# Index Model 645 Mill



## T. J. (Aug 15, 2016)

I went to pick up a milling machine yesterday - what an adventure!  I'll give you the complete narrative, so everyone has ample opportunity to laugh at me . 

I live in the Texas Panhandle, which is probably as much of a machinery desert as anywhere in the country. So I obsessively scour Craigslist, EBay, etc for machinery in a large radius around me. (I bought my lathe in Wichita Falls - about 250 miles away)  So a few days ago I found an ad for this milling machine on EBay. It's in Enid, OK - about 300 miles away. The photos were horrible but I was able to determine that 1) it was an Index Model 645, 2) it came with a milling vise and a rotary table 3) it had a power feed. The seller didn't know much about the machine, so was unable to answer my questions about spindle taper, wear, etc. But he only wanted $700 for it. So I bought it, figuring that even if it was completely unserviceable, I could part it out and/or scrap it and recover my money. So we made plans for me to pick it up and he said he even had a hoist to load it on my trailer and some extra guys to help - perfect!

I drove 5 hours to get there and meet the guy, who obviously doesn't bathe frequently.  No other guys to be seen. He takes me to the machine:


This photo was taken from the door of the building. If you look close, you can see the motor and belt guard of the mill in the middle-left of the pic, behind the two toilets. Most of the stuff between the door and the mill is heavy. Oh, and there was a piano behind me.   Mind you, he's had 10 days to get ready for me to pick it up. He asks me if I brought any help (no), then says he has a broken rib and can't lift much. This is getting even better. He calls some friends to come help, one shows up, then leaves and never comes back.

Undeterred, he and I start working. First, we have to bring the A-frame with the hoist from another building about 100 across yards the parking lot. It also had a lot of 'stuff' around it that had to be moved. Then we begin creating a path to the mill buy pulling stuff out of the way with a come-a-long and a pickup. About 3 hours in, we're to this point:
	

		
			
		

		
	




I didn't take any more photos of the loading process after this because I was sweating so much at this point, my phone was getting too wet in my shirt pocket. (Remember - it's August in Oklahoma). We drug the mill to the door with the pickup, stopping once about halfway to reposition it with the come-a-long. We positioned the A-frame in the door and backed my trailer up, ready to back it under once we had the mill lifted high enough. Easy right?  Well, his 1-1/2 ton manual hoist would barely get the back end of the mill off the ground. So with a floor jack and lots of wood blocks, and we finally get it high enough for the base to clear the trailer bed. Then come-a-long it into position over the trailer axles. At this point, I'm completely exhausted, soaked in sweat, and look like an oilfield grease monkey. The loading process has taken 5 hours. Now I have a 5 hour drive back home. Here's a pic of how I strapped it down.  This was taken after I had it home and backed into my barn.



It probably would have been better to leave the head upright and place two straps across the ram. At any rate, this was very stable and the mill did not move at all on the ride home.

In the next post, I'll have some closer photos after I have time to inspect things a little further. I think the ways are probably OK since they had a thick coating of oil. The spindle has an R-8 taper and turns smoothly. My main worry is the condition of the table. I'm afraid it may be pitted.  We'll see once I get it cleaned up...


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## woodchucker (Aug 15, 2016)

Sweet, looks like you got a good buy, but had to put some sweat into it to get it.


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## ScrapMetal (Aug 15, 2016)

Wow!  That was way too much work.    He should have given it to you for "free" to cover your labor cleaning up his storage area.   On the plus side, as it was buried, you know that it hasn't been abused lately. 

Glad you got it home safely.  I'll be looking forward to seeing it come back to life.

-Ron


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## T. J. (Aug 15, 2016)

ScrapMetal said:


> Wow!  That was way too much work.    He should have given it to you for "free" to cover your labor cleaning up his storage area.   On the plus side, as it was buried, you know that it hasn't been abused lately.
> 
> Glad you got it home safely.  I'll be looking forward to seeing it come back to life.
> 
> -Ron



Actually, whoever buys the lathe that was sitting next to it owes me big time because they can use the same pathway to get it out!  There are a few gems among all the junk in there. There was an Atlas shaper in good condition and complete with the stand. I thought about negotiating for it, but there was one big problem. I would've had to move all that stuff again in the other direction to get it out!

As for abuse, it's seen its share. I'll get to that in a minute. But first, I found out some history on it. I ordered a manual from Wells-Index today ($49) and while I was on the phone, had them look it up in their records. It is serial #9942. It was shipped from the factory in October 1963 to Hart Machine Tool Supply in Oklahoma City.  That company's tag is still on it. It included options of an R-8 spindle taper, power feed, and vernier scales.  

I had a little time this afternoon to mess with it. The collet in the spindle came out easily and the taper seemed to be smooth. Now on to the table. I removed the vise and rotary table. The vise is made in India, but looks to be decent quality. I'll have to clean the rotary table up to find a makers name. The t slots in the table were packed full of brass chips, dirt, and rust. Here's what the table looked like after I got the slots cleaned out a little. 


It looks better in the pic than in real life.   I scrubbed on it a bit with some mineral spirits and scotchbrite and did find some shiney iron under the rust. 



Also, I was too optimistic about the ways...


I'm gonna remove a little more of the thick rust on the table manually, then I'll cover it with towels soaked in Evaporust. Also I'm thinking about pressure washing it to get the caked on dirt & oil off before I start disassembling it. 

Here's where I could use some advise. The table and ways look pretty bad to me. How bad do they have to be to say it's not worth refurbishing?  I don't mind spending some time and money on it if I'll have a useful machine in the end. If it's not going to be capable of accurate work, I'd rather cut my losses and keep looking for another mill.


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## ScrapMetal (Aug 17, 2016)

I don't think the table looks that bad (unless "real life" is much, much worse than the pic).  Remember, most of the work you do will be using a vise or rotary table.  As long as you can get everything level with itself and trammed you should be golden.

-Ron


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## brino (Aug 17, 2016)

It is a little hard to tell from the pictures how the dovetail ways look.

My advice is to clean them up and run some tests:
1) to find worn spots (and with no power), you can tighten the gib adjustments so the table just moves in that direction and then trying moving the table to its extents. If you tighten the gibs on a worn/loose spot then the table will not move end-to-end until you loosen them again.

2) if you have power to it you can tighten the gibs for good motion and try cutting something. Look for any "throbbing" at the dovetail interface, if it's well lubed sometimes you can see the light reflection changing off the oil at that line. Start with something soft (wood/plastic/Al) and if all good move on to something harder.

Due to the amount of "dirt" on that machine it's probably worth removing the jibs for a good cleaning and lube before doing those tests.....if already have so much time and effort in it just getting it home, it's be a shame to give up too early.

Personally I don't see any show-stoppers, but much of it is about your expectations and what you intend to do.

Good Luck, and please keep updating us!

-brino


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## 4GSR (Aug 18, 2016)

I have a 645 just like yours that looked much worse than yours when I started putting it back together.  At least yours has all of its parts!  The table on mine looked like someone used it for an anvil.  I sent it out to a grind shop in Houston and had it re surfaced.  You may get lucky and find someone in the Amarillo area with a surface grinder that can resurface your table top for you.  If not, Commercial Grinding in Dallas may be your best bet.  One nice thing about Index mills, they use Meenite cast iron for all of the casting in the machine.  The ways are slightly chilled and tough and hold up well.  Get you a flat oil stone and some mineral spirits, start honing all of the way surfaces to remove dings, rust, etc..  After doing that, start  evaluating wear, if any, and consult us, and go from there.  I'll be glad to offer advise on pulling yours apart if you need any assistance.  Ken


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## 4GSR (Aug 18, 2016)

I was in Enid, Oklahoma back in 1985 on a testing job at a oilfield location just north of there.  I recall seeing a large acreage of used machinery that I have ever seen in that town.  I wanted to go rummaging thru it, but there was no time and I wasn't in my own vehicle.  The story I was told, it was owned by an Indian guy and was not interested in selling any of it.  I alway wondered what happened to that grave yard of machinery. 
BTW: Hart Machine Tool Supply in Oklahoma City, was a industrial supply house that sole machine tools back in its time.  I had a old Lehmann lathe that was sold thru them back in 1929 to a oilfield machine shop I want to say around Tulsa.  Don't remember, been too many years remembering details.  So its no telling who the end user was that bought the mill from Hart Industrial.  Ken


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## T. J. (Aug 18, 2016)

Thanks for the encouragement guys. I've regained a little optimism after scrubbing on it a bit more. 

I finally got it off of the trailer this afternoon. 


It was about all that tractor could handle. I've got it sitting in my barn for now. I'll do some cleaning on it there first and a partial disassembly. Then I'll move it into my backyard shop in pieces and reassemble it there.  It'll be a little slow going, since I have several other irons in the fire. One of which is getting my Logan lathe painted and put back together!  I'll post my progress as well as lots of questions I'm sure!


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## Martin W (Sep 4, 2016)

Sounds like a great adventure. Probably not what you had in mind when you left that morning though. Some days the rows are a little harder to hoe, but the end result is worth it. Can't wait for more posts to see it being put back to work.
Cheers
Martin


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## T. J. (Sep 13, 2016)

I haven't been able to do much with the mill lately due to other obligations and projects. But I did score a used 3 hp rotary phase converter on eBay for a reasonable price, which arrived yesterday. I was able to spare an hour or so this evening and temporarily wired it and the mill up. I am excited to report that IT LIVES!  The spindle motor runs smoothly and quietly. The spindle feed works in both directions and all three speeds, although one neutral position on the speed selector seems a little finicky. The table power feed motor shakes quite a bit - I assume due to the belt sitting in one position for years. Also one of the gear selector levers is stuck.

Now I'm even more anxious to get the mill cleaned up and moved into my shop...


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## fast freddie (Sep 13, 2016)

well worth the trouble for sure


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## 4GSR (Sep 24, 2016)

T. J. said:


> ......snip....... The table power feed motor shakes quite a bit - I assume due to the belt sitting in one position for years. Also one of the gear selector levers is stuck....


The stuck gear selector lever is NOT stuck!  That is the interlock doing its job. One has to be in the middle or neutral position for the other lever to move and vise-versa.  Don't force it!  Might be advisable to take the gear box apart, clean, re-assemble.  Fill with oil.  Ken


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## T. J. (Sep 26, 2016)

Good to know. I'll give that a try. 

I need some advise/guidance on disassembling the mill for cleaning and moving.  I have an engine hoist to help with the heavy parts. This is my rough plan for now:

Remove spindle motor
Remove spindle feed gear box
Remove head from ram 
Remove ram
Remove table
Remove saddle
Remove knee
One issue I've identified is that the ram is frozen in place. Unfortunately, I broke the ram positioning shaft while trying to get it to budge. If I protect the back end of the ram with some wood, can I hammer on it lightly (or heavily) to move it?  (All this with the clamping bolts loosened of course)

Also I may or may not remove the knee depending on how much of a pain it's going to be.


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## 4GSR (Sep 27, 2016)

Go easy on taking things apart.  Parts for this old mill are almost untainable today! 
Removing the spindle motor is cut and dry.  Next thing you want to do is remove the belt drive/guard housing.  Should be four 3/8" socket head cap screws accessible from the top flange of the head under the belt guard to remove.  Belt guard is heavy, get some help handling it!  Once these four bolts are removed, you should be able to remove it without removing the spindle pulley or brake.  I'm doing from memory, so correct me if I'm wrong!  The spindle feed box is more complicated and will require you to remove the guts from it before you can remove the housing.  It's been too many years ago since I removed the one on my mill.  In fact, it doesn't exists on my mill today.  That's another story for another time.  The head is pretty straight forward to remove from the ram.  Again, it is slightly heavy.  Before removing, pull the spindle pulley from the housing.  Once you get it out of the way apply some ATF fluid mixed with Acetone in the top of the spindle quill and let soak.  Keep applying for about a week.  Don't try to beat the spindle out yet!!!  There is a certain sequence of events that you you go thru before beating on it.  In fact I don't encourage it at this point.  I'll report back on what to do.  Got to go look at mine and recollect from memory how I did it on my mill.  Ken


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## Chuck K (Nov 13, 2016)

I had a 645 that was probably the ugliest machine I ever bought.  I'm glad that someone painted lime green because nobody was interested in it and I got it for little more than scrap price.  I put a lot of work into it but it was a great machine.  My advice would be to focus on the gearbox before you run it.  When I took mine apart the original grease was hardened and came out like chipping away at a bar of soap.  That machine calls for a special grease in the gearbox.  I know that I found something compatible at NAPA.  I'm sure I still have a tube of it.  If you want I can check and give you the info on it.  You're going to have a nice mill when you're done with it.​


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## 4GSR (Nov 17, 2016)

Special Grease?  Mine is filled with oil.  There is a sight glass at the bottom of my gear box.  Can't see anything because of it's awkward location, but it's there.  Now up in the head, that gearing is in a bath of grease.  Since my head does not have any of that gearing in it anymore, it's no concern to me.  But for those that still have the power feed attachment still in tack, I suggest packing it with Lubriplate 630 grease or one of the other Lubriplate products they have for gearing.  Ken


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## Chuck K (Nov 17, 2016)

Yes..I thought we were talking about the gearbox on the left side of the head...maybe I should go back and reread the thread.


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## 4GSR (Nov 17, 2016)

I may need to go back and re-read it, too Yeiks! 

Look at his post #11.


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## Chuck K (Nov 18, 2016)

Ok...I see that the table powerfeed gearbox takes oil.  That I'm not familiar with as mine didn't have it.  I was looking for a pic of mine but after computer crashes I have lost a lot of pics.  I'll have to search on here and see if I ever posted any pics.


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## Chuck K (Nov 18, 2016)

Hah.....I found some pics of the index on photo bucket.  I called it "The Green Weenie" when I bought it.  The pics really don't do the color justice.  It was almost fluorescent.
http://s1191.photobucket.com/user/cozmo135/library/Index 645?page=1&sort=3


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## 4GSR (Nov 18, 2016)

Much nicer than the basket case I have.  Dad left it in pieces and not very protected from the elements before he passed.  I took it on and cleaned it up and put it back together.  The power feed was missing the worm gear and the cover.  The gear was nearly $600 from Index and the cover was unattainable.  Drawing of the cover was available for $25.  That was quoted 21 years ago.  I removed the gear box and what was left to the power feed and tossed most of it out.  Put together a right angle gear box for a hand feed that works fine for me.  Here's a couple of pictures I've found to post.  Ken


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## T. J. (Nov 18, 2016)

Thanks for sharing those pics guys!

I'm almost to the point where I can dedicate some more time to this machine. I've finally got my Logan lathe painted and put back together. This weekends project is installing my RPC and 3 phase wiring in my shop to power both machines. 

I have removed the motor - the bearings in it feel nice and smooth. I got the spindle pulley off.  Next step is to remove the brake handle from its shaft and then I think the belt guard will come off. I'll try to post quite a few pics of the disassembly process here since these machines don't seem to get much air time on the forums . Here's a pic of the spindle and brake shoe with the pulley removed:


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## Chuck K (Nov 18, 2016)

That's really cool how you mounted the gearbox.  The funny thing about mine was that it was actually in real good shape.  I think it was just being used as a drill press.  The dials were completely covered with paint.  I wish I had pics of it before I sold it.  It looked really nice.  TJ keep the pics coming.  I'm afraid that my memory isn't good enough to be of much technical help.


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## T. J. (Dec 29, 2016)

I'm finally back to working on the mill. Since my last post, I removed the belt guard assembly along with the brake shoe. It simply lifted off after removing the brake lever from its shaft.  Next step was to remove the head. Before the head can slide out of the ram, the worm that rotates the head must be removed. It is held in by a castle type nut :



Crude methods were unsuccessful at loosening the nut, so I made a tool for it:




It was a nice little project for my newly refurbished Logan lathe. It worked well and the nut and worm came out easily. 



Then with some gentle wiggling, the head slipped out of the ram. I supported it with an engine hoist - it's heavy!



Next step will be to remove the table...


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## Chuck K (Dec 29, 2016)

T. J. said:


> I'm finally back to working on the mill. Since my last post, I removed the belt guard assembly along with the brake shoe. It simply lifted off after removing the brake lever from its shaft.  Next step was to remove the head. Before the head can slide out of the ram, the worm that rotates the head must be removed. It is held in by a castle type nut :
> View attachment 142485
> 
> 
> ...


Your pin socket brings back memories. I have one almost identical to it in my toolbox. Half the fun of a project like that is overcoming the obstacles along the way.


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## T. J. (Dec 31, 2016)

I got the table removed today and discovered a problem along the way. I had previously noticed a large amount of backlash in the power feed drive shaft - now I know why. This is the gear box on the right end of the table. The shaft that's sticking out is the lead screw. The gear on the bottom is on the end of the driveshaft. 


After removing the gear I found that the woodruff key slot was wollered out.  You can't really tell it from the photo, but the shaft is worn to a taper from the gear flopping around on it. The bore of the gear is shot as well. 



I'm going to check on prices and availability from W-I, but I'll bet they're pricey. It would be fairly easy to make a new shaft. What is the feasibility of brazing the bore of the gear and then reboring it?

Anyway, I finished removing the gear box on the right end of the table and the hand wheel from the left end. I then removed both table gibs. The table then slid off easily.


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## FOMOGO (Jan 1, 2017)

Might be simpler to bore the gear oversize, and install a press fit bushing. Looks like a brazing repair was made on the housing, which might account for the damage to the shaft and gear. Mike


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## 4GSR (Jan 3, 2017)

May be easier to build up the shaft and fill in the woodruff key slot and re-machine.  Be a cleaner method to use.  Still have to re-bore the gear slightly to get a true running bore in it.  Then remachine the shaft for a snug fit to the freshly bored gear.  Once that's done, start working on fitting the woodruff key.

Why do people think grease is a better lubricant?  Yuck!!  What a nasty mess!!!

Get all of that cleaned up, need to plumb the mill with a Bijur lubrication system, put an end to all of that grease!

Ken


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## T. J. (Jan 3, 2017)

Yes, the grease globs vary from looking like it was pumped in yesterday, to being almost petrified. And most of it is infused with the ubiquitous brass swarf that seems to have permeated every crevice on this machine. I'll look into the Bijur systems. Do you have any suggested suppliers?

I do have a question regarding building up the shaft. Since it is steel, would it be better to weld it (MIG) or braze it? 

Thanks!


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## 4GSR (Jan 3, 2017)

T. J. said:


> .....snip........ I'll look into the Bijur systems. Do you have any suggested suppliers?
> 
> I do have a question regarding building up the shaft. Since it is steel, would it be better to weld it (MIG) or braze it?
> 
> Thanks!



Either welding process should work.  Brass may wear down quicker and put you back to square one.  

Just thought of something, go buy a piece of 11/16" hex stock locally or from Speedy Metals, and just remake the shaft.  Much easier and cheaper!

As for the Bijur lubricating stuff, there's lots of stuff on eBay for sale.  In fact, there's a place out on the west coast that sell a Asian brand that is used on Acer mills.  He advertises on eBay as Supra Machine Tool, I think.  Easy to find his stuff.  He may have a kit made up of all of the stuff needed to convert a knee mill over to automatic lubrication.  Be prepared to spend upward around $300 for the necessary stuff to convert you mill.

When you get to that point, let me know and I'll try to put together a lube diagram of all of the points of lubrication needed with a basic list of items for a shopping list to look for.

Ken


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## Martin W (Jan 7, 2017)

Depending on how bad it is worn, you could use a stick welder with a carbon rod and some bronze wire?
Martin W


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## T. J. (Jan 7, 2017)

I think I will just make a new one from hex stock as Ken suggested. That project will have to wait until I get the mill put back together because it requires a woodruff key slot to be milled. 

I got the ram off last night, but I forgot to take pictures . I'll post some later today.


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## T. J. (Jan 7, 2017)

As I mentioned earlier, I got the ram off yesterday. I had been dribbling Kroil along the dovetail for about a week hoping to get it loosened up. I removed the bolts on each end that anchor the chain, and the ram moved freely. I was then able to remove the broken ram adjustment shaft and sprocket. I don't think I caused all of this damage, but I sure finished it off!  Another part to make...



The top of the turret after a little cleaning:


The rectangular hole close to the center is where the sprocket sits and the chain rides in the groove. I didn't get a photo of it, but the chain is attached to the bottom of the ram. Along with the sprocket it acts like a rack and pinion for extending the ram. The square hole toward the bottom of the pic is for removing the T-bolts that hold the turret to the column. 

The underside of the turret:



The top of the column:


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## T. J. (Jan 7, 2017)

Removal saddle was pretty straightforward. The hand wheel and dial were removed, then the bearing bracket which bolts to the front of the knee:



Then the screw is screwed out. This key was missing. I haven't had a chance to investigate what it is supposed to engage



The nuts for both the table and saddle lead screws are cast as one piece. It can now be removed:



I was then able to slide the saddle off. The knee was raised as far as it would go, then hoisted off.


I'll have to find a way to grab it closer to its center of gravity when I put it back on. 

So now the mill is broken down into its major assemblies. I will start cleaning them and move them to my shop for reassembly. I was hoping to get more done today, but I ran out of propane for the heater in the barn. It's supposed to be warmer tomorrow, so I plan on attacking the column with some degreaser and a pressure washer.


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## 4GSR (Jan 8, 2017)

That woodruff keyway in the cross feed shaft you were referring to is for use with power feed if your mill was equipped with it.  You're bringing back old memories when I had mine taken apart in pieces.  Actually my dad had taken it apart when bought the mill left it that way and passed away before he ever got a chance to put it back together.  I got stuck with putting the mill back together later.


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## T. J. (Jan 8, 2017)

4gsr said:


> That woodruff keyway in the cross feed shaft you were referring to is for use with power feed if your mill was equipped with it.  You're bringing back old memories when I had mine taken apart in pieces.  Actually my dad had taken it apart when bought the mill left it that way and passed away before he ever got a chance to put it back together.  I got stuck with putting the mill back together later.



Ok. Mine doesn't have a y axis power feed, so that's why there's no key. I'm scared that I'll forget how some piece of this thing goes back together before I get done. I can't imagine starting with a pile of parts and figuring it out from there!


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## T. J. (Jan 11, 2017)

I got the column cleaned up. This is a photo of the left way. This is the worst damage that I've found on any of the ways so far. This is limited to about a 3 inch area.


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## Silverbullet (Jan 11, 2017)

4gsr said:


> That woodruff keyway in the cross feed shaft you were referring to is for use with power feed if your mill was equipped with it.  You're bringing back old memories when I had mine taken apart in pieces.  Actually my dad had taken it apart when bought the mill left it that way and passed away before he ever got a chance to put it back together.  I got stuck with putting the mill back together later.


Ken you know you wouldn't have let that mill go . After your dad did all the tear down , it may have been ment for you to do it. I have things from my pop I wouldn't take a million bucks for. Just holding them I relive every thing.


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## Silverbullet (Jan 11, 2017)

Clean up the parts then Ck your damages. I'd polish them up stone the ways to take nice  down to keep them from  catching chips and hold them to make more damage. Get or make felts and keepers , cheap floor mats help keep chips out of the ways. Even if you can't afford the bijor  oiler you can make your own with a decent pump oil gun hooked up to a block of feed lines. I've got old drip oilers on one of my mills , and 1/8" copper lines soldered in place to a block with six lines to it to spread it thru the machine. Lots of options while it's tore down , great machines good luck with your rebuild. You can bag and label parts so you know where they go , pics help too.


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## 4GSR (Jan 12, 2017)

I've used every thing from cardboard boxes to plastic butter bowels with their lids to the little plastic containers you get from Kentucky Fried Chicken to store bolts nut in.  The butter bowels can be marked on top with a Sharpie with it's contents.  Like you said, the freezer zip lock bags work nice too!  BTW- the parts to my 645 mill, I had carried them thru three moves before I was able to get it back together!  Carried most of the loose parts in 5 gallon buckets!  Didn't loose anything in those moves.  Now, I have two lathes mostly tore down, working to get them back together.


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## T. J. (Jan 16, 2017)

Made a replacement ram adjustment shaft. I milled the flats with an end mill in the lathe by holding the shaft in a boring bar holder. Sure made me wish I had a milling machine...


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## Chuck K (Jan 16, 2017)

And a milling machine you shall have!


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## 4GSR (Jan 18, 2017)

T.J.,

At least yours wasn't frozen up like mine was.  I hate to beat on anything to get it out, actually, I had to grab it with a pair of vise grips and twist and pull at the same time to get mine lose.  And that was after I got the chain loose and removed.  Oh, if you need any of the short roll pins that are used to secure the chain, I have a bag of 99 of them.  At the time Fastenal would only sell me a full bag of a 100 when I only needed 1 pin. 

I'm glad I didn't twist on the shaft and broke as it happen on you.  But going into it, I knew that that wasn't going to free the slide to move on mine.  It was frozen up with rust and crud.  Took lots of soaking with oil and such.  I cleaned and honed the way surfaces of all rust before attempting the get the ram unstuck.  Had to use a big 4 x 4 block and BIG persuasion tool to get the ram to move.  Luckily, the way surfaces hidden were in good shape, very little rust.  Once I move the ram as far as I felt safe to move it, I cleaned and oiled the way surfaces on the exposed end and force it back the other direction until it freed up.  Once that was done, I fished the chain back under the ram and attached.

Ken


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## T. J. (Feb 6, 2017)

I'm behind on posting photos. ;-)

I reassembled the turret and ram to give me a way to lift the base. I got that much moved into my shop a couple weeks ago. 





Then I hit a snag on disassembling the knee elevation shaft. The collar that the hand crank engages, was froze up something fierce. Heating it and soaking it with Kroil were unsuccessful. There was only a 3/32 inch gap between it and the measurement dial, so I couldn't put a puller directly on it. I wound up making a clamp that would grab it and give me something to latch onto with a bearing puller. 



It was a hard pull the whole way. I got it to the end of the shaft and that gave me enough room to remove the socket head screws behind the dial that held the bearing flange to the knee. I could then pull the whole shaft out (after removing the bevel gear from the other end). 





I then pressed the collar the rest of the way off of the shaft. There was some scoring on the shaft where the collar had spun at some point. That was what made the removal so difficult.


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## T. J. (Feb 6, 2017)

Here's some pics of the clamp I made and a close up of the scoring on the shaft


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## Chuck K (Feb 6, 2017)

The clamp idea is great.  Looks like your shaft needs a little love. Maybe braze it and turn it smooth.


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## 4GSR (Feb 11, 2017)

Oh Yeah, your supposed to remove the set screw from the beveled gear before removing the shaft.


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## T. J. (Mar 6, 2017)

I got the knee put back on Saturday. This time, I put the straps on the front and back of the knee, rather than the sides.  This kept it a lot more level. Right now, it's still suspended with the hoist since I'm still waiting on the new thrust bearing for the screw to arrive. The crank shaft is installed with new bearings. 



I'll try to post the numbers of the replacement bearings that I use in case someone else could use the info. For the knee crank shaft:
Outboard = Koyo 6203
Inboard = Peer 6003

Slowly but surely...


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## T. J. (Mar 14, 2017)

I was making notes for myself last night about each zerk on the saddle lubricates, since it's not very apparent on some of them once everything is assembled. Then it occurred to me that this info might be of value to someone who hasn't disassembled their mill. So here are some annotated photos of the saddle with each zerk labeled. If it says "way", that means the horizontal surface (when the machine is assembled). "Dovetail" means the angled surface. 





Sorry about the cluttered background. In the first two photos, the saddle is sitting vertically with its front side up. For now, I'm replacing all of the zerks. I may install an oiling system later.


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## 4GSR (Mar 15, 2017)

Did you pump fresh oil thru all of the holes to push out all of the grease that someone filled it up with?

My 645 is equipped with a Bijur oiling system.  Later, if you need pictures on how the oil lines are run, I'll be glade to provide some.  I may be able to put together a list of all of the metering units and their sizes, too if you like.  Ken


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## T. J. (Mar 15, 2017)

With the old zerks removed, I was able to clean the grease out of all of the holes with a combination of solvents, compressed air, Q-tips, gun patches, and patience.   I didn't even try to clean up the old zerks themselves, new ones are cheap!  Thanks for the offer on the oil system Ken.!  If the mill proves to be adequate for my needs after I get it running, I'll take you up on that. 

I should be able to make some big progress in the next few days. The thrust bearing for the knee screw finally came in today.  Once that's in, I have everything ready to install the saddle and table.


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## T. J. (Mar 19, 2017)

Here's a view of the mostly complete saddle installed.


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## T. J. (Mar 19, 2017)

I ran into a problem today and I could use some advise. Here is a picture of the housing that holds the bearings and gears for the right end of the table lead screw. You might remember from an earlier post that this housing had been repaired by brazing in the past. 


When I went to install the lead screw bearing, the fit was excessively tight. After I pressed it in, the inner race was noticeably more difficult to turn. So then I pressed the bearing back out and did some measuring. The outer race of the bearing measures 1.653" (42 mm). The bore of the housing varies from 1.648" to 1.663" (measured with snap gauges and a mic). 

So I'm open to suggestions on how to fix this. The part will swing on my lathe, so I guess I could mount it on a faceplate and just skim the bore to remove the high spots. Obviously, I can't bore it perfectly round or then it would be too big.  Any other ideas?


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## ScrapMetal (Mar 19, 2017)

You've probably already thought of this but since you ask and as I'm not familiar with the bearing (take this for what it's worth then ) -  have you looked around to see if there is a bearing available that has an over-size OD?

I guess that one could also bore it out in a big way and put a press fit "ring/plug" in and then bore to size/position.

Both would probably work but the over-size bearing would be the easiest, best looking, etc. if at all possible.

Sorry, not much help,

-Ron


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## T. J. (Mar 20, 2017)

That's a good thought, but...  A quick search on the Grainger website shows the next size od available is 47 mm. If I bored it out to that diameter, I would be removing roughly half of the thickness of the housing (leaving about 0.1"). That seems too thin to me. What do you think?


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## 4GSR (Mar 20, 2017)

T.J,

If I recall, the  bearing is a slip fit in the housing.  All its doing is providing support for the lead screw and feed rod.  So if you bore it slightly large, it won't hurt anything.  If you go too much, well, I would make a very thin bushing that would be a finger push fit in the housing and likewise with the bearing too.  If you notice, there is two tapped holes for a couple of machine screws that were used to hold the bearing in place.

The flange  part where it mounts to the table on mine is broken off.  I was able to secure the broken off piece with a small socket head cap screw.  The other mount is still broken off but is held in place with a bolt.  Been like that for the last 13 years and hasn't come off yet.  Some day I'll try my luck at brazing and attempt to fit it.  Ken


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## ScrapMetal (Mar 22, 2017)

I'm with Ken.  If there is that little of area to work with I'd be looking to make a collar/insert.

-Ron


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## T. J. (Mar 25, 2017)

I got the bearing housing bored out today.  Everything went well. Here are some pics of my setup. 






It was a little tricky to get indicated in since the hole wasn't round, but I got it done. As you can see, the hole cleaned up pretty well except for the one area that was really large to begin with. 





The bearing is now a nice slip fit in the housing.


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## ScrapMetal (Mar 25, 2017)

Nicely done!

-Ron


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## T. J. (Apr 3, 2017)

OK fellas, I'm looking for some more advise.  I'm about to start on the head of the machine.  I have already removed the large bracket from the right side and the 'nod' worm gear.  The thing is really heavy and unwieldy on the bench, so I was thinking about cleaning the outside up, putting the 'nod' bracket back on, then mounting it back on the ram.  I would then disassemble the quill/spindle, and quill feed gear box as necessary.  Do ya'll think that is possible?   I can't see anything so far to make me think it wouldn't work, but I'd rather not put the head on the machine, then have to take it back off!


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## 4GSR (Apr 3, 2017)

Your that far,  I'd go ahead and tear down the rest of the head,  clean, then go back together. The feed box is a little tedious but not hard. May need to replace some of the bearings in the feed box. 
I would definitely tear down the spindle, clean out all of the crud,  inspect the bearings.  My last set of bearings cost  $250.  Maybe able to get a hold of an set on ebay lot cheaper.  May need to do some repair to the bearing nut  on bottom of the spindle. I had to  do some modifying to mine. I run Lubriplate 105 grease in. But it gets oil mixed in with the grease to the point that most of the grease has oozed out. Suggest oil feed from the top of spindle. Run a shielded bearing on top so the oil can pass thru to the spindle lower bearings. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk


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## ezduzit (Apr 3, 2017)

Kudos on not giving up easy!


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## T. J. (Apr 3, 2017)

I got to spend some time on it this evening and I got most of the crud off of the head. Here's some before and after pics.


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## markba633csi (Apr 4, 2017)

For the shaft, I'd weld it or better yet, make a new one.
Mark S.


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## markba633csi (Apr 4, 2017)

Great job boring the housing
MS


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## FOMOGO (Apr 4, 2017)

Great job on the restoration. Your going to know that machine inside out by the time your done. Cheers, Mike


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## T. J. (Apr 7, 2017)

Well, I opened up the spindle feed gear box. I was happy to find that all the grease was still soft and clean. All of the gears are in great condition and everything turns freely. I think I can skip disassembling it and just repack it with grease.


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## ezduzit (Apr 7, 2017)

The color of that grease makes it appear to have been contaminated with water, no?


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## Sandia (Apr 7, 2017)

Looks like your doing a jam up job T.J.  My hats off to you guy.  One thing I would like to mention in the area of safety.  I would be real careful using the light chain that I see in your pictures.  Unless my eyes deceive me, that looks like a light weight decorative type chain.  A good sling or choker would be a lot safer and easier to use.

Good luck to you,


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## T. J. (Apr 7, 2017)

My thought was that the yellowish green color in the top section of the gearbox was mostly oil. In the lubrication manual for this machine, it states that in early machines, the upper gearbox was filled with Mobil Vactra HH oil. In later machines, it was packed with Mobilplex EP No 0 grease.  The big glob of grease on the shifter bar (upper right corner) seems to have come from the bearing housing on the upper ends of those shafts, which has a grease zerk.


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## 4GSR (Apr 7, 2017)

My suggestion is to fill it with General Lubriplate 105 grease.  Not quite as thin as the old Mobil stuff was, but nice if you ask me.  You can still get Mobil Vactra HH gear oil.  May have to buy a 5 gallon bucket of it!  In fact, you may be able to get a quart of it from your local auto supply or Amazon.  It doesn't need any heavy grease.  Not like it will be running 24 hours a day 7 seven days a week year after year.  Ken


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## JAS (Apr 8, 2017)

Nice job the old oil filled ones had a sight glass on the side panel.yours looks like it had a sight glass above the slip clutch handle hard to tell from the picture. minje was starting to get hardened grease when i pulled it apart but turned out ok.Good luck you seem to be doing well I know what you are going thru.


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## markba633csi (Apr 14, 2017)

You could put some of that greenish oil on a hot surface- if you see bubbles there's water in it
MS


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## T. J. (Apr 23, 2017)

ezduzit said:


> The color of that grease makes it appear to have been contaminated with water, no?



Turns out you were right...



markba633csi said:


> You could put some of that greenish oil on a hot surface- if you see bubbles there's water in it
> MS



Thanks for the recommendation. I tried it and sure enough, it boiled like crazy. So I guess the gear box will require a more thorough cleaning than I thought.


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## T. J. (Apr 23, 2017)

I worked a little yesterday on trying to get the quill and spindle out. I'm working under the assumption that the quill feed shaft has to come out before the quill can be removed. Is that correct?

On another note, the quill counterbalance spring is corroded and broken. 


Anybody ever tried to make one of these?


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## 4GSR (Apr 24, 2017)

Is it actually broke?  It looks more crudded up than anything.  The end of the spring should be squared off, looks like it is broken off on a taper.  If it is, square up the end and continue to use it.  I would suggest not unwinding it!  Unless it's actually broke somewhere in the length of the spring, continue to use it.  To me, it appears fine other than cleaning it up as geed as you can.  The end of the spring just slips into a slit in the piece that is on the rack pinion shaft.

May also check with Wells Index and see if a new spring assembly is available if you want to go that route.

Ken


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## T. J. (Apr 24, 2017)

I think it's broken about 2 or 3 coils in from the center. I haven't verified that yet though.


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## markba633csi (Apr 25, 2017)

Maybe you could find a replacement spring from an old drill press?  
Just a thought.
MS


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## FOMOGO (Apr 25, 2017)

Those are welded links, and a decent dia., I think it's plenty strong for what your hanging. I have become a great fan of slings and other woven straps. They are strong, easy to use, and they don't tend to tear things up like a chain can. Mike


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## T. J. (Sep 17, 2017)

It's been a busy summer and my progress has been slow on the mill, but I'm back on it now.  My current task is disassembling the quill. I have gotten the lock nut and the bearing preload nut off of the bottom end (after a lot of effort). Now what?  The drawing shows something called a bearing removal ring that could be accessed via the plugged hole on the side of the quill. It's not apparent to me how this would be used though. It looks to me like the spindle could be pressed out from either end, but I don't want to mash on it until I know for sure.


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## JAS (Sep 17, 2017)

definitely water in that grease mine looked like that when I tore it apart.You can probably get a new spring from Wells /Index they still have certain parts  but at what cost .


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## T. J. (Sep 25, 2017)

I finally got the spindle out!  Here is the apparatus I used.  It's a piece of 1/2" all-thread run through the spindle with some wooden blocks bearing on the quill. 





This was enough to get it broken free where I could tap it the rest of the way out. I still need to get the top bearing out. The two bottom bearings are in pretty good shape, but I will go ahead and replace them unless they are outrageously expensive.


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## 4GSR (Sep 26, 2017)

After you settle down from pricing the bearing set, I have a extra set here I'll Let go for $125 if you are interested in them.


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## T. J. (Sep 29, 2017)

4gsr said:


> After you settle down from pricing the bearing set, I have a extra set here I'll Let go for $125 if you are interested in them.



Thanks Ken, PM on the way.


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## azshadeguy (Oct 19, 2017)

T. J. said:


> It was shipped from the factory in October 1963 to Hart Machine Tool Supply in Oklahoma City. That company's tag is still on it.


My Model 745 Also came from Hart Machine Tool Supply


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## T. J. (Oct 19, 2017)

azshadeguy said:


> My Model 745 Also came from Hart Machine Tool Supply



Ha!  That's cool!  

Another interesting coincidence:  there are pics of a 645 on vintagemachinery.org that is consecutively serial numbered with mine.


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## Sandia (Oct 20, 2017)

Its gonna be real nice wen you get thru with it, worth the effort.  You know, its hard to believe someone would let a peace of equipment like that get that filthy.  Doesn't cost much to clean it every once in a while.


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## T. J. (Oct 22, 2017)

It's getting closer! 

The head is mostly back together. I ordered a couple of R-8 spindle keys from W-I a couple of weeks ago, but my order got lost. Hopefully it'll be here this week. Then I can reassemble the quill with the bearings that I got from Ken. I'll pick up some electrical cord and new belts tomorrow. Chips coming soon!

I was able to heat and bend a new hook in the counterbalance spring. A new one is $108, so I thought I'd try fixing the old one first. Once I get the quill in, we'll see if it holds up. There was approximately 8 inches broken off.


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## brino (Oct 22, 2017)

T. J. said:


> I was able to heat and bend a new hook in the counterbalance spring. A new one is $108



Wow........The original pictures of that old one made it look like it was garbage....so rusty and broken.
Nice save!

-brino


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## 4GSR (Oct 22, 2017)

T.J, those spindle keys you ordered are going to cause problems later on in life.  I would suggest not installing them in my opinion.  They are not designed to drive the collet.  They just hold the collet while you tighten the collet or arbor.  I've been using my mill for over 12 years with out them.  Don't miss them one bit.  Ken


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## T. J. (Oct 29, 2017)

Gentlemen, the mill is back in business!  I finished assembling the head and got it trammed in this afternoon. 






I whittled on some scrap with an end mill before I ran out of shop time, just to be able to say I've finally made some chips!  I've only had it 14 months...  Of course, it's not completely done yet. I still have to clean up the table feed gear box and get it mounted. Then I need to make a new drive shaft. First though, I've got a very messy shop to straighten up


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## T. J. (Nov 1, 2017)

Here's a funny (now) side note to the mill project. The vise that came with the machine is a Kurt-style that was made in India. I cleaned it up the other day when I was getting close to being ready to use it. It's got a few dings and some pitting, but it will work for now. Two of the socket head cap screws that hold the jaw faces on were missing, so I stopped in town to get new ones: 1/2" x 1". I get home and they don't fit - bummer - I guess I measured wrong and they're metric. Next day, I make a trip to a Fastenal store and get two M12 bolts - they don't fit either!  Now, I'm kinda mad. I can't be this bad at measuring. So I reconfirmed the diameter with 2 different calipers - .493". Then I got my thread pitch gauge out - 12 tpi. WHAT!?!  What kinda screwed up outfit uses 1/2"-12 bolts instead of 1/2"-13?  Those guys that made this thing in India must be...wait a minute...India was formerly British...

I look a little closer, then get out the Machinery's Handbook - sure enough, they're  WHITWORTH threads!  So now, I just ordered some online - $14.00 after making the minimum order and shipping. Not to mention the time making two wasted trips..


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## 4GSR (Nov 1, 2017)

T. J. said:


> Here's a funny (now) side note to the mill project. The vise that came with the machine is a Kurt-style that was made in India. I cleaned it up the other day when I was getting close to being ready to use it. It's got a few dings and some pitting, but it will work for now. Two of the socket head cap screws that hold the jaw faces on were missing, so I stopped in town to get new ones: 1/2" x 1". I get home and they don't fit - bummer - I guess I measured wrong and they're metric. Next day, I make a trip to a Fastenal store and get two M12 bolts - they don't fit either!  Now, I'm kinda mad. I can't be this bad at measuring. So I reconfirmed the diameter with 2 different calipers - .493". Then I got my thread pitch gauge out - 12 tpi. WHAT!?!  What kinda screwed up outfit uses 1/2"-12 bolts instead of 1/2"-13?  Those guys that made this thing in India must be...wait a minute...India was formerly British...
> 
> I look a little closer, then get out the Machinery's Handbook - sure enough, they're  WHITWORTH threads!  So now, I just ordered some online - $14.00 after making the minimum order and shipping. Not to mention the time making two wasted trips..


I recall a few instances in my past where this came up.  We just chased the thread with a 1/2-13 tap, installed the new screws, torqued them down and never looked back.  Them old English built machines were finally pulled and scrapped out about ten years ago after a 30 plus years of running.  So guess they held up....


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## brino (Nov 1, 2017)

Two different ways of "chasing" threads.....
-brino


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## NorseDave (Nov 1, 2017)

Looks good!  I see that your mill has the breaker box mounted below the Index lettering on the side.  Mine is mounted directly over top of the lettering   Why would someone do that!  You've got literally square feet of empty space on the side.  

Your handles and controls are a lot shinier than mine.


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## T. J. (Jan 25, 2018)

Last weekend, I decided to tackle the table feed gear box.






After finding the spindle feed fear box to have water in it,  I expected the same with this one and I was correct. There was a little bit of rust on a couple of the gears, but nothing bad. 
	

		
			
		

		
	



I disassembled the whole thing and got it all cleaned up. 


I got new bearings for it and I've got it most of the way back together as of now. But here is the bad news (you knew it was coming didn't you?).  The worm gear is worn very badly.  
	

		
			
		

		
	



I contacted W-I and a new one is $305. For that amount of money, I would rather try to adapt a Servo style power feed to the lead screw. Since I've already spent the money on the bearings for the gear box, I'm thinking I might just go ahead and try it like it is before I go another route.


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## middle.road (Jan 26, 2018)

Ah man, that sux to max.
Is there any hope that the 'worm' was a standard pitch and we could find a gear and adapt it to the original 'hub'?

on a side note, at least when you called W-I you received a positive though costly response. 
Whenever I called them about a couple of items I needed for my Model 40 I ended up pounding sand.


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## T. J. (Jan 26, 2018)

I haven't taken any detailed measurements, but the gear is a 20 tooth and the worm is 3 tpi. That seems to be an unusual combination based on what I've found so far. 

I have considered making one myself. The process would be to make a hob from drill rod, then use it to hob a bronze gear blank. I would need to obtain change gears for my lathe to cut 3 tpi (the coarsest thread my QCGB will do is 4 tpi). Then comes the problem of making a hexagonal hole through it (the bore is about 2" long). While I am sure I could overcome all of these issues, I'm not sure the reward is worth all of the investment. It seems like adapting a Servo style power feed to the lead screw would be fairly straightforward. I think I would just need to remove the gear housing from the right end of the table and fabricate a bracket to take its place with the proper hole pattern to mount the power feed. When completed, it would offer a couple of advantages over the original equipment - mainly infinitely variable feeds and rapid traverse. 

Regarding Wells-Index, my dealings with them have been all positive other than the prices for a couple of items. I'm just glad they are still around to answer the phone and willing to help me with a machine they sold over 50 years ago!


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## 4GSR (Jan 26, 2018)

Yeah, the gear on mine is worn too, not as bad as yours.  I second the idea of going with a servo drive to takes place.  If you buy the servo brand, they may be able to supply the correct setup for the 645 mill.  At least, they used to.


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## 4GSR (Jan 26, 2018)

One thing I like about Well Index mills, they use a number of stock gears in their design with a few specials like this one.  You might be able to match up part of it to something stock out there.  Highly unlikely, never know until you try.


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## T. J. (Jan 26, 2018)

A name brand Servo unit is more than I want to spend, but it looks like the Align (Taiwan) and ALGS (China) brands are reasonable options.  There are several threads here on H-M talking about them.

The Boston Gear catalog is pretty detailed about their offerings.  I just need to take some more detailed measurements on the gear when I get time.


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## T. J. (Jan 27, 2018)

Well, the gear may not be as much of an oddity as I thought.  I took some measurements of the gear and made a drawing last night.



While at first glance, the worm appears to be 3 tpi, measuring the distance between adjacent threads gives a lead of 0.305".  After consulting Machinery's Handbook and the Boston Gear catalog, I did some calculations, I came up with this (also making some allowances for the fact that my measurements were taken from worn parts).  The worm gear has a pitch diameter of 2 inches and diametral pitch of 10.  This is a stock gear from BG:
http://www.bostongear.com/ecatalog?cid=worm_gears&id=GB1060A

My thoughts are that I could machine the gear teeth off of the original part down to a diameter of around 1".  Then on the new gear, remove the protruding hub and bore it out to be a press fit onto the turned down section of the original part.  It would probably need to be pinned in place.  What do ya'll think?  I've placed RFQ with Boston Gear, so we'll see how much it costs.


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## ezduzit (Jan 27, 2018)

You should try to make this work. Your machine is more valuable with the stock drive system, no matter what must be done to repair it.


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## T. J. (Jan 29, 2018)

I got a quote on the part from Boston Gear through a local distributor today. It was $105.00. I guess that's not bad considering it's bronze. 

For now, I'm going to finish assembling the power feed with the worn out gear and try it out.  If it's not going to work, then I'll make the decision on which way to go from there. 

I've gotta replace the bearings in the motor and then it will be ready to mount back on the mill.  Then I will need to fix the drive shaft before I can test it.


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## 4GSR (Jan 29, 2018)

Here's the price if you buy it thru Amazon if you have Prime.

https://www.amazon.com/Boston-Gear-GB1060A-Plain-Pressure/dp/B004N8503C

Ken


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## ezduzit (Jan 29, 2018)

That old one is SHOT!


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## middle.road (Jan 29, 2018)

One now wonders if any of the 'scrap' gear boxes that we have laying around, especially the Boston brand might just have one of these in it...

-EDIT- Added image. I can't believe I was able to run out into the shop and find this. Can't find the calipers from last night, but found this...
Have no idea where the cover is...


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## 4GSR (Jan 29, 2018)

middle.road said:


> One now wonders if any of the 'scrap' gear boxes that we have laying around, especially the Boston brand might just have one of these in it...


Doubtful.  But you never know.


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## T. J. (Jan 29, 2018)

4gsr said:


> Here's the price if you buy it thru Amazon if you have Prime.
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/Boston-Gear-GB1060A-Plain-Pressure/dp/B004N8503C
> 
> Ken



Wow, I never thought to check Amazon. I learn something new every day!

Sooooo......I went ahead and ordered it. I got to thinking, it'll be easier to check to make sure it's correct while the gear box is still off of the mill, and if it's not I can return it to Amazon. It should be here by the end of the week.


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## T. J. (Feb 2, 2018)

The gear came in and it fits the worm perfectly. Here's a comparison between new and old:



I could use some advise on how to secure the new gear to the old hub once I get them mated together. I was thinking two or three #10 socket head cap screws through the face of the gear into the large portion of the hub. Then I got to wondering if it would be a good idea to use something that would shear in the event of a crash (not that I would ever let that happen ).  What do ya'll think?


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## 4GSR (Feb 2, 2018)

That is super!  I think it's going to take more than three 10# socket head cap screws.  I would figure at least 4 just to make sure.  Have a way to cut a matching hex in the gear?  Doing that, three screws should be plenty.  Red Loctite gear to the other piece and blue Loctite on the socket head cap screws.


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## T. J. (Feb 2, 2018)

Here is a sketch of my plan:



I was doing it this way to avoid having to cut the hex shaped bore into the gear.  One dimension not on the drawing is the corner to corner distance on the hex is about 0.825". I was figuring on placing the screws adjacent to the flats on the hex, to give me a little more room. If you don't think three is enough, I may just go ahead and put in six.


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## 4GSR (Feb 3, 2018)

Put in six screws.  Do you have a way to cut two small keyways in the gear and shaft?  This item can see a lot of torque at times.  Try six screws for now.  If they get sheared off or loosen, you'll need to put a couple of keys in there.  How about putting two H & G dowel pins in place of two of the screws.  That should keep the gear from loosening the screws.


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## T. J. (Feb 3, 2018)

The dowel pins should work. There's not going to be enough meat on the 'shaft' part to put in a keyway.


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## brino (Feb 3, 2018)

T. J. said:


> The gear came in and it fits the worm perfectly. Here's a comparison between new and old...... What do ya'll think?



I think the centre hole in the new one is all wrong......it needs to be some kind of wallowed out daisy-shape to match the old one. 

But seriously.......
I like the idea of dowel pins.....but the "old hub" seems a little worn on the OD:



We don't have measurements of this:


versus this:



It __looks__ like the old hub is bigger than the new hub......but it's hard to tell from here........

-brino


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## T. J. (Feb 3, 2018)

That portion of the old hub you have circled is unmachined casting. That section is just a spacer between the gear and the bearing journal to the left. 



brino said:


> It __looks__ like the old hub is bigger than the new hub......but it's hard to tell from here..



You are correct, but the hub of the new gear will be removed.


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## 4GSR (Feb 3, 2018)

I might be a little late.  I found a 3/4" hex broach in my toybox that I had forgotten all about.  Your more than welcome to borrow it if you like.

Ken


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## T. J. (Feb 4, 2018)

You're not too late, as I haven't started on it yet. I really appreciate the offer, but I think I'll go a different route. As you can see from the photos, the bore is not a true hex. As Brino said, "daisy-shaped" might be more accurate. I don't think this is wear. I think it was purposely cut this way so that it bears on the flats of the driveshaft rather than on the corners. 

I've been thinking a lot about how to go about this project. One thing that occurred to me last night, is that I could try to cut the hex in the new gear, and if it didn't work, I could go back to my original plan. I would start by drilling holes for the 6 corners, then hog out the middle with an end mill. The final shaping would be done with a file.


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## 4GSR (Feb 4, 2018)

That "daisy-shape" is wear, but that's ok.  Still has lots of life.  It'll last your lifetime since it don't have to work for a living anymore.  Mine is more a true hex with some wear from what I remember.  Too much crap to remove to get to that gear on my mill to look at it again.


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## T. J. (Feb 11, 2018)

Well I finally quit hem-hawing around and did something with this gear .  

First, I cut off most of the hub on the bandsaw and milled it flat, leaving a 0.100" boss.


Then, I drilled 1/8" holes in the corners of the hex. I milled the flats using a 1/4" end mill.



After finishing the corners with a triangle file, I think it came out pretty good.



Then, I chucked the old gear in the lathe and turned down the gear teeth. I removed the rest of it with a parting tool.



Then, I bored out a recess to accept the boss on the gear. 




That's as far as I made it today.  Next will be to mate the two halves and get the bolt holes drilled. I was reluctant to try making the hex bore in the gear at first, because I doubted my ability. Then I got to thinking that I could try it, and if I screwed it up, I could always bore it out round and go with my original plan.  It turns out that it wasn't that big a deal.  This is a better situation since the bolts won't be taking a shear load now.  

And oh by the way, you wouldn't recognize it, but the rotary table in the pics is the one that came with the mill. It's a little rough around the edges just like everything else, but it worked well. This was the first time I've used it.


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## Chuck K (Feb 12, 2018)

Nice job!


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## T. J. (Mar 11, 2018)

I got the gear done today - finally!  Life and other projects have a way of slowing progress...




Here's a view of it with the bearing and nut installed



And here it is on the machine with the driveshaft installed as well


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## 5ubtle (Sep 27, 2018)

See post #35 on page #2.


T. J. said:


> Then the screw is screwed out. This key was missing. I haven't had a chance to investigate what it is supposed to engage



I don't think that that key is for use with the power feed as was suggested by "Deleted member 473".  My machine does have Y axis power feed, and I am also missing a similar key.  I wonder if it is used temporarily during shaft grinding.




The power feed gear (2842) goes between the bearing housing and the handwheel.

I also want to thank you for posting all of these pictures of your mill.  They have been beneficial to me during my build.


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## T. J. (Sep 27, 2018)

[QUOTE="The power feed gear (2842) goes between the bearing housing and the handwheel.

I also want to thank you for posting all of these pictures of your mill.  They have been beneficial to me during my build.[/QUOTE]

That's good to know. And you're very welcome, I'm glad the pics were helpful. You are adding much to the W-I knowledge base on this site yourself with your thread!


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## dmittz (Oct 16, 2018)

You did a wonderful job with your Mill*, I *really enjoyed reading about your work.  Thank you for sharing.


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