# RF-30 Clone Head Alignment Guide



## Gravydog (May 17, 2020)

Here is my latest mod to my Grizzly G1006 / RF-30 clone mill. Like everyone, I was annoyed by having to plan ahead so much in setting the head height so I could complete all the operations I had planned within the available travel of the quill. I searched online and YT many times for ideas and none of them really grabbed me until I saw the one that I based my design on. I was struck immediately that it was the one I wanted to use! As you'll see in the photos, it is a wishbone-type arrangement with the pivot about 16" away from the column and that really minimizes any errors due to play compared to a guide that is close to the column that even has its errors multiplied if it is closer to the column than the quill is.

After seeing the concept, I engineered it my usual way: seat of the pants and totally in my head. I admit there were changes and errors fixed as I went along and it began to take shape but I am quite happy with the end result and I don't particularly wish I had done anything differently.

I began with the idea of the clamp to go around the bottom of the column. I got to use my lathe and my mill, yay! I ordered a disk of aluminum on eBay from a guy who offers many diameters and thicknesses for quite reasonable prices. I bought one 6" diameter, 1" thick (came 1.050" so I could face it off no problem). I faced both sides and made it exactly 1" thick, though that wasn't important.




Next I scribed 2 lines across the center perpendicular to each other. Then I added two more lines each 10 degrees offset from one line towards what would be the back. This was because as I mocked things up that looked about right to keep the balls in the Heim joints basically in the center of their sockets.  A word of warning: don't be like me and cheap out on the Heim joints. I bought economy ones on eBay that didn't have Teflon inserts in them, just the ball and the steel shell. I asked the seller before I ordered about whether his joints had any discernable play in them. He didn't really say, and they did. I cobbled together some parts to squeeze the shell of the joints using my press into closer contact with the ball and was able to actually put some preload on the balls, so zero play now. I ordered some right-hand and some left-hand threaded joints as at that point I was envisioning adjustable tie rods in some way but in the end that wouldn't have worked so all RH would have been fine.

Next the disk went back in the lathe to have a center hole bored out. I chose to start with a 3.5" hole saw so I wouldn't have to spend a long time boring but once the teeth were out of view I had to back it out over and over and over to clear the packed aluminum from the teeth! Finally made it through and then it was simple to bore it to the diameter of my column. I see machines later than mine have a 4.5" column? Mine measured 4.016", probably 100mm.




Now the ring went into the milling vise with the future cut line (without the 10 degree offsets) as nearly horizontal as I could manage. I located one edge and one side of the ring and then used an end-cutting .750" end mill to make the recesses for the 1/2-20 socket head bolts I would use, centered over the future cut surfaces. I could pretty much only go deep enough to get a full-round spot for the same reason I am making this, the head was too high after allowing for the drill chuck and bits I would use for the bolt holes. I drilled all the way through with a tap drill and then to the cut line with a clearance bit.




I would have liked to then saw off the top half with a cutter so that I could keep things square but I didn't have one (I do, but no arbor as yet). I took the ring to the band saw and cut it in half. I mounted each half in the vise and faced off the rough ends. Then I put the half that needed to be threaded back in the vise, again as level as I could and then tapped the holes with a spiral machine tap under power, no danger because they were through holes. My mill with its stock 4 pulleys can go down to 85 RPM. I had to back the tap out manually, that's why I'm going to add a reversing switch. It will be easy and will be my next mod and post.

Next I put one half in the vise with a 10 degree mark vertical and did a spot face, then drilled and tapped for the bolts for the Heim joints.




Lastly, I put the left half in the vise and milled a slot for the height adjusting rack to go through, aligned with the 90 degree line I scribed. Here is the finished ring.







Now it was time to think about the next stage. For the tie rods I used 1/2" black pipe and turned threaded inserts to weld into them. I made the pipes about 14" long because it looked right and I didn't want to move my mill any farther from the wall. The pipes form a 20 degree V to go along with the two 10 degree offsets for the joint attaching bolts. I welded them to a stout piece of angle iron using my TIG welder which I am still terrible at but improving slightly.

As I scratched my head over how to attach the upper tie rods to the head, here is a place where my design diverged from the sketches I saw online. I had already added the 1" thick ring to lose vertical travel and if I attached the upper ties rods to the underside of the head I stood to lose more travel (plus how was I going to attach them, anyway?) I got the idea at this point to make the upper arm assembly wider so as to straddle the lower assembly as seen here:









By adding mounting brackets to the sides of the head I can lower it until the rods are all in the same plane. I twisted the brackets to the same 10 degree angle and tried my best to position the brackets so that the bolts are centered with each other. I enlarged the mounting holes a little on the left bracket to allow moving it up or down a little to hopefully eliminate any left or right angular motion at the end of the rods as they pivot up and down. Here it is fully installed:








Next, I had to try to align everything as good as I could. I had to think a while about how to square up the lower collar and what I ended up doing was to use a framing square (a woodworking tool, I'm sorry!) to go from the shell of the Heim joint down and over to the edge of the table on both sides and shift the collar around the column until the measurements matched. I put a piece of very true .750" round stock in a collet and placed a dial indicator against it and then cranked the head up and down. I was getting some drift so I moved the left upper bracket up or down a little until it seemed to be eliminated. After putting the preload on all the joints, the indicator wiggles a little when you are cranking but there is no actual play and it always returns to zero. That is, after I discovered that the indicator would shift 5 to 8 thousandths when I would tighten the head clamping nuts. I experimented by tightening each nut individually and then turning the crank down a little, then I would carefully loosen the nut just until the head dropped. I put an arrow straight up on each nut right at that point and I actually find that the difference between the head being free to move and the nuts being tight to clamp the column is only about a quarter turn! This will help me by not having to needlessly turn the nuts until they are free of all tension as I was before, and by having them close to clamping down, there is now no movement of the indicator when I tighten or loosen them.





I had some nagging doubts about how well this was going to work but I am very pleasantly surprised. When moving the head up or down almost 5 inches (the length of my measuring round stock) there is virtually no change at all! I pronounce it a success that I will really enjoy. I hope it helps someone else with their design sometime.

Rob


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## DavidR8 (May 18, 2020)

That is a fantastic idea and very well executed!
Thanks for a great write-up and photos.


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## C-Bag (May 18, 2020)

I have seen every kind of setup I thought until now. The first thing I though is it looks exactly like the Oleo strut on an aircraft! Then I thought well on mine it will be too close to the wall, but then saw the motor hanging over the strut and it fits perfect. Great job, thanks for posting. That is added to my future mod's along with your other mod's.


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## mikey (May 18, 2020)

Great job and very nice write-up! It's also great that you can still rotate the head if you had to.

So far, this is the only mod of this type that I've seen with such low radial run out. Most have at least a thou or more, especially when tightening the nuts to lock down the head. 

Thanks for sharing!


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## Garryloy (May 18, 2020)

Excellent!  Great job!  This is the same principle I have developed using three 7" wide hinges and two 1/2" aluminum plates.  It was inspired by a study of the sarrus linkage.   My version fabrication is about 80% complete at this time since I was sidetracked with surgery.  The design allows the head to move down on the column within 3/4" of the original limit, and does not interfere with the ability to rotate the head when needed.  I'll post a screenshot of the 3D design tomorrow.


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## Garryloy (May 19, 2020)




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## DavidR8 (May 19, 2020)

Great design!
What are you thinking about for hinges?


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## C-Bag (May 19, 2020)

My problem with the design is piano hinges are notoriously sloppy and solid plates all the way down occlude the motor cooling fan.


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## Ben Nevis (May 19, 2020)

You could drill holes in the plates to allow air flow.


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## Garryloy (May 19, 2020)

Good observation. I planned to add holes for cooling air in case I ever dropped the head all the way down.  

I bought a 24" length of a 2" wide, .090" thick, 1/4" pin continuous hinge from McMaster Carr.  Cut it into the three sections I needed.  Drove out the pins, used a Bosch  carbide tooth oscillating blade to cut 1/16" out of the knuckle tab so I could crimp it tighter around the pin (before pin insertion to allow for springback).  I also added a very strong compression spring to bias the lateral play out of the hinge (see model).  I have them all finished, drilled and countersunk ready to install.  They are so stiff you can barely open them by hand.  I believe the hinge idea would not work without these modifications.  If I had it to do over I would seriously consider a fabricated pivot  joint, but it could not be as compact.  So far my fabrication is 100% per the 3D model shown.  I really like the rod ends design.  But, I found the cheaper ones to have some play.  I know you can get them with a permanent lube liner that will preload them.

Another design consideration was anchoring the top hinge to the head without interfering with the casting movement during clamping and unclamping from the column.  The angle iron brackets are attached only to the front area of the head.

Not part of this thread, but you can see my next project.  Hand operated toggle clamps on the side with the crank to lock and unlock the head without tools.  I will prototype this before full project commitment since it is unproven.  From an engineering point of view it looks good on paper.


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## C-Bag (May 19, 2020)

After looking at the Heim joints it dawns on me the only reason they are needed is because of the angles the struts are at. Kinda melding the two designs I'm thinking homemade bushings made slip fit with a 1/2" rod as the main pivot instead of piano hinge. The struts for the mast base are a different width than the struts for the mill head so they offset from each other and be able to attach to the single rod with no angles involved so no need for the Heim joints.

I also though about cam locks for the head clamps. I know for a fact cranking on the head bolts can't help but make it drift from home so adjusting the cam locks to be able to pull straight down would do the trick. With the linkage I don't think the head bolts would need to be as tight as without.


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## yendor (May 20, 2020)

I think the OP's note about the difference between the head being able to move Up and Down Vs being locked was only 1/4 turn on the locking bolts is a REALLY BIG Piece of News for all of us RF-XX Owners even if we don't build his setup.

I was trying to use a Torque Wrench to keep them even, but I still found it to move more than I liked.
I am going to try and find that sweet spot for the 1/4 Turn and Mark my Nuts too, and see if that eliminates more of the movement when tightening the head to lock it.


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## Gravydog (May 20, 2020)

yendor said:


> I think the OP's note about the difference between the head being able to move Up and Down Vs being locked was only 1/4 turn on the locking bolts is a REALLY BIG Piece of News for all of us RF-XX Owners even if we don't build his setup.
> 
> I was trying to use a Torque Wrench to keep them even, but I still found it to move more than I liked.
> I am going to try and find that sweet spot for the 1/4 Turn and Mark my Nuts too, and see if that eliminates more of the movement when tightening the head to lock it.



Yes, I was happy to discover that fact. In my case, the nuts are 5/8-11 so a quarter turn equals about .023" of clamping movement. Now with my longer, staggered-length nuts and only having to put the wrench on each one once it is much more convenient.

Rob


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## Canuck75 (Jun 28, 2020)

Gravydog said:


> Here is my latest mod to my Grizzly G1006 / RF-30 clone mill. Like everyone, I was annoyed by having to plan ahead so much in setting the head height so I could complete all the operations I had planned within the available travel of the quill. I searched online and YT many times for ideas and none of them really grabbed me until I saw the one that I based my design on. I was struck immediately that it was the one I wanted to use! As you'll see in the photos, it is a wishbone-type arrangement with the pivot about 16" away from the column and that really minimizes any errors due to play compared to a guide that is close to the column that even has its errors multiplied if it is closer to the column than the quill is.
> 
> After seeing the concept, I engineered it my usual way: seat of the pants and totally in my head. I admit there were changes and errors fixed as I went along and it began to take shape but I am quite happy with the end result and I don't particularly wish I had done anything differently.
> 
> ...


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## Canuck75 (Jun 28, 2020)

Gravydog,-

Very nice mod.
The head casting on your machine is a bit different the mine (King PDM30, Taiwan built in 2000) at the back.
I see two main clamping bolts and a third at the bottom on yours, *what does the third one do?*
Have attached a picture of the King casting.
Used the rack as a guide on mine (see "Keeping the X on a Round Column Mill") and also found that I have to clamp the top bolt first to get the head to position the same each time and that 1/4 turn is indeed all that is necessary.
Thanks

Canuck75


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## Buffalo21 (Jun 28, 2020)

Interesting design


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## C-Bag (Jun 28, 2020)

Canuck75 said:


> Gravydog,-
> 
> Very nice mod.
> The head casting on your machine is a bit different the mine (King PDM30, Taiwan built in 2000) at the back.
> ...


i think what you see as the third clamp was actually the clamp that was used to clamp a rod that was attached to the original motor mount to adjust the motor belt. Gravydog got rid of the original motor mount when he went to a quick release he came up with in another post.


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## Gravydog (Jun 29, 2020)

Canuck75 said:


> Gravydog,-
> 
> Very nice mod.
> The head casting on your machine is a bit different the mine (King PDM30, Taiwan built in 2000) at the back.
> ...



The third bolt is just for a hand lever nut to quickly clamp the head for drilling, perhaps. It is the same size bolt as the other two and was originally in the center position but I moved it to the lower hole to facilitate my idea of making progressively longer nuts for the other two bolts above it. I haven't actually used it since.

Rob


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## Canuck75 (Jun 29, 2020)

Thanks Gravydog.
Like your quick belt release for the motor too.
Haven't tested mine for repeating accuracy since doing the mod but must do it gain to what effect seven years of use has had.

Cheers


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## Gravydog (Jun 29, 2020)

Canuck75 said:


> Thanks Gravydog.
> Like your quick belt release for the motor too.
> Haven't tested mine for repeating accuracy since doing the mod but must do it gain to what effect seven years of use has had.
> 
> Cheers



I love my belt tensioning mod! It turned changing belt positions from a real pain to just a nuisance. Especially good for me because my machine has 3 belts instead of just two.

Rob


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## Canuck75 (Jul 1, 2020)

Rob,-

Now you have me going again, mine has two belts. Does three mean you have a power quill down drive?


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## Gravydog (Jul 1, 2020)

No, I just have two intermediate pulleys. Here are photos that show the pulleys and the spindle speeds I have available.

Rob


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## DavidR8 (Jul 1, 2020)

Interesting, do the two idler pulleys mount on the same mount?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Gravydog (Jul 1, 2020)

No, they are on separate, stacked brackets that pivot around the column. They have to be able to move independently in order to change the position of the belt they share.

Rob


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## Canuck75 (Jul 1, 2020)

Rob,-

Seem there are lots of variations on this style of bench mill. Thanks for the pictures.
Here is my setup and the speed chart. The 3000 top end is useful for small drills and end mills.
Got tired of flipping the top cover up so removed it and put a shorty safety guard at the front.
By the way, you mentioned column size in your writeup, checked mine and it is a little over 4.5".

Canuck75


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## pontiac428 (Jul 1, 2020)

Mine is identical to @Canuck75's. Three pulley system and a column approaching 120mm. Guess we get 12 speeds with either system.


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## pontiac428 (Jul 1, 2020)

Double vision


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## C-Bag (Jul 2, 2020)

Canuck75 said:


> Rob,-
> 
> Seem there are lots of variations on this style of bench mill. Thanks for the pictures.
> Here is my setup and the speed chart. The 3000 top end is useful for small drills and end mills.
> ...


I’ve got the same on my Enco RF 30. If you guys haven’t seen it, check out Gravydog’s mod for quick belt adjust.   very slick. I’m probably going to do the min and just put some double nuts or nylock nuts on that pesky column adjusters. Why I didn’t think of that before dunno. I do have to say if I had two of them silly idlers like GD, it would have been more on my mind! One idler is bad enough.


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## Ben Nevis (Jul 5, 2020)

I have an Enco rf30 also. I hated changing the speed so much that I replaced the motor with a VFD and 3 phase motor. I changed the old belts with link belts. Now a speed change involves turning a knob, no fooling with belt guards,  etc.


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## pontiac428 (Jul 5, 2020)

I've posted this several times.  It has fixed all head bolt related issues for me.  It's about $23 to buy.  The spherical nuts move to ensure tension is even.  The double nuts are big, and fit the casting in the head.  It fixes slipping, crooked clamping, sagging, and nagging spouses.  The bill of materials is below. 




pontiac428@hotmail.com has sent you this requisition for McMaster-Carr products from 7/5/2020.



RF-31 HEAD BOLT FIX


Ships Monday morning


1Black-Oxide Steel Setup Stud
5/8"-11 Thread Size, 8" Long, 1-3/4" Long Threads
90281A8222​$3.44​$6.88​2Black-Oxide Steel Leveling Flange Nut
5/8"-11 Thread Size
91045A0352​$5.58​$11.16​3Extreme-Strength Steel Extra-Wide Hex Nut
Grade 2H, Black-Oxide, 5/8"-11 Thread Size
91026A0351​$4.74​$4.74​Merchandise Total​$22.78​
*Phone *(562) 692-5911* Fax *(562) 695-2323* Internet *www.mcmaster.com* Email *la.sales@mcmaster.com​


If the above link and button do not work, paste this web address into your browser to edit and place this order:

https://www.mcmaster.com/order/rcvRtedOrd.aspx?ordid=6011065541874&lnktyp=txt


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## hman (Aug 4, 2020)

Thanks, Pontiac!  Just ordered a set.


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## pontiac428 (Aug 4, 2020)

Let me know how you like the upgrade.  It made my mill nicer to use.


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## DavidR8 (Oct 19, 2020)

@Gravydog I'm planning to do your alignment upgrade. You mentioned that the joints you ordered had a lot of play. I'm looking at these Heim joints. Curious if you think they are up to the task.
Thanks!








						Male Rod End 1/2'' POSB8 Right Hand Ball Bearings
					

Buy Online, Male Rod End 1/2' POSB8 Right Hand Ball Bearings, from the Canadian Bearing Supplier in Toronto, Canada, Concord, BearingsCanada.com



					www.bearingscanada.com


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## Gravydog (Oct 19, 2020)

I don't know but in the photo they look like better quality with the bronze insert than the ones I bought. I'm often sorry when I put price above all else. They will never see a heavy load or wear from lots of movement, so if there is no discernible play in them they should work great. Good luck with the upgrade.

Rob


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## DavidR8 (Oct 19, 2020)

Gravydog said:


> I don't know but in the photo they look like better quality with the bronze insert than the ones I bought. I'm often sorry when I put price above all else. They will never see a heavy load or wear from lots of movement, so if there is no discernible play in them they should work great. Good luck with the upgrade.
> 
> Rob



Thanks Rob. I think I’ll go ahead and order them. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Shotgun (Jun 29, 2021)

Garryloy said:


> Good observation. I planned to add holes for cooling air in case I ever dropped the head all the way down.
> 
> I bought a 24" length of a 2" wide, .090" thick, 1/4" pin continuous hinge from McMaster Carr.  Cut it into the three sections I needed.  Drove out the pins, used a Bosch  carbide tooth oscillating blade to cut 1/16" out of the knuckle tab so I could crimp it tighter around the pin (before pin insertion to allow for springback).  I also added a very strong compression spring to bias the lateral play out of the hinge (see model).  I have them all finished, drilled and countersunk ready to install.  They are so stiff you can barely open them by hand.  I believe the hinge idea would not work without these modifications.  If I had it to do over I would seriously consider a fabricated pivot  joint, but it could not be as compact.  So far my fabrication is 100% per the 3D model shown.  I really like the rod ends design.  But, I found the cheaper ones to have some play.  I know you can get them with a permanent lube liner that will preload them.
> 
> ...


@Garryloy , did you ever finish this head guide?  This looks like it would be the easiest and most accurate installation I've seen, and I'd like to give it a go.

-Did it work well?
-How did you guarantee and then verify alignment? (It seems that if you get the angles of the hinges off even slightly, it would spin the head as it came down.)

I like what you suggested for removing axial play in the hinges.  I would add substituting a bolt for the hinge pin.  Tighten the bolt to push the fingers together to remove any lateral play.  I'd also use some 4" wide stock I have.  It won't interfere with airflow that way.  And, because all the forces, what there is of them, will be in shear across the flat, that should be plenty wide.

I'd also flip the bottom hinge and screw it to the column base.  Screws would have to come out to rotate the head, but that would be such a rare event anyway.

The final thing I'd like to try is having different lengths for the sections.  If the bottom were just slightly shorter than the top, the leafs would droop down as the head approached the bottom.


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## hman (Jun 29, 2021)

Re-reading the whole thread, I happened to notice something about the 4 pulley speed chart.  It seems to be missing 6 additional possibilities ... 4-7-10, 3-5-9, 3-5-10, 3-6-10, 2-5-10, and 1-6-9.  Are they (close to) redundant with some other combinations?


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## Garryloy (Jun 29, 2021)

Shotgun,
Thanks for your comments.  I have not finished and installed the hinge guide.  I have a great excuse but I will spare you the gory details.  I expect to finish it within the next two months.  I am excited about it since I have done a lot of engineering analysis and design work on it (I am a retired mechanical engineer), and 90% of the parts are finished.

You are correct about the alignment.  I am counting on precision machine work, and I won't know how good it works until I test it.  Theoretically it is perfect. (Ha!)

My hinges are ready to install and they are too tight to operate by hand.  This is good.  

I wanted it to work with the head rotated, so the column clamp mount is necessary.   The clamp is 1/2" thick plate.

My hinge plate sizes were chosen to give the lowest possible head position, which is important to me.  They are 7-1/2" wide, which works out great for buying one 24" hinge.

The only part not finished is the head bracket.  This is a weldment that must be screwed to the front half in order for the head clamping system to work.

Your ideas will probably work fine.  All designs are usually a selection of compromises.  Another way to say there's more than one way to skin a cat.


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## Shotgun (Jun 30, 2021)

Garryloy said:


> My hinge plate sizes were chosen to give the lowest possible head position, which is important to me.  They are 7-1/2" wide, which works out great for buying one 24" hinge.
> 
> The only part not finished is the head bracket.  This is a weldment that must be screwed to the front half in order for the head clamping system to work.


Could you maybe start another thread, so we don't hi-jack this one?  I'd really like to get more details before I start on a version of this, especially the "head clamping system".  I'm in no rush, as I'm knee deep in the Dividing Head Group Project, and I'm behind.

As for the plate dimensions, consider what would happen if reduced how far the bottom plate sticks out the back by the thickness of the plate and moved the head attachment point back by the same amount.  As the head moves down, and the guide folds, the middle hinge will be forced to move down as well as back.  It will move away from the motor, and not stick out as far.


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## C-Bag (Jun 30, 2021)

I wonder if Gravydog would mind if the different mods to his original design were continued on here? 

Its getting harder and harder to find specific threads because of the sheer mass of info on this site.


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## prphntm63 (Feb 7, 2022)

Sorry to revive a dead thread, but how well does this support keep the tram when cranking the column up and down?


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## DavidR8 (Feb 7, 2022)

prphntm63 said:


> Sorry to revive a dead thread, but how well does this support keep the tram when cranking the column up and down?


By tram do you mean nod or tilt?
Or do you mean hold position relative to the work?


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## prphntm63 (Feb 7, 2022)

If you install this alignment guide, if you were tram the head to the table at a "lower" Z then crank the head up, is your spindle still true to the table? Or does it need to be trammed again?


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## C-Bag (Feb 7, 2022)

The "alignment" is to maintain where the head is on the round column or what they call register. It has nothing to do with nod or tram.


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## DavidR8 (Feb 7, 2022)

prphntm63 said:


> If you install this alignment guide, if you were tram the head to the table at a "lower" Z then crank the head up, is your spindle still true to the table? Or does it need to be trammed again?


I have not noticed any difference in tram after raising and lowering the head. But I also would not expect to see any difference as the alignmnet guide simply prevents the head from turning as it is raised or lowered.


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## Shotgun (Feb 7, 2022)

If moving the head up or down screws up your tram, you have a bent column.

But, I don't think that is what you want to know.  Maybe your question is, "Does this modification keep the quill aligned with the hole I just bored?"  Just to help you out:

Heh, guys.  When moving the head up or down, how well will this modification keep the quill aligned with the hole I just bored?


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## C-Bag (Feb 7, 2022)

Shotgun said:


> If moving the head up or down screws up your tram, you have a bent column.


not necessarily. The column base might not be parallel to the table and you can shim the base to get nod and tram within tolerance.


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## Larry42 (Feb 7, 2022)

pontiac428 said:


> It fixes slipping, crooked clamping, sagging, and nagging spouses.


That last item fixed is well worth the price of admission!


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## prphntm63 (Feb 7, 2022)

C-Bag said:


> not necessarily. The column base might not be parallel to the table and you can shim the base to get nod and tram within tolerance.


Thank you, this was specifically what I was wondering. Maybe I should rephrase my question:

After installing this (or other similar) column reference position lock on their head, has anyone had any issues with nod or tilt* being off after adjusting head height by unclamping/cranking/re-clamping the head?

Shimming the base to dial in tram is a pain in the ass and I notice my tram measurement sometimes drifts a few thou after adjusting moving the head along the column. I think this may be due to slight rotation about the column while raising/lowering. If I can find a consistent way to be able to move the head vertically while maintaining my spindle tram, I'd be over the moon. X and Y position lock is a huge plus, but I have an edgefinder and know how to use it so it's not as big of a deal.


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## C-Bag (Feb 7, 2022)

prphntm63 said:


> Thank you, this was specifically what I was wondering. Maybe I should rephrase my question:
> 
> After installing this (or other similar) column reference position lock on their head, has anyone had any issues with nod or tilt* being off after adjusting head height by unclamping/cranking/re-clamping the head?
> 
> Shimming the base to dial in tram is a pain in the ass and I notice my tram measurement sometimes drifts a few thou after adjusting moving the head along the column. I think this may be due to slight rotation about the column while raising/lowering. If I can find a consistent way to be able to move the head vertically while maintaining my spindle tram, I'd be over the moon. X and Y position lock is a huge plus, but I have an edgefinder and know how to use it so it's not as big of a deal.


Notice I said in tolerance. I have learned about myself I make more mistakes in my setup and procedures than my cheap CNC vise or my tired old RF30. I have learned to deal with not getting too riled up about perfection as it doesn’t exist on this plane. If I get within a thou or two it’s time for celebration. If not it was a lesson learned. I KNOW the silly guy who owned the RF30 before went down that rabbit hole of tramming that column and it’s not perfect. But it seems to kick out great work when I don’t have myself all in knots. YMMV.


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## mickri (Feb 7, 2022)

I use a dial indicator combined with a stop to bring the head back to position.  Put the stop and DI against the spindle and zero the DI.  Move the head wherever you need to and then bring it back until the DI reads zero again as the spindle touches the stop. Works for me.


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## Garryloy (Feb 12, 2022)

Finally finished my head alignment design (see posts #5,6,38 in this thread).  Seems to work great, but I have not figured out the best way to test it with my equipment.  I'm thinking about using my 14" B&S height gage from my surface plate, clamped to the mill table, and a dial test indicator mounted on the quill. I don't know how straight (or square to the base) the edge of the gage is, but it stands 15.5" tall.

I'd appreciate any suggestions.   Here are pictures of the finished parts before and after installation.


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## prphntm63 (Feb 12, 2022)

Garryloy said:


> Finally finished my head alignment design (see posts #5,6,38 in this thread).  Seems to work great, but I have not figured out the best way to test it with my equipment.  I'm thinking about using my 14" B&S height gage from my surface plate, clamped to the mill table, and a dial test indicator mounted on the quill. I don't know how straight (or square to the base) the edge of the gage is, but it stands 15.5" tall.
> 
> I'd appreciate any suggestions.   Here are pictures of the finished parts before and after installation.


Maybe put a long-ish piece of ground round stock in a collet, and use your dial indicator (fixed to the table) to measure as you raise and lower the head? The only problem I could see with that is if your ground stock has any flaws.


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## epanzella (Mar 22, 2022)

I used a ground bar and a pillow block for head alignment. Works great.


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## chriskatana (Apr 19, 2022)

> pontiac428@hotmail.com has sent you this requisition for McMaster-Carr products from 7/5/2020.
> 
> 
> RF-31 HEAD BOLT FIX
> ...


Will these parts work on the RF-40 head?


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## minsk (Nov 20, 2022)

epanzella said:


> I used a ground bar and a pillow block for head alignment. Works great.


im thinking of doing  two pillow block on each side...but  bot connected to the mill...so if i go t sell it the stand stays with me.


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## minsk (Nov 20, 2022)

epanzella said:


> I used a ground bar and a pillow block for head alignment. Works great.


what size is this block and and rod? im going to do one on each side


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## Garryloy (Nov 20, 2022)

I'm wondering how good a radial bearing in a pillow block works in a linear application.


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## epanzella (Nov 23, 2022)

minsk said:


> what size is this block and and rod? im going to do one on each side


It presently has a 7/8" rod and I've been using this for about six years with good results. My future project is a worm gear transmission to power lift the head and the present indexer which is mounted to the table is in the way.  I'm making clamps to mount the indexer directly to the column. I also bought a hunk of 1 1/2 inch O1 tool steel for the new worm gear but I had to buy 3 feet and I only needed 4 inches. I'm using the extra to upgrade the 7/8" rod to to 1 1/2". The 7/8 rod is also O1 so I can use that to make other cutters.


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## ARC-170 (Nov 28, 2022)

mickri said:


> I use a dial indicator combined with a stop to bring the head back to position.  Put the stop and DI against the spindle and zero the DI.  Move the head wherever you need to and then bring it back until the DI reads zero again as the spindle touches the stop. Works for me.
> 
> View attachment 395487


While I love all the designs people make to "fix" this problem, I tried this and it works surprisingly well. I just have to watch the dial as the head moves so the movement stays within the limits of the dial.


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## epanzella (Nov 29, 2022)

Garryloy said:


> I'm wondering how good a radial bearing in a pillow block works in a linear application.





ARC-170 said:


> While I love all the designs people make to "fix" this problem, I tried this and it works surprisingly well. I just have to watch the dial as the head moves so the movement stays within the limits of the dial.


Yes the pillow block works great. I did have to "polish in" the shaft for a precise sliding fit to the bearing as it was a bit too tight from the factory. This took about 15 minutes in the lathe while sliding the bearing along the shaft. 
.
Once I had an indexing system that worked I found myself raising and lowering the head so much that dealing with any kind of indicator would drive me crazy.


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