# Rollout Wheel (Welding Positioner)



## erikmannie (Mar 22, 2022)

Today, I received a rollout wheel kit today from HK Fabrication in Conway, AR.

I will post pictures of what I received.

I get to weld this up myself. I also get to assemble a trailer spindle to a trailer hub. See pictures of these trailer parts that I bought from Tractor Supply.

The used plain back 8” 3J scroll chuck that I bought should bolt right on, but the chuck does not include a lathe chuck key or mounting bolts.

If I make my own lathe chuck key (which I prefer), is mild steel good enough? I won’t be tightening the chuck too much, as the chuck is only holding the pipe (or tubing) for welding, & never for machining. Maybe I could make the body of the chuck key out of 4140 prehard.

I will get to choose which welding process to use for welding this rollout wheel kit. The last project I did was all SMAW, so I won’t choose that.

I just got a new tank of acetylene that I haven’t tried yet. I always love to gas weld, but I have been doing a lot of gas welding lately. As such, I should choose GTAW or GMAW because it has been awhile since I have used either one of those processes.

I will choose GTAW (never my favorite process for carbon steel) because I think my wireless foot pedal is out of batteries.


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## erikmannie (Mar 22, 2022)

Rollout Wheel Kit:









						DIY Rollout Wheel Kit - H&K Fabrication
					

Don't overpay on a rollout wheel, H&K produces a high quality DIY Rollout Wheel Kit (welding positioner) at a very reasonable price. Our kits take about 30 minutes to fit and tack together. With 3 different functions (2G, 3G, 6G) and fine tune leveler for adjustments in between, our kit is a...




					hkfabrication.com
				




Spindle & Hub:


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## erikmannie (Mar 22, 2022)

What I received from HK Fabrication. All of the plate is 1/4”:


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## erikmannie (Mar 22, 2022)

I bought a used Bison chuck for $324 delivered.




I was thinking about buying a very economical chuck from mainland China for as low as $150 delivered, but I have been trying to only buy Chinese products as a last resort.

Also, the Chinese chucks are advertised as both 8” and 200mm; most are marked 200.

The Bison is 8”, so the Bison is pretty much guaranteed to bolt right on.

Here is what the manufacturer (HK Fabrication) when I inquired about this 8” versus 200mm question, telling them that I was probably going to buy a Bison:

“Bison shouldn’t be an issue. We rarely have them not line up. Normally it’s really old ones or China knock offs.”

My point here is that I just wanted to go to with a sure thing (i.e. the Bison bolting on to the rollout wheel).


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## erikmannie (Mar 23, 2022)

This rollout wheel kit is designed to fit in a 2” I.D. trailer hitch, usually in the back of a pickup truck.

I will be putting my rollout wheel inside a 2” I.D., .25” wall square tubing arm on a fixture stand. This arm will be about 36” long, so the arm *must* be supported by a sturdy, height adjustable stand.

The load of rollout wheel kit + chuck + pipe can be up to 120 pounds extending out as much as 5 feet (!), so if the support stand fails, then the whole work bench will come tumbling over. If I bolt the work bench to the wall (which I will), I’m sure that the plate would pull out the plywood bench top if the support stand were to fail.

My fixture stand will be used indoors sometimes (only for GTAW, & bolted to a welding table), & outdoors most of the time (all other welding processes, & bolted to a wooden work bench).

The only thing that I will leave out in the weather (covered with a tarp) is the base and mast. My fixture stand has 3 arms, & there is no need for the arms to be out in the weather.


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## erikmannie (Mar 23, 2022)

Relevant videos:






and






I like this video from the 7:40 mark:






Finally, this one from the 4:01 mark:


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## stupoty (Mar 23, 2022)

You should keep an eye out for a lower price chuck, bison is pritty up there with the finest stuff.

Might be a good horse traiding thing for somone who needs a chuck upgrade

My 40's or 50's bison 8 inch still repeats to 3th or better.

Unless its a had a lot of late days and no suppers and been put away wet as some may say 

Rotator thing looks interesting.

Stu


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## aliva (Mar 23, 2022)

Coincidence I'm going to be building a welding positioner later this year, stay tuned for the build


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## erikmannie (Mar 23, 2022)

aliva said:


> Coincidence I'm going to be building a welding positioner later this year, stay tuned for the build


Is your positioner going to have a motor, or is it manually operated like mine?


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## aliva (Mar 24, 2022)

The rotation will be motorized  with speed control. It will also have a motorized tilt, along with food pedal control. The foot pedal can be unplugged for contestant non stop rotation.


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## erikmannie (Mar 24, 2022)

aliva said:


> The rotation will be motorized  with speed control. It will also have a motorized tilt, along with food pedal control. The foot pedal can be unplugged for contestant non stop rotation.


I want to make sure I follow that build thread.


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

I am working on this today. I already assembled the spindle to the hub (see photos), & got my TIG machine going. I have not done much TIG welding in over a year!

I have 3/32” lanthanated tungsten, a 3/32” gas lens, & my welder is set to 210A max for the 1/4” plate. It goes without saying that my welder is set to DCEN, as I am welding on carbon steel. My 100% Argon is set to 15 cfh.

Today I’m going to see how far I get  in welding up the rollout wheel. I don’t have to go to work until 4:30 PM.

I won’t have the steel for the arm or height adjustable stand until Tuesday. That is going to cost about $250, & I won’t have that money until next week. I have to take the morning off of work to go down to the steel yard because they are not open on the weekend.

I expect that I am going to have to remove or reverse the 4 bolts in the trailer hub. I will find that out when I follow along with the instructional video.


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

I want to point out that this vendor is very responsive to questions. I have texted him 2 questions, and both times he responded almost immediately. Much appreciated!

My first question was about the bolt hole pattern on a metric (200mm vs. 8”) chuck. The second question was clarifying that I have the new style kit, & I had to make sure to watch the most current instructional video.

This is the video that I am following along with:


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

I cleaned the 3/32” tungsten, filler rod (3/32” ER70S-2) as well as the (1/4” plate) base material with acetone. Here I am ready for my first tack weld:


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

These are the first TIG tacks on carbon steel that I have made in a year!


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

Pictures of the action:




(Dipped the tungsten)


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

This is the next bit:


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

I just had to cut out that last tack weld because it wasn’t flush. Here is a picture of it flush:


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## aliva (Mar 26, 2022)

Looks like your TIG skills are still there after a year off.


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

Continuing the work…


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

aliva said:


> Looks like your TIG skills are still there after a year off.


I can tack weld 1/4” carbon steel!


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

This is not where I had planned to tack it, but the situation called for keeping the assembly clamped closed.




There is some undercut on at least 3 of these tack welds:


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

I tested that it can go vertical, horizontal or 45°:


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

Up next is tacking this assembly:


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

That gets me to here:


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

This is next. I covered the spacer because I don’t want to confuse anybody. The spacer that I am using is another part of the kit that does not belong there, so I covered it.




I dipped the tungsten again + minor undercut, lower right:


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

That gets it to here:


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

I am welding this in the fixture because I have to tack in one side, & then pound the other side out square.

You can see in the photo that the near side is flush, & the far side is pushed down a little.


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

Let’s see if I can pound this straight:


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

I think I got it:


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

I welded the bolts on to the handles. I did *not* grind the finish off the bolts, & the offgassing from the vaporizing coating on the bolts contaminated the tungsten.


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

Here are the welded on nuts:


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

This gets me to here:


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

I am knocking out the stock hub studs:


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

I had to shorten the spindle, and now I need to go to work for the night.


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## erikmannie (Mar 26, 2022)

This is how far I got today. The only other tack welding that I need to do is to weld the spindle on to the fixture.




After everything is tack welded, I can go in and do all the permanent welds.

The rollout wheel gets bolted on  with spacers.




The lathe chuck gets bolted on to the rollout wheel. The lathe chuck arrives Wednesday.


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## erikmannie (Mar 27, 2022)

I am off to a wacky start today. Apparently I couldn’t do better than this for a spacer.

I am tack welding the spindle to the assembly. It needs to be square.




I know that looks very stupid, but look what I get to weld on.


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## erikmannie (Mar 27, 2022)

Here are the tack welds. Now I need to check straightness in a major way.


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## erikmannie (Mar 27, 2022)

Good thing I checked. It was significantly off. This is now square:




I had to bust one of the tacks to square it up.


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## erikmannie (Mar 27, 2022)

This is somewhere between tack welded and finished.


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## erikmannie (Mar 27, 2022)

All 4 of the bolts are 3/16” too long. It is so easy to shorten bolts on a lathe with a 5C collet.


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## erikmannie (Mar 27, 2022)

I ran a 1/2-13 tap through this because it was a little deformed from the welding:


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## erikmannie (Mar 27, 2022)

Here are some pictures with the whole thing tacked together. Now I’m going to go through and weld it out.


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## woodchucker (Mar 27, 2022)

looking good.. I think I would like to have a way to rotate it without using my spare hand. I suck at welding, so I need a second hand to steady sometimes. I would probably want a motor, barring that, a way of moving it incrementally with a foot pedal ... think drum cymbal pedal...


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## NC Rick (Mar 27, 2022)

erikmannie said:


> This is somewhere between tack welded and finished.
> 
> View attachment 401977


Files as shims just feels wrong


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## erikmannie (Mar 29, 2022)

Here are the components welded out. I TIG welded everything, & then I ground the welds down flush (except the weld bead on the spindle). This was a lot of work.

I am aware that it isn’t even anywhere close to looking perfect, but I had to keep in mind what it is being used for. We’ll see what this looks like when it’s all painted and being used.


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## erikmannie (Mar 29, 2022)

I did another test assembly after all that welding. It is now ready for paint!


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## WobblyHand (Mar 29, 2022)

Looks very nice!  Better than professional.  
Wondering why you ground off a lot of your welding?  I mean, a stack of dimes is a pretty sight, don't you think?


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## erikmannie (Mar 29, 2022)

Had it looked like a stack of dimes, I would have left it on there.

Seriously, though, the joints were not seams. Here is what I was welding up; all of the material is 1/4”.

When I know that I am going to grind the welding work down flush, I can focus 100% of my effort on penetration.


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## WobblyHand (Mar 29, 2022)

erikmannie said:


> Had it looked like a stack of dimes, I would have left it on there.
> 
> Seriously, though, the joints were not seams. I will upload a zoomed image of what I was welding. It was more like filling holes.


From your earlier posts I recall the little mouse ear holes.  I can see they wouldn't be all that attractive.

Although I probably wouldn't bother with a lot of grinding on a fixture, (unless it was butt ugly,) I can say what you have shown looks really well done.  Attention to detail is quite apparent.


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## erikmannie (Mar 29, 2022)

WobblyHand said:


> Looks very nice!  Better than professional.
> Wondering why you ground off a lot of your welding?  I mean, a stack of dimes is a pretty sight, don't you think?





WobblyHand said:


> From your earlier posts I recall the little mouse ear holes.  I can see they wouldn't be all that attractive.
> 
> Although I probably wouldn't bother with a lot of grinding on a fixture, (unless it was butt ugly,) I can say what you have shown looks really well done.  Attention to detail is quite apparent.


I assure you, my aggressive stitch welds over the holes were butt ugly.


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## erikmannie (Mar 30, 2022)

So the rollout wheel is on 2” O.D. square tubing like a trailer.

The pictures below show a length of 1/4” wall, 2” I.D. square tubing that is mitered for a sleeve. I am going to weld this up now.

The rollout wheel slips into this 2” I.D. square tubing, & the sleeve goes on the main mast of my welding fixture stand.


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## erikmannie (Mar 30, 2022)

Here are the parts getting their first coat of spray paint:


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## erikmannie (Apr 10, 2022)

I got sidetracked for about 2 weeks going over the used lathe chuck that I bought.

I did a very thorough cleaning on the chuck, & I had to bore out the chuck center hole from 2.167” to 2.55” in order for the chuck to fit over the hub on the positioner.

Here are 2 pictures taken after I refinished the chuck body, cleaned all the parts, and applied Evapo-Rust & oil.

Evapo-Rust is an amazing product!


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## erikmannie (Apr 10, 2022)

Here is the Bison 8” 3-jaw scroll chuck being reassembled. All my cleaning work paid off, & the action is very smooth.


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## erikmannie (Apr 10, 2022)

When I tried to mount the chuck on to the rollout wheel, the holes did not line up. I had to drill out the holes up to 1/2” diameter.

I got very lucky that the chuck jaws clear the dust cap on the hub, although spacers would have fixed that issue.


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## erikmannie (Apr 10, 2022)

The chuck looks really small on the positioner.

Here are pictures from the test fitting. I still need to break it down to touch up the paint.


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## erikmannie (Apr 10, 2022)

Here are some pictures of the “rollout wheel arm” on the fixture stand. 

I still have to build a base that bolts the fixture stand to the floor.


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## erikmannie (Apr 17, 2022)

Here is the rollout wheel on the finished fixture stand and base:


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