carbon steel shanks, like carbide, but the usable blank was much longer than a typical carbide tool, and could be sharpened back very much further.
> It seems to me that it was invented and made by the Haynes Company, I think the same company as made the Haynes automobile.


We seem to be hijacking Jared's thread here, so I started a new thread here:
https://hobby-machinist.com/threads/stellite-and-other-special-unusual-tool-bits.61674/


----------



## Ken from ontario (Aug 23, 2017)

Bob Korves said:


> For aluminum or brass, which would be about 400 surface feet per minute (SFPM)


I'm a bit confused ,is the SFPM for Aluminum 250 or 400? thank s for helping a confused rookie.


----------



## Bob Korves (Aug 23, 2017)

Ken from ontario said:


> I'm a bit confused ,is the SFPM for Aluminum 250 or 400? thank s for helping a confused rookie.


I use 400 SFPM on aluminum if I am confident with what I am doing.  Otherwise I start slower and see how it goes...


----------



## Ken from ontario (Aug 23, 2017)

Thanks Bob, For milling aluminum I calculate  RPM using 250 x 4 divided by the diameter of the end mill, if I use 400 SFPM  with a .500" end mill, the RPM will be beyond what my little mini mill  can handle, that's why I asked thinking all this time I was way too slow . thanks for the clarification.


----------



## Bob Korves (Aug 23, 2017)

Ken from ontario said:


> Thanks Bob, For milling aluminum I calculate  RPM using 250 x 4 divided by the diameter of the end mill, if I use 400 SFPM  with a .500" end mill, the RPM will be beyond what my little mini mill  can handle, that's why I asked thinking all this time I was way too slow . thanks for the clarification.


I use that same basic formula, Ken.


----------



## jaredbeck (Aug 25, 2017)

First chips! And, my first time operating a lathe 




Check out my questionable lathe dog.  Apparently I don't know how to center a hole in round stock on my drill press. Well, it worked, and I'm taking 0.020" cuts. I'm getting a real lathe dog and some new HSS blanks in the mail tomorrow. Then I need to find a chuck .. with the oddball 1/2"-24 spindle, that might be tricky.


----------



## jaredbeck (Aug 25, 2017)

Oh, and I forgot to mention, the tool bit has an engraving on it, "Rex AA" which I'm guessing stands for Ann Arbor, where the lathe was made, right? Or am I letting my imagination get away with me?


----------



## Tozguy (Aug 25, 2017)

Congrats on your first turning, now you are off and running. BTW that dog is fine. The only criteria for dogs is that they work. Looks don't count so you can even use hose clamps and such.

And you have a sense of humour


----------



## Bob Korves (Aug 25, 2017)

jaredbeck said:


> First chips! And, my first time operating a lathe
> 
> View attachment 240472
> 
> ...


Probably a reach at your stage of machining, but this is an option:
http://www.deansphotographica.com/machining/projects/109/spindle/adapter.html
Here are some adapters (and ideas):
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_od..._trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=1/2-24+chuck&_sacat=0


----------



## Bob Korves (Aug 25, 2017)

jaredbeck said:


> Oh, and I forgot to mention, the tool bit has an engraving on it, "Rex AA" which I'm guessing stands for Ann Arbor, where the lathe was made, right? Or am I letting my imagination get away with me?
> 
> View attachment 240474


Rex AA is made of T-1 steel, a tungsten based high speed tool steel, similar in qualities to our common today M2 high speed steel, which uses molybdenum instead to create the carbides.  These days, molybdenum is cheaper for that use than tungsten.  Rex AA bits are very good high speed steel tools for general work.
http://www.diehlsteel.com/products/high-speed-steel/t-1


----------



## Bob Korves (Aug 25, 2017)

jaredbeck said:


> First chips! And, my first time operating a lathe
> 
> View attachment 240472
> 
> ...


Your lathe dog is just fine.  It looks like it will do the job well and that is all that matters.


----------



## dlane (Aug 25, 2017)

Looks as if you have a wood drive center in the spindle, you may want to get a dead center of the rite taper, also the dog looks backwards are you cutting with the spindle turning cw and tool upside down when looking from tailstock ?. Normally the spindle would  turn ccw with cutting pressure pushing down on tool.


----------



## jaredbeck (Aug 25, 2017)

Bob Korves said:


> Probably a reach at your stage of machining, but this is an option:
> http://www.deansphotographica.com/machining/projects/109/spindle/adapter.html
> Here are some adapters (and ideas):
> https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odkw=1/2-24+chuck+adapter&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=1/2-24+chuck&_sacat=0



Awesome, thanks Bob! I'm going to get one of those 1/2"-24 adapter backplates.



Bob Korves said:


> Rex AA is made of T-1 steel, a tungsten based high speed tool steel, similar in qualities to our common today M2 high speed steel, which uses molybdenum instead to create the carbides.  These days, molybdenum is cheaper for that use than tungsten.  Rex AA bits are very good high speed steel tools for general work.
> http://www.diehlsteel.com/products/high-speed-steel/t-1



Oh, haha I thought there was a guy named Rex and in my imagination he lived in Ann Arbor and worked at the factory that made the lathe 



dlane said:


> Looks as if you have a wood drive center in the spindle, you may want to get a dead center of the rite taper ..



Quite right, will do!



dlane said:


> .. also the dog looks backwards ..



I think it's just a badly posed picture. Either that or the motor's backwards


----------



## Bob Korves (Aug 25, 2017)

jaredbeck said:


> Oh, haha I thought there was a guy named Rex and in my imagination he lived in Ann Arbor and worked at the factory that made the lathe


Rex tools were made by Crucible Industries, and are still in business, big time:
http://www.crucible.com/products.aspx 
Rex AA has not been made for decades AFAIK.
Edit:  You might enjoy the "history" link at the Crucible site.  Even covers AA steel...


----------



## owl (Aug 25, 2017)

That lathe should teach you well the various intricacies of turning, just scaled up and somewhat automated on larger equipment.  Assuming good alignment, bearings, etc, you should be able to make parts within its capacity to just about any accuracy you would care to do, just takes practice.  I'm afraid that free is out of the question, see the threads on accessories, and desired metrology.  Also, lathe bits, etc. can add up.  Mystery metal is reasonably cheap, but you may want to buy material that turns more reliably too.  OTOH, it may well be a cheaper hobby than golf.


----------



## Silverbullet (Aug 25, 2017)

Ok hi and welcome , your on your way now. You may need to look at wood lathe chucks for that spindle size. Or get one close say a 1" -10 and make an adapter right on your lathe to the 1"-10 threads then you can loctite it in the chuck.


----------



## dlane (Aug 25, 2017)

Sorry but if you were cutting as the pic shows the rotation is cw, the face plate bolt would be on top of the dog bolt if turning ccw , "but the wood drive center may be engaged into stock enough to grip it"
Ccw is the normal direction for cutting, forces pushing down on tool and carriage.


----------



## dulltool17 (Aug 25, 2017)

Like Dlane wrote above, it looks like a wood lathe center in your headstock- I'd take a good look at that and maybe get a new center.

Also, be sure to grease the tailstock dead center.

Go make some stuff!


----------



## Tozguy (Aug 25, 2017)

dlane said:


> Sorry but if you were cutting as the pic shows the rotation is cw, the face plate bolt would be on top of the dog bolt if turning ccw , "but the wood drive center may be engaged into stock enough to grip it"
> Ccw is the normal direction for cutting, forces pushing down on tool and carriage.



It looks to me like the shaft got cut CCW based on the position of the tool. But the dog is free to move into the position shown in the picture when the lathe is stopped. To prevent the dog from swinging away from the stop normally one would tie them together somehow.
Here is an example using rubber bands.


----------



## RichardDeptris (Aug 29, 2017)

361549208446Congratulations!  I have two of those lathes in various states of restoration.  Each one is missing parts and between the two there's a nearly complete 109 lathe. Neither have the back gear assembly and one is missing the pulley and spindle assembly.

Surprisingly, they're both -703s which is a model up from yours.  After I complete the restoration, which is mainly derusting  and cleaning, I will sell it off piece by piece.

I thought about modding it into a decent lathe, but the spindle size is the deal killer.  It is too puny to be of any use.  It's literally the thickness of a pen.  The MT0 taper it uses, from what I've read, is slightly non-standard.  I contemplated performing a decapitation and laceration where I would replace the headstock and tailstock with one from a cheap HF lathe. I posted my thoughts on a 109 forum and I was told to not waste my time.

I figure the parts are worth enough money to purchase a more righteous lathe with true victimization power.

Here's my ill-advised idea to decapitate and lacerate and create a Frankenlathe.




Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## cwgreen1938 (Aug 29, 2017)

jaredbeck said:


> Hi y'all, I got my first lathe. It's pretty exciting for me but it's very basic, probably not too interesting for other people. It doesn't even have a chuck, just a faceplate and dead centers!
> 
> Like I said in my intro. post last week, I'm looking to get a real machine, like a Grizzly G4003 or a PM-1236. But, in the meantime, I found this lathe for free (no motor) on the Syracuse craigslist and I thought I could learn something about how to operate a lathe while I wait to get a real machine.
> 
> ...



You may have found a barn find. I have a 
109.20630, it is called a 5" and is a 1945 model. Yours is probably older than mine. I have not got mine running yet because it has lots of surface rust. I am going to take it all apart and clean and maybe paint it. If yours is not worn a lot you are in great shape. Just to let you know, there are still a few lathe parts available according to their website. I also have a Sears/Atlas 
101.07403, a 12X36" that is a 1951 model. It is not running yet, it needs the same TLC as the other one. They are both complete and if you and I can get these things in operating order I think we will be far ahead from buying a Harbor Freight mini lathe. Like you, I'm excited to get going and make something. Good luck and hope you get going soon. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## dlane (Aug 29, 2017)

Richard : The procedure for using tapatalk on this site is apparently different than others
If you search using tapatalk, it should explain how to post pics on this site that actually show up as a picture and not red x's
Don't know where to search but it's somewhere on this site


----------



## chipmaker51 (Aug 29, 2017)

Congratulations on your lathe.  I started out with one very similar only it had a four jaw along with a face plate and centers.  In spite of enough slack to steer a truck through, along with bell mouthed jaws, I learned to "dial in" the work with that chuck.  It serves its purpose and I learned something too.  When this really takes hold you'll never again pick up an interesting part without asking yourself "How did they do that?  And if I had to, how would I?" 

Sent from my SM-T210R using Tapatalk


----------



## TRX (Aug 29, 2017)

Even after you get a bigger, more capable lathe, you'll find you'll use the little lathe maybe 20% of the time anyway, for when you're doing second ops on parts from the big lathe, or you just want a quick job without having to clean up the new one after you're done, etc.


----------



## Scott.S (Sep 1, 2017)

Heck, I started out with a commutator lathe and then upgraded to a Sears 109.  The 109s are fun little machines and very easy to restore as they are so basic.
     After two 109s and an Atlas 618 I settled on a 1936 Atlas 10" ( with babbet bearings ) and a treadmill motor for the spindle and the feed screw.  
    Just more proof one can make almost anything work given enough time and energy.


----------



## jaredbeck (Sep 1, 2017)

Thanks to Bob K, I found a 1/2-24 backplate ...




.. and a chuck. They came in the mail this week, and they bolt right together, I don't have to drill anything! 




The only modification I have to do is to turn down the "locator" step on the front of the backplate. The problem is, it's cast iron, I only have HSS tools, and my lathe's slowest speed right now is 1070 rpm. Turning a 2.5" diameter at that speed is around 400 SFPM and my Machinery's Handbook says 60 SFPM for cast iron. Of course, I tried anyway  but it just melts my HSS. So, I ordered some brazed carbide tools from Grizzly.

I'd like to learn more about how to set up a "jack shaft" to slow down my spindle further, but I haven't gotten around to researching that yet. I want to get a chuck mounted first.


----------



## Dave 41 (Sep 1, 2017)

Bob Korves said:


> It should be just threaded on.  I would soak it from the front and back of the faceplate with penetrating oil and see if you can free it up.  Let the penetrant sit overnight, then turn it first in the tighten direction, followed by the loosen direction, counter clockwise.  Do not force it or you might bend the spindle.  If it does not come free with moderate force, do the penetrant thing again, try to work it loose, lather, rinse, repeat until it comes off, and it will eventually come off.  It had decades to get stuck on there, you have days or weeks or whatever to get it loose if necessary.  Patience, grasshopper...


I have one, it does thread on.  I know because it was given to me in pieces, because the spindle is bent.  Be careful with it.


----------

