# Pm 727 - Bearing Squeal?



## lpeedin (Jan 14, 2016)

The last couple of times that I have used my mill, I have been hearing an intermittent squealing sound that varies with spindle speed.  After the bearings going out on my PM1127VF-LB lathe motor in less than a year, I am suspect of a similar situation with a bearing inside the head.  I am 99.9% sure it isn't the motor bearings as the squeal changes with respect to spindle speed, and the motor runs at a constant speed.  I also don't think it is coming from the spindle.  I believe it is going to be the bearing for one of the geared shafts inside the head.  Does anybody know what size bearings those are so I can go ahead and order some now?  I am going to shoot Matt an email, but I thought I would ask here.


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## joshua43214 (Jan 15, 2016)

If the noise changes with all spindle speeds, it is probably the spindle bearings.
If the noise only changes with one of the knobs and not the other, then it is probably a gear bearing.

Either way, Matt will have all this info and he can help you figure out what parts are bad.
Is it not under warranty? He is pretty flexible about taking care of warranties. He doesn't want it shipped back to him any more than you want to ship it to him, he will work something out with you.


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## lpeedin (Jan 18, 2016)

Joshua, it is a funny thing.  I thought it was speed based, but I have noticed that it does it more so when the machine is cold but not so much once things warm up.  I talked to Matt and he is not inclined that it is any of the bearings inside of the oil filled head, simply due to the fact that they are running in oil. They shouldn't squeal at all.  He did send me the new 727 Manual he worked up which shows the parts breakdown and he suggested pulling and repacking the tapered spindle bearings.  I am probably going to do that in the next couple of weeks.  It seems pretty straightforward.  

I figure that I will start with the bearings in the motor itself, especially since I just did the motor bearings in my lathe and it took all of 15 minutes to do.  (it did take me longer the first time when I pulled the motor apart to see what bearings were in there)  The Grizzly site has a parts list showing the motor bearings so I just ordered a couple from ebay.  That would be a good project for next weekend.  I will let you guys know what I find out.


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## JR49 (Jan 18, 2016)

Not sure I understand.  Why would you buy the bearings when your mill is not even 6 months old ?  JR49


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## tomh (Jan 18, 2016)

how long have you had the mill.
I was under the impression that mat at PM  had a 3 year warranty on his machines is that not correct? Am I wrong.


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## lpeedin (Jan 18, 2016)

Matt has been very helpful thus far.  The problem is, I can't nail down where the noise is coming from.  I can't ask him to fix something that I cannot determine the cause / issue.  For the $11 for Nachi brand bearings, I am not concerned.  I realize that there are some that will stand on that principle of pushing the issue with the 3 year warranty.  I don't think this is at that point yet.  

What I can tell you is that I messed up one of my tapered gibs 100% out of ignorance and Matt had (2) replacements direct shipped to me from the factory in China at no charge.  I don't think it will be an issue when I am able to determine what the actual issue is.  

And for the record, I got my mill back at the end of July.  I replaced the motor bearings on my lathe after a year.  It cost me $8 and a little bit of time.  It wouldn't be worth my time to try to get reimbursed for that.


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## tomh (Jan 18, 2016)

ok
You cleared any clouds with me.   I recommended a friend to mat on the warranty and I needed to make sure I hadn't messed up with my friend.  And that's what I need to know.
thanks


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## Doubleeboy (Jan 18, 2016)

Best tool for chasing down nasty sounds in all kind of machinery is a stethoscope, even a cheap one will do the job.  Harbor Freight has them cheap, they are junk as is most of their stuff but it works for the intended job.  If the noise is only worse when cold I would bet on motor bearings.   I have seen it happen more than once.

cheers
michael


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## JR49 (Jan 18, 2016)

I totally understand, 3dshooter, I remember that you posted about the situation with the gib, and yes, Matt did indeed do right by you! Nuff Said.  JR49


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## lpeedin (Jan 19, 2016)

Even when I got my lathe, I emailed Matt asking to purchase additional keyed bushings for the change gears and he put 5 of them in the mail to me at no cost after I specifically asked him for a price so I could pay him.  His response was something along the lines of "no big deal, everybody needs a few extras and I keep those in stock anyways".  He is top notch.  I hope I didn't give anyone the wrong impression of this situation.  

FYI, I do plan to film the motor bearing swap.  I'm sure that is no big deal to some guys, but I hope it to be informative to others.


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## lpeedin (Jan 26, 2016)

Happy to report I swapped the motor bearings and the 727 is purring like a kitten again. Once I got the motor off, I could hear a chirping sound when I rotated the motor shaft. 

I filmed the repair and I will get it up on youtube by this weekend.  In case I hadn't mentioned it, I have recently started a youtube channel under my real name (not sure of that is a mistake or not) of Chad Hensley.  I have three videos up so far.  My most recent one is machining an adapter plate to mount a 3 jaw chuck on my new rotary table.  Check out my videos and let me know what you think!


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## JR49 (Jan 27, 2016)

3dshooter80 said:


> I have recently started a youtube channel under my real name


    Just went to youtube and subscribed to your channel, 3d, didn't watch the videos yet as I was just about to get off the computer.  If the great help you gave me, in your first few threads about your 727M is any indication, of your informative videos,  then I'll surely be watching.  Happy Machining,  JR49


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## Steve Shannon (Jan 27, 2016)

I also watched two of your three videos early this morning and subscribed. I think you show real potential; your focus was very clear, your delivery seemed well done. I couldn't see much detail in your work; an additional camera might help with that, but that is not meant as criticism. I've never made a YouTube video that I would be proud enough to share. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## lpeedin (Jan 27, 2016)

Steve, 
 That is exactly the kind of feedback I am looking for.  I am still playing with settings, field of view especially, on the GoPro that I am using.  I am also looking into alternative mounting setups so that I can get closer to the cutting action when need be.   I am trying to find that balance between showing the steps of a project, but not wasting airtime with repetitious operations or handle turning.  I think the best thing I can do is show set-ups, operations, and processes.  I know when I watch a video of someone else, I get bored watching the actual machining sometimes.  As we all know, making the cut is the easy / quick part much of the time.  The magic is in the setup / details.  

I am brand new to this and have lots to learn.  I am using Windows Movie Maker as it is free and does all that I need it to do.  At some point, I would love to add a cool intro! 

Thanks for watching, subscribing, and your feedback.  It means a lot.  I want to help others the same as I have been helped.


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## joshua43214 (Jan 28, 2016)

Enjoyed the video.
Not sure what it causing it, but the playback flickers at times. I know others use GoPro's so it is probably your video editing software.
Rendering video can be very sensitive to a bunch of things, the biggest is read/write speed from your hard drive. Running other applications that do a lot of read/write such as listening to music, watching movies, or running software like CAD programs that use a lot of virtual memory can interrupt the render. Many YouTubers use a dedicated SSD (internal drive because usb is slow) for video recording and rendering.

Pro-tip. The old bearing is the perfect size for pressing in the new bearing. Hit the inside with a rotary file to make it a tad bigger. 6 point sockets can damage the bearing or seal pretty easily since they tend to slide off center. 12 point sockets are better for this application. Those bearings went on easy, so not an issue here.


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## stupoty (Jan 28, 2016)

joshua43214 said:


> Enjoyed the video.
> Not sure what it causing it, but the playback flickers at times. I know others use GoPro's so it is probably your video editing software.
> Rendering video can be very sensitive to a bunch of things, the biggest is read/write speed from your hard drive. Running other applications that do a lot of read/write such as listening to music, watching movies, or running software like CAD programs that use a lot of virtual memory can interrupt the render. Many YouTubers use a dedicated SSD (internal drive because usb is slow) for video recording and rendering.
> 
> Pro-tip. The old bearing is the perfect size for pressing in the new bearing. Hit the inside with a rotary file to make it a tad bigger. 6 point sockets can damage the bearing or seal pretty easily since they tend to slide off center. 12 point sockets are better for this application. Those bearings went on easy, so not an issue here.




video thing looks a bit like interlaced video thats been converted to progressive with the field order set the wrong way round.

Stuart


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## lpeedin (Jan 28, 2016)

As to the flickering, I don't know much at all really about video editing other than I am using Windows Movie Maker that came on my laptop.  It does "process" the video clips when they are added to the project before you can do any editing which takes a while.  Then once it is all edited, it then saves the video, which takes a long time as well.   I was using my laptop for cruising around the net while it was saving and.  I did have the browser quit responding twice while the video was saving.  Maybe that is what is causing the flickering?  I know it doesn't flicker when I am editing the clips so it surprised me as well when I watched the video on YouTube.   Do you guys have any recommendations for other relatively low-cost editing software?  And it looks like I need to leave things alone while the video is processing / saving.  

Good tip about using the old bearings.  The sockets were a good fit, though.  There wasn't enough axial play between the socket and the shaft to let the socket wander around much at all.  I did make sure to use a small brass hammer to avoid pounding on the bearings with anything too heavy.


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## lpeedin (Jan 28, 2016)

I switched from MovieMaker to VideoPad by NCH Software. We've used their audio editing software for years at the office. Their free version will let you do editing, but will only allow you to export to video a couple of times. I believe the Pro edition was $70. When I'm working on videos I don't do anything else on the computer especially during the final stage of exporting the final video. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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