# DRO advice for lathe?



## skcncx (Jul 22, 2022)

*Any prevailing advice on features/style/usability for a lathe DRO?*


Usability is my primary concern - unfortunately, the 3 options (pic attached) I'm picking from have varying levels of info in their manual... and one, no manual exists (yet).


Primary features wanted- abs/inc modes, Radius/Diameter modes and the calculator with ability to reference and apply calculations to/from the x and z coordinates... all DRO appear to have that.... though some depending on button and interface may make that more user friendly.
I would imagine the LCD (option #2 in attached pic) could provide a good experience but NO manual yet... so it's hard to know.



No preference between glass vs magnetic scales - won't be using cooling other than manually applying cutting fluid when necessary.  That seems to be the main con of optical, they don't do as well with surrounding swarf and cutting fluids.


This will be on a PM-1236T


I guess worst case I can switch the interface to the TouchDRO app or other compatible display.

*Available options these... (#s coordinate with attached pic)*

https://www.precisionmatthews.com/shop/dropml8x35/
https://www.precisionmatthews.com/shop/pm-2-axis-lathe-dro-lcd-display-8x35-0001-hi-res-cross-scale/
https://www.precisionmatthews.com/shop/magxact-magnetic-2-axis-lathe-dro-8x40/

_Back story context__ -  I previously decided on the PM-1228 and it only has one option for an installed DRO... so my decision was easy.  I have more options with the PM-1236T... good and bad I guess.  The PM-1228, has all the features I want and $3200 less than the PM-1236T configured with identical and installed DROs.... but sitting on that decision before I placed the order, I kept coming back to the overall quality improvement of the PM-1236T and input from others in previous thread.  Both have all the features I want and I actually prefer the variable speed motor of the PM-1228.  To start I'm going single phase on the PM-1236T and see if the gear ranges suffice before I spend the extra for VFD controlled motor and hassle of changing many of the electrical components._


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## Just for fun (Jul 22, 2022)

I'm a beginner so not a lot of real life experience yet.  I have the PM MX100 it seems to work pretty well.   The problem I have is the way my shop is setup when I have the big door open the natural light makes it hard to see the numbers.


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## skcncx (Jul 22, 2022)

Just for fun said:


> I'm a beginner so not a lot of real life experience yet.  I have the PM MX100 it seems to work pretty well.   The problem I have is the way my shop is setup when I have the big door open the natural light makes it hard to see the numbers.


Thanks.  The hard to read numbers seems to be pretty common for the basic numerical displays.  

I read the manual for the MX100 and seems pretty straight forward, but they left a lot of detail out for using the calculator other than basic functionality... seems like some dedicated buttons for the common plus/minus/multiply/divide operations would be nice.  Though, that's likely the same issue on the LCD display unit they have.

With little to no experience... I'm not sure what features I want for quick access (dedicated button) vs having a display unit I have to "menu" through to get to everything.. that can be annoying.  Especially when you don't use it every day... I'm trying to figure out which will be the most intuitive.


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## Aurelius (Jul 25, 2022)

I have a 1228 with the (newer) stock DRO (#2 on your list).  I really like it.  I've used the older style like #1 on your list and they are fine but I find theo ne I have much easier to read and, being  more compact, a bit easier to use (less movememnt needed to reach all the controls).


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## mksj (Jul 25, 2022)

You might also look at the Easson, I use the 12B on my lathe and it works very well, no issues with glare. Quite a few people have ordered them from Machine DRO in the UK, ships by air and arrives within a week. The display has 3 axis inputs, so I use the 3rd scale on my tailstock (Z1), but you can also get it with 2 scales. The magnetic scales are an easier install as to alignment and bulk, and the price is not much more than glass. If ordering you will want to upgrade the X axis to a 1 micron read head, the scales are all the same. The exchange rate is very favorable, and you do not pay VAT, shipping is about $70, the 1 micron head upgrade is around $30.  So £550 works out to around $500, so figure around $600-650 for a 3 axis with magnetic scales. You can download the manual for features, it has soft keys which change based on the menu, you can change the display colors to your preference.






						Universal Lathe Digital Readouts DRO Kits - Easy Fitting - Machine DRO UK
					

Wide Range of lathe Digital Readouts DRO Packages with Magnetic Encoders




					www.machine-dro.co.uk
				











						Easson ES-12B LCD digital readout package including 3 linear magnetic encoders
					

3 Axis  Easson ES-12B LCD graphic digital readout package with three magnetic encoders. The encoders offer a very compact profile size and can be cut to length to custom fit the machine being installed. The package is suitable for mills up to Bridgeport 42" sized machines or 30" between centre...




					www.machine-dro.co.uk


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## skcncx (Jul 25, 2022)

Aurelius said:


> I have a 1228 with the (newer) stock DRO (#2 on your list).  I really like it.  I've used the older style like #1 on your list and they are fine but I find theo ne I have much easier to read and, being  more compact, a bit easier to use (less movememnt needed to reach all the controls).


Thanks.  the LCD seems to be the preference by most.  Glad you like the new LCD style that comes with the PM-1228.  Sounds like features and user friendly features are good... easy to get to the common things and I'd imagine the menu'ing system is better just because they have a screen to walk you though the menus vs cryptic letter/word codes on a numeric only display.

Have you been overall impressed with your PM-1228? I had nearly put in an order for one, but deciding to go with the PM1236T... ad much as I prefer to save the $ as it's more, it seems better in the longer run... but I'm so new and unfortunately have to paper shop these... can't see or run either.


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## skcncx (Jul 25, 2022)

mksj said:


> You might also look at the Easson, I use the 12B on my lathe and it works very well, no issues with glare. Quite a few people have ordered them from Machine DRO in the UK, ships by air and arrives within a week. The display has 3 axis inputs, so I use the 3rd scale on my tailstock (Z1), but you can also get it with 2 scales. The magnetic scales are an easier install as to alignment and bulk, and the price is not much more than glass. If ordering you will want to upgrade the X axis to a 1 micron read head, the scales are all the same. The exchange rate is very favorable, and you do not pay VAT, shipping is about $70, the 1 micron head upgrade is around $30.  So £550 works out to around $500, so figure around $600-650 for a 3 axis with magnetic scales. You can download the manual for features, it has soft keys which change based on the menu, you can change the display colors to your preference.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Interesting, I'll have to take a look.  Looks like a nice unit.  I do like the idea of having the extra read out for the tail stock quick... though not a show stopper.  I'd rather have it on the compound where it can affect both x and z based on the angle it set to... though it seems with a lathe DRO...if you move the compound (and don't have a scale to affect x/z readouts), etc, change out tooling, adjust cutters you can quickly nullify much work you've taken to setup the tool catalog registry thereby making the readout not represent real life.  So, in my limited use and understanding, too many bells and whistles/setup are somewhat too much work to make it worth the effort... and therefore just the few basic functions and easily being able to zero out either abs or inc mode and the readius/diameter features are what you do most of the time.

In the end though, I think I'll prefer an option from PM... as they will install it for me and likely better/quicker support... but I'm open.


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## Winegrower (Jul 25, 2022)

If  you want a turnkey installation, then do what you have to do.   I've been happy with the Ditron D80 DRO...the screen visibility is the best I've seen, the features are good, actually way more than I need or use, and the cost is terrific at $185 for two axis, $190 including RPM sensors and readout on the display.   I like the slimline magnetic scales, because of their small size and ease of installation.


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## Aurelius (Jul 25, 2022)

skcncx said:


> Have you been overall impressed with your PM-1228? I had nearly put in an order for one, but deciding to go with the PM1236T... ad much as I prefer to save the $ as it's more, it seems better in the longer run... but I'm so new and unfortunately have to paper shop these... can't see or run either.


I have been. As I mentioned in your other thread, I was limited by available electrics and the physical requirements of getting it into my basement but I am working almost exclusively on smaller parts made of softer materials (mostly plastics, maybe some aluminum/brass/steel) so it is likely all the machine I will need for some time to come.


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## skcncx (Jul 25, 2022)

Winegrower said:


> If  you want a turnkey installation, then do what you have to do.   I've been happy with the Ditron D80 DRO...the screen visibility is the best I've seen, the features are good, actually way more than I need or use, and the cost is terrific at $185 for two axis, $190 including RPM sensors and readout on the display.   I like the slimline magnetic scales, because of their small size and ease of installation.


Looks like that $190 is just for the head display?  Not the magnetic sensors as well.

It seems like the magnetic (or glass scales) are somewhat independent from the head unit and you can just swap out a new head unit. I would think the scales do nothing more than send a relative movement signal to the head unit which does all the display magic and remembering where you are at in virtual space based on scale input/movement.  I'm likely over simplifying this... but if that's true, I should care more about the type of scale I want (glass vs magnetic) and the head unit can be swapped easily (aside from cost) . I installed the TouchDRO on my tablet just to see it... seemed like a few things were buggy but overall great.


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## JimDawson (Jul 25, 2022)

You might take a quick look at my installation.  My preference is magnetic read heads.








						Lathe DRO
					

Last weekend my son informed me that it is time to put a DRO on the lathe.  I guess he hasn't figured out what all those little numbers are for on the dials.  :rolleyes:  He has a short production run for a product he is developing so figured it would be easier to do it with a DRO.  I suggested...




					www.hobby-machinist.com


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## Winegrower (Jul 25, 2022)

skcncx said:


> Looks like that $190 is just for the head display? Not the magnetic sensors as well.


Correct.   Except that some scales have different pinouts, as I've discovered empirically.   I just finished wiring up some DB9 connectors to adjust for magnetic scales.   One D80 notes "magnetic scales" on a rear sticker, the other doesn't, and needed the conversion.   Maybe there's some way to check that before ordering.   Both DRO and Scales are RS422, but who knows why the pinout is different.


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## mksj (Jul 25, 2022)

I do not move my compound except to cut a taper, so all the coordinates stay fixed. The absolute position needs to be set when you power up the DRO, they are not absolute reading scales.  If you have an assortment of tool holders you can index them all off of an absolute position in the tool datum file, one of these days I may get around to doing that. If you want summation of the compound and X and Z movements, you need something along the lines of an EL700/750 (the MX200L only has 2 axis), you need to accurately put in the angle of the compound and it will calculate the movement in the X and Z. The ES-12B does not have this functor or axis summing. in lathe mode it is pretty basic. The Ditron DRO's seem particular to the magnetic scales used as to their accuracy, so more hit or miss. My point with the Easson 12B package with magnetic scales, is that essentially you are getting the DRO display as an extra when buying the scales which sell by themselves for $150-200 a piece.

Ditron with magnetic scales, you still would want a 1 micron scale on the cross slide and the length you need,  make sure you get Ditron magnetic scales as opposed to some no name brand. I only see the Ditron Official Store through Amazon, service/support in general is disappointing and warranty they say contact the seller. So kind of a revolving door on that one.


			Amazon.com
		


As far as installing, I always prefer to do my own and almost never use the stock brackets which are usually cobbled together. A lathe 2 axis DRO install is pretty straight forward, and magnetic scales you do not need to be spot on. You save $300, good learning experience. Lots of information in this forum on the install on the PM lathes.  Warranty and support are both important if you have any issues, but for others its just rock bottom cost. All I can say is to know what you are getting, and not be disappointed down the line.


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## tjb (Jul 25, 2022)

mksj said:


> You might also look at the Easson, I use the 12B on my lathe and it works very well, no issues with glare. Quite a few people have ordered them from Machine DRO in the UK, ships by air and arrives within a week. The display has 3 axis inputs, so I use the 3rd scale on my tailstock (Z1), but you can also get it with 2 scales. The magnetic scales are an easier install as to alignment and bulk, and the price is not much more than glass. If ordering you will want to upgrade the X axis to a 1 micron read head, the scales are all the same. The exchange rate is very favorable, and you do not pay VAT, shipping is about $70, the 1 micron head upgrade is around $30.  So £550 works out to around $500, so figure around $600-650 for a 3 axis with magnetic scales. You can download the manual for features, it has soft keys which change based on the menu, you can change the display colors to your preference.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


About a year ago, I followed mksj's advice on the Easson packages on both my mill and my lathe.  I replaced glass scales on both pieces of equipment and have been thoroughly satisfied with both.  It's a little more money but well worth it in the long run.  This strikes me as one of those areas where the axiom, "buy it cheap, buy it twice; buy it right, but it once" is most relevant.  I was beginning to have issues with my glass scales, and magnetic is much better.  All the features you're looking for are on the Easson packages, and I use them regularly.

Regards


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## skcncx (Jul 26, 2022)

tjb said:


> This strikes me as one of those areas where the axiom, "buy it cheap, buy it twice; buy it right, but it once"


And that is the crux of my waffling on which lathe and which dro, etc ... Sounds like the PM-1236T with magnetic DRO scales is the way go to for me.  I've even thought the 1340GT but then another $1k overall cost.. never ends and the 1340GT is even a longer wait.

I've already purchased my atlast 618 and I'm replacing pretty quickly... but still a good investment to "know" what I'm getting into before spending the nearly $10K on a PM-1236T outfitted with DROs and a couple extras.

*Sounds like glass scales are good, but given the option, most prefer the magnetic.  *

As far as having a scale on the compound so it can affect both x and z would be a luxury. It seems most of the time you lock down the compound  and only use the carriage and cross feed (x/z) movement.  My main "thought/revelation" on that was, if you take the time to setup all your various tool offsets and such and either swivel your QCTP or move your compound (angle or lead screw)... your offsets and DRO is off and therefore you have to reset everything or return the QCTP/Compound back to where it was when you cataloged everything... and that must be very precise.  Having a scale on the compound would allow travel and the system would track it... but you still cannot adjust it's angle or change the QCTP angle and assume the DRO knows where everything is at in space... so, it doesn't seem like the cost/benefit to have that feature is there for me... maybe I'm missing something.  And it's one less wire dangling around.

I'll do little extra reading on the Easson  and Ditron DROs you guys have pointed out... great input and exactly what I'm looking for.  Though, if I can buy from a reputable reseller that provide support... that's a big benefit to me, even if it's a bit more.

If I stick with PM... it's either the MX-100L or the MX-200L... both magnetic... but the MX-200L is LCD screen and likely easier to navigate w/out manual... is that worth the extra $200... I don't know .


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## Winegrower (Jul 26, 2022)

I notice the second Ditron D80 has added some new features...a feed rate computation that can be set quickly to any axis, a visual indicator of getting close to a setpoint and the ability to sum together either X+Y or X+Z axes.   There's no ability to set a compound angle, as far as I know, but there are a bunch of features I haven't looked into yet.


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## skcncx (Jul 26, 2022)

mksj said:


> The absolute position needs to be set when you power up the DRO, they are not absolute reading scales.


That didn't register in my head... but now I understand the meaning of "absolute".. and most magnetic scales (at least in my price range) are not. Seems like the primary/critical axis for this is the X axis.. Do you insert tool #1 (which all other tools are offset by), turn something and measure to get back to resetting your absolute position?

Not sure if I'm asking/stating that right... I guess what's the process to "reset" the absolute position when you turn your DRO back on and it has or hasn't moved when it was off?



mksj said:


> If you have an assortment of tool holders you can index them all off of an absolute position in the tool datum file, one of these days I may get around to doing that.


I'd imagine, I'd only do this for the 2-3 most common tools I use and switch between.


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## skcncx (Jul 26, 2022)

Winegrower said:


> I notice the second Ditron D80 has added some new features...a feed rate computation that can be set quickly to any axis, a visual indicator of getting close to a setpoint and the ability to sum together either X+Y or X+Z axes.   There's no ability to set a compound angle, as far as I know, but there are a bunch of features I haven't looked into yet.


Having the spindle RPM input to calculate SFM on the fly based does seem like a nice feature.    I think the TouchDRO has input for that.

Seems like the "distance-to-go" feature is pretty common, though likely better visual on an LCD screen.

With all these "fancy" features, the LCD screen (assuming it's done well) is a huge advantage, a requirement really.

Funny how all this works... I put cheap IGauging read outs on my Atlas 618 just so I didn't have to stop and measure as much, at least not until I get close to my target dimensions... those are nothing more than built in calipers....  and now that I'm planning on a DRO system for my to be lifetime setup.... I want all the extra bells and whistles.


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## JimDawson (Jul 26, 2022)

skcncx said:


> Not sure if I'm asking/stating that right... I guess what's the process to "reset" the absolute position when you turn your DRO back on and it has or hasn't moved when it was off?



Turn it back on? You turn it off?   I keep my electronics on all the time.  Unless you have a fixed location to set a tool/carriage to, its not possible to set an absolute position.  A DRO is normally used as an incremental device, however you might set a 0,0 as a work coordinate per the job.  You are not going to have a home position like on a CNC machine.


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## mksj (Jul 26, 2022)

If indexing all your tools off of absolute position, there are a number of ways to set the the absolute position. One is simply use a dial gauge in a holder with a known diameter stock and have a calibration point, you could also setup a touch probe in a holder to do the same. You can buy a cheap one for a mill put it in a holder and touch off on a known diameter stock. What I typically do is to measure the diameter of my stock, touch off with the tip of the reference cutter (insert), do a test cut, remeasure and then enter the diameter if different. Then all your other tools would be indexed off of that known diameter, you would calibrate the others by doing a test cut in the same material measuring and entering the value.

With a lathe the amount of material removed and the final diameter of the work, often requires some fine tuning if doing work in the sub 0.001" range. I recently turned some tapping O1 steel blanks and needed one to be +0.0010" of a given diameter, I remove the bulk of the material with 0.1" DOC (0.2") diameter, then 0.050" and when I get down close to target will do a smaller increment measure and then compensate for the indicated DRO reading and the actual diameter cut on the pass. You need to remove enough material which is about 1/2 the nose radius of your cutter and you have some movement of the piece being turned relative to the cutter. You also have thermal expansion from cutting the piece. Below is an example of a series of replacement pins I needed to make that all were within 0.0002" diameter spec.

I agree with buying with a dealer that offers support and a warranty. I have a EL700 DRO (purchased years ago from Dro Pros) on my mill which is essentially the same as the MX200, the latest model is the EL-750 which has some software changes/new functions. The display and menu system is great, it is a touch screen so you do not have the tactile button feel and they can get a bit finicky if your fingers are greasy/wet. The other issues they need to be resolved with the MX200 DRO's is that the feed rate is not accurate and the display refresh rate is painfully slow (at least reported recently). I do not have those issues with my EL700. The latter refresh rate is not acceptable in my opinion.  Use of a DRO on a lathe, is more basic functions and reading the numbers, so they will all get you there for the most part. Being able to read the numbers and ergonomics is what is important for me, one reason why a I prefer the vertical screen so the axis buttons are aligned along the left side of the ES-12B. If they where horizontal or on the right side of the screen they would be more awkward to use. On my mill I use a horizontal screen and it is mounted on the right side of the head, the axis and keypad are on the right side of the display.








						PM’s new MagXact MX-200L DRO?
					

I can try mine today and see if I get the same behavior.




					www.hobby-machinist.com


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## skcncx (Jul 26, 2022)

mksj said:


> I agree with buying with a dealer that offers support and a warranty. I have a EL700 DRO (purchased years ago from Dro Pros) on my mill which is essentially the same as the MX200, the latest model is the EL-750 which has some software changes/new functions. The display and menu system is great, it is a touch screen so you do not have the tactile button feel and they can get a bit finicky if your fingers are greasy/wet. The other issues they need to be resolved with the MX200 DRO's is that the feed rate is not accurate and the display refresh rate is painfully slow (at least reported recently). I do not have those issues with my EL700



Thanks for all the info/input.  I think the EL700/750 is out of my price range... at least based on prices of the DROPros.com site, starts at $1800 for the kit... and I have followed the recent MX200L thread... makes me a little nervous.... if that's common, not worth the extra then.  Their MX-100 would likely be good enough, as much as I'd prefer an LCD screen.... or my own install, the Ditron D80 looks great, but support and only purchased via amazon is not my preference.

And for resetting my DRO when I turn on/off the unit...I'll just have to come up with what works best for me then, many 'good' ways I gather.. I just want to ensure my primary turning tool on the X axis to be zero when it's actually at the center point of round stock.... getting to +- a few thousandths would likely suffice for me.... I have a LOT to learn before I try master anything sub .001.


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## Winegrower (Jul 26, 2022)

skcncx said:


> the Ditron D80 looks great, but support and only purchased via amazon is not my preference.


For the record, I got my D80 from eBay, and the seller turned out to be the factory in China.   I got excellent and prompt support from them, given the overnight delay on emails.   The factory email is included in the D80 shipping box.


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## skcncx (Jul 26, 2022)

Winegrower said:


> For the record, I got my D80 from eBay, and the seller turned out to be the factory in China.   I got excellent and prompt support from them, given the overnight delay on emails.   The factory email is included in the D80 shipping box.


Yea, ebay comes up when you search "Ditron D80" and I found the Ditron D80 product site, http://www.dcoee.com/page188?product_id=6&brd=1 but can't seem to pull up the manual..  Looks like a intuitive interface... but would really like to find the manual.  Will search youtube late.


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## mksj (Jul 26, 2022)

The D80 use to be carried by a US distributor but they now carry a different Asian DRO line. Unfortunately none of these companies seem to list the warranty period and repair/replacement policy.



			https://www.machinetoolproducts.com/content/Ditron/D80%20User%20Manual%202017.6.28.pdf
		







						MachineToolProducts.com
					

Value Added Distributor




					www.machinetoolproducts.com
				








						Aikron Products - MachineToolProducts.com
					






					www.machinetoolproducts.com


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## davidpbest (Jul 27, 2022)

I have the EL400 with magnetic scales from DROPros on my 1340GT and it's been fine.  It doesn't come close to the quality of the Newall I have onn my mill, but it works and I prefer the tactile sense of knowing when the button you've pushed has been accepted (like zeroing an axis).  I use the tool position library all the time, but I do not turn off the AC power to the DRO when I shut down the lathe and it's control system.  Although I have not needed it, DROPros is well known for post sales support.


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## skcncx (Jul 29, 2022)

davidpbest said:


> I have the EL400 with magnetic scales from DROPros on my 1340GT and it's been fine.  It doesn't come close to the quality of the Newall I have onn my mill, but it works and I prefer the tactile sense of knowing when the button you've pushed has been accepted (like zeroing an axis).  I use the tool position library all the time, but I do not turn off the AC power to the DRO when I shut down the lathe and it's control system.  Although I have not needed it, DROPros is well known for post sales support.


Thanks, the EL400 and the PM-100L look like great purpose made just for the common lathe stuff.... I like the single button push to zero either axis. At spending $800 for the PM-100L, I'm actually thinking of jumping up to the PM-200L for the screen display only... I guess the other benefit is easier to use menu and calculator function since the screen can do a lot more than just the LED numerical displays. 

I kind of wish either of these two could take input for spindle RPM input... would be nice to see that as well, though, not sure it really adds much.


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## davidpbest (Jul 29, 2022)

skcncx said:


> Thanks, the EL400 and the PM-100L look like great purpose made just for the common lathe stuff.... I like the single button push to zero either axis. At spending $800 for the PM-100L, I'm actually thinking of jumping up to the PM-200L for the screen display only... I guess the other benefit is easier to use menu and calculator function since the screen can do a lot more than just the LED numerical displays.
> 
> I kind of wish either of these two could take input for spindle RPM input... would be nice to see that as well, though, not sure it really adds much.


Personally, I think you are putting too much emphasis on the display and it’s additional features.  “Shiny objects” are always attractive, but beyond what you call “basic lathe stuff” what are you expecting to do?   I do advanced work on my 1340GT, including employing the tool library (which few others use) and have not found the EL400 lacking considering it is in a different league quality and documentation wise from my Newall DROs costing 4x more.  If you want to see my DRO installation on my 1340GT, have a look at *this build log* and accompanying descriptions.


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## skcncx (Jul 31, 2022)

davidpbest said:


> Personally, I think you are putting too much emphasis on the display and it’s additional features. “Shiny objects” are always attractive, but beyond what you call “basic lathe stuff” what are you expecting to do?


Definitely swayed by the "shiney objects".  To be honest, I'm not sure what I'm expecting it to do beyond the basics, likely nothing.  However, from the MX-100L (EL400) to the MX-200L (EL700), it goes from $800 to $1000.  It seems most prefer the LCD screen just for clarity and glare issues, so if nothing else, the readability is "nicer"... I guess clarity is in the eye of the beholder.   So just $200, may be worth it only for that.

I do find myself constantly going to my phone for the calculator function... so having a nice calculator function on my DRO that is easy to use seems very functional.  And if I can easy input the results of a calculation to the DRO on either axis that would be fantastic.  I believe that ability is on just about every DRO as well... just seems the LCD screen version are simpler to use.

I imagine, I might use the tool offsets as I gain experience and have multiple parts I want to repeat with a given setup... but time will tell.


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## skcncx (Aug 1, 2022)

davidpbest said:


> If you want to see my DRO installation on my 1340GT, have a look at *this build log* and accompanying descriptions.


@davidpbest  Thanks for the detailed photos on your 1340GT DRO install... I'm contemplating having PM install it for me but to save the $300 I may do it myself.

In regards to accessing the cross slide locking screw, any other ways to retain access to it? Or is it really the only and best way to do it like you have... put a gap and switch the locking screw to a hex headed bolt?

PM will not install with spacers for a gap... I would have to unmount and add the spacers myself to the scale and reading head.  They'll won't install drag chain and I think that is a great way to run the cables and keep all the swarf off of them... certainly more involved though.


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## davidpbest (Aug 1, 2022)

skcncx said:


> @davidpbest  Thanks for the detailed photos on your 1340GT DRO install... I'm contemplating having PM install it for me but to save the $300 I may do it myself.
> 
> In regards to accessing the cross slide locking screw, any other ways to retain access to it? Or is it really the only and best way to do it like you have... put a gap and switch the locking screw to a hex headed bolt?


You can install the scale and encoder on the chuck-side of the cross slide - that will free up the right side for access to the locking screw and allow the tailstock to be positioned closer to the tool post.  The downside is that the DRO encoder/scale gets more exposure to chips and coolant and potentially damage by the chuck or rotating part.  There are several examples of this type of install on H-M if you search around.  I would always choose to do the DRO install myself - posts here (and Practical Machinist) suggest the distributor (PM, Eisen, Acra, etc.) do a pretty quick-and-dirty install.


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## skcncx (Aug 1, 2022)

davidpbest said:


> You can install the scale and encoder on the chuck-side of the cross slide - that will free up the right side for access to the locking screw and allow the tailstock to be positioned closer to the tool post.  The downside is that the DRO encoder/scale gets more exposure to chips and coolant and potentially damage by the chuck or rotating part.  There are several examples of this type of install on H-M if you search around.  I would always choose to do the DRO install myself - posts here (and Practical Machinist) suggest the distributor (PM, Eisen, Acra, etc.) do a pretty quick-and-dirty install.


Right... or "left" . I had seen suggestions to put it on the lefts side, just escaped from my memory.  I won't use coolant, but cutting fluid for drilling/turning nonetheless is still going to drip/flung there.

Seems like most typical installs is on the right side. Out of the way of from the chuck and chips and is preferred over losing a bit on how close you can bring the tailstock up to the saddle.  *Do you you lose about an inch of useable quill travel that if it can't be snugged up to the saddle?*

Yea, debating on OEM install... I figure it would be pretty basic. It looks pretty management as long as  you are careful and take your time... plus is saves me a chunk and I'd likely just go with the Ditron DV80 or Eason EB12 with magnetic scales... so in total, I could save $400-$600 over the PM-MX200L installed by them.

Something to think about!


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## pontiac428 (Aug 1, 2022)

I have to cut power to the D80 on my mill when I shut down the RPC and leave the shop.  It retains all configuration settings (axes, in/mm, direction, etc) but loses any location/movement settings for the session.  It's no big deal.  If I leave work on the table, I just touch off and get my location back.

If the mag scale placement takes an inch away from you when using the tailstock up close, just take that inch back by feeding it into the tailstock quill.  You don't really "lose" anything.  Maybe you could say you lose little bit of depth when drilling with the tailstock, but that's why we have so many ways to skin the cat when making parts.


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## skcncx (Aug 1, 2022)

pontiac428 said:


> If the mag scale placement takes an inch away from you when using the tailstock up close, just take that inch back by feeding it into the tailstock quill. You don't really "lose" anything. Maybe you could say you lose little bit of depth when drilling with the tailstock, but that's why we have so many ways to skin the cat when making parts.


In my head I was thinking you might lose travel when drilling if you needed to butt up the tail stock to the saddle... but that's not likely a real scenario... I was just trying to envision what impact you have with the scales mounted on the right.

I guess, most of the time I've need to be very close to the tail stock with the saddle is when I have a live center in the tail stock and I want to reach the end of the part to turn it down, in that case, just extend the tailstock quill a bit and move on.... my current lathe, Atlas 618 has very little quill travel.



pontiac428 said:


> It retains all configuration settings (axes, in/mm, direction, etc) but loses any location/movement settings for the session. It's no big deal. If I leave work on the table, I just touch off and get my location back.


That makes sense... figured that's how just about every DRO (unless it was absolute), settings are retained but absolute location is not... easy to regain as you say.... My only reference is my CNC would router... I just home it... I guess, that's the aspect of getting my location back... though my controller software does remember it between powering off and on.

Going to go look at the Ditron D80 again... if I install this thing, that seems to be a great bang for your buck system.


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## pontiac428 (Aug 1, 2022)

I understand what you mean, I run my carriage up tight to the tailstock all the time.  It's valuable space, and running your quill way out there may not produce the best accuracy and finish.  Regardless, if you need to run a scale on your cross slide, run it on the operator's right hand side.  The list of good reasons for putting it on the right is a whole lot longer than the one for putting it on the left.

And absolute coordinates are never needed on manual machines, because they have a real human brain keeping track of things like home.


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## skcncx (Aug 5, 2022)

@mksj couple questions on your ES-12B...

*I assume you have the EH-05 scales on your (1340 or 1440?) lathe and I assume the height of the scale is shorter than the side wall of your cross slide where it's mounted.. correct?* I'd think it can't be taller, otherwise there may be clearance issues swiveling the compound?   My guess/hope is the PM-1236T is at least 1" inch tall, I'll have to confirm.







I've gotta measure, but I believe the 1050mm (41.25" travel length) mag scale for the Easson Kit is plenty for a 1236T... I want to ensure full range on cross slide, even if tailstock is off and I don't have long extended chuck on the headstock... as in, when no chuck, I want to ensure I can take the saddle as far left as possible.


I'm leaning toward the ES-12C (horizontal display version), same otherwise to the 12B (vertical) You previously mentioned your prefer  the ergonomics of the ES-12B... do you have your unit mounted on top/above the head stock?  I was actually thinking about mounting mine right out in front between centers above back splash panel... that does not seem as common for mounting but "seems" a natural position to view it, though maybe a safety issue with always reaching directly over the workpiece.



mksj said:


> Being able to read the numbers and ergonomics is what is important for me, one reason why a I prefer the vertical screen so the axis buttons are aligned along the left side of the ES-12B. If they where horizontal or on the right side of the screen they would be more awkward to use.




I've reached out to machine-dro.co.uk and their 3 axis ES-12B/C with all reading heads upgraded to 1 micron is $910 shipped to my door.  I'm really considering this option and just install myself.  A small savings over the MX-200L 2 axis as well. Since I was planning to put a caliper on my tail stock quill I keep thinking it's just as easy to use the 3rd axis as I believe you and many do.

I also reached out to Ditron on their D80, for 3 mag scales with RPM is only $595, so even less... though, my perception is the Easson is higher quality... but I really like the idea of the RPM readout right on the DRO head unit as well.... too many non critical but nice to have options I guess.  It just feels odd that they keep asking to send a payment link, but never provide a detailed sale order I'm paying on... and support, my guess is Machine DRO and PM wins hands down with after sales support/warranty.  To bad SRM (seemingly a division of Machine DRO UK) is actually more than their UK shop for the same Easson ES-12B/C.... I digress...


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## mksj (Aug 5, 2022)

The height of the cross slide on the 1236/1340GT is something like 30mm and you can also shorten the width of the magnetic aluminum carrier. I used glass GS31 slimLine glass scales on my 1340'S, thats all they had at the time. I added a magntic scale to my tailstock on my ERL-1340. The magnetic scale lengths are based on travel not overall length, so a 1000mm would be for 40" travel. More than long enough for a 1236.

I do not follow the pricing you are getting from Machine DRO, unless the shipping has gone up dramatically. The 3 axis magnetic kit is ~$500 when you remove the VAT (and current exchange rate), the 1 micron read head for the cross slide was $25, the 1000mm Z axis scale was $25. Shipping previously was ~$75. The British pound has declined significantly in value relative to the dollar. When I put in an order and checked price of the 3 axis with shipping to the US it came to £615.86, current exchange rate is £1.00 = $1.21 (put lets say 1.1 after fees) so you are at ~$600 with the scale adds. If you are paying $900+ for a DRO from Machine DRO, I would go with the MX100/200 if they have worked out the software bugs.

A tachometer is $20, if you not using a VFD then it doesn't matter, if you are then just add it at that time or use a 0-100 scale on your pot and you can workout the speed. If you went with the Baldor vector motor then the speed range at 50% is the same as the low belt speeds and at 120Hz the same as the high belt speed.

I prefer to have my DRO away from flying hot chips and oil coolant splatter, I do not want to be reaching over anything spinning to get to the keypad. In addition a lot of people mount tooling to the back splash, last place I would want a DRO to be located. It would be totally useless trying to mount mine to the splash shield. The way it is setup I use my left hand to access the X, Y Z keys and my right hand is on the carriage controls.


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## Beckerkumm (Aug 5, 2022)

My 3 axis system with 1 um magnetic scales was 739 BPS in April.  I also factor in some aluminum bar stock.  I don't like using screws under the magnetic strip so I can't remove the scale at a later date so I mount them on a bar thick enough that I can screw to it and just attach it to the machine at the ends.  I'm not sure that a glass scale on the Z axis with clips that secure it to the top extrusion wouldn't be easier and cheaper.  Dave


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## skcncx (Aug 5, 2022)

mksj said:


> The height of the cross slide on the 1236/1340GT is something like 30mm


Great, no need to trim down the aluminum carrier.



mksj said:


> I do not follow the pricing you are getting from Machine DRO, unless the shipping has gone up dramatically. The 3 axis magnetic kit is ~$500 when you remove the VAT (and current exchange rate), the 1 micron read head for the cross slide was $25, the 1000mm Z axis scale was $25. Shipping previously was ~$75.



My quote... 2nd and 3rd scales lengths are way too long, but they said it's actually cheaper because it's part of a kit.  Even at $909, the MX-200-L 2 axis kit from PM is $999, so $100 less for Machine DRO and the extra scale.

I asked PM... I cannot get a 3 axis MX-200-L lathe kit, they only sell it as 2 axis.. so if I want the tail stock quill DRO... it's not an option.  I can't even get their 3 Axis MX-200-M kit with scales for a lathe... kind of a bummer.












mksj said:


> A tachometer is $20, if you not using a VFD then it doesn't matter,


No VFD to start, single phase... Just to have an RPM sensor on the spindle just seems like a nice display value, gratuitous for sure.  Then I don't care what the charts say on gear selection or what pulley I would have setup... the sensor is the final truth in RPM.  This feature is not something that's going to push me to Ditron.



mksj said:


> prefer to have my DRO away from flying hot chips and oil coolant splatter, I do not want to be reaching over anything spinning to get to the keypad.


Yea, I'll put it on top of the head stock.... also thinking I would have extra tool holders above/mounted on back splash for quick access.  That makes total sense for vertical display when using left hand for x/y/z access buttons.


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## Beckerkumm (Aug 5, 2022)

Ask them if they have there new mounting brackets.  They were sourcing new brackets when I asked in April that were to be  solid on both sides rather than cast which should improve their function.  Dave


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## mksj (Aug 5, 2022)

Must have gotten the exchange rate backwards, oh well. see where it goes. On my 1340GT I used an Igaging Absolute scale on the tailstock and it worked fine. Batteries lasted about 6 months, others have done similar and not a big expense.


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## skcncx (Aug 5, 2022)

mksj said:


> Must have gotten the exchange rate backwards, oh well. see where it goes.


Yea, well, I guess lately the GBP and USD has flip flopped on which one is stronger... plus, mentally thinking of prices from just 12 months ago is useless... between shipping, inflation, it's hard to know what things cost just 2 years ago.



mksj said:


> I used an Igaging Absolute scale on the tailstock and it worked fine.


Yes, that was an option I'm considering... This is just as good I guess (if not better) than trying to hook it up to the DRO... one less cable that needs to run back to the DRO (that's the better part)...

If I want 3 axis lathe DRO, machine-dro is my go to and is less than PM's MX-200 2 axis.... as usual, it'll come down to what I'm comfortable with for support/warranty.


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## skcncx (Aug 5, 2022)

Ya know, my guess is that I don't need 1 micron on the z or y axis, just the X cross slide access, I can save $50 right there.... PayPal (just based on currency conversion from adds about $48 to it.... my guess is I can't get around that.

$715 GPB should be $861 ... I don't usually buy direction from overseas to be confronted with currency rates so maybe it's normal to have a fee on top of it.... hopefully, I don't get hit with another fee when it get's here through customs.


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## Beckerkumm (Aug 5, 2022)

you always get gouged on exchange rates or fees and need to build that in to the math.  you are correct on the Z axis but I'd get the 1 um on the short scales.  Gives me the flexibility to swap on other machines that can benefit from it.  Not a big deal for the lathe tailstock or compound though.  Dave


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## skcncx (Aug 5, 2022)

Beckerkumm said:


> you always get gouged on exchange rates or fees and need to build that in to the math.  you are correct on the Z axis but I'd get the 1 um on the short scales.  Gives me the flexibility to swap on other machines that can benefit from it.  Not a big deal for the lathe tailstock or compound though.  Dave


I finding that out!  Still cheaper than PM though to my doorstep and I get an extra scale.  Though, I'd actually prefer to buy from PM, I've been very satisfied with their support so far... given, I'm still pre-delivery on my machine.

For sure 1 micron on the X cross slide... but since I'll be cutting the the 3rd scale pretty short for tail stock, I'll never swap to another machine... though, the idea is good.  So it's either 1 micron on all or save $50 and 1 micron for cross slide and 5 micron for tail stock and z axis.


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## Beckerkumm (Aug 5, 2022)

Jo Shepard at Allendale ( M dro ) is very good to deal with too.  I'd trust her for support.  I do think there is cost cutting compared to a Dro Pro similar set up but not enough to get me to pay the extra.  Dave


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## mksj (Aug 5, 2022)

A 1 micron scale on all axis will drive you nuts with 4-5 digits. The main reason for needing it on the cross slide is that in diameter mode it doubles the actual movement so the DRO jumps in 0.0004" increments, and the scale error doubles and so does the calculation errors. End of the day is you get some weird numbers and your errors can go up significantly. My DRO originally was specified as a 1 micron cross slide, but I just couldn't get accuracy at the 0.001" level, so I checked the scale and it ended up they shipped a 5 micron scale. PM/QMT sent me a 1 micron and there was no longer a problem. I would see where things are when you are close to getting your lathe, a lot can change until then, or they run out of DRO's and you use the dials. 

FYI the magnetic scales are the same, it is only the read head which is the higher resolution and also represents 90% of the cost of the scale.

PM/QMT in my opinion has the best service at this level of machines, nobody is perfect and not everyone can be satisfied.


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## tjb (Aug 5, 2022)

About a year ago, I went with what mksj recommended on both my mill and lathe and have been over-the-top satisfied with both.  I like what Mark did on his tail-stock.  Mine is a little more complicated to build but probably not any more accurate than his.  Here's a link:






I agree with Beckerkumm about the mounting brackets.  The older style, which is what came with my kits, is a little cheesy but functional.  I ended up modifying and/or fabricating - whatever was necessary to make them work.  Interesting to hear that they've upgraded - maybe they're better now.

Bottom line: I'd buy both again in a heartbeat.  They are MUCH nicer than the glass scales that they replaced.  I don't think you'll be disappointed.

Regards


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## tjb (Aug 5, 2022)

Beckerkumm said:


> Jo Shepard at Allendale ( M dro ) is very good to deal with too.  I'd trust her for support.  I do think there is cost cutting compared to a Dro Pro similar set up but not enough to get me to pay the extra.  Dave


Ditto.


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## skcncx (Aug 5, 2022)

mksj said:


> A 1 micron scale on all axis will drive you nuts with 4-5 digits


Is that because it "flickers" or rather, so sensitive that the 4 and 5 digits are constantly moving? I thought on the MX-200 is showed in the manual you can adjust how many digits to display, I read the ES-12C manual and I don' think that's an option, likely 4 digits when in  inch mode.  Maybe that was a setting in Touch DRO... I've gone through just about all the manuals for these, likely getting them crisscrossed on features.

I guess more/better is not always "better"... a higher resolution scale read head when is not of much benefit.... I doubt I'll need to turn a shoulder to the 1 micron level of accuracy.... right now, I'll be happy with +- a few thousandths and it saves me $50 going with 2 at 5 micron and 1 a 1 micron for scales/read heads. 



mksj said:


> My DRO originally was specified as a 1 micron cross slide, but I just couldn't get accuracy at the 0.001" level, so I checked the scale and it ended up they shipped a 5 micron scale.


That makes sense, looks like the scale (or more correctly the read head) resolution needs to match what's configured in the DRO head, seems like all DRO's that's a setup config you need to make sure it right.



mksj said:


> I would see where things are when you are close to getting your lathe, a lot can change until then, or they run out of DRO's and you use the dials.


Cart before the horse on this one, I'll likely order my DRO now, if it's from Machine-DRO so I know I'll have it... if I just go with MX-200, I'll just pick it up with lathe when it comes in.




mksj said:


> PM/QMT in my opinion has the best service at this level of machines, nobody is perfect and not everyone can be satisfied.


No doubt there... I have asked them so many questions (as well as every on this forum) and they are super quick to respond, even had a couple calls with sales and tech support.  Without a doubt their support is the main reason, amongst them having a higher quality lathe in a small package is why I'm getting most of the biggies from them... DRO I'm on the fence.  What's I can save on the ES-12C over the MX-200L and installing myself, I could get PM's 4 jaw chuck.  Though, my stand/workstation setup is starting to snowball into really expensive as well. 

I wish their MX-200 would be like all the other DROS out there... pick how many scales and lengths and resolutions and you decide what machine it goes on... it's a bummer I cannot get a 3 axis lathe DRO from them.


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## skcncx (Aug 5, 2022)

tjb said:


> About a year ago, I went with what mksj recommended on both my mill and lathe and have been over-the-top satisfied with both.  I like what Mark did on his tail-stock.  Mine is a little more complicated to build but probably not any more accurate than his.  Here's a link:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Nice setup on tailstock, I like the magnet mount and how it's a magnet attached to the fixed quill end, I have a digital scale on my table saw and it uses a magnet to keep the fence connected to the scale read head... for now what you have would be out of my buildability, no mill here yet.... though, seems like that will be on the horizon if I keep digging into this metal machining fab stuff.

If I go through with my ES-12C DRO order I guess I'll hope for better brackets, but either way I'll make it work.  From the pics on their site looks like the standard bracket setup from just about any of the DRO kits.


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## Larry$ (Aug 6, 2022)

I've got the Eason that came on my PM1440 in 2016. Takes a minimum of button pushing to do most anything. Display is bright and easy to read. 
I bought a 3 axis model Eason for my 9X49 Jet mill a couple of years ago. Works great all sorts of functions. More functions are used on a mill. I'd hate to go back to not having either DRO. They came with excellent user manuals.


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## Christianstark (Aug 7, 2022)

[QUOTE="skcncx, post: 969905, member: 70275"
I wish their MX-200 would be like all the other DROS out there... pick how many scales and lengths and resolutions and you decide what machine it goes on... it's a bummer I cannot get a 3 axis lathe DRO from them.
[/QUOTE]

I’m almost positive my MX-200 DRO has lathe or mill selections in the config menu. I am having a hard time understanding why you could not order a 3 axis Mx-200 and select Lathe when setting it up. My only guess is the 3 axis lathes won’t have a 1 micron encoder, and they may be able to offer the dros at such a good price due to packaging from the factory, but bottom line, I think it can be done.


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## skcncx (Aug 7, 2022)

Christianstark said:


> I’m almost positive my MX-200 DRO has lathe or mill selections in the config menu. I am having a hard time understanding why you could not order a 3 axis Mx-200 and select Lathe when setting it up. My only guess is the 3 axis lathes won’t have a 1 micron encoder, and they may be able to offer the dros at such a good price due to packaging from the factory, but bottom line, I think it can be done.


I asked this very question to PM's sales support, see question and response below from Matt, not sure if that's "the owner" Matt or not.

It's hard to tell if their MX-200L and MX-200M are different in meaningful ways, they definitely gave them different model numbers.  From a cost, the Machine-DRO in the UK for the Easson 12B/C is $300 cheaper with all scales upgraded to 1 micron than their MX-200M 3 axis.  Even more when I downgrade two scales to 5 micron and the scales are longer as well.

For lathe, the MX-200M has the longest scale of 36"... so, longer lathe, no luck.

*My Question*


> Can I purchase the MX-200M 3 axis DRO but with scale lengths and the 1UM cross slide scale resolution for the PM-1236T?
> 
> I’d like to use the 3rd axis for the tail stock quill.
> 
> If the MagXAct is like every other DRO head unit the only difference is the number of axis inputs on the back.  The software is identical and can be setup as a “lathe” machine in setup.



*Their response*


> No, the 3 axis is a mill version only, not switchable like some, and we only sell them as they are shown as a kit. Our LCD DRO can be change from lathe, mill, EDM, etc. but that does not work with the Magnetic scales.


Some of this statement seems be contradicting itself... either way, it won't work or is cost effective.  If the MX-200L lathe version only has 2 axis inputs on the head unit, you can't buy a 3rd scale and use it.  They don't show the back side on their site.  If you can't buy their 3 axis mill with lengths for your lathe, then it's certainly not cost effective.  As you'd have to buy the kit and then buy an additional set of scales for either additional length and or if you want 1 micron read head for the cross slide which seems to be critical if working in diameter mode.

It's likely they just have a very specific setup with their kits.. I would suggest anyone digging deep to talk directly to PM.. this is JUST my email and their response... I may have asked the question incorrectly and may have gotten answer that is off or not accurate.

*EDIT*... When their response reads _"Our LCD DRO can be change from lathe, mill, EDM etc but does not work with magnetic scales"_, they must (likely) be referring to their lesser expensive LCD dro which is only sold with glass scales.

It would be nicer if the scales were separate from the head unit and you could purchase them separately.  Though, probably coming from different sources and pin outs and software is different as to what it supports, so I do get it.


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## mksj (Aug 8, 2022)

FYI, DRO's can be universal or they can be machine specific. If you look at the mainstream DRO manufactures/distributors, you pay more for if you want additional scale inputs. Most likely the electronics are there but the socket and sometimes the keys are not there. That happened with my first  Easson ES-12 which I bought from PM/QMT for my lathe, I figured they all came with 3 inputs but it only had two. This was also the case of my Acu-Rite DRO that I purchased for my first mill.  Same with many of the DRO Pros units. Vendors that primarily sell DRO's/measurement instruments have the ability to build custom kits. Manufacturers that install DRO's on machines, usually do not give you that choice and may only use one or two DRO models/brands. So I see no reason for QMT/PM to pay extra for 3 or 4  axis DRO units, that the vast majority of buyers would never use. As mentioned you can go to the DRO distributors and order what you want, DRO Pros carries the EL700/750, but you pay extra for the 3rd and 4th inputs. At the end of the day so much time is spent answering peoples questions, at some point I wonder how they can make enough money vs. the employee cost for time spent providing information relative to each unit that they sell.


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## Christianstark (Aug 8, 2022)

Some pics of my MX-200M today.

Changed the config to "Lathe" I did not change anything like X to diameter vs radius, nor do I have 1 micron scales, but I see no reason why this can not be done.


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## skcncx (Aug 8, 2022)

mksj said:


> FYI, DRO's can be universal or they can be machine specific. If you look at the mainstream DRO manufactures/distributors, you pay more for if you want additional scale inputs. Most likely the electronics are there but the socket and sometimes the keys are not there. That happened with my first  Easson ES-12 which I bought from PM/QMT for my lathe, I figured they all came with 3 inputs but it only had two. This was also the case of my Acu-Rite DRO that I purchased for my first mill.  Same with many of the DRO Pros units. Vendors that primarily sell DRO's/measurement instruments have the ability to build custom kits. Manufacturers that install DRO's on machines, usually do not give you that choice and may only use one or two DRO models/brands. So I see no reason for QMT/PM to pay extra for 3 or 4  axis DRO units, that the vast majority of buyers would never use. As mentioned you can go to the DRO distributors and order what you want, DRO Pros carries the EL700/750, but you pay extra for the 3rd and 4th inputs. At the end of the day so much time is spent answering peoples questions, at some point I wonder how they can make enough money vs. the employee cost for time spent providing information relative to each unit that they sell.


Yep, totally understand, just a lot to wade though as a newcomer to all of this. There are many similarities and many critical differences between brands and re-sellers even for the same head unit.  It makes complete sense for PM to simplify offerings and packages.  If the MX-200 is equivalent in all most ways to the EL700/750 for a given machine then PM's version is a great deal.

I reached out to PM since I was preferring them for the DRO with my lathe order, but I'm landing on wanting the 3rd axis for tail stock.  So for now I'm pretty sure the 3 axis Eassson ES-12C with just one scale at 1 micron will be the way I go.  That's about $860 USD shipped to my door.  DITON D80 seems nice as well and is even less at around $600 shipped to door.  My guess is the overall quality between EL700/750, MX-200, Easson 12B/C and Ditron D80 are all in the same ball park.  They are all good but none are at the "Newall" quality I hear about.  Comes down to support and can you get it configured the way you want to.

In regards to cost of business to sell, support and answer questions, I do sympathize with the cost just to get the info out and deal with us.  PM by far has more info on their site and self service information, coupled with reliable and quick support.  You can't go wrong with working PM.

In many cases (broadly speaking in many industries) the lack of readily available product information is frustrating... I really don't want to take up a persons time if the information could easily be downloaded and read.  In the case of Ditron I had to ask twice for the manual. I can order it the way I want but never receive an itemized quote/bill.  Maybe I'm the only one that will read the full manual and install guide before I buy something.


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## skcncx (Aug 8, 2022)

Christianstark said:


> Some pics of my MX-200M today.
> 
> Changed the config to "Lathe"


Yea, not surprised and I would have expected that based on how all the other DRO head units work and setup in their menus. 

PM does not sell their MX-200 in a package that is suitable for what I want on my lathe (an on order PM-1236T).  I'd have to buy another 1 micro reader head and possibly a longer scale for the Z axis.  Neither of which they offer by themselves.

I'd imagine they only want to sell and support their specific packages... even if the hardware and software on these units can do more.  If I were them, I'd probably do the same thing.


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## skcncx (Aug 8, 2022)

For those that have used both the Easson 12B/C and the MagXact M-200... are the button styles different?  Either the soft menu buttons or the calculator/specific labeled buttons?

Just from what I've seen so far it looks like you put a clear bag over the Easson 12B for protection but the MagXAct 200 you apply a common phone/tablet screen protector.  Looks like the entire MX-200 display is glass, even if just a portion is truly dynamic display.  While the Easson 12B's buttons are more mechanical in nature and therefore don't lend themselves to tablet style screen protectors.

Easson ES-12C on machine-dro.co.uk indicates... "_Durable and wipe clean front panel graphic overlay *with PCB mount switches*_"


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## skcncx (Aug 11, 2022)

For what it's worth, I ended up ordering the Aikron A30 DRO.

This looks very similar to the Ditron D80 interface and button layout.  Can buy as 1-4 axis with RPM and touch probe inputs as well.  They actually have an Aikron A30P but that is the cheaper version (not by much though) to the Aikron A30.  The A30P does not support touch probe.

As mentioned in other threads, MachineToolProducts.com out of Indiana switched from the Ditron to the Aikron line and according to them it's much better...I can't quantify that though, so could be all "talk".  If you want to order the Aikron A30 with upgraded scales, 1 micron or longer/different lengths they are just ordering it and shipping it direct from https://www.aikrondro.com which you can order directly from.  They even gave me the "8ctypbg6" discount code to share as well.  That knocked off $40 on my order.

On the aikrondro.com site, you can also easily order your scales and head unit separately and pick and choose glass, vs magnetic and various scale sizes and which resolution you want with them all ala-carte.  They responded very quickly with all my questions as well.

It's worth looking into at least, it's another DRO option out there I don't see a lot of feedback on.  I just decided to go for it and see how it turns out.  Still wish I could have ordered from PM directly but wanted the 3rd axis and since the RPM function comes with it, why not.

It'll be awhile before I can post any feedback to how fast it arrives, did I received everything as ordered and when setup on lathe how does it function and overall quality and accuracy.... this will come from a beginner's perspective for sure!


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## Larry$ (Aug 11, 2022)

skcncx said:


> the RPM function comes with it


I don't even know what the RPM function is. Sounds like a tachometer?? My Easons have a travel speed function that is easy to use, if you were doing production work and wanted to have all parts have the same mill marks it would seem useful. But as a hobbyist??


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## skcncx (Aug 12, 2022)

Larry$ said:


> I don't even know what the RPM function is. Sounds like a tachometer?? My Easons have a travel speed function that is easy to use, if you were doing production work and wanted to have all parts have the same mill marks it would seem useful. But as a hobbyist??


Yes, just a tachometer, the DRO has an input for a hall sensor to read spindle rpm.  RPM "function" probably wasn't the best word to use.  

Likely just a gratuitous sensor/read out but it seems many lathe operators have hooked up some type of auxiliary tach/rpm readout on their lathes... so why not just have it built into the DRO.


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## Larry$ (Aug 12, 2022)

OK, I'm too crude of a machinist to care if the rpm is exactly one thing or another. I just go by the indicator on the variable speed (Reeves drive.) No idea how accurate that is. 60 to ???? on mill.  Gear drive on lathe that I assume to be relatively accurate to the chart.


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## skcncx (Aug 21, 2022)

Well, my Aikron A30 3 axis DRO arrived for my lathe... still waiting on lathe, October eta.  Anyway, it's certainly worth a consideration if you are in the market for one.  I ordered on Friday and it arrived the following Friday.  I ordered directly since I could ala cart the head unit and scales.  Though you can purchase from https://www.machinetoolproducts.com out of the US.

The DRO head unit seems rock solid, a lot heavier than I was anticipating.  While plastic, it doesn't flex one bit and is very tough.  Not a game changer, but their UI has the manual built in for quick help when needed... that's a nice touch. 

I ordered 2 of their slim (AUMS) scales, one 1 micron for x axis and the other 5 micron for quill.  The 3rd scale for z axis is 5 micron but the larger body scale... though the actual magnetic scale underneath the protective stainless band is identical in size to the slim scales... just a bigger aluminum frame for it to sit in.

One thing I learned is that the 1 micron read head is specific to the 1 micron magnetic strip.... as is the 5 micron read heads and mag strips.   I was previously under the impression the only difference between 1 and 5 micron was the read head.  Maybe that's different for other brands but not the case with Aikron.  Has something to do with the pitch of the magnetic scale.  In testing I thought they didn't work, but it was just that I had the 5 micron read head on the 1 micron mag scale.  Anyway, it'll still be a while before I can install and put it in real use.

Below are the pics of their AUMS mag scales, the docs say 16mm by 10mm, they are actually a bit smaller.

Once I get my PM-1236T, I may even glue/self stick them for the cross slide mount. Being so slim I likely won't need any offset to retain access to the cross slide lock screw.


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