# Finally made the jump to 3D-Printing.......



## brino (Oct 5, 2017)

I saved up and wanted to buy a 3D Printer earlier this year. The problem was there were too many options! In March I gave up looking, overwhelmed by too much information.

I probably could have started building one but the amount of work for that would have been even bigger than researching to buy one.

Why do I want one?
Many reasons really (but some may just be me justify the purchase) here they are:

Both of my kids are currently in post-secondary education, and both are using 3D printers on campus. For one it's an integral part of his program (Industrial Design) for the other (Math & Computer Science) it's out of interest at the campus "Maker space". Greater access to a 3D printing machine should be good for them.

I always want to add new capabilities to what I can build. Is plastic strong enough for some things I want to build......I guess we'll see.
It would finally force me to learn a 3D CAD tool. I installed AutoDesk Fusion 360 a long time ago (yes it's free for home use! ; see here and here). It would be very useful to have complete prints when I'm standing at my 1916 milling machine or 1937 lathe. I love the juxtaposition.

As an intro to "CNC". It may be a stretch for some, but I see 3D printing squarely in the CNC camp....you draw the part and you hit "print" and a computer moves the head around and extrudes plastic. Sure it's "additive" rather than "subtractive" but it's still CNC. I could see a distant future where I build a CNC router or plasma table.....and this counts as research......right?

Maybe it was the kids getting back to school that gave me the kick in the pants I needed.
I dove in and purchased a 3D printer. It arrived last Thursday.

This is getting a little long already.
Stay tuned for more.

-brino


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## mikey (Oct 5, 2017)

Cool, Brino. Please keep us posted on your progress. It would be neat if you could print in metal and then heat treat it to toughen it into a useful tool.


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## brino (Oct 5, 2017)

What features did I want in a 3D printer?
-decent size print bed (my son likes to make various models from video game weapons to masks, etc. I wanted to support his creativity)
-easy to repair with no (or few) custom parts
-one I could fully "own", ie. ability to tweak (hardware or software) short-comings and not dependant on custom software or controller
-easy to upgrade  and expandability; can I use new types of filaments with higher required nozzle and bed temperatures

A home-made one would be right up my alley.......but time is too short.

I found it strange that the printer was actually cheaper on amazon.ca than directly from the supplier.
I also added a few small spools of different colour filament to the shopping cart.
I chose PLA filament, expecting the ABS to smell too bad for use in the house.

So I am now one week in with a 3D printer in my basement.

first impressions....

I waited 'til after the kids were home to even open the box (I want them to feel some ownership too)

it went together very quickly with no extra tools
there were also a number of tools supplied in a tool kit (exacto-knife, a decent set of tweezers, larger "prying" knife, etc.)
we were printing in minutes from the models on the supplied SD card.
first projects...
we first printed a few items from the SD card; a key chain, some little trinkets, etc.

what shocked me was the fish skeleton
I just figured that it was a standard flat print......but no!
When I went to pry it off the print bed with the included knife I thought I broke it, only the y-shaped tail popped off.
I went along the "bones" popping them off the bed and realized that this model was actually printed with joints in it.
The fish was articulated!!! Holy Crap!

You can find the fish skeleton .stl model here: https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1276095
and a decent free stl viewer here: https://www.3d-tool.com/en_update.htm
(look for the title "Free STL and 3D-Tool DDD Viewer", I have already uploaded it to VirusTotal to prove it's safe, see here)

Here's a couple screen shots from the viewer:







....and just one vertabrae





This whole fish prints as ONE object!
This is NOT printing multiple things and snapping them together.
It is printed as one object with joints.

Still more to come............

-brino


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## brino (Oct 5, 2017)

Okay, so how about a couple more neat objects from "the web".......

Once I learned it was possible, I wanted to explore what was possible in terms of "bridging", that is, jumping the gap over top of a previous layers without having the extruded material droop into the void.

I printed a crocodile: https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:941177
Here's the model:





That squiggly base material is known as a support structure or "raft".
Since the crocodile feet stick out from the body it needs support under the head and tail to print properly.
The support material is meant to be break-away, and come off easily without damaging the model.
I found it not quite so.....

The top side looked great:





But the bottom side was pretty rough after pulling away the "raft":




There are holes in the side of the face under the eye and in the tail.

However, the designer supplied a few versions.
One has the feet embedded into the body of the croc:





This version printed flat on the bed with no need for support material , and NO defects.
I guess the support material is something I need to learn more about.
It appears to be part of the .stl (stereo-lithography) file, yet I can still turn it on or off in the printer software.

This model is one piece, but the upper jaw and head are attached to the feet via a thin neck thru a square hole in the lower jaws.




The mouth springs open when you pinch from belly to back.
Most people I showed it to describe it as a "clothes pin".

I also printed a "minisaur": https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2476792
Here's the model:





This thing is also one piece. The mouth opens, but it is "sprung".
The back legs act as a lever to the lower jaw, and that is attached inside the tail somewhere.....
You pinch the back legs to the tail to open the mouth.

Since it is one piece the stl viewer cannot show the different parts.
Right now the printer is busy, but tomorrow I'll try to load that model into the "slicer" software and grab some screen shots of the internal layers.

Good night!
-brino


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## tweinke (Oct 6, 2017)

I think 3D printing would be a good way to learn CNC/ and the drawing side of the game so like you I have considered to try to find a printer and do a bit of learning


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## brino (Oct 6, 2017)

I am still learning tool flow, file types, print features, material differences, etc. and will be for a long time.

These .stl files can be directly loaded into the free "Cura" software that has a profile for the specific printer.
You can rotate, scale, and use "ghost", "x-ray" and "layer" views of the model.

Here's layer 1 of that "minisaur":





and layer 9:





In that last one you can see the lower jaw connected thru the body to the tail.
Note also the semi-circle about midway that is the hip that connects it to the back leg as a kind of lever for moving the lower jaw.

Within this software you can select the print quality, trading off detail vs. print speed.
I need to do a couple prints at different ends of the spectrum for comparison......

-brino


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## Shepherd (Oct 6, 2017)

I bought one two years ago for my son, but he lost interest pretty quickly....just got it up and running again.  It's 50% science, and 50% art...be prepared for a lot of experimentation with settings, and a lot of wasted prints.  Just started figuring out ABS, which is much trickier than PLA, but far tougher in the final product.

And warning: Browsing Thingiverse is a huge time suck from which countless hours of productivity is lost....


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## brino (Oct 6, 2017)

A little trouble:

I wanted an object printed in another colour so I followed the instructions to change filaments (turn the nozzle temp up, loosen the feed clamp, pull out the old, insert the new, re-clamp)

I tried a print but it turned out a MESS!

I left the printer for a few minutes and came back to a model stuck to the head and the bed moving around underneath it.
The nozzle kept spewing molten plastic as a string of gnarly "rope" as it dragged the model around the table.

Hmmmmm.....what I did I change?
I thought that I had only changed the filament colour.
When I bought filament I searched on "PLA" , so it should all be the same material just different colours, right?

NOT so right........this package says it's "co-polymer". Wait, that's different than the previous "PLA" filament!
Looking up the vendor specs on that filament showed it was very different.

The PLA material wants a nozzle temperature of 205 deg. C. and a bed temperature of 60 deg. C.
This "co-poly" stuff want a nozzle temperature of 230 deg. C and a bed temperature around 85 deg. C.

That made a huge difference.
But there are also other tricks......

The filament vendors web site also suggested another aid to getting better bed adhesion.
They suggest using a simple Elmers rub-on type glue stick, like kids use for paper crafts.
So I found an old one that wasn't hardened and gave the print area a coating.
Yeah that helps too, but is a little messy as it leaves a crusty film on the bed that needs to be scraped off.

My son suggested another option he had seen used at school; masking tape.
I first tried plain old green painters tape.
You stick it down to the printer bed, and the extruded plastic sticks to the back-side of the tape.
Experimentation showed that it did help, but often the edges of the tape were lifting too.

So we tried a better "Pro" blue masking tape. That worked even better.

Lessons:
-you gotta know your material, don't assume anything
-there are a host of tricks available to help workaround problems.

Still lots to learn!

-brino


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## f350ca (Oct 6, 2017)

Welcome to the 21st century Brino. I can see where having one would open up a lot of possibilities. We need a picture of the machine though, or it never happened.
Could have used one this past week to make a control cam for the totally plastic transaxle in my Sears riding mower. You could print me a new rear end for it.

Greg


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## Firestopper (Oct 6, 2017)

Anything to do with learning along side your children is great. Once they grow you'll miss those special days. Thanks for sharing your experiences and like Greg wrote, post up some  photos of your printer.


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## dlane (Oct 6, 2017)

Yes brino pics , price
Thanks


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## brino (Oct 6, 2017)

Alright guys, I was trying to be humble and not a braggart about the machine and price tag, but this write-up wouldn't be complete without that kinda info.

The machine that I found that best fit my wish list above was the LulzBot Taz 6.
Here a link to their page with full pricing and specs:
https://www.lulzbot.com/store/printers/lulzbot-taz-6

It is open source hardware and software. 
It is upgradeable with a dual extruder (for printing two colours at once), and other special heads for flex material, etc.

The maximum print envelope is about 11 x 11 x 10 inches.
The nozzle diameter is 0.5 mm.

It currently sells for USD $2500.
I was going to get it direct from Lulzbot as they offered free shipping in Canada (almost unheard of!) from their "Canadian Fullfillment Centre".
However, I actually found it slightly cheaper (also with free shipping) on amazon.ca.
After dollar conversion, taxes and with 6 spools of different colour filament (o.5 kg each), it was CAD $3800.

Also, I knew if I didn't buy one soon then that saved money would be spent on something frivolous like new windows for the house .

With this machine a large number of the components are themselves 3D printed. In fact, the SD memory card that came with it has the models for all the printed parts.
I figured this would give me an instant 3D printer setup, and offer the ability to duplicate the machine in the future.

Here's a video showing their "fleet" of 109 printers making parts for more printers:





I don't have pictures of my printer yet, but will get some........

-brino


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## brino (Oct 6, 2017)

*real-world applications:*

okay, enough of making Toys for "Happy Meals".
Is there anything actually useful you can do with a 3D printer?

Here's my first real project.

The keyboard I am using right now had a broken foot.
It's one of those little flip-down deals that allow you to prop the keyboard up at a better angle for typing.
It broke years ago and I've had a sharpie marker stuck under one corner as a "work around".

I decided to tackle that.

Here's the broken foot beside the good one.....









You can see that I tried fixing it........first with CA glue, then later with a UV-cured glue.
Neither one held.

I really only have a few hours using Fusion 360 but have watched a couple online videos, so I wasn't sure how well I could do up a drawing for the replacement part.
I sat down at Fusion 360 with the good part and my digital calipers.
After only a little trouble finding the right tools, I had made this model:









The recess is required to go over a feature on the keyboard and the spring latch keeps it from flopping around.

I was able to set up Fusion 360 to output a 3D print directly to the Cura printer controller software.

Here's the printed part:








It sure looks like it should work!

Here it is installed:








No one will ever be able to tell the difference!!! 

I call that a success.

-brino


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## francist (Oct 6, 2017)

Sweet! Love it -- extruding plastic parts to replace broken plastic parts. Perfect!
You're having way too much fun with that already...

-frank


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## brino (Oct 8, 2017)

Here are some of the prints that went bad.

This was meant to be a little plastic tag with my name on it...but it did not adhere properly to the heated bed.
I came back to the the main parts stuck to the hot print head and the nozzle still spewing plastic as it dragged the mess around the bed.



Here's another "bed adhesion" problem.....

This is another puzzle one from thingiverse: https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:186372
The model looks like this in the free viewer (linked to above):





However, when it does NOT stick to the bed during printing it can look like this:



However using masking tape on the bed allowed this:


(note it printed fine, I just don't have the knowledge/patience to arrange all the rings and balance it for a photo.)

However we are making more "good prints" than "bad prints".

-brino


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## brino (Oct 8, 2017)

Here's another neat puzzle from "Thingiverse".
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:186372

Here's the pyramid puzzle.

You print two identical prints of this model::









.......and they twist together to make the pyramid:





The pink ones my son printed on a Dremel 3D-Printer at school.
The black and green were printed here at home on our Lulzbot Taz 6.
Yet the parts can interchange:







Notice the rough bottom edge on that middle one above. That edge was vertical when it was printed and that rough edge comes from molten plastic not turning off immediately when the nozzle gets done a layer. Kinda a "run-out" at shut off.....the machine does actually pull the filament backwards away from the nozzle, but obviously cannot stop the flow entirely.

I'm still wondering about possible improvements for this......print quality settings, nozzle temperature adjustments, etc.

-brino


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## Firestopper (Oct 8, 2017)

Back in 2003 at SEMA in LV there was a booth showcasing a 3D printer. They had all sorts of really neat gear clusters that would  rotate different directions with no assembly required. The printer would print from the bottom up adjusting for rotating clearances. I was mesmerized watching that printer do its magic. I understand they have made great advancements with plastics that are direct application vs prototyping only.
Really happy for you brino. Keep us posted on your 3D advancements.
Paco


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## xalky (Oct 8, 2017)

brino said:


> Here's another neat puzzle from "Thingiverse".
> https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:186372
> 
> Here's the pyramid puzzle.
> ...


Which 3D printer did you end up buying? I bought an ANET A6 a few months back, and it's the most fun I've had in a long time. Although it can be frustrating at times. I only paid around $200 for mine but I've upgraded and hot rodded it quite a bit. I have a bunch of videos up on my 3d printing adventures. There's a lot of great channels on youtube for learning this stuff. If it wasn't for them Ida kicked my machine to the curb...lol


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## brino (Oct 8, 2017)

xalky said:


> Which 3D printer did you end up buying?



We got the LulzBot Taz 6.
It wasn't cheap, but we were making successful prints about an hour after opening the box.



xalky said:


> I've upgraded and hot rodded it quite a bit


I'd like to know what upgrades you did.



xalky said:


> There's a lot of great channels on youtube for learning this stuff. If it wasn't for them Ida kicked my machine to the curb...lol


Got any favourites you could mention?

Thanks,
-brino


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## xalky (Oct 8, 2017)

I wish I could say the same about the Anet a6. It took 10 hrs to put it all together. Of course I took my time to make sure everything was square and parallel and straight.  I'll post a link to my 3d printing play list below. Other channels include, Thomas Sanladerer , 3d maker noob, CHEP 3D printing, makers muse. There's a lot of them really. You can also do a search for your specific printer on YouTube to get people that have modded the lulzbot.


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## xalky (Oct 8, 2017)

Here's just one of my videos.


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## brino (Oct 9, 2017)

xalky said:


> Here's just one of my videos.



Thanks, Marcel.
I watched a couple of your videos.
I like your honest, laid-back style and enthusiasm.
Thanks for sharing!

-brino


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## cs900 (Oct 9, 2017)

congrats Brino, that's a great printer you have there.

I'll also say that you are absolutely right, 3d printing is a great way to get into CNC. In fact both 3d printers and traditional CNCs use the same programming language (gcode).  Next time you slice your part, save the code as a text file and take a look at it. It's interesting to see how simple the language really is, and yet you can do so much with it.

Welcome to the 3d printing family!

Edit...and in case you haven't already seen this page, it's a life saver:
https://www.simplify3d.com/support/print-quality-troubleshooting/


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## brino (Oct 9, 2017)

@xalky 
Hi Marcel,

I am currently _trying_ to use Fusion 360 and outputting that to Cura (Lulzbot edition).
I find Fusion 360 a nightmare in terms of "easy of use".......nothing is where I think it should be.
Maybe just growing pains, but it feels like I'm wasting a bunch of time.
And my son notices that our "special edition" of Cura doesn't have all the bells and whistles of the version they use at school.
I guess I could find the vanilla version and produce my own printer profile for the Taz 6.

Is there any advice you could give on software?
Any part CAD, slicers, etc.
What do you use?

I read that a lot of people like "Symplify-3D" (https://www.simplify3d.com/), have you tried that one?
$150 seems a little steep (says the guy with the expensive printer ).

I also saw:
AutoDesk MeshMixer (http://www.meshmixer.com/), free to use!
Blender (https://www.blender.org/) open source
but that last one looks more like an animation package, I picture way too many buttons and menus.....

Anyone with good/bad experiences with their software please jump in.

Thanks,
-brino


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## xalky (Oct 9, 2017)

brino said:


> @xalky
> Hi Marcel,
> 
> I am currently _trying_ to use Fusion 360 and outputting that to Cura (Lulzbot edition).
> ...


I use fusion 360, and I really like it. There's another guy on YouTube, Lars Chistensen, that has a 3 or 4 part series for absolute beginners that is great. Once you get used to it, it's very powerful. Don't waste your time learning something like tinkercad, you'll quickly outgrow it.

As far as slicers, I use the latest cura 2.7, it's free and a lot of people use it, so there's lots of community support.

Meshmixer and blender are mainly for altering meshes, not so much for creating them. There's a mesh tool in fusion 360 that does the same thing.


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## cs900 (Oct 9, 2017)

hey Brino,
Cura is a bit funny. They recently overhauled their software and started naming it version 2.X.X...if you want all the goodies you'll need to download the older version of the software, version 15.04.06

Repitierhost and octoprint (web based) are other good, and free, slicers

Fusion is actually really nice for 3d printing. There is a 3d print button in the ribbon that will automatically convert your part to an STL and import it into your slicer for you. Pretty slick.


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## silverhawk (Oct 14, 2017)

brino said:


> okay, enough of making Toys for "Happy Meals".
> Is there anything actually useful you can do with a 3D printer?



Now that you are getting familiar with that, I would suggest an aluminum foundry, and beginning research on "lost-PLA casting".  A good youtube channel is Makercise - he recently completed a Dave Gingery lathe, and has started on the Gingery shaper.  Good and interesting information.  Or, myfordboy does that.  Having aluminum parts you can make without needing a mill (e.g. making your own car emblems by printing, casting, and adding enamel for colors) or to custom build anything you want is a huge win for your home shop, and actually gives you more resources than most professional shops.


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## brino (Oct 21, 2017)

okay.........(way past) time for an update.

I've printed a few more small models/toys, but want to show that this 3D-printer is actually useful.
To me buying tools is about expanding the capabilities of me and my shop.
(Certainly a lot of learning goes along with it!)

Here's another small project to produce something useful.

I have two of these Lufkin measuring tapes:




They are my current favourites (since I lost my last favourite in the blown attic insulation, I dropped it and it disappeared, tried searching and finally gave up!). I like these for two reasons: i) they have both metric and imperial measures, and ii) the size is right...long enough for most jobs, but not too bulky.

The problem is with the little "brake" mechanism the locks the tape when you push the thumb button.
The original white plastic ones wore out.
I don't want to throw these away due to that minor issue, but sometimes it's a PITA when I need to pick up my pencil, but cannot let go of the measuring tape or it'll retract in a hurry.

It annoyed me enough that months ago I attempted a repair.....by CA-gluing on a piece of flat wood from a tongue depressor, and then adding a bit of hot glue as a gripping pad on the end.


Ugly? Yes, but they did work........for a little while.

Okay so can I 3D-print some replacements?
I can try..........here's my first model part:


The oval is meant to give some spring to the tip.
The little "bite" out of the tip is meant to clear the rivets that attach the edge-clip to the end fo the tape.

I printed four expecting to break at least one removing it from the "raft" support material.
Here's a picture of two removed from the raft, and one cleaned up.



Unfortunately, the first ones were too short...they did NOT stop the measuring tape from retracting.
Of course, I was guessing a little on size since the ones I was measuring were worn too short too.

However, the process is quick and easy to make a tweak and try again. This one is a little longer:
Fusion-360 model:


and actual parts:


The one on top-left is still attached to the "raft", the one on top-right has been removed and cleaned-up.

Here's the inside of the measuring tape:



Here's one of the old parts in the measuring tape:






....and here it is fixed and locked with the new 3D-printed brake part:




Both measuring tapes are back in operation with functional thumb locks!
These small parts but would have been tough to make any other way.

-brino


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## cs900 (Oct 21, 2017)

looks great, and it's functional! great job


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## HBilly1022 (Oct 22, 2017)

brino said:


> These small parts but would have been tough to make any other way.
> 
> -brino



When I got my first lathe I told my wife it was a hobby and laughed about the fact that I spent thousands of $ so I could make a part that could be purchased for pennies. Then I bought a mill / drill to expand my ability to make parts _cheaply_, lol.

But you, Brino, have got me beat. You even bought a 3-D printer to make parts that can be bought cheaply (or the entire part can be replaced for a nominal amount). I must tell my wife that I am not alone in this journey to find ways to save money  by making things ourselves and there are people that are even more committed to saving than me. 

Seriously though, I think this is very cool. I didn't know this technology existed (been out of touch since retirement). I hope this doesn't lead to another new hobby for me. I don't have enough time for all the ones I have now.


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## brino (Oct 22, 2017)

HBilly1022 said:


> You even bought a 3-D printer to make parts that can be bought cheaply (or the entire part can be replaced for a nominal amount).



Sometimes it's just about the journey..........not the destination. 
-brino


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## HBilly1022 (Oct 22, 2017)

brino said:


> Sometimes it's just about the journey..........not the destination.
> -brino



Agree wholeheartedly. It appears your 3-D printing journey could be a long, interesting one. Something like this machining hobby. Soooooooo much to learn. 

Enjoy the journey.


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## silverhawk (Oct 22, 2017)

HBilly1022 said:


> When I got my first lathe I told my wife it was a hobby and laughed about the fact that I spent thousands of $ so I could make a part that could be purchased for pennies. Then I bought a mill / drill to expand my ability to make parts _cheaply_, lol.
> 
> But you, Brino, have got me beat. You even bought a 3-D printer to make parts that can be bought cheaply (or the entire part can be replaced for a nominal amount). I must tell my wife that I am not alone in this journey to find ways to save money  by making things ourselves and there are people that are even more committed to saving than me.
> 
> Seriously though, I think this is very cool. I didn't know this technology existed (been out of touch since retirement). I hope this doesn't lead to another new hobby for me. I don't have enough time for all the ones I have now.



It's a slippery slope.  After the 3D printer comes vacuum forming.  After that comes injection molding.  Trust me, tools and learning are an addiction that runs deep.


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## coherent (Oct 23, 2017)

I've had a 3D printer for a couple years now. I think it's great when you need a plastic "thingy" or part. The nearest hardware store or box store to me is a 30 mile round trip.  About half the time, they don't have what I need and its back home to order online and then wait days to get it.  When you break something like the window screen frame plastic corner or keyboard leg, or need custom piece, to be able to make one without leaving home is pretty cool. Who cares what it costs... it's fun!


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## 7milesup (Nov 1, 2017)

I purchased a Prusa I3 Mk2S about a month ago.  Absolutely love it, especially the mesh bed leveling feature.  They just came out with the I3 Mk3 which adds some awesome features.  Mine has the PEI bed on it, but the new Mk3 has the PEI as a powder coated metal bed that is attached to the "Y" axis with magnets.  So, when you want the part to come off, just remove the metal sheet with the part on it and flex it slightly, which pops the part off.

I use Fusion 360 almost exclusively.  I just joined the EAA however, which allows you to download the maker edition of Solidworks, which is the same as the regular version except for a few analysis functionalities and a "Student" watermark that ends up on the file I believe.  Just started learning Solidworks and crikey, it seems a lot harder than Fusion 360.

A link to the Prusa printer.  Prusa I3 Mk3


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## RJSakowski (Nov 2, 2017)

7milesup said:


> I use Fusion 360 almost exclusively.  I just joined the EAA however, which allows you to download the maker edition of Solidworks, which is the same as the regular version except for a few analysis functionalities and a "Student" watermark that ends up on the file I believe.  Just started learning Solidworks and crikey, it seems a lot harder than Fusion 360.



Every transition to a new CAD system has been difficult for me.  I have had Fusion 360 on my computer for over two years now and have yet to use it for anything meaningful.  IMO, it takes total immersion for a week or two to really get the feel for a new CAD package.  I keep promising myself that I will do that but it hasn't happened yet.  My problem is that I have a totally functional SolidWorks 2012 seat that is my go-to whenever I need to design a part and I always take the easy path.

When I made the transition from AutoCAD to SolidWorks, I bought a reference called "SolidWorks 2003 Bible".   After that, I bought a current edition with every version update.  The last that I bought was 2010.  I found it to be a handy reference that explained how to accomplish a particular task that I instinctively knew was possible but couldn't figure out how to do.  I haven't found a similar reference for Fusion 360 and maybe never will because of the way in which Fusion updates but if it exists, it would go a long way towards my understanding the software.


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## RJSakowski (Nov 2, 2017)

I have been wondering for some time about using my Tormach CNC as a platform for various non-traditional uses.  I have already set up a laser head for cutting things like gaskets and a microscope that will permit use as an optical comparator.  Addition of a touch probe would permit 3D scanning of parts fairly easily. I use the mill to make printed circuit boards via conventional milling and can see using the laser to " burn" printed circuit board resist for subsequent chemical etching. (The laser isn't powerful enough to directly etch the copper trace).

The question that I have is has anyone used a CNC mill for 3D printing?  It would seem that it would be a logical platform for this application and cut the cost of this application substantially.


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## jbolt (Nov 6, 2017)

7milesup said:


> Just started learning Solidworks and crikey, it seems a lot harder than Fusion 360.



That's interesting. I learned on Solidworks and I find it very intuitive to use. Once you grasp a few basic concepts it falls together pretty quickly. I have Fusion 360 but it drives me nuts since it is almost a polar opposite to how Solidworks works.


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## ebolton (Feb 18, 2018)

brino said:


> Alright guys, I was trying to be humble and not a braggart about the machine and price tag, but this write-up wouldn't be complete without that kinda info.
> 
> The machine that I found that best fit my wish list above was the LulzBot Taz 6....
> 
> -brino



Hey Brino, I just got a TAZ 6 yesterday. Will be putting it together later today (after clearing the snow we got last night). I picked it for some of the reasons you did- wanted to make stuff, but I didn't want to add 3D printer building as a hobby in itself. Life is way, way too short for everything.

I was going to get the Mini, but almost every review of the Mini ended up by saying the reviewer was going to move up to the TAZ when possible. So I waited a bit longer and went directly there.

I'm glad to see you are positive about your choice and experience so far!

-Ed


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## brino (Feb 18, 2018)

ebolton said:


> I'm glad to see you are positive about your choice and experience so far!



Yep and I still am! I am still using it more and more, and finally starting to get comfortable with Fusion-360.

Congrats on your leap into 3D printing too!

Please keep posting with your progress or any questions (not that I'll necessarily have the answers, but there's a wise and numerous group here that have helped me immeasurably)

-brino


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## ebolton (Feb 18, 2018)

First glitch. I assembled the TAZ 6; it went well. I had previously installed Cura on my main computer in my living room. That went well also, it runs fine there. BUT, I should have tried it on this laptop I keep in my cellar workshop. Cura won't run on the laptop. It's a Celeron machine running Windows 7, though it is old and limited in spec. After the splash screen, which takes a huge long time, Windows crashes it out. It's impractical for me to move the TAZ to the living room, and it is impractical for me to move our main computer to the cellar, so I guess I need a new laptop. That is a bummer, to say the least.

-Ed


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## Dave Paine (Feb 18, 2018)

Before you give up on the laptop, see if Slic3r works.    I am using this at the moment.

Slic3r site


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## ebolton (Feb 18, 2018)

Dave Paine said:


> Before you give up on the laptop, see if Slic3r works.    I am using this at the moment.
> 
> Slic3r site


No new laptop or software at the moment. Maybe later. I had downloaded Cura from the Luzbot site, figuring it would likely be newer than the version supplied on the SD card that came with the printer. It probably is, but I tried installing the version on the SD card instead, and it worked fine on the laptop. The sample octopus thing came out great.

I see even with this "turnkey" solution, there will be some fiddling and diddling to be done.

I'm fairly impressed with the hardware, except for the provisions for holding and controlling the filament spool. I had read that is a priority upgrade for many Lulzbot owners, and I now concurr.

There must be a lot of blinking LED's on that control board, and they must be really bright. Through the air vents in the back of the housing, it looks like the thing is on fire!

The sounds are almost musical. I could fall asleep listening to it. I know my wife won't like the sound, though, which is one reason this must stay in the workshop.

-Ed


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## brino (Feb 18, 2018)

ebolton said:


> It's impractical for me to move the TAZ to the living room, and it is impractical for me to move our main computer to the cellar, so I guess I need a new laptop. That is a bummer, to say the least.



I currently have a nearly 20 foot length of USB cable between the PC and the printer.....made of 3 separate cables hooked together. Not pretty, but it works!



ebolton said:


> The sounds are almost musical. I could fall asleep listening to it. I know my wife won't like the sound, though, which is one reason this must stay in the workshop.



TRUE STORY: Within the first couple days we had it there was some bag pipe music on the radio. When I came back into the room I did NOT notice that the printer was running. I guess it's the rhythm of the stepper X and Y motors.

For me it's the smell of using ABS filament that will get the machine kicked out of the basement to the shop.

-brino


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## middle.road (Feb 19, 2018)

ebolton said:


> First glitch. I assembled the TAZ 6; it went well. I had previously installed Cura on my main computer in my living room. That went well also, it runs fine there. BUT, I should have tried it on this laptop I keep in my cellar workshop. Cura won't run on the laptop. It's a Celeron machine running Windows 7, though it is old and limited in spec. After the splash screen, which takes a huge long time, Windows crashes it out. It's impractical for me to move the TAZ to the living room, and it is impractical for me to move our main computer to the cellar, so I guess I need a new laptop. That is a bummer, to say the least.
> 
> -Ed


<begin rant>
Forget a Celeron based PC for anything productive besides Surfing and reading E-mail. 
If I had a quarter for everytime a friend/acquaintance has called me in the last 20 years _after_ they bought a Celeron based machine and could not accomplish what they wanted to, I would be sitting on a white sand beach, under a palm tree with a very fine adult beverage in hand.
They are strictly a price point engineered processor put out by Intel to create low price computers.
They have their place but number crunching will never be it.
Just as in the 'ancient' times when an 80286 required an 80287 math co-processor and and 80386 likewise required an 80387 co-processor, to be able to do any _number crunching_ or CAD work, the Celeron doesn't have that level of capability. I've seen them fail time and again on simple spreadsheets with a minimum of calculations. Sorry, I just can't stand them. They hinder folks trying toaccomplish something and then that experience sours the person on computers in general. </end rant>
If you go to upgrade look at used lease-back equipment. Easy on the budget comes with a warranty from the reseller - I have steered numerous folks that direction with only one problem. But he was the type of person who was never happy with anything, be it vehicle, lawn equipment, appliances, ETC.


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## middle.road (Feb 19, 2018)

Now for the over the top All-one-machines.
One that I came across is called the Boxzy, Prints, Carves, Mills, but doesn't make coffee, and there's a few other's out there that are similar.
However, the cost ($$$$) of them creates a hurdle for hobbyists. But man some of them look real sweet. The enjoyment factor might be worth it for some.
They are an entire level above a standard 3D printer.


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## ebolton (Feb 19, 2018)

middle.road said:


> <begin rant>
> Forget a Celeron based PC for anything productive besides Surfing and reading E-mail....



I do a workout most mornings on a Concept 2 rower, and I run a program called Rowpro on this computer that interfaces with the rower to set it up and log the workouts. I also use it with Garmin Basecamp when I'm on the road. That and leisure-time web surfing when I travel is all I previously used it for, and it has worked fine for those things. It also runs the older version of Cura with no trouble. It's just the latest version that exceeds it.

Anyway, right now I'm running a test print off the SD card via sneakernet. That you can do this is one good reason for picking the TAZ over the Mini. I get to set up prints on the newer, more full featured Cura upstairs and run them on the printer downstairs, freeing up both computers while the print is running. I think that is the winner for me.

I hope to keep the crappy old laptop till Win 7 goes unsupported if I can.

-Ed


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## FLguy (Dec 9, 2018)

Thanks to all of you!! I'm trying to learn Fusion 360 and my Flying Bear Ghost printer. What you guys laid out here gives me hope that this 71 yr. old can have more fun and excitement in my life.


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## 7milesup (Dec 9, 2018)

FLguy said:


> Thanks to all of you!! I'm trying to learn Fusion 360 and my Flying Bear Ghost printer. What you guys laid out here gives me hope that this 71 yr. old can have more fun and excitement in my life.



Never too old my friend!!   I have been watching Lars Christensen lately to gain more insight and depth into my Fusion 360 knowledge.   Keep in mind (and I have a hard time wrapping my head around this too) that there are usually more than one way to get to your end result.  Like a "combine" command vs a "Joint" command.

Lars Christensen YouTube Channel.


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## coherent (Dec 11, 2018)

FLguy said:


> Thanks to all of you!! I'm trying to learn Fusion 360 and my Flying Bear Ghost printer. What you guys laid out here gives me hope that this 71 yr. old can have more fun and excitement in my life.



I went with Autodesk Inventor and found it pretty easy to get a handle on. There are lots of online tutorials. It takes a little time to master but I  really like it. If you do any other 3d cad or  CNC machining it offers some great tools and excellent HSM tool path capabilities also.


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## middle.road (Feb 1, 2021)

middle.road said:


> Now for the over the top All-one-machines.
> One that I came across is called the Boxzy, Prints, Carves, Mills, but doesn't make coffee, and there's a few other's out there that are similar.
> However, the cost ($$$$) of them creates a hurdle for hobbyists. But man some of them look real sweet. The enjoyment factor might be worth it for some.
> They are an entire level above a standard 3D printer.


It appears that Boxzy went under, their website is unreachable. I wonder if it was a Kickstarter sham. Don't know, not certain, can't find anything relevant.
Sites like Newark and WoodCraft still have them on their sites, but they are 'Out of Stock'.


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## GunsOfNavarone (Feb 11, 2021)

Brino, as I can tell your mind is as blown as mine was with the whole print in place deal....you'll love this. It was one of the 1st things I printed and I STILL play with it and marvel at it.
Bearing


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## brino (Feb 11, 2021)

GunsOfNavarone said:


> you'll love this. It was one of the 1st things I printed and I STILL play with it and marvel at it.



....I just downloaded it and starting a print in a few minutes, thanks!
-brino


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## Aaron_W (Feb 14, 2021)

middle.road said:


> It appears that Boxzy went under, their website is unreachable. I wonder if it was a Kickstarter sham. Don't know, not certain, can't find anything relevant.
> Sites like Newark and WoodCraft still have them on their sites, but they are 'Out of Stock'.



I don't know about that Boxzy but there is Snap Maker 2.0 a 3D printer, CNC router, and laser cutter / engraver. When I was shopping so looking at a lot of 3D printer sites I was constantly getting their ads. Kind of a neat idea but I'm guessing like most many in one machines probably a lot less convenient than just getting individual dedicated machines. I can't imagine the 3D printer and laser cutter components would appreciate the chips from the router. 

Snap Maker 2.0


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