# New PM-1236T Lathe



## shooter123456 (May 14, 2020)

With all of these stay at home orders and some modified working schedules (and a few other financial things going my way), I found myself in a position to be able to upgrade my lathe.  I have had a PM-1030v for nearly 4 years now and for the past 6 months or so, I have been considering stepping up to something a bit bigger and a bit more powerful.  After going back and forth several times, I was determined to get the PM-1236 (Not T).  After finding out that the "Standard" package isn't in stock and won't be in stock for a while, and the "Standard" stand isn't either, the difference between that and the 1236T was so small it was worth the extra cash to go Taiwanese.  

I placed the order and a little over a week later, there was a big ol crate in my driveway holding a new lathe, a stand, and a QCTP.  I got it mounted up on the stand with an engine hoist (Man that was scary!) and got it wired in.  First impressions were pretty good, but not fantastic.  Overall I am very happy with the machine, but I think there are definitely a few things that could be improved on.  

First, the things I really like!  In no particular order.
1. The handles are fantastic.  They are smooth, easy to read, have inch and metric measurements, and are a significantly better design than the ones on my 1030v.
2. The power switch being on the carriage is excellent.  No more reaching over the chuck to hit the power button.
3. A quick change gear box is awesome!  Having like 30 feed rates to choose from vs 3 is incredible.  If I need to feed just a little faster to break a chip, I can do that.  On the 1030v, I can either double the feed rate (If I am not already maxed out) or break out the change gears.  
4. That D1-4 cam lock spindle is so much easier and so much faster than what I am used to.  No wrenches and no rotating back plates to deal with.
5. The single speed motor with gears to change speeds.  This is a much better design than a variable speed motor.  It is insane how much torque it has at the low end and how much power it has on the high end.  

Some things I didn't love, but aren't a huge deal.
1. The work light doesn't seem like it is really part of the machine as much as it is just thrown in with the shipment.  It didn't come with mounting hardware (Came with a bracket, no screws, washers, or nuts), there isn't a hole into the power box for it, and the mounting holes aren't pre drilled.  There also weren't any mounting instructions included.  Mounting it required drilling a few holes, grabbing some suitable screws, and screwing it in place.  I still need to get some hardware and drill a hole to pass the power cord into the power box.  It isn't the end of the world by any means, but it would be nice if it was at least slightly more integrated into the machine package. 
2. The included 3 jaw chuck is really bad.  It is advertised as an "Economy" chuck so my expectations were quite low, but it was substantially worse than the 6" 3 jaw chinese chuck I got for my old lathe for around $120 shipped.  That cheap chinese one replaced the included one almost immediately.  Some of the hardware was loose, some was tight, it was gritty and rough, and it was so out of balance that the machine would shake starting at only 335 RPM.  I took it apart hoping a little cleaning and stoning would help, but the build quality was just so bad it wasn't worth the time.  
3. It looks like the stand paint wasn't dry before they put it into the box.  So the doors and the back of the stand look just terrible.  The rest of the paint looks fantastic, but it will be hard to ignore the messed up paint when you step back to admire it.  It isn't functional, so again, not a big deal.
4. The fit of the handles for changing gears isn't particularly good.  There are a few combinations that cause one of them to wobble a ton when the machine runs.  Moving them is a bit challenging because the handles bind immediately when you apply force to move it side to side.  You need to sort of drop them all the way down, hold them with both hands to try to position it correctly, then pull the spring back while trying not to move it left or right at all (As soon as you do, it will bind and you can't get it aligned to change the gears), then lift it up to the hole and work the spindle with your other hand to get the gears to align.  Maybe it just needs to be broken in a bit, but at the moment, they are pretty miserable to change (But not anywhere near as bad as dealing with change gears on the 1030v).
5. I don't love the fit of the quick change tool post.  When you unscrew it to rotate it (No wrench for that included btw, you'll need a 25mm wrench to tighten it), it moves freely back and forth in the compound slot.  Then when you tighten it down, it does not sit still in the slightest.  Trying to tighten it while aligning a threading tool was really frustrating.  As soon as you apply torque, it just wants to rotate and slide around.  Then when it is tightened down, I have had it move several times while trying a few heavier cuts (nothing outrageous, I have done more on the 1030v).  I think it needs something like what the standard tool post was using in order to hold it in place (See picture below).
6. The little nubs on the ends of most of the handles are cheap plastic.  I am thinking a few aluminum ones will be in order because I really don't like how they feel.  They work, but they make manipulating the controls feel a little bit like a toy...

All in all, it seems like the important stuff, they got right.  Some of the smaller details were overlooked, either deliberately to keep the price low, or just carelessly.  The spindle is not as smooth as I would like, but I am not positive if that is because it has gears instead of just the belt drive.  I would say it is a solid step up in quality compared to my chinese machine, but there is definitely room for improvement.  At some point, I will need to break down the quick change gear box because something has to be wrong for it to be so difficult to operate.  It should not bind moving back and forth with one hand.

Wow that is quite the wall of text!  If you are still with me, here are some of my plans for this machine in the near future:
1. DRO.  This has already been ordered from PM and will hopefully be here soon.
2. Tool rack.  I would like to make something to hold the tools on the splash guard toward the tailstock side.  It will hold the cutting tools, the centers, the drill chuck, chuck keys, and a few other miscellaneous items you need when operating a lathe.  
3. Flood coolant.  The stand already has the grate, so really why wouldn't you add a little tank and pump to keep those cutting tools chilly?
4. New hardware for mounting and securing the QCTP, similar to what the stock tool post uses.  

Some pictures!

The new machine in all its glory!






A look at the chuck (This one was mine, not the one that came with the machine), I like to pretend I am a photographer.





'Nother





Here is a look at just about everything that came with the machine.  Not a ton compared to the 1030v.  QCTP, 4 Jaw Chuck were not included.





Comparison of the steady and follow rests compared to the 1030v ones.  Much better quality, much heavier, much bigger.  No comparison here really. 





Quick comparison of the standard tool post to the 1030v.  It is really hard to get an idea of the size differences when looking online.  The 1236T is a good bit beefier.





Here is the 8 inch 4 jaw.  Note that this is not standard, it was roughly $400 extra.  It is so nice though!  It is super tight, so hopefully once I use it a bit, it will be a perfect fit.





Here is the 5" that comes with the 1030v compared to the 8".  Look at that shine!





I wonder if I could sell these pictures back to Precision Matthews (Or trade for tools 'n such) for their marketing.  Its so perdy.





The quick change tool post.





The handles for changing gears.





Now some of the not so good stuff.  First, the work light.  Just didn't feel right man.  And the electrical box doesn't close!










Some of the bad paint.  I am not sure how much the door will bug me.  I am sure I won't notice, but it takes away from the general presentation of the machine a little bit.  















Also, first part!


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## Dhal22 (May 15, 2020)

Selling your 1030?


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## Kiwi Canuck (May 15, 2020)

I love the look of the 1236T looks like the little brother of my 1340GT.

On the QCTP the T-Nut may need to be skimmed down if it's not tightening properly, if I read that right, I had to do that on my Aloris as it was a tad too thick and it would move when I was machining heavy cuts. How about just make a new one if the one supplied is too sloppy or have Matt send you a blank and you can mill up one that has a nice firm fit.

The QCGB can be a little tricky to start, I use the jog button to advance the lathe to get them to drop in, sometimes I still need 2 hands to get them aligned properly but mine has got better with practice and a bit of use.

Too bad about the finish being damaged, I would get a can of paint and respray the cabinets, not sure if that's easy for you or not, but it would make them look way better.

That grey paint looks like it shouldn't be too hard to match, I'm getting my paint shop to make a up a few spray cans of PM white to match my machines as my mill and lathe both have few chips that need some attention. 

Look forward to hearing how things work out with your new machine.

BTW that screw looks awesome, nice work.

David.


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## mikey (May 15, 2020)

Congrats on the new lathe! I agree, she shore is purdy!

I wonder if a call to Matt about the gearbox levers being balky would be in order? That would bother me ...


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## shooter123456 (May 15, 2020)

Dhal22 said:


> Selling your 1030?


I have not decided.  Initially I was planning to, but now I am thinking I may keep it around.  If I can find a use for it and fix some things, I will keep it.  If it just sits indefinitely, I will likely clean it up and sell it.


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## shooter123456 (May 15, 2020)

Kiwi Canuck said:


> On the QCTP the T-Nut may need to be skimmed down if it's not tightening properly, if I read that right, I had to do that on my Aloris as it was a tad too thick and it would move when I was machining heavy cuts. How about just make a new one if the one supplied is too sloppy or have Matt send you a blank and you can mill up one that has a nice firm fit.


I haven't had the chance to look into it much yet, but I am thinking it is the T nut being too loose of a fit.  It can rotate pretty freely in the slot, so when tightened down, I imagine that if it rotates, the tool post rotates with it.  I am thinking I will likely make a new one that is similar to the one that came with the standard tool post.  It fit nice and tight and had set screws to hold it in place.



Kiwi Canuck said:


> The QCGB can be a little tricky to start, I use the jog button to advance the lathe to get them to drop in, sometimes I still need 2 hands to get them aligned properly but mine has got better with practice and a bit of use.


I was a bit worried about jogging it while changing the gears, but that might make it much easier.  Hopefully they get easier once broken in a little bit, but otherwise, I may need to take it apart, find out what the problem is, and maybe make new parts to replace whatever is off.



Kiwi Canuck said:


> Too bad about the finish being damaged, I would get a can of paint and respray the cabinets, not sure if that's easy for you or not, but it would make them look way better.


Where it is at the moment, that will be a challenge.  I am thinking I will just leave it as is, and when I move in the next 2 years or so, I will repaint before putting it back on the stand.



Kiwi Canuck said:


> BTW that screw looks awesome, nice work.


Thank you!  I love being able to switch from feeding to threading by just throwing a lever!


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## shooter123456 (May 15, 2020)

mikey said:


> Congrats on the new lathe! I agree, she shore is purdy!
> 
> I wonder if a call to Matt about the gearbox levers being balky would be in order? That would bother me ...


Thank you!  Sometimes before work, I still go out and just look at it for a second...

If the gearbox levers don't improve with a little work, I will pull it apart and find the issue.  Then I may need to talk to Matt, depending on what is wrong.


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## wrmiller (May 15, 2020)

The Norton on my 1340GT was a little sticky when initially moving the levers back and forth. 

They must have gotten better though, as I moved the levers several times yesterday and didn't notice anything.


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## shooter123456 (May 15, 2020)

wrmiller said:


> The Norton on my 1340GT was a little sticky when initially moving the levers back and forth.
> 
> They must have gotten better though, as I moved the levers several times yesterday and didn't notice anything.


I am really hoping it just needs some breaking in.


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## Meta Key (May 15, 2020)

Congratulations on the new lathe!

I've had mine about a year now and I've gotten used to it and can now turn out good work on the thing.

The gearbox does smooth out with use and I don't even notice it now.  Seems like a break-in issue.

I saw similar damage to the cabinet doors -- I thought it was shipping damage as the boxes were trashed on arrival.  

Messed up paint on 1236T cabinet door.

I asked Matt about a paint code for the cabinet base and he said he had no idea what the color was and that they didn't stock touch up paint.  Kinda surprising.  He did indicate he would be happy to send me two new cabinet doors but I declined.  Not that big a deal.  Maybe in a decade or two I'll get around to running a color match and having the local paint guys make me up a spray can of the stuff.  

Did you find this tool in the little red toolbox?  




Yeah, it's the cross slide lock tool.  My 1236T had a hex head set screw in place and the tool in the toolbox.  I use the cross slide lock all the time so this little tool was a nice discovery.

Also, I mounted the light fixture to a steel shelf that I mounted to the wall behind the lathe.  Seemed like a better option than mounting it to the machine itself.  Nice and solid and no vibration of the light fixture.




Also, you can run the wire to the light fixture through an existing grommeted hole in the bottom of the electrical box.  Then you can close the door on the electrical box.  ;-)

-MK


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## advmaker (May 18, 2020)

Thorough review of the 1236T. Surprised to hear about the economy chuck quality.

I got a 1127VFLB last year and so far enjoying it. I made a barbell bar for a friend recently and used steady/follow rests first time with a few mistakes. Last year I tried to cut some thread and learnt to change gears. No desire to do it again. It was a hassle to put just right gear slack to make the machine quiet. Been wondering about 1236T/1340GT but no way I can keep both. Any idea what would a 1yr old 1127 fetch? Buyer has to come to my place as no way I can ship it.

Also I realize that with variable speed in 1127, the torque at low speeds is not much, can't take heavy cuts. So now I understand why geared speed is better.


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## Dhal22 (May 18, 2020)

Can you move closer?


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## shooter123456 (May 22, 2020)

Meta Key said:


> Yeah, it's the cross slide lock tool. My 1236T had a hex head set screw in place and the tool in the toolbox. I use the cross slide lock all the time so this little tool was a nice discovery.


I was wondering what that was for!  I don't think I ever would have figured that out.  Unfortunately, that will be blocked by the DRO scale so I won't be able to put it to use.


Meta Key said:


> Also, you can run the wire to the light fixture through an existing grommeted hole in the bottom of the electrical box. Then you can close the door on the electrical box. ;-)


Ill take obvious things that were right in front of my face for $500 Alex.


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## shooter123456 (May 22, 2020)

I got the DRO delivered on Monday and I am just about finished installing it.  It came with a bunch of mounting hardware, but I couldn't figure out how most of it was supposed to be used.  I modeled up part of the machine and the scales and made some new mounts that I think will work better.  

The guards they included are pretty nice though.  The look like they will be very easy to install and very effective.  My only gripes about the DRO kit are that there aren't really any install instructions, so you are more or less buying a kit that you still need to figure out how to make work.  A few pictures and recommended install practices would have been nice.

Once I had the model and decided how I wanted everything arranged, the install was fairly straight forward.  I am not sure what kind of alignment tolerances are needed, but the Z scale was straight within about .005" and the X is around .001.  Its tough to tell if there is any twist or anything, but I think they are close enough.

I pulled the cross slide off and stuck it in the mill to drill and tap the holes for mounting the scale.  It came off very easily, just one screw and slide it off!  In the mill, I used 1-2-3 blocks to hold it up and lightly clamped it with the vise.  I used a piece of scrap aluminum to try to protect the ways.  This was very straightforward and everything went fine!






It looks like it has a steel insert where the screw goes to attach it to the lead nut.  That seemed like a nice touch to me.  Also, I am no expert on scraping, but these ways seemed to have the scraping done a little bit deep.





Getting the carriage drilled and tapped was a bit more difficult just because there was no room and I couldn't reach it.  I had to make a quick drill extension and drill guide, then convert it into a tap extension.  Once those were done, it went surprisingly well and the holes lined up just as they should.  











I have had a cheap DRO on my mini mill before and the difference that it made makes me really excited to give this one a try.  

The Z axis gave me slightly more trouble, but again, not much.  There are 2 raised portions along the side of the bed that look like they are there for mounting a DRO, but the DRO scales were not long enough to reach them.  If I went to the left of the rear raised area, it would run into the splash guard mounting.  If I went to the right of it, it would be mounting into the gap bed portion.  The solution was just 2 little brackets that allow the scales to screw into a nut that slides in a slot on the bracket while the bracket screws into the bed directly.  The 2 aluminum pieces that attach to the cairrage allow for vertical and horizontal adjustment.  The brackets at the ends of the scale allow for adjustment as well.  These combined made it rather easy to align once I had the holes drilled and tapped.  
















All that is left is to mount up the display, mount the guards, and secure the wires.  Speaking of which, these cables with their metal cases are awesome!  I need to figure out where to get them because they would be great for a number of other things.

I also got their BXA insert kit and I am very happy with the quality.  The tools have a great finish (Smooth finish rather than the chalky finish you often see) and when you tighten the inserts into place, you can feel it forcing them into the pocket the way they are supposed to.  

I had a look at the inserts under the microscope and they were looking good!  The radius on the aluminum cutting insert looks like it will make an excellent finish.


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## shooter123456 (May 28, 2020)

The next add on a tool rack to keep all of the QCTP tool holders organized and nearby.  I have always wanted to make a rack of some kind so they could stay on the machine, but in the past, I have just kept them on a table nearby.  I drew something up in fusion and machined the parts over the weekend.  

I wasn't sure how I wanted to space the tools out and I also didn't want to get stuck having tool holders that wouldn't fit because they had tools that were too large, so I made the spacing adjustable.  The rack uses small dovetail portions that slide along a slot and are tightened using a screw from the other side.  A nice bonus for this is that they are reversible so that boring tools and turning tools can face the same direction.  The rack is tilted at 60 degrees so I can see the tools rather than just the backs of the holders.  Now that i have put it on the machine though, 60 degrees seems a little bit steep.  Next time, 55 or 45 would probably be better.  I am already thinking a modification will be needed to add multiple decks for tools.  I am only at 9 tool holders so far and I can only hang so many along the length of the back splash.  I also added a hook to hold chuck keys hanging down below.  

I am working on a similar rack that will hold tail stock tools like the live center, dead center, drill chuck and drill bits.  I am thinking a few wrenches will also go on that one since it seems I am always looking for the one size that isn't handy.

I also can't decide where I want to put the display for the DRO.  I didn't love placing it on the head stock because that would require reaching over the chuck to use it.  I don't love where I put it on the back splash because it takes up space where tools will be going soon.  If I put it too close to the chuck, it will be sprayed with oil and chips.  Tough to decide...


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## shooter123456 (Jul 1, 2020)

I got the DRO and tool racks permanently mounted.  I am sure they will move around as time goes on, but for now, this is where they will go.  The DRO does get splashed a bit, but it doesn't seem like it will be a problem.






I made a new post for the tool post that fits into the base for the old tool post.  This made a pretty big difference in ease of tightening down the tool post.  It doesn't jump the way it used to with the old tool post post.  Here is a picture of the new one compared to the old one.






I also modified the DRO mount a bit and made a small hex head screw to be able to lock the cross slide gib while the DRO is mounted.  With the standard configuration, this is blocked, so I made a small slot in the mount and the cover and modified a standard M8 screw so it could be tightened with a 10mm wrench.






All in all, I am loving this machine.  Making parts with the DRO feels like cheating because it is so fast and easy to make accurate parts.  I will be working on a BT30 spindle with it shortly and I am sure I will be adding more to it as well.


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## shooter123456 (Jul 4, 2020)

Working on the BT30 spindle with this machine is awesome.  I don't normally break out the micrometers and try to hold tight tolerances, but with this spindle, you kind of have to.  I roughed everything in, made a cut about .005" over, measured, made an adjustment, and each time it was accurate to a tenth.  I thought I might have been tricking myself, but according to my inexpensive micrometers, the machine was "holding tenths all day long".  It may be time to invest in some of those micrometers that can measure down to 50 millionths.  You can't have a machine that is more accurate than your measuring tools. 

The exterior of the shaft has 3 different threads and 2 bearing surfaces.  It took a solid 20 minutes to do all 3 threads.  

I need to order some longer drills to drill out the middle of this shaft.  Until then, the next thing to work on is the housing.


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## StevSmar (Jul 4, 2020)

Meta Key said:


> Also, I mounted the light fixture to a steel shelf that I mounted to the wall behind the lathe.  Seemed like a better option than mounting it to the machine itself.  Nice and solid and no vibration of the light fixture.


That’s a great idea!!!


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## shooter123456 (Jul 19, 2020)

I have been working on a bit of a runout issue with the 4 jaw and was hoping someone might have some insight.  The unbalance was pretty rough at the top low speed (780 RPM if I remember right).  

I started with some prussian blue to try to check contact on the taper and on the spindle face.  The taper contact looked fine, but the face wasn't.  Here is the spindle face after attaching and removing the chuck.





And here is the rear of the 4 jaw.  There was contact along the outer edges in 2 of the 3 areas between the cams, and on one, there is no contact.  The taper had good contact all the way around.





Here is the spindle face after checking the 3 jaw back plate.  Contact was much better all the way around.





I tried switching the cams between the 2 and there was a good bit of improvement.  Here is the contact on the rear of the 4 jaw after swapping the cams.  It was tough to get it to show up in the picture, so I highlighted the blued areas with sharpie.  There is still  good contact in 2 of the sections, but not quite so good in the third.  





So the questions:
Can the cams affect the fit of the chuck?
Any idea about how to improve the runout on the 4 jaw?  What would be an acceptable amount?


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## shooter123456 (Jul 19, 2020)

Also, unrelated, but I need to bore a .875" hole about 8.5" deep.  I made a D bit to do it and a little block to hold it in the tool post.  I reamed the toolpost block with the reamer and I was blown away by how well it worked.  The bore finish was phenomenal and it was as close to perfect size as I can measure.  I don't know why I waited so long to try one of these, it was so easy.


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