# Totally O.T  Need wood workers advice



## 8ntsane (Jul 6, 2012)

Hello everyone

I have been building a new front deck for the last while. The materials are pressure treated lumber. Now, let me say this. Ive never been a wood worker, claimed to be, or played one on TV. When it comes to this stuff, I am a Newbie.

This deck was my first project built out of wood. It has turned out fine, but I have a few questions if you dont mind. Since the project has been started, I have the neighbours in the area stopping by regular to chat, and see the progress. This leads to my questions.

Ive heard from more than a few, that being I used pressure treated lumber, I cant water proof, or stain this deck for atleast 1-yr. I dont understand why , and havnt got a reasonable explanation for it either.

So, whats the real deal with this stuff? I would like to water proof this thing with a product like thompsons water seal, and also would like to stain it as well. But wait a year, really?
I have noticed when it rains, this wood sucks up water like a sponge, and the water seems to make the wood constantly move around some. Maybe its just wood, but somthing Im not used to at all.

Building this deck has taught me some hard lessons for sure. Like buy your lumber, and get it screwed down asap, or it will start warping, big time. Ive also noticed the posts, have cracks growing. This leads to another question. Is wood filler ok to use on pressure treated lumber? And filling the cracks, is it effective in helping keep the water from entering?

Those are a few questions for now. This wood working is crazyness. I never knew this stuff had so many quirks to it. The stuff expands, and shrinks, it cracks, and people are telling me not to seal, or stain it for a year, WTF?

Im hoping some of the experianced wood wookers can answer some of my questions.

TIA


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## xalky (Jul 6, 2012)

The only good thing about pressure treated is that it doesn't rot. Other than that _it's basically crap._ It's southern yellow pine, which is just the nastiest twistiest splitinest lumber I've ever seen. I'm a remodeler, That's how I've made a living for the past 25 yrs. There is a product that can be applied on pressure treated immediately,...i believe its made by FLOOD, but not positive.

What a lot of people do is frame the deck with pressure treated and use a different material for decking and railings to hide the ugliness of the PT. Its a lot more expensive to do it like that.

You could use putty to fill the cracks....it may or may not hold up. There's nothing you can do about the twisting except to make sure it's fastened really well, but even that only helps a little.

Sorry about the bad news. Ask any carpenter, he'll tell you the same.

Marcel


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## DMS (Jul 6, 2012)

I've never heard of anyone using PT wood for the surface of the deck, only the support members and things that come in contact with soil. I haven't worked with PT much myself, but if the wood is still "green", that may be a reason to wait (was the sawdust damp?). I don't know about a whole year, for the deck surface, you may give it a month in the summer heat.


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## Gary Max (Jul 6, 2012)

thompsons water seal------------ I would never use that product.
Unless you are wanting to make it a full time job refinishing and resanding the deck every year.
If you really want to change the appearance, use a oil base stain and thin it down with Mineral sprits.
This will help it soak into the wood.
That's about the only thing I know of that stands a chance of holding up on PT wood.
Hot and dry when you apply will help.


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## Toolslinger (Jul 6, 2012)

Keep in mind wood will keep changing it's moisture content forever.  When it does so, it changes dimension.  In general you can ignore the change in length, but the width and thickness can be a real pain. Obviously paint can help slow that way down, but it never completely stops it.

Frequently PT comes in so full of moisture it will spit at you every time you put a nail in it.  I'd suspect that would be where the 1 year time period comes from.  Once it settles in to whatever warped shape it decides to take, it will typically stay there apart from the swelling/shrinkage that comes with seasonal moisture changes.  

If you nailed the deck boards down, you can plan to go back in with screws before too long.  When the sun bakes the deck, the top shrinks and pull the ends up, and up come the nails. That's pretty much true of any wood though.  Also, if you didn't use stainless, or weather guard, or at least galvanized screws, they'll be gone in no time.  The copper compound they pump in there loves to attack steel.

-Tim


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## rebush (Jul 6, 2012)

All wood rots pressure treated just takes longer. You need to let the moisture get out of the lumber before you seal it. As far as the splits and cracks filler won't work for long and it'll look ugly. Let the wood dry and when you think it's stopped splitting mix up some two part epoxy and use wood shims to fill the cracks. Time consuming but it leaves a decent job. Roger


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## Gary Max (Jul 6, 2012)

We have a small 6 x 10 deck at the back doort made from PT----- twice a year I clean the green algae off it with a pressure washer.
It came with the place so it's at least 15 years old and still very solid.


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## xalky (Jul 6, 2012)

rebush said:


> All wood rots pressure treated just takes longer. You need to let the moisture get out of the lumber before you seal it. As far as the splits and cracks filler won't work for long and it'll look ugly. Let the wood dry and when you think it's stopped splitting mix up some two part epoxy and use wood shims to fill the cracks. Time consuming but it leaves a decent job. Roger


Your right about it rotting, but it takes a very long time if its not in contact with the ground. I did some decks back in the late 80s that are still in remarkable shape except for the splitting. The twisting will stop once its dried out. I agree with using an oil based stain, thinned out, so it penetrtes deep. This is best done when the PT is dry so it absorbs it into the pores. Filling the cracks might be a losing battle, even though I like the epoxy idea, the epoxied areas will not take the stain. Pick your poison, nice even color or cracks.


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## jumps4 (Jul 6, 2012)

I hate pt it is just garbage even if you hand pick the boards they will twist and warp.
my screen room that sits on the concrete supports about 4" above the ground. I used terminex lumber treatment it applies with a chemical sprayer and is supposed to last 10 years. I applied it before laying the floor and sprayed the plywood before laying it also. In florida we have high humidity all year and for termites we have 2 kinds the in ground type and a type that does not return to the ground daily they normally get in attics with ac drip pans for their water source. the terminex has worked really well for me for 15 years now with no sign of termites or rot. a ramp i built for my shed was gone in 2 years and the termites got into the shed floor before i noticed it. a ladder i had leaning against my shed is a foot shorter now in 2 months because of termites. lol
steve


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## Tony Wells (Jul 6, 2012)

Just go ahead and buy Trex and be done with it.

There is no end to the arguments you can read all over the Internet on this subject. I went through some research a year or so ago. Never really decided on what advise to follow. I had (wife had, actually) painted some steps around back, and naturally, it didn't stick. It was fresh, treated wood when I built them, so of course it hadn't dried at all. A year later, the alkyd enamel was peeling off. Thinking it should have been primed, wife used Kilz....normally an ok Primer, but another year, and repeat....peeling again. If I build anything with CCA, it will likely be left plain, or at least a year before a clear on low pigment stain goes on. Oil, either way..no latex.


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## jgedde (Jul 6, 2012)

While I agree with the statements about PT, I have seen it used for decking before with various degrees of success.  The reason you have to wait, is it is VERY wet after treatment and won't accept stain or coatings worth a damn.  Once seasoned, it will accept stains like regular non-treated fir, southern yellow pine or spruce (whatever they sell in your area).  I did the deck on our cabin in 1-by PT.  It has held up but removing splinters from the kids feet have made it a curse. 

Stay away from Thompsons.  Some swear by it, most swear at it.  IMHO, water sealing is NOT a good thing as it prevents both sides of the wood from expanding and contracting evenly and you end up with warping.  In other words, wood needs to breathe.  As far as stains, nothing the big box stores carry is top notch stuff.  Try a real paint store - like a Benjamin Moore dealer.  My local BM dealer carries Sikkens products which work well on the Mahogany deck I built.  I sounds luxurious, but "Mahogany" decking is really Luan and only costs a bit more than cedar.  It hasn't split or warped in 12 years, although I did need to replace two planks due to rot.

For stain, the darker it is, the longer it will last as the main degradation mechanism for decking other than moisture is UV.

John


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## 8ntsane (Jul 6, 2012)

Thanks Guys for all the responses
Looks like I,ll be waiting till next year to do any staining. I guess Im best to leave it be and let it dry out. I will stay clear of thompsons water seal, thanks for that tip. The wait will let me get back to metal working , as I have had my fill of working with wood anyway.

Its been a long project , and glad its over with. I guess I could have chosen better materials for this project, but P.T lumber was more in the budget for this.

I did use S/S screws through out this project , and not one nail, so I should be good with that. I will just let it do it,s thing from here till next year. I,ll be watching it to see how bad things move around. I hope not to much movement . Only time will tell.

For a Newbie at this wood working, I can honestly say ( I dont like working with wood) The stuff is not for me. I learned alot doing this project, but just the same, Im glad it over!

Im sticking to Metal, atleast when I make things in metal, they remain the same after machining them. Wood does way to much moving around for my liking 

Thanks to all that posted
The comments, and tips will be helpfull down the road when it comes time to stain this thing. All great information.

Thanks Guys

Maybe my next wood working project should be a dog house for my buddy Norton. lol


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## Gary Max (Jul 7, 2012)

Slow down there Paul----------- where's the pics???????????
We want to see your new deck.
SS screws where a nice upgrade


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## 8ntsane (Jul 7, 2012)

Gary
I,ll snap some pics tomorrow, and get them posted up later in the day.
I didnt think any of the machine boys would be intersted.


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## DaveD (Jul 7, 2012)

You don't have to wait a year. Give it 30 or 60 days to dry out and have at it. BTW, until all the synthetic stuff came out about 10-15 years ago your average deck was all pressure treated. They are still very popular in today's world. 

Synthetic deck surfaces have there own kind of problems.


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## xalky (Jul 7, 2012)

DaveD said:


> Synthetic deck surfaces have there own kind of problems.


 Yes they do. For one they move even more than PT especially between hot and cold. Trex type composites really should be framed 12" on center underneath in warm climates, because it"ll sag with the heat. Even on hot summer days here in the northeast. I've seen them get moldy and they can be very slippery .


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## 8ntsane (Jul 11, 2012)

Here is a few pics of what I built on my first wood working project.
















The pic with the dog is the morning after I ripped the old porch out. The dog is sitting on the concrete step wondering where the hell it went. You can see the milk crate behind him used to get in the front door.

Pics are a little late Gary, but better late, than Never 




8ft 6 inches deep, 12ft wide
The original was 3 1/2 ft deep x 5ft wide


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## xalky (Jul 11, 2012)

Looks good. I love the brick work on the House. ) I like the metal railing spindles, good move, at least the spindles won't be twisting and bending.

Marcel


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## rafe (Jul 14, 2012)

I have done a LOT of PT decks and the ones that I painted with an oil based primer (behr+10) and then coated with a solid stain are still looking good 10 - 15 years later the ones that people insisted they wanted thomsons looked like crap in a year ......by the way I'd prime them after a week in the sun ....NEVER had a problem .......problem is I don't think that particular primer is available .......get yours done soon and you will slow the cracking and splintering fill after you prime use an acrylic latex caulk (ALEX)


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