# No more traffic cops!



## Janderso (Dec 13, 2022)

Is it just the area that I live or is this a national problem?

Drivers no longer stop at stop signs, run red lights, pass on the right, speed, don’t signal, texting and cell phone calls distract drivers, etc.

There still seems to be sporadic highway patrol oversight on the state and federal highways but there is no attempt made by our local city police or county units.

How is it in your area?

We live in Chico Ca. (Butte County) About 80 miles north of Sacramento.


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## Asm109 (Dec 13, 2022)

Americans have ALWAYS passed on the right.  Its only in Europe where they follow this quaint tradition.


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## JPMacG (Dec 13, 2022)

Enforcement is kind of random here.  I'd say enforcement is about the same as it has always been.   Some areas they don't enforce at all and others they regularly ticket stop sign violations.  

Distracted driving is my pet peeve.  We were rear ended recently by someone who I suspect was multi-tasking.  I don't know of a solution.


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## matthewsx (Dec 13, 2022)

Get off my lawn


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## Just for fun (Dec 13, 2022)

It's bad up here in North Central Washington also.  I think it is the sine of the times, unfortunately.


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## aliva (Dec 13, 2022)

Here in northern Ontario cops are spread pretty thin, so it's not unusual to see very few. ( population density is much lower than Southern Ontario) I recently drove a total 360 miles and never saw one cop on the high way this was 2 and 4 lanes . Further south of me is the 401 highway ( 4, 6 and 8 lanes)  which runs  East and West, the busiest in North American , you cant go 10 miles without seeing cruiser either driving or on the side with radar. Traffic volume obliviously has a bearing on the number of police. Distracted driving is also a big problem here, the number  of charges has dropped over the years I think maybe due to the accompanying $350.00 fine and 3 demerit points. Passing on the right is legal on 4 and more lane roadways not on 2 lanes except if there is a left turning lane. Some people still pass  school buses ( with lights flashing and stop sign out). The fine is up to $1000.00 plus 6 demerit points and possible jail time.


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## Bone Head (Dec 13, 2022)

I pretty much have quit the night rides on my motorcycle.  From 9 to 10 a.m. I'll leave for a ride, but pass 2 p.m. it gets absolutely stupid.  Law enforcement can't be everywhere I know; there just isn't enough of them.
My truck is an old piece of junk.  Someone hits it I don't care.


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## Winegrower (Dec 13, 2022)

It seems to me that there is something going on…driving along with the traffic, maybe 75 or 80 mph on the interstates, there will be an occasional car pass at something more like 95 or 100, cutting in and out to get through.  Sometimes two cars seeming to be in some way together, tracking movements.   Is this some new game I’m missing?

Anybody else observe this, or is it me?

And yes, driving to Fresno and back over the weekend, I saw zero CHP.


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## benmychree (Dec 13, 2022)

Winegrower said:


> It seems to me that there is something going on…driving along with the traffic, maybe 75 or 80 mph on the interstates, there will be an occasional car pass at something more like 95 or 100, cutting in and out to get through.  Sometimes two cars seeming to be in some way together, tracking movements.   Is this some new game I’m missing?
> 
> Anybody else observe this, or is it me?
> 
> And yes, driving to Fresno and back over the weekend, I saw zero CHP.


Sorry to hear that you had to go to Fresno!  Around here our city cops keep pretty busy with traffic, a state highway runs right throug our main drag, so we usually have 2 city cops running around town plus CHP and the occasional sheriff's deputies; we have a police report in our local paper, a weekly publication, and there a lot of citations listed in every issue.  As long as they leave me alone, that's OK!  I suspect a lot of citations are tourists, bring their big city ways to the country, one thing I've seen several times that irks me is people passing on the left at high speed on the turn lanes.


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## sdelivery (Dec 13, 2022)

Welcome to California


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## pontiac428 (Dec 13, 2022)

Up here, they had a movement to defund the police.  You may have seen the parties they threw on the TV.

The police have been on minimal staffing since.  Now, if you want to see a cop, you have to get naked, put on face paint, grab an AR, and run down the middle of the street impeding traffic for an hour.  Then you might see a cop.

The criminals have gotten well used to it and the street urchins are bold as a result.


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## benmychree (Dec 13, 2022)

I support our local cops, maybe not so much in some other locales ---


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## sdelivery (Dec 13, 2022)

pontiac428 said:


> Up here, they had a movement to defund the police.  You may have seen the parties they threw on the TV.
> 
> The police have been on minimal staffing since.  Now, if you want to see a cop, you have to get naked, put on face paint, grab an AR, and run down the middle of the street impeding traffic for an hour.  Then you might see a cop.
> 
> The criminals have gotten well used to it and the street urchins are bold as a result.


If your not part of the solution then you are part of the problem. 
This is a universal problem in this country right now.
Stand strong to your beliefs,to your morals.
We must fight the blight of this rape of the dignity of moral, working citizens.
Much of the rest of the nation doesn't think highly of the west coast and feel like that garbage is heading our way


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## JPMacG (Dec 13, 2022)

Winegrower said:


> It seems to me that there is something going on…driving along with the traffic, maybe 75 or 80 mph on the interstates, there will be an occasional car pass at something more like 95 or 100, cutting in and out to get through.  Sometimes two cars seeming to be in some way together, tracking movements.   Is this some new game I’m missing?
> 
> Anybody else observe this, or is it me?
> 
> And yes, driving to Fresno and back over the weekend, I saw zero CHP.



Yes, we see that behavior frequently on Rt 95 near the Delaware-Maryland border.  We think there are organized competitions of some kind.  Illegal road rallys or something.  Occasionally one gets pulled over by the MD state police.


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## matthewsx (Dec 13, 2022)

sdelivery said:


> If your not part of the solution then you are part of the problem.
> This is a universal problem in this country right now.
> Stand strong to your beliefs,to your morals.
> We must fight the blight of this rape of the dignity of moral, working citizens.
> Much of the rest of the nation doesn't think highly of the west coast and feel like that garbage is heading our way


I'm sorry you feel that way, if you would like to move on to politics I suggest another forum.

John


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## tq60 (Dec 13, 2022)

If you see stupid stuff call 911!

We have patrol radio in our work truck, earlier today was a dispatch for a motorist who reported converter theft on freeway.

They had a flat tire. 

Bad guys came along and stole converter and all tools, including ones used to change tire, dispatched a tow truck to assist.

Prisons are being shuttered due to low crime...

Sent from my SM-G781V using Tapatalk


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## markba633csi (Dec 13, 2022)

For habitual drunk drivers they put breathalyzers in their cars. For the rest, they should put consciousness-alyzers


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## WobblyHand (Dec 13, 2022)

Just yesterday there was a State Police crack down on the local highway, 31 drivers were stopped for speeding and aggressive driving within a 4 hour period.  This is not the first time they have done this.  There have been several of these sweeps the past three months.  Sadly, it seems necessary to inform the offenders that there are some rules for driving on public roads.


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## WobblyHand (Dec 13, 2022)

markba633csi said:


> For habitual drunk drivers they put breathalyzers in their cars. For the rest, they should put consciousness-alyzers


Well that would clear the roads...  None of them would pass.


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## tonydi (Dec 13, 2022)

I listen to the local CHP radio feed here.  Don't waste your time calling 911 for anything that's moving as CHP will not respond. 

Well, not quite true, here are the moving things they respond to...

Pedestrians, animals, tumbleweeds (rare around here) and wrong way drivers.

If you see some crazy going 100mph, weaving in and out of traffic, cutting people off, driving on the shoulder and brake checking other cars, (which I hear at least once a day!)....nope, it's just noted as "beat info" and no units will respond.

If you are the victim of a road rage incident and report that sort of crazy driving activity by the other driver, even report the other driver brandishing a weapon during the incident, beat info.

But don't worry Mr Opossum.....if you're wandering around in the center divide. three units will rush to your aid.

I'm not sure why they don't respond, maybe not enough units to get to the area in time to do anything, risk to public safety, no telling.  I do know that on the graveyard shift the closest unit to something like a crash will often be 15-20 miles away, yet the live incident report may show no other incidents.  So it's not like everyone else is out on calls.  That definitely points to low staffing, just like during the day you almost never see any units actually patrolling the freeways (which is why those 100mph nutjobs are doing it every day).


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## Janderso (Dec 13, 2022)

pontiac428 said:


> Up here, they had a movement to defund the police.  You may have seen the parties they threw on the TV.
> 
> The police have been on minimal staffing since.  Now, if you want to see a cop, you have to get naked, put on face paint, grab an AR, and run down the middle of the street impeding traffic for an hour.  Then you might see a cop.
> 
> The criminals have gotten well used to it and the street urchins are bold as a result.


Or a BB gun.


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## Janderso (Dec 13, 2022)

tonydi said:


> I listen to the local CHP radio feed here.  Don't waste your time calling 911 for anything that's moving as CHP will not respond.
> 
> Well, not quite true, here are the moving things they respond to...
> 
> ...


Hmm, low staffing seems to be the way it is these days.
Restaurants are closed Sunday-Wednesday due to low staffing.
Everywhere you go we see, Now Hiring, 
Must be a shortage of people on the planet


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## brino (Dec 13, 2022)

aliva said:


> Some people still pass school buses ( with lights flashing and stop sign out). The fine is up to $1000.00 plus 6 demerit points and possible jail time.


Those penalties are NOT enough!



Winegrower said:


> And yes, driving to Fresno and back over the weekend, I saw zero CHP.


John and Ponch must be retired by now......  



markba633csi said:


> For habitual drunk drivers they put breathalyzers in their cars.


.....maybe should just run the exhaust straight back in and disable the windows.

Brian


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## vtcnc (Dec 13, 2022)

WobblyHand said:


> Just yesterday there was a State Police crack down on the local highway, 31 drivers were stopped for speeding and aggressive driving within a 4 hour period.  This is not the first time they have done this.  There have been several of these sweeps the past three months.  Sadly, it seems necessary to inform the offenders that there are some rules for driving on public roads.


You want to send them over to Vermont for the weekend?


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## tq60 (Dec 13, 2022)

tonydi said:


> I listen to the local CHP radio feed here. Don't waste your time calling 911 for anything that's moving as CHP will not respond.
> 
> Well, not quite true, here are the moving things they respond to...
> 
> ...


Yes, they do respond.

It matters where they are and what the rp (reporting party) is stating.

We monitor traffic whenever we are driving, yes it seems like they are not responding but you may not be aware of justice department restricting radio traffic regarding privacy.

They are requiring encryption to protect privacy of folks, CHP not likely to encript so much is done via computer screens.

We have observed many instances where the RP is traveling down the roadway and calling about road rage or other stupid stuff.

They swarm on it, setup on the freeway and work with the caller.

We worked for Motorola way back, the expression is "you may out run me but not Motorola".

One day the had a bad guy under pursuit, many units and the helicopter involved.

Guy got out of car and climbed a tree.

The K9 was at the bottom barking.

Helicopter dropped down to take a "closer look", blew him out of the tree, K9 secured him, thy drug him to the hospital for repairs...

Sent from my SM-G781V using Tapatalk


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## WobblyHand (Dec 13, 2022)

vtcnc said:


> You want to send them over to Vermont for the weekend?


No I don't.  I'd like them taken off the road.

I don't think folks should be driving in a way that endangers others.  That doesn't mean exceeding the speed limit, it means driving in an unsafe manner.  Like weaving and darting in traffic to get some miniscule time advantage, but forcing others to jam on their brakes, or high speed tailgating.  There's lots of other unsafe practices, like texting, watching porn, and all kinds of other stuff that we have all seen on the road.  Let's see now, brushing hair, shaving, doing makeup, turning your head around to yell at bickering or fighting kids.  Basically any activity, including feeding your face, using social media or anything else that takes your eyes and attention off the road.  Can't say I've never been distracted.  I can say however, that I have never caused an accident or event to occur as a result of my actions (to my knowledge).


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## Gnpenning (Dec 13, 2022)

During the Thanksgiving holidays I did a multiple state trip.  A fair portion of the drive was on 80 mph roads.  I noticed in UT that the speed limit was a vague suggestion.  At 80 I felt like I should have been checking tire pressure the way I was being passed.  It was insane.  The officers I saw were tending to accidents. 

To be fair Utah wasn't the he only state with speeding vehicles, just the one with the higher percentage of perceived speeders. 

On a 4 state and roughly 3000 mile road trip I don't recall seeing anyone pulled over for what would appear getting a ticket.


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## rwm (Dec 13, 2022)

Charlotte is terrible with speeding, red light and stop sign running. Here, it is not due to texting or lack of attention. Unfortunately, it is deliberate law breaking because they have nothing to lose. They are uninsured and driving a $1000 car with temp tags. They do not care if they hit a pedestrian or a Bugatti. 
I was recently passed by a car on I85 going over 100mph ON THE RIGHT SHOULDER. 
We desperately need red light cameras (which I used to strongly oppose) but apparently this has been determined to be illegal in NC. 
I now feel like I am dangerous by setting my cruise control at 10 mph over the limit since I am usually the slowest car on the road.


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## sdelivery (Dec 14, 2022)

Wow what I have seen in Ohio is a change of guard sorta....the state highway patrol now patrols in cities they didn't typically in the past.
For instance Cleveland,  I have seen them (two in car) drive by incidents and never turn their heads to look but the highway patrol in the city stopping cars for basic traffic violations. 
I am sure staffing is down, it has become more of a thankless job.
I always thought it was an under paid job as well.
One thought, I know that OHP is a Para military organization as it has its own boot camp and military techniques where most of the police departments here do not.
Another crazy side note is how many of our cities have ex military armored vehicles.


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## Bone Head (Dec 14, 2022)

sdelivery said:


> Wow what I have seen in Ohio is a change of guard sorta....the state highway patrol now patrols in cities they didn't typically in the past.
> For instance Cleveland,  I have seen them (two in car) drive by incidents and never turn their heads to look but the highway patrol in the city stopping cars for basic traffic violations.
> I am sure staffing is down, it has become more of a thankless job.
> I always thought it was an under paid job as well.
> ...


You should know it is no longer the "Ohio State Highway Patrol"...it's now the "Ohio State Police".  Not sure when Columbus changed the mission.


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## jbaccell (Dec 14, 2022)

Janderso said:


> Hmm, low staffing seems to be the way it is these days.
> Restaurants are closed Sunday-Wednesday due to low staffing.
> Everywhere you go we see, Now Hiring,
> Must be a shortage of people on the planet


No shortage of people just a shortage of those willing to work!


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## sdelivery (Dec 14, 2022)

Bone Head said:


> You should know it is no longer the "Ohio State Highway Patrol"...it's now the "Ohio State Police".  Not sure when Columbus changed the mission.


Well well well I didn't know that.
Most of the stateies are pretty nice...I have met a few....Inconnel right foot


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## frugalguido (Dec 14, 2022)

I still think a big problem, besides a lack enforcement, is that there is no drivers training(school) anymore. When is the last time you heard a kid went to drivers school to learn to drive before getting their license ?  People don't know the rules of the road. They are taught by parents, friends that can't drive either and gets passed down threw the generations and just like a snow ball effect.


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## jbaccell (Dec 14, 2022)

frugalguido said:


> I still think a big problem, besides a lack enforcement, is that there is no drivers training(school) anymore. When is the last time you heard a kid went to drivers school to learn to drive before getting their license ?  People don't know the rules of the road. They are taught by parents, friends that can't drive either and gets passed down threw the generations and just like a snow ball effect.


And, they made cars too easy to drive which further exacerbates the issue. So easy, you need no skills to move the vehicle but that doesn’t make you a driver.


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## Bone Head (Dec 14, 2022)

sdelivery said:


> Well well well I didn't know that.
> Most of the stateies are pretty nice...I have met a few....Inconnel right foot


LOL, me too!  I've been pulled over by locals, county and our State Police.  Most of them, as long as you're courteous and respectful there's no problem.  I will say the OSP are the most professional of all of them.  Some locals not so much.  I won't name names, but I've had a couple of nasty episodes in Ohio and traveling out of state.


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## Janderso (Dec 14, 2022)

Gnpenning said:


> During the Thanksgiving holidays I did a multiple state trip.  A fair portion of the drive was on 80 mph roads.  I noticed in UT that the speed limit was a vague suggestion.  At 80 I felt like I should have been checking tire pressure the way I was being passed.  It was insane.  The officers I saw were tending to accidents.
> 
> To be fair Utah wasn't the he only state with speeding vehicles, just the one with the higher percentage of perceived speeders.
> 
> On a 4 state and roughly 3000 mile road trip I don't recall seeing anyone pulled over for what would appear getting a ticket.


Those of you old enough to remember the alleged gas shortage in the 70's, may remember when the national speed limit went to 55 MPH!!. 
Or was that a state thing?
I was driving during this mess. It felt like we were crawling on the freeway.
I'm sure glad those days have passed us by.


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## Cadillac (Dec 14, 2022)

frugalguido said:


> I still think a big problem, besides a lack enforcement, is that there is no drivers training(school) anymore. When is the last time you heard a kid went to drivers school to learn to drive before getting their license ?  People don't know the rules of the road. They are taught by parents, friends that can't drive either and gets passed down threw the generations and just like a snow ball effect.


I don’t know about that. I have five nieces and nephews that have gotten their license in the last five years. They are in suburban school districts and they have to log so many hours of on the road driving. Day time/ night time etc. If they want to get their license actuallly when they turn 16 they have to go to a private driving school. The schools have so many kids to go through the school and meet the requirements your looking at junior year or 17. And it’s expensive to go the private route. Times have changed since I got mine in 92’ and on my birthday. 
 The problem is lack of morals, lack of respect for others and safety and plan old stupidity!!! At the highest level. 
 I live about a mile outside city limits of Chicago. It’s crazy people run red lights. Either come up through the turning lane look and just go through. I see people on a regular basis riding atv’s and dirt bikes down main four lane roads. People never use turn signals don’t know where they are going just turn. Seems they think they’re the only ones on the road. Highways are a free for all. People get shot all the time driving on the highway sometimes car on car sometimes someone shooting from the roadside. We have a highway that runs through the city and theirs at least a flipped over car every other day. How do you flip a car on the roof answer that?? Almost every four way intersection has donuts marks like they burned the whole tire there. It’s the Wild West for sure. 
 Cops have their hands tied they can’t chase anymore can’t use force. They catch them and they’re out in two hours. Criminals know to just run they won’t get caught. They have new recruiting problems. Cops have all this responsibility to fight crime with no tools,no use of force, and can get sued or put in jail for their actions. The criminal gets released little to no repercussions for the crimes committed.  Who wants to be a cop these days your crazy.


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## Janderso (Dec 14, 2022)

Cadillac said:


> The problem is lack of morals, lack of respect for others and safety and plan old stupidity!!! At the highest level.


You know, looking back, I don't think guys are mature enough at 16 to drive a car/truck.
When I was 18, I was much more mature than I was when I was 16. 
Five nieces and nephews!! whew, that's a blessing.


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## pontiac428 (Dec 14, 2022)

Cadillac said:


> Times have changed since I got mine in 92’ and on my birthday.
> How do you flip a car on the roof answer that?? Almost every four way intersection has donuts marks like they burned the whole tire there. It’s the Wild West for sure.
> Cops have their hands tied they can’t chase anymore can’t use force.


Looks like we're the same age, @Cadillac man.  When I was 16, I had a license and three jobs to keep me busy after school and weekends for 7 days a week.  I would get out of school and go to the roofing yard, where I would sweep the yard, unload trucks, and load pallets of tile on the trucks for the next day.  Then I was off to the pizza joint to wash pots and pans until closing.  I worked in a mom and pop gun shop on the weekends so the owner could screw off with his family.  I had plenty of cash and a strong sense of agency.  I don't know about kids these days.  We hire 20-somethings a year or so out of college and they don't know how to read and understand the regulations and requirements that they are supposed to be able to enforce.  If you're on the clock, and your boss tells you to read the regs, you read the damn regs and be happy you're on the clock to do it!


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## Cadillac (Dec 14, 2022)

Janderso said:


> You know, looking back, I don't think guys are mature enough at 16 to drive a car/truck.
> When I was 18, I was much more mature than I was when I was 16.
> Five nieces and nephews!! whew, that's a blessing.


I have eight actually ranging from 12 to 22. You can see a big difference in generations when it comes to technology ie phone use. TOTALLY different times than when I grew up. Weird to say but so true. 
 Idk about being mature enough at 16 either. Some are some arnt. You gotta know your limits. As for driving we use to go in the HS parking lot when it snowed and messed around till we got booted out. That’s what taught me to understand and control Sliding in the snow. Ive NEVER been in a accident too. Knock on wood!


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## WobblyHand (Dec 14, 2022)

Cadillac said:


> As for driving we use to go in the HS parking lot when it snowed and messed around till we got booted out. That’s what taught me to understand and control Sliding in the snow.


This actually should be required of drivers.  

Can't believe people drive even faster and brake later in the snow when they should be doing the opposite.  They obviously haven't practiced in an empty parking lot that is slicked over.  You can learn a whole lot about traction, steering and braking dynamics that way.


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## Jeff.64 (Dec 14, 2022)

Janderso said:


> Those of you old enough to remember the alleged gas shortage in the 70's, may remember when the national speed limit went to 55 MPH!!.
> Or was that a state thing?
> I was driving during this mess. It felt like we were crawling on the freeway.
> I'm sure glad those days have passed us by.


I remember those days and the series of signs stating "You may do a mile a minute," and further down the road "but there is no future in it".  The 55 mph idea was better fuel economy and not dying.  Lots of TV commercials touting the reduced speed with slogans like "drive 55 and arrive alive."  As for now, maybe the lack of arrests on the road is to promote "Darwin awards" to address the low inventory in organ banks ... just kidding of course. I remember the switch back to 65 mph and 70 mph. So people then went from driving 60-65 to 75-90. I have to admit it was nice to get to where you're going faster after the change. A little over 20 years ago, arriving in Nashville after driving 10 hours straight, rush hour traffic, very close to bumper to bumper, three or four lanes, everyone at 85 to 90 mph for a good 20 miles. Very uncomfortable. So glad when my exit came up. The only time I missed the old days of 55.


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## tonydi (Dec 14, 2022)

tq60 said:


> Yes, they do respond.



Actually, no, they do not.  Maybe someplace else but not in my area.  When they get a call for any of the things I said they respond to, they say they are responding and dispatch confirms.  Why would they say beat info if they're responding?  Also, the unit determining it's beat info many times will be the one who takes the very next call.




tq60 said:


> It matters where they are and what the rp (reporting party) is stating.



 I've heard a few very harrowing reports (guns being pointed, kids in the car screaming) of road rage and I keep thinking for sure they've got to respond, but no.    



tq60 said:


> We monitor traffic whenever we are driving, yes it seems like they are not responding but you may not be aware of justice department restricting radio traffic regarding privacy.
> 
> They are requiring encryption to protect privacy of folks, CHP not likely to encript so much is done via computer screens.



 You're right, no encryption of any CHP channels here in the Bay Area.  If they do send info to the screens, dispatch will mention that.


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## Janderso (Dec 15, 2022)

tonydi said:


> Actually, no, they do not.  Maybe someplace else but not in my area.  When they get a call for any of the things I said they respond to, they say they are responding and dispatch confirms.  Why would they say beat info if they're responding?  Also, the unit determining it's beat info many times will be the one who takes the very next call.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Road rage is a scary thing to see.
When I commuted from Walnut Creek to Milbrae (near the San Francisco Airport) the road rage was a sight to behold.
When you go three blocks in an hour, people go ballistic if you let someone in the lane 
I don't miss that commute.


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## pontiac428 (Dec 15, 2022)

I used to sit in that hellhole between 680 and the MacArthur freeway too.  Some days though, I cold bring popcorn and just kick back and watch the entertainment.  When two mofos decide to fight in the center lane, it doesn't matter if cars are whizzing by.


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## rwm (Dec 15, 2022)

My take away from this thread so far is that drivers everywhere have gotten worse. They are taking more risks and driving at more dangerous speeds. From y'alls comments I take it that CLT is not unique.


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## twraska (Dec 15, 2022)

Janderso said:


> Is it just the area that I live or is this a national problem?
> 
> Drivers no longer stop at stop signs, run red lights, pass on the right, speed, don’t signal, texting and cell phone calls distract drivers, etc.
> 
> ...


Come here to Wallis, Texas and speed through town.  Let me know how it turns out.


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## Bone Head (Dec 16, 2022)

I think that people (especially younger people) don't enjoy driving just for the sake of it anymore.  They're all in a hurry to get somewhere.  Most of you had cars or trucks we modified or restored and was proud of it.  Took pleasure in rowing through the gears, taking a curve; all that.
I do have to admit that today I would have a hard time enjoying a Kia.


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## Suzuki4evr (Dec 16, 2022)

Janderso said:


> Is it just the area that I live or is this a national problem?
> 
> Drivers no longer stop at stop signs, run red lights, pass on the right, speed, don’t signal, texting and cell phone calls distract drivers, etc.
> 
> ...


Welcome to South Africa...O sorry I see  you are in Chico Ca.

What you are talking about is going on for years and years now in South Africa. People don't give a damn because there is no punishment. And the traffic cops.....well al I can say is corruption in SA is a problem.


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## ddickey (Dec 16, 2022)

Cadillac said:


> As for driving we use to go in the HS parking lot when it snowed and messed around till we got booted out. That’s what taught me to understand and control Sliding in the snow. Ive NEVER been in a accident too. Knock on wood!


This is how I mastered a full 360 at about 30mph in my 75 Chevy Monza, lol.


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## Janderso (Dec 16, 2022)

No rules on the road is anarchy.
Well, rules that aren’t inforced creates chaos On our highways and byways.


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