# Disappointed



## jbolt (May 10, 2020)

Last year we purchased a 7x14 enclosed trailer to move our household belongings to the new home in Oregon. On our last trip up we lost the trailer brakes. I had set the controller when we left and all was good. Most of the drive heading north out of California is up hill so the trailer brakes really don’t matter (other than needing to stop suddenly) until we get over the pass into Ashland. This is where I discovered we had no trailer brakes, where they are needed. The trailer was loaded with my PM-1440GT and all my metal stock. The trailer has a 7000 lb gross weight. We were 6800 lbs. this trip. I also had 1100 lbs in the bed of the truck.

Fortunately we had no mishaps on the way down. I just dropped it into 2nd and followed a slow semi down the hill letting the engine/tranny do most of the braking. I also credit having just installed airbags at the rear of the truck. I run an equalizer hitch and the addition of the airbags really helps the control under braking.

Upon investigating the cause I found the installer who wired the brakes at the factory routed the rear brake wires under the frame directly over the axle. Now in California our wonderful state government has routinely conned the masses into passing tax bills for road improvements, promising that they would only be used for roads and then immediately rob them for pet projects so our roads are pretty awful. Somewhere along the drive we bottomed out the axle which severed a wire to one of the brake magnets causing a fault in the controller. The controller is mounted low on the dash and not readily visible while driving.

As I started digging into repairing the broken wire I soon realized the whole system needed to rewired. The main brake wire connected to the 7-pin harness (which is 10 ga.) was only 14 ga. It should be a minimum of 12 ga., preferably 10 ga. Branch connections were done with cheap Scotchloks which are inappropriate for the application. Wires at the tongue were routed through steel tubes that had no grommets or sharp ends debured. The main brake wire was also routed through a hole in a frame cross member that was made with a torch with no protection around the wire. Connections to the wire harness were poorly done with the cheapest butt connectors available. wire were stripped back too far leaving bare wire exposed to others. When I was replacing the brake wiring several factory butt connections came apart at the harness with light pulling. The whole mess was just wrapped together with black tape.

Overall I am pleased with the trailer but very disappointed with the cost cutting in areas related to safety. Not what I expect form a product made in the USA.


----------



## savarin (May 10, 2020)

I detest the complete lack of professionalism in a lot of tradies these days, as soon as you find one who is proud of their work and it shows in the final product I shout it wide and loud to everyone I know and make sure they get repeat custom.
I do the same for the shonkies so they loose as much business as possible.
If I am paying for the work I want a perfect job.


----------



## Superburban (May 10, 2020)

I have seen trailers just like your description, all across the country. Nor just one local, or manufacturer. I bought a used flatbed/car trailer, that the PO bought in NC, and used once to move out here. Only had brakes on one axle, and they were not even hooked up, The wire for the brakes was grounded, So it would light up the light on the brake controller. Back in Pa, I redid the brakes on a trailer for a friend, it was 2 years old, and had been state inspected twice. Had brakes on both axles, but only one was hooked up, and they were never adjusted, so the shoes never touched the drums. Had the same wire in tube design, and scotchlock connectors, and the battery was long dead.


----------



## Ulma Doctor (May 10, 2020)

price points are the culprit.
i work on many types of machines from Europe and Asia, things have changed there too.
we have placed more value on price, than quality.
when we manufactured things in the USA, it meant something
now it seems to be a bad punchline to a joke that really is not funny.

maybe there is hope for future innovation combined with a better than it needs to be engineering behind it


----------



## Dhal22 (May 10, 2020)

Ulma Doctor said:


> price points are the culprit.
> i work on many types of machines from Europe and Asia, things have changed there too.
> we have placed more value on price, than quality.
> when we manufactured things in the USA, it meant something
> ...




Thank you.   As a plumbing contractor, I see sooooo many times where the price point is the difference in quality.   Fortunately we  often get to come behind work where the price was the only deciding factor and redo it.


----------



## westerner (May 10, 2020)

I believe there is a rant of mine somewhere on this site concerning ScotchLocks. They are the single greatest evidence of the "flat-rate" mentality of modern manufacturing. A $10/hr trained monkey can assemble the trailer wiring, and will only spend .5 hours doing it. It will function for long enough to get the machine out of the local jurisdiction, and precious little farther. 

On the upside, a diligent student down the line will learn a GREAT lesson about intermittents, power, ground and resistance.


----------



## Manual Mac (May 10, 2020)

Sounds like the Marx Brothers Trailer Sales.
You were fortunate. The Oregon side of Siskiyou Summit can be a real problem for loads with bad brakes. 
There is a truck escape ramp about halfway down.


----------



## Old Mud (May 11, 2020)

Ulma Doctor said:


> price points are the culprit.
> i work on many types of machines from Europe and Asia, things have changed there too.
> we have placed more value on price, than quality.
> when we manufactured things in the USA, it meant something
> ...




 You know that saying "Everything comes around 360 sooner or later"   We can only hope that holds true in this situation.


----------



## ub27Rocks (May 11, 2020)

So actually your post has nothing to do with government spending on roads, just pathetic design and manufacturing?

"Not what I expect form a product made in the USA. " in my experience this is exactly what I expect from a lot of US made product, pricey with poor engineering and quality.

Have you gone back to the trailer manufacturer with your observations? Or perhaps report to DMV for dangerous practices? Hold them accountable, otherwise nothing will change.


----------



## jbolt (May 11, 2020)

ub27Rocks said:


> So actually your post has nothing to do with government spending on roads, just pathetic design and manufacturing?
> 
> "Not what I expect form a product made in the USA. " in my experience this is exactly what I expect from a lot of US made product, pricey with poor engineering and quality.
> 
> Have you gone back to the trailer manufacturer with your observations? Or perhaps report to DMV for dangerous practices? Hold them accountable, otherwise nothing will change.


Never pass an opportunity to call out government abuse and incompetence.

I have reached out to the manufacturer via email and phone, will see if I get a response. 

As far as the DMV is concerned they are currently closed...and getting paid for not working. Oh and speaking of the DMV, they forced me to do a safety recall for valve springs on a car with 220,000 miles and I am still waiting for my tags....from October of last year.....


----------



## jbolt (May 11, 2020)

Ulma Doctor said:


> price points are the culprit.



I totally agree with this statement and accept that there would be some compromise in quality vs price. It's that fact that they cut corners on safety related items. With our litigious society you would hope this would be more of a priority. I want to say "as a conscientious human it would be a priority" but that ship sailed long ago.


----------



## kb58 (May 11, 2020)

Regardless, it's always a new owner's responsibility to look over any new purchase really close to find any lurking problems.


----------



## ub27Rocks (May 11, 2020)

kb58 said:


> Regardless, it's always a new owner's responsibility to look over any new purchase really close to find any lurking problems.


Seriously? You do this with cars, trucks, machines, toaster, tv's, cell phones? How would the average person even know what to look for? At a minimum I expect the products I buy to be safe wihtout needing a degree in automotive engineering and electrical design to see if it meets minimum standards.

There is zero excuse for the short cuts listed in the original post, the manufacturer is responsible and accountable. Making excuses for them such as 'the new owner should check things' is exactly why quality sucks. Expecting to file lawsuits and have that somehow solve anything is not going to do anything except part you with more money. Were this trailer made in China ppl here would be all over this with Chinesium comments. Crap is crap.


----------



## Superburban (May 11, 2020)

ub27Rocks said:


> Seriously? You do this with cars, trucks, machines, toaster, tv's, cell phones? How would the average person even know what to look for? At a minimum I expect the products I buy to be safe wihtout needing a degree in automotive engineering and electrical design to see if it meets minimum standards.
> 
> There is zero excuse for the short cuts listed in the original post, the manufacturer is responsible and accountable. Making excuses for them such as 'the new owner should check things' is exactly why quality sucks. Expecting to file lawsuits and have that somehow solve anything is not going to do anything except part you with more money. Were this trailer made in China ppl here would be all over this with Chinesium comments. Crap is crap.


Agreed. Here is the US, an implied warranty is that the item is fit for the use it was sold for. Since most of these trailers are sold to individuals, that may only use them a handfull of times, So the issues do not come up in a reasonable time. If they do, the selling dealer would likely replace the wiring, and write off the expense. If an accident does arise, it would likely be a long drawn out legal battle between the manufacturer, the selling dealer, and the consumer, With lots of accusations flung back and forth. 

Before I started looking at trailers, I knew a parts place in Pa, that sold trailers that were made by a company connected with them. Every few years the name would change, but one could easily tell they were the same trailer. Was not until I started looking at trailers to help with the move to Co, that  I saw how badly they were built. 

The other big thing I see a lot, is trailers without the required lights, but DOT does not seem to get involved with them, so no one cares.


----------



## Bi11Hudson (May 11, 2020)

When I was splicing, I went "overboard" with my trailer rigging to hopefully reduce any problems over liability. The truck and trailer were "company" assets and insurance companys were(are) known for sticking it to corporations. From the hitch out, I had the strongest (*12K*) draft gear that would mount on a 3/4 ton pick-up. 1-5/16 ball, brakes on both axles, the whole "9 yards" for an *8K* gross trailer. It didn't weigh near that much in actual usage, maybe 6K. The battery was well kept up because I used it as a starting battery for the generator as well. Every day usage ~~~ I never had to draw on the preps, but they were in place if needed.

The truck and trailer were both acquired used, I was just getting started and capital costs for fiber optics work is extremely high. I went through the entire system from the hitch plug on the truck back and removed any "ScotchLocks" and crimped connectors that I found.

I fell back to my industrial electrical background here. *All* connections were made with wrapped connections and soldered. Those I *can* trust, and on the highway with wet and dirty splashes, the only sort that will stand up long term. The hitch wiring had setscrews on stranded wire. I will concede that 30 plus years in the electrical field before I started splicing was a strong background. And acquiring the equipment used left no concept of who actually did the work. But going over the rig and correcting hass alf work saved me a lot of pain as time went on.

The truck had a "factory" installed harness. Chevrolet, probably by a dealer. The trailer was Wells Cargo, again *probably* dealer work. In both cases, well known manufacturers. The shoddy work is typical of such aftermarket work. Soldered and properly insulated terminations, to me, the only way such work will take the abuse of a moving rig.

.


----------



## westerner (May 11, 2020)

Bi11Hudson said:


> The shoddy work is typical of such aftermarket work. Soldered and properly insulated terminations, to me, the only way such work will take the abuse of a moving rig.


I could not agree more. You Gentlemen in the Rust Belt must have either VERY diligent mechanics, or VERY loose interpretation of the law as your local Trooper inforces it.


----------



## savarin (Jun 1, 2020)

Shoddy is shoddy and crops up with alarming regularity these days.
Not is the same dangerous category but really bloody annoying to me.
Most deli counter staff cannot wrap up their products correctly.
How many times have they stuck the wet product into the plastic bag then wrapped that up nice and neatly in the paper.
BUT they never twist or otherwise seal the plastic bag, just flip the top of the bag somewhat over so any liquid can leak out soaking the paper wrapper and puddling in the bottom of your carry bag that then has to be washed out.
Its done so often that it must be norm.
I'm in the middle of a local complaint so I will see what eventuates.
Probably nothing more than an simple apology.


----------



## 7milesup (Jun 2, 2020)

Interesting subject.
I find that the quality of wiring used in all consumer grade trailers is just good enough to get out the door and past the one year warranty.

I fly large RC stuff and the discussion of soldered vs crimped comes up occasionally.  In an environment where vibration is a concern, soldered joints are NOT the way to go.  The reason being is that the solder wicks up the wires and creates a "hard point" where the solder ends.  The wire will break where this solder ends, especially since any strain relief usually ends long before that point.  In the aviation industry, soldered joints are relatively rare.  In the equipment bay of the aircraft I flew, there were thousands (or so it seems, maybe just 800 or so) of wires in huge bundles and they were all terminated with a crimp.  Not saying there are no soldered joints at all, but the vast majority were crimped.  BUT, crimping was done with calibrated tools and of course utilized high quality splicing connectors or terminations.  In fact, if you want to dig deep, NASA has a white paper on proper terminations for spacecraft.
I have always thought about re-wiring my trailers with a high quality silicone multi-strand wire like I use in my RC aircraft, but it would be expensive.


----------



## kb58 (Jun 2, 2020)

ub27Rocks said:


> Seriously? You do this with cars, trucks, machines, toaster, tv's, cell phones? How would the average person even know what to look for? At a minimum I expect the products I buy to be safe wihtout needing a degree in automotive engineering and electrical design to see if it meets minimum standards. There is zero excuse for the short cuts listed in the original post, the manufacturer is responsible and accountable...



I don't see where the OP explicitly state that the trailer was purchased new. If it's used, and you feel there's no need for looking it over, okay.


----------



## Janderso (Jun 2, 2020)

westerner said:


> believe there is a rant of mine somewhere on this site concerning ScotchLocks.


Ha Ha, I was going to mention these dastardly devices. They are just terrible.
The boat trailer we had, which was made in Los Angeles had scotch locks inside the enclosed frame- A BOAT TRAILER! Hello.


----------



## ub27Rocks (Jun 2, 2020)

kb58 said:


> I don't see where the OP explicitly state that the trailer was purchased new. If it's used, and you feel there's no need for looking it over, okay.


He did mention in a later post (before mine) that he contacted the manufacturer, implying it was bought new. If used, then yes I agree you need to look it over very carefully.


----------



## jbolt (Jun 2, 2020)

Yes, trailer was purchased new. I just now heard back from the maufaturer. They offered to repair the wiring under warranty or send me replacement wire and connectors. They asked for photos which I provided and then said they would forward the complaint and photos to manufacturing. I declined their offer stating I had already performed repiars substituting proper components and I would be more than happy to send them my receipts for reimbursment. I also told them that after the repairs I had to dial down the braking power on my controller by 30% which suggests there was power loss through the factory installed wiring. We are currently in Oregon dropping off another full load of equipment and shop items. This time no issues with the brakes and they work considerably better than before.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


----------



## RandyWilson (Jun 2, 2020)

Coming in late, but what you describe, undersized poorly routed wiring with scotch lock and cheap butt splices that looked like they were crimped by having granny gum them  has been standard industry practice for both trailer and truck body wiring since the 1970s. Every trailer I got, from 4x8 utilities to 43 foot goose neck race trailers required a complete rewrite before I would pull them.


----------



## Superburban (Jun 3, 2020)

Have to admit, when I first saw the scotch lock connectors in the 70's, I thought they were great. After a few years in Pennsylvania's salt crusted roads, I changed my mind.


----------



## middle.road (Jun 7, 2020)

On my 1999 30' camper the wires were routed through the axle tube.
Third trip out coming off the interstate on a downhill ramp I had nothing... It got real hairy real fast.
Wasn't even (3) years old. Break was somewhere in the tube.
In a parking lot with it raining (of course), I took a cheesy 16ga extension cord and spliced it in with butt connectors.
I never have gotten over the things I had to fix on that RV - that should have been done properly at the time of manufacture.
Then there was the axle bearing fire in the middle of Atlanta on I75, cause they did not put enough grease in them...


----------



## savarin (Jun 7, 2020)

When we first arrived in Oz I purchased a General Motors three speed column shift straight six station wagon.
Awesome torque.
Every Aussie we met told us they wouldnt drive one as the front seats ripped out in even light shunts.
I found out after it was re sold that GM knew of the fault but decided to settle any cases out of court as that was cheaper than a recall.
Never purchased a GM motor since.


----------

