# Leggos for Machinists



## RJSakowski (Jan 8, 2020)

Well, not quite.  About a year ago, I purchased five pairs of 1-2-3 blocks to go with the pair I already had.  My intent was to use them for machining setups, etc.  As mny of us already knew, although the Asian blocks have 3/8"-16 threaded holes on the 2 x 3 face, all the through holes are bored for the the 5/16" tap drill, making them unsuitable for use with 3/8"-16 fasteners.  

My idea was to turn down the diameter of a 3/8" bolt to 5/16" to allow them to pass through the blocks and threading the last inch for 5/16"-18.  I purchased a selection of 2", 3", and 4" bolts.  I used my 5C collet chuck and a 3/8" collet for work holding  and turned the hex heads to 3/8" to gain an extra 1/4".  For the 2" bolts,  I turned the diameter of the shafts to .312",  leaving 3/4" of the original 3/.8" thread and threaded about 1" of the opposite end for 5/16"-18.   because I had 1-1/2" of stickout, I experienced deflection on the end of the shaft so I chased the threads with a die.   Because of the oversized tip thread, I couldn't check the threading progress with a nut but once I got it dialed in, I ran by the numbers on the compound.

The longer bolts were turned to .312" in segments to minimize deflection, again leaving 3/4" of the original thread.  I then switched to a 5/16" collet and inserted the bolt through the collet from the back leaving about 1-1/2" exposed for the threading operation.  All the threads were chased using a vise for work holding and double nutting the 3/8" thread.  This was my first real use of the new electronic lead screw on the 602 and it was a real pleasure not having to mess around with change gears going from turning to threading.


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## Superburban (Jan 8, 2020)

clever solution.


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## middle.road (Jan 8, 2020)

I tried to use 3/8" Dia. dremel bits once to enlarge the 5/16" holes. 
A whole lot of effort with little return.


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## Bob Korves (Jan 8, 2020)

Robin Renzetti 1-2-3 blocks


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## middle.road (Jan 9, 2020)

Bob Korves said:


> Robin Renzetti 1-2-3 blocks


I'm going to go out on a limb here and state irrevocably that those don't look like imports... -just saying.   
How neat would a batch of those be in 1-2-3, 2-3-4, 2-4-6, & 4-6-8 with a pair of 1/2-1-2 as mascots?


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## mmcmdl (Jan 9, 2020)

I made 1000s of similar blocks for Joe when I ran his shop . All different sizes . He based his entire laser setups on them . I thought they were cheap but they did the job !   I wonder if he's still living , haven't stayed in touch . My daughter went to school with his son , who was unfortunately killed when struck by a vehicle .









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## brino (Jan 9, 2020)

RJSakowski said:


> My idea was to turn down the diameter of a 3/8" bolt to 5/16" to allow them to pass through the blocks and threading the last inch for 5/16"-18.




Great solution Bob!

I am going to use that idea, and I am sure many others will too.
Thanks for sharing it!

-brino


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## Bob Korves (Jan 9, 2020)

brino said:


> Great solution Bob!


Well, not my idea...  What I cannot fathom is why manufacturers don't come up with designs like this that allow the blocks to be easily bolted together in numerous configurations.  The common Asian ones we get, even the ones sold by Suburban Tool, have a bunch of holes and threads in them that are pretty much worthless to actually use for setups.  Why hasn't anybody stepped up and started selling blocks that are actually usable?  They put a whole lot of effort into drilling and tapping mostly useless holes, which costs money, and I would prefer plain, solid, no holes 1-2-3 blocks (at a reduced price) over the useless swarf catching holes and threads we get with the current ones.


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## RJSakowski (Jan 9, 2020)

Bob Korves said:


> Well, not my idea...  What I cannot fathom is why manufacturers don't come up with designs like this that allow the blocks to be easily bolted together in numerous configurations.  The common Asian ones we get, even the ones sold by Suburban Tool, have a bunch of holes and threads in them that are pretty much worthless to actually use for setups.  Why hasn't anybody stepped up and started selling blocks that are actually usable?  They put a whole lot of effort into drilling and tapping mostly useless holes, which costs money, and I would prefer plain, solid, no holes 1-2-3 blocks (at a reduced price) over the useless swarf catching holes and threads we get with the current ones.


Actually, the Renzetti blocks are a superior design and far more functional than the traditional blocks but unfortunately, they are not commercially available.  Making our own blocks would require one to have access to a mill, heat treating facilities, and a surface grinder which is not feasible for most of of us.

The Asian block are what they are.  My blocks were only a few dollars each and, IMO, a great bargain.  My solution allows all holes to be used and for a couple of pennies per block and some lathe time, a great way to increase the utility of a 1-2-3 block.


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## Bob Korves (Jan 9, 2020)

RJSakowski said:


> My solution allows all holes to be used and for a couple of pennies per block and some lathe time, a great way to increase the utility of a 1-2-3 block.


Indeed, RJ, your solution is an excellent one.  I will have to make some of those connectors and get the versatility that you have discovered.  But still, why don't we see manufacturers out there looking to corner the market (at least temporarily) with improved designs?  Seems like a no-brainer to me.


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## RJSakowski (Jan 9, 2020)

Bob Korves said:


> Indeed, RJ, your solution is an excellent one.  I will have to make some of those connectors and get the versatility that you have discovered.  But still, why don't we see manufacturers out there looking to corner the market (at least temporarily) with improved designs?  Seems like a no-brainer to me.


My guess is that the part is more expensive to make the way that Renzetti did and that the manufacturers don't see the market for upscale 1-2-3 blocks tro justify the effort.  My observation is that the Chinese are excellent at copying things but not the best at innovation.  If someone were to send them one of the improved blocks, they would have copies out the next day.


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## RJSakowski (Jan 9, 2020)

BTW, the Chinese are actively trying to change that paradigm.  Once they learn how to innovate, we will be in deep doo doo.


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## middle.road (Jan 9, 2020)

RJSakowski said:


> Actually, the Renzetti blocks are a superior design and far more functional than the traditional blocks but unfortunately, they are not commercially available.  _Making our own blocks would require one to have access to a mill, heat treating facilities, and a surface grinder which is not feasible for most of of us._
> 
> The Asian block are what they are.  My blocks were only a few dollars each and, IMO, a great bargain.  My solution allows all holes to be used and for a couple of pennies per block and some lathe time, a great way to increase the utility of a 1-2-3 block.


You left out the part about skill and talent. 
I'd probably end up with trapezoidal shaped blocks,off by several thousandths in every direction.


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## Cadillac (Jan 10, 2020)

Manufacturers make them I think people run when they see the prices. Suburban tools has then 200 for 123, 400 for 234,and 600 for 246.
 The tapped hole ones that most people have are used for bolting to a face plate angled plate or fixture not for building blocks. That’s what the countersunk through hole ones are for.


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## petertha (Feb 9, 2020)

I tried playing around with a Renzetti-esque non-external-protrusion idea I had bouncing around my head using classic offshore 123 'botched blocks' LOL.  I didn't take a picture of the 123 stack-up but I can if anyone is interested. The sketches better show the intent. Basically a through hole dowel pin and a threaded dowel pin. They can be one hole width apart regardless of stack-up orientation. 

Well, that was CAD world where everything looks good. In reality its a bit fiddly to position them in the block holes & aligning the fastener holes. A skewer stick worked well. But the bigger thing is the clamping doesn't feel very positive. I suspect this related to pin tangents on hole tangents makes for little contact area and a bit of position sliding until they are cinched secure.


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## petertha (Feb 9, 2020)

My apologies to whoever developed this idea. I snagged the picture but not the link. From what I can tell, inserts are threaded into the existing 123 block holes utilizing the chamfer to seat, presumably with head under the surface. But I also see what looks like similar cross dowels to my attempt? 

What I'd like to try next is a threaded stud like shown, but it has internal (say 8-32) thread like mine. Then the opposing faster would have 8-32 male thread but the same flat head, sub-flush geometry. But then you would need 3 lengths for each (1-2-3) configuration depending on stack-up. I tried different off the shelf flat head fasteners & they don't fit too well and/or the thread shank becomes too large. Nuts. I guess I'm going to ask Santa for an oven, surface grinder and a 2 by 4 of tool steel. LOL


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