# A little help with my Husky A1S mill



## larry2c (Nov 13, 2019)

Hi all - I joined this forum a couple years ago but didn't have much time to be a "home machinist" while I was working. I retired recently and now I'm getting more time to work with my mill and maybe add a lathe one of these days. For the record, I was a machinist/NC programmer/manufacturing automation specialist for about 40 years so I'm really looking forward to just playing instead of working!

My current help request has to do mostly with the motor for my mill. It is a 240/120 motor wired for 120 and it has worked fine for the times I've used it over the past couple years. Last week I started a project making some game boards for Christmas presents and today I noticed that the dedicated 20 amp outlet the mill is plugged into is tripping the breaker if I also run my shop vac at the same time (just a little guy, not industrial). I also noticed that the case of the motor is getting really hot and I guess I can smell it a little bit (not sure if its an electrical smell or hot grease).

I really don't know much about electrical so I'm a bit hesitant to tear into the motor. Also, I need to make a half dozen or so of these game boards over the next couple weeks so I can get them mailed out in time for Christmas. Can anyone give me some tips on what to look at? Or maybe where I could get a replacement motor - FWIW, I could live with a straight 120V motor which I assume would be cheaper than the 240/120 motor I have.

I also noticed there are several Husky owners out there when I did a search on my problem. If any of you guys have other info on this mill I'd be greatly appreciative. I saw pictures from MikeInOr of his mill and it had what looked like cast metal handwheels for the table. Mine are plastic and all have had the "handle" break out of the wheel - I'd love to know where to get a metallic version. I also saw where Radials was doing a complete rebuild on his mill. He mentioned maybe starting a thread on the rebuild but I haven't found it so far - anyone know if it got created?

That's enough for this post. Thanks in advance for the help!


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## matthewsx (Nov 13, 2019)

First thing I would do is check the connections where the power cable hooks up. If there’s corrosion it could cause problems and it easy and free to do.

If you do end up swapping the motor consider 3phase with a vfd provided you have 220v available.

cheers,

john


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## markba633csi (Nov 14, 2019)

120 volt motors pull a fair amount of amperage- as much as 5 to 6 times the steady rating when they start up. Does it start quickly or does it struggle to start?
What is the HP rating? Is this a dual voltage motor? Wiring the motor for 240 volts and running a 240 volt line to it is recommended if the motor is 3/4 HP or higher.
Have you checked that the vents are clear and the motor isn't packed with dust?
mark


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## machPete99 (Nov 14, 2019)

You might want to post the data plate from the motor so we know more about what you have.
You can take the belt off and try spinning the motor by hand to check for bearings that might be seizing up.


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## larry2c (Nov 14, 2019)

Thanks all - regarding the motor plate, I haven't been able to find it yet but I need to get access around behind the machine for a last check. According to literature I've found on this mill, it should be a 1hp motor.

Yes, it is a dual voltage motor and I am running it as 120V (reference my original post). I do have 240 in the garage but since it was originally wired for 120, I just used it that way and it has been working fine for the last 4 years or so (admittedly, intermittent use)

I did some Googling on motors like this and it sounds like it should use a centrifugal switch to go from the start up windings to the running windings (might not be the proper terms, I'm not an electrician - it's just what I remember from the article). What I notice is that until yesterday, it always had sort of a rattling sound for the first few seconds then it would get quite with just belt & spindle noise. I assume that rattling was the centrifugal switch. Now it starts up slow but without the rattling.

I'm debating on whether I should open up the motor and see if it is just that centrifuge being hung up or something more. There is an electric motor repair place about 10 miles from me so I may call them to see what a rebuild would cost.

Regarding the suggestions to go to 240V and/or get a 3 phase motor. I'm really not sure why that would be "better" for my specific use. I know all the machines I ran in the shop were 240V 3 phase machines but I'm not running this machine on heavy cuts or extended periods of time. As I said, it has been fine for my use as a 120V machine. I can't see going to the expense of getting a 3 phase inverter or even trying to rewire it for 220V since I'm really not an electrical whiz. Just trying to learn, not start a heated debate


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## larry2c (Nov 14, 2019)

Here's the tag on the motor. My apologies for the crooked photo but I didn't want to pull the mill away from the wall so this was my best attempt. I was wrong on the HP - I thought it was 1HP but looks like I got the high power 1.5HP motor! One interesting thing I noticed is that in pictures of other people's 8X30 mill motor the capacitor is mounted on the side of the motor case. My motor does not have that - so where would the capacitor be?


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## matthewsx (Nov 14, 2019)

If the capacitor isn't on the side it's probably under the cover on the bottom. 

As for the 3 phase suggestion it's really only if your motor is shot which is unlikely given the symptoms you describe. Small 3 phase motors are often available used pretty cheap and the price for VFD's has come down dramatically. This setup would give you adjustable speed with a knob rather than changing the belt, it's the kind of thing you don't realize you needed until you have it.

Cheers,

1ohn


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## machPete99 (Nov 15, 2019)

If I read that right the tag says its pulling 19A at 115V so you are living on the edge for a 20A breaker.
The amperage will go down by 1/2 of that on 220, so you could run on 15A 220 setup.
Most motors are much happier at 220.


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## larry2c (Nov 15, 2019)

OK, I may have figured this thing out! I pulled the end cap off so I could have a look at the shaft size. To get a real measurement, I pulled the plastic fan off the shaft and the centrifugal switch just fell off! Apparently, the set screw that holds it on the shaft had fallen out at some point. I found some info on the Grizzly site that seems to match up to this motor and using that I reinstalled the centrifugal switch and put a screw in to hold it in place. It seemed to start up like it used to and after letting it run under no load for 5 minutes the motor was still cool. 

Next I will remove the switch, clean the points a bit, and then reassemble it all so I can do some load testing. Fingers crossed! I'll update once I have finished the test.


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## larry2c (Nov 15, 2019)

Well, my excitement was premature - after running it for 15 minutes or so the motor is getting hot and I can smell the "maybe" electrical smell again. Dang!

I called the local motor repair place and they said for motors that size it's cheaper to replace them than repair them - they get $115 and hour for the work. I may give Grizzly a call and see what they sell their motors for...


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## larry2c (Nov 15, 2019)

OK, I called Grizzly and talked to a tech support guy. He was helpful but there was a limit to what he could tell me. He can see the part number for the replacement motor on the G0731 machine (8X30) but he can only see the electrical specs. He has no visibility of the specs for the mounting hole pattern or shaft size & length.

By any chance, does anyone here have this Grizzly machine that could measure those things for me? I'm looking into a motor from Grainger but they don't really have any advice for me on which motor to get - and they run from the low 300's to the 700's in price. I want to get it right but I don't want to spend money I don't have to.

Thanks all!


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## machPete99 (Nov 15, 2019)

They don't tell you on the data plate so you will need to figure out for yourself if this corresponds to a standard frame size:




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						Electrical Motors - Frame Dimensions
					

Electrical motors NEMA frame dimensions.




					www.engineeringtoolbox.com
				




If it mounts by the face plate it is called a "C Mount", and specified is differently:




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						Hydra Mount
					





					www.hydramount.com
				




Once you have frame and shaft dimensions you can scour the internet, ebay, etc.


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## larry2c (Nov 15, 2019)

Looking at the Grainger online site, I find this one and it seems to be a proper match. The 145T frame size matches everything I can measure on my motor and the sealed top will keep belt dust & crud from falling down into the motor (there is a similar motor but it has vents on the top face...)






						1-1/2 HP General Purpose Motor,Capacitor-Start/Run,1725 Nameplate RPM,Voltage 115/208-230,Frame 145T
					

Motor, 1-1/2 HP, 1725 RPM, 115/208-230V




					www.grainger.com
				




What do you think? I'm trying to get things back up & running so I can finish my Christmas gift making otherwise I'd spend more time trying to see if I could salvage the old motor.


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## machPete99 (Nov 15, 2019)

You should be able to find cheaper on ebay, like this:








						1.5HP FARM DUTY Motor 7/8" Shaft, Single Phase, 115/230V, 145T , 1750 RPM, TEFC  | eBay
					

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for 1.5HP FARM DUTY Motor 7/8" Shaft, Single Phase, 115/230V, 145T , 1750 RPM, TEFC at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!



					www.ebay.com
				




Just make sure the shaft diameter and length are appropriate, some mills have custom speced motors


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## larry2c (Nov 15, 2019)

Thanks Pete - I'll take a look at that one!


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## Joeman77 (Nov 15, 2019)

If your mill motor is rated at 19 amps and you're plugging it AND your shop vac into the same outlet even if you only trip the breaker sometimes, you'll ALWAYS be getting a significant voltage drop.  Even a dedicated 20 amp circuit is probably ran with 12 gauge wire, that's 20 amps MAX. And while you might've gotten away with running them both in the past, running motors in a long term low voltage situation tends to have long term ramifications in terms of heat buildup & reduced life. You might try (short term until your Christmas projects are done) running an extension cord to the shop vac & using the dedicated circuit for the mill, that might get you through the present project.
 In the interim I would shut down the breaker and check ALL the connections from the breaker to the outlet and take a really good look at the outlet, you're looking for loose connections & signs of heat (anything discolored). Also take a good look at the plugs & cords for the Mill & Vac, run them both individually lightly loaded for a few minutes and feel along the cords for a sudden warm spot, that's a partial brake & a bad thing, but a cheap fix, just need new cord. Loose or bad connections cause voltage drops which causes heat, which causes worse connections, it's a viscous circle. I think you're going to find a loose connection or a bad outlet or plug  somewhere in the mix, clean, tighten, replace the bad spot & you're back up & going!
 I know more than a bit long winded, sorry about that. Good luck.


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## FOMOGO (Nov 15, 2019)

If it were me, before buying a new motor, I would wire it up to your 240V circuit (change your motor wiring first) and see how it performs. I think you would be pleasantly surprised.  As machPete said above your motor will be happier too. Mike


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## Joeman77 (Nov 15, 2019)

While I'm up on my soap-box, I'd replace the outlet with a one hole 20 amp unit to avoid future problems.


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## Joeman77 (Nov 15, 2019)

FOMOGO said:


> If it were me, before buying a new motor, I would wire it up to your 240V circuit (change your motor wiring first) and see how it performs. I think you would be pleasantly surprised.  As machPete said above your motor will be happier too. Mike


This would work well & probably solve any possibility of voltage drop issues to the mill, your existing wiring to the outlet could be repurposed (with a bit of red marking tape on the white wire), a new 220v outlet, breaker & plug on old cord on the mill and you're cooking with evil gas!


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## larry2c (Nov 16, 2019)

OK, I have a NEMA 10-50 220V pigtail coming today. As I mentioned before, I'm not well versed in electrical so my concern is, will the switch I currently have on the machine going to work with 220V. Below is a picture of the inside of the switch (simple on/off - no reverse). If this switch will work, what are the proper connections for the switch and the motor? If this switch won't work, would the one I grabbed a screen shot from Amazon work? They definitely have different connection lugs...
.


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## larry2c (Nov 16, 2019)

And to complete things, here's the motor connections as they are today for 120V


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## machPete99 (Nov 17, 2019)

If running 220V you want a switch that breaks both sides of the line (called "double pole"). The Woodman D4157 switch illustrated will do that. I am not sure about the one that came on your mill. Instructions for the woodman are below.



			https://d27ewrs9ow50op.cloudfront.net/manuals/d4157_m.pdf
		


You can also use one of these, which I typically use as the disconnect for a VFD setup, although its slightly more $:
Bryant 30002D manual motor controller (disconnect switch), 30A, 600 VAC, 2-pole, 15hp





						Manual Motor Controller: 30A, 2-pole, 15hp (PN# 30002D) | AutomationDirect
					

30002D - Bryant manual motor controller, non-enclosed, 30A, 600 VAC, 2-pole, 15hp, UL 508 rated.



					www.automationdirect.com


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## larry2c (Nov 18, 2019)

I have an electrician coming out tomorrow and he will do the 240V wiring/old motor hook up. I will likely need a new outlet for my 240V connection as well as the switch. Hopefully that does the trick. If not, then more $$$ will be spent.

Is the image below what he will need to properly wire the motor up (from the Grizzly user manual)?


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## machPete99 (Nov 18, 2019)

That diagram appears to have come from here, which seems to show a rotary switch for forward/reverse operation, with your diagram showing the rotary switch part.




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						Grizzly Vertical Milling Machines G0728 - Manual (Page 41)
					

Grizzly Vertical Milling Machines G0728 User Manual • 110 vac • Grizzly Power saws




					www.manualsdir.com
				




The switches mentioned earlier will just do on/off so may not be appropriate, and I am not sure that the G0728 configuration matches your actual setup.
The wiring shown in your machine pictures does not seem to line up with all of this, and the taped connections are certainly suspicious.
NEMA 10-50 implies using 50A circuit which would not be appropriate here, see the Grizzly page for correct plug/wire.
I would expect that your electrician should be able to sort this out, you should really leave it to him to be safe.
Good Luck!


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## larry2c (Nov 20, 2019)

Thanks for the reply Pete

I am going to have an electrician come out and do this right. The biggest challenge as I understand it is that the old motor has no wiring diagram on the label and no manufacturer's name either. I'm not sure if he'll be able to hook up the motor to 240V properly without the diagram.


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## machPete99 (Nov 20, 2019)

If your guy is good he might be able to figure it out (or possibly blow it up...):




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						Switching a motor between 240 and 120 volts
					





					woodgears.ca
				




Also see (in case runs wrong direction):




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						Reversing single phase induction motors
					





					woodgears.ca
				




Would be better to find the diagram... are you sure its not on the back of the cover somewhere?


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## machPete99 (Nov 21, 2019)

It would also be useful to draw out all of the connections that are currently inside the motor, with the wire labels, that appear in your post #21. The capacitor will be in series with the starter winding, which is likely the 2 wires on the left. The other 3 wires are likely the 2 main windings, probably already tied in series inside the motor. From such a diagram you could probably figure out the needed configuration for 220V (main windings in series, starter in parallel with one main winding).


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## larry2c (Feb 17, 2020)

Hi all - I know it's been just about forever since I last responded on this thread but long story short, I wanted to get a real electrician in to help me and that took time (holidays + life). I finally got a great electrician and he helped me get back on line. I bought a motor (Marathon 1.5 HP 240/120) from Grainger and today I finally got it wired up. I'm running 240V now and the mill is purring like a kitten.

For the record, the electrician told me the old motor was shot and switching it over to 240V would only have prolonged the death march. I hated spending the $$ on a new motor but now that it's behind me, the new setup should last as long as I do and I'm very happy.






Thanks to all for your responses and support. Hope I can return the favor some day!


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## 316 steel (Dec 2, 2020)

larry2c said:


> Hi all - I know it's been just about forever since I last responded on this thread but long story short, I wanted to get a real electrician in to help me and that took time (holidays + life). I finally got a great electrician and he helped me get back on line. I bought a motor (Marathon 1.5 HP 240/120) from Grainger and today I finally got it wired up. I'm running 240V now and the mill is purring like a kitten.
> 
> For the record, the electrician told me the old motor was shot and switching it over to 240V would only have prolonged the death march. I hated spending the $$ on a new motor but now that it's behind me, the new setup should last as long as I do and I'm very happy.
> 
> ...


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## 316 steel (Dec 2, 2020)

Sometimes I love the internet. This is what’s it’s all about, people helping each other with their knowledge and experience. Well done everyone


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