# Pm-1440b



## oldhank60 (Mar 8, 2015)

I am getting ready to purchase the 1440B   it has everything I am looking for and more standard options than my other choice 1340GT. except not made in Taiwan,  I will use this mostly for gunsmith work, threading barrels either end.  making some class III items , I do hold a 07 FFL license,   I have  a old Cincinnati tray top lathe that I refurbished a few years back,  tooling is expensive for LO spindle. With what it would cost to buy or make for lathe I could almost  pay for the 1440B  and still not have what I will get Buying the new lathe.  I have done search for reviews on PM lathes and mostly all I see is positive. I have contacted matt with email,   I dont see any downside.     I will also use this lathe for small contracts I can land in my area.  I can retire at anytime  now, If I wait the chance are I will not be able to buy new after retirement.  
could some tell me what problems the 1440b's have if any.. I'm talking out of the box.  all machines have something that has to be dealt with even the hi dollat machines seem to have little things that need attention before they settle down to run production or single parts. 
What will it be with the 1440 B?

Hank


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## wrmiller (Mar 8, 2015)

Hi Hank, and welcome to the forum. 

Can't speak to the 1440B as I went with your other choice (1340GT). But I just wanted to say Hi and to say how pleasantly surprised I was to see someone as the question about out-of-the-box issues. Some people don't realize that all of these machines, regardless of cost, have things that have to be dealt with in order to get them all tuned up. I looked at the 1440BV as a possible, but decided I didn't want to deal with a lathe that large. We all make choices. 

If I remember correctly, we have a few members with this lathe, and hopefully they will show up soon. Of course you know that when someone here gets a new machine we expect pics and a write-up.


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## darkzero (Mar 8, 2015)

Here's a video review of the PM1440-BV from one of our members. It's basically the same lathe as the PM1440-B but with variable speed.


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## mksj (Mar 9, 2015)

Thank you darkzero for posting this video, very informative/nice review. The VFD variable speed is great for adjusting the speed on the fly, and getting the sweet spot dialed in. Would recommend getting the BV version if you go with the PM1440. If the 1340GT, consider adding a VFD for about $400 to the 3 phase model. A number of individuals have also gone to Set-Tru type or higher end type chucks, but the costs add up. If using 5C collets, consider a 5mt to 5C adapter from JFK Co Precision Products or for the 1340GT D1-4, a Lathemaster Tru-stting 5C.


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## maker of things (Mar 9, 2015)

Hank,
  I have been quite happy with my PM1440E I posted tons of pics about it in an earlier thread http://www.hobby-machinist.com/threads/precision-mathews-pm1440e-lb-lathe.26414/ Matt told me it was basically the same machine as the B but without the step pulley from the motor to the spindle.  Since the site was redone the pics are all very small.  
  I can only recall 3 things that I had to sort out with my lathe.  1) the forward/reverse switch was hooked up so that the lever up=forward which was backwards (Matt walked me through swapping the wires) 2)the plate the holds the tail stock in place was not machined well so it did not clamp the tail stock in place (quick clean up on the mill fixed). 3) the vernier dial for the cross slide was for a metric threaded machine. (Matt shipped me the correct part).  
  The stock chuck had very tight runout but I wanted the 2 piece jaws so I ordered a replacement.  Not a problem, but something to be aware of.
  Can't speak to the Taiwan lathes, but pretty much all of the 12x36-14x40 chinese lathes that I researched have difficult tension adjustment and really cheap v belts, so expect to do some amount of fiddling at some point there.
  I'm happy with the wedge type qctp that came on my lathe (as a rank amateur) but of late the chinese BXA holders have been hard to get ahold of I suspect from spring festival shipping interruptions and the relative popularity of that size.


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## darkzero (Mar 9, 2015)

mksj said:


> Thank you darkzero for posting this video, very informative/nice review.



I once had my eye on the BV. The one thing I did not like about it which I did not know until that video, is the foot brake is not really a foot brake. It just cuts the power to the spindle. The foot brake on my 1236 is a real mechanical foot brake. In addition to cutting power, it engages a drum brake inside the spindle pulley.

Not really a deal breaker but I guess I'm spolied. My next lathe has to have a real foot brake too.


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## maker of things (Mar 10, 2015)

My 1440E has the drum brake.


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## coolidge (Mar 10, 2015)

darkzero said:


> I once had my eye on the BV. The one thing I did not like about it which I did not know until that video, is the foot brake is not really a foot brake. It just cuts the power to the spindle. The foot brake on my 1236 is a real mechanical foot brake. In addition to cutting power, it engages a drum brake inside the spindle pulley.
> 
> Not really a deal breaker but I guess I'm spolied. My next lathe has to have a real foot brake too.



Are you sure its not electronically braked? For example I had a 19" band saw which tend to spool on forever with the large cast iron wheels. It had an electronic brake vs mechanical, there was something special about the motor as I recall, it was single phase. It would bring the band saw to a stop in under 3 seconds.


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## darkzero (Mar 10, 2015)

coolidge said:


> Are you sure its not electronically braked? For example I had a 19" band saw which tend to spool on forever with the large cast iron wheels. It had an electronic brake vs mechanical, there was something special about the motor as I recall, it was single phase. It would bring the band saw to a stop in under 3 seconds.



No, my lathe is stock single phase, no electronic VFD braking. I was not aware that you can eletronically brake a single phase AC motor. My foot brake has a bar connected to 2  brake shoes inside the double speed spindle pulley. The brake shoes look just like drum shoes on a truck/car, the pulley acts as the brake drum. The foot brake first engages a switch that cuts spindle power, then when you depress it more it engages the drum brake. I don't often use the brake to fully stop the spindle instantly from higher RPMs but I have & it has saved my ass.


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## John Hasler (Mar 10, 2015)

darkzero said:


> No, my lathe is stock single phase, no electronic VFD braking. I was not aware that you can eletronically brake a single phase AC motor. My foot brake has a bar connected to 2  brake shoes inside the double speed spindle pulley. The brake shoes look just like drum shoes on a truck/car, the pulley acts as the brake drum. The foot brake first engages a switch that cuts spindle power, then when you depress it more it engages the drum brake. I don't often use the brake to fully stop the spindle instantly from higher RPMs but I have & it has saved my ass.


You can electrically brake a single-phase induction motor but it is not often done.  You just apply DC to one of the windings.  This makes it act as a generator, inducing current in the squirrel cage.  It's shorted of course, so the kinetic energy of the spinning rotor is rapidly converted to heat.


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## coolidge (Mar 10, 2015)

Here's a braking technique I have used while threading...

1. Take a first cut .020
2. Back out .120 to zero, reposition and go back in .120 plus .015 for the second cut
3. Get distracted
4. Return to the lathe...go in another .120 plus .015 and let her fly
5. GRRRRRRRRAHHHH
6. Hit the E-Stop button.


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## darkzero (Mar 10, 2015)

Thanks for the info John, did not know that.

The e-stop button is not equivalent to braking IMO. It's just a quicker way of cutting power off to the spindle. You still have to wait for the spindle to spin down which during a mishap make the bad day even worse. One of the reasons why I prefer my primary chuck(s) to be 6.3" instead of 8". A Set-Tru adds more weight to the chuck as you know. I went with an 8" 4 jaw direct mount which eliminates the weight of a backplate, also easier to carry because of the hollow casting. The more weight, the longer it takes to spin down. No big deal really to most though.

If I had never used a lathe with a proper foot brake, I probably wouldn't care about it. But since I'm spoiled with one, I wouldn't want to be without one & is one of the reasons that set me to get the PM1236 at the time.

It can be a real time saver when you need to do quick repeative operations. More important it's another big safety advantage to be able to stop the spindle instantly with your foot if both hands are tied up. Like if you were threading very close to a shoulder (which I often do) having one hand on the half nut lever & one hand on the cross slide hand wheel or sanding, filing, you just never know when something might go wrong no matter how much experience one might have.

Other great uses too but I don't want to sound like I'm preaching about them. It's a luxury feature, one that I really like obviously. Coolidge (& probably most anyone), sounds like you would love the foot brake on your new lathe.


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## maker of things (Mar 12, 2015)

Totally agree with darkzero.  The piece of mind I get knowing the brake will instantaneously shut off the machine and stop the spindle is great as I learn how much my machine can do.  

Hank did you order your lathe?


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## oldhank60 (Mar 14, 2015)

I am leaning hard towards the 1440 BV now.   best bang for the buck.  Income tax refund will pay for this purchase so I don't not have unlimited funds)  thanks for all the video's that were posted. 
does the 1440 B or BV come in 2 crates or is it all 1 big crate with lathe already installed onto the base?
What Fluids will I need to have on hand when lathe arrives ( not ordered yet )  I would like to see a pdf. manual for these lathes, I could get allot of answers just reading.
Could a after market brake drum type brake be installed on to the 1440BV.

safety issues 
I plan on installing a bump safety  onto lathe , I think that is correct name. we have them on lathe's at work,  it is a rubber runner safety switch that any contact with shuts lathe down, I think they are great . they make sure you don't try and get close and personnel with lathe,  could possibly keep your clothing from being snagged or anything else that might give a person that one last ride of their life.   ( seen photo's of what a lathe can do to a body )
1340gt does not have any foot  braking system  it one reason I am passing on it. I am very safety minded I have worked around running machines for the last 35 years. I still have all the parts I was issued. I don't wear loose clothing when running any machine, I pay attention to shear points and when servicing anything I make sure no stored  kinetic energy can index or rotate machine or any part of machine.

Hank


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## wrmiller (Mar 14, 2015)

darkzero said:


> Thanks for the info John, did not know that.
> 
> The e-stop button is not equivalent to braking IMO. It's just a quicker way of cutting power off to the spindle. You still have to wait for the spindle to spin down which during a mishap make the bad day even worse. One of the reasons why I prefer my primary chuck(s) to be 6.3" instead of 8". A Set-Tru adds more weight to the chuck as you know. I went with an 8" 4 jaw direct mount which eliminates the weight of a backplate, also easier to carry because of the hollow casting. The more weight, the longer it takes to spin down. No big deal really to most though.
> 
> ...



OK guys, after reading about all this braking stuff I'm going to go ahead and install the braking resistor. With that big 8" set-tru it could take a while for it to stop. I'm sold.  (only slight hi-jack)


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## mksj (Mar 14, 2015)

Although the 1340gt does not have a foot brake, with the vfd and braking resistor, you can get down to 1 seconds stops unless you are spinning a large chuck. You can add a foot switch or limit switch in addition to the e-stop. My vfd setting is 1 second.


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## oldhank60 (Mar 15, 2015)

maker of things said:


> Totally agree with darkzero.  The piece of mind I get knowing the brake will instantaneously shut off the machine and stop the spindle is great as I learn how much my machine can do.
> 
> Hank did you order your lathe?[/QUOTE
> 
> ...


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## oldhank60 (Mar 15, 2015)

no have not ordered yet.  I have to go sign papers for tax refund at accountants office and I seem to always be off work late and after hours. once I get papers sign it takes about 3 wks for refund to hit.  then I will order 1440 B or BV.  I do know that rfund is large enough to cover the lathe and part of the cost of a new mill.  MY son is going to cover the rest of the cost of new mill.  Its good having life long good relationship with son.  it during the hard times


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## mgalusha (Mar 16, 2015)

darkzero said:


> Here's a video review of the PM1440-BV from one of our members. It's basically the same lathe as the PM1440-B but with variable speed.



Haven't been on the site in a few weeks, they pulled part of my innards out. Was a wee bit surprised to see my video linked. 

On the braking, the BV does have a large braking resistor, at least mine does and the VFD can be adjusted to stop (and start) the motor faster. I emailed Ray C about this and he said changing the settings would not void the warranty. 

Most of the time it stops plenty fast and thus far I've not been annoyed by how fast it stops to futz around with the VFD and change it.


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## mgalusha (Mar 16, 2015)

mgalusha said:


> Haven't been on the site in a few weeks, they pulled part of my innards out. Was a wee bit surprised to see my video linked.
> 
> On the braking, the BV does have a large braking resistor, at least mine does and the VFD can be adjusted to stop (and start) the motor faster. I emailed Ray C about this and he said changing the settings would not void the warranty.
> 
> Most of the time it stops plenty fast and thus far I've not been annoyed by how fast it stops to futz around with the VFD and change it.



Picture of the braking actuator. Removes all doubt that it's electrical and not mechanical.


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## oldhank60 (Apr 11, 2015)

I finally got tax papers done today, refund will be here in 3 weeks or less so I will order lathe then,  I thought for sure I would get the 1440bv but might go for the 1340gt .  I guess it will down to the last minute before I place telephone call and place order before it will be etched in stone

Hank


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