# Atlas Craftsman 101.07300 Can I swap the headstock with a later model??



## robert574 (Jul 11, 2020)

Just thinking, my 6" lathe 101.07300 has a 3/4" spindle.  Does anyone know if I swapped out the headstock for a 618 (101.07301 or later) with a 1" spindle, would it fit and the rest of the gears, covers and other parts fit?  Clearly the chuck threads are a problem.  Has anyone done this?  

Thanks for any help.


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## Ulma Doctor (Jul 11, 2020)

i can see challenges to the swap like headstock alignment and pitch, tailstock alignment and pitch
but- if you were so inclined, the challenges can be overcome- be ready for a project of great undertaking


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## LF_WS (Jul 11, 2020)

If you haven't already done so, you might want to look at comparable lathes listed over at VintageMachinery.org - Craftsman Metal Lathes 
Comparing photos of different models may give some insight into the issues you'd be likely to confront in doing the transplant.

For what it's worth:  I note there's only one 101.07300 lathe like yours registered on VintageMachinery.org, but lots of later 101.07301 & 101.21400 6" lathes.  Your model was apparently only marketed for one year (1938), while the later models were sold for decades. I don't know what the collector's market might be for a seemingly scarse example of the early model, but you might save yourself heartache in the long run by selling it unmolested and just buying a later model with the proceeds+the cash you'd have to invest in acquiring the newer headstock & whatever other parts you might need.


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## mickri (Jul 11, 2020)

You could compare the part numbers on the 101-07301 to the part numbers on your lathe.  If they are the same except for the headstock then the swap may be possible.  http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/222/17735.pdf

I personally would not alter a rare lathe like yours for the reasons in LF-WS's post.


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## robert574 (Jul 11, 2020)

Thanks.  Does anyone have a copy of the parts list for the 101.07300?

I wonder how they lined up the spindle bore and the tail stock.   Surely there was a fixture of some sort.


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## mickri (Jul 11, 2020)

I might be wrong but I believe the alignment on the headstock comes from the precision machining of the bed and the headstock.  The tailstock is typically adjustable.  Lots of threads on the forum on aligning the tailstock.
The part numbers on your 101.07300 should be cast into or stamped on the parts.  Might have to take some of the parts off to find the part numbers but they are going to be there.


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## robert574 (Jul 11, 2020)

I found some numbers.  The end cover is the same number as the 101.07301, the lever that engages the gears is the same, but the top cover over the belts on the headstock on mine is a L9-22 and the one on the parts list is a L9-22A.  The gear table plate inside the end cover looks almost brand new and is the same number.  I also don't have a back gear.  The whole lathe is blue.  Is that the right color?

edit: I did a search for 101.07300 lathe and there are pictures of some different ones.  They are the same blue as mine.


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## mickri (Jul 11, 2020)

I think the most critical part number to look for would be the bed part number.  If those numbers are the same then the later headstock should fit.

I did some searching online and came across a 101.07300 lathe bed for sale on Ebay.  One of the pictures showed a part number of L9-1 https://www.ebay.com/itm/333333576708


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## Ulma Doctor (Jul 11, 2020)

mickri said:


> I might be wrong but I believe the alignment on the headstock comes from the precision machining of the bed and the headstock.  The tailstock is typically adjustable.  Lots of threads on the forum on aligning the tailstock.
> The part numbers on your 101.07300 should be cast into or stamped on the parts.  Might have to take some of the parts off to find the part numbers but they are going to be there.


The headstock will require utmost care in alignment . A fraction of a decimal value will have consequences. You will cut tapers.
If the height of the tailstock doesn’t match the new headstock, you will turn nothin but tapers.


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## robert574 (Jul 12, 2020)

mickri said:


> I think the most critical part number to look for would be the bed part number.  If those numbers are the same then the later headstock should fit.
> 
> I did some searching online and came across a 101.07300 lathe bed for sale on Ebay.  One of the pictures showed a part number of L9-1 https://www.ebay.com/itm/333333576708


Looking at the beds was a really good idea.  It turns out that the 101.07300, 101.07301 and 101.21400 lathes all use the L9-1 bed casting.  I also found pictures of a number of different beds all and of the ones above look to have the exact same machining for the headstock on the bed.


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## wa5cab (Jul 12, 2020)

Actually, the height error statement is only conditionally true.  The theoretical error in diameter due to an error in tailstock height (assuming that the part is being turned between centers) depends upon the diameter of the workpiece.  The larger the diameter the less the error.  I did an extensive workup on it several years ago that you will find in the Atlas section of Downloads and in Files in the A-C group on groups,io.  In general, the tailstock height error has negligible effect (meaning that the diameter error is less than 0.0010") on the finished diameter if the finished diameter is greater than about 5/8" and if the height error is equal to 0.01".  The file name of the paper is "Tailstock Height and Bed Wear Errors.pdf".


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## wa5cab (Jul 12, 2020)

On the letters and numbers cast into parts made from castings, technically the letters/numbers are the casting part number.  If the machining changed but the casting didn't, the part number got a suffix "A", "B". etc. but the casting number didn't change.  Initially, the part number of the 612 and 618 bed part number was M6-1.  Sometime between 1940 and 1945, the Atlas 6" bed part number changed to L9-1.  Why they changed M6-1 to L9-1 instead of the opposite is unknown.  Possibly they were selling more 101.07301's than 618's at the time.  Possibly the pattern happened to have L9-1 installed on it when they decided to consolidate  the numbers.  Who knows?  But in any case, the 6" bed part number remained L9-1 at least until 1976.  So that would not be an issue.  You should be able to fit a 618, 101.07301, 101.21400, 3950, or 101.21200 headstock to the existing bed.  However, I am inclined to agree that it might be better to swap lathes than to swap headstocks.


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## Ulma Doctor (Jul 12, 2020)

robert574 said:


> Looking at the beds was a really good idea.  It turns out that the 101.07300, 101.07301 and 101.21400 lathes all use the L9-1 bed casting.  I also found pictures of a number of different beds all and of the ones above look to have the exact same machining for the headstock on the bed.


just because the headstock mounts the same, it may (read: will) not be in the same alignment of the original headstock


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## robert574 (Jul 12, 2020)

I did see a lot of beds that clearly had different machining for the headstock and that's why I settled on the two I listed as possibilities.  I like the idea that most of you think I need a new lathe.  I feel the same way.  I just don't see a lot of lathes for sale locally and I definitely would like to check it out in person before I buy another.  Since I'm dreaming anyway, my goal is a spindle that can handle a 5C collet closer and have a chip pan,  but all I have ever seen have been way over priced.  I put a couple of new searches on Craig's list around Orlando.   Heck maybe one of you fell into some bucks and are buying a brand new one and I can take the old one off your hands.


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## wa5cab (Jul 12, 2020)

Robert,

If by "handle a 5C collet Closer" you mean also that the hollow spindle must pass the largest diameter rod that a 5C collet will hold (1-1/16" I think), you are talking about an expensive machine, not an over-priced one.  Out of the realm of most hobbyists.  On the other hand, if your target working stock will be limited to 5 or 6 inches long, there are a lot of front-mounted screw-on collet chucks available, including many that will fit the 10" and 12" Atlas-built machines.  And other brands that have 1-1/2"-8 spindle nose threads and 25/32" diameter bores.  And Royal once made a front-mounted lever operated collet closer that would also fit that thread and those lathes.


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## robert574 (Jul 12, 2020)

If you went to look at a lathe say with V ways and you wanted to know how worn the ways were, would you put a piece of drill rod between centers and set a magnetic base indicator on the tool rest and run it back and forth?  Or is there a better way?  There is a good chance the lathe might not be connected to power.

I saw some lathes for around $3000 or less on Craigs lists.  Not real close by though.  Do they have something like an AAA meeting for people who buy lathes, mills and all kinds of tooling and tools?  Maybe I could go to one of those and buy something from them.  I'm not ready to be cured yet. The lack of stuff available is the only thing that has hindered me so far.

When I was younger starting out back in the '70s  I took some machine shop classes from the tech school.  It cost $90/semester, met twice weekly for 15 weeks (or 30 sessions at $3 night) and my employer paid for mine.  All of your stock and materials were at the school cost and a lot was donated.  All of the tooling was supplied and even your tools.  Large companies would take your work, heat treat and black or plate it for free and return it.  When I went to class, about half of the students were in the class room for the beginning and the rest were in the shop.  The half in the shop just signed up to have a shop to work in and make stuff and work on cars.  Most of them were as knowledgeable as the instructor and would drop everything to answer a question or show you how to do something (like here).  I had tried to get a better job at my company and wanted work in the machine shop but I was told repeatedly there were no openings.  They asked me why I was bothering to enroll in classes and I said I was going to do it anyway.  They day after the first class, the head of the machine shop came to me and asked what I learned.  I told him a lot about safety and how to turn a lathe off and on. He walked me back to the machine shop and put me to work at my new job.  After that, the day before every class, they asked me what we were going to learn on the machines that night and they showed me and had me do it at work first.  What's the moral you say?  Easy, three dollars a night for a full machine shop.


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## mickri (Jul 12, 2020)

The easiest way to search craigslist over a wide area is to use search tempest.  https://www.searchtempest.com/  That is what I used when I was looking for a lathe.  I found that estate sales where the heirs just wanted to be rid of stuff had the best deals.  Also look into auction sites in your area.  You can sometimes find good deals on older large lathes that most hobby guys don't want.  The biggest thing is to be patient.  Don't be in a rush.  You will find what you are looking for at a price you can afford.


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## robert574 (Jul 21, 2020)

wa5cab said:


> On the letters and numbers cast into parts made from castings, technically the letters/numbers are the casting part number.  If the machining changed but the casting didn't, the part number got a suffix "A", "B". etc. but the casting number didn't change.  Initially, the part number of the 612 and 618 bed part number was M6-1.  Sometime between 1940 and 1945, the Atlas 6" bed part number changed to L9-1.  Why they changed M6-1 to L9-1 instead of the opposite is unknown.  Possibly they were selling more 101.07301's than 618's at the time.  Possibly the pattern happened to have L9-1 installed on it when they decided to consolidate  the numbers.  Who knows?  But in any case, the 6" bed part number remained L9-1 at least until 1976.  So that would not be an issue.  You should be able to fit a 618, 101.07301, 101.21400, 3950, or 101.21200 headstock to the existing bed.  However, I am inclined to agree that it might be better to swap lathes than to swap headstocks.



Since this is an Atlas lathe, the Atlas #618 might be a fit?  The 101.07300 spindle doesn't have bushings (just cast iron), the 101.07301 looks to have the same casting (no bearing caps) but did they install spindle bushings in the headstock?  How did that work?


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## wa5cab (Jul 21, 2020)

Yes, I listed everything from 618 to 3950 as using the same finished bed part number.  

If the 101.07300 did not have the same spindle bushings as the 101.07301, then it might have used the same headstock raw casting (you should be able to find the casting number) but not the same finish-machined headstock.  The 101.07300 spindle had 3/4"-16 threads on the spindle nose.  The 101.07301 had 1"-8.  (and the 618 and every other Atlas 6" had 1"-10).  At any rate, the 101.07301 spindle bearings are 1" nominal bore and the journals are half split on the front with a clamping screw that locks the bushing in place.


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