# The madness needs to stop...how about a GROUP PROJECT?



## GunsOfNavarone

The "madness"? I see it a lot here and it's 90% what I spend my free time doing, making tools or making tools to make my tools better. Alright, it keeps us off the streets and we are enjoying ourselves, no harm no foul. What if we spent some time making forum tools? If you've seen TOT or Blondihacks, when many share the responsibility and build something big or valuable or handy or....?
Twenty people or 100 people could each take a part of a drawing/plan and make a part to a specific set of tolerances and the parts come together (maybe at a moderator's home and it is assembled). If it's a tool, say a diving head, now that moderator has a valuable tool that can be shipped to whomever needs it to use for a project or learn how to use it or whatever. Depending on your strengths and or your knowledge, you pick your best fit or the moderator can pick based on a 1-10 know how questionnaire. There really are a lot of possibilities how to handle that. 
Costs? Well, depending on the project and how many interested ( we could have multiple levels and multiple projects) but say $10 to $20 each that is paypal'd to that mod and when items need too be paid for, that mod could paypal whomever for whatever material is needed. If someone flakes and doesn't build, someone could step in and take over that part and we could publicly humiliate that member! If they owed that$10 or whatever fee, I'm sure there is a way to put a hold on their access to the site, or we just write it off (less the public stoning)
Help me out here, the possibilities are endless. Would the mod here like to step in? We all obviously like making tools, but hell, it could be Jonny5!
Thoughts? Concerns? I dunno, maybe I've had too many espresso's?


----------



## mmcmdl

I had suggested a group beer cannon awhile back .  It didn't go too far .


----------



## mmcmdl

+ , I can't seem to keep any ammunition on my shelves lately for the above cannon .


----------



## RJSakowski

mmcmdl said:


> + , I can't seem to keep any ammunition on my shelves lately for the above cannon .


It's the cannon that you're supposed to keep loaded.


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

I'm not hearing no!


----------



## RJSakowski

GunsOfNavarone said:


> The "madness"? I see it a lot here and it's 90% what I spend my free time doing, making tools or making tools to make my tools better. Alright, it keeps us off the streets and we are enjoying ourselves, no harm no foul. What if we spent some time making forum tools? If you've seen TOT or Blondihacks, when many share the responsibility and build something big or valuable or handy or....?
> Twenty people or 100 people could each take a part of a drawing/plan and make a part to a specific set of tolerances and the parts come together (maybe at a moderator's home and it is assembled). If it's a tool, say a diving head, now that moderator has a valuable tool that can be shipped to whomever needs it to use for a project or learn how to use it or whatever. Depending on your strengths and or your knowledge, you pick your best fit or the moderator can pick based on a 1-10 know how questionnaire. There really are a lot of possibilities how to handle that.
> Costs? Well, depending on the project and how many interested ( we could have multiple levels and multiple projects) but say $10 to $20 each that is paypal'd to that mod and when items need too be paid for, that mod could paypal whomever for whatever material is needed. If someone flakes and doesn't build, someone could step in and take over that part and we could publicly humiliate that member! If they owed that$10 or whatever fee, I'm sure there is a way to put a hold on their access to the site, or we just write it off (less the public stoning)
> Help me out here, the possibilities are endless. Would the mod here like to step in? We all obviously like making tools, but hell, it could be Jonny5!
> Thoughts? Concerns? I dunno, maybe I've had too many espresso's?


An interesting idea.  One thing that woulde become apparent very quickly is the need to be able to manufacture to tolerances.  When two parties are responsible for making mating parts, each would have an assigned set of tolerances in order to ensure that the parts would mate correctly.  The stacked tolerances would be the sum of the two and that tolerance would have to be within the tolerance allo2wed fror proper operation of the assembly.

When we make something solely within our own shop, we can check fits and adjust as required.  This was done efectively in medieval times without the benefit of precision measuring tools.  A blacksmith would make a lock and key by first making the key and fitting a lock to it.  In colonial times, rifles were made the same way.  Parts were not interchangeable from one to another.

Not saying that it can't be done but it will require special skill and discipline.  Measuring instruments should be calibrated so everyone is on the same page.  Ability to follow GD&T would be a plus.


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

Yes, and if tolerances were provided, either the final product is within or not. The person making it would be responsible for measuring, but perhaps the person that receives the parts from all parties. Maybe I'm crazy, but isn't that part of the fun? I've made parts for people and I try hard to make it perfectly to spec, whether they gave me those tolerances or not, I enjoys doing my best to hit the nail on the head. 
Imagine the potential if everyone hits the mark, huge time consuming projects for one person is now small, palatable bites!


----------



## thomb

Sounds fun! An idea?  Perhaps there are others like me who enjoy making multiples of the same part (I enjoy learning and improving the repetitive  process to reduce cycle time). Assign a part and everyone ends up with one of the resulting tool/item.


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

@thomb exactly, work on peoples strengths. I hate doing the CAD/CAM part of the job, but whether manual or CNC, I love/need having the instructions. There are people here where the CAD part ain't no thang. People who love hobbing gears, people whole love repetitive work, people whole love intricate small. Why don't we combine our "superpowers" and make something worth while? Something that gives the group an incredible benefit of being a member here? And who doesn't think this sounds like a blast? I mean the pass around box is great, think how much better this would be and possible for many more to get involved. If people had 1 or 2 months to complete their small part, well, at the end of that time we could have made a mars rover! (j/k but you get the jist)


----------



## Flyinfool

On the other side of the coin, This would be  a lot of extra time, and workload for an already busy moderator. The person running it could be any long time trusted member, that has a clue.

I can see where the beer cannon did not get far as anything that goes bang will have certain legal issues attached depending on where a member lives. If the project is a tool or piece of equipment that everyone needs and can use, then it will get the biggest following.

Once this tool is built there is the issue of shipping it repeatedly, at some point it will get dropped and break. ALL shippers do this. Packing something big and or heavy is difficult to do, normally the cushioning is a one shot deal, It can absorb one big impact and has then given its life to protect its contents. It would need a custom designed, reusable, indestructible, shipping container.

I am not trying to be a naysayer, just bringing up the ugly parts of the equation that no one like to look at so we all go in with eyes wide open.


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

I was concerned with the final product and shipping and for sure that can be an issue, it would have to be bang for the buck. Even if not for group use after the fact, a group build would be quite the collaboration. Fun? For sure. Great practice for some of the newer people into machining? Absolutely. Smaller yet more complex (many working parts) maybe a better fit. I know it's not for everyone, but anyone really into machining and the challenges of machining, this would have to be really be a draw for. 
I don't see any reason it would have to be a mod that the completed parts would HAVE TO go to, but someone whole could spec the final parts to thumbs up or down the part would be a must. I can see why this project has never left the ground but there are far more challenging issues we have all come up against and overcome...where there's a will.....
I think about the combined knowledge base here, the equipment at our disposal, man! What potential! I'm scratching my head right now, but I'm still trying to find the answers.


----------



## ErichKeane

I'd love to do this!  This would be a lot of fun   I have a new large shaper, and a large lathe, so anything on the larger side is doable 

I'd hope we could do something interesting, but the idea of a "Hobby Machinist Library" of group made tools would be pretty cool as well.

I would be willing to buy my own materials to make my part (and I presume others might be as well!), so perhaps the money-to-a-mod would be unnecessary.  

So I think the hardest part would be to come up with something complicated enough we could get about a dozen people working on it, but easy enough that the tolerances wouldn't be deadly.


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

Yeah, I blow so much money on this hobby, what's a small bit more for materials? I was thinking if there were some materials that cost more than others, this could balance out the unfair weight on any one person. A shaper? That would be a huge asset and that gets back to the combines knowledge/combined available equipment....we could build a damn GoBot! I'm sure someone has a the ability to harden steel, maybe a smaller (lighter) tool library with things like broaching tools/keyway cutters, ring roller, I don't know. Maybe a 8-12 person per project is a decent number, I guess the complexity of each project would dictate.


----------



## Braeden P

I like the idea of a “model” cannon and maybe a steam engine? Small stuff that would be easy to make but have lots of parts
Here’s a link to a ton of steam engine plans




__





						Plans for Everything, Mostly Free
					

Plans for Engines, Tools, Vehicles and more for the home builder



					www.plans-for-everything.com


----------



## Aaron_W

thomb said:


> Sounds fun! An idea?  Perhaps there are others like me who enjoy making multiples of the same part (I enjoy learning and improving the repetitive  process to reduce cycle time). Assign a part and everyone ends up with one of the resulting tool/item.



I think that might get more traction as all the participants would have something at the end, instead of one item shared which seems kind of awkward. Fun for the project but not really practical to actually get use of a tool.


----------



## extropic

Aaron_W said:


> I think that might get more traction as all the participants would have something at the end, instead of one item shared which seems kind of awkward. Fun for the project but not really practical to actually get use of a tool.



To be sure I understand what you're saying: if there are 10 members of the participating group, each member would produce 10 each of their part(s)?


----------



## Aaron_W

extropic said:


> To be sure I understand what you're saying: if there are 10 members of the participating group, each member would produce 10 each of their part(s)?



That is kind of what I was thinking. Would have to be something kind of simple with just a few parts of roughly similar material value.

Something like one of these tool makers clamps would be a possibility. It could be done a few ways probably generating 5-7 pieces with some wiggle room in division of labor. Something like this also favors using different machines, so someone who only has a mill or just a lathe can still participate, and possibly gets a tool that would be difficult to make in their shop. Also small enough that a guy with a Bridgeport and a guy with a mini-mill could both participate.

Lets call it 5 pieces, so you make 5 of your parts, and everybody gets what they need to build a clamp, make 10 and everybody gets a pair of clamps. Five is small enough to be able to find enough interested parties, but also small enough that if there were a lot of interest it could be broken into multiple project groups (2 groups of 5, 3 groups of 5 etc). Cheap and simple enough that if a participant fails to come through with their part not really a big deal, someone else can step in and make the parts or it can just be finished on your own.




The clamps are just to illustrate the kind of thing I think would be a good starting point for such a project. A fairly simple project to help smooth over the inevitable bumps. If it works then it could get more ambitious, if it fails no one is out much but some time and material. The actual item built could also take advantage of what individuals bring to it, machines available, skills, comfort levels, desired objectives. 

I think one of the major learning benefits of group project like this would be having to build to a spec. No fudging and hand fitting, because you don't have the other parts until, everybody is done.


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

extropic said:


> To be sure I understand what you're saying: if there are 10 members of the participating group, each member would produce 10 each of their part(s)?


I hadn't thought about that, but that might get boring. I was thinking, say a device that is being made had 10 parts....10 people, 1 part each. I feel (this is just me) it should be somewhat complicated (not a key holder or a bird house) and require a a fair amount of tight tolerances (+/- .002"?) How cool to put this...I dunno, lets say a dividing head, together and have something made as a team. I agree with you @Aaron_W about that complete device not being in the hands of all that made it..maybe the making 10 identical parts for the 10 other people making their own different parts for 10 complete, identical items for all involved to have one. 
I can't be the only person that thinks working from a drawing/blueprints to make a part of a complete machine is awesome? Its like the guy who contacted me here to make him a timing wheel for his plane He sent me plans, I matched those plans and he has since sent me a video of the plane running. It was pretty cool as I have never seen the motor nor know anything about planes.
Has anyone seen the group builds by all the machinist folks? This OldTony, Blondihacks....no?


----------



## Mini Cooper S

mmcmdl said:


> I had suggested a group beer cannon awhile back .  It didn't go too far .


Try more air pressure!


----------



## extropic

GunsOfNavarone said:


> snip>
> Has anyone seen the group builds by all the machinist folks? This OldTony, Blondihacks....no?



I'm not familiar with group builds. Can you provide links?


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

@extropic There are lot of big name YouTubers that have got together to do this, but I think even Tony did something for Project Egress, when they rebuilt the moon lander....it's been a while. Go through his vids and Blondihcks for more of this. Seems like its a thing I know Tony and Ron Covell did a crazy over built dust pan...I know it sounds crazy.
ThisOldTony

Even Better...
ProjectEgress


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

BlondiHacks contribution to the Adam Savage (Mythbusters) 50 year moon landing rebuild...

Quinn's Contribution


----------



## ErichKeane

Aaron_W said:


> That is kind of what I was thinking. Would have to be something kind of simple with just a few parts of roughly similar material value.
> 
> Something like one of these tool makers clamps would be a possibility. It could be done a few ways probably generating 5-7 pieces with some wiggle room in division of labor. Something like this also favors using different machines, so someone who only has a mill or just a lathe can still participate, and possibly gets a tool that would be difficult to make in their shop. Also small enough that a guy with a Bridgeport and a guy with a mini-mill could both participate.
> 
> Lets call it 5 pieces, so you make 5 of your parts, and everybody gets what they need to build a clamp, make 10 and everybody gets a pair of clamps. Five is small enough to be able to find enough interested parties, but also small enough that if there were a lot of interest it could be broken into multiple project groups (2 groups of 5, 3 groups of 5 etc). Cheap and simple enough that if a participant fails to come through with their part not really a big deal, someone else can step in and make the parts or it can just be finished on your own.
> 
> View attachment 356384
> 
> 
> The clamps are just to illustrate the kind of thing I think would be a good starting point for such a project. A fairly simple project to help smooth over the inevitable bumps. If it works then it could get more ambitious, if it fails no one is out much but some time and material. The actual item built could also take advantage of what individuals bring to it, machines available, skills, comfort levels, desired objectives.
> 
> I think one of the major learning benefits of group project like this would be having to build to a spec. No fudging and hand fitting, because you don't have the other parts until, everybody is done.


See, I would find something like that to be less interesting.  If it is simple (like those clamps), I would think I would spend more time dealing with shipping stuff out than I would to just make the whole thing in the first place.

The selling point for me is to be able to make a part to something complicated and cool, and see it come together.


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

Think of something like a prefabricated building (not the mobile home type) when all the parts are made off site, different places by different people. It's kind of awe-inspiring watching it all come together.. the information on those blueprints coming together. SO....
1) it needs to have a level of precision (low tolerance)
2) it needs to be somewhat complicated...multiple parts
3) help me here!


----------



## Aaron_W

ErichKeane said:


> See, I would find something like that to be less interesting.  If it is simple (like those clamps), I would think I would spend more time dealing with shipping stuff out than I would to just make the whole thing in the first place.
> 
> The selling point for me is to be able to make a part to something complicated and cool, and see it come together.



I agree it is less interesting, I mean those clamps are the kind of thing many would just buy instead of make and I was just throwing those out there as an idea for a simple project. 

I've seen group projects in other areas and they usually fizzle out, as people who signed up find they are over their head or just plain lose interest, so I see doing something complex right out the gate as doomed to failure. 

If you start small without too much commitment, or risk, from there you could see how it worked, address issues that popped up and help to build a group of people who really know what they are in for and will enjoy the project.


----------



## Weldingrod1

Both routes (one object or multiple copies) have fun factor. I would pitch in for sure!

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


----------



## rwm

There has been some of this collaboration on HM already. I note that 2 people are currently designing and building an XRF on this site. I am certain they will succeed. Previously a build was started for the HM shop made surface grinder. That has stalled. Perhaps someone (sometwo, somethree or someN) should pick this back up?!
Robert


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

Wow! A surface grinder...that's huge! Maybe a big bigger (size and weight) for my undertaking, but any rate...lets start another project. Did someone say the diving head seemed big?


----------



## ErichKeane

GunsOfNavarone said:


> Wow! A surface grinder...that's huge! Maybe a big bigger (size and weight) for my undertaking, but any rate...lets start another project. Did someone say the diving head seemed big?


It's on the complicated side(depending on the style), but I think would be doable.


----------



## vtcnc

Great idea! You are guaranteed to hit some bumps in the road regardless of the project type and who is involved so I would worry less about what specifically happens and focus on what will keep the project moving as frequently as possible. A couple of suggestions for your consideration:

1) Shipping. One might consider the wisdom of picking a project that fits inside no larger than a Large Priority Mail box. That keeps your shipping cost to about $20 and the project parts/assemblies can be up to 70lbs and ship to all 50 states.

2) Membership. I would limit participation to those that are donating members or have been members for a minimum amount of time and with minimum number of posts.

3) Project selection. I think doing a group project that is a shared tool or device is a really great idea. Tool sharpening jigs, dividing head, milling attachment, etc. that members who built the project have access to.

4) Youtube?


----------



## ErichKeane

Thinking about it a bit... It would be nice to make something that isn't available made of Chinesium. Something we cannot get for a few hundred bucks on eBay/AliExpress/Etc. 

One example might be a small shaper (sub 7", maybe just big enough to cut inside features, but this is likely too heavy even so.

Anyone have anything that they needed 1x but couldn't find a cheap alternative and had to either work-around or pay the big bucks for the expensive one?


----------



## vtcnc

ErichKeane said:


> Thinking about it a bit... It would be nice to make something that isn't available made of Chinesium. Something we cannot get for a few hundred bucks on eBay/AliExpress/Etc.
> 
> One example might be a small shaper (sub 7", maybe just big enough to cut inside features, but this is likely too heavy even so.
> 
> Anyone have anything that they needed 1x but couldn't find a cheap alternative and had to either work-around or pay the big bucks for the expensive one?


You might find that a slotter attachment might be a more suitably sized project, achieves the same thing a small shaper can, and if participants agree on the machine it is built for - makes it worth doing.


----------



## vtcnc

Another good idea that I think people would sign up for: toolpost grinder.


----------



## ErichKeane

Those are good ideas! A right angle milling head or slotting attachment for a mill are both fun seeming projects. If we designed it right, we might be able to flat-pack it into a flat rate box.

For example, if we made the part that goes on the spindle two 1/4" circle-to-square adapter parts, the body out of plate, plus gears/bushings, we can make it diassemble in a way that ships easy.

Additionally, it would make it somewhat easy to adapt to other mills by making different adapters.


----------



## Braeden P

How about I little shaper? Might be hard but it would be fun! Hopefully I will be able to help out but I’m not a donating member and won’t be allowed to so I might not make the requirements


----------



## ErichKeane

Braeden P said:


> How about I little shaper? Might be hard but it would be fun! Hopefully I will be able to help out but I’m not a donating member and won’t be allowed to so I might not make the requirements


There are hand-shaper casting kits around... Perhaps we could copy off of one of those?

As for being a donating member, it's pretty cheap 

They said, LENDING the tool to someone should require membership, but participating in the build shouldn't. If the person disappears, someone else can just take their place and the rest of us have lost nothing but time.


----------



## Braeden P

ErichKeane said:


> As for being a donating member, it's pretty cheap


 Not for a 12 y/o who just spent all of there money on a lathe I am going to plow more drive ways to be a donating member but my birthday is in a few weeks so I will get some money but lending a big heavy tool sounds like a pain, I like the idea of only donating members getting to use the tool because nobody will like spending time to make something then someone just disappears with it would be bad.


----------



## vtcnc

ErichKeane said:


> If the person disappears, someone else can just take their place and the rest of us have lost nothing but time.


Not if they have the parts.

You guys might want to look at our rule set on the Pass Around Box sub-forum. It is similar (but not the same goal) as what is being proposed here.


----------



## ErichKeane

vtcnc said:


> Not if they have the parts.
> 
> You guys might want to look at our rule set on the Pass Around Box sub-forum. It is similar (but not the same goal) as what is being proposed here.


I presumed the "lead" person was doing assembly and everyone else was mailing them completed parts. I thought about the pass around box, but it seems more tolerant of losing the box (and didn't one disappear just a year or two ago?).


----------



## rwm

GunsOfNavarone said:


> Wow! A surface grinder...that's huge! Maybe a big bigger (size and weight) for my undertaking, but any rate...lets start another project. Did someone say the diving head seemed big?


I found the thread:








						A Project Quest
					

That's correct, a quest, not a request.   Mark F and myself have decided to do a project together. What we wish to do will be announced at a later date.   Here is the quest, we are looking for some who can Plasma Cut parts for us. The largest part will come from sheet steel measuring 24x24...




					www.hobby-machinist.com
				



R


----------



## ttabbal

I like the idea of participating in a group effort. I'll be happy to help out with it.


----------



## ErichKeane

Here's a machine idea now that I'm watching a bunch of vintage machinery   What about a bevel-gear cutting adapter for a mill?    I don't know what a generic one would look like, but it seems like something that would be useful to a number of people, and isn't readily available.


----------



## vtcnc

ErichKeane said:


> I presumed the "lead" person was doing assembly and everyone else was mailing them completed parts. I thought about the pass around box, but it seems more tolerant of losing the box (and didn't one disappear just a year or two ago?).


The issue with all of these ideas, including Pass Around is that the box can get lost or stolen. This is an assumed risk.


----------



## ErichKeane

vtcnc said:


> The issue with all of these ideas, including Pass Around is that the box can get lost or stolen. This is an assumed risk.


Yep, I agree! The hope with only the lead person getting all the parts is that at least until it is completed, our risk is all in 1 person (rather than the list of people).

Lending it out of course would be difficult/dangerous, but from my perspective, the journey is the fun


----------



## erikmannie

I will join in & make my part, whatever that may be. I would request a drawing & tolerance.


----------



## Braeden P

how about we come up with ideas and we have a poll to choose which project we will make kind of like an election


----------



## rwm

Just had a thought. If the project was not too complex and there are a lot of people interested, we could have two designs and two dueling teams. I am also curious if anyone here can cast cast iron? I have not tried that yet.
Robert


----------



## Doug Gray

I'd be willing to contribute drafting services.


----------



## ErichKeane

Oooh, so I just had a project idea!  There aren't plans as this is a school project that some guy did and the instructor keeps the plans otherwise secret, but this is really awesome : https://www.reddit.com/gallery/lj8q8w

Not particularly useful to lend out, but I'd love to give it a try!  He gives a ton of pictures across a number of threads on Reddit, so perhaps it is easy enough to RE from that.


----------



## Braeden P

rwm said:


> Just had a thought. If the project was not too complex and there are a lot of people interested, we could have two designs and two dueling teams. I am also curious if anyone here can cast cast iron? I have not tried that yet.
> Robert


I like the two teams idea it seems fun


----------



## mmcmdl

mmcmdl said:


> + , I can't seem to keep any ammunition on my shelves lately for the above cannon .



Time to reload being I'm off till Weds night !


----------



## rwm

How about a horizontal/vertical rotary table/super spacer? That involves a lot of disciplines.
Robert


----------



## mmcmdl

I'm now lightly re-armed , back to the selling !


----------



## rock_breaker

I like the idea and would be interested in purchasing a pair of machinists clamps at competitive prices. I have a dividing indexer that is currently a WIP also an Atlas horizontal mill that I am trying to get cleaned up and operative, so  am not anxious to take on more projects.
Have a good day
Ray


----------



## Braeden P

Or we could make a die filler


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

Is the final weight of the project important? How about the weight of the heaviest individual part? Also, I PERSONALLY think it should have at least 15 individual parts. This is not only for complexity but also how many people can take part.


----------



## Braeden P

We could also make two parts one is the correct size and the other is half size then it would be a mini one too


----------



## Flyinfool

If this is to be a group project that will be available to all participants then weight does matter since it has to be easily shipped to the other participants. As mentioned earlier, it would be best to be able to fit in a large flat rate box from USPS to keep shipping reasonable.


----------



## Braeden P

well now we should decide what to build the thread has 6 pages but no project has been decided on lets choose some!


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

I gotta say, that floor jack that was posted is bad ass. Seems as if it would have plenty of pieces/parts, all fairly small or fit in a flat rate box. Part of me thinks whomever makes a part, they make 10 and we all swap pieces and have a xxxxxxx. I know that no one wants to make 10 of the same part so being realistic here, we need to keep it to one part each. Maybe its not so much to have the final product (ship it around to whomever wants it/needs it, as much as making something complicated and precision from individuals across the nation. Following the plans and having it come together and work. This is why a dividing hear/rotary table sounds so good.


----------



## Weldingrod1

I'm in the midst of dreaming up a die filer based on a hackzall or chinese clone carcass. Photos of both attached. They use a nice spiral bevel gear and already include the linear motion and anti rotation. A crossover from sawzall blade to file and you could reuse the quick change. Turn down the DC motor speed a LOT, of course.
I'm thinking the table actually wants to be tilted toward you. Metal top and 3d printed angle adjuster might work.
	

	
	
		
		

		
			








Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


----------



## Weldingrod1

For the die filer each person could provide their own carcass and we collectively run batches of piece parts.

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


----------



## Braeden P

Or we make all of the parts so that it looks really good they are simple and it could be run on a 1/4 hp motor real easy


----------



## ErichKeane

Braeden P said:


> Or we make all of the parts so that it looks really good they are simple and it could be run on a 1/4 hp motor real easy


I might prefer we build one that is driven off of a different machine that we are all likely to have...


----------



## finsruskw

Who is going to own it, what ever it turns out to be?

How about what ever it turns out to be, sell it to a forum member with the proceeds going to the site.
.
Maybe a silent auction of sorts?


----------



## Braeden P

ErichKeane said:


> I might prefer we build one that is driven off of a different machine that we are all likely to have...


We could get a 12 volt or 24 volt gear motor and put a switch mode power supply it would look professional and be cheap to make


----------



## Braeden P

Use these pulleys and belt


			https://www.amazon.com/Houkr-Aluminum-Bearing-Synchronous-Printer/dp/B081PXKKS4/ref=sr_1_20_sspa?dchild=1&keywords=3m%2B40%2Btooth%2Bpulley&qid=1614436597&sr=8-20-spons&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUFDSjhTR1lDR0ZWVk8mZW5jcnlwdGVkSWQ9QTA1NTI5NjYxUzdQWjQwNTdNSDA3JmVuY3J5cHRlZEFkSWQ9QTEwMzA0MjAyWFhLUlQ3WFBSUENOJndpZGdldE5hbWU9c3BfYnRmJmFjdGlvbj1jbGlja1JlZGlyZWN0JmRvTm90TG9nQ2xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ&th=1
		


And this motor




__





						Happybuy 12V Electric Motor 150W DC Motor 2500 RPM Rated Speed Brushed Motor with 3M-16T Transmission Belt Pulley - - Amazon.com
					

Happybuy 12V Electric Motor 150W DC Motor 2500 RPM Rated Speed Brushed Motor with 3M-16T Transmission Belt Pulley - - Amazon.com



					www.amazon.com
				




This should be about the right speed and they will fit the motor if you guys like this idea I will try to get them


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

I have a suggestion...it's small, beautiful, easy to make multiple parts (maybe not as precision as I'd originally wanted) but what about Eagle 66 oil cans? Too small?


----------



## TTatano

I like the idea, and I haven't made my first chip. My Atlas Craftsman 12x36 is still in the sellers garage across the street, but she's comin home this weekend. Obviously, my part would need to be reeeeaally simple, but it does sound like a lot of fun!


----------



## TTatano

I agree on the purchase of your ow


ErichKeane said:


> I'd love to do this!  This would be a lot of fun   I have a new large shaper, and a large lathe, so anything on the larger side is doable
> 
> I'd hope we could do something interesting, but the idea of a "Hobby Machinist Library" of group made tools would be pretty cool as well.
> 
> I would be willing to buy my own materials to make my part (and I presume others might be as well!), so perhaps the money-to-a-mod would be unnecessary.
> 
> So I think the hardest part would be to come up with something complicated enough we could get about a dozen people working on it, but easy enough that the tolerances wouldn't be deadly.


n materials. It doesn't need to become someone's bookkeeping nightmare that way.


----------



## TTatano

I spent all night trying to find a


GunsOfNavarone said:


> I have a suggestion...it's small, beautiful, easy to make multiple parts (maybe not as precision as I'd originally wanted) but what about Eagle 66 oil cans? Too small?


 I've spent all night trying to find a built "trigger" assembly to make the eagle my first project. Can't find such a thing anywhere. I'm guessing some folks must have the skills to build such a part. That guy's not me, unfortunately...


----------



## TTatano

I love the Eagle idea. Especially if 


GunsOfNavarone said:


> Think of something like a prefabricated building (not the mobile home type) when all the parts are made off site, different places by different people. It's kind of awe-inspiring watching it all come together.. the information on those blueprints coming together. SO....
> 1) it needs to have a level of precision (low tolerance)
> 2) it needs to be somewhat complicated...multiple parts
> 3) help me here!


someone had the prints for the complete project. I'd probably make the complete project for my shop, in addition to making a single part for the group. Who couldn't use another nice oil can, right?


----------



## ErichKeane

There are a couple copies of the Eagle 66 plans running around here that we could work off of, this one seems pretty popular: https://www.hobby-machinist.com/threads/pump-oil-can-prints.33616/.

  I don't mind it as a project, but I would think it would have to be a situation where we made enough for everyone.


----------



## TTatano

ErichKeane said:


> Those are good ideas! A right angle milling head or slotting attachment for a mill are both fun seeming projects. If we designed it right, we might be able to flat-pack it into a flat rate box.
> 
> For example, if we made the part that goes on the spindle two 1/4" circle-to-square adapter parts, the body out of plate, plus gears/bushings, we can make it diassemble in a way that ships easy.
> 
> Additionally, it would make it somewhat easy to adapt to other mills by making different adapters.


I've been wishing my new purchase had a milling attachment, bein that I'll never afford a mill. Maybe a group of folks who have a certain make of lathe, and in similar financial circumstance, would be interested in such a build.


----------



## rwm

Those are my oil can plans. I would be gratified if people decide to proceed with that!
Robert


----------



## ErichKeane

TTatano said:


> I've been wishing my new purchase had a milling attachment, bein that I'll never afford a mill. Maybe a group of folks who have a certain make of lathe, and in similar financial circumstance, would be interested in such a build.



So for that, I might consider checking out the 'can you make something for me' part of this forum! I know that if you came up with a set of plans that there are a few parts of one of those that I'd love to make on my tooling in exchange for materials+beer money.  SO, if you do the CAD work, you might be able to crowd source manufacture.


----------



## TTatano

ErichKeane said:


> Yep, I agree! The hope with only the lead person getting all the parts is that at least until it is completed, our risk is all in 1 person (rather than the list of people).
> 
> Lending it out of course would be difficult/dangerous, but from my perspective, the journey is the fun


What about an idea where at the completion of a build, one of the participants would somehow be chosen as a "winner" of the item? Then if they choose to loan it, it's their individual risk? Isn't the participation in the group build where the fun is?


----------



## TTatano

Thank you for sharing your plans. And thank brother Erich for the link to them. I WILL be building one. They are beautiful oilers!!


rwm said:


> Those are my oil can plans. I would be gratified if people decide to proceed with that!
> Robert


----------



## ErichKeane

TTatano said:


> What about an idea where at the completion of a build, one of the participants would somehow be chosen as a "winner" of the item? Then if they choose to loan it, it's their individual risk? Isn't the participation in the group build where the fun is?


I'd be OK with something like that for a bunch of projects, like the oiler/etc. Basically anything where I didn't put a bunch of money into my part.


----------



## TTatano

That sounds like an awesome idea and I thank you very much, but I'm tech illiterate, so I'd have to rely on the skills of yet another good soul. I have been watching for the perfect example of one. Seems that each version has it's own weakness. I'm wide open for suggestions!!! 


ErichKeane said:


> ave been watching a lot So for that, I might consider checking out the 'can you make something for me' part of this forum! I know that if you came up with a set of plans that there are a few parts of one of those that I'd love to make on my tooling in exchange for materials+beer money.  SO, if you do the CAD work, you might be able to crowd source manufacture.


----------



## TTatano

ErichKeane said:


> I'd be OK with something like that for a bunch of projects, like the oiler/etc. Basically anything where I didn't put a bunch of money into my part.


That was my thought as well. My internet is running so slow today, I'm having a hard time keeping up. I think it's trying to tell me to get out there in the garage and get the space ready for the lathe. I was trying to find the message with the link to the oiler plans to thank you for the link. Was binge watching Abom79 last night and saw one someone sent to him several years ago. It was beautiful, and I been jones'en for one since I saw it.


----------



## Braeden P

We need to decide what we will do, will it be a contest or group project? We could vote on it and we need to decide who will make it or is it just for donating members.


----------



## rwm

One problem I should point out with the oil cans is the cost of brass. Brass screws especially have gotten very expensive. You could make them, but thread tolerance would contribute heavily to part compatibility. 
Robert


----------



## Braeden P

Ok some one needs to make a poll so that we can decide what to make here is some that we came up with
Die filer 
Oil can
Dividing head
And feel free to add on


----------



## ttabbal

Does the oil can need to be brass? It seems like we could use aluminum. Thread tolerance isn't that hard, wires or thread mics. For internal threads, make a gauge. If we have multiple of the same internal threads, maybe include the gauges in the box. 

I'd like a die filer, but I think I would need to purchase castings to make one. 

I think it makes sense to do something smaller for a first go round. Particularly if we can all end up with one at the end. Makes it a little more fun, and limits the potential losses from shipping and such. Maybe pass-around box style? Make x number of parts, ship around. Everyone makes some, keeps one from the box to build theirs, ship it on..


----------



## ErichKeane

ttabbal said:


> Does the oil can need to be brass? It seems like we could use aluminum. Thread tolerance isn't that hard, wires or thread mics. For internal threads, make a gauge. If we have multiple of the same internal threads, maybe include the gauges in the box.
> 
> I'd like a die filer, but I think I would need to purchase castings to make one.
> 
> I think it makes sense to do something smaller for a first go round. Particularly if we can all end up with one at the end. Makes it a little more fun, and limits the potential losses from shipping and such. Maybe pass-around box style? Make x number of parts, ship around. Everyone makes some, keeps one from the box to build theirs, ship it on..


I don't see any reason why it has to be Brass other than that is what it is traditionally made out of.  I'm sure aluminum would be fine.

As far as the die filer... since we're making this a group project if we could find someone who is able to do castings, perhaps that could be 1 or 2 people's contribution!

1st person makes the dead-tree-carcass(or 3d printed?) mold, 2nd person casts, 3rd machines, etc.  We'd have to find someone willing to do castings 1st though.


----------



## Flyinfool

Since there are soldered joints on the oil can, aluminum is really hard to solder, it can be done but is not easy, Brass is very easy to solder, or braze, stainless is a bit harder to solder but still not to bad to braze steel will end up rusting unless someone can do plating of some kind. To make it out of AL it would need to have a bit of redesign to eliminate the soldered connections. For a first project I still like the oil can idea as it is simple and everyone gets one. And most have a use for one. Just have to figure out the best way for the logistics to get the parts around to everyone.


Bigger machines are hard to share just because of the shipping issues.


----------



## ErichKeane

FWIW, for the die filer, I was thinking something inspired by/the size of: https://www.martinmodel.com/products/4-piece-die-filer-casting-set

My thought would be that we could change the design of the base to disassemble (perhaps just make the flange bolt on, so it can fit in a thinner box?

If i were designing it, I'd probably also want to make sure that the machine could be driven either by a lathe or a drill/etc.  That way we wouldn't have to buy a motor.


----------



## ttabbal

I missed that the oil can is soldered/brazed. I do wish brass were not so expensive, it's a really nice looking metal and it's easy to work. Not the end of the world. 

That little die filer would be interesting. But unless someone wants to do casting for us, the next option would probably be to have everyone order from the same place and perhaps share shop made parts between each other.


----------



## Weldingrod1

My thought on the die filer would be to re-purpose the existing mechanism. I found my imported one for $36... looks like $45 after a quick look, search term: "20V max cordless reciprocating saw sabre jigsaw battery Electric cutting blades" Looks decent inside!

You would need to make a tilting table, a base that held the mechanism and coupled to the table, something to power it (the supplied batteries could work), and something to slow it down. And, of course, a way to hold the files ;-)
Swapping the linear motion object to a custom one with a screw clamp would be pretty easy, or we could dream up a sawzall blade shank to file fitting (but you need a few of them...)

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


----------



## rock_breaker

@Flyingfool has brought up a very important activity for this to work, *Project Management*! No doubt there are hundreds of people in this group that do this daily and some may enjoy taking on the task. Keeping track of who has the individual parts, expenses involved. completion schedules etc. may be more than our moderators want or are able to do. Nelson has put together and made it work with the effort of our very astute administrators, a marvelous website, this project should reflect his efforts. 

My current view of this project would be the moderators acting as a board of directors, a Manager from the membership (or committee) and as many department heads from the membership the manager feels is necessary. I was taught in school the least effective way to make a decision is by committee, so be careful.  

Perhaps a project like a steam engine that could be raffled off at machinist organizations at their annual meetings would be viable. This is just one of the many decisions that has to be made.

Have a good day
Ray


----------



## macardoso

I'd be happy to participate in a group project.

I have a lathe and a CNC mill (as most do here!) but also metrology experience, I know GD&T, and I'm pretty darn good in CAD. 

Didn't get through the whole thread, but I'd be happy to do a part of a project.


----------



## macardoso

Couple of ideas. I am finishing a PM Research steam engine. All of the parts have tolerances on the prints so in theory, if each part was made to tolerance, the whole thing should go together nicely. I've found this to be true so far.

One of these engines can take in the realm of 50-150 man hours, so this might be a nice project for a 5-10 person team. Perhaps someone puts the money up front to buy the kit and ship out the castings to their team (and acts as the project manager), and in the end they keep the engine. Their team gets the benefit of having the fun of machining some interesting parts. 

If more than 5-10 people want to do this, we can get 2-3 teams going and have a race to the finish!


----------



## Shotgun

RJSakowski said:


> Ability to follow GD&T would be a plus.



Follow GD&T?

Hell, I can't even spell it.  What does it mean?


----------



## RJSakowski

Shotgun said:


> Follow GD&T?
> 
> Hell, I can't even spell it.  What does it mean?


Not quite the same as a G & T.  Geometric dimensioning and tolerancing.


----------



## RJSakowski

GD&T Provides an unambiguous way of conveying design intent to a manufacturer.  As a result, parts made by different manufacturers are assured of properly functioning as an assembly (assuming that the designer/draftsman did their jobs properly ).


----------



## Braeden P

Machinist

a person who does precision guesswork designed by those with questionable intelligence


----------



## Shotgun

I started making a dividing head.  I didn't really have a plan, and was just making it up as I went along.  (I know.  Failure to plan is a plan to fail.). I got as far as making the 40:1 worm gear and shaft.  I had to make up tool to hob the gear, and a fixture to hold it for hobbing.

If I can get others to make the complimentary parts, I'd be ecstatic to use the tool and fixture to make more gears.  I'd ship to participants to who would ship me their parts, and we'd all have a dividing head at the end.

I guess the first step would be to come up with an actual drawing.

Anyone want to join in?


----------



## ErichKeane

Shotgun said:


> I started making a dividing head.  I didn't really have a plan, and was just making it up as I went along.  (I know.  Failure to plan is a plan to fail.). I got as far as making the 40:1 worm gear and shaft.  I had to make up tool to hob the gear, and a fixture to hold it for hobbing.
> 
> If I can get others to make the complimentary parts, I'd be ecstatic to use the tool and fixture to make more gears.  I'd ship to participants to who would ship me their parts, and we'd all have a dividing head at the end.
> 
> I guess the first step would be to come up with an actual drawing.
> 
> Anyone want to join in?


I'm game


----------



## Doug Gray

Good Drawings Make for Good Parts


----------



## rock_breaker

In my shop is a 40:1 manufactured worm gear assembly and a few home made parts, naturally mention of a dividing head got my attention. Having made some parts, measuring and drafting (CAD) make me believe this would be a good project simply because it has parts for most home machinist, and is a tool that many of us could use. I am not qualified as a Machinist or a Draftsman but certainly see the need for them.
Two thoughts on finances; the first from a black powder shoot out in Lakewood, CO. You put your dollar down and take your shot, The next is financial aid from The Hobby-Machinist website. Statistically if 1/4 of our 36000 members were to contribute $1.00 it would create a budget 0f $9000 a year, devote 25% of this to administration and have $6750 for the project. Shop owners and managers can tell us how far that will go. A real challenge for the Board of Directors and the Project managers.
 This is a good Idea with  challenges for many people to produce a quality workable project. Shipping has the potential of destroying any manufacturing budget, perhaps shipping to an assembly point would combat these costs.
Have a good day
Ray (Rock breaker)


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

Wow, I have been fighting with replacing and programing the motherboard on my 3d printer (I have 15 hours AT least on that sonb1tch!) and this thread has really moved! FWIW, when I ever get around to making the oil cans, I'm not brazing, I'm threading the mating surfaces...with a gutter for a oil seal, it won't leak. I really have been on the fence if people should end up with their own (whatever this ends up being) or it's one large/complicated item that is shared? Stored where ever it happens to be? I really don't have the answers but I just want my fellow hobby machinist newbs to know this, if you haven't made (or worked off) blueprints with tolerances and finished that project and marveled at the glory of your accomplishments....you're missing out. Not only that, but it's a whole new world when you make something like that versus part by part, checking to see if things fit up as your gauge. There is a huge value to learning to work that way over winging it. No matter what I make now, I start with Fusion 360 plans, mostly because I sometimes don't see my own mistakes until it's too late. I enjoy this but I'm limited by my few years of doing this...learning what I can from whomever is willing (thanks @rock_breaker for all the emails explaining tirelessly) Youtube, forums etc.... but the best discipline at some point is just doing it.
I really want to do gears...never have. Quite honestly, I may never get up the nerves unless I'm forced to. Anyway, these sort of reasons are my motivation. I'd like it to be pretty complicated and pretty precision. Seriously, with all the people here (even if just the interested ones) and all the knowledge, what couldn't be made?? If I'm out $20, $30, $50.....so be it, but the experience is worth far more than that.
A Die filer? How many parts to that? Seems like its mostly a stand for a motor....no?
A steam engine?....ok, that's probably a bit closer to what I envision.
I will say...dividing head really appeals to me. I have one, so I don't need one, but I really don't know if that there really is that many parts to it. I wish I had the answers...I'm along for the ride.


----------



## ErichKeane

So I found this site linked here, and he has plans posted for a dividing head that we might use as inspiration: http://home.scarlet.be/mini-draaien-frezen/engels/project-07.html

It is all in metric, so we may wish to convert it (or use it as inspiration?), but it is a good starting point for those who know CAD.

Also, appear to be about 15-20 parts?  Seems about right as a couple (like the dividing plates) are repeats.


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

Maybe....if enough people are interested, we could have a couple projects? Seems like Die Filer has some momentum, oil cans had some interest and so did the dividing head. Maybe a list of whos in and what they are most into? Total up how many people/how many groups?
i.e >below< and everyone  just quote the thread and adds their name and interest? 
1) GunsOfNavarone Dividing Head


----------



## Doug Gray

GunsOfNavarone said:


> Maybe....if enough people are interested, we could have a couple projects? Seems like Die Filer has some momentum, oil cans had some interest and so did the dividing head. Maybe a list of whos in and what they are most into? Total up how many people/how many groups?
> i.e >below< and everyone  just quote the thread and adds their name and interest?
> 1) GunsOfNavarone Dividing Head


2) Joe065 (Doug Gray) I'd love to help with CAD work as needed


----------



## Braeden P

(3) I have a lathe with 0.0001 run out so I can make some precision parts and make round stuff


----------



## ErichKeane

(4) erichkeane  I have a big lathe, a surface grinder, and a huge shaper, so big and/or flat is my specialty   Up for any project, though the dividing head seems fun!


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

Braeden P said:


> (3) I have a lathe with 0.0001 run out so I can make some precision parts and make round stuff


Stop braggin' Braeden!


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

I was hoping something organized like this...

1) GunsOfNavarone 1st choice Dividing Head, 2nd Oil Can
2) Joe065 (Doug Gray) I'd love to help with CAD work as needed
3) I have a lathe with 0.0001 run out so I can make some precision parts and make round stuff
4) erichkeane I have a big lathe, a surface grinder, and a huge shaper, so big and/or flat is my specialty  Up for any project, though the dividing head seems fun!


----------



## Shotgun

(5) I have a Wrong-Fu round column mill, an Atlast 12x36, and the fixture and homemade hob to make the the worm gear.  

It's kind of backwards, but if we could work up a drawing around this gear, then I have the material on hand to make ten sets of gear, worm, and shaft.  I'd ship it to ten people that would commit to making a tenth of the parts of a dividing head, and shipping their parts to me.


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

Shotgun said:


> (5) I have a Wrong-Fu round column mill, an Atlast 12x36, and the fixture and homemade hob to make the the worm gear.
> 
> It's kind of backwards, but if we could work up a drawing around this gear, then I have the material on hand to make ten sets of gear, worm, and shaft.  I'd ship it to ten people that would commit to making a tenth of the parts of a dividing head, and shipping their parts to me.


No, not backwards....I think you're right on with that idea. I was assuming people would sign up for parts within their personal work envelope, but it may be to the point where they are given prints based on their available equipment. THOUGH I for one may have more equipment than I can work with 80% or more ability.


----------



## ttabbal

GunsOfNavarone said:


> I was hoping something organized like this...
> 
> 1) GunsOfNavarone 1st choice Dividing Head, 2nd Oil Can
> 2) Joe065 (Doug Gray) I'd love to help with CAD work as needed
> 3) I have a lathe with 0.0001 run out so I can make some precision parts and make round stuff
> 4) erichkeane I have a big lathe, a surface grinder, and a huge shaper, so big and/or flat is my specialty  Up for any project, though the dividing head seems fun!
> 5) ttabbal. PM1127 lathe and Bridgeport mill. I'm up for whatever. We have someone willing to provide us with the gears, so perhaps the dividing head is a good idea. It's one part I can't make at the moment.


----------



## Braeden P

GunsOfNavarone said:


> Stop braggin' Braeden!


I’m just stating the facts


----------



## rock_breaker

@Erichikeane, Joe065 and Shotgun seem to be on the same page.  The owner of the metric plans  gives individuals permission to use his plans, where do we stand as a group? Should we ask his permission to have @Joe065, and others convert them to imperial? His plans have something we need first, a bill of material. Rough count is 40 +/_ parts includes some duplicates. The plates with the indexing holes may be a real challenge.

I have a dividing head underway with a 40:1 worm gear supported on Timken bearings and some parts made so am reluctant to start over. I would be interested in making a small part if you run short of machinists however. 

It is horn blowing time! I also have some tools capable of working on a project of this nature. Not sure if the local salvage yard has anything but A36 in new stock. Next supplier is 140 miles round trip. 

Have a god day
Ray (rock breaker)


----------



## ErichKeane

rock_breaker said:


> @Erichikeane, Joe065 and Shotgun seem to be on the same page.  The owner of the metric plans  gives individuals permission to use his plans, where do we stand as a group? Should we ask his permission to have @Joe065, and others convert them to imperial? His plans have something we need first, a bill of material. Rough count is 40 +/_ parts includes some duplicates. The plates with the indexing holes may be a real challenge.
> 
> I have a dividing head underway with a 40:1 worm gear supported on Timken bearings and some parts made so am reluctant to start over. I would be interested in making a small part if you run short of machinists however.
> 
> It is horn blowing time! I also have some tools capable of working on a project of this nature. Not sure if the local salvage yard has anything but A36 in new stock. Next supplier is 140 miles round trip.
> 
> Have a god day
> Ray (rock breaker)


Dividing plates are actually not a problem.  Time consuming as all heck, but not a problem.  I already have a rotary table for my mill (plus a DRO!), so I could likely do it with either.  Presumably a number of others could as well.


----------



## finsruskw

Too late for another project suggestion??
I didn't think so....

How about a belt sander setup sans motor??
I could use one of those for sure and I'll bet a lot of others could as well.


----------



## Peyton Price 17

6  Braeden p´s brother. can use a lathe and some hand tools.


----------



## extropic

I've been following along. I don't want to participate in the fab process at this time, however I have a couple of ideas to throw into the pot.

My thinking is that all participants should end up with a complete device. Availability coordination and shipping of something as large as a BS 2 indexing head would be obnoxious, IMHO compared to buying one of your own. If the device is small enough to fit in a Priority Mail FRB, how hard could it be to make enough parts for each participant to end up with a complete unit?

Anyway, my project ideas are 1) a radius turner or 2) a quick retract threading device.

My thinking is that a single design (for each) is pretty easily adaptable to any lathe between, maybe, 9" to 13" at least. Maybe each participant makes their own adaptor.

I don't have plans to link to but there are many out there. Maybe a group collaboration on the design is in order. You already have a design/drawing volunteer.

Good luck all.


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

@extropic absolutely nothing is in stone yet...I like the retracting threading device, but I assume that is very little parts list?


----------



## extropic

GunsOfNavarone said:


> @extropic absolutely nothing is in stone yet...I like the retracting threading device, but I assume that is very little parts list?


I was thinking on the order of 20-30 parts for the retractor. I expect 1/3-1/2 would be COTS (Commercial Off The Shelf) parts.
The concept I like is using an over-center link to advance and lock the tool.
A very close linear guide is necessary which means, to me, hardening and grinding.
The cool feature is to incorporate a wedge, cam or solenoid to release the over-center link.
The release is activated by an adjustable stop attached to the lathe bed.
With those features you can OD thread very close to a flange (or specific length) without risk or a relief groove.
The CNC guys are ROTFLTAO by now.   

I've never seen a device as described but everything has been done, someplace, at sometime, by somebody.
AFAIK, it would require a non-trivial design effort.
It's on my personal bucket list.


----------



## Weldingrod1

We might want to do a test project first; something very simple with few parts where we can get our feet wet. The toolmakers clamp idea would work there. 

Great idea: clone my favorite clamp ever! No makers marks at all... I have two and wish I had more! A 0.500" OD tube runs in a 0.506" hole to give very quick, firm locking. The tube isnt super hard. The sliding bit seems a bit harder. If there's interest then drawings wouldn't be very hard. 6 or 7 parts plus a trip to someone's blacking/bluing tanks.

Tube
Fixed jaw
Sliding jaw
Knurled knob
Stud (1/4-20, could be integral with the knob, has a shoulder for the foot)
Clamp foot.
Lock screw for the fixed foot

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

@Weldingrod1 I'm not pooping on your parade, but like I said before I PERSONALLY would like to see it have a sizable amount of parts and tolerance so when all these random parts show up, are put together, we have a precision working model. There is so much room on the clamps, it'd be hard to not have it working one way or another....there is a lot of play in the design.
Maybe my sights are not realistic, I'm okay hearing that, but it excites me so much to think, This Old Tony, BlondiHacks, Abom79, Adam Savage and dozens more made a full size working replica of Apollo 11 hatch. From Plans and all over the country. There's got to be a realistic compromise?


----------



## Peyton Price 17

GunsOfNavarone said:


> @Weldingrod1 I'm not pooping on your parade, but like I said before I PERSONALLY would like to see it have a sizable amount of parts and tolerance so when all these random parts show up, are put together, we have a precision working model. There is so much room on the clamps, it'd be hard to not have it working one way or another....there is a lot of play in the design.
> Maybe my sights are not realistic, I'm okay hearing that, but it excites me so much to think, This Old Tony, BlondiHacks, Abom79, Adam Savage and dozens more made a full size working replica of Apollo 11 hatch. From Plans and all over the country. There's got to be a realistic compromise?


I like your idea but I think we start with a small project for proof of concept. like what Weldingrod1 said,


Weldingrod1 said:


> We might want to do a test project first; something very simple with few parts where we can get our feet wet. The toolmakers clamp idea would work there.
> 
> Great idea: clone my favorite clamp ever! No makers marks at all... I have two and wish I had more! A 0.500" OD tube runs in a 0.506" hole to give very quick, firm locking. The tube isnt super hard. The sliding bit seems a bit harder. If there's interest then drawings wouldn't be very hard. 6 or 7 parts plus a trip to someone's blacking/bluing tanks.


it could be done by a few people in 2 weeks tops. we could sort out any problems or issues about doing a project then go full scale with lots of parts. This reminds me of a school board meeting, they take for every to do something and it is said what to do multiple times. I think we should have a poll on what to make. I think to start small then go big.


----------



## Shotgun

The dividing head will probably take several months.  The clamp a couple weeks.

Compromise suggestion:  Do both.  The dividing head project can be modified to incorporate any lessons learned from the clamp.  I'll volunteer to participate in both.  

Follow the "make your part and ship to all participants" model?
Limit the group to 3 or 4 people to make working out the process easier?
Start a separate thread to track each project?  If it works well, get HM to setup a "Group Project" forum?

For the clamp, I'll have the ability to case harden parts in a month or so, right after I get my furnace built.  I've got all the parts, and now that I have the rotary engine rebuilt for the Dyke Delta, I'll have time to put it together.


----------



## rock_breaker

More good ideas!
Not sure I fully understand the full function of a retracting threading devise. What does ROTFLTAO mean? If it concerns "rolling on the floor laughing their best body part off " they need to tell us what button they use to choose one of 12 +/- projects not even on a list yet. Once a project is chosen, parts drawn and dimentioned (where is the spell checker?) there is no doubt in my mind about their ability to complete a project.
Would it be better to start with a small project with fewer parts sent to the participants in the build for their use?. In the event of more parts than participants those with less complicated parts would be asked to double up. Dimensions and tolerances are the first order.
At this point should the number of projects and a time limit be set?
Have a good day 
Ray (Rock Breaker)
PS @Shotgun added good ideas as I was working on my blog


----------



## Peyton Price 17

rock_breaker said:


> More good ideas!
> Not sure I fully understand the full function of a retracting threading devise. What does ROTFLTAO mean? If it concerns "rolling on the floor laughing their best body part off " they need to tell us what button they use to choose one of 12 +/- projects not even on a list yet. Once a project is chosen, parts drawn and dimentioned (where is the spell checker?) there is no doubt in my mind about their ability to complete a project.
> Would it be better to start with a small project with fewer parts sent to the participants in the build for their use?. In the event of more parts than participants those with less complicated parts would be asked to double up. Dimensions and tolerances are the first order.
> At this point should the number of projects and a time limit be set?
> Have a good day
> Ray (Rock Breaker)
> PS @Shotgun added good ideas as I was working on my blog


we should just have a poll soon to see what we want to make.


----------



## dudley.toolwright

Interesting idea.


----------



## Peyton Price 17

so far we have
1 die filler
2 toolmakers clamp
3 oil can
4 dividing head
5 belt sander setup motor
6 radius turner
7 quick retract threading device
8 floor jack

tell me if I missed one.


----------



## ErichKeane

There was the floor jack, but i don't think anyone really showed interest.


----------



## Peyton Price 17

ErichKeane said:


> There was the floor jack, but i don't think anyone really showed interest.


added it to the list.


----------



## Shotgun

Guys (and gals, as the case may be), we're running a strong chance of talking this thing to death at this point.

I'm going to start a separate thread to get the dividing head group build discussion started.  I'd like to thank GunsOfNavarone for getting this started, and hope many of you will join me in the new ProjectOfTheDay thread.


----------



## Peyton Price 17

I made a poll in the home machine shop discussion so go vote on what you want to see be made.


----------



## rock_breaker

@Shotgun is right about talking this thing to death. My interest is in coordinating the work of several people to make precision inter-changeable parts. We have listed our machines over and over and a willingness to make parts.
@Shotgun has started a long term project that he may need help with, dimensions and tolerances will probably be the subject of conversation. There have been several smaller projects listed which suggests two groups; 1) longterm projects [indexers etc.] and 2) short term projects, [clamps disk sanders, die grinders etc.]  A poll was suggested as acting coordinator I am asking for an email from the person that suggested the poll.
In the mean time I would like an email from people interested in the following subjects:
Drafting/CAD
Dimensions and/or tolerances (GD&T),
Metals knowledge/heat treating,
Machines and Skills
Gear Cutting
Type of project 1) Longterm 2)Shortterm3)Both

The time deadline is March 28. for sending emails, listing more than one topic on an email is desirable. The address is raypatt33@fone.net
Have a good day
Ray


----------



## extropic

Peyton Price 17 said:


> I made a poll in the home machine shop discussion so go vote on what you want to see be made.


I looked for your poll and didn't find it.
Please post a link.


----------



## Braeden P

Here’s  he looks link 








						What group project to make
					

read the thread first in the project of the day forum about a group project. I think after 14 pages we should decide because we are just beating a dead horse.




					www.hobby-machinist.com


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

I'm going dividing head (and really have since the get go) Is complicated, precision, many parts and expensive if you were to buy one. This in theory could be of very high quality...would feel good to complete.


----------



## ErichKeane

GunsOfNavarone said:


> I'm going dividing head (and really have since the get go) Is complicated, precision, many parts and expensive if you were to buy one. This in theory could be of very high quality...would feel good to complete.


I saw in the thread that they were thinking of only needing 5 people and seemed to have enough by the time I paid attention.

Id hoped it was more complicated than that


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

@Shotgun Did I get pushed out my own idea?


----------



## Shotgun

@GunsOfNavarone Nobody has put their name next to anything at this point other than myself, and I'm willing to get pushed out.  I was counting on ten people initially, but when I got to looking at the parts, it seemed 5 might be more appropriate.  I could be wrong.  10 people would make it so that each person is making a single part.  Worst case is that we could have two groups of 5 competing to see who makes the best units.

Jump on the thread and start throwing your opinion around. . . even if its wrong.  That's what I do.


----------



## Flyinfool

I am in a tight spot for this, I am still out of work due to covid so have no spare cash for material or shipping, But that also means I have time and desire to be involved. I can certainly help with design, tolerance and drawing, that is what I have been doing for the last 40+ years. I have both Inventor and Solidworks here at home. I would also love to partake in making parts as long as it can be made from stock I have on hand. This is why I am leaning toward the lower cost projects.


----------



## Shotgun

Flyinfool said:


> I am in a tight spot for this, I am still out of work due to covid so have no spare cash for material or shipping, But that also means I have time and desire to be involved. I can certainly help with design, tolerance and drawing, that is what I have been doing for the last 40+ years. I have both Inventor and Solidworks here at home. I would also love to partake in making parts as long as it can be made from stock I have on hand. This is why I am leaning toward the lower cost projects.


Join the thread.  I can turn the drawing over to you.


----------



## extropic

GunsOfNavarone said:


> @Shotgun Did I get pushed out my own idea?



You asked more than two days ago, but I haven't seen you show up on Shotgun's Dividing Head project thread.
I'm posting, below, a link to that thread to be sure you understood Shotgun's reply.

Group Project: Dividing Head


----------



## ErichKeane

Another plan for a future project that is perhaps smaller: a rotary broach!


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

Oddly, I have been both shopping for one and looking at YT videos of making one. Decent ones are EXPENSIVE, so that points to making one. Do you know if any plans out there to make one?


----------



## ErichKeane

GunsOfNavarone said:


> Oddly, I have been both shopping for one and looking at YT videos of making one. Decent ones are EXPENSIVE, so that points to making one. Do you know if any plans out there to make one?


Yeah, I found a really nice set of plans at one point that I was meaning to do one of these days but never came across a reason I needed one.

I'll have to look next time I get a chance! Nice part is that it was pretty simple, only like 3-4 non purchased parts (plus the broaches).


----------



## Brento

Id like to see the plans for it.


----------



## Flyinfool

I have sets of plans for at least 2 different versions somewhere. One is so simple it is not worth being a group project, it is 2 simple parts to make plus the actual cutters, one separate cutter for each size and shape of hole. This is true of all versions.

Maybe for a winter project. Best to start a new thread for that so this one does not get confused.


----------



## ErichKeane

Flyinfool said:


> I think I have a set of plans somewhere too.
> Maybe for a winter project. Best to start a new thread for that so this one does not get confused.


Of course! But I figured I'd post in the "organize a group project" thread to see what the interest is like.


----------



## Flyinfool

ErichKeane said:


> Of course! But I figured I'd post in the "organize a group project" thread to see what the interest is like.


OOpie, I was cornfused and thought I was in the other thread.


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

@ErichKeane I'm in is you go forward with this....


----------



## ErichKeane

GunsOfNavarone said:


> @ErichKeane I'm in is you go forward with this....



 I found the plans!  I'd liked this one at the time because it didn't seem particularly difficult (other than needing a good .875 reamer), and is pretty 'short' (which was useful at the time when I had a short Logan). It uses a grease-fitting instead of bearings which is an interesting choice, but keeps it 'small'.  Additionally, it still uses a standard 1/2" broach

It looks like it has 4 pieces (5 if you count the broach itself!), though one is a washer.  Purchased parts-list is pretty minimal as well, it looks like a grease fitting, a set screw, and a snap ring!.

Looking at the lower-left piece, I don't particularly get the point of the 10-32 threaded holes though... Unless there is something I'm missing there, it seems like they don't have much purpose.

I'd probably want to finish up my dividing head work, but we could start on the planning at least if we had ~4 people interested.  I have a surface grinder, so I could make a broach or two for everyone (if we could decide on a size we were all interested in ).  I see those rotary broaches are absurdly expensive...


----------



## GunsOfNavarone

Get a Thread started! Consider me #1 on your list!


----------



## ErichKeane

GunsOfNavarone said:


> Get a Thread started! Consider me #1 on your list!


Posted here: https://www.hobby-machinist.com/threads/group-project-rotary-broach-recruiting-members.93241/ (you're #2  ).


----------



## Shotgun

Brento said:


> Id like to see the plans for it.











						A Shop-Made Compact Rotary Broach
					

I’ve been looking at some shop-made rotary broaching tools for about a year, thinking that one could be very handy when a small internal feature is (occasionally) required. Finally I decided to make one and the result is shown below with the tool installed in a vertical mill.    Most shop-made...




					www.hobby-machinist.com


----------

