# Installed a new water heater to get shop AC



## Shotgun (May 10, 2021)

My old water heater has seen over 20yrs, and water had been seeping from the top for a week or two, so I footed the $1500 for this one. They're called hybrid water heaters, and claim to save you nearly $500/yr in energy costs, plus the feds will give you a $300 tax credit.  It uses a heat pump to warm the water, and the waste is chilled air.  I'm dumping the chilled air into the workshop for now. In the winter, I'll cut a hole in the wall behind it and install a dryer vent.  I'd say it cuts the workshop temp by 10 degrees or so.  A welcome relief in NC.

It's slightly noisy while running, made worse by reverberating with the walls behind it.  So, the box on top is a muffler.  I used the cardboard from the box it came in, two or three layers thick, including the top, built in a couple baffles and the foam from an old seat cushion that the intake air has to route around, and cut holes in the top so that the heater's vent can't "see" them.  It's put together with tape, and held on by the strap.  I'll build something more appropriate if this ever wears out.

The pipe sticking out the front is for condensate.  I'll get a hose and route it over to the sink.  Right now, it's filling a bucket.  I'll also route the water lines behind it at some point in the future.  Had guest in the house this weekend and needed to get it back up ASAP, so some parts of the installation are a little makeshift.  It needs pipe insulation, too.

There is an app that is supposed to let you control the settings, but they want you name, email, phone number, etc to "create an account".  Now, WTH would I need "an account" to the temp on a HWH for?  Just say no.


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## kb58 (May 10, 2021)

Is there a frame under the compressed wood panel it's sitting on? When full, it probably weighs 450-500lbs, and if there's even a tiny leak, it won't take much soaking for that sheet to lose much of its strength.


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## Shotgun (May 10, 2021)

kb58 said:


> Is there a frame under the compressed wood panel it's sitting on? When full, it probably weighs 450-500lbs, and if there's even a tiny leak, it won't take much soaking for that sheet to lose much of its strength.


Yes.  There is a post under the center.  But, now that you point that out, I think I will brace it a bit more..


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## brino (May 10, 2021)

Shotgun said:


> There is an app that is supposed to let you control the settings, but they want you name, email, phone number, etc to "create an account". Now, WTH would I need "an account" to the temp on a HWH for? Just say no.



So they can track you and advertise to you, and sell your data.

Absolutely say "No" to this kinda crap.......or some profanity!

-brino


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## silence dogood (May 10, 2021)

May I suggest put in an inline water filter on the cold intake.  The last time that the city worked on the main line, mud was running through the lines.  Had to replace the filter cartriage, but that is a heck a lot cheaper than a water heater.


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## Dhal22 (May 10, 2021)

It looks all makeshift.  I would have a plumber come in and clean it up.


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## Shotgun (May 11, 2021)

silence dogood said:


> May I suggest put in an inline water filter on the cold intake.  The last time that the city worked on the main line, mud was running through the lines.  Had to replace the filter cartriage, but that is a heck a lot cheaper than a water heater.


I'm on a well that pulls from NC clay.  I literally live just outside a town called "Clay"ton. . The filter is just to the other side of the sink.


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## Shotgun (May 11, 2021)

Dhal22 said:


> It looks all makeshift.  I would have a plumber come in and clean it up.


It is makeshift.  

I had guest and needed to get it running.  I'd have let the plumbers do it, if I could have found one that would do it for a reasonable price.  I don't consider $1200 to $1500 for a job that I can do myself in a couple hours to be reasonable.

But, I got it installed and running.  Verified that it cools the shop (also drops humidity).  The cleanup is easy.


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## Dhal22 (May 11, 2021)

$1200?  My company is about $2000 for 50 gal has water heater.   But I live in a high income area,  no doubt they are cheaper in small towns.


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## Karlito26 (May 19, 2021)

I am happy that you called it a water heater. So many people I talk to its a hot water heater. When I used to work in Home Depot people would ask for hot water heaters all the time. I would politely say we were out of them!

They are so easy to install if you have the tools. $2000 is a lot of money. 

When I install water heater I put ball valves on the cold and hot lines above unions. This way when they break, just turn off the valves and unscrew the unions. Much easier this way.


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## Shotgun (May 19, 2021)

Karlito26 said:


> When I install water heater I put ball valves on the cold and hot lines above unions. This way when they break, just turn off the valves and unscrew the unions. Much easier this way.


Dang-it!  Where were you last week!?   

This weekend, I reworked the installation without the pressure of overnight guests.  Moved the pipes around to the back, cleaned up the power feed, etc.  I reused some of the piping, specifically the section with the shutoff valve on the cold water side.  The CPVC feeds into a set of flexible stainless hoses.  One of those hoses also has a shutoff valve.  A smart move would have been to put the second shutoff on the top, and it is ridiculously obvious. . . now that you say it.  :-(.  Well, if I ever need to drain it again, this will get fixed.

Thank you.


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## Tio Loco (May 19, 2021)

Bought one of those for my last house, loved it. In addition to the cooling exhaust, it de-humidifies the air, which is a plus in Florida.


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## JPMacG (May 19, 2021)

Please let us know how the hybrid works out for you.  I seriously considered one but decided against it because of the noise and the cold air that it would blow into my basement shop, although the dehumidifying action would have been a bonus.


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## Shotgun (May 19, 2021)

JPMacG said:


> I'd like to know how the hybrid works out for you.  I seriously considered one but decided against it because of the noise and the cold air that it would blow into my basement shop, although the dehumidifying would have been a bonus.


It can be noisy, but I made a muffler out of the box that it came in.  While I can hear it, it is no worse than an office computer.

You can vent the cold air outside.  If you want to use the  dehumidifying feature, be sure to have some sort of drain handy.

Here is my updated install.  I added more support in the base.  The pipes run around the back to be protected.  And notice the condensation hose just below the control panel.  It runs around the back, against the wall, and then drips into the sink.

The muffler is highly effective.  Two layers of cardboard, with a divider in the middle made from the insides of an old seat pillow.  Air comes in the top of the muffler to one side, and routes around the pillow before entering the unit.  I may make a similar muffler for the outlet at some point, but it's not that loud, and I'd have to account for condensation.  If you duct the cold air outside, you get that part for free.

Come winter, I'm consider ducting attic air from a hole in the garage ceiling.


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## kb58 (May 19, 2021)

Redundant post, nothing to see here.


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## SLK001 (May 19, 2021)

Your improvised "muffler" is probably interfering with the unit's ability to cool itself.  You might want to double check the installation for the required air-flow.


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## thewacokid (May 19, 2021)

In some parts of the US it gets hot enough it can still be a hot water heater, lol!!


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## Shotgun (May 19, 2021)

SLK001 said:


> Your improvised "muffler" is probably interfering with the unit's ability to cool itself.  You might want to double check the installation for the required air-flow.


I did.  All the flow paths are larger than the inlet/outlet area.  Also, mindful of what the manufacturer is recommending:






						rheem water heater ducting at DuckDuckGo
					

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## Dhal22 (May 19, 2021)

Karlito26 said:


> I am happy that you called it a water heater. So many people I talk to its a hot water heater. When I used to work in Home Depot people would ask for hot water heaters all the time. I would politely say we were out of them!
> 
> They are so easy to install if you have the tools. $2000 is a lot of money.
> 
> When I install water heater I put ball valves on the cold and hot lines above unions. This way when they break, just turn off the valves and unscrew the unions. Much easier this way.



Easy to install but obvious diy connections will trigger comments from a quality home inspector when you go to sell your home. 

I'm fortunate to live in a high income area,  very few diy'ers around here.


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## Karlito26 (May 20, 2021)

Shotgun said:


> Dang-it!  Where were you last week!?
> 
> This weekend, I reworked the installation without the pressure of overnight guests.  Moved the pipes around to the back, cleaned up the power feed, etc.  I reused some of the piping, specifically the section with the shutoff valve on the cold water side.  The CPVC feeds into a set of flexible stainless hoses.  One of those hoses also has a shutoff valve.  A smart move would have been to put the second shutoff on the top, and it is ridiculously obvious. . . now that you say it.  :-(.  Well, if I ever need to drain it again, this will get fixed.
> 
> Thank you.


If I am not mistaken I believe water heaters should be drained but I dont know the interval.


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## Flyinfool (May 20, 2021)

I think the interval depends on your water quality. I have city water and drain and rinse mine once a year. I always get some sediment out of it.
My process is to first turn off the inlet and outlet valves where they are connected.
I then open the drain and the over temp valve to drain the tank.
Once it is as empty as it will get I open the hot outlet side valve and the highest hot fixture in the house. so that the water from the pipes will drain back into the tank and splash around to try to dislodge more sediment. 
I then open the cold in side valve and let that splash around until the drain water is clear.
Close the drain valve, and let the tank fill till the air is out of the house plumbing, once last crack of the over temp valve to flush it out and all is good till next year.


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## Shotgun (May 20, 2021)

I have never done that or heard of anyone doing it.  The one I just replaced was over 20yrs old.


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## Flyinfool (May 20, 2021)

Like I said, it all depends on your water quality. It also depends on the quality of the heater design. Some are more prone to sediment buildup than others. There is no one right answer for everyone.


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## thewacokid (May 20, 2021)

Karlito26 said:


> If I am not mistaken I believe water heaters should be drained but I dont know the interval.


Depends a lot on how hard your water is but rule of them is every 2 to three years and if it is really high hardness with no water softener than annually is a good plan, but if you have a water softener it helps prevent it for longer than a couple years.


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## JPMacG (May 21, 2021)

Old plumber once told me that if I religiously drain my water heater every year and get all the mineral sediment out, my electric water heater will last 10 to 15 years.  But if I am totally lazy and negligent and just ignore the water heater it will last.... 10 to 15 years.   My own experience and observations support his claim.


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## Flyinfool (May 21, 2021)

With an electric the heating elements are not in the bottom, so sediment won't hurt much, with gas the heat comes from a flame under the tank, a layer of sediment insulates the water from the heat source, I am not sure how a heat pump water heater works.


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## Shotgun (May 21, 2021)

Flyinfool said:


> With an electric the heating elements are not in the bottom, so sediment won't hurt much, with gas the heat comes from a flame under the tank, a layer of sediment insulates the water from the heat source, I am not sure how a heat pump water heater works.


It has coils extending down into the water from the top.
The brochure also says that it is designed to circulate the water in such a way that sediment doesn't build up.  Don't know how much I believe it, but it is in the brochure.


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## Flyinfool (May 21, 2021)

My gas heater says that the water circulation is designed to prevent sediment, but I DO get some out every year when I drain it.


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