# Surprise Super Find



## songbird (Nov 16, 2016)

I am a retired carpenter, who has got bit by the hobby machinist world. In the process of looking for a lathe, I started buying up old machines, cleaning the up, repairing what I could, painting and then selling, making a little profit, then buying up more machines. I thought I would back off for a while, as I found it was hard to part with these machines once they were up and running. I currently have a 9" southbend 9a, a 10" Wards/Logan, a 12" Craftsman Commercial (cabinet model) and a 12" Clausing 5914. I received a call through a friend, from a woman who had just lost her husband and wanted to know if I would be interested in an old southbend lathe. The price was right, ($250), so I told her I would take it sight unseen. I went over today to pick it up with my son, expecting a 9a, but it turned out to be a 13"! I am quite happy, but now trying to tear it down for transport is challenging. I removed the tailstock, carriage and gear box and motor. I'm considering removing the headstock, but hate the thought of cutting the one piece flat drive belt. Anyone have any suggestions, I certainly do not wish to remove the spindle. Would a person just replace the belt with the new flat belt sold on eBay? Thanks in advance for any comments, Jim.


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## woodtickgreg (Nov 16, 2016)

There are several options for new belts, just cut the belt, remove the headstock and deal with the belt later. Congrats on the 13, I want one myself.


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## T Bredehoft (Nov 16, 2016)

Surprises like that are most welcome. I should extend my welcome to you, too, welcome to the best hobby machinist forum around.


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## FOMOGO (Nov 17, 2016)

With it torn down as far as you have it I think it would be manageable as is. What are you planning on moving it with? If you have a trailer and a winch or come-along it shouldn't be that difficult. There are several threads on here dealing with moving machines and the many options available. Welcome to the site and  good luck with the move and refurbishing. Mike


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## songbird (Nov 17, 2016)

FOMOGO said:


> With it torn down as far as you have it I think it would be manageable as is. What are you planning on moving it with? If you have a trailer and a winch or come-along it shouldn't be that difficult. There are several threads on here dealing with moving machines and the many options available. Welcome to the site and  good luck with the move and refurbishing. Mike


Thanks Mike. I have a truck, but because of the height of the truck bed, I might be looking at a trailer and ofcorse a come a long. With the head stock removed, I don't think it will be nearly as top heavy.


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## derf (Nov 17, 2016)

I wouldn't remove anything....at that price it would be a good investment to rent the right equipment or pay someone to get it home.


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## songbird (Dec 4, 2016)

Well, I finally got the 13" south bend home, but now have some questions;
Does anybody know what the spindle taper is for this large spindle hole, (my 4 1/2" mt passes into it)?
Does anybody know where to get a spindle adaptor for a mt 3 or one that will accept 5c collets?
I know this has been asked before, but the replys refer to websites that appear to have been shut down. Thanks, Jim.


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## Kroll (Dec 4, 2016)

Remember the old Wendy's commercial?"Where's the beef" well I have to ask"Where's the pics" Something like that,that probably been preserve by the previous owner is kinda like a time capsule.Maybe it is,maybe its not but if possible and time permits please do post pics.Congrats on a fantastic find---kroll


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## woodtickgreg (Dec 4, 2016)

songbird said:


> Well, I finally got the 13" south bend home, but now have some questions;
> Does anybody know what the spindle taper is for this large spindle hole, (my 4 1/2" mt passes into it)?
> Does anybody know where to get a spindle adaptor for a mt 3 or one that will accept 5c collets?
> I know this has been asked before, but the replys refer to websites that appear to have been shut down. Thanks, Jim.


Look on ebay for the collet adapter and thread protector, you will also need a drawbar to close the collets. Sometimes you have to be patient to find these items, it took me awhile to find them for my 10L. I can't remember what the spindle taper is but I think it is a proprietary taper that south bend used.
I'm sure one of the guys her will know what it is and chime in.


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## songbird (Dec 4, 2016)

Kroll said:


> Remember the old Wendy's commercial?"Where's the beef" well I have to ask"Where's the pics" Something like that,that probably been preserve by the previous owner is kinda like a time capsule.Maybe it is,maybe its not but if possible and time permits please do post pics.Congrats on a fantastic find---kroll


Thanks Kroll!


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## songbird (Dec 4, 2016)

woodtickgreg said:


> Look on ebay for the collet adapter and thread protector, you will also need a drawbar to close the collets. Sometimes you have to be patient to find these items, it took me awhile to find them for my 10L. I can't remember what the spindle taper is but I think it is a proprietary taper that south bend used.
> I'm sure one of the guys her will know what it is and chime in.


Thanks, I will cont. looking.


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## LucknowKen (Dec 4, 2016)

songbird said:


> In the process of looking for a lathe, I started buying up old machines, cleaning the up, repairing what I could, painting and then selling, making a little profit, then buying up more machines. I thought I would back off for a while, as I found it was hard to part with these machines once they were up and running. I currently have a 9" southbend 9a, a 10" Wards/Logan, a 12" Craftsman Commercial (cabinet model) and a 12" Clausing 5914. I received a call through a friend, from a woman who had just lost her husband and wanted to know if I would be interested in an old southbend lathe. The price was right, ($250), so I told her I would take it sight unseen.



Only 5 lathes?


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## songbird (Dec 4, 2016)

LucknowKen said:


> Only 5 lathes?


I have to stop buying lathes because of health issues, (if I bring another lathe home my wife will kill me!).


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## songbird (Dec 13, 2016)

songbird said:


> I have to stop buying lathes because of health issues, (if I bring another lathe home my wife will kill me!).


Small problem with 13" South Bend. In the process of tearing down and cleaning this lathe, I am having trouble removing the screw in saddle holding the apron. I've tried using a ton of penetrating oil along with a "hammer" type of impact. I'm afraid of using heat, but may not have any choice. Any ideas out there? Thanks in advance, Jim.


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## buggsy (Dec 31, 2016)

Hi, I just ran into the same problem with a 16" SB I just picked up for nothing. I ended up using a 1/2-Drive Drag Link Driver. Just ground slightly to fit and tapped it in.With a half inch drive ratchet and slow pressure they came right out.


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## Kroll (Dec 31, 2016)

Maybe try one of those 1/2 drive allen screw sockets with an impact set to light pressure.Slowly increase the air pressure just a little.The hammering of the impact may loosen the screws without breaking the heads off,but take care doing so.----kroll
If I may add,for problems like this I like this product which it really works.Its as thin as WD so it will soak into the threads if its able to get to them.So if there is paint in the way then it can't get to the threads.I will soak it down all day long,let it seat over night then give it a try next day.


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## songbird (Dec 31, 2016)

buggsy said:


> Hi, I just ran into the same problem with a 16" SB I just picked up for nothing. I ended up using a 1/2-Drive Drag Link Driver. Just ground slightly to fit and tapped it in.With a half inch drive ratchet and slow pressure they came right out.


Sounds like it's worth a try, Thanks.


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## tq60 (Dec 31, 2016)

Oil will not help but impact will.

Do not mickey mouse it.

If yiu already have used the hammer type impact you have the bit so now use pneumatic but...

Do not go full throttle as it may not be needed.

Turn Ari down to 40 to 50 psi and lean heavy on it to insure bit is firmly in the screw and let the driver work on it.

It will just sing for a bit then start to move.

Give it time...

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337Z using Tapatalk


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## songbird (Dec 31, 2016)

Kroll said:


> Maybe try one of those 1/2 drive allen screw sockets with an impact set to light pressure.Slowly increase the air pressure just a little.The hammering of the impact may loosen the screws without breaking the heads off,but take care doing so.----kroll
> If I may add,for problems like this I like this product which it really works.Its as thin as WD so it will soak into the threads if its able to get to them.So if there is paint in the way then it can't get to the threads.I will soak it down all day long,let it seat over night then give it a try next day.


I don't know what the Allen head screw socket looks like, if it works on a straight slot screw head. Can you send a pic? I have tried soaking the screw heads for several days with "break free", but no luck. Thanks, Jim.


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## buggsy (Dec 31, 2016)

I tried all the same things you did, including heat and the impact screwdriver. If you have'nt screwed up the heads to badly, I promise it will work.
Buggsy


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## Kroll (Dec 31, 2016)

Sorry songbird,the lathes that I have work on have always been allen head bolts.But what about one of those impacts that you use a hammer on with a screwdriver tip which comes with the impact?Sorry for my misunderstanding---kroll
Opps I see you already did the impact


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## songbird (Dec 31, 2016)

Kroll said:


> Sorry songbird,the lathes that I have work on have always been allen head bolts.But what about one of those impacts that you use a hammer on with a screwdriver tip which comes with the impact?Sorry for my misunderstanding---kroll
> Opps I see you already did the impact


No problem, my Clausing uses Allen head cap screws, if I get these out that is what I will be replacing them with. Thanks, Jim.


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## songbird (Dec 31, 2016)

tq60 said:


> Oil will not help but impact will.
> 
> Do not mickey mouse it.
> 
> ...


YaHoo!!!, an impact with the right bit worked so fast and so well, it's hard to believe. It had absolutely no effort for the impact at all. This is a 1954 lathe, you can't believe the amount of trash in it. I really wasn't planning on tearing the whole apron apart, but with the amount of crud in it, I really have no choice. Thanks for the tip! Jim.


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## tq60 (Dec 31, 2016)

Our 194x 14.5 was same way...

So figured you could use the same process that finally worked for us.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337Z using Tapatalk


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## songbird (Mar 8, 2017)

songbird said:


> YaHoo!!!, an impact with the right bit worked so fast and so well, it's hard to believe. It had absolutely no effort for the impact at all. This is a 1954 lathe, you can't believe the amount of trash in it. I really wasn't planning on tearing the whole apron apart, but with the amount of crud in it, I really have no choice. Thanks for the tip! Jim.


Ok, got the lathe up and running, restoring/repairing one section at a time. The apron was completely filled with sludge and gunk. Clutch was sticking and sometimes not holding. After a complete cleaning and "lapping" of the clutch discs, it works like new.
The next issue is the cross slide. There is so much wear, the adjustable gib is maxed out. I ground off about 50 thou off the end, where it was "bottoming" out against the casting, and it seemed to help. I do not have access to a surface grinder and therefore cannot make an oversized gib. Has anyone ever added a shim to the side of the gib to compensate for the wear? Any suggestions? Thanks in advance, Jim.


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## Glenn Brooks (Mar 8, 2017)

Hi Songbird,

Both my larger lathes have shims in the cross slide gibs.  Both shims are on the outside of the gib, and seem to work well.  They both are cut from what looks like stainless shim stock and have a notch cut into the operator end to accommodate the adjusting nut that you use to tighten or loosen the gib.  So with the notch cut in the shim, it moves to and fro with the gib.  I don't see any reason why brass shim stock wouldn't work also - might be more easier to come by. 

The big thing is how thick to make the shim....  mine are maybe between  .010" to .020" thickness... Never measured.  I could actually measure the one  off my SB Fourteen if you need. It's disassembled at the moment, awaiting a new leadscrew.

Cheers
Glenn


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## songbird (Mar 9, 2017)

Glenn Brooks said:


> Hi Songbird,
> 
> Both my larger lathes have shims in the cross slide gibs.  Both shims are on the outside of the gib, and seem to work well.  They both are cut from what looks like stainless shim stock and have a notch cut into the operator end to accommodate the adjusting nut that you use to tighten or loosen the gib.  So with the notch cut in the shim, it moves to and fro with the gib.  I don't see any reason why brass shim stock wouldn't work also - might be more easier to come by.
> 
> ...


Thanks Glen, I don't think you have to measure yours, I just didn't know if that was a practical or common way of addressing the problem. I will look for brass shim stock. Thanks again, Jim.


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## Glenn Brooks (Mar 9, 2017)

I bought a package of brass shim stock for 30 bucks or so, maybe less, off eBay.  MSC and McMaster Carr also sell a similar package.  Must be 20 sheets of brass, all sizes from around .002 up to .020" thickness.  Amazing how cheap it is for a life time supply!

Good luck,

Glenn


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## songbird (Mar 10, 2017)

Glenn Brooks said:


> I bought a package of brass shim stock for 30 bucks or so, maybe less, off eBay.  MSC and McMaster Carr also sell a similar package.  Must be 20 sheets of brass, all sizes from around .002 up to .020" thickness.  Amazing how cheap it is for a life time supply!
> 
> Good luck,
> 
> Glenn


Thanks for the info Glen!


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## brino (Mar 10, 2017)

Lee Valley sells brass shim stock, six different thicknesses by the 6"x100"roll, or a sampler pack with 2"x6" strips of all six thicknesses.
http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/page.aspx?p=40946&cat=1,43456,43407

I always try to keep a sample pack on hand.

-brino


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## songbird (Mar 10, 2017)

brino said:


> Lee Valley sells brass shim stock, six different thicknesses by the 6"x100"roll, or a sampler pack with 2"x6" strips of all six thicknesses.
> http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/page.aspx?p=40946&cat=1,43456,43407
> 
> I always try to keep a sample pack on hand.
> ...


Thanks Brino!


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