# Horizontal band saw and coolant, really? What a mess



## Janderso (Sep 6, 2021)

Ok, so am I protecting the blade? Expediting the cut?
We cut a lot of material without coolant.
It’s just so darn messy. The coolant needs to be replaced several times a year and that’s a joy.
Just wondering what you do.


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## 682bear (Sep 6, 2021)

I've never used coolant on my bandsaws... the blades may not last quite as long, but considering the cost, mess, and hassle dealing with a flood system, it's probably a wash... 

-Bear


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## rabler (Sep 6, 2021)

I use coolant on my G0613.  I keep a chip brush handy to clean up.  Never had a problem with coolant going bad, just have to top it up periodically.  I cut a piece of O-1 tool steel recently, coolant was low (shop dehumidifier does its job), and so the coolant didn’t flow.  First time I had to replace the blade after 3+ years…

My biggest complaint with the saw is that after putting casters under the stand, it sits too high for cutting large heavy stock.  Works fine for detailed/small cuts.


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## MrWhoopee (Sep 6, 2021)

The coolant tank for my Kalamazoo 8CW is out behind the garage.


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## C-Bag (Sep 7, 2021)

I’ve never used coolant in the 40yrs I’ve had my 4x6. And I don’t think I’ve put even 5 blades on it in all those years. At least 2 of the blades were replaced because I got tired of the skips from missing teeth. And those teeth were because I was being stupid and cutting too thin of sheetmetal for the kind of blade I was running. That was also why I have the vertical saw with a fine blade on it so I can cut super thin stuff. In a production shop where the saw is set at a hi ft per min to cut fast it makes sense to run coolant. Luckily I don’t have those kinds of pressures anymore and run my saw on the slowest speed with moderate feed pressure which is plenty fast. No muss no fuss.


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## mksj (Sep 7, 2021)

So a couple of suggestions, the use of coolant is somewhat dependent on the material you are cutting, frequency of use, type of blade and coolant used. When I was in Tucson, I used my badsaw quite a bit for both aluminum and various steel up to 4.5" in diameter, coolant is needed with the bigger diameter's to both keep the blade temperature down and clear the chips. Newer water based coolants lasted a year, and that was with the temperature over 100 for more than 100 days. The KoolRite 2290 has a very long tank life w/o going rancid, you do need to add water to compensate for evaporation. There are other long life water based emulsions, my experience was they worked very well, blades would last several years unless I broke some teeth from bouncing the blade on the work. I added a second coolant port near the motor end to wash the chips down off the blade which decreases the buildup of swarf/chips in the bandsaw, and I added neoprene splash shields in front of both coolant ports. Rarely have any issues with splashed coolant or loading up with chips, other than the drain and the pump sump being full of chips.

These days I use the metal bandsaw much less, so run it dry and just apply some lubricant to the blade when cutting, I have a Bahco variable pitch 10-14 blade as a backup, the Lenox has lasted quite a few years with dry cutting. If I had a lot of metal stock to cut I would use the coolant.


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## Janderso (Sep 7, 2021)

For the small stuff I may just leave it dry.
when everything has dried out, I can use a brush and a vacuum to do a basic clean up.

I use a suggested oil base as I use it for the grinder too.
What a PITA


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## projectnut (Sep 7, 2021)

I'm with those that cut dry.  I've had my Startrite 175 for around 20 years and have never used coolant.  It is coolant capable, but like any saw with coolant it's a mess to clean.  Keep in mind all the swarf from the cuts mixes with the coolant and goes back into the tank.  If the tank is properly built that's where it will stay until you change the coolant.  The swarf gets caked on the bottom and sides of the tank and is a bear to clean off.  If you don't clean the tank regularly it will weigh a ton and you'll have to scoop it out by hand.

I've had to clean a few saws in my time and it's not a fun job.  The dried coolant/swarf is like sand paper against your skin and it takes high pressure hot water with a detergent to get the dried stuff off.

Having said all this I think it's all but mandatory in a commercial shop.  Most shops use their saws between 20 and 40 hours a week.  The blades wouldn't last more than a few weeks without coolant.  At around $100.00 or more for a good quality bimetal blade coolant is a necessity.

Blades for my machine run around $45.00 a copy.  They generally last 3 years or more. Good quality coolant is around $50.00 a gallon.  The blades will probably last twice as long with coolant, but I'll have to clean the tank regularly and deal with the mess and smell in the shop.  For the difference in price I'll continue to dry cut.  I really don't want to spend half a day every few months cleaning the nasty mess off the saw.

The chip pan in my saw is 4"x 4"x 26".  Generally I clean it out with a vacuum on a daily basis.  When I let it go for a week it gets about 1/2 full.  That's a little over 200 cubic inches of swarf a week.  The coolant tank is only a little over 4 gallons. I can't imagine letting swarf wash into the tank for weeks or months even if I did use coolant.  Along with all the other downsides of coolant the tank would probably overflow, and be so heavy it would be impossible to move.


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## Bob Korves (Sep 7, 2021)

There are also thicker, oily to even pasty lubricants that do not fly around like liquids do, some oil base, some water base.  They do not do as good a job of cooling as liquid does, and water cools better than oil does.  I mostly cut dry with my band saw, depending on what is being cut...


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## Stonebriar (Sep 7, 2021)

I have old Enco saw and I don't use coolant. Even when I cut Drill stem for a pipe fence that was 2500 feet.  The blades still last several years. I did use coolant the first time i used the saw and said what a mess. Heck some end mills cost more than a blade.


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## Janderso (Sep 7, 2021)

projectnut said:


> I really don't want to spend half a day every few months cleaning the nasty mess off the saw.


Exactly, it's a ****ty job. The coolant tank that comes with these saws don't have chambers to allow the swarf to settle in one of the baffles.
As you said, the chips just sit in the tank and probably get sucked up with the coolant for another trip around the pan.


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## markba633csi (Sep 7, 2021)

I drip a bit of oil by hand when cutting steel, but that's it.  Aluminum dry. Not too much mess.
-Mark


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## mksj (Sep 7, 2021)

My coolant tank does have a baffle, so most of the swarf collects in the chamber before it gets to the coolant pump. I was pulling out the tank and pump about every 12-18 months. Cutting oil is much nastier then the water based coolant emulsions, the latter cleans up much easier and does not go rancid as fast. Many of the low production badsaws with longer blade run only dry, like the Ellis. The major downside of dry cutting in a smaller bandsaw is the chips tend to load up in the saw and wheels, I need to pull everything apart and clean the inside every couple of months.


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## Eyerelief (Sep 7, 2021)

I normally keep my goofy ideas to myself but I will throw this out there in the event I qualify for poster child of goofy hobbiest.  I cut al and plastics dry  and just use a shop vac to get up the chips.  I use coolant for steel. I put a harbor fright magnetic pan under the main location where the swarf and coolant drop.  The pan fills with coolant, then overflows back into the drain.  The chips get stuck to the magnet.  Not all the chips but I bet around 90%.  To make my life a little easier, I cover the tray with a zip lock bag.  That way, when time to dump, I just hold it over the trash can and pull the pan out of the bag, the chips are on the outside of the bag and fall into the trash.  

Disclaimer:  This advise is only worth what you paid for it.  You have to sleep pretty late to be lazier than me.


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## 682bear (Sep 7, 2021)

Eyerelief said:


> I normally keep my goofy ideas to myself but I will throw this out there in the event I qualify for poster child of goofy hobbiest.  I cut al and plastics dry  and just use a shop vac to get up the chips.  I use coolant for steel. I put a harbor fright magnetic pan under the main location where the swarf and coolant drop.  The pan fills with coolant, then overflows back into the drain.  The chips get stuck to the magnet.  Not all the chips but I bet around 90%.  To make my life a little easier, I cover the tray with a zip lock bag.  That way, when time to dump, I just hold it over the trash can and pull the pan out of the bag, the chips are on the outside of the bag and fall into the trash.
> 
> Disclaimer:  This advise is only worth what you paid for it.  You have to sleep pretty late to be lazier than me.



I'd say that is a very good idea...

-Bear


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## C-Bag (Sep 7, 2021)

My experience with coolant is if you ever run it you are stuck, literally, with it. I don't have to clean swarf out of my saw ever. It just falls into it's pan. There's nothing there to stick to. And I don't run brushes or anything else. 95% of all swarf falls off before it gets to the guide roll. I've never needed to add any lube to the horizontal. YMMV.


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## Suzuki4evr (Sep 7, 2021)

Eyerelief said:


> I normally keep my goofy ideas to myself but I will throw this out there in the event I qualify for poster child of goofy hobbiest.  I cut al and plastics dry  and just use a shop vac to get up the chips.  I use coolant for steel. I put a harbor fright magnetic pan under the main location where the swarf and coolant drop.  The pan fills with coolant, then overflows back into the drain.  The chips get stuck to the magnet.  Not all the chips but I bet around 90%.  To make my life a little easier, I cover the tray with a zip lock bag.  That way, when time to dump, I just hold it over the trash can and pull the pan out of the bag, the chips are on the outside of the bag and fall into the trash.
> 
> Disclaimer:  This advise is only worth what you paid for it.  You have to sleep pretty late to be lazier than me.


Doesn't sound lazy,sort of sounds well thought out and even genius.


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## AGCB97 (Sep 7, 2021)

I run coolant in my Johnson all the time. It comes on with the saw. I made a double baffle system and catch most chips on a paper towel under the blade. I also added a shop air blower to blow off the chips and coolant immediately after the cut. It also comes on with the saw. I used to get chips (not lots) everywhere but now everything stays clean. I've only cleaned the whole system twice since 2016. No problem with coolant spoilage but just add water and sometimes mix as needed. Also put a little used car antifreeze in it in the winter as the shop gets below freezing when it's less than 20 degrees.


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## FOMOGO (Sep 7, 2021)

Steve Summers came up with this coolant system for his HF saw. Seems to be really well thought out, and works well, with minimal fuss. Will most likely be doing something similar on my 7x14, as I have some very large stock I will eventually need to be slicing up. Mike


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## projectnut (Sep 7, 2021)

I didn't use a blade brush for many years.  During that time I was mainly cutting different steel alloys.  More recently I've been cutting a lot of 6061 aluminum.  It likes to stick to the blade so I recently went to a blade brush.  It keeps the blade clean and doesn't allow swarf to get deposited on the wheels.


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## kb58 (Sep 7, 2021)

I don't use coolant at all, other than drops of oil or cutting fluid. I'll pay for whatever extra cutters and blades that are consumed in order to avoid the mess. Having said that, if I owned a shop as a business, I'd probably answer different.

Oh, and as incentive to either not use coolant at all, or as a reminder to keep it clean, is to buy an old lathe with a coolant sump that looked like it hadn't be cleaned out in decades. To say that it was like cleaning out a Porta-Potty wearing nothing but rubber gloves is close, both in appearance and consistency...


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## jwmay (Sep 7, 2021)

At home I don't use it.  At work I use it, and go to "great" lengths to ensure I have fluid. I also don't mind cleaning the one at work as often as I think it needs done. I'm being paid for it...Why not?


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## Dave Smith (Sep 7, 2021)

always just dry cutting on my bandsaws--works great and no sticky mess. Dave


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## Janderso (Sep 7, 2021)

markba633csi said:


> Aluminum dry.


If I cut aluminum dry I get a severe case of chip welding. If I spray a bit of WD-40 it works like a charm.
How do you cut aluminum without anything>
Maybe different blade design makes a difference?


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## Janderso (Sep 7, 2021)

projectnut said:


> I recently went to a blade brush. It keeps the blade clean and doesn't allow swarf to get deposited on the wheels.


I need to add-replace the brush that came with the saw.
Steve Summer felt he needed coolant.
I like the shield Steve added to his saw right after the blade passed through the material.


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## projectnut (Sep 7, 2021)

Janderso said:


> If I cut aluminum dry I get a severe case of chip welding. If I spray a bit of WD-40 it works like a charm.
> How do you cut aluminum without anything>
> *Maybe different blade design makes a difference?*


One problem with aluminum is that the swarf likes to fill the gullets of the blade.  It has a tendency to get "welded" to the blade if you use a blade approaching or over the guideline of a maximum of 24 teeth engaged in the material.  Essentially that means you should limit a 10-14 tpi variable pitch blade to material less than 1 3/4" across.

Some of us are lazy and tend to stretch the guidelines a bit.  On my less ambitious days I've been known to cut up to 6" material with a 10-14 tpi blade.  It isn't wise, and probably shortens the blade life.  Without a blade brush it was difficult to the point the I had to take an excruciatingly boring  additional 10 minutes to change a 5-7 tpi blade which is the most coarse blade I have in stock.  With the blade brush even the nastiest welded on swarf is easily ejected into the pan.  That means I can continue with my less than stellar practices until such time I either come to my senses or break a blade.

As a side note I've only attempted to cut a 6" piece of 6061 with a 10-14 tpi blade on a couple occasions.  Mama doesn't like it when I make a quick run to the bathroom to change my shorts after I snap a blade.


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## projectnut (Sep 7, 2021)

I have 2 saws (a power hacksaw, and a horizontal bandsaw) that used coolant in a previous life.  Both took several days, and lots of elbow grease to clean before I put them to use in my shop.  The bandsaw was used in a production shop where it ran as much as 40 hours a week.  It was really too small for the job so thankfully the owner changed it out for a larger one before it got destroyed.  

By the time I got it the coolant had dried for several months.  The reservoir and lines were nasty.  Coolant was carried by the blade around the wheels and through the trough on the top of the saw.  The dried coolant was peppered with swarf which turned the entire surface into 60 grit sandpaper.  I've had the saw around 20 years and still occasionally find swarf laced dried coolant in places I'd never suspect.

The power hacksaw was even worse.  The reservoir was half full of semi dried coolant/swarf paste.  The top half of the reservoir was like the sandpaper surface of the bandsaw.  I literally had to disassemble the saw, take it to the local DIY car wash, and spray it down with hot high pressure water and detergent.  It took almost half a day and $30.00 in quarters to get the crud off the saw and the inside of the tank.   

These experiences along with having to clean the saw reservoirs a few times at work have lead me to my NO COOLANT policy.


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## pontiac428 (Sep 7, 2021)

Back when I did work in a machine shop, I was put off by flood coolant because of the nasty, infectious, petri-dish funk that came with it.  The way all those little fingertip papercuts from burred parts would get infected from "probiotic" coolant was just wrong.  In my home shop, I've tried to stick with oils and mists instead.  If I've got a big piece to cut on the 4x6, I'll just tend it a little with some WD40.  Works like kerosene on aluminum and steel, takes very little, and does not make a mess.  I can still vacuum my saw clean when done.


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## MrWhoopee (Sep 8, 2021)

projectnut said:


> One problem with aluminum is that the swarf likes to fill the gullets of the blade.  It has a tendency to get "welded" to the blade if you use a blade approaching or over the guideline of a maximum of 24 teeth engaged in the material.  Essentially that means you should limit a 10-14 tpi variable pitch blade to material less than 1 3/4" across.
> 
> Some of us are lazy and tend to stretch the guidelines a bit.  On my less ambitious days I've been known to cut up to 6" material with a 10-14 tpi blade.  It isn't wise, and probably shortens the blade life.  Without a blade brush it was difficult to the point the I had to take an excruciatingly boring  additional 10 minutes to change a 5-7 tpi blade which is the most coarse blade I have in stock.  With the blade brush even the nastiest welded on swarf is easily ejected into the pan.  That means I can continue with my less than stellar practices until such time I either come to my senses or break a blade.
> 
> As a side note I've only attempted to cut a 6" piece of 6061 with a 10-14 tpi blade on a couple occasions.  Mama doesn't like it when I make a quick run to the bathroom to change my shorts after I snap a blade.



Many of you already know this, there is a trick for cutting wide stock with a blade that is too fine. Place a piece of material (preferably round) equal to the stock thickness under the edge of the stock next to the fixed jaw, raising the stock at an angle. This reduces the area of blade contact and chip load. I have cut plenty of 4-6 in. wide aluminum this way with a 10/14 tpi blade with no problems.


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## Dabbler (Sep 8, 2021)

I also never use coolant on my bandsaws.


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## Tim9 (Sep 11, 2021)

I’ve been using a little oil or WD. But I just bought a stick of Lenox Lube Tube. Haven’t used it yet but I read somewhere that bandsaw users were happy with this sort of blade lube. It’s more like a thick wax. The package says….Multi purpose lubricating wax for industrial use.


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## Eyerelief (Sep 13, 2021)

Jeff. Got to thinking about your comment on blade design. I cut al dry and use a bimetal 10-14 tooth blade. I removed the HF blade before I ever used it and installed this one
https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B011E41Q7G/ref=yo_ii_img?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Cut everything from wood to A2 with it. Stays pretty busy and so far it’s worked without issue. Just a thought.


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## Dodgewade (Oct 22, 2021)

I used my band saw for 10 years without lubrication. Added it and use it off/on. Really never seen any difference with it or without. It not used daily, weekly or monthly. But from time to time it's used for a few hours. My opinion probably don't count as much as others, but I'm not sold on using a lubricant for my bandsaw. It seems I haven't bought over three blades in the last 20 - 25 years. It had a 1" wide blade when I got it and maybe 10 years or so later I had to buy one and stumbled up on something that lead me to get a 3/4" wide blade, which is much better for my saw. I have replaced  the 3/4" once and bought a spare that hanging on the wall rusting, LOL!
I have taken care of it by not pushing the feed rate or " leaning" on it.


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