# Precision Matthews PM-1030V-wQCTP- ( and w/2axDRO??? )



## wachuko (Jul 20, 2021)

After two years trying to decide, finally ready to pull the trigger on a metal lathe.

Thread when I was looking at just getting a small one to just learn: Feedback on first lathe - 8x14 600W variable speed lathe CJ210A  - But you all quickly convinced me to save my money and buy something that I could use for most of the stuff I needed to do.  Even though, at the time, I just wanted to get my hands dirty starting with something.   It was great feedback, and even if I wanted to start playing, it was worth waiting and using the money for something that I could give it better use.

So at the end of that thread, back in Jan 29, 2020, I had decided on a Precision Matthews PM-1030V-wQCTP-w/2axDRO.

Since then I have been watching videos, reading, trying to learn how, what, when to use a lathe...  I started watching again the videos from recommended by Aaron_W:

Blondihacks Lathe Skills video series and that has answered a few questions I had.

In that previous thread I started to ask about additional tools/accessories I should get with the new lathe... since that thread was for feedback on a smaller lathe, and since I had decided on a Precision Matthews lathe, decided to start a new thread here.

Here is what I have so far on my list to buy:

The lathe, of course.  A Precision Matthews PM-1030V-wQCTP-w/2axDRO - the thing that I keep coming back to is on the DRO option.  Is it necessary for a newbie like me?  It is an additional US$500.00 and I just want to make sure that it is an added bonus that will get used a lot and worth getting or ??? Or skip it and save the $$$ for more tooling.

Anyway... the list:


Precision Matthews PM-1030V-wQCTP- (w/2axDRO ??)
PM-1030V-STAND w/Storage
AXA Master Turning/Boring Tool Set
0-1/2 Ultra Precision Keyless Drill Chuck MT2
Slim MT-2 Body Live Center
Spare Back Plate, 5" Diameter, for PM-1030V Lathes - feedback I got, so decided to get one (if they become available by the time I order) : 



> Spare backplate could be handy as it seems like they are not easy to find outside of PM. You may need one if you decide to add a different chuck, like an ER or 5C collet chuck.




Being a newbie, the idea of grinding my own cutters was a scary thought... but I need to learn that as well.  So added to the list a few 3/8" and 1/2" HSS tooling blanks.
HHIP 2000-7010 1/16 W x 1/2H x 4-1/2 Inch 5% Cobalt P1 Style Parallel Type Cut-Off Blade and the holder for it AXA #7 250-107 Quick Change Universal Parting Blade Holder
Norton NTFB14 Stone India Aluminum Oxide Oil Stone 1/4" X 1" X 4 Fine Grit
I have a couple dial indicators, and in the video from Blondihacks I saw that she had one with a 3D printed base on the lathe ways.  I want to make that as well.  I do have a cheap 3D printer, but found this video and seems like a great project  (to practice using my mill) to make my own base out of aluminum - Making a Lathe Ways Dial Indicator Holder

Apologies for the long post... So the questions/requests that I have:

1. DRO or not?  I do not mind spending the additional 500.00.  That is not the issue.  I do mind wasting that money if there is really no need for it.

2. Anyone has a photo of a Precision Matthews PM-1030V-wQCTP with the DRO installed?  I can't seem to find any photos of that setup.

3. Besides those I already listed, what additional tools should I get to start with?

Anything that I am missing?  And I can't go with a larger one... not financially feasible with all the other stuff that I want for my garage.  The next size would put me in the over US$5K range... What I have listed above is right around US$3,658.93

Thank you!


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## RJSakowski (Jul 20, 2021)

I have a DRO on my machines with the exception of my Atlas/Craftsman 6 x 18 which I rarely use any more.  In my experience, anyone who has added a DRO wouldn't go back to using a machine without one.  My lathe has a 3 xis DRO with the third axis being the tailstock.

It looks like your list is fairly complete for a start.  There will eventually be other tooling.  You will decide on that once you get familiuar with your lathe.  I have a Grizzly G0602 which is a 10 x 22 lathe and have had very few instances where it has restricted my ability to fabricate something. IMO it's a good size.


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## Christianstark (Jul 20, 2021)

Please take with a grain of salt, but a DRO is a quality of life item. People made precision parts for a long time before a DRO was even possible. It is an aid that will make cutting with precision easier and quicker, but is it necessary? Nope.

Grain of salt disclaimer - I don't even own my lathe yet, and I DID opt for the DRO.

Second grain of salt comment - Have you looked at used local machines that are larger, and have more capability than the 1030V?


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## Christianstark (Jul 20, 2021)

Enco 12 x 36 lathe - tools - by owner - sale
					

Very Nice Enco shop lathe. 12" swing and 36" bed length. Serial no. 1371. Hardened and ground bedways. Recently replaced original motor with American made Baldor. The motor is currently wired for...



					orlando.craigslist.org
				




Less than $3000


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## wachuko (Jul 20, 2021)

What lathe are you going with?



Christianstark said:


> Second grain of salt comment - Have you looked at used local machines that are larger, and have more capability than the 1030V?





Christianstark said:


> Enco 12 x 36 lathe - tools - by owner - sale
> 
> 
> Very Nice Enco shop lathe. 12" swing and 36" bed length. Serial no. 1371. Hardened and ground bedways. Recently replaced original motor with American made Baldor. The motor is currently wired for...
> ...



I do not know enough to know if I am buying something good or paying for someone else problems.  And I do not know anyone locally (Orlando, FL) that could help me with that.  Reason why I have looked at local used equipment and keep going back to getting a new one.  At least I know that with a new one, any screw ups are mine... 

I do not see a tool post on that lathe for sale... so looks like it is missing stuff... and that is only what I can tell from the photos.  Does not say what model number (only serial) and year.  Being new, I am just scared of jumping on a used/unknown to me tool...

I see that @macardoso got one of those that he rebuilt.... 









						Enco 12x36 Lathe Rebuild (Picture Heavy!)
					

Hi All, I recently purchased an Enco110-2033 gap bed lathe from a industrial surplus business for around $1100. It's more than some have spent on a lathe like this, but it was available nearby my house and in beautiful condition under the significant amount of grime that had coated it.  This...




					www.hobby-machinist.com


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## Aurelius (Jul 20, 2021)

You didn't specify what you are planning on making, but I'm currently accumulating tools ahead of my lathe getting here sometime in November.
You said you already have a mill, so I will assume you have calipers (digital or otherwise) but if you don't pick one up.
A good set of drill bits is also something that you should have around.  I got a Norseman set based on a bunch of recommendations here and on other forums.  
A boring bar could also be useful depending on intended projects. 
I'm planniong on doing pens so I picked up the necessary taps and dies and will be getting the tailstock de holder as well.  Something to consider as well.


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## wachuko (Jul 20, 2021)

Aurelius said:


> You didn't specify what you are planning on making, but I'm currently accumulating tools ahead of my lathe getting here sometime in November.
> You said you already have a mill, so I will assume you have calipers (digital or otherwise) but if you don't pick one up.
> A good set of drill bits is also something that you should have around.  I got a Norseman set based on a bunch of recommendations here and on other forums.
> A boring bar could also be useful depending on intended projects.
> I'm planniong on doing pens so I picked up the necessary taps and dies and will be getting the tailstock de holder as well.  Something to consider as well.



Might sound crazy, but I do not have any specific use for it.  I just want to learn to make stuff.  So small stuff for the motorcycle, or cars, or even venture into trying to make small steam engines...   Figured that when I retire, anyone wanting to see me, will have to go into the workshop to look for me... 

I do have a first project for it... buying a 20-ton press and making these improvements:






I have a small mill that I am converting to CNC ( My G0704 CNC conversion thread ) , again, to also learn how to work with a CNC machine...







There is no logic to my madness...

I will add boring bars and a good set of drill bits to the list.  Thank you.


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## yota (Jul 20, 2021)

I had a harbor freight press.  the large pin under the bottle that does the actual work bent over.  actually it was the C channel the pin was welded to that bent and angled the pin over.  I could have rebuilt it but I dismantled the frame for steel stock and kept the bottle to use as a jack.  found this on Craig's for the same money.  US made and fully welded.


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## wachuko (Jul 20, 2021)

yota said:


> I had a harbor freight press.  the large pin under the bottle that does the actual work bent over.  actually it was the C channel the pin was welded to that bent and angled the pin over.  I could have rebuilt it but I dismantled the frame for steel stock and kept the bottle to use as a jack.  found this on Craig's for the same money.  US made and fully welded.



I was going to also take on this project to improve on that.  All stuff that would be great as projects to learn when I get the lathe.


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## yota (Jul 20, 2021)

if you do that work, I would replace the soft press formed C channel with one that is extruded steel.


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## wachuko (Jul 20, 2021)

yota said:


> if you do that work, I would replace the soft press formed C channel with one that is extruded steel.



That is what he did in the video as well... he reinforced the press by building a new base for the bottle and replaced the C channel.  He used the piston from the original bottle to have an adjustable press surface.  Pretty cool.







But after your post, I started to look in Craiglist and Facebook Market Place... many used 20-ton press available for a fraction of what it would cost to make all these mods to the HF unit... so I will just get a used one.  I will have a more robust press and I can still get to do a few of the small upgrades.  

Thank you for making me look.


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## Christianstark (Jul 20, 2021)

wachuko said:


> That is what he did in the video as well... he reinforced the press by building a new base for the bottle and replaced the C channel.  He used the piston from the original bottle to have an adjustable press surface.  Pretty cool.
> 
> View attachment 372756
> 
> ...


That C channel looks only to be there to ensure the press does not experience axial deflection. Wouldn't think it needs to be too beefy.


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## Larry$ (Jul 20, 2021)

I've got an older, 25years, 20 ton press that may be a HF. It is much stouter than the ones they sell now. 
DRO?? I've got them on both lathe & mill and really like them, especially on the mill. Required... NO! You can always add one latter and for less $. 
Inserted tooling is fine but the really good stuff is expensive. I have a set from PM that is OK, included a couple of boring bars. Most of the time I use HSS that I grind. It's not rocket science to grid an acceptable edge. You will want additional tool holders. One for every tool. Most of mine are from Shars when they put them on sale. I use my PM 5C collet chuck a lot. It's sort of a toss up on whether to get 5C or ER. I got the 5C because I've got other things that the collets fit. 

Other things: tap & die sets (good ones, not from the hardware store) 115 piece set of *quality* drills, I also have a set of screw machine drills that I use more than the jobber drills.  Set of 60 & 82 degree center drills. Lots of measuring devices, adjustable parallels, thread pitch, fishtail, angles, depth, height, micrometers, bore measuring, 6" scale, bench grinder, band saw, gage pins ... buy as you find a need. 

MsMaster-Carr carries a lot of supplies

I'm older than dirt, retired, and mostly repair things. Make parts that are no longer available. I have a casting setup for aluminum, brass & zinc that allows me to make some parts that would be really difficult or impossible for me to machine from solid. I like the challenges, might even slow down an old mind going to hell.


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## wachuko (Jul 20, 2021)

I have not been able to find a decent tap & die set... all I find around is carp...  Would appreciate a recommendation for one...


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## Christianstark (Jul 20, 2021)

wachuko said:


> I have not been able to find a decent tap & die set... all I find around is carp...  Would appreciate a recommendation for one...


Just buy the ones you need when you need them. Sets are usually crap.


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## Larry$ (Jul 20, 2021)

19M3 × 0.50 mm, M4 × 0.70 mm, M5 × 0.80 mm, M6 × 1.00 mm, M8 × 1.25 mm, M10 × 1.50 mm, and M12 × 1.75 mmPlugRoundM3 × 0.50 mm, M4 × 0.70 mm, M5 × 0.80 mm, M6 × 1.00 mm, M8 × 1.25 mm, M10 × 1.50 mm, and M12 × 1.75 mm__Metal CaseDie Wrench, Screwdriver, Tap Wrench (2), Thread Gauge2646A14198.46
McMaster-Carr HSS Note that this set has round dies for threading. If you want to repair threads get the hex dies.


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## wachuko (Jul 20, 2021)

Larry$ said:


> 19M3 × 0.50 mm, M4 × 0.70 mm, M5 × 0.80 mm, M6 × 1.00 mm, M8 × 1.25 mm, M10 × 1.50 mm, and M12 × 1.75 mmPlugRoundM3 × 0.50 mm, M4 × 0.70 mm, M5 × 0.80 mm, M6 × 1.00 mm, M8 × 1.25 mm, M10 × 1.50 mm, and M12 × 1.75 mm__Metal CaseDie Wrench, Screwdriver, Tap Wrench (2), Thread Gauge2646A14198.46
> McMaster-Carr HSS Note that this set has round dies for threading. If you want to repair threads get the hex dies.


Thank you!



Christianstark said:


> Just buy the ones you need when you need them. Sets are usually crap.


That is what I have been doing.  But the only ones that I can get locally when in need, are the Irwin.  They have worked well so far, but I kept forgetting to ask here in the forum for recommendation on a good set.


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## KevinM (Jul 20, 2021)

wachuko said:


> Apologies for the long post... So the questions/requests that I have:
> 
> 1. DRO or not?  I do not mind spending the additional 500.00.  That is not the issue.  I do mind wasting that money if there is really no need for it.
> 
> 2. Anyone has a photo of a Precision Matthews PM-1030V-wQCTP with the DRO installed?  I can't seem to find any photos of that setup.


   Once I had DROs I have never looked at my handwheel markings.
I have a PM 10-22 which is the same lathe as yours with 8" lopped off of the bed.  The PM DRO that I have has served me well.  The only complaint is the cross-slide scale interferes with the tailstock.



To allow cuts close to the tailstock  I have made a solid mount for the QCTP that you can swap to the left to the right side depending on where the tool needs to be.  The solid mount greatly increases rigidity (I'm looking at you cutoff tool).







This lathe and DRO were ordered about 10 months ago.  It may be different than the one that they are shipping now.





As for backplates:
What a pain in the backside!! I ordered a spare with my lathe but it was cast for a 4 jaw chuck.  I eventually found some from Grizzly but had to machine a sleeve to correct the wrong size center hole.  This cowboy explains how to get one ($11 !!!!). 





As for taps:
High quality taps and dies are worth their weight in gold.  I build very small things in imperial and metric that use taps and dies often not included in a tap "set".  Those I buy individually (YG-1 on Amazon).  Generally, very small, good quality taps cost more that larger ones, $22 for a 2mm tap.


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## KevinM (Jul 20, 2021)

wachuko said:


> Thank you!
> 
> 
> That is what I have been doing.  But the only ones that I can get locally when in need, are the Irwin.  They have worked well so far, but I kept forgetting to ask here in the forum for recommendation on a good set.


I think that I could cut better threads with a hatchet than I could with an Irwin tap.


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## Christianstark (Jul 20, 2021)

wachuko said:


> Thank you!
> 
> 
> That is what I have been doing.  But the only ones that I can get locally when in need, are the Irwin.  They have worked well so far, but I kept forgetting to ask here in the forum for recommendation on a good set.


Ahh. I meant buy quality ones from a distributer for the size you need when needed. It would take a few days to arrive however, so you would want to determine fastener strategy while you were planning your project.


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## wachuko (Jul 20, 2021)

KevinM said:


> Once I had DROs I have never looked at my handwheel markings.
> I have a PM 10-22 which is the same lathe as yours with 8" lopped off of the bed.  The PM DRO that I have has served me well.  The only complaint is the cross-slide scale interferes with the tailstock.
> 
> View attachment 372768
> ...



So are you recommending that I order that back plate from Grizzly?  US$11.12 for that plate and the three bolts!


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## KevinM (Jul 20, 2021)

wachuko said:


> So are you recommending that I order that back plate from Grizzly?  US$11.12 for that plate and the three bolts!


I ordered 2, it was the only ones that I could find.  The center hole on the backplate is too large.  If you use it as-is then you are relying on the bolts to register the backplate.  I made a sleeve to fit the end of the spindle, bored the hole in the backplate so that it was concentric with the spindle and pressed it into place.  It was worth my effort to get a collet chuck mounted that would allow extra material to be pushed back into the spindle as apposed to the chucks that fit inside the spindle taper.


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## RJSakowski (Jul 20, 2021)

Collets on a lathe are intended to hold work rather than tools.   5C collets have a very limited grip range.  In order to holdall possible diameters from .030" to 1.125", you would minimally need a 35 collet set by 1/32nds.  A purist would say that you shouldn't distort the collets that much and that you should have a set by 64ths or even 128ths.  In contrast, ER collets have a much greater grip range and you could conceivably get by with a much smaller set. 

As to the issue of buy a lathe with a DRO or buy an aftermarket DRO, I am assuming that PM sells their lathe with the DRO installed.  Unless you are comfortable with fitting a DRO to the lathe, it is probably a false economy to save a few bucks installing your own.  I have installed four DRO's, making custom brackets for each.  The results are better than would be had with a factory install but I had many hours in designing, machining, and fitting them to my machines.


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## wachuko (Jul 20, 2021)

RJSakowski said:


> Collets on a lathe are intended to hold work rather than tools.   5C collets have a very limited grip range.  In order to holdall possible diameters from .030" to 1.125", you would minimally need a 35 collet set by 1/32nds.  A purist would say that you shouldn't distort the collets that much and that you should have a set by 64ths or even 128ths.  In contrast, ER collets have a much greater grip range and you could conceivably get by with a much smaller set.
> 
> As to the issue of buy a lathe with a DRO or buy an aftermarket DRO, I am assuming that PM sells their lathe with the DRO installed.  Unless you are comfortable with fitting a DRO to the lathe, it is probably a false economy to save a few bucks installing your own.  I have installed four DRO's, making custom brackets for each.  The results are better than would be had with a factory install but I had many hours in designing, machining, and fitting them to my machines.



From the feedback, best to get it... and best to get it installed already from PM... yeah.  Will get with the DRO from the get go.  

I still have the DRO setup that I made for my milling machine, sitting on a shelf gathering dust.   So it was not a matter of me installing it later to save a few bucks... I know myself well enough... hahahahahaha


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## wachuko (Jul 20, 2021)

KevinM said:


> I ordered 2, it was the only ones that I could find.  The center hole on the backplate is too large.  If you use it as-is then you are relying on the bolts to register the backplate.  I made a sleeve to fit the end of the spindle, bored the hole in the backplate so that it was concentric with the spindle and pressed it into place.  It was worth my effort to get a collet chuck mounted that would allow extra material to be pushed back into the spindle as apposed to the chucks that fit inside the spindle taper.



Got it.  I will do the same.  For the price, heck!  Best to have it here in case they are gone later on... 

And they are backordered, but I can wait for them to arrive.  Order placed!


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## yota (Jul 20, 2021)

Christianstark said:


> That C channel looks only to be there to ensure the press does not experience axial deflection. Wouldn't think it needs to be too beefy.


the HF C channel distorted causing the pin to angle over.  I took it off and hammered it straight and it did it again immediately.  junky.


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## T Bredehoft (Jul 20, 2021)

Back to  DRO's on your 10-30. I have the same lathe, I ordered it without DROs. Then bought some less expensive (read cheap) ones, Installed them myself and they just don't work the z, long one, just quit. the other didn't repeat within a week, never mind a few thousands. If I need an accurate length I use a 1" or 2" dial indicator. For diameter, hand wheel dial works accurately. If I want .oo3, I take 1 1/2 marks.

I   can't speak to the ones installed by PM, they may be perfect. The ones I had were junk. But I don't feel the loss, I was trained without, (they didn't exist in the 1960s).

By all means use the Quick Change Tool Holder. It's a god-send.


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## MERLIncMan (Jul 22, 2021)

wachuko said:


> After two years trying to decide, finally ready to pull the trigger on a metal lathe.
> 
> Thread when I was looking at just getting a small one to just learn: Feedback on first lathe - 8x14 600W variable speed lathe CJ210A  - But you all quickly convinced me to save my money and buy something that I could use for most of the stuff I needed to do.  Even though, at the time, I just wanted to get my hands dirty starting with something.   It was great feedback, and even if I wanted to start playing, it was worth waiting and using the money for something that I could give it better use.
> 
> ...



Here you go 

As for tools?

ALL. OF. THEM.

YES DRO! ALWAYS THE DRO!!!!!!!!!!!! It came pre-installed which was cool - faster than installing the one on Milly.

The machine is only the beginning....

But, you'll want a Machinist's level so you can tell how bad the floor is, and finally give up trying to level the lathe after a month of fighting yourself... 

Also, I too got the spare backplate and put on an 8" three-jaw that Sweetie got for me (I told her I needed a chuck for my 4" Midi lathe on the wood side, then she showed up with an 8" chuck... it took me three years to get a lathe that would fit it - it's installed in this pic. I had to find a big cookie of steel and make my own adapter for the backplate - was fun and really put Lizzy through her paces (Lizzy is the lathe, not the sweetie)).

Oh, I just added a thread about putting a DRO on the tailstock quill - go look. I've added one of those pictures here for your drooling pleasure.


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## Larry$ (Jul 22, 2021)

Nice looking play room. That chuck looks huge on that lathe.


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## MERLIncMan (Jul 22, 2021)

Larry$ said:


> Nice looking play room. That chuck looks huge on that lathe.


It does, but it works surprisingly well. I don't really like too much on the spindle, but... I had the 100mm 4 jaw on for making the tailstock DRO, and it looked almost comically small after being used to a chuck twice the size.


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## wachuko (Jul 23, 2021)

MERLIncMan said:


> Here you go
> 
> As for tools?
> 
> ...



Very nice.  Thank you for the photos.  Exactly what I wanted to see.

As a side comment... part of the reason for getting into this is the great feel of manually working with these machines.  I am kind of starting to regret starting to convert my Grizzly G0704 to CNC... Already started and will finish the conversion... and maybe is just now because I need to learn even more to know how to use the software... will see...


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## MERLIncMan (Jul 23, 2021)

wachuko said:


> Very nice.  Thank you for the photos.  Exactly what I wanted to see.
> 
> As a side comment... part of the reason for getting into this is the great feel of manually working with these machines.  I am kind of starting to regret starting to convert my Grizzly G0704 to CNC... Already started and will finish the conversion... and maybe is just now because I need to learn even more to know how to use the software... will see...


Do not regret the CNC - just have both, or add handles to the rear end of your steppers 

Software is my bottleneck too - I have FreeCAD (AutoDesk can go "know" themselves), but my work computer has XP on it, and FreeCAD won't run on it, while K40 Whisperer, Repetier, and USB CNC will. I don't have MACH (3 or 4) because I don't think I've got a parallel port.

So, I make do with Inkscape for flat stuff (through a converter to make the Gcode for the router, or K40 Whisperer runs it natively) and Sketchup with a utility to make STL for the 3D printer.

If I spent about as much on software as I have on machines, I could do it easier - then keep paying that much because "Subscription Models"....

All that being said, I wish I had a 6 Axis hybrid Addative/Subtractive machining-manufacturing machine 

Glad I could help with the pictures!


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## Larry$ (Jul 23, 2021)

CNC is great for making stuff, especially repetitive stuff. It reduces labor content, speeds manufacturing and above all repeats each part over and over with little variation. My business is full of it. Have dedicated CAD guys on fast computers with really expensive software. All machines have access to the server. If CNC is where you want your hobby to go... Go for it.  

It's not what I got started into metal working to do. I get a certain level of pleasure from manually manipulating my machines. Learning new skills. I also enjoy fixing stuff, making parts that can't be bought. I find it to be fun, mentally challenging. I'm retired, Money isn't a problem, time is. Enjoy life, it won't last forever.


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## wachuko (Jul 24, 2021)

MERLIncMan said:


> ...But, you'll want a Machinist's level so you can tell how bad the floor is, and finally give up trying to level the lathe after a month of fighting yourself...
> 
> ...



Something like this?

Starrett 98-6 6" Machinists' Level with Ground and Graduated vials


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## MERLIncMan (Jul 27, 2021)

wachuko said:


> Something like this?
> 
> Starrett 98-6 6" Machinists' Level with Ground and Graduated vials


That would do it.

There are rumors of an easier way to  level a lathe using (I think) a square and a plumb bob - but I never looked it up. Apparently it's easier than chasing the bubble on the ways.


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## starr256 (Aug 3, 2021)

I have had my PM1030V with DRO for 3 years. After a couple of years of playing with shims to get the lathe bed "flat" (no twist), I spent the the money for a MT4 test bar and added leveling plates to the both ends of the lathe. They are 1/4" steel with a couple of 5/16 cap screws. The original 1/2" hold down bolts are still used the secure the lathe to the bench. Now it is a simple 5 minute effort to verify the "flatness" for the lathe and correct it when out of whack (I get 0.0005" variation across a 10" span).


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## wachuko (Aug 3, 2021)

starr256 said:


> I have had my PM1030V with DRO for 3 years. After a couple of years of playing with shims to get the lathe bed "flat" (no twist), I spent the the money for a MT4 test bar and added leveling plates to the both ends of the lathe. They are 1/4" steel with a couple of 5/16 cap screws. The original 1/2" hold down bolts are still used the secure the lathe to the bench. Now it is a simple 5 minute effort to verify the "flatness" for the lathe and correct it when out of whack (I get 0.0005" variation across a 10" span).
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Do you mind sharing which one you went with?

And pardon my ignorance, but how do these plates work if you are still securing the lathe to the base using the stock bolts?  Having trouble visualizing your solution to simplifying this process.  Can you elaborate a bit more?  Thank you!


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## Christianstark (Aug 3, 2021)

wachuko said:


> Do you mind sharing which one you went with?
> 
> And pardon my ignorance, but how do these plates work if you are still securing the lathe to the base using the stock bolts?  Having trouble visualizing your solution to simplifying this process.  Can you elaborate a bit more?  Thank you!


Looks like he is using front and back jack screws to adjust the plate that the lathe through bolts to the base and sits on.


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## wachuko (Aug 3, 2021)

MERLIncMan said:


> Here you go
> 
> As for tools?
> 
> ...



I had a question on your setup... How tall are you?  Are the 4x4 with the 2x4 there to make it more comfortable for you do to your height or do they serve vibration absorption, or???   

Wood gives out right? it compresses when you tighten everything down.  That has to impact level and twist? Right?

You also have the grinder next to the lathe.  I was told to keep that away as far as possible.  The dust from grinding bits and whatnot, is bad to the lathe's ways.   I just replaced the wheels on my grinder, and just cleaning them (had the grinder close to the milling machine at the time)... it got fine dust all over!  I plan to have a shop vac next to the grinder to minimize the mess when using it, but was still planning to have it as far as possible from the lathe... 

I am making all this questions to better arrange the machines when I get the lathe...


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## wachuko (Aug 3, 2021)

Christianstark said:


> Looks like he is using front and back jack screws to adjust the plate that the lathe through bolts to the base and sits on.



But still means that he has to loosen the through bolts securing the lathe to make the adjustments, right?  Or the tension from the bolts is enough for the fine adjustments needed?


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## starr256 (Aug 3, 2021)

The lathe just sits on the plates. The plates have holes for the 1/2" bolts which go through the the bench. I don't get crazy in tightening them. The issue with the shims was that it was a elaborate process to loosen the 1/2 bolts, raise the tail end, insert shims (always to many or to few), re-tighten the bolts and check the results. Another issue was that the vertical alignment between the head stock and the tail was off. All this got easier with the plates and cap screws.


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## MERLIncMan (Aug 3, 2021)

wachuko said:


> I had a question on your setup... How tall are you?  Are the 4x4 with the 2x4 there to make it more comfortable for you do to your height or do they serve vibration absorption, or???
> 
> Wood gives out right? it compresses when you tighten everything down.  That has to impact level and twist? Right?
> 
> ...


Thank you for the questions, sorry that it took me so long to reply!

I am 6'1". The wooden cribbing is indeed for my back; hunching over a machine gets at me quick. Wood would eventually warp, twist, crack - but it won't really squish under the few hundred pounds that these machines weigh. Yes, it will effect level and twist, and it most assuredly does not help with vibration 

I decided I'd be ok with it for now because I got tired of trying to level and stabilize everything, and I wanted to make things - they might have a taper, but so far I've not been doing long skinny, just short- fat.

The better solution would be some big-ole' cast-concrete footers with a fantastic finish and J-bolts inset. God willing, when I build my shop that will be the case - dead nuts level and 8 - 12" thick poured just for these ladies...

There is a 6" bench grinder by the tailstock, and it is ideal to suck the grit out of the air, as well as protect the ways. The bench grinder is, however, the least of the concerns - now that I've got this thing:







I have a "cyclone separator" that I made with an old vacuum, a road-cone, and a 5 gallon bucket. I've not yet made a suck-funnel for the grinder, but someday - plus a coolant shroud.

My Lab is about 13x20, and I am somewhat adept at cramming things into places where they might not otherwise go - but we hobbyists make due with tiny places yes?

My metroloscopy station (granite, gauges, and an optical comparator - hence the "-oscopy" part of the "metrology") has got a bed-sheet on it 

I'd suggest, if you're wanting, get some graph paper and make a scale of your shop - then cut out bits to scale for your machines: this includes the full working envelope including table travel, and swarf-shoot-off - then you can arrange your shop like a board-game. I spent a few hours with a tape measure finding the way to fit the machines with the walk-ways. Because they are heavy, one is loath to move them more than fifteen times or so...


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## MERLIncMan (Aug 3, 2021)

starr256 said:


> I have had my PM1030V with DRO for 3 years. After a couple of years of playing with shims to get the lathe bed "flat" (no twist), I spent the the money for a MT4 test bar and added leveling plates to the both ends of the lathe. They are 1/4" steel with a couple of 5/16 cap screws. The original 1/2" hold down bolts are still used the secure the lathe to the bench. Now it is a simple 5 minute effort to verify the "flatness" for the lathe and correct it when out of whack (I get 0.0005" variation across a 10" span).
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That's a pretty sharp levely-setup you got there!

Also - getting the MT4 checker-bar is good, because it's another tool, and I like tools - especially gauge-like-tools!

I wonder if it would work as a mandrel...


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## wachuko (Aug 3, 2021)

MERLIncMan said:


> Thank you for the questions, sorry that it took me so long to reply!
> 
> I am 6'1". The wooden cribbing is indeed for my back; hunching over a machine gets at me quick. Wood would eventually warp, twist, crack - but it won't really squish under the few hundred pounds that these machines weigh. Yes, it will effect level and twist, and it most assuredly does not help with vibration
> 
> ...



That contraption looks a lot more complicated than the lathe  .  Baby steps for me... first let me buy a lathe, then learn how to use it with bits already cut to the most common shapes...   then I can figure out what the heck I am looking at in the photo.  I can't identify the model, but pretty sure is a tool grinder machine of some sort...

I tried doing a reverse image research to try to find the model... you know, so I did not sound so clueless, but could not find the brand model.  The base is JET, but not sure if the top part is also JET, could not find anything from them that looked like that...


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## MERLIncMan (Aug 3, 2021)

wachuko said:


> That contraption looks a lot more complicated than the lathe  .  Baby steps for me... first let me buy a lathe, then learn how to use it with bits already cut to the most common shapes...   then I can figure out what the heck I am looking at in the photo.  I can't identify the model, but pretty sure is a tool grinder machine of some sort...
> 
> I tried doing a reverse image research to try to find the model... you know, so I did not sound so clueless, but could not find the brand model.  The base is JET, but not sure if the top part is also JET, could not find anything from them that looked like that...




It's a Jet Tool-And-Cutter-Grinder (450 something-or-other). It is, for all intents and purposes, a surface-grinder with 2 main differences: surface not as fine (+/- maybe 0.0005", as opposed to better than 0.0002") and it's got GOODIES!!! It adjusts every which way (compounding errors....) and can have things bolted to it to hold at weird angles and constrain motion to desired axes... (axises... axes... axeeeeeeezzzeeee?)

The base is actually an integral part of the gizmo - it's got a coolant tank and pump in it. I bolted some shelves to each side for to contain all the goodies - so many goodies!!!

It was a stupid-good find on Ebay - it is effectively brand-new and gave me a legitimate excuse to drive 900 miles one-way overnight at an age where I really should know better...

You wanna know my secret? I know a bit about surface grinders, how to dress crazy radius/angles/tangents on a wheel, how to get a mirror in CPM and all that - but this thing? I don't know what it can do 
I know it can sharpen endmills and shell-mills, can do OD grinding and surface grinding... but... I don't even know how to use some of the accessories that I bought for it...

YAY!

Now, if only I could find a 110VAC heat treat oven... the Hotshot 360 (I learned about it from This Old Tony on Youtube) has been bought out, so that's not an option...

Anywho - you can read every book in the world, watch every tutorial, but until you put your hands on your own machine, and screw-up your own paid-for-out-of-pocket materials, you never really know how to REALLY use a machine...


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## Steve-F (Aug 3, 2021)

Very cool!  As for your oven we have a couple Ney Vulcan's that run on 110VAC, it might fit your needs?






						Neytech Vulcan Benchtop Furnace Model 3-550 #9493308 – Pacific Combustion – 1800-342-4442
					






					pacificcombustion.com


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## wachuko (Aug 3, 2021)

Got it!  JET Model JCG-450-3


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## MERLIncMan (Aug 3, 2021)

Steve-F said:


> Very cool!  As for your oven we have a couple Ney Vulcan's that run on 110VAC, it might fit your needs?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Why would you do such a thing to me!  YES it fits my needs! But I can't fit yours   

At first, I was super excited at your reply - YAY! - then, my excitement faded at the price....

Honestly though, you are awesome for showing me that - seriously, I half hoped someone would know of an alternate to the HotShot; but (and I didn't say this, so it's on me) - the price-point is under $1000 delivered... it's the only way I can moralize the cost. 

Thusly, you have made me happy-sad (like when you get 99% on an exam, and you're happy, but then see you only missed one answer, and it turns out you knew the answer but marked it wrong... so then you're sad...)

You could send me one, and I'd tell people how great it is... and you could then tell the IRS that you donated $2900.00 so as to reduce your fiscal-year-end-punishment by an equivalent amount....


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## wachuko (Aug 3, 2021)

I guess I will stick to only powder coating with my GE stove/oven...


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