# New member working on a Southbend 13"



## 56Safari (Apr 28, 2021)

Just joined the community here so I figured I'd start a post with what I'm working on and how I got here.  I'm not a machinist just a hobbyist with limited knowledge in machining, I took some basic machining courses in college 15 years ago and I really enjoyed it.  I had been wanting a lathe ever since I left college, and then about 2 years ago I found a lot of machines at auction with really crappy photos showing what appeared to be 2 dirty, rusty Southbend 13" lathes, a drill press, band saw and radial arm saw.  I ended up winning the lot for $2600 sight unseen, I knew it was a bit of a gamble but figured if they were junk I could part them out and likely break even.

Luckily, they ended up being in much better shape than they look.  These were used in a technical school in a really small town in the middle of nowhere, they were pulled out of service and placed in the back of a pole barn with an open front for 2 years.  So they were left covered in oil and just collected a bunch of grime over the years.. They really don't look like they've been abused, just neglected.. but luckily, they were put away covered from head to toe in oil which really helped preserve them... The rust on on the ways is actually metal debris sitting on top of the layer of grime that was protecting the ways..  They came with taper attachments, drawbar, collet rack, collets and some other stuff, No tool posts though.  It looks like they never pulled the chucks, because there were no witness marks on the ways near the spindle and even though its a d1-4 cam lock, it was stuck on there pretty damn good.      Long story short, I put new power switches in the saw and drill press and they both fired right up, after that I sold the bandsaw and I gave the powermatic 1150 to my dad (I already have an 1150VS).  I ended up selling the lathe for $1500, which was probably a little low but I really needed it out of the way...  After all was said and done I ended up getting 1 lathe for free minus gas and my time spent driving.












So recently I've started cleaning it up, cleaning the bed in between the ways took forever, it was caked on thick... I disassembled the tailstock and the compound cross slide with taper attachment because almost everything was seized up from the grime.  I stripped all the paint and just repainted those items, I'm currently waiting for my jug of Mobil DTE 26 for re-assembly as well as a replacement thrust bearing for the crossfeed screw and the rubber washer to prevent binding the screw in the tailstock.











I'm going to move at the end of this year, so I don't want to tear much further into the machine until I get to the new place.  I would love to get my VFD wired up and play around with it for a bit to see how it runs, but I also don't want to damage anything as I plan to replace all the wicks, etc..  Spindle is smooth and has had oil in the cups the entire time.

Should I pull the apron off and clean it all out? I'm hesitating to remove the apron because it moves really smooth.  I will dig into it eventually, but would love to postpone that until after I move the machine.

If the spindle oilers are holding full with oil, is that likely good enough to fire it up and test it without replacing the wicks?  I've been rotating the spindle by hand every time I go into the shop in the hopes that its spreading oil throughout it.

Any other checks anyone would recommend doing before attempting to power the lathe?

Somehow I lost the pin for the handle on the crossfeed slide, is there a good place to get a replacement?  or will a piece of tig filler rod or something like that work?

Does anyone know the correct size oilers for the gear box?  mine are completely smashed in there and I'd love to buy some new ones to replace them with before I pull them out.

I purchased a Bostar toolholder, I need to find someone to machine the nut down for me.  I also picked up a 4 Jaw Buck 1308 chuck (still need to make a D1-4 backing plate, I plan to make a backing plate for it once I get the lathe running).   I got a bunch of free HSS bits and some live and dead centers from my dads friend... hoping to get a mill once I move to colorado.. hopefully I'm not dumb enough to buy one right before I move .

I also purchased a TECO L510 VFD.  My dad advised me on that purchase when I gave him the motor specs, hoping that will work just fine for what I'm doing.  He knows a lot more about electrical than I do

Anyhow, looking foward to getting this thing up and running!


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## markba633csi (Apr 28, 2021)

Great deal! If the spindle spins freely I would go ahead and power it up.  I would run it thru it's paces and find out if everything works.  You can substitute whatever fits for the missing cross slide handle pin.  Ebay is a source of parts, as well as our members
-Mark


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## martik777 (Apr 28, 2021)

Make sure you use light oil in the spindle (10W or less)

You can make the t-nut on the lathe even with the 3 jaw by face cutting the rectangle in 4 passes after roughing it out with a hacksaw or cutoff wheel.  You could also make a round t-nut but it won't be as strong and will place more stress on the compound

That pin is likely a taper pin .250"/ft taper which can be made on the lathe (compound angle about 1/2 degree iirc)

Here's a detailed rebuild guide on an older 13":


			http://www.lathes.co.uk/southbend/1954-south-bend-rebuild.pdf


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## 56Safari (Apr 28, 2021)

martik777 said:


> Make sure you use light oil in the spindle (10W or less)
> 
> You can make the t-nut on the lathe even with the 3 jaw by face cutting the rectangle in 4 passes after roughing it out with a hacksaw or cutoff wheel.  You could also make a round t-nut but it won't be as strong and will place more stress on the compound
> 
> ...


Thanks, yeah I ordered a gallon of Mobil velocite #10 for the spindle.. I was actually going to try to get a syringe or something and empty the oilers first and then re-fill them once it comes in just to be on the safe sides

I thought about doing making my own Tnut, but this is my only machine, and I didn’t get the original SB tool post so I don’t have anyway to hold a tool currently..  I might pop into the local engine machine shop down the street one day and see if I can leave it with them and get it cut when they have some spare time.

I just found that pdf right before I posted.. wish I had found that 6 months ago!


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## benmychree (Apr 28, 2021)

It appears that it was built in the 1950s
600T is 1947
2781T is 1950
This is all that the serial number book shows for 13" T series machines, copyright 1959, rev. 1963.


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## martik777 (Apr 28, 2021)

Closer to 1975 I think, see the 15041T in this link:




__





						South Bend Lathe Works - Serial Number Registry | VintageMachinery.org
					





					vintagemachinery.org


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## martik777 (Apr 28, 2021)

56Safari said:


> Thanks, yeah I ordered a gallon of Mobil velocite #10 for the spindle.. I was actually going to try to get a syringe or something and empty the oilers first and then re-fill them once it comes in just to be on the safe sides



Just unscrew  and remove the oilers and most of the oil should run out


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## 56Safari (Apr 28, 2021)

benmychree said:


> It appears that it was built in the 1950s
> 600T is 1947
> 2781T is 1950
> This is all that the serial number book shows for 13" T series machines, copyright 1959, rev. 1963.


Interesting... I did a brief search on Vintagemachinery.org and I was thinking it was a 70's model based on the link below and the power controls... however, I didn't really dig too far into it.  



			South Bend Lathe Works Serial Number Registry - Lathe No. 15041T | VintageMachinery.org


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## 56Safari (Apr 28, 2021)

martik777 said:


> Closer to 1975 I think, see the 15041T in this link:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


haha.. beat me to it, thats the 1 entry I found that I was loosely referencing my machine date on


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## martik777 (Apr 28, 2021)

56Safari said:


> haha.. beat me to it, thats the 1 entry I found that I was loosely referencing my machine date on


It was the more modern font of the gearbox threading chart  that gave it away


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## 56Safari (Apr 28, 2021)

martik777 said:


> It was the more modern font of the gearbox threading chart  that gave it away


I didn’t even think of that.. Also not pictured Are a lot of collets stamped made in Germany but also stamped S.B.L. .. figured that was more likely to lean toward a later date


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## SLK001 (Apr 28, 2021)

martik777 said:


> Just unscrew  and remove the oilers and most of the oil should run out



There's supposed to be a drain plug right below the oilers.


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## SLK001 (Apr 28, 2021)

The bed cross webbing points to the later years.  Does the bed have a "Flame Hardened" tag?

Yes, I see that it does.  Dates the lathe to post 1958-ish.


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## 56Safari (Apr 28, 2021)

Thanks, is it this hex screw here?


SLK001 said:


> There's supposed to be a drain plug right below the oilers.the no





SLK001 said:


> There's supposed to be a drain plug right below the oilers.


Thanks, is it just the hex screw directly below the oiler?


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## Ulma Doctor (Apr 28, 2021)

sweet machine!


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## SLK001 (Apr 29, 2021)

56Safari said:


> Thanks, is it just the hex screw directly below the oiler?



Yes, that's it.

Before you get going in your tear down, get the book _*A Guide to Renovating the South Bend Lathe Models 10L - 13" - 14 ½" - 16" *_by Ilion Industrial Services on ebay.  You might also want to pick up their *rebuild kit*.

The book gives you valuable insight on exactly *how *to tear down your lathe.  The rebuild kit gives you the consumables you will also need.


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## 56Safari (Apr 29, 2021)

Thanks, yeah I actually ordered that rebuild kit and manual on Sunday because it has the replacement washer for the tailstock..  it should be here Saturday.   My tailstock was bound up when I got it and that washer was disintegrated.. Took a week of soaking in oil and gently persuading it to pop free.  And I found the thrust bearing for the cross slide here, MSC - Crossfeed thrust bearing... all the ones on ebay were waaay too high, I added a gallon of way oil to average down the shipping costs, because they wanted $12 to ship a bearing.


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## wswells (Apr 29, 2021)

SN: 15385T, This is a 1976 S series lathe, the "T" in the serial number is for 13-inch.
N-K-R-T-F-H
9(N)-10K(K)-10L&R(R)-13L&R(T)-14-1/2(F)-16(H)

The T series lathes had the older total loss top-oiling headstock. 

"Does anyone know the correct size oilers for the gear box? mine are completely smashed in there and I'd love to buy some new ones to replace them with before I pull them out."

SBL-155x20
Gits 501 - Beaded Drive in, Style G – Steel, Trivalent Zinc Plating

--Drive-In Hole Diameter--Drive Diameter--Drive Length--Overall Height--Assembly Clearance--Item #
--------------------------------Min--Max--                
----------1/4------------------.253--.255--------5/32-----------13/32----------------11/16----------00501

Steve


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## wswells (Apr 29, 2021)

That's wrong, I looked in the older parts manual, I believe it might a Gits 330.
Let me look it up again,

Steve


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## Janderso (Apr 29, 2021)

Sweet lathe, take your time.


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## DavidR8 (Apr 29, 2021)

Welcome to the forum and congratulations on an great lathe!


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## wswells (Apr 29, 2021)

I can't find the 330 listed, but the 501 should interchange for the gearbox oiler cups, same drive shank height  0.156, same total length 0.406.
Make a small driver to fit inside the cup and have the top size the same as the top OD. Probably 0.195/0.250 should work.

Steve


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## 56Safari (Apr 29, 2021)

wswells said:


> I can't find the 330 listed, but the 501 should interchange for the gearbox oiler cups, same drive shank height  0.156, same total length 0.406.
> Make a small driver to fit inside the cup and have the top size the same as the top OD. Probably 0.195/0.250 should work.
> 
> Steve


thanks.. I found the 501 here Gits 501 for $6.43,  And they have a store pretty close to me.., so I may pop over one day and see if they have them/can order them.  I looked at ordering the 501's through MSC and it was $35 for 2 of them shipped, which seems ridiculous


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## wswells (Apr 29, 2021)

"Somehow I lost the pin for the handle on the cross-feed slide, is there a good place to get a replacement? or will a piece of tig filler rod or something like that work?"

The "Dutchman Key" under the handle nut on the T-F-H size lathes:
SBL: 160 x 19
1/8" x 3/8" dowel pin.

Steve


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## 56Safari (Apr 30, 2021)

I vaguely recall saying something like... "I don't want to take the lathe apart any further, I just want to get it running and see how it runs".... Well, this morning the South bend manual and consumables arrived a day early, but I found out the Gallon of Mobil DTE26 got lost in the mail and now I have to re-order it again...  Annoyed, I went into the shop and started taking off the electrical boxes so I can start mapping out how I'm going to layout/wire up the VFD and get some parts ordered.. But after seeing how many chips were behind the box, and knowing that I have another week to wait, I decided to tear into the lathe a little further..  Hopefully I'll get most of it cleaned up by the end of the weekend... maybe get the doors and big pieces cleaned off and re-painted by mid week next week.

Everything came apart pretty easy, 1 of the screws holding the saddle down to the apron was seized, but eventually after twisting the tips on 3 of my big ass screwdrivers I broke out the impact driver, ground an old chisel to fit the slotted screw perfectly and it came loose......  I would like to replace those slotted screws with hex cap screws eventually, that might be a good project to tackle once I get it back together.

the back gears and tumbler are all caked in old grease, in fact the gearbox levers would hardly slide until after I pulled the gearbox off.. but all of the gears move, I haven’t seen any missing, damaged or chipped teeth upon initial inspection..  but it seems that old grease is making it tough to move.. per the chart, it recommends oil for both.. so I’m going to guess they just made a call to grease the gears heavily since they were student machines..  I’m going to try to clean all of it out without disassembling the gearbox.. I’m debating whether to put fresh grease in or just use oil as recommended... I won’t be using it every day, so maybe a little grease would be good if there will be long periods of inactivity?  (I travel a lot for work, next year we start back on the road)

I'm working on putting together a list of electrical items to order, I also I need to order a dial indicator and a dial test indicator.  I have a NOGA arm with a magnetic base, but the only indicator I have is a COMPAQ test indicator in .002mm graduations (got it for free)... I was thinking about going with something like this for a dial indicator Mitutoyo digital dial, and I'm not quite sure on the test indicator yet, let me know what you all would recommend for either of them..  I don't mind spending SOME money on them but I don't want to break the bank just yet.. I need to get my feet wet again.


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## MyLilMule (May 13, 2021)

Grease is a bad idea. It’s sticky and attracts all sorts of nasty stuff. 

Just use the oil. It doesn’t need to be oiled if it’s just sitting there anyway. I mean, not if you’re using it every few weeks or even months. It’ll be fine. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## 56Safari (May 14, 2021)

MyLilMule said:


> Grease is a bad idea. It’s sticky and attracts all sorts of nasty stuff.
> 
> Just use the oil. It doesn’t need to be oiled if it’s just sitting there anyway. I mean, not if you’re using it every few weeks or even months. It’ll be fine.
> 
> ...


yeah, I'm starting to realize that now that I've gotten into the gearing..  theres a bunch of junk collecting in the grease thats been flung off the gears, and all the old grease has hardened, so I'm taking my time getting everything cleaned out... I ended up stripping all the paint off the lathe this week, going for a full respray soon.


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