# Tooling Up for the MFC Atlas Mill????



## Kroll (May 11, 2014)

Morning guys and yes I'm loss without a clue.Guys this mill is not on my bucket list but its what I have and I want to work within its limits so that I can increase my chances to have some success.I do have a small vise but nothing else.Reading the small print in the manual this mill has a #2MT so I would like to find a basic collet set(maybe a drawbar also) to where the end mill will not stick out so far,would a fly cutter work on this mill?I don't know the difference between one collet set vs another,so which one would you choose that has good holding power and can be release easy?Now,other than having a vise what are the opposition for holding work flat and on edge.On the Atlas mill,the table just does not have alot of real estate so I wonder whats out there for clamping?I did go to Jeffs website and there is I guess a holddown set but I think its mainly for the bigger mills.What about clamping for round stock such as shafts,or something like that?
One of my first projects is trying to make a shoulder cut(1/8x3/4) in a piece of flat bar stock 3/4x6"x22".So I would like to ask for suggestions on what to get or look for in horizontal cutters(do I need the cutter to be able to cut on the side as well as the top)
One more question,end mills that I look at some or 2/4 flute,guessing the the 4 would be a slower smoother cut but I'm also guessing that this atlas will be slow anyway.I don't have no parallels,or 123 blocks,so I'm really at the begaining.
Well will these questions should keep me confuse but will also help me get started,so if you can make suggestions ,maybe provide a link to your favorite spot or just pics of what you are using will help greatly.I'm not making anything for airplanes or spaceships just stuff for myself.Thanks---kroll


----------



## LJP (May 11, 2014)

Kroll, my Atlas mill will be running soon. Working on it today. I will take some pictures of hold down tooling to begin with. You need 1 2 3 blocks and parellels for sure. Angle plates will help. A "mini pallet" like Tom Lipton shows in his Youtube videos would be great on this mill. Some of this stuff you could make. Yes a fly cutter would work fine in a MT collet. Buy a set of 2MT collets and make a draw bar (not sure if you have a lathe). Little Machine Shop has some stuff you could use, Shars as well. You can get all this stuff on Ebay with patience. 
Hope this helps! Larry


----------



## LJP (May 12, 2014)

Kroll, here are a few different types of blocks for clamping down to the Atlas table. Really the same stuff I use on the Bridgeport, but smaller scale.


----------



## Earl (May 12, 2014)

You stated that you have a vise.  That is very important to keeping your table from getting dinged up while learning to operate the machine.   Later on,  you can mount stuff to the table of the  mill.   I am not sure that I would get an entrie collet set.  Probably just one or two for the common end mills that I would use.   I use my MFC mostly in the horizontal mode.   I have several slab mills, slitting saws, and cutters.   An easy project to start with would be to use the Mill to make yourself some T nuts for clamping stuff to your table.  You could do that with either and end mill or horizontal cutter.    Do you have an overarm support with your machine?  That helps to "stiffen things up" a bit when using it in the horizontal mode.   Is your arbor 7/8 or 1 inch?  I have both 7/8 and 1 inch cutters and a r8 adapter for the 7/8 cutters so I can use them in my grizzly vertical mill.   I was lucky enough to find a guy about a hundred miles away (craigslist) that was selling a bunch of cutters.  I drove down and found that most were new, and the ones that weren't new had all been re-sharpened and covered in a protective coating.  I ended up buying all that he had.  I'm afraid of Ebay cutters.  I have had several instances where I bought end mills and they turned out to be junk.   Stuff that probably came out of a garbage can.  Took me a while to realize that there are few bargains on good, used cutters.   
By the way,  the manuals for the machine (I only have a few pages that were copies of copies) state that you do not want to do "climb milling" on this machine.   That means that when doing a cut,  the rotation of the end mill "opposes" the direction of table travel , i.e., the cutter does not attempt to "pull" the part along.  There is a good video about climb vs standard milling by a gentleman in the uk named "doubleboost".  (the guy has a jet powered go-kart with an afterburner)  He is very hard to understand but goes over this topic in detail in "How not to climb" on youtube.

As for the drawbar,  just go to home depot or lowes and get some "all thread" and a coupld of nuts to fit it.  Double nut on the end to keep the nuts from coming off and cut it to the length you need.  I am not 100% sure but I think mine is 3/8 x 16.   

Good luck with your mill.


Earl


----------



## Kroll (May 12, 2014)

Thanks for posting,LJP I see the 123 blocks,are the other blocks called angle blocks and vee blocks?You have a nice collection, and Earl I hear ya on the ebay stuff which most items are broken or just wore out.The bar thats for stiffing up the mill is something that I wanted to make,but one of my problems is I'm clueless when it comes to figure out how to clamp and hold flat bar stock in place to use an end mill.Like what your saying,I want to make my on tee-nuts.Out of flat bar stock,make a shoulder cut on both sides.I guess just plain old mild steel is good for all this,nothing fancy???Thanks for some directions---kroll


----------



## Earl (May 13, 2014)

Kroll said:


> Thanks for posting,LJP I see the 123 blocks,are the other blocks called angle blocks and vee blocks?You have a nice collection, and Earl I hear ya on the ebay stuff which most items are broken or just wore out.The bar thats for stiffing up the mill is something that I wanted to make,but one of my problems is I'm clueless when it comes to figure out how to clamp and hold flat bar stock in place to use an end mill.Like what your saying,I want to make my on tee-nuts.Out of flat bar stock,make a shoulder cut on both sides.I guess just plain old mild steel is good for all this,nothing fancy???Thanks for some directions---kroll


Do you have a 7/8 or a 1 inch mandrel?  (Lets  think horizontal for now)  You said that you had a vise.   If there is a mandrel in the machine, it is likely that there is a drawbar holding it in.  If you dont have a drawbar, take your mandrel to home depot and get a footlong piece of all thread to make a drawbar.  A hacksaw and file will get you on your way.   Do you have spacers and a key for your mandrel?  How about the precious nut that holds the mandrel together?  If you dont have any T nuts just use some nuts, bolts, and washers to lock down the vise.  I can send you a cutter to make yourself some better T nuts with.   The important thing is to start making chips.  You learn by doing.  I know that you dont have an overarm support yet but you can make lite cuts without it.

Post some pics of your mandrel.   Let's see what ya got.


----------



## Earl (May 15, 2014)

I just looked again at the picture that you posted of your mill.   I see the drawbar sticking out of the back of the headstock!   unscrew it a few turns,  hit it with a soft hammer and you will pop the mandrel loose.  Also re-reading your post,  you talked about collets for MT2.    Collets are not what you need.   You need mt2 end mill holders.
The end mill holder has an MT2 taper but is threaded inside for the drawbar.   The end mill is held in place with a set screw.


----------



## wa5cab (May 15, 2014)

Kroll.

4-flute end mills will generally cut faster and smoother than 2-flute ones because at the same RPM the 4-flute has twice as many cutting surfaces per revolution.  However, a 4-flute will not cut to center.  Meaning that you can not drill a hole with it.  So you cannot for example cut a short slot out in the middle of a larger part.

Morse Taper shank milling cutter holders (AKA end mill holders) are made in two styles.  One has a tang on the small end.  The other does not and is drilled for drawbar.  Unfortunately, although I have learned the hard way to consider them unsafe to use, the former are much easier to find than the latter.  They have a set screw in the side to lock the shank of the cutter.  They are intended for use with Weldon style cutters (including end mills).  The shank of the Weldon style has a flat ground across it for the set screw to bear against.  Unfortunately, not all cutter shanks have the flat.  And the holding power of a hardened set screw on a hardened and ground round shank is iffy.  The round shank cutters are primarily intended to be used in collets.  From years of acquisitions I have end mills and other cutters with both shank styles.  So I have both collets and holders and use whichever matches the cutter shank.  Unless your mill came with its milling cutter holder and set of reducing bushings, probably your cheapest entry level route will be to opt for a set of 2MT collets.  As the Weldon style shanks are usable in collets, you can buy end mills and other type cutters without much worrying about the shank style.

Robert D.


----------



## Kroll (May 17, 2014)

Afternoon guys,sorry about not replying sooner been working some OT and thanks so much for answering my questions.I did have to go out and check,its a 7/8 mandrel with spacers.Boy,thank you Robert for the info on 2 vs 4 flute.I did not know that you can drill with the end mills,so using a 2 flute end mill slow to drill a hole or just like using the DP?Guys thanks for pointing out what I need as far as end mill holders.I was looking at the collet set,but will go with the other.Take alook at the this http://www.tools4cheap.net/proddetail.php?prod=mt2em out of stock right now.Any other suggestions on brand,look like there's not much to them.
So I will be looking for a set of 2 flute end mill cutters,so for the weekend warrior what would be a decent brand to look for and do you send the cutters off to be re-sharpen or toss them?
Guys I know that these questions can be answer by trial/error but now days errors cost to much,so thanks for the guidence---kroll
LJP,thanks for the pic.I have an ideal now on what I need to look for


----------



## 34_40 (May 18, 2014)

Hi Kroll, like you I'm a new Atlas Mill owner,  and with your questions, I'm learning right along with you! 
I just brought mine home yesterday and will share some pics soon. 

Thanks in advance for all your help that you didn't know you were providing! :wavinghi:


----------



## Kroll (May 18, 2014)

Welcome 34-40,when you can please post some pics of your mill and maybe share how you come across it.One of the many things that makes Hobby-Machinist website fantastic is posters like yourself and the membership that helps us through and learn today,tomorrow,or whenever.Myself I know nothing about how to use a mill or anything about end mill holders or cutters.What I would like to find out is if I can get by with only one mill holder say a 1/2,then purchase end mills of different sizes but with 1/2 shanks.Learning as I go-----kroll


----------



## 34_40 (May 18, 2014)

Kroll said:


> Welcome 34-40,when you can please post some pics of your mill and maybe share how you come across it.One of the many things that makes Hobby-Machinist website fantastic is posters like yourself and the membership that helps us through and learn today,tomorrow,or whenever.Myself I know nothing about how to use a mill or anything about end mill holders or cutters.What I would like to find out is if I can get by with only one mill holder say a 1/2,then purchase end mills of different sizes but with 1/2 shanks.Learning as I go-----kroll



You can read all about the dilemma here! http://www.hobby-machinist.com/showthread.php?t=21602  The same guy that shared pics with you ( LJP ) owned my mill.  

And yes, you can buy 1 or 2 cutters or end mills and work with them and then buy more later.  It becomes more costly buying things piece by piece but sometimes you have to do what you must!


----------



## Kroll (May 18, 2014)

Well I be,I remember reading it and feeling sorry for you cause that has happen to me.(except I never got a second chance). Like alot of people here LJP is a class act for giving you first chance,this story has a happy ending for you,so congrats on your new mill----kroll


----------



## Bradrock (May 18, 2014)

Here's a new made over arm support:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Atlas-horiz...2?pt=BI_Tool_Work_Holding&hash=item563f162270

- - - Updated - - -

Here's a DVD I am really enjoying! It's the most I've ever paid for a video & I thought long and hard about it. But I now think it's worth every penny to a new Atlas mill owner.
Rudy is super easy to understand.
Now I want all of his videos & hope someday to buy one or more of the combo sets to save a bit.
I can almost promise you won't be sorry if you order one!

Have fun! I use mine all the time & love it!


http://bay-com.com/pid/72/machining_machine_lathe_milling_machine_lathe_operator_grinding.html


----------



## 34_40 (May 18, 2014)

Bradrock, LJP and I were just discussing that very video.  I'm glad to hear it's helpful, 'cause the price is a bit steep!  But I may re-consider now.

Did yours come with the blueprints for some parts?


----------



## wa5cab (May 25, 2014)

Kroll,

Yes, if you look hard enough you can probably still find 1/2" shank end mills in various diameters.  But at least new they are likely to be more expensive.  And with flats for set screws likely yet again more.  It is easier (and probably cheaper) to find them with smooth shanks in 1/16" increments.  I.e., 3/32" dia. cutter with 1/8" dia. shank.  My suggestion would be to buy a 1/16" increment set of 2MT collets.

Robert D.



Kroll said:


> What I would like to find out is if I can get by with only one mill holder say a 1/2,then purchase end mills of different sizes but with 1/2 shanks.Learning as I go-----kroll


----------



## WDG (May 28, 2014)

I have a bench mill and a knee machine.  I purchased a set of ER40 collets and use the one set for both machines.  The only additional thing I had to purchase was the collet holder but by having one set I don't have the extra cost of two sets.  My reason for going with the ER 40 is that I can change everything at the bottom of the quill without having to reach up to the top and loosen the draw bar as it always stays tight.  There are probably some that would rather use the collet with the taper for the machine, but I like my set up.  I do note that both machines have an R8 taper so I could still use a set of R8 collets, but I would still have to loosen the draw bar and I don't like do that.
I have two and four flute cutters and prefer the four flute if I don't have to start in the middle of a piece of work because they are faster.  There are some very large lots of cutters on Ebay but you have to be careful.  The pictures are deceiving and many that look sharp and good are not.  I had to return one lot and was out the shipping but it would have cost me a fortune to send them all out and get them sharpened.  What fooled me was the cosmolene (? or what ever it's called) on the end of many of the cutters.  I thought they would all be in good shape but they were not.  My worst two problems is that I am not good at sharpening bits of any kind so it is trial and error and the second is patience that I don't have and don't see any on Ebay either.  There are companies that sharpen bits but I have no idea how the cost would relate to having it sharpened against buying a new one.  Best bet is to have someone show you how to sharpen them (cause you're going to have to at some point) and next get a grinder with a good wheel and designate it for ONLY sharpening but and not for general grinding keeping a dressing wheel handy to keep it flat.
Just my 2 cents.


----------



## Kroll (Jun 1, 2014)

I'll have to google ER40 so that I can see what they are,I sure like your ideal of not having to change the MT#2 collet each time.Plus what I have read if I remember correctly is the holding power is better.Thanks for responding----kroll


----------



## wa5cab (Jun 1, 2014)

The ER type collets (they come in several different basic sizes which all take different collet chucks) work sorta like the collets in a Dremel, except that they are double ended.  If the chuck is 2MT, then it requires a draw bar and stock cannot be passed through them.  If that is an issue and you decide to go with one of them, I would recommend a threaded chuck instead of 2MT.  Since a milling machine normally holds cutters, not a workpiece, in the spindle (unlike a lathe) that shouldn't be an issue.  Unless you also have a 618 and want to use the same chuck with it.

Otherwise, changing ER collet sizes probably takes a little longer than changing MT collet sizes.  But their clamping diameter range should be a little greater than an MT.

Robert D.


----------



## Kenneth (Nov 25, 2017)

I just bought a Atlas MF horizontal mill. All the info you guys put out will really help me. My son went and picked it up for me and it's still at his house. I can hardly wait to get it.


----------



## larry4406 (Nov 25, 2017)

Kenneth - nice machine.  How much did it set you back?


----------



## francist (Nov 25, 2017)

Nice, looks like most of the pieces are there. At least on this side. 

Looking forward to more when you get it home.

-frank


----------



## 34_40 (Nov 25, 2017)

Welcome to the club. Looks like a nice machine. Pretty complete.
What's your plans?


----------



## JPMacG (Nov 25, 2017)

Very nice.  The arm of the level that engages the back gear is not broken.  That is unusual.   Most are broken.


----------



## Kroll (Nov 25, 2017)

That is fantastic Kenneth,really like the cast iron legs.If you do a search over on Youtube you will find several to watch maybe pick up some tips


----------



## Silverbullet (Nov 25, 2017)

If you get on eBay , search for 2 morse collets , or tool holders. Atlas Mill for parts and arbors. There are several tool stores on there for sets of collets. Shars is a good place to start, cadco ?? Is another. I have one too.


----------



## jakes_66 (Nov 25, 2017)

I see an arbor with a cutter, spacers, a vise, and even an original drawbar appears to be sticking out the back!  Nice score!  The arbors and drawbars are easily lost when the machines are stored and moved and sold, so it's really nice that you got them.  I don't recognize the gear mounted to the end of the spindle in place of the drive dog, it must be a retrofit of some kind.

All this and your machine has the power feed for the table.  Hope you enjoy!


----------



## Kenneth (Nov 25, 2017)

Thanks for all the comments. I hope it comes in handy helping me work on my 1966 Bronco Sport. I also have a Atlas 12X36 lathe. I should be able to make minor parts.


----------



## wa5cab (Nov 26, 2017)

I used to restore Land Rovers.  With a 12x36 Atlas you can turn brake drums up to 10".  Which was what the short wheelbase Rovers had.  Turn the compound around pointing towards you and 30 deg. to the left.  Use a boring bar (with the mininun amount stuck out) and carbide inserts.  Use a spare hub with the bearing cones removed and mount the drum on it before you put the hub in the chuck.


----------



## 34_40 (Nov 26, 2017)

And wrap the drum in some strapping of leather or rubber 'cause the harmonics will break your ear drums!


----------



## Billh50 (Nov 26, 2017)

34_40 said:


> And wrap the drum in some strapping of leather or rubber 'cause the harmonics will break your ear drums!



A flat rubber bungee cord works good for that.


----------



## wa5cab (Dec 4, 2017)

Yeah, forgot to mention the noise!


----------

