# SB Heavy 10 CL187A     Just getting started



## Dale Barton (Apr 4, 2014)

I recently found my ultimate lathe deal on Craig's List. I've always hoped that some day I'd hear or read the words "My dad was a machinist for 45 years and he had this lathe with all kinds of junk, we really want it to go to someone who will use it".  It was only listed for $1000 and from what I'd learned in recent months I knew this was not a deal to haggle about. I contacted the guy and told him that I'm recently retired from the Army after 30 years as a musician/musical instrument repairman. I'm also a guitar maker. I've got a part of me that always wanted to be a machinist. Anyway

South Bend CL187A  serial no. 4649RKL11      

I'll post a bunch of pictures and will be seeking help as I learn to use it and get it back into shape.  

It came with a ton of stuff. Collet draw lever with full set of 5C collets in original plastic cases. Production style tail stock (The kind with a drill press type lever). 4 jaw chuck, 2 3 jaw chucks, 3 faceplates, Aloris tool post with 5 tool holders. (not sure what it's called) Square style multi tool post. Original tool post with 6+ tool holders, heavy duty knurling tool, steady rest, additional home made steady rest. 3 jacobs chucks, 1 keyless chuck. TONS of cutting bits and blanks (definitely over 100...this guy was a grinding master), 5C indexing rotary thingy. Home made taper attachment. And butt loads of other stuff that I'll need help identifying.  Also a bunch of old catalogs and an old but lovely copy of "How to Run a Lathe"


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## Dale Barton (Apr 4, 2014)

I've seen that you can order a "serial number card" from Grizzly. Is there any information on that card that is worth the $25 price for a single scan?  I guess I'd be interested to see if many of the features of this lathe were ordered originally or retrofitted later on. 

Also forgot to mention the lathe has a micrometer carriage stop and a thread dial indicator.  It's got a 110v motor which is good for me.  But with all of this stuff...no lathe dogs. Not sure why that bugs me but it really does.


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## stevecmo (Apr 4, 2014)

Dale,

Welcome to the group!  Looks like you found a nice old SB.  She'll serve you well.

Since you are a guitar maker, you might want to check out Frank Ford's website if you haven't already.  He's also a very good machinist.

http://www.frets.com/HomeShopTech/hstpages.html

Steve


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## Dale Barton (Apr 4, 2014)

stevecmo said:


> Dale,
> 
> Welcome to the group!  Looks like you found a nice old SB.  She'll serve you well.
> 
> ...



Thanks for the Frank Ford link. That guy is great. I've got a CD ROM he put together a few years ago from all of his Frets.com stuff. 

OK, so now I've found this lathe and need to get it home. I read all kinds of articles and worked myself into a frenzy worrying about doing it right. The place it was located is a little shop built on the side of the house with a very spongy floor. 
No driveway, just a nice grassy hill  going down from a mile long dirt road with the worst pot holes I've EVER seen. Driving down the road I get visions of the lathe tipping over from the bouncing. 

Picked up a ramped Uhaul trailer and drove to Annapolis in the rain. The hill was pretty slick and we didn't think we'd ever get back up with the lathe in the trailer. This is as close as we could get.




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With help from the owner, his son-in-law and my buddy Mike we daisy chained plywood and used an old rope come along to get the lathe up the hill. Those dollys I made were a great Idea. Picked up heavy wheels from Harbor Freight plus a couple of the 1000lb movers dollys. Made the big dolly for the headstock and combined the two movers dollys for the tail. Figured I had at least 3000lbs of support. We did have to do some fun wedging and cribbing to get the lathe up to that level. At that point I used lag bolts and bolted the lathe to the dollys.

Finally got her up the hill and strapped down tight and covered....did I mention it was raining?


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## Dale Barton (Apr 4, 2014)

My phone had died so I didn't get pictures of the truck and trailer at my place. Got help from a couple of guys across the street and wheeled the lathe down the ramp.  I'd previously prepared a path to get back to the shop. Again, those dollies helped a lot. Just had to be careful not to go over the edge because my ramp was a wee bit narrow.  

Got her into the shop and wheeled in place. Time to let my helpers go. I'd figure out how to get her off the dollies and on to the floor later. 

I'm adding some pictures showing the prep of my ramps etc.  Also loaded the truck up with a tool chest and a bunch of containers. We went down the night before to load up all of the accessories and to plan out the strategy for the move.  There was a lot of tooling with this! Feel like a criminal...not quite.


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## WallyM3 (Apr 4, 2014)

Beg, borrow or steal an engine hoist. Lift heavy end 1", remove dolly. Lower heavy end. Lift tail stock end, etc.,....

I've moved Bridgeports alone with an engine hoist.


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## brasssmanget (Apr 4, 2014)

This is pretty exciting. It's nice to see a nice Hvy10 getting set up by a new owner. I went through it myself about two years ago - this brings back memories. )


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## Dale Barton (Apr 4, 2014)

I used a combination of hydraulic jacks, metal pipes, paving stones etc. Got the lathe up and down. I'll do the final leveling and securing to the ground as I clean it up.  

First big question.   Do I completely refinish this or just do the mechanical rebuild. I'd like to start using it and as long as it cleans up OK I'm fine with the old look. But....if I decide I want to make it cherry and new will I really want to go through the whole tear down again? Is it one of those situations that if I don't do it now, I'll probably never do it...and I'll regret it?

Here's the plate with the model number and the serial number. Anyone who has any extra information about this machine I'd appreciate it. 







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Here are some shots of the headstock with the micrometer carriage stop, back gears, cone pully, collet closer and some of the stuff I used to get the lathe off of the dollies and on to the ground. Feel free to berate me. I know I should have used an engine hoist and I was REALLY stupid to do this alone. I'll consider that I have 8 lives left. No more stupid stuff....this is a serious beast (at least it is for me).    Looks like someone did a bit of woodworking...that'll be fun!








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OK, time to share the tooling and accessories. Again, I bought this for $1000...I know how incredibily fortunate I am to have all of this stuff already! 

large 4 jaw chuck. Large and small 3 jaw chucks (large chuck is on lathe).  I need a chuck key for the small chuck.  3 face plates.  Also looks like I've got a couple of extra sets of jaws.


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## Dale Barton (Apr 4, 2014)

Apron and cross feed. Aloris tool post. Thread dial indicator. How common was this type of tailstock?  I've got lots of dead centers but this huge mondo chuck seemed like it was good for the picture.






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Here's a shot of all of the centers and chucks. I like that huge bull nose center. That'll come in handy for bass clarinet and bassoon repairs.  Nice steady rest, die holder heavy boring bar holder.





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Now we move to the tool posts, tool holders and boring bars.  I LOVE the knurling tool from hell!  Heavy and massive!


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## Kroll (Apr 4, 2014)

Congrats on your lucky find,I say you did very well.If it was me I would ask the owner about the lathe and see if he knows of any problems,if he would recommend anything that should be done before you put it to work.Just to do a good cleaning is alot of work in itself so how far do you go is up to you and if you can wait that long.If he says "put it to work"then do so if your happy with the way it looks.
I should say congrats to both you and the seller,fair price and you don't have to wait or look any longer----kroll


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## Dale Barton (Apr 4, 2014)

I want to finish posting the pictures of all of the stuff. Please feel free to comment and give me any advice on what you see!  

As far as I know the C5 collets are one of the more expensive items included with the lathe. I do like that I got the rotating/indexing collet holder. That'll make it easier to clamp stuff in my drill press for holes and such. Eventually I'll get a mill but I'll probably be able to get buy for awhile. 

1/16"-1" in 1/32" increments. Is there supposed to be a 1/32" collet...and does this lathe support anything larger than 1"?




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Kroll said:


> Congrats on your lucky find,I say you did very well.If it was me I would ask the owner about the lathe and see if he knows of any problems,if he would recommend anything that should be done before you put it to work.Just to do a good cleaning is alot of work in itself so how far do you go is up to you and if you can wait that long.If he says "put it to work"then do so if your happy with the way it looks.
> I should say congrats to both you and the seller,fair price and you don't have to wait or look any longer----kroll



Kroll,  The seller is the son of the former owner of this lathe. His dad died about 2 years ago and it sounds like the son knew a bit about the lathe but didn't really work much on it.  I think there was a mill that he sold and it's possible that a few small things from the lathe got included with the sale of the mill. 

Not aware of any issues with the machine. It was used up to the end of this man's life. He made a lot of stuff if the cutting bits are any indication. Saw a few model ships he made and he did good work. So, the machine had consistent use, but not heavy use for a long time. I also think he bought the lathe used in the early 60s.  Although it's gunked up a bit everything slides well and most of the oil cups still had oil in them. Not too much significant rust on anything either.

The seller knew that the price was about half what he could have gotten for the lathe and the tooling. He had a lot of interested buyers but he liked my story.  It also ends up that I worked with a few guys who go to his church. I guess that helps although he didn't know it at the time. He did know that I'd retired from the Army Field Band, so he was aware of that connection.  Like so many other things people are often willing to give things away as long as they know it goes to a good home.


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## Kroll (Apr 4, 2014)

Dang you pick up some goodies with the lathe and it helps when theres a connection,like you said knowing its going to a good home.Check this out when you have time,Woodtickgreg did an awesome job on restoring his which is just like yours.Checking out what he did,you will be able to clearly see what is involved(lot of work)but its part of the fun.http://www.hobby-machinist.com/showthread.php?t=7459
kroll


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## Dale Barton (Apr 4, 2014)

I got a really amazing assortment of cutting bits. It'll be interesting to see how many I can use without any sharpening.  There are also a number of brackets and other assorted things that I can't yet identify.  This will be all of the "before" stuff. Then we'll see how long it takes me to get it running 
real nice.


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## mgalusha (Apr 4, 2014)

Sure looks like a great deal all around. A great machine and lots of tooling without breaking the bank and it's found a great new home.


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## itsme_Bernie (Apr 4, 2014)

Dale,

It's like you bought half of a shop for $1k...  I hope you know how lucky you are!  Enjoy enjoy!!  


Bernie


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## Dale Barton (Apr 5, 2014)

itsme_Bernie said:


> Dale,
> 
> It's like you bought half of a shop for $1k...  I hope you know how lucky you are!  Enjoy enjoy!!
> 
> ...



Bernie,

I really do know how lucky I am.  For many years I've dreamed (literally) of ending up with a deal like this. I dream that I buy a house, then I go out back and there's this old cluttered but well equipped shop included in the deal. I find it really telling that finally at just the right time in my life...the dream comes true.  I know how easy it is to slap down a grand for tools or machines or parts. I was a Harbor Freight today and saw the little POS metal lathe they had that was almost $600. The Sherline setup I got for my shop in the Army was cool, had a mill etc. But it was a complete joke compared to this lathe...and I slapped down about $3000 (Uncle Sam slapped it down). No back gears, no power feed, tiny capabilities. Very cool machine but it's not a South Bend.

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OK, now it's time to get to work!   I've got a bit of literature (I love "How to Run a Lathe!), I ordered the lathe restoration book plus all of the wicks and gaskets from E-bay. Also got the proper oils.


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## WallyM3 (Apr 5, 2014)

What a lovely scoop!

Not all of that is worth fussing with, but it looks like you got beyond the majority's worth of good stuff. You'll find that the tail stock configuration has great advantages in some applications, but that you might miss the old screw driven barrel sometimes. Get one, if you can. Large dials should be on your list to do. You can make these with this lathe, then install them.

I just introduced myself in the appropriate sub-forum tonight, and posted pix of my last remaining shop queen...a Heavy 10 made from 4 different lathe's assemblies, plus parts I made myself.

If excusable, I will repost in your thread:




I wish I had "before" photos, but the nature of the project didn't lend itself to that sort of documentation. However, imagine 8 years and 4 different lathes in various states of decrepitude...plus assorted fill-ins. 

If I can be of any assistance at all, please do not hesitate to rattle my jail cell.


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## Dale Barton (Apr 5, 2014)

It looks like I've exceeded my storage allocation.   Are my file sizes too big?   is my limit just the things stored in the upload section in the "manage attachments" section? Can I delete the things stored? or do they consider all images in my thread "stored"?  It's always a struggle figuring out a new forum

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Wally,  That is a beautiful lathe!   I'm thinking that I'll really need to completely redo mine. It would be a shame if I didn't.


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## WallyM3 (Apr 5, 2014)

Yes. I agree with you.

But it all depends on what you want to do in your shop. Mebbe what I mean by that is, what do you want your shop to do for you?

I started out wanting a lathe because those things make parts, right? It got well beyond that when I started to develop a sincere interest in the machines for themselves.

My cut to the chase is that all HSM shops need 2 lathes. You don't even need a mill, though it makes certain fabrications easier having one. My change gear Logan made parts for my SB 10L (and reciprocally) and there was almost nothing they couldn't do as a tag team. But, try and get my B'port away from me! (LOL)

There was not one machine in my shop, spare one, that ultimately had any two parts connected during my "rebuild" process.

I think I need to stop there because I'm launching into perhaps uninvited tutorial territory, but I have long considered reasons for my attitude towards the whole subject.

I'm willing to share, but loathe to be tedious.


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## Dale Barton (Apr 5, 2014)

Share away....tutor away...mentor away....be tedious. It's all good!!


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## GK1918 (Apr 5, 2014)

WOW!    what a score.   Am I seeing a M-100 Hammond.  I bought a new one in 1963 and traded for a new B3 in 1965.   still got it.....


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## Dale Barton (Apr 5, 2014)

It's a Hammond L-111.  We found it at an antique warehouse on the way back from Ocean City. Strapped it on top of the Volvo and brought it home. It must have belonged to a real working musician. It was on a heavy duty rolling base with chest handles on either side. They also added an extra set of draw bars plus Chorus, Tremelo and Leslie controls. It's wired for a Leslie but we couldn't find the cabinet...now that would have been a great fine. I think we paid $75 for it.  Notice the appropriate Hammond tone wheel oil?


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