# What's wrong with people these days?   RANT



## woodchucker (Dec 17, 2021)

I took my dog out for a walk to the horse farm up the road.  It's about 75 acres and has a walking trail around it, and the next farm.
On my way there we are walking in the road, and a Harley slows down, about 2 feet from me and Rex he drops into low gear and opens the throttle full bore. My dog jumps, he is scared s*t less... It's loud, open pipes.  WTF.. I guess he thought it was funny. 

My wife is scheduled for a hair salon for tomorrow, she gets a text from her hair cutter.. Call me.  She calls, someone came in yesterday got a haircut and toward the end told them that she had covid.. just tested positive... NO MASK.. NO CONCERN... so today the salon is closed for disinfecting. She had a rapid test yesterday and today and is negative.. (means nothing because you may not show positive for a few days).. her cutter knows we had a grand kid this week, and knows we are going up to Ct  for the Christmas.. she at least has a brain, but the woman that had covid was so selfish to come in possibly infect everyone...  And NO MASK.. the mask protects people from your possible infection, not the other way around...

Anyway.. Many times these days I am left feeling there is no sense of decency, common courtesy, treat people like you would like to be treated..  People killing people at an alarming rate.. 

I should feel blessed right now, having a new grandchild... but what I feel is fear for what her life might be like if things continue to slip. It's like an old TV or movie where things have gotten so bad... escape from NY type...  maybe it wasn't sci fi or whatever.. it's almost here.


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## rabler (Dec 17, 2021)

woodchucker said:


> I took my dog out for a walk to the horse farm up the road.  It's about 75 acres and has a walking trail around it, and the next farm.
> On my way there we are walking in the road, and a Harley slows down, about 2 feet from me and Rex he drops into low gear and opens the throttle full bore. My dog jumps, he is scared s*t less... It's loud, open pipes.  WTF.. I guess he thought it was funny.
> 
> My wife is scheduled for a hair salon for tomorrow, she gets a text from her hair cutter.. Call me.  She calls, someone came in yesterday got a haircut and toward the end told them that she had covid.. just tested positive... NO MASK.. NO CONCERN... so today the salon is closed for disinfecting. She had a rapid test yesterday and today and is negative.. (means nothing because you may not show positive for a few days).. her cutter knows we had a grand kid this week, and knows we are going up to Ct  for the Christmas.. she at least has a brain, but the woman that had covid was so selfish to come in possibly infect everyone...  And NO MASK.. the mask protects people from your possible infection, not the other way around...
> ...


Neighbor's dog killed two of the kittens at our barn.  They're barn cats, not house pets, but we still try to socialize them enough that we can get them fixed before the next batch of kittens.  Went to discuss it with the neighbor, who cronically has loose dogs wondering around by our barns.  Try to be polite, not trying to antagonize, just point out that my wife gets quite upset.  The guy says the dog actually belongs to his daughter in law, who is in the hospital with recurring cancer.  Goes on to say his son married a real "b***h".  Sigh.

After that I did ask him if he'd seen the big pit bull mix that belongs the gal who occasionally feeds horses for us.  "Oh, the one missing an eye?".  Yeah, that one, you know how he lost that eye?  "No".  Sniffing one of the stallion a bit to intimately.  And then I mentioned the stray pig that had set up shop in our barnyard.  Yeah, the one I shot after animal services was to busy to come get it.  Just a nice neighborly way of pointing out that bad things happen.  No threats made.


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## davek181 (Dec 17, 2021)

I hate loud piped anything, not funny at all.  I think they should require straight pipes to be run straight up to the helmet so the rider can enjoy it better.

I don't know how it is where you are, but out here in the west the brain dead idiots think the neat thing to do is roll coal with their modified diesel trucks.  All the better if there are pedestrians or bicycle riders to foul with their soot clouds.

Common sense is not common for sure.


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## ChristianSilver (Dec 17, 2021)

It’s definitely got me thinking about the future of my 5 grandkids, youngest 3 and oldest 13z
I’m afraid to admit it but their quality of life and choices in life will be nothing like what we had.

Something has got give, lack of morals, Christian values and being a man of your word is lost.

Maybe the Lord will rescue us believers soon.
I’m ready..


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## matthewsx (Dec 17, 2021)

It's discouraging to me that many of the folks who say they want things to go back to the old ways seem to have forgotten that the old ways included common courtesy and respect for others.

John


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## rabler (Dec 17, 2021)

Someone gave me this t-shirt as a Christmas present at a party last weekend.  I think it fits this situation:


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## 682bear (Dec 17, 2021)

On my way home from work tuesday, I had a UPS delivery truck tailgate my for two miles... not more than 10 feet from my bumper. We were on a 4 lane divided highway, in the left lane. I couldn't speed up, there was a car in front of me. I couldn't merge right, there was a car beside me.

He was jerking the vehicle to the left and right... clearly very agitated. I decided the best thing to do was get out of his way and let him go on his way, but to do that, I HAD to slow down to let the car next to me get out of the way. I let off the gas... did not hit the brake... but as soon as the car in the right lane started getting ahead,the UPS driver jerked the truck into that lane, pulled up beside me... and merged into my lane, pushing me off the road!

He did this on purpose! I managed to avoid getting hit... just by luck...

I have a dashcam, so I have the incident on video, but the sherriffs dept wasn't even interested in seeing it.

I finally managed to get in touch with someone at UPS to file a complaint, but when they found out I had it on video, I got a definate feeling that they weren't happy about it, so I doubt anything was said or done to the idiot driver. I got the feeling that they are going to protect their fellow employees...

I feel that I was in a 'catch 22' situation, and that anything I did would have ended badly... 

What is wrong with people?

-Bear


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## mmcmdl (Dec 17, 2021)

I just read that my 3 Shelties are the third smartest dogs in the world . My brother said that makes them smarter than 90% of humans . Which I DO believe .


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## aliva (Dec 17, 2021)

woodchucker said:


> I took my dog out for a walk to the horse farm up the road.  It's about 75 acres and has a walking trail around it, and the next farm.
> On my way there we are walking in the road, and a Harley slows down, about 2 feet from me and Rex he drops into low gear and opens the throttle full bore. My dog jumps, he is scared s*t less... It's loud, open pipes.  WTF.. I guess he thought it was funny.
> 
> My wife is scheduled for a hair salon for tomorrow, she gets a text from her hair cutter.. Call me.  She calls, someone came in yesterday got a haircut and toward the end told them that she had covid.. just tested positive... NO MASK.. NO CONCERN... so today the salon is closed for disinfecting. She had a rapid test yesterday and today and is negative.. (means nothing because you may not show positive for a few days).. her cutter knows we had a grand kid this week, and knows we are going up to Ct  for the Christmas.. she at least has a brain, but the woman that had covid was so selfish to come in possibly infect everyone...  And NO MASK.. the mask protects people from your possible infection, not the other way around...
> ...


Concerning the hair salon customer with Covid. Here in the province of Ontario, health regulations demand that Salon customers must show 2 doses of  government approved  vaccine, ware approved masks while indoors before entry, along with name and address for contact tracing. If the salon fails to abide by the regulations, they me fined and or loose there operating license. There have been several restaurants that have lost their licences for violations.


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## FOMOGO (Dec 17, 2021)

Like I've been saying way to much lately, you can't fix stupid. In addition, you have all the political idiocy, combined with the pandemic stress pushing normally tolerable people over the edge into the nutso zone. Mike


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## extropic (Dec 17, 2021)

@woodchucker 

I don't consider the OP a RANT at all. It's just very rational comments on life today.

The only reply that I want to publish is that I think the hairdresser is negligent by not protecting her business better.
No mask = NO SERVICE and take everyone's temperature before they take a chair.

This COVID thing is going to be a long haul.


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## woodchucker (Dec 17, 2021)

extropic said:


> @woodchucker
> 
> I don't consider the OP a RANT at all. It's just very rational comments on life today.
> 
> ...


Right now masks are not mandatory. It's a personal responsibility. I don't blame the establishment, there are many people who would rather fight than put the mask on.  What I do blame is the customer that knowingly walked in, got their hair done, and then told them they had covid.
They wanted their hair done F everyone else. So now the salon closed for a day, hired a company to come in and clean.. (lost a day + paid out a day)... Not to mention possibly infecting anyone in that day.. I don't know if they closed immediately afterwards though, but I'll assume they did, so maybe a day and a half.  That person proclaiming it after knew exactly what they were doing...  These days its me  , me , me...
had she worn a mask she still would have been wrong, but at least lessened the possibility of spreading her virus.

Gotta get back to work, almost done with my quick adjuster... Got a late start today...


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## extropic (Dec 17, 2021)

woodchucker said:


> Right now masks are not mandatory. *It's a personal responsibility. *  snip>



How's that philosophy working out?


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## graham-xrf (Dec 17, 2021)

extropic said:


> How's that philosophy working out?


Here in UK masks are "not mandatory" ( though that situation might change again soon).
BUT
Businesses and homefolk are imposing their own terms, regardless. We are getting back to something like lockdown, even though there is no lockdown. Travel agents are reeling amid cancellations. Pubs, hotels, and everything in the hospitality sector is about cancellations. And folk are wearing masks - everywhere. This kind of self-policed situation has happened spontaneously. UK is back to being a runaway COVID hazard, despite having one of the fastest and most widely delivered vaccination efforts on the planet, and the people know it. The mask mandate is effectively there, despite there isn't an official one.

That nobody has any right to freely go around being a public health hazard because of some philosophy, is being imposed by the community without need for coercion from laws. Almost as a side-effect, I sense there is also steadily less tolerance for most other kinds of bad behavior.


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## Braeden P (Dec 17, 2021)

At school there’s kids walking out of class and not coming back then get mad when they get in trouble! Teachers should still be able to hit students, some really need a good beating. People getting COVID three time in one year then say that the shot doesn’t work because their friend said so! Where did common sense go?


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## addertooth (Dec 17, 2021)

I got my hair cut a couple months ago.  I had to remove my mask so they could do the cutting.  I could quite imagine with some masks, and hair cuts, keeping a mask entirely on would be well nigh impossible.  

As for the client being covid positive, that is another issue. 

I have a strange view on the current "panic variant of the week (Omicron)".   For most people the symptoms are much more mild than the Delta variant.   As far as I know, they haven't reported any Omicron Deaths; the deaths we are seeing are the Delta variant.  If Omicron confers immunity when caught, it could be the vehicle which gives antibodies for those not vaccinated.  For this reason, it is not an entirely bad thing.  

My employer mandated the vaccine to stay employed.   It seemed a bit draconian.  Now there are three injunctions/stays against the mandates in the USA.   Some of my co-workers (3) who got vaccinated (and had serious complications from the shot which required additional treatment), they all wished they had waited for the courts to do their thing.  No vaccine is without risks.


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## woodchucker (Dec 17, 2021)

Braeden P said:


> At school there’s kids walking out of class and not coming back then get mad when they get in trouble! Teachers should still be able to hit students, some really need a good beating. People getting COVID three time in one year then say that the shot doesn’t work because their friend said so! Where did common sense go?


not sure about the hitting. But grabbing a kid to take them to the principle yea.. I have seen both sides, where the kids are out of control, but I have also seen where the teacher is a jerk.

gotta go, dinner's ready...


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## 7milesup (Dec 17, 2021)

Braeden P said:


> At school there’s kids walking out of class and not coming back then get mad when they get in trouble! Teachers should still be able to hit students, some really need a good beating. People getting COVID three time in one year then say that the shot doesn’t work because their friend said so! Where did common sense go?


Yeah, teachers hitting kids = not good.  I grew up in the Era where that was ok.  Sometimes got hit just because.   There are a few teachers (and a school principle) that I would have enjoyed bringing their 'punishment full circle".


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## Braeden P (Dec 17, 2021)

Let me reword that

Being able to drag them to the office and a light whack to the knuckles if needed


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## Reddinr (Dec 17, 2021)

Fortunately, I think the jerks are in the minority.  They do make themselves known better than the rest of humanity and it is frustrating/maddening.

People are murdering people at an alarming rate.... BUT, it is better than it used to be 30 years ago.  In the USA, for example, it was about 9/1000000 in 1990 but now it is "only" 5/100000 people per year.  Roughly 4X the UK and 8X Netherlands and more than double Canada at the moment.  (source)

https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/USA/united-states/murder-homicide-rate

My hair-cutter has zero-tolerance for non-mask wearing.  As a result, I feel safer getting my hair cut.  They used a couple of small pieces of tape to keep the mask in place as they were snipping around the ears.


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## MrWhoopee (Dec 17, 2021)

My county in northern California is a stronghold of the "my body, my rights" mindset when it comes to masks, vaccines, mandates etc.  We are among the very highest in the state for cases of covid, deaths etc. With a population of 180,000, we've been averaging over 3 deaths per day for weeks now. You would think something that is killing 3 people per day would would be a headline, but the local TV news just posts the daily statistics with no further mention, then quickly moves on to cover more interesting (crime) stories. Because of statewide increases, the governor has reinstituted an indoor mask mandate. The county board of supervisors is going to ask the state for a waiver! I don't know why they even bother, local law enforcement refuses to enforce any covid related orders. I was in town today, fewer than 10% were wearing masks. Omicron is going to tear through this county like a wind-driven wildfire.


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## woodchucker (Dec 17, 2021)

Reddinr said:


> Fortunately, I think the jerks are in the minority.  They do make themselves known better than the rest of humanity and it is frustrating/maddening.
> 
> People are murdering people at an alarming rate.... BUT, it is better than it used to be 30 years ago.  In the USA, for example, it was about 9/1000000 in 1990 but now it is "only" 5/100000 people per year.  Roughly 4X the UK and 8X Netherlands and more than double Canada at the moment.  (source)
> 
> ...


maybe the minority, but people feel entitled. Have you seen the number of airline incidents.  I think it's a lot greater number than you might think.


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## extropic (Dec 17, 2021)

MrWhoopee said:


> <snip  I was in town today, fewer than 10% were wearing masks. Omicron is going to tear through this county like a wind-driven wildfire.



The good news is that it should spark up the estate sale action in your area after a while.   

Evolution is great!


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## jwmay (Dec 17, 2021)

Well to be honest guys, I'm real happy to read this thread. Not that it's all about me, of course. But in my neck of the woods, I've been openly mocked by strangers for wearing a mask.  I've been told it's made up.  I've been told it's no worse than the flu. Oh, and I also had covid.  It was remarkably worse than any flu. Although my buddy got it too, and he said it was more like a mild cold. No surprise there I guess. There are some really strong feelings about this topic. But it warms my heart to know that at least someone out there not related to me feels the same.
As for what's wrong with people.  The older I get, the less I worry about it. I just do my best, and hope that that's good enough for most people. I'm not worried about the future generations. They're different than my generation for sure. But they'll figure it out. They seem, to me, mostly bright, funny, and happy.  And they care about things we never knew needed caring about.  
There will always be jerks. I just try real hard not to be one. After all, I'm the only person I have any control over.


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## MrWhoopee (Dec 17, 2021)

extropic said:


> The good news is that it should spark up the estate sale action in your area after a while.
> 
> Evolution is great!


It's literally the people who don't believe proving that Darwin was right.


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## brino (Dec 17, 2021)

addertooth said:


> I have a strange view on the current "panic variant of the week (Omicron)". For most people the symptoms are much more mild than the Delta variant. As far as I know, they haven't reported any Omicron Deaths; the deaths we are seeing are the Delta variant. If Omicron confers immunity when caught, it could be the vehicle which gives antibodies for those not vaccinated. For this reason, it is not an entirely bad thing.



First, yes there have been confirmed omicron deaths.

The problem is that this new variant is so transmissible.
So even if it is less deadly (which has NOT been proven yet!) so many more people will get it that even with a reduced complication rate it will still overwhelm the hospital intensive care units (ICUs).

Also, rising infection rates will pull the entire healthcare industry into more over-work burden and "elective" surgical cancellations/delays.
Therefore (completely misnamed) "elective" surgeries like cancer removal and joint replacements will be delayed..... again.

My wife is already being asked to work on her long-planned and well earned vacation days next week at a pop-up booster vaccination clinic.
They are also trying to get her for January and February and she is NOT even on the medical side, but the financial/clerical at the hospital.
They want her to work after her regular 8 hour day shift..... and she likely will agree; she's the most selfless person I know!

I have been closely following Dr. Peter Juni the head of my provincial COVID-19 Science Advisory Table.
Here's a local radio interview from this week:
https://www.cbc.ca/listen/live-radi...ons-coming-soon-ontario-faces-potential-surge

To me, this guy is a rock-star!
....and that's coming from a guy that shuns ALL sports, entertainment or political "fandom".
His mathematical models and predictions have been spot-on for the last couple years.

Don't get me wrong; I sincerely hope that he's is very wrong this time.... but the evidence suggests otherwise.

Stay safe everyone!
Brian


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## addertooth (Dec 17, 2021)

Brino,
I had to look it up.  You are correct.  They have reported one Omicron-related death in the UK.  They gave no details on the person's underlying health condition.  But, to the letter of the wording, you are spot on.  I always try to admit any errors I put forward.


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## 7milesup (Dec 17, 2021)

jwmay said:


> Well to be honest guys, I'm real happy to read this thread. Not that it's all about me, of course. But in my neck of the woods, I've been openly mocked by strangers for wearing a mask.  I've been told it's made up.  I've been told it's no worse than the flu. Oh, and I also had covid.  It was remarkably worse than any flu. Although my buddy got it too, and he said it was more like a mild cold. No surprise there I guess. There are some really strong feelings about this topic. But it warms my heart to know that at least someone out there not related to me feels the same.
> As for what's wrong with people.  The older I get, the less I worry about it. I just do my best, and hope that that's good enough for most people. I'm not worried about the future generations. They're different than my generation for sure. But they'll figure it out. They seem, to me, mostly bright, funny, and happy.  And they care about things we never knew needed caring about.
> There will always be jerks. I just try real hard not to be one. After all, I'm the only person I have any control over.


Very well said.  
Just as a day brightener for you, there are a lot of us here that believe in the science of vaccines and the benefit for the greater good.  The problem is we are not very vocal about it like the "other" side is.  The current hypocrisy is astounding.  Ya know.. Lets outlaw abortion but don't you dare tell me to wear a mask.  SMH.


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## benmychree (Dec 17, 2021)

davek181 said:


> I hate loud piped anything, not funny at all.  I think they should require straight pipes to be run straight up to the helmet so the rider can enjoy it better.
> 
> I don't know how it is where you are, but out here in the west the brain dead idiots think the neat thing to do is roll coal with their modified diesel trucks.  All the better if there are pedestrians or bicycle riders to foul with their soot clouds.
> 
> Common sense is not common for sure.


The coal dudes are 8in for a big wake up in Ca. smog inspections are going into their vehicle computers and if they have made mods to them to the detriment of rules, they go straight to the smog referees for corrective action, likely to cost them$.


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## benmychree (Dec 17, 2021)

Article in our paper today that correlates education levels in Ca counties with infection rates and vaccination rates; the conclusion is that as others have observed; you can't fix stupid.  'Nuff said.


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## Reddinr (Dec 17, 2021)

> It's literally the people who don't believe proving that Darwin was right.



It only works though if the darwin award folks have not reproduced yet.  Ok.  Probably enough out of me.   You all be safe now.  Good night.


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## erikmannie (Dec 18, 2021)

682bear said:


> On my way home from work tuesday, I had a UPS delivery truck tailgate my for two miles... not more than 10 feet from my bumper. We were on a 4 lane divided highway, in the left lane. I couldn't speed up, there was a car in front of me. I couldn't merge right, there was a car beside me.
> 
> He was jerking the vehicle to the left and right... clearly very agitated. I decided the best thing to do was get out of his way and let him go on his way, but to do that, I HAD to slow down to let the car next to me get out of the way. I let off the gas... did not hit the brake... but as soon as the car in the right lane started getting ahead,the UPS driver jerked the truck into that lane, pulled up beside me... and merged into my lane, pushing me off the road!
> 
> ...



I have worked as a UPS driver for 27 years. I apologize for this jerk. 

I wish you would make a few copies of that video, put the copies on some cheap USB flash drives, and take it down to the center that this driver works out of. Hand the flash drives to a few full-time *supervisors* (not hourlies).

If this happened at my center, the driver would get in a tremendous amount of trouble, and he would be very lucky to keep his job. If it were up to me, I would fire him on the spot.

I have the opposite experience. I have a 90 minute drive back to my center from my route, and I get tailgated about half the time on this long drive. I just disregard it, and continue to drive safely. 

I really hate tailgaters! Why don’t they just leave earlier so that they can drive defensively?!


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## jwmay (Dec 18, 2021)

Jubil said:


> Some of us are just too stupid to know we are hypocritical or is it that we are too hypocritical to know we are stupid.
> I thought this forum was about not being offensive to others.


You would be right saying it either way Chuck. I apologize if I offended you. Your opinions may not be the same as some on this thread, and I do know how uncomfortable that can be. I think it's very important that our forum not get ugly about it. Ive just been beat up for so long on that topic. It's good to hear someone agree sometimes too. I apologize and I won't bring it up again.


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## Jubil (Dec 18, 2021)

jwmay said:


> You would be right saying it either way Chuck. I apologize if I offended you. Your opinions may not be the same as some on this thread, and I do know how uncomfortable that can be. I think it's very important that our forum not get ugly about it. Ive just been beat up for so long on that topic. It's good to hear someone agree sometimes too. I apologize and I won't bring it up again.


No. Your post is not offensive to me. And I can relate to what you are saying. 
Chuck


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## Jubil (Dec 18, 2021)

I apologize to everyone. I was overreacting. Sometimes I take things too personal.
Chuck


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## Winegrower (Dec 18, 2021)

Covid became very real to me in August when my younger brother died from the virus.   It was ugly, two weeks in the hospital, ventilator, etc.   While I took every precaution with shots, vitamins, masks, he ignored all that and was a strong  enthusiastic watcher of Fox news and their pundits.   Don’t see how I can ever get over this.


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## higgite (Dec 18, 2021)

I’ve watched this thread steadily morph into a perfect illustration of the OP’s original rant. Jerks sometimes show up where you least expect them. 

But, thankfully, I have a foolproof method to easily identify them. They don’t agree with my opinion nor watch the same news channel that I do. 

Just MHO. Feel free to disagree. I won't be offended. 

Tom


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## Reddinr (Dec 18, 2021)

My apology too if I offended anyone.  This is a hot-button issue with me.  I also lost a family member and a friend to Covid, needlessly.  However, this is the wrong forum and the wrong people to vent my frustration on.  Hobby-machinist is too nice a place to mess up with my snarky comment above.  I stand by my opinions though.


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## Winegrower (Dec 18, 2021)

I also apologize, I don’t mean to politicize what should be simple valid information and logic.  I suppose even saying this could be offensive to some, so I will offer the standard “I apologize to anyone who may have been offended by my comments”.


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## addertooth (Dec 18, 2021)

I think most rational people are not truly made upset by debates about science.

Some things are a "religion" and are closed to any meaningful debate.
An example would be to ask a Christian or a person of Islamic faith "who God is".
Both may argue to the bitter end, and neither are likely to move from their position.

Science on the other hand, is meant to be debated.  It is the only way it grows.
Once you reach the point where it can no longer be debated, a view has ceased being science, and is now a religion.

There is no argument from either side, that Covid has killed many people.  And those deaths have touched many
people who knew the casualties of Covid in a deeply meaningful way.  Strong feelings from many would be the
expected outcome.

I do get a bit concerned when I hear the words "settled science" coming out of the mouths of people who cannot
tell me the interaction of the following words with Covid:
ACE2 Receptor, CRISPR, mRNA sequence insertion, Reverse Transcriptase, Cytokine storm, Myocarditis, Endocarditis, and Vaccine.
It leads me to believe their scientific opinion is largely based upon what their favorite news pundit fed them.  
Their beliefs are also adjusted based upon what personal impact they have experienced (good and bad).

Still, the majority of views on this are very personal to people, and as such, agreement will always be difficult.


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## Cadillac (Dec 18, 2021)

“What’s wrong with people these days”? the loss of God and Family in their lives! Which in return gives you morals and values. As for Covid it sure is a train ride. Interesting how the Amish communities handled it and the outcome. Be safe Out there.


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## Ulma Doctor (Dec 18, 2021)

682bear said:


> On my way home from work tuesday, I had a UPS delivery truck tailgate my for two miles... not more than 10 feet from my bumper. We were on a 4 lane divided highway, in the left lane. I couldn't speed up, there was a car in front of me. I couldn't merge right, there was a car beside me.
> 
> He was jerking the vehicle to the left and right... clearly very agitated. I decided the best thing to do was get out of his way and let him go on his way, but to do that, I HAD to slow down to let the car next to me get out of the way. I let off the gas... did not hit the brake... but as soon as the car in the right lane started getting ahead,the UPS driver jerked the truck into that lane, pulled up beside me... and merged into my lane, pushing me off the road!
> 
> ...


post the video on youtube, facebook,twitter, and any other platform you can think of- UPS won't be able to deny the existence of the tape


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## rabler (Dec 18, 2021)

My grandfather was a machinist, 9th grade education.  Wasn't the oldest so he wouldn't inherit the farm.  My father is a retired M.D.  They lived on opposite sides of the political fence.  Thing is they could argue, discuss, and respect each others opinions even if they didn't agree.  And at the end of the day happily drink a beer and play a hand of cards together.  I remember many family get togethers like that.

I think there is a huge difference between a difference of opinion, and being offensive.  Unfortunately, in a short answer to @woodchucker's posed question "What is wrong with people these days?", I think a big issue these days is people have forgotten how to get along even if they disagree with your opinions.  Several people here have shown the ability to apologize for offending, and still maintain a discussion.  I wish all the forums I participated in had such manners.

I wish I'd inherited more of that trait.  Even my father, who is now in his 80's, says I don't tolerate fools.  He says it with a bit of good nature humor and respect, but I'd be happy to outgrow that.


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## mmcmdl (Dec 18, 2021)

Sorry to hear about all these problems all over this world , luckily we had a slow night here in Maryland .   








						15 people shot around Baltimore City Friday
					

It was an extremely violent Friday in Baltimore City, with 15 people shot around the city - two fatally - before the night was even over. After a quadruple shooting and a triple shooting around noon, another five people were reported shot in Penn-North at 7:49 p. m. The quintuple shooting...




					foxbaltimore.com


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## Suzuki4evr (Dec 18, 2021)

Braeden P said:


> At school there’s kids walking out of class and not coming back then get mad when they get in trouble! Teachers should still be able to hit students, some really need a good beating. People getting COVID three time in one year then say that the shot doesn’t work because their friend said so! Where did common sense go?


I like the way you think.


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## Suzuki4evr (Dec 18, 2021)

For me that hair salon customer is vary close to borderline manslaughter....my 2 cents,I'm by NO means a law expert.

I am a biker,but sadly not riding anymore, but that guy with the Harley is an a$$. I love animals more than Harleys,I am a Superbike guy.


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## woodchucker (Dec 18, 2021)

Suzuki4evr said:


> For me that hair salon customer is vary close to borderline manslaughter....my 2 cents,I'm by NO means a law expert.
> 
> I am a biker,but sadly not riding anymore, but that guy with the Harley is an a$$. I love animals more than Harleys,I am a Superbike guy.


I was a biker in my early days. From 78 to maybe 84, I didn't have a car, rode my bike every day, snow, sleet, rain, even in a hurricane (legs spread wide because the bike was heavily leaning at times)  So I am used to the loud noise of Hogs.  I preferred the higher pitch bikes, but I rode down to Florida with 2 open pipe bikes... As long as I was out in front it was ok.. just ok, but if they took the lead it was mind numbing..

But I like animals over my bike too.  I would never do something like that also because you don't know how it will go... a consistent sound they are less likely to bolt, but to do what the guy did was dangerous to all of us.


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## Illinoyance (Dec 18, 2021)

Just assume that people in general are self centered assholes.


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## eugene13 (Dec 18, 2021)

It seems that the entire human race has forgotten the word compromise.


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## addertooth (Dec 18, 2021)

eugene13 said:


> It seems that the entire human race has forgotten the word compromise.


Compromise always starts with the assumption there is a reasonable middle ground.
It assumes that neither party is "unreasonable" (cannot be reasoned with).  

When I was in Iraq, they "other guys" wanted my head removed from my body.
I wished for it to remain in place.   Because the other side was so unreasonable, and there
 was no reasonable middle-ground, compromise was not an option.  In cases like this, 
only one side can prevail. 

Compromise is only possible, when an option, which is in the middle, is disliked, but acceptable to both sides.
Sometimes, one side is so excessive, and so unreasonable, that compromise is not a viable option. 
I would not have accepted the removal of half my head to meet them in the middle.  A judge friend of mine once said the best 
court compromise has been met, when both sides walk away hating the agreement, and as life-long enemies. 

Thankfully, circumstances like I described are usually uncommon.


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## jwmay (Dec 18, 2021)

Illinoyance said:


> Just assume that people in general are self centered assholes.


I think... and could be wrong...that it  is better to think that everyone has their own perspectives, their own priorities, and their own worries.  Perhaps the aggressive tailgater has a relative in the hospital. Maybe that guy laying on the gas at exactly the wrong moment is just learning to ride. It might be that the rude guy in line at Wal Mart just had his wife leave him, or just found out his kids in jail. I don't know. There are certainly scenarios where I've been a jerk without even realizing it. I had something else on my mind! So thinking this way does tend to help me not hate my fellow man. And it gives me hope that someone might be patient with me in my own moment of absentminded disregard for others. 
But true, some people are generally unpleasant. You can't win them all. Lol


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## Braeden P (Dec 18, 2021)

“Everyone is entitled to their own opinions but not their own facts.”


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## Ken from ontario (Dec 18, 2021)

jwmay said:


> I think... and could be wrong...that it  is better to think that everyone has their own perspectives, their own priorities, and their own worries.  Perhaps the aggressive tailgater has a relative in the hospital. Maybe that guy laying on the gas at exactly the wrong moment is just learning to ride. It might be that the rude guy in line at Wal Mart just had his wife leave him, or just found out his kids in jail. I don't know. There are certainly scenarios where I've been a jerk without even realizing it. I had something else on my mind! So thinking this way does tend to help me not hate my fellow man. And it gives me hope that someone might be patient with me in my own moment of absentminded disregard for others.
> *But true, some people are generally unpleasant. You can't win them all.* Lol


I knw a couple of those who are "generally unpleasant", for all we know they might have unresolved issues that stayed with them for years, I know one person in particular who is always angry, and has a short fuse also, we all tiptoe around him.


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## Suzuki4evr (Dec 19, 2021)

jwmay said:


> I think... and could be wrong...that it  is better to think that everyone has their own perspectives, their own priorities, and their own worries.  Perhaps the aggressive tailgater has a relative in the hospital. Maybe that guy laying on the gas at exactly the wrong moment is just learning to ride. It might be that the rude guy in line at Wal Mart just had his wife leave him, or just found out his kids in jail. I don't know. There are certainly scenarios where I've been a jerk without even realizing it. I had something else on my mind! So thinking this way does tend to help me not hate my fellow man. And it gives me hope that someone might be patient with me in my own moment of absentminded disregard for others.
> But true, some people are generally unpleasant. You can't win them all. Lol


You made a very good point and I do agree with you,but some people are just ugh......well don't give a......well you know what I mean attatude.


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## vtcnc (Dec 19, 2021)

davek181 said:


> I don't know how it is where you are, but out here in the west the brain dead idiots think the neat thing to do is roll coal with their modified diesel trucks.  All the better if there are pedestrians or bicycle riders to foul with their soot cloud.


I'm not sure if the walking dead went west to east or east to west but they are everywhere. Our town recently put an ordinance in effect specifically targeting rollers of the coal.


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## davek181 (Dec 19, 2021)

Our town also has an excessive smoke ordinance, and excessive noise too.  According to the cops I know they rarely write tickets because the cases keep getting thrown out of court.  If the offender goes before the judge and the ticketing officer is not there with video to prove the allegation it gets dismissed.  

Don't get me wrong, I do like modifying cars and motorcycles.  i ride a dual sport motorcycle with a super trapp muffler that is not silent, but a straight piped harley near me will completely drown out my bike.  It even takes away the engine vibrations you feel on your bike and I have to shift with the tach as I can't tell otherwise.

I also drive a modified VW diesel, but you will not ever see a wisp of smoke out of it.  If tuned properly you will not see smoke once the turbo kicks in.  The truck crowd thinks smoke is power, little do they know it is unburned fuel.  My car driving all week produces less pollution than one idiot in a Dodge pickup pulling a  steep hill in town.


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## Suzuki4evr (Dec 19, 2021)

vtcnc said:


> I'm not sure if the walking dead went west to east or east to west but they are everywhere.


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## vtcnc (Dec 19, 2021)

erikmannie said:


> I have worked as a UPS driver for 27 years. I apologize for this jerk.
> 
> I wish you would make a few copies of that video, put the copies on some cheap USB flash drives, and take it down to the center that this driver works out of. Hand the flash drives to a few full-time *supervisors* (not hourlies).
> 
> ...


Put it on reddit.... r/dashcam or r/idiotsincars

Let the UPS folks that didn't respond know that is where it is going...you will get a response.


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## Jubil (Dec 19, 2021)

jwmay said:


> I think... and could be wrong...that it  is better to think that everyone has their own perspectives, their own priorities, and their own worries.  Perhaps the aggressive tailgater has a relative in the hospital. Maybe that guy laying on the gas at exactly the wrong moment is just learning to ride. It might be that the rude guy in line at Wal Mart just had his wife leave him, or just found out his kids in jail. I don't know. There are certainly scenarios where I've been a jerk without even realizing it. I had something else on my mind! So thinking this way does tend to help me not hate my fellow man. And it gives me hope that someone might be patient with me in my own moment of absentminded disregard for others.
> But true, some people are generally unpleasant. You can't win them all. Lol


I wish I had said that! 
My wife tells me all the time: “when you see someone in Walmart or elsewhere, you never know what they are going through.”

Chuck


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## Dabbler (Dec 19, 2021)

I think it is time to try to calm this thread down a little.  At times some of the points have been expressed very strongly, and it has lead to a number of posts being taken down, some apologies, etc.

Please, please, in the spirit of the season, treat each other on the forum with dignity and be kind.  There has already been calls to lock this discussion, but there seems to be good that is coming of it also.  If it gets out of hand again one of the mods is sure to lock it right away.


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## jwmay (Dec 19, 2021)

I remember a couple years back, my wife and I made a habit of walking at the park in the evenings. Some kid with a diesel had great fun circling the park making noxious clouds of black smoke loudly for us to breathe.  Eventually he got over that habit, and I got rid of that awful walking habit too.


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## savarin (Dec 19, 2021)

Choose any paradigm you want to judge any group/population etc, place them on the bell curve,
realise half the target fall on the negative side of the curve.
I rest my case.


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## woodchucker (Dec 19, 2021)

savarin said:


> Choose any paradigm you want to judge any group/population etc, place them on the bell curve,
> realise half the target fall on the negative side of the curve.
> I rest my case.


you do realize that the bell curve is moving based on the people, so if more people are jerks, then some of the jerks fall on the positive end.
It works both ways.. 


are you an optimist or pessimist? Doesn't really matter we have no say in it.


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## jwmay (Dec 19, 2021)

I always liked hearing about the research on personal evaluations. Something like 95% of us believe ourselves to be above average. But then of course that's a statistical impossibility. Lol. We all do the best we can. 
And of course, here between us, I'm sure at least 95 % of you are above average. But I'm sticking around to represent the under privileged  5 %!


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## Janderso (Dec 20, 2021)

Braeden P said:


> Let me reword that
> 
> Being able to drag them to the office and a light whack to the knuckles if needed


Many of us are probably old enough to remember the device the principal used to swat us on the bum.
I don’t think Mr. Winterstein enjoyed it, I know I didn’t.
I didn’t flush any more apples down the toilets.


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## Braeden P (Dec 20, 2021)

Janderso said:


> I didn’t flush any more apples down the toilets.


never heard of that before! sounds like fun...


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## Scra99tch (Dec 20, 2021)

jwmay said:


> I remember a couple years back, my wife and I made a habit of walking at the park in the evenings. Some kid with a diesel had great fun circling the park making noxious clouds of black smoke loudly for us to breathe.  Eventually he got over that habit, and I got rid of that awful walking habit too.


I would hope a can of 5$ spray foam in the smoke stack would work in this case.


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## davek181 (Dec 20, 2021)

I thought the exact same thing, just didn't say that, so as not to seem to harsh.


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## davek181 (Dec 20, 2021)

I draw the line there.  I like dogs better than some people I have met.


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## savarin (Dec 20, 2021)

that would not be hard


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## woodchucker (Dec 17, 2021)

I took my dog out for a walk to the horse farm up the road.  It's about 75 acres and has a walking trail around it, and the next farm.
On my way there we are walking in the road, and a Harley slows down, about 2 feet from me and Rex he drops into low gear and opens the throttle full bore. My dog jumps, he is scared s*t less... It's loud, open pipes.  WTF.. I guess he thought it was funny. 

My wife is scheduled for a hair salon for tomorrow, she gets a text from her hair cutter.. Call me.  She calls, someone came in yesterday got a haircut and toward the end told them that she had covid.. just tested positive... NO MASK.. NO CONCERN... so today the salon is closed for disinfecting. She had a rapid test yesterday and today and is negative.. (means nothing because you may not show positive for a few days).. her cutter knows we had a grand kid this week, and knows we are going up to Ct  for the Christmas.. she at least has a brain, but the woman that had covid was so selfish to come in possibly infect everyone...  And NO MASK.. the mask protects people from your possible infection, not the other way around...

Anyway.. Many times these days I am left feeling there is no sense of decency, common courtesy, treat people like you would like to be treated..  People killing people at an alarming rate.. 

I should feel blessed right now, having a new grandchild... but what I feel is fear for what her life might be like if things continue to slip. It's like an old TV or movie where things have gotten so bad... escape from NY type...  maybe it wasn't sci fi or whatever.. it's almost here.


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## rabler (Dec 17, 2021)

woodchucker said:


> I took my dog out for a walk to the horse farm up the road.  It's about 75 acres and has a walking trail around it, and the next farm.
> On my way there we are walking in the road, and a Harley slows down, about 2 feet from me and Rex he drops into low gear and opens the throttle full bore. My dog jumps, he is scared s*t less... It's loud, open pipes.  WTF.. I guess he thought it was funny.
> 
> My wife is scheduled for a hair salon for tomorrow, she gets a text from her hair cutter.. Call me.  She calls, someone came in yesterday got a haircut and toward the end told them that she had covid.. just tested positive... NO MASK.. NO CONCERN... so today the salon is closed for disinfecting. She had a rapid test yesterday and today and is negative.. (means nothing because you may not show positive for a few days).. her cutter knows we had a grand kid this week, and knows we are going up to Ct  for the Christmas.. she at least has a brain, but the woman that had covid was so selfish to come in possibly infect everyone...  And NO MASK.. the mask protects people from your possible infection, not the other way around...
> ...


Neighbor's dog killed two of the kittens at our barn.  They're barn cats, not house pets, but we still try to socialize them enough that we can get them fixed before the next batch of kittens.  Went to discuss it with the neighbor, who cronically has loose dogs wondering around by our barns.  Try to be polite, not trying to antagonize, just point out that my wife gets quite upset.  The guy says the dog actually belongs to his daughter in law, who is in the hospital with recurring cancer.  Goes on to say his son married a real "b***h".  Sigh.

After that I did ask him if he'd seen the big pit bull mix that belongs the gal who occasionally feeds horses for us.  "Oh, the one missing an eye?".  Yeah, that one, you know how he lost that eye?  "No".  Sniffing one of the stallion a bit to intimately.  And then I mentioned the stray pig that had set up shop in our barnyard.  Yeah, the one I shot after animal services was to busy to come get it.  Just a nice neighborly way of pointing out that bad things happen.  No threats made.


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## davek181 (Dec 17, 2021)

I hate loud piped anything, not funny at all.  I think they should require straight pipes to be run straight up to the helmet so the rider can enjoy it better.

I don't know how it is where you are, but out here in the west the brain dead idiots think the neat thing to do is roll coal with their modified diesel trucks.  All the better if there are pedestrians or bicycle riders to foul with their soot clouds.

Common sense is not common for sure.


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## ChristianSilver (Dec 17, 2021)

It’s definitely got me thinking about the future of my 5 grandkids, youngest 3 and oldest 13z
I’m afraid to admit it but their quality of life and choices in life will be nothing like what we had.

Something has got give, lack of morals, Christian values and being a man of your word is lost.

Maybe the Lord will rescue us believers soon.
I’m ready..


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## matthewsx (Dec 17, 2021)

It's discouraging to me that many of the folks who say they want things to go back to the old ways seem to have forgotten that the old ways included common courtesy and respect for others.

John


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## rabler (Dec 17, 2021)

Someone gave me this t-shirt as a Christmas present at a party last weekend.  I think it fits this situation:


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## 682bear (Dec 17, 2021)

On my way home from work tuesday, I had a UPS delivery truck tailgate my for two miles... not more than 10 feet from my bumper. We were on a 4 lane divided highway, in the left lane. I couldn't speed up, there was a car in front of me. I couldn't merge right, there was a car beside me.

He was jerking the vehicle to the left and right... clearly very agitated. I decided the best thing to do was get out of his way and let him go on his way, but to do that, I HAD to slow down to let the car next to me get out of the way. I let off the gas... did not hit the brake... but as soon as the car in the right lane started getting ahead,the UPS driver jerked the truck into that lane, pulled up beside me... and merged into my lane, pushing me off the road!

He did this on purpose! I managed to avoid getting hit... just by luck...

I have a dashcam, so I have the incident on video, but the sherriffs dept wasn't even interested in seeing it.

I finally managed to get in touch with someone at UPS to file a complaint, but when they found out I had it on video, I got a definate feeling that they weren't happy about it, so I doubt anything was said or done to the idiot driver. I got the feeling that they are going to protect their fellow employees...

I feel that I was in a 'catch 22' situation, and that anything I did would have ended badly... 

What is wrong with people?

-Bear


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## mmcmdl (Dec 17, 2021)

I just read that my 3 Shelties are the third smartest dogs in the world . My brother said that makes them smarter than 90% of humans . Which I DO believe .


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## aliva (Dec 17, 2021)

woodchucker said:


> I took my dog out for a walk to the horse farm up the road.  It's about 75 acres and has a walking trail around it, and the next farm.
> On my way there we are walking in the road, and a Harley slows down, about 2 feet from me and Rex he drops into low gear and opens the throttle full bore. My dog jumps, he is scared s*t less... It's loud, open pipes.  WTF.. I guess he thought it was funny.
> 
> My wife is scheduled for a hair salon for tomorrow, she gets a text from her hair cutter.. Call me.  She calls, someone came in yesterday got a haircut and toward the end told them that she had covid.. just tested positive... NO MASK.. NO CONCERN... so today the salon is closed for disinfecting. She had a rapid test yesterday and today and is negative.. (means nothing because you may not show positive for a few days).. her cutter knows we had a grand kid this week, and knows we are going up to Ct  for the Christmas.. she at least has a brain, but the woman that had covid was so selfish to come in possibly infect everyone...  And NO MASK.. the mask protects people from your possible infection, not the other way around...
> ...


Concerning the hair salon customer with Covid. Here in the province of Ontario, health regulations demand that Salon customers must show 2 doses of  government approved  vaccine, ware approved masks while indoors before entry, along with name and address for contact tracing. If the salon fails to abide by the regulations, they me fined and or loose there operating license. There have been several restaurants that have lost their licences for violations.


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## FOMOGO (Dec 17, 2021)

Like I've been saying way to much lately, you can't fix stupid. In addition, you have all the political idiocy, combined with the pandemic stress pushing normally tolerable people over the edge into the nutso zone. Mike


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