# Contemplating My First Mini Metal Lathe Purchase



## TonyL (May 13, 2016)

Hi Folks: I am delighted to find this forum. I am looking forward to purchasing my first mini metal lathe. I am a penturner, but want to learn how to make small parts for pen turning as well as make pens out of metal. Basically, I just like making things.

I am looking at Sieg, Taig, and Sherline. I am thoroughly confused, but enjoying the learning process. I can't see my needs beyond drilling a depth more than 6 inches, cutting threads more than 3/4 inches around (in diameter) or using stock more than 1 inch in diameter or square. Anyway, any advice, recommendations, etc. are all welcome. I am sure that their are thousands of great, but differing  opinions, and I will respect them all.

Thank you for reading.

Tony


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## LucknowKen (May 13, 2016)

http://www.hobby-machinist.com/forums/sherline-taig-sieg-mini-machines.92/
Some of the membership here have really nice watchmakers lathes.
I cannot really comment on your choices but there is a lot of good info here and in the beginners section.
Good luck getting the lathe that is best for you.
Welcome to THM and (please,) post some photos when you get your new machine.
Lken


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## MSD0 (May 13, 2016)

What's your budget?


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## mikey (May 13, 2016)

Welcome to HM, Tony. I think any metal lathe is better than no metal lathe, and all the brands you listed will do what you want it to do. What will differentiate them are the work envelope, the available accessories, cost and drive features (variable speed vs belts) and other factors. For transparency, I'm a Sherline owner with the typical biases so keep that in mind. 

When I contemplated my first lathe I knew that I was primarily going to make general stuff for my hobbies and stuff around the house. Being a city dweller, that meant a mini-lathe would suffice to see if I liked the hobby enough to stay with it. At the time, Taig was just getting started and Sherline was the best game in town. Most of the Asian lathes weren't copied from Emco yet so my choices were simpler. I ended up with a well-tooled long bed Sherline lathe and have never regretted that decision. You will hear that you should go for the biggest lathe you can afford and I agree ... except if you are only working on small precision parts. In that specific case, go for a smaller precision lathe. In my book, that would be a Sherline or Taig in the USA. 

Between the Taig and Sherline, the key differences are the available accessories and the drives. Sherline lathes come with a very reliable variable speed DC motor, while Taig typically uses an AC motor or one of your choice that you must provide. The capacity of the long bed Sherline is greater than the Taig. I haven't owned a Taig so cannot attest to its accuracy but lots of nice work are done on those things so join one of the Taig groups and ask about it. The Sherline is VERY accurate and will do almost anything within its work envelope, and maybe beyond it. As for accessories, Sherline produces the largest choice of US made tooling for their machines and their stuff is very good quality; Taig is okay but nowhere near what Sherline offers. 

As for the Asian lathes, Little Machine Shop carries almost anything you could possibly want, including the lathes. Look them over, ask about them here and you'll have many informed opinions. Nowadays, few others produce lathes at prices we can afford so you almost have to consider them. Don't forget that the Asian lathes are copies of the early Emco lathes made in Austria; you may find one in good shape on Craigslist in your area.

One other thing to look at is how many mods you have to do to the machine for it to perform well for you. The Asian lathes will usually require some tune up to function well or correct design flaws. Before buying, look around to see what has been done for the lathe you're considering. Sherline lathes will typically run well out of the box. I don't know about Taig.

This is not an easy decision, I know. The very best advice I can offer is to ask, ask, ask until you are very clear on what you need and what you can afford before you buy.


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## TonyL (May 14, 2016)

Thank you very much for sharing your experience and the welcome. As far as a budget about 2k., but I can go more or less. I just want benchtop. I am leaning toward the HighTorque 7 - 16. Then I read this and I am back looking at the Sherline. I spoke to both owners they seem like very nice guys and neither criticized the other. I was looking at a Precsion Matthews, but that name doesn't come up that frequently for some reason....maybe because it is larger. I am in no rush and still watching tons of videos.  I may even take an adult education class. I need to read through many of the earlier post as well. Thanks again. This is really a neat place.


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## mikey (May 14, 2016)

Tony, if a Precision Matthews may fit your needs then please look at them. They are much larger but far more capable than the mini-lathe class you're considering. If you visit the PM sub-forum here you will find that these machines are very highly regarded and that Matt, the owner, provides superb support. I own a Sherline and an Emco lathe but if I were to buy an Asian lathe today, it would be a PM from Matt. 

Only you know how much space, money and time you can afford to spend on this hobby. Keep in mind that the accessories you need to run a machine tool can easily eclipse the cost of the machine itself. The costs for accessories will, in general, be commensurate with their size. 

Your statement, "I can't see my needs beyond drilling a depth more than 6 inches, cutting threads more than 3/4 inches around (in diameter) or using stock more than 1 inch in diameter or square." would point to a mini-machine but you never know. If you have interests or hobbies aside from machining then your machines may be used to support those hobbies so really put some thought into the largest work you expect to do and buy your lathe accordingly.


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## brav65 (May 14, 2016)

TonyL said:


> Thank you very much for sharing your experience and the welcome. As far as a budget about 2k., but I can go more or less. I just want benchtop. I am leaning toward the HighTorque 7 - 16. Then I read this and I am back looking at the Sherline. I spoke to both owners they seem like very nice guys and neither criticized the other. I was looking at a Precsion Matthews, but that name doesn't come up that frequently for some reason....maybe because it is larger. I am in no rush and still watching tons of videos.  I may even take an adult education class. I need to read through many of the earlier post as well. Thanks again. This is really a neat place.



+1 on giving Matt a call. He has a 10x22 that is in your budget and has a power cross feed.  Check it out here:  http://www.machinetoolonline.com/PM1030.html

I am saving my pennies for a larger lathe and will only purchase from Matt!


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## royesses (May 14, 2016)

Wow, I like that PM 1030 lathe. With all the money I've spent modifying and upgrading my HF 7x10 I could have paid for the PM and had a much more capable machine.

From experience my opinion you should purchase more machine than you think you will need. The Sherline is a beautiful machine and the Sieg and Taig are very nice machines. Either will do the job you describe. If you are like me you will be doing many more projects than you originally envisioned. Then you will want more machine. If you have the discipline to stick with just making pens your choice of the smaller machines is fine. Of course space is something that comes into play too. I don't have the space in my overstuffed garage for full size machines so I went with a benchtop size lathe and mill. 

Roy


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## TOOLMASTER (May 14, 2016)

where are the Precision Matthews made?


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## mikey (May 14, 2016)

I thought about this post while trying to fall asleep last night and came to the conclusion that a larger lathe is really nice to have - I have a Sherline and an 11" lathe - but 80% of the work I do can be handled by the Sherline. It has been said ad nauseum that you can do small parts on a larger lathe but you cannot do big parts on a smaller one, mostly because its true. However, I suspect that this party line is spoken mostly by those who have not worked with a Sherline lathe. 

Realistically, if you put the edge of the working envelope of a Sherline lathe at about 1-1/4", the diameter that will easily allow the cross slide to pass under, then you have to decide if the majority of your work will fall over or under that size before ruling the Sherline out. I say this because within its working envelope there is little that the Sherline cannot do that a larger lathe can, at lower cost and with great precision. My bigger lathe is still not big by the standards of this forum but it is a mid-size lathe made in Austria and made to what they billed as tool room standards. It is a very good machine but for small parts it is nowhere near as simple or accurate to use as the Sherline. Add to that the cost between a fully tooled Sherline lathe and a fully tooled mid-sized lathe and you begin to realize that for a hobby guy who isn't turning out a lot of parts a mini-lathe may not be a bad choice. 

So, it comes down to how large a part Tony will need to make, budget, space and interests. It makes sense to me to start small and see if you like cutting metal. If you do like it and you find that you need a larger lathe then you will have learned enough by then to make a good choice. If not, then see your Psychiatrist.


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## TOOLMASTER (May 14, 2016)

i have always had big lathes at work. what i miss the most is the bore size...i am limited to 7/8 at home. ;-(


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## MSD0 (May 14, 2016)

I haven't used a Sherline or Taig, but used to have a Emco Unimat at work. Great for turning small parts, but I think you would feel really limited if it was your only lathe. The 7x16 size mini lathes can handle larger parts, but still aren't that rigid. I would go for something like that PM 10x22 mentioned above.


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## silence dogood (May 14, 2016)

Tony, You will get advise on getting a large maybe 12" lathe.  I drive a Mazda B4000 pickup. the largest load that ever was in it was a Sheldon 10" lathe.  Why do I need a Peterbuilt semi?   I think that you got the right idea of getting size of lathe to fit your needs.  There is also another reason which is even more important. If this is your first lathe, then start small.  You need to learn how to use this tool and learn how to use it "safely".  If you decide that you want to go bigger, you can always sell what you got.  The other thing is tooling.  You will have to add that to the price of the lathe.  LMS has nice lathes and you can get a tooling package which will save you money.  you can also check out Taig, Sherline, and Grizzly.  All of these companies have tooling available.


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## mikey (May 14, 2016)

TOOLMASTER said:


> i have always had big lathes at work. what i miss the most is the bore size...i am limited to 7/8 at home. ;-(



Ain't it the truth? I can pass 1-3/8" and that isn't enough sometimes.


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## brav65 (May 14, 2016)

TOOLMASTER said:


> where are the Precision Matthews made?



Most of their machines are made in China, if the model number ends in a T then it is made in Taiwan.  The 10x22/30 mentioned above is made is China.  Matt typically specs his machines with higher quality bearings, and cast iron.  He also includes many small features that many other importers do not.


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## MSD0 (May 14, 2016)

brav65 said:


> Most of their machines are made in China, if the model number ends in a T then it is made in Taiwan.  The 10x22/30 mentioned above is made is China.  Matt typically specs his machines with higher quality bearings, and cast iron.  He also includes many small features that many other importers do not.


Matt also offers great customer service and will take care of you down the road.


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## TonyL (May 14, 2016)

Thank you for the sharing your experiences and advice. I can easily double my budget or buy a second larger metal lathe if I find that I really like cutting metal. I also have plenty of room, I just don't want something big to make pen, pens bushing, etc..  I do like horsepower and speed though, but not an the expense of quality and accuracy.

The only thing that "bothers" me about the Sherline is the 0MT tailstock and possibly not having much weight to it. I have been turning pens for over 2 years, but over 700 of them. I have several Jet wood lathes, and have bought bottle stopper kits and the like, but still have not had a desire to turn anything else.  It appears that I can't go wrong with any of the ones that I have been looking at or that have been recommended. I should probably see if there is any one local to me that wouldn't mind showing me theirs. Presently, I am limited to YouTubes (which are excellent!). 

Thanks again and please continue to share your thoughts. I had some family from out of town visiting and didn't get to read many older posts. I did stay up until 3am this morning watching YouTube tough!


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## mksj (May 15, 2016)

The Taig gets high marks for rigidity and function in this size range. Given the work envelop and speeds your are looking at, I do not think a larger hobby lathe would work well for your application which requires higher speeds and high precision over a shorter distance. Haven't made pens, but my understanding is the threads are usually very fine/odd pitch, so a larger hobby lathe would most likely not benefit you for cutting threads (assume dies are most commonly used). Taig reviews indicate that they have high rigidity for the size and construction. Taig also seems to offer lot of innovative features in this size, like power feed, ER16 chuck system, quick change tool post system, high precision tolerances, 2 year warranty, etc. 

What is the most intriguing offering from Taig is there CNC models which can do threading and machining with multiple tooling with high accuracy in this size range. The pricing of their CNC lathe would be similar to a 11x30 or 12x27 range lathe. Might be a fun to learn the CNC aspect given your extensive experience in making pens.
http://www.taigtools.com/


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## TonyL (May 15, 2016)

Thank you. Looking forward to conducting the research.


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## MSD0 (May 15, 2016)

That Taig looks like a cool little machine. These small machines certainly work well for making small parts and work well when paired up with a larger machine. We have one of the Cameron micro drilling/milling machines at work and it's awesome for doing tiny parts. http://cameronmicrodrillpress.com/manual-micro-drill-presses/cameron-md70-series/cameron-md70-x/


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## mikey (May 15, 2016)

TonyL said:


> The only thing that "bothers" me about the Sherline is the 0MT tailstock and possibly not having much weight to it.



What about the 0 MT bothers you? It is adequate for the size of the lathe and works well. As for the weight of the lathe, it is very light; you can pick the whole thing up with one hand. However, when mounted to a base and in actual use the lathe doesn't move around. 

The last time I looked, Taig did not have a screw cutting attachment so threads must be cut with dies. This is a deal breaker for me. Sherline sells a threading attachment that will cut more threads than just about any lathe I know of and it works really well. This is an M8 thread single pointed in 1144 Stressproof steel cut on a Sherline lathe.




I'm not a CNC guy so I cannot speak from personal experience but I can tell you that I know how my lathe feels and sounds when it is cutting well, and I know exactly what to do when something goes wrong. I know how to adjust feed on the fly to get the cut I need or how to alter depths of cut when the books and calculations are wrong. Count me amongst the dinosaurs but if I were learning to cut metal I would steer clear of CNC until I learned what I was doing.


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## TonyL (May 15, 2016)

That the 0MT is not common or may be too light. However, those are amazing threads!


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## mikey (May 15, 2016)

The 0MT is fine for the size of the lathe. I have drilled a 1/2" hole in steel using a chuck in the tailstock so I wouldn't let it concern you too much. You are right, though, that it is not common. You will have to either use Sherline's stuff or make your own tapers, which is not a big deal to do.

And yes, the Sherline cuts nice threads.


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## TonyL (May 15, 2016)

Thank you.


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## TonyL (May 16, 2016)

I am close to narrowing it down to the Precision Matthews or the LMS HighTorque. I have heard (from a non-member) not to get hung-up on not having the power cross feed. The same person who owns the LMS HighTorque owned the Jet 920 (and regrets selling it).

Here is an excerpt from my first post:

_I am a penturner, but want to learn how to make small parts for pen turning as well as make pens out of metal. Basically, I just like making things.

I am looking at Sieg, Taig, and Sherline. I am thoroughly confused, but enjoying the learning process. I can't see my needs beyond drilling a depth more than 6 inches, cutting threads more than 3/4 inches around (in diameter) or using stock more than 1 inch in diameter or square. Anyway, any advice, recommendations, etc. are all welcome. I am sure that their are thousands of great, but differing opinions, and I will respect them all._


Any thoughts on the text in red above?

Thank you all again?


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## mikey (May 17, 2016)

Power cross feed is nice to have but you'll use it mainly for facing or parting and neither one is a big deal to do manually. I would go for the lathe that has the features you need while also bearing in mind that Matt of PM has a stellar reputation for support after the sale.


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## TonyL (May 17, 2016)

Thank you Mike. His reputation is excellent.


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## TonyL (May 17, 2016)

Well, spoke  to 3 owners/distributors and exchanged emails with the other - all nice folks. I can toss a coin and buy the PM or Seig 5200. I am leaning toward the 5200 because I think it will be a decent first lathe given its size. I am going to see if I can take an adult ed course somewhere. I attended parochial school for 16 years; the closest thing to a shop class was watching the janitor polishes the floors after class.


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## Steve Shannon (May 18, 2016)

You might want to wait until you've had a few classes before deciding which lathe to buy.  What you learn in those classes may sway your opinion. I think it's a great idea to take the classes.


 Steve Shannon


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## TonyL (May 18, 2016)

Looking for some now. I have plenty of time and maybe one (of the lathes will go on sale in the meantime). Thanks for all the advice and guidance folks!


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