# Going To Buy A New Lathe And Mill. Need Your Thoughts And Opinions.



## dieselshadow (Aug 22, 2016)

Gentlemen, I'm seriously considering pulling the trigger on a new G0709 lathe and G0755 mill. Both seem to have a good reputation along with Grizzly. Sure, I've found some online drawbacks and issues, but nothing that seems out of the ordinary. They seem awfully hard to beat for the money, features, customer service, and reputation. 

All of the other machines I've looked at don't have the features or are priced way out of my budget. I have looked at PM machines as there seems to be a faithful following with great customer service and support. However, their website is complete junk, a serious lack of good info and pics, completely disagrees with their mobile site, and the manuals are even worse. I wish I could see these machines in person. I've researched the heck out of these machines, but at the end of the day I don't feel comfortable spending that kind of money when I can't find much info or even many videos online of these machines. 

So in short, I haven't seen any of these machines in person, much less any equipment in this size range and capability. There isn't much on the used market here, what is is overpriced, not taken care of, or way too big or small. I want to work with the tools, not work on them. 

I'm really open to any opinions, suggestions, recommendations, and advice y'all are wiling to help me with. Thank you.


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## Eddyde (Aug 23, 2016)

I've been shopping for my next lathe and settled on PM if I buy new (I'm still looking at what the used market has to offer). I think you should at least give Matt at PM a call before you make your final decision, he will answer any concerns. He seems to rely more on personal contact than the website for closing the deal and from what I can see he has a better offering:
http://www.machinetoolonline.com/PM1440.html


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## dieselshadow (Aug 23, 2016)

Yeah, I will be calling Matt. He was out of town for a while there. I have been looking at the PM1440E-LB as well. The price is right, and the specs seem to be good. I had requested a spec sheet from them and some pics, since this wasn't available online. The spec sheet didn't match what was online at all. They also sent one on the GT, but that one is pretty expensive and you have to buy the preferred package just to get the basic equipment. By the time you add up all the nickels, I'm in the price range of the G0509G which blows away all of these lathes in the weight and specs dept. I'm trying to "keep it real" and quit looking at that monster. LOL


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## Eddyde (Aug 23, 2016)

The GT Lathes are made in Taiwan, a step up in quality.


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## RandyM (Aug 23, 2016)

Dieselshadow, Welcome to HM, love the avatar.


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## dieselshadow (Aug 23, 2016)

RandyM said:


> Dieselshadow, Welcome to HM, love the avatar.



Thanks Randy!


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## davidh (Aug 23, 2016)

here comes 2 cents worth. . . . .  grizzly is a large company, been around for quite some time.  if they were really bad to deal with, they would not survive.  so a plus 1 for them.  matt at PM is a hard working and dedicated shop owner/ operator.  he has good product and has control of what he is buying and selling, and it appears he is concerned about satisfaction both during and after the sale.  i believe he will be around for the after sale issues for quite some time, and trying to keep up with the demands for his equipment is a major challenge to say the least. if he had the equipment i was going to buy at the time, he would have been my "go to" guy.  i liked the way he operated and how he appeared totally committed to his purpose.  others have said the same thing. . . his catalog may be lacking but his customer service and satisfaction rate more than makes up for that. . . 
like i said, you got my 2-cents. . .


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## mksj (Aug 23, 2016)

If one is looking at website and manuals, Grizzly has the financial resources to do a much better job. The cost of doing these both at a high level, one would loose money as a small business owner. QMT has been working on their manuals, and the newer ones are very well done, so it is worth contacting them to see if they have a manual available for the machines you are interested in.  Also QMT often has models/machines not listed on their website, so it as least worth giving them a call and discussion what you are looking for. 

We sometimes get caught up in the specs and loose site of what are needs are. Going purely by weight and which has the longest or widest dimensions on a lathe bed, does not necessarily yield the best machine for what the application and environment they will be used in. As a hobbyist, the demands you place on the machine are minimal in comparison to an industrial environment.   That being said, there are some factors they may be key to your decision, such as spindle bore on a lathe and travel dimensions on a mill. Historically, I would say most people who have the G0709 are very happy with the machine, and if you do a lot of threading there are no change gears. Quality wise, they will all have their nit picks at this price range. The comparative machine from QMT would be PM1440E-LB, which offers a few more features at the same price, but either one would be a great machine.  The next step up would be the PM1440GT, which is a big chunk of change more. You do not need to get the preferred package, if you think there are other chucks you would be interested in. Many of us end up using one chuck most of the time.  I have the 1340GT and it exceeds my expectations, even though it is a smaller machine. My experience with the cheaper machines/products from Chinese mainland is such, that I would not buy one again (and haven't), but this is more if your budget allows the choice.  If I where buying a machine today, I would want a larger spindle bore and a universal enclosed gearbox.  Rigidity and capabilities wise the 1340GT has not been an issue even though it is a 1000Lb machine, I can easily machine to better than 0.001" tolerances.  

On the mill, my suggestion would be get a machine that gives you the longest travel possible. I would look at the PM-940M, having 12" of Y travel is a huge plus, especially if you add a DRO as you will loose an inch of travel. Personally, I would seriously consider the PM935 mill and along with either the G0709 or PM1440. I have had a bench top mill with the same travel as the PM932/G0755 for 3 years and have always found it limiting in the Y travel. I also added power feeds to the X and Z axis, I can't imagine not having a mill without them. The fit and finish on my mill (Optimum) has been decent for the price I paid, but I recently upgrade to a Taiwanese 9x42 mill, and it puts you in a whole different level.  It is also very reasonable to look at the used market for a full size knee mill if you have the space.


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## BGHansen (Aug 23, 2016)

I bought a G0709 14x40 lathe about 11 months ago.  Have had absolutely no problems with it at all.  No quality issues, no leaks, no funny noises, very good finish on my work.  Love the universal gear box for threading, turn a knob to one position for English threads, rotate to another setting for metric.

Only "required" mod in my mind was reinforcing the switch plate.  The switches are mounted to the silk screened head stock info plate which is around 0.050" aluminum.  The switches felt spongy pushing on them.  I added an 1/8" aluminum plate behind them so now all is good.  I've added the taper attachment and lever style 5-C collet closer.  Should have a TPAC tools DRO on it by this next weekend.  I can't speak to Grizzly's service department since I've had no issues.  Can't speak to their mills; I have a Jet JVM-830 and an Atlas MFB.

Bruce


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## dieselshadow (Aug 23, 2016)

So I spoke to Matt at PM today. He's going to send me some more information regarding the PM1440E-LB and a mill with power down feed. I can't remember which model it was he recommended.


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## mksj (Aug 25, 2016)

The PM1440E-LB is a lot of lathe/accessories for the price and the DRO is an Easson ES-8A which are very good units (I have this brand on my lathe).  On the mill, one model which is not on their website, but would be a step up quality wise from the PM-940 would be the PM833T. It is made in Taiwan, comes with power feeds, one shot lubrication and looks to be very high quality.  Certainly worth considering if you do not go with a knee mill.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/PM-833T-8-x...R-WARRANTY-FREE-SHIPPING-TAIWAN-/331930028248


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## dieselshadow (Aug 25, 2016)

Thanks.... Now I'm drooling over another machine.... It's only money I suppose. 

Anyone got a few extra G's they want to donate?


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## wrmiller (Aug 25, 2016)

Hey Dieselshadow,

Just a FWIW, but having spent years using (and using well I might add) Chinese machines I can honestly say that my current PM machines that were made in Taiwan make me wonder why I waited so long to make the jump. Not putting down the Chinese machines because I used them quite successfully. After tweaking and modifying them to my satisfaction. Other than adding DROs and VFDs to my PM935 and PM1340GT I have done nothing to them other than to use them. Usually with a big grin on my face...  Just my $0.02...


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## Charles Spencer (Aug 25, 2016)

dieselshadow said:


> Anyone got a few extra G's they want to donate?



Tell ya what.   I'll help you raise $5,000.  I'll give you the $5 and then all you'll need will be zeroes.


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## tmarks11 (Aug 25, 2016)

Charles Spencer said:


> Tell ya what.   I'll help you raise $5,000.  I'll give you the $5 and then all you'll need will be zeroes.



I volunteer to give you a Zero.  Now you only need two more.... 

I have a Grizzly G0709, it is okay.  If I were buying again, I would really look at PM-1340GT.  He is getting a single piece cast iron base made up for them, which would make it an awesome choice.  Not cheap, however.


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## dieselshadow (Aug 25, 2016)

It looks like I'm going to pull the trigger on a PM1440E-LB and a PM932M-PDF from Matt at Quality Machine Tool.


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## Charles Spencer (Aug 25, 2016)

To save everybody else the trouble of looking up the pictures:





They look very nice indeed.


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## Bamban (Aug 26, 2016)

dieselshadow said:


> Yeah, I will be calling Matt. He was out of town for a while there. I have been looking at the PM1440E-LB as well. The price is right, and the specs seem to be good. I had requested a spec sheet from them and some pics, since this wasn't available online. The spec sheet didn't match what was online at all. They also sent one on the GT, but that one is pretty expensive and you have to buy the preferred package just to get the basic equipment. By the time you add up all the nickels, I'm in the price range of the G0509G which blows away all of these lathes in the weight and specs dept. I'm trying to "keep it real" and quit looking at that monster. LOL



In one of my conversations with Shiraz Balolia, the  owner of Grizzly.com and Bullets.com, we talked about lathes, here is the statement he made on what lathe he uses *"I have access to ANY lathe I want in my shop and I have the G0509G. That should tell you something."*


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## RandyM (Aug 26, 2016)

dieselshadow said:


> It looks like I'm going to pull the trigger on a PM1440E-LB and a PM932M-PDF from Matt at Quality Machine Tool.



Good choice. Can't wait to see them sitting in your shop.


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## Eddyde (Aug 26, 2016)

Bamban said:


> In one of my conversations with Shiraz Balolia, the  owner of Grizzly.com and Bullets.com, we talked about lathes, here is the statement he made on what lathe he uses *"I have access to ANY lathe I want in my shop and I have the G0509G. That should tell you something."*


So he uses the most practical lathe for his personal needs from his massive inventory, that doesn't surprise me. What would is if he admitted he had the PM1440GT!


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## dieselshadow (Aug 26, 2016)

RandyM said:


> Good choice. Can't wait to see them sitting in your shop.



Thanks Randy. I can't wait either. If work isn't crazy today, I should have the order completed.  Of course the obligatory photos will come.


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## mksj (Aug 26, 2016)

At that price level I would recommend considering the PM940M-PDF over the 932 and gain another 4" in Y travel. Hugh difference when you throw a vise on the machine, and if you add a DRO scale to the back, having that extra 4" for a few dollars more is significant. My mill has 8.5" of Y travel, and I just replaced it with a longer travel machine as this was the most limiting factor. You may also consider going 3 phase and put an inexpensive VFD (like $150), as it fills in the speed range and you do not have the issue of the motor capacitors going.

Just my


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## dieselshadow (Aug 26, 2016)

mksj said:


> At that price level I would recommend considering the PM940M-PDF over the 932 and gain another 4" in Y travel. Hugh difference when you throw a vise on the machine, and if you add a DRO scale to the back, having that extra 4" for a few dollars more is significant. My mill has 8.5" of Y travel, and I just replaced it with a longer travel machine as this was the most limiting factor. You may also consider going 3 phase and put an inexpensive VFD (like $150), as it fills in the speed range and you do not have the issue of the motor capacitors going.



This was an excellent suggestion. I've run Matt around crazy with emails, but now I've got a PM-940M-PDF on the list.  I should be placing the order this afternoon. 

Then the dreadful wait begins.


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## RandyM (Aug 26, 2016)

It's only money.


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## dieselshadow (Aug 26, 2016)

RandyM said:


> It's only money.



Yup. Much easier if its someone else's.


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## dieselshadow (Aug 27, 2016)

So the decision has been made, deposits have been put down! Here's the _*new thread*_ for you to follow.


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