# Need some ideas on expanding the outer edge



## tim6575 (Nov 4, 2020)

okay here what im working on first let me explain what i do Im a magician for over 30 years and now have started making coins for my self .


Im working on an expanded shell half dollar, that when finished wil have another normal unmilled just regular coin nest into the milled out other 50Cent  coin the only thing is expanding the outer edge of the milled coin .

i have tried a refridgeration tool that expands pipe but the edge of the tooling slips off the very small edge of the milled out 50Cent coin.

any ideas? if you need pic let me know.


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## matthewsx (Nov 4, 2020)

Glue?

"Those who tell don't know and those who know don't tell"  I definitely don't know but lots of folks use crazy glue to hold small parts.

John


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## Flyinfool (Nov 4, 2020)

Pics and/or drawings will always help us visualize what you are trying to do.

That might be a  long way to stretch it, and the unmilled face will strongly resist the expansion.
Could you add some silver solder to the outside of the shelled coin to increase its Diameter, and then knurl it to match the original and that can give you the room to cut your pocket to hold the unmodified coin.

Another option may be to cut the milled coins center completely out so that you are left with a ring, it will be easier to then fit the ring over your stretcher to increase its dia, then silver solder it to a full coin so that you now have a full coin that is bigger in dia, then machine out your pocket.


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## pontiac428 (Nov 4, 2020)

I envision an expanding die that works like an internal collet with a plunger or ball expander and is operated with an arbor press.  That way the press force holds the die and work tightly together.  That's my shot in the dark, anyway.


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## markba633csi (Nov 4, 2020)

Gem cutter's pitch? Hard when cold but softens with heat
-mark


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## Diecutter (Nov 5, 2020)

Another idea is to use a hydraulic bench press and round tooling with a slight angle on it's outside diameter.  The downward hydraulic pressure would eliminate any raising of the round tool during expansion.  Removing material from the face of the tool would allow precise  adjustment to the coin pocket's final diameter.


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## tim6575 (Nov 5, 2020)

i was trying to use a refridgeration tool that expands pipe but some kind  jig will need to be made but no clue what the jig should look like lolso i started where anyone  would a holder for the tool as for the


markba633csi said:


> Gem cutter's pitch? Hard when cold but softens with heat
> -mark


i have thought of the annealing process but hve to be carful not to burn the coin it has to look brand new


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## tim6575 (Nov 5, 2020)

Diecutter said:


> Another idea is to use a hydraulic bench press and round tooling with a slight angle on it's outside diameter.  The downward hydraulic pressure would eliminate any raising of the round tool during expansion.  Removing material from the face of the tool would allow precise  adjustment to the coin pocket's final diameter.


i considering buying a harbor freight press but dont want to buy something if it wont be used but im considering


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## pontiac428 (Nov 5, 2020)

I bet you could apply all the pressure you need for this particular job with a bench vise.  Unless you've already worked a press into your magic routine!


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## Flyinfool (Nov 5, 2020)

The heat from anealing or silver soldering will discolor the surface of the coin. But that discoloration is easily removed.


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## tim6575 (Nov 5, 2020)

i was trying to use a refridgeration tool that expands pipe but some kind  jig will need to be made but no clue what the jig should look like lolso i started where anyone  would a holder for the tool as for the


matthewsx said:


> Glue?
> 
> "Those who tell don't know and those who know don't tell"  I definitely don't know but lots of folks use crazy glue to hold small parts.
> 
> John


added a pic


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## tim6575 (Nov 5, 2020)

by polishing or chemical?


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## tim6575 (Nov 5, 2020)

pic  i have more


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## Flyinfool (Nov 5, 2020)

That pic sure looks like the outer ring was soldered to the face as I described above. Polishing or chemical should work. You may need some of both.


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## tim6575 (Nov 7, 2020)

Flyinfool said:


> That pic sure looks like the outer ring was soldered to the face as I described above. Polishing or chemical should work. You may need some of both.


the coin in my hand is the fake coin the coin on my leg is a real coin that not been gaffed
so which one looks soldered?


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## BGHansen (Nov 7, 2020)

Maybe bore out the shell and don't try to expand the edge. Turn the solid coin down to fit and knurl the outside. Challenge will be work holding of the coin. You might try turning an arbor with a pocket for the coin, held in the head stock. Mash a center drilled round held in the tail stock into the face of the coin. Then peck away at the OD of the arbor/coin to diameter. You'll be turning away the pocket for the coin and relying on friction to hold it in place.

Another thought is mash the tail stock piece to the coin with some JB Weld. Turn the OD, knurl and apply some heat to remove the coin.

Bruce

P.s. I have a few old Gilbert Mysto Magic sets that use a stamping for the shell. Definite loss of details in the stamping but it was a kid's toy. Still makes for a nice truck shaking coins in your hand and making one disappear.


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## addertooth (Nov 7, 2020)

Another classic is using a modern zinc core penny, score one side, then toss in nitric acid.  It will eat the zinc out of the copper-clad penny and produce a shell, which a dime will fit perfectly in. The old turn a penny into a dime trick.  Because the colors are not similar the change is from penny to dime is very clear.  Because the copper "shell of a penny" is very thin when the zinc core is removed, it can simply be easily crushed into a BB sized wad of copper (thus ridding any evidence that the "penny" ever existed.  No carefully milling or expanding a rim required.


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## Flyinfool (Nov 7, 2020)

tim6575 said:


> the coin in my hand is the fake coin the coin on my leg is a real coin that not been gaffed
> so which one looks soldered?



The one in your hand. Looking at the seam between the inside of the rim and the inside of the flat face. That does not look like a machined corner. It looks to be a solder joint. 
In this application you could even soft solder it so the temps will never be high enough to discolor anything.


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## Weldingrod1 (Nov 7, 2020)

I suggest making a nest that the shell can sit in, that has your target diameter so you have good control of the motion. Maybe a shelf around the edge and a central plastic filled recess to support that area.

Make an expander that just goes into your shell's rim and swage it out.

As for the expander, one route would be a split ring with a tapered ID and a matching tapered plug. A segmented collet is another thought. 

My best idea: use a rubber plug either recess size or a little taller. Use a steel punch that is a pretty close fit on the shell, and some kind of alignment jig. The rubber will follow the shell outward. It will also drive the shell down, so for that one you may want a max OD control ring with a rubber plug under the shell to avoid boogering the face. That design would also make centering the punch easy! You will have to fiddle clearances to get rubber extrusion under control. 0.010" gap should be safe for pretty high pressure.

You may need to try and spot anneal the rim. Depends on the work hardening during the coining process.

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


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## Weldingrod1 (Nov 7, 2020)

Btw, coins are made from layered blanks with a Copper core. I'm pretty sure they are metallurgically bonded during rolling, rather than soldering.

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk


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## RJSakowski (Nov 7, 2020)

US coins are made by either roll bonding or explosion welding the three layers.  Roll bonding is done by heating the metal and rolling under high pressure to achieve the bond.  Explosion welding is done by stacking the layers and using an explosive charge atop one layer to force the layers into intimate contact with each other, creating the bond.


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## pontiac428 (Nov 7, 2020)

It's called "cladding" and more resembles a weld at the molecular level.  Copper moves into the nickel layer and vise versa. 

Step 1 should be finding the collet you need to fix a half dollar to your lathe and hollowing a few out.  Seems like there are a couple of useful ideas for expanding the hollow shell.  At $0.50 per attempt, there's no reason not to see what works.


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## RJSakowski (Nov 7, 2020)

I don't think it is practical to expand the perimeter of a hollowed out coin.  Even if you can expand part of the edge, the junction between the edge and the face will be rounded.
You might have success by cutting away the interior of the coin leaving a rim and then stretching that so an OEM coin can fit inside.  A third coin would be faced to a thin disk and silver soldered to the expanded rim to create the container.    There will be a small line of silver solder corresponding to the clearance fit for the OEM coin but it should be unnoticeable under casual inspection.  Before facing the coin, the edge could be worked to expand the diameter slightly for a closer fit.  

As I recall, it was John Saunders, NYC CNC, that did a video on cutting down a coin.  I believe that he glued the coin down with super glue.

I would mount a piece of aluminum in the lathe and machine a pocket for a snug fit of the coin.  Then, I would glue a coin in with super glue and machine the coin.   When finished, the assembly can be trimmed to remove excess material and the remainder of the aluminum dissolved away with a dilute sodium hydroxide solution.  The super glue can be removed with actone or, more quickly, with Goof Off ™ super glue remover leaving the machined coin behind.


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## tim6575 (Nov 7, 2020)

RJSakowski said:


> I don't think it is practical to expand the perimeter of a hollowed out coin.  Even if you can expand part of the edge, the junction between the edge and the face will be rounded.
> You might have success by cutting away the interior of the coin leaving a rim and then stretching that so an OEM coin can fit inside.  A third coin would be faced to a thin disk and silver soldered to the expanded rim to create the container.    There will be a small line of silver solder corresponding to the clearance fit for the OEM coin but it should be unnoticeable under casual inspection.  Before facing the coin, the edge could be worked to expand the diameter slightly for a closer fit.
> 
> As I recall, it was John Saunders, NYC CNC, that did a video on cutting down a coin.  I believe that he glued the coin down with super glue.
> ...


holy s*** thats a good idea  btw  i bought a press yesterday just to try something similar


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## tim6575 (Nov 7, 2020)

tim6575 said:


> holy s*** thats a good idea  btw  i bought a press yesterday just to try something similar


silver solder is that a special kind of solder or is all solder silver solder ?


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## tim6575 (Nov 7, 2020)

RJSakowski said:


> I don't think it is practical to expand the perimeter of a hollowed out coin.  Even if you can expand part of the edge, the junction between the edge and the face will be rounded.
> You might have success by cutting away the interior of the coin leaving a rim and then stretching that so an OEM coin can fit inside.  A third coin would be faced to a thin disk and silver soldered to the expanded rim to create the container.    There will be a small line of silver solder corresponding to the clearance fit for the OEM coin but it should be unnoticeable under casual inspection.  Before facing the coin, the edge could be worked to expand the diameter slightly for a closer fit.
> 
> As I recall, it was John Saunders, NYC CNC, that did a video on cutting down a coin.  I believe that he glued the coin down with super glue.
> ...


silver solder is that a special kind of solder or is all solder silver solder ?


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## tim6575 (Nov 7, 2020)

pontiac428 said:


> It's called "cladding" and more resembles a weld at the molecular level.  Copper moves into the nickel layer and vise versa.
> 
> Step 1 should be finding the collet you need to fix a half dollar to your lathe and hollowing a few out.  Seems like there are a couple of useful ideas for expanding the hollow shell.  At $0.50 per attempt, there's no reason not to see what works.


already have my collets made and for my quarter too and for my englis and centavos


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## tim6575 (Nov 7, 2020)

remember this name 2 to 5 years from now if we havent been depopulated  by the tyrants that be We Build Ilusion will be one of the main magic makers thats the goal and working on negotiations with collectors work Shop.


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## tim6575 (Nov 7, 2020)

RJSakowski said:


> US coins are made by either roll bonding or explosion welding the three layers.  Roll bonding is done by heating the metal and rolling under high pressure to achieve the bond.  Explosion welding is done by stacking the layers and using an explosive charge atop one layer to force the layers into intimate contact with each other, creating the bond.


uh  that part doesnt sound right i use to make silver coins and bars we used dies


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## tim6575 (Nov 7, 2020)

addertooth said:


> Another classic is using a modern zinc core penny, score one side, then toss in nitric acid.  It will eat the zinc out of the copper-clad penny and produce a shell, which a dime will fit perfectly in. The old turn a penny into a dime trick.  Because the colors are not similar the change is from penny to dime is very clear.  Because the copper "shell of a penny" is very thin when the zinc core is removed, it can simply be easily crushed into a BB sized wad of copper (thus ridding any evidence that the "penny" ever existed.  No carefully milling or expanding a rim required.


yes i also plan on make nickels to dimes and the one i think  you are talking about is a matchbox put penny on someones  hgand and place matchbox on top  penny changes to the dime and penny reappears inside the matchbox


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## tim6575 (Nov 7, 2020)

Flyinfool said:


> That pic sure looks like the outer ring was soldered to the face as I described above. Polishing or chemical should work. You may need some of both.


oh  no  the bottom pic  is the shell on bottom upside down with the real coin placed inside


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## tim6575 (Nov 7, 2020)

heres  a silver walking liberty shell expanded by one of thebest  Johnson


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## pontiac428 (Nov 7, 2020)

There is no reason you can't do that with a die of the right diameter and only a slight chamfer for alignment.  Use any means necessary for the press.  If you machine the edge thin enough, you could even drive the die with a dead blow hammer and accomplish your goal.


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## RJSakowski (Nov 7, 2020)

tim6575 said:


> uh  that part doesnt sound right i use to make silver coins and bars we used dies


The roll bonding or explosion welding was to make the laminated sheet.  The sheet was then sent to the mint for blanking.  When the laminated coins first were issued they made some fuss over using an explosion to form the laminate.  Apparently, roll bonding has replaced it for current coins.


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## RJSakowski (Nov 7, 2020)

tim6575 said:


> silver solder is that a special kind of solder or is all solder silver solder ?



Silver solder is a silver bearing solder that melts at a higher temperature than soft solder but a lower temperature than braze.  Jewelers use silver solder extensively as they create their jewelry.  It is available with multiple melting temperatures which allows jewelers to add pieces to a fabrication without melting previous work.


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## tim6575 (Nov 8, 2020)

pontiac428 said:


> There is no reason you can't do that with a die of the right diameter and only a slight chamfer for alignment.  Use any means necessary for the press.  If you machine the edge thin enough, you could even drive the die with a dead blow hammer and accomplish your goal.


just got some map gas to anneal coin


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## tim6575 (Nov 8, 2020)

thank you everyone none of us is greater then all of us and by that i mean by all of us brain storming we can use our ideas and know how to help each other out And want to say thank you  for your time and knowledge thanks. I will let you know if im successful .I have no choice  but to be So I will just in time.


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## tim6575 (Nov 8, 2020)

ALL THE PRESS IS  doing is tearing ing it up and the idea about machinging it out then pressing one ito it would that be the same od  once the oem coin is pressed yeah im losing ideas the only other thing but wouldnt know how to make on a lathe is a tapered die


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## tim6575 (Nov 9, 2020)

good news  and bad news   Okay i have got the coin to expand around a new 2019 50cent from th mint well started either way  i have a new coin fitting into a milled 50cent . bad  news is.  You know those beveled washers the outtter rim  of the expanded coin has started to buckeland the discoloration i can fix by polishing its just how in the hell to you keep from buckeling probably starting to get off topic of this forum. but thats where iam


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## tim6575 (Nov 9, 2020)

anyone have any ideas on how to go about the above mentioned cutting the rim and Soldering on . .?maybe take a coin punch and cut the outter rim of two coins  take jewlers saw cut the rim in half then start soldering onto a brand new coin then mill out?


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## Flyinfool (Nov 9, 2020)

Start with a full coin.
Drill a hole in the center to be able to mount it on a mandrel.
Trepan off the ring at the desired wall thickness.
Use your pipe stretcher to increase the diameter of the ring so that a full coin will fit inside it with the desired force. You may need to anneal the ring to get it to stretch and not just break, the ring will want to break due to the knurling on the outside, every single knurl is a stress riser.
Glue a full coin to a flat surface with a removable glue, machine this coin to the desired final thickness, I would guess the thinner the better, It may take a few tries to learn just how far you can go.
Solder this to the ring being careful to mot melt the thin coin parts or use to much solder where it will make a big fillet on the inside corner.
Polish off any excess solder on the outside of the joint.

For this job I do not think you want or need to use a silver brazing alloy, It heat is likely to damage the parts and this will not be a highly stressed joint. Even electrical grade solder, good old 60/40 if you can still find it, will be more than strong enough and is close enough to the color of the coin that it will be hard to spot. There are silver bearing solders that have 3 to 8% silver added that will also work well and melt at about the same temp as electrical solder, they are a bit stronger and flow really well into thin cracks.


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## tim6575 (Nov 9, 2020)

Flyinfool said:


> Start with a full coin.
> Drill a hole in the center to be able to mount it on a mandrel.
> Trepan off the ring at the desired wall thickness.
> Use your pipe stretcher to increase the diameter of the ring so that a full coin will fit inside it with the desired force. You may need to anneal the ring to get it to stretch and not just break, the ring will want to break due to the knurling on the outside, every single knurl is a stress riser.
> ...


my lathe is a grizzly G0602 i have been using 5c emergency collets any particular mandrel i should know about ?cause in the past i have bought stuffnot knowing theres ton of other stuff to get up and going .thanks ahead of time.


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## Tim9 (Nov 9, 2020)

FWIW.... looks like you’re using a copper alloy coin. Pre 1964 coins are 90% silver. Silver is much softer. It’s going to be easier using silver in my opinion.


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## Flyinfool (Nov 9, 2020)

Mandrel is easy.
Put a chunk of scrap stock in the 3 jaw, face it, drill it, tap it, bolt the drilled coin to it, trepan it, done.


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## tim6575 (Nov 9, 2020)

deleted


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## tim6575 (Nov 9, 2020)

Tim9 said:


> FWIW.... looks like you’re using a copper alloy coin. Pre 1964 coins are 90% silver. Silver is much softer. It’s going to be easier using silver in my opinion.


i agree but people want to do magic with things that are more likly to be real world and cheaper


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## Tim9 (Nov 9, 2020)

tim6575 said:


> i agree but people want to do magic with things that are more likly to be real world and cheaper


It isn’t that easy to distinguish a Kennedy half dollar that is silver versus a Kenney Half Dollar that’s copper clad. The motto hasn’t changed. They are both Kennedy Half Dollars
buying a silver Kennedy only cost 9.50 more than the copper. Am I missing something  ?


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## tim6575 (Nov 10, 2020)

Flyinfool said:


> Start with a full coin.
> Drill a hole in the center to be able to mount it on a mandrel.
> Trepan off the ring at the desired wall thickness.
> Use your pipe stretcher to increase the diameter of the ring so that a full coin will fit inside it with the desired force. You may need to anneal the ring to get it to stretch and not just break, the ring will want to break due to the knurling on the outside, every single knurl is a stress riser.
> ...


dont have the patients to solder  need 5 arms  for the shzzz


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## tim6575 (Nov 10, 2020)

tim6575 said:


> dont have the patients to solder  need 5 arms  for the shzzz


that key word  riser reminds me of someone lol


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## tim6575 (Nov 10, 2020)

Tim9 said:


> It isn’t that easy to distinguish a Kennedy half dollar that is silver versus a Kenney Half Dollar that’s copper clad. The motto hasn’t changed. They are both Kennedy Half Dollars
> buying a silver Kennedy only cost 9.50 more than the copper. Am I missing something  ?


sorry miss understood i was thinking walking liberty my mistake


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## Tim9 (Nov 10, 2020)

No problem. It’s just that silver coins are real soft compared to copper clad coins. In fact, I remember as a kid... taking a silver quarter.....drilling a hole in it for my finger. Then.....I’d sit in front of the TV and tap the edges with a tablespoon for hours. Before you know it....the edges were mashed out and presto, I had a silver ring. This was like 1972. Flower Power and hippie stuff. 
    But it was interesting how fast one could fashion a ring out of a silver quarter by just tapping on the edges with a spoon.


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## Papa Charlie (Nov 10, 2020)

That shell looks like it is a stamped piece, most likely they had a die made to match the side of the coin and the edge then stamped them from a solid disc to create the cup and imprint the coin face all in one motion. I don't believe they modified an actual coin.


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## Tim9 (Nov 11, 2020)

Papa Charlie. I think you’re correct. I vaguely remember an article or video on how someone made some of these coin shells. I’m thinking that a plaster mold is made of a 50 cent piece by doing multiple thin dips of the coin into thinned  plaster so that you have a clear representation of the coin face.... and somehow through the process of plaster molds and silicone molds... finally a die is cast which is now larger. By dipping into plaster.... removing....dipping.....and repeating this process a few times, one ends up with a slightly larger representation plaster mold of the coin. Then the silicone mold is made of this and finally the reverse can be cast using plaster.
You now have a pattern which represents the coin but is large enough for the shell so you can fit the original sized 50 cent piece into it.
As far as the die to stamp your shells....Just needs to be a metal hard enough to form a soft silver alloy. Maybe a silver / lead , Zinc, or tin based alloy in which you can then form your shell. And although cast iron is obviously great for a die... maybe a hard bronze will suffice. No matter what, we are talking about a lot of work.
  But I vaguely think that the thin dipping into plaster is what gets you to a 50 cents piece which is a little bigger than the original. As far as exacting metal alloys....just not my forte. But I’m think copper based alloys give you harder metals. Lead and zinc give you softer ones.

   Personally, to find out more.... I’d shoot an email to Clicksprings / Ramnsey’s website. Or ask him on one of his videos for maybe pointing you in the right direction. I’m betting he would know how it’s done. That’s one talented guy in my opinion. There’s  bound to be something out there somewhere.
  All that said....it’s a heck of a lot of work and probably cheaper to just buy one.






						Expanded Shell - Half Dollar (Head) - Tango D0001
					

Expanded Shell Half Dollar (Head) by Tango




					www.propdog.co.uk
				




not saying it’s cheap. But by the time you tool up and buy your supplies to make one, it’s still more cost affective.


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## francist (Nov 11, 2020)

It is possible to swell or shrink silicone moulds with the use of a solvent such as acetone or toluene. To achieve a larger than original casting the silicone mould is soaked in the solvent which causes it to swell. The yield is a larger than original casting. To achieve a smaller casting than original the solvent is mixed into the liquid moulding material when it is being prepared. As the silicone cures the solvent off-gasses and yields a smaller than original mould.

There is a practical limit of expansion or shrinkage and some distortion can occur at larger ratios, but for small variances I believe the results would be convincing. I’ve used the Smooth-On line of moulding products pretty exclusively and they have a pretty good Q&A section on the website for more information on stuff like this.

-frank


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## tim6575 (Nov 11, 2020)

Papa Charlie said:


> That shell looks like it is a stamped piece, most likely they had a die made to match the side of the coin and the edge then stamped them from a solid disc to create the cup and imprint the coin face all in one motion. I don't believe they modified an actual coin.


the silver one from johnson i looked at under microscope found traces of solder does this help anyone?


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## tim6575 (Nov 11, 2020)

francist said:


> It is possible to swell or shrink silicone moulds with the use of a solvent such as acetone or toluene. To achieve a larger than original casting the silicone mould is soaked in the solvent which causes it to swell. The yield is a larger than original casting. To achieve a smaller casting than original the solvent is mixed into the liquid moulding material when it is being prepared. As the silicone cures the solvent off-gasses and yields a smaller than original mould.
> 
> There is a practical limit of expansion or shrinkage and some distortion can occur at larger ratios, but for small variances I believe the results would be convincing. I’ve used the Smooth-On line of moulding products pretty exclusively and they have a pretty good Q&A section on the website for more information on stuff like this.
> 
> -frank


where talking about metal coin


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## tim6575 (Nov 13, 2020)

Tim9 said:


> Papa Charlie. I think you’re correct. I vaguely remember an article or video on how someone made some of these coin shells. I’m thinking that a plaster mold is made of a 50 cent piece by doing multiple thin dips of the coin into thinned  plaster so that you have a clear representation of the coin face.... and somehow through the process of plaster molds and silicone molds... finally a die is cast which is now larger. By dipping into plaster.... removing....dipping.....and repeating this process a few times, one ends up with a slightly larger representation plaster mold of the coin. Then the silicone mold is made of this and finally the reverse can be cast using plaster.
> You now have a pattern which represents the coin but is large enough for the shell so you can fit the original sized 50 cent piece into it.
> As far as the die to stamp your shells....Just needs to be a metal hard enough to form a soft silver alloy. Maybe a silver / lead , Zinc, or tin based alloy in which you can then form your shell. And although cast iron is obviously great for a die... maybe a hard bronze will suffice. No matter what, we are talking about a lot of work.
> But I vaguely think that the thin dipping into plaster is what gets you to a 50 cents piece which is a little bigger than the original. As far as exacting metal alloys....just not my forte. But I’m think copper based alloys give you harder metals. Lead and zinc give you softer ones.
> ...


some people just want to know how to make and you never know i might be the next johnson coin manufacture


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## tim6575 (Nov 13, 2020)

i have looked into having a die made waiting on reply .would rather make one every 30 min vs one every 5 hours with crap results lol


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## Tim9 (Nov 15, 2020)

Well...if you want to make it and time and effort isn’t an issue. Then like I say. By dipping a half dollar into a thinned plaster Paris slurry... remove...dry...repeat.... then you’re now making an image for a pattern which is larger than a 50 cent piece. The thinned slurry will run off the 50 cent piece and have a close resemblance of the coin.
   Of course there will be some adjustments to the plaster recipe because just letting it quickly dry and it’s going to flake off. But I’m thinking there’s a way of getting there. Maybe making a silicone pattern of the 50 cent piece and then using it as the pattern original and then dipping the silicone  in the slurry.

  The point being is after a few dips in slurry you now have a close resemblance of the 50 cent piece but it’s larger since each dip increases the size. And you’d need to hold the coin or master silicone pattern with tweezers.  Once you get to the right size.... then you will make a pattern of this now larger 50 cent piece  to cast your now larger 50 cent piece which will act as you shell. You can cast it in cast iron..... if you are looking for a die.

FWIW.... MyFordBoy on YouTube has tons of high quality backyard casting videos. He’s a expert in my opinion when it comes to casting..

really a highly skilled pattern maker and backyard foundry guy.


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## tim6575 (Nov 17, 2020)

I have come to the conclusion im going to have a over sized die made just little bit bigger then original oem coin i will be shipping a ex shell to the die maker problem solved.


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