# My Precision Mathews PM935TV Arrival/Setup



## zmotorsports (Sep 8, 2014)

My PM935TV knee mill finally arrived last Tuesday and I have spent a few days last week getting it set up and personalized a bit.  

First off, I must say that now after having it for nearly a week it is everything I had hoped for.  The quality is extremely high end and compliments my PM1340GT very nicely.

I will admit that when the driver backed up to my shop and opened the door, my stomach jumped into my throat and I wanted to strangle the driver.  The mill had tipped over onto its' side, broken through the pallet and was leaning against the inside of the truck box.  It didn't go all the way over onto its' side but more horizontal than vertical.  Evidently the driver was a bit aggressive at driving and the mill had pulled the four large lag bolts right up and out of the pallet it was sitting on.  I jumped all over the driver and asked if he didn't see the large "TOP HEAVY" lettering on each of the four sides of the crate.  Needless to say I did NOT tip the driver on this delivery. 

He wanted to close up the truck and bring it back to their dock and get it stood upright with a forklift.  Although a forklift would have been the best alternative, I didn't think it would make it another 30 miles back to Salt Lake City without going the rest of the way over and for sure creating more damage.  I also didn't want to wait another 5-months to get another one.  I wanted to get it upright and inspect prior to making any definitive decision.

Here is how it showed up at my home/shop.











After removing three sides of the pallet/crate to get a better look.





Luckily my son had just gotten home and was able to help me because the driver was absolutely worthless as far as helping.  All he wanted to do was bring it back to their Salt Lake City transportation hub and really didn't want me messing with it.  My son and I got the engine hoist up into the back of the truck and strapped the top of the column.  We raised it about as far as we could with the hoist and got the weight up off of the head and away from the side of the truck so I could get a better visual of it.  All I could see at this point was the small handle for the RPM that was broken.  I was able to push it the last few degrees to get it vertical and standing back on the pallet flat on its' base.  We shifted/jockied it around so I could drive the lag bolts back into the pallet and then we used a 10k pound ratchet strap to secure it to the pallet.

Once we got it out of the truck, on the ground and somewhat in place in my shop we removed the remainder of the plastic wrapping and did a thorough inspection.  Unbelievably there was NO damage with the exception of the small handle for the dial.  I called QMT and Matt was busy but I informed Nicole about what had transpired and she was awesome.  After speaking with Matt she called back to ask a few more questions and I forwarded the pictures that I had taken to Matt.

Here it is close to its' new home in my shop.





This was the only damage.  No big deal and Matt was great to get a new one in the mail immediately.





I got the pallet cut down so I could lift the mill off of the pallet and get it sitting on the floor.  I then commenced on taking measurements for a base.  I needed to get the mill a few inches up to make it more comfortable.  After exchanging information with a few members of the forum who already own this machine I had originally decided I was going to build a base that was 4" in height combined with leveling feet which were 2" for a total of 6" overall height gain.  I really liked the height in which it was sitting on the pallet which was closer to 8" overall height.  That did it for me, so I embarked on fabricating a base that would raise the milling machine a total of 8".  The base would bolt directly to the bottom of the mill yet be slightly wider at the footprint and employ leveling feet.

I started with some 2"x4"x.125" rectangular tubing and some 2"square tube x .125" wall.





I machined some threaded bungs and welded them to the rectangular tubing to anchor the mill to the base.





I then welded the 2" square tubing to the 2"x4" rectangular tubing as well as gusseted it for strength.










Base completed, painted and sitting in front of the milling machine ready for installation.





And there she is, sitting on her new base in her new home.




















So far this all took place on Tuesday.  The truck backed up to my shop door just before 2:00PM and by 7:30PM it was sitting in its' final resting spot.

Now on to Wednesday morning.  I took a couple of days off work to get it all set up and put my shop back together so I wanted to get right after it.  I installed my 220VAC/30amp plug and she purred like a kitten.  So nice and smooth running.  I noticed immediately that none of the collets fit in the spindle and I kind of was expecting that due to other threads that I have read.

Here is how to remedy that.  There is a small set screw on the back side of the quill that must be loosened to remove the collar.  





Next use a spanner wrench to remove the collar.





Once the collar is broken loose it should spin out freely by hand.





Collar removed.





Once the collar is removed there is a set screw with another one under it.  The top one is a locking set screw, remove it.  Then back the inner one out just enough so that the collets, drill chucks and other tooling will fit into the spindle/quill freely.  Once you are happy with the fit, install the outer set screw and tighten.  Then reassemble everything in reverse order.

Now on to tramming the head.  Got her dead on in both axis.










I also installed the Eason ES-8A onto the machine and got it all hooked up and operational.

More to follow.

Mike.


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## zmotorsports (Sep 8, 2014)

Now on the personalization of the machine.  I temporarily used some "T" nuts from my hold down kit but I wanted to make some specifically for the mill vise.  I also was anxious to make my first chips so this is project No. 1.

Installed a piece of 1" stock and commenced on bringing it to size.





Picture doesn't do it justice, very nice finish for hot rolled mild steel.





All sized up and ready to cut the slots for the "T".  





Grooves cut down both sides.





Drilling both holes prior to cutting.  I am also playing with and experimenting with the DRO.  I have never used a mill with a DRO before.  Ours at work is "old school".  My son talked me into getting the DRO and now I don't think I could be without it and I have only scratched the surface on its' features.





Threaded and cut apart.





I had previously machined and threaded some studs for this purpose so now I decided to weld them together as these will be dedicated for milling vise only.





I also machined some .100" thick washers to go under the nuts for the mill vise and had purchased some large flange nuts from McMaster Carr.





Now I decided to add some table protectors to keep the table looking nice.  Ours at work looks like hell due to the abuse the table gets and although my son and I will be the only ones using this machine, I realize that accidents happen and tools or parts can get dropped.  I purchased some black neoprene rubber and cut it to shape/size and notched to go around the mill vise fasteners.





Stay tuned as next up is my pneumatic/power drawbar.  By around 6:00PM on Wednesday I realized that I need to fabricate a power drawbar as this isn't going to fly.  Changing tools around this frequently is time consuming.

Mike.


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## JimDawson (Sep 8, 2014)

Congratulations on your new mill.  Your welding is beautiful, I wish I could do that well.  Love the table covers.

The only problem I see is that your shop is way too clean.:rofl:  Mine will never look like that.


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## drs23 (Sep 8, 2014)

JimDawson said:


> Congratulations on your new mill.  Your welding is beautiful, I wish I could do that well.  Love the table covers.
> 
> *The only problem I see is that your shop is way too clean.:rofl:  Mine will never look like that.*



+1 on all the above. 

Me & You both Jim on the clean shop thing.


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## dave2176 (Sep 8, 2014)

Mike,
 I'm glad there wasn't more damage. It has been a long enough wait. It looks great though.
 Dave


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## zmotorsports (Sep 8, 2014)

Thanks guys.  I appreciate the comments.  

As far as cleanliness, I despise a dirty shop.  It flusters me to no end and I lose focus when I have a mess to work around.

When I leave chips on the floor from one night to the next because I know I am going to be continuing my mess the next day I find it hard to quiet my mind down and I end up thinking about the mess in the shop and can't relax.

Mike.


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## zmotorsports (Sep 8, 2014)

Now moving on to my power drawbar.  By Wednesday evening the power drawbar was officially bumped to the TOP of the "To Do" list as I was already tired of switching tooling around by hand.

I dug through some scraps and found some aluminum plate and some .625" O1 drill rod along with some bronze bushing material.  I had ordered some fittings a few months ago from McMaster Carr as I was slowly building up my supplies for the power drawbar.

The top of the mill has a bearing support with three (3) 6mmx1.0 SHCS that would be a simple attachment point with some longer bolts.





I chucked up a 7"x7"x.5" piece of 6061 aluminum in the four-jaw chuck on the lathe and aligned the offset for the spindle center.





I drilled the hole with a 1" drill bit and then commenced boring it out to 1.375" diameter.  The same as the top of the bearing support.





I then machined a step .150" deep to sit on the bearing support.  This part probably wasn't necessary but I wanted it to be a close tolerance fit onto the mill.










Test fit on the machine and measuring the bolt pattern.





Next up was to start the machining of the movable parts.  I set up my new work stop because I knew these parts would be in and out of the vise multiple times.










I then showed the lathe some love and started on the bushings.





I arbitrarily picked 1" as my target diameter and nailed it spot on.  This lathe is so nice to hit a dimension on, repeatably.





I machined a step into the bushing so I could press them into the aluminum right up the shoulder.





I bored them to allow a couple thousands clearance for the .625" O1 drill rod to slide through.  Test fit.





Then moved back to the mill to bore out the plates to accept the bushings.  Ended up with a .001" interference fit.





Holes bored and bushings completed.





Bushings pressed in and butterfly gun installed on lower plate.





Top movable plate was drilled and lapped to mate to the end of the butterfly gun once the end cap was removed.





Mocked up.





Using the bolt circle layout feature on the Eason DRO.  I figured I paid for it I may as well learn how to use it.  There are a lot of features I have only scratched the surface on as far as learning the DRO.  I am so glad I let my son talk me into purchasing the DRO.





Test fit on the mill.  Bolted right on.





Now on to the air line plumbing.





Lastly on to the controls/buttons for activation.  Using the end of the butterfly gun and a piece of scrap aluminum.





Lapped the aluminum and the valve body.





Then moved on to machining the lever.





All of the components of the controls sitting out and ready for assembly as well as identifying a mounting position/location.





I bent up a piece of steel to mount the switch next to the electrical switch for the mill.  This will use the same mounting point of the electrical switch without having to drill or tap another hole(s).  I also bead blasted and painted it gloss black.





And last but not least the finishing touches.  I found a piece of 1" aluminum round stock to make a couple of large diameter buttons for the control lever.










Installed and completed.  Almost looks like it belongs there.





That is it as far as modifications at this point.  Overall I am just as impressed with the Precision Mathews small knee mill as I am the PM1340GT lathe.  I am sure glad I spent a little extra and purchased the Taiwanese machines and for the most part I feel good about the purchase(s).

Mike.


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## drs23 (Sep 8, 2014)

Another fine job Mike. I'm getting to the point where I'm wanting to do the same thing. Now if my scrap/drop buddy would just trickle the material in...


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## catoctin (Sep 8, 2014)

And I thought the shipping companies only did this to me.  Fortunately, nothing major happened to the mill.  This could have been a real pain after waiting so long.

My 935 is somewhere in Nebraska right now on it's way to the Livermore depot.  I expect it will arrive Thursday or Friday.  Things should get very interesting then.

Thanks for the heads-up on the collet issue.  I had almost forgotten that someone else had problems with that.  

-Joe    




zmotorsports said:


> My PM935TV knee mill finally arrived last Tuesday and I have spent a few days last week getting it set up and personalized a bit.
> 
> First off, I must say that now after having it for nearly a week it is everything I had hoped for.  The quality is extremely high end and compliments my PM1340GT very nicely.
> 
> ...


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## zmotorsports (Sep 8, 2014)

drs23 said:


> Another fine job Mike. I'm getting to the point where I'm wanting to do the same thing. Now if my scrap/drop buddy would just trickle the material in...



Thanks Dale, I appreciate the compliment.




catoctin said:


> And I thought the shipping companies only did this to me.  Fortunately, nothing major happened to the mill.  This could have been a real pain after waiting so long.
> 
> My 935 is somewhere in Nebraska right now on it's way to the Livermore depot.  I expect it will arrive Thursday or Friday.  Things should get very interesting then.
> 
> ...



Joe, good luck on the delivery and be sure to post up some pictures and thoughts of the unit when you get it.

Mike.


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## Stonebriar (Sep 8, 2014)

I know what you mean about shipping companies.  When I got my 935 the side and front of the crate was off and the top was sitting on the machine.  
They had balanced the mill pallet on another pallet because the original didn't fit their pallet jack.  The thing was just sitting up there half off and the bottom pallet was junk and half crushed. Luckily I had no damage.

Rick


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## zmotorsports (Sep 8, 2014)

Stonebriar said:


> I know what you mean about shipping companies.  When I got my 935 the side and front of the crate was off and the top was sitting on the machine.
> They had balanced the mill pallet on another pallet because the original didn't fit their pallet jack.  The thing was just sitting up there half off and the bottom pallet was junk and half crushed. Luckily I had no damage.
> 
> Rick



Thankfully you didn't end up with any damage either.  I know when that door opened on the truck my stomach leaped into my throat.  I didn't know what to do or say for a moment.  

Mike.


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## Smudgemo (Sep 8, 2014)

Wow.  My first reaction was feeling lucky mine arrived looking mostly like how RoadRunner got it in PA, but I should feel relief they did their job?  Sounds like maybe.  I'm just glad you like it since I recommended it so confidently.  

And I feel the same about the DRO.  The function I've used the most is the 1/2 position function to center the spindle on a part or a hole.  I also go back and forth a lot between metric and Imperial when I'm making Harold Hall's projects (he works in metric, but I don't really want to.)  Sure is handy.  

-Ryan


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## zmotorsports (Sep 8, 2014)

Smudgemo said:


> Wow.  My first reaction was feeling lucky mine arrived looking mostly like how RoadRunner got it in PA, but I should feel relief they did their job?  Sounds like maybe.  I'm just glad you like it since I recommended it so confidently.
> 
> And I feel the same about the DRO.  The function I've used the most is the 1/2 position function to center the spindle on a part or a hole.  I also go back and forth a lot between metric and Imperial when I'm making Harold Hall's projects (he works in metric, but I don't really want to.)  Sure is handy.
> 
> -Ryan



Ryan, I agree about the 1/2 function.  Once I saw that in the manual I used that a lot over the past several days.  Very nice feature.  I really liked how easy the bolt pattern feature was to use.  It is very user friendly and I see myself using that a lot in the future.

I seem to always have my calculator on the lathe and one sitting on the mill table.  I am going to start using the one on the DRO and noticed you can have it import to the axis of your choice once you calculate the dimensions.  That is another feature I see myself using a lot in the future.

Mike.


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## rmack898 (Sep 8, 2014)

I was wondering when your mill was going to show up, I'm glad you had no major damage. I'm not sure I would have been as nice to the driver as you were.

Nice job on the base and power draw bar.


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## John Hasler (Sep 8, 2014)

rmack898 said:


> I was wondering when your mill was going to show up, I'm glad you had no major damage. I'm not sure I would have been as nice to the driver as you were.



I'm not so sure I'd blame the driver.  Maybe he had to take evasive action to avoid an accident.  IMHO those lag screws should not have pulled out.  Through-bolts would have been better, and I might have added diagonal bracing as well.


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## Smudgemo (Sep 8, 2014)

catoctin said:


> Thanks for the heads-up on the collet issue.  I had almost forgotten that someone else had problems with that.  -Joe



That would be me.  They said to pull the part to access the screws to adjust, but didn't mention the set screw in the back and I never thought to look.  Note that those are reverse threads, so now you have no excuse for getting it wrong.

-Ryan


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## zmotorsports (Sep 8, 2014)

Smudgemo said:


> That would be me.  They said to pull the part to access the screws to adjust, but didn't mention the set screw in the back and I never thought to look.  Note that those are reverse threads, so now you have no excuse for getting it wrong.
> 
> -Ryan



Good point Ryan, I forgot to mention that it is a left hand thread.

Mike.


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## darkzero (Sep 9, 2014)

Congrats Mike, looking good.


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## zmotorsports (Sep 9, 2014)

Thanks Will.  I appreciate that.

Mike.


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## zmotorsports (Sep 9, 2014)

rmack898 said:


> I was wondering when your mill was going to show up, I'm glad you had no major damage. I'm not sure I would have been as nice to the driver as you were.
> 
> Nice job on the base and power draw bar.



Thanks Mac, I appreciate that.


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## nickmckinney (Sep 9, 2014)

John Hasler said:


> I'm not so sure I'd blame the driver.  Maybe he had to take evasive action to avoid an accident.  IMHO those lag screws should not have pulled out.  Through-bolts would have been better, and I might have added diagonal bracing as well.



I would have to agree, you can't blame a driver for an item coming loose from inside its packaging. I know for a fact you would lose any insurance claim with those pictures.

Thats a beautiful machine and a beautiful shop. I am the same way, I can't stand a mess or grease sitting around even though it seems to grow on its own.


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## Falcon67 (Sep 9, 2014)

That is a very nice machine.  You're braver than I am - in spite of the wait I'd have likely just refused delivery.  There's no excuse for a large heavy expensive item to show up with the crate in that condition.  I don't know about Salt Lake, but I've seen how the bob tails drive in Fort Worth, Dallas and Atlanta and it's not pretty.  And I drive fast in traffic.  Having stated such, these machines put up with a lot of guff.  You think about the trip from the factory to your door and all the bump and grinding that occurs in between, then we stand 'em up and fuss over .0005 per foot of adjustment.  )

Like the stand - have to remember that when I finally get up into the knee mill territory.  Nice shop too, like the layout.


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## zmotorsports (Sep 9, 2014)

Falcon67 said:


> That is a very nice machine.  You're braver than I am - in spite of the wait I'd have likely just refused delivery.  There's no excuse for a large heavy expensive item to show up with the crate in that condition.  I don't know about Salt Lake, but I've seen how the bob tails drive in Fort Worth, Dallas and Atlanta and it's not pretty.  And I drive fast in traffic.  Having stated such, these machines put up with a lot of guff.  You think about the trip from the factory to your door and all the bump and grinding that occurs in between, then we stand 'em up and fuss over .0005 per foot of adjustment.  )
> 
> Like the stand - have to remember that when I finally get up into the knee mill territory.  Nice shop too, like the layout.



Thanks Chris.  I appreciate that.

I am anal about my tools/equipment.  Had it shown even the slightest bit of damage more than that broken handle I would have not unloaded it and refused it.  However, it appeared to be a "soft" lean and it really didn't come crashing all the way down that is why I opted to right it on the pallet and take a closer look.

After just seeing the small handle is when I opted to off-load the machine into the shop.


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## David (Sep 9, 2014)

Wow Mike, the mill and lathe compliment your shop nicely, or is it the other way around!  Anyway glad damage was minor and look forward to seeing your projects.

David


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## zmotorsports (Sep 9, 2014)

Thank you David, I appreciate that.  

I do like what I see when I walk into my shop from the front door.  I thought I had it arranged nice before but everything seems to "flow" better now as far as equipment placement.  I also am glad I hung the electrical and air lines from the ceiling as I hate having cords and hoses lying across the floor when feeding machines.  It is one thing when running an air gun or a drop light momentarily or intermittently, but to feed machines permanently I hate things on the floor.

Thanks again.


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## maker of things (Sep 9, 2014)

Mike,  you should be careful floating those clean shop pictures around.  People might feel peer pressure to clean up their shop too.  In middle school we were taught that peer pressure is bad.

Now if only there was a way you could make a new handle for your mill...

-Jon


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## zmotorsports (Sep 9, 2014)

maker of things said:


> Mike,  you should be careful floating those clean shop pictures around.  People might feel peer pressure to clean up their shop too.  In middle school we were taught that peer pressure is bad.
> 
> Now if only there was a way you could make a new handle for your mill...
> 
> -Jon



Thanks Jon, no need to have to machine a new handle.  Matt threw one in the mail and I have already received it.  Pretty good customer service if you ask me.


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## rpmMan (Sep 9, 2014)

Mike

Very nice work.. and when I grow up I want a shop like yours.. 

rich


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## zmotorsports (Sep 9, 2014)

rpmMan said:


> Mike
> 
> Very nice work.. and when I grow up I want a shop like yours..
> 
> rich



Thanks Rich.


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## Falcon67 (Sep 9, 2014)

Haha - racer types can certainly tell a soft hit from a hard hit.  

>People might feel peer pressure to clean up their shop too.  In middle school we were taught that peer pressure is bad.
Has no effect on me.  Mine sure looks clean in the pics - up close, it needs some moppin'.  Told my wife last night it was time for a systematic attack on all idle residents of the bench tops.  Except that stack of Hot Rods from 1970 by the file cabinet...

I wonder how that PM machine compares with the Turn Pro level of mill offered at Enco.


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## zmotorsports (Sep 9, 2014)

Falcon67 said:


> Haha - racer types can certainly tell a soft hit from a hard hit.
> 
> >People might feel peer pressure to clean up their shop too.  In middle school we were taught that peer pressure is bad.
> Has no effect on me.  Mine sure looks clean in the pics - up close, it needs some moppin'.  Told my wife last night it was time for a systematic attack on all idle residents of the bench tops.  Except that stack of Hot Rods from 1970 by the file cabinet...
> ...



I wondered the same thing about the Turn Pro line as they state they are of Taiwanese origin.  All I can say for certain is that this mill is leaps and bounds above the Enco BP clone at work but it is about 15 years old and gets abused by 15 maintenance mechanics, not machinists.  But even remembering back to when it was new it wasn't this nice.

I think it is nicer than my buddies Jet JVM836 as well.  He stopped by last night and didn't say too awfully much other than "its nice".  I could tell there was more but he wasn't saying and I didn't push the issue.  He is happy with his and I am happy with mine, that is all that really matters.  He did mention that he wished the head nodded and that he had a bit more Y-axis travel.  I asked him if he felt like he ever needed more table size and he didn't recall ever needing much more so that made me happy.  He seems to work on similar sized items that I do.


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## Falcon67 (Sep 9, 2014)

Yes I would shy from the base Enco.  Actually did that as the choice was a mill or a lathe.  Decided the lathe was the best bet for now and to wait and get a better grade mill.  The Turn-Pro and the PM have very similar specs.  And it'd be hard to turn away from a 30% discount if it comes.  Makes the Turn-Pro $5K.  I do like that the PM 949v seems to have have box ways.  You could -theoretically- bore a block on that and do reasonable.


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## wrmiller (Sep 9, 2014)

Very nice Mike. Never had a shop like that when I used to race bikes...  

Question if I may? Is that a 5" or 6" vise on the mill?

Thanks,
Bill


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## zmotorsports (Sep 10, 2014)

wrmiller19 said:


> Very nice Mike. Never had a shop like that when I used to race bikes...
> 
> Question if I may? Is that a 5" or 6" vise on the mill?
> 
> ...



Bill it is a 5" Glacern vise.  I love it.

Mike.


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## zmotorsports (Sep 10, 2014)

Matt sent me a replacement handle for my RPM dial and it came in the mail yesterday.  So I was able to install it which makes adjusting the RPM much, much nicer.






The only thing that I am not pleased with on the mill is the small handles for the quill lock, X-axis and Y-axis gibs.  I am sure they work perfectly and they are nice looking, however, they are a bit on the small side for my liking.  You don't have to really crank down on them, but I personally just like a bit larger handle to lock the quill and the axis with.  

I ordered a few replacement handles from McMaster Carr by size specifications and they showed up yesterday as well. 

Here is the OEM quill handle (silver) and the one I replaced it with.  The OEM handle was barely 2" from end to end whereas the replacement (black) was 2.750" in length and seemed a bit beefier by feel.  Again, nothing wrong with the OEM ones, just a personal preference.





Y-axis handle.  One on the left side of the knee.





X-axis locking handle, there are two on the front of the table.





All these larger handles take is a little bump with the hand and they are locked.  No need to apply much pressure.  I just prefer the looks and feel of the little larger handles.


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## Smudgemo (Sep 10, 2014)

Got part numbers?  I might need a few MMC items. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Falcon67 (Sep 10, 2014)

Smudgemo said:


> Got part numbers?  I might need a few MMC items.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



X2 - I can see some immediate applications on my 12x36.  My little off brand 4" vice is pretty good, but when I step up the mill I'd love to have a couple of Glacerns.  Veeery nice parts.


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## zmotorsports (Sep 10, 2014)

Smudgemo said:


> Got part numbers?  I might need a few MMC items.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Ryan, the part #for the quill handle is 6271K24 (1 req.) and the part # 6271K21 (3 req.) for the X and Y axis gib locks.

These are all McMaster Carr part #'s.


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## Smudgemo (Sep 11, 2014)

Thanks, dude.  Not sure I'll bother with replacements, but I have indeed considered stock units to be a bit small compared to the Bridgeports I've operated at the local maker school I've attended.


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## zmotorsports (Sep 11, 2014)

Smudgemo said:


> Thanks, dude.  Not sure I'll bother with replacements, but I have indeed considered stock units to be a bit small compared to the Bridgeports I've operated at the local maker school I've attended.



I agree.  At first when using the mill I thought they were a bit small compared to what I was used to but they worked fine so I didn't bother.  The more and more I used the mill over the past week + it bothered me more and more and I had to place an order @ McMaster Carr the other day so I thought what the hell all four handles for less than $35.00 I am going to order them and be done with it.  Now I am glad I did, they don't work any different but they look and feel better to me.


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## catoctin (Sep 17, 2014)

Mike,
I am going through the sparse documentation on our mills and have a few questions.  Others can chime in with input also.

1. The parts diagram for the mill indicates there is a drawbar washer.  I hunted around through the stuff shipped to me and could not find it.  Did your unit come with one and if so, where did you find it?

2.  What are you using for spindle oil?  The manual indicates Mobil DTE Light.  It looks like this is only sold in 5 gal pails.

Thanks,
-Joe


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## Ed W (Sep 19, 2014)

Hi All,





Just received my PM-935TS today and it arrived in good shape.  One thing that bothered me though is the way the limit switch for the x-axis power feed was attached to the table.  It looks like the bracket was purposely bent (see photo) to clear the table casting rather than simply adding a spacer block.  Anybody else have one like this?  Did it bother you too?  I wrote to Matt about it but haven't heard back.

Thanks.

Ed

P.S. I just looked at the last photo in post #36 of this thread and it looks like Mike's machine was installed exactly the same way.  Not really consistent with the rest of the very high quality of the machine ?!?


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## drs23 (Sep 19, 2014)

Ed W said:


> Hi All,
> 
> 
> Just received my PM-935TS today and it arrived in good shape.  One thing that bothered me though is the way the limit switch for the x-axis power feed was attached to the table.  It looks like the bracket was purposely bent (see photo) to clear the table casting rather than simply adding a spacer block.  Anybody else have one like this?  Did it bother you too?  I wrote to Matt about it but haven't heard back.
> ...



Don't sweat it. Mine came like that out of the box.


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## tmarks11 (Sep 19, 2014)

Ed W said:


> It looks like the bracket was purposely bent (see photo) to clear the table casting rather than simply adding a spacer block.


That is the joy of owning a mill.  15 minutes with a $5 chunk of aluminum will make a spacer to make your heart sing with pride.



Ed W said:


> Not really consistent with the rest of the very high quality of the machine ?!?


Of note, the table power feed is an aftermarket add-on, installed by Matt, not installed at the factory, AFAIK.  The power feed is a generic product, designed to fit almost any size and shape of mill, and requires ingenuity to make it fit in more than just a functional manner. Who even knows if the power feed was made in China or Taiwan.

If that is the only worry about the mill, than you have scored big time.  No dents, bruises, etc, which is always a concern when a 1000-2000# lump of iron is shipped 2/3 of the way around the world by train, ship, and truck (reference zmotorsports mill....)


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## Smudgemo (Sep 19, 2014)

Ed W said:


> P.S. I just looked at the last photo in post #36 of this thread and it looks like Mike's machine was installed exactly the same way.  Not really consistent with the rest of the very high quality of the machine ?!?



Same with mine.  Never gave it a thought though, and I personally don't consider it an issue.  Matt said the drive is a high quality product and I'm choosing to take him at his word.  I have had no issues whatsoever with my machine and I'll be ordering a new lathe from him when I decide my savings for frivolous things is high enough. 

-Ryan


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## Ed W (Sep 19, 2014)

You're all correct and I understand.  It just struck me the wrong way. Pay no mind. When I took the side off the crate for whatever reason it was the first thing I saw. Just knowing Matt's attention to detail I was a little surprised.


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## catoctin (Sep 20, 2014)

Ed W said:


> Hi All,
> 
> View attachment 84069
> 
> ...



My unit came the same way.  I also needed to install the spring limit stops.  No big deal the parts were in the box.

Thanks,
-Joe


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## Falcon67 (Sep 20, 2014)

I got my table drive from CDCO and the limit switch did come with a spacer.  There will be some variation between the drives and how the parts mount.  I used 20w-20 non detergent oil in my mill head.


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## zmotorsports (Sep 21, 2014)

Ed W said:


> Hi All,
> 
> View attachment 84069
> 
> ...




It isn't bent Ed, that is just the design of that particular bracket.  Make sure to install the spring style stops and adjust as they will contact the switch properly.  The ones in the picture will not make proper contact.


As far as spindle oil, I just squirt a little AW68 hydraulic oil in it as that is what I have handy and use in my lathe gearbox and apron.


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## MarioM (Oct 1, 2014)

zmotorsports said:


> My PM935TV knee mill finally arrived last Tuesday and I have spent a few days last week getting it set up and personalized a bit.
> 
> First off, I must say that now after having it for nearly a week it is everything I had hoped for.  The quality is extremely high end and compliments my PM1340GT very nicely.
> 
> ...



Congrats for your new mill.  It looks very nice.  You have a terrific shop.....I wish mine could be that big and clean.  Like the base you made for the new mill, I need one for mine.....need it a bit higher....no good to bend your knees or back to reach the front handwhell.


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## zmotorsports (Oct 1, 2014)

MarioM said:


> Congrats for your new mill.  It looks very nice.  You have a terrific shop.....I wish mine could be that big and clean.  Like the base you made for the new mill, I need one for mine.....need it a bit higher....no good to bend your knees or back to reach the front handwhell.



Thanks.  I appreciate the compliments.  I agree on the base, with my last lathe I put up with it for 16+ years as I was always going to "get around to it" but never did.  With this setup, I decided to set it up for comfort NOW or probably never would.

It is so much nicer on the back when working now.  Both the lathe and mill are setup for my son and I to use comfortably.  I also built a new pedestal for my Baldor grinder a few months ago that I had put up with for the past 15-ish or so years.  Nice to not have to kneel down to sharpen drill bits or cutting tools.)


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## jeff_g1137 (Oct 1, 2014)

hi
Nice mill, a bit to big for me, no room, but i like it. :thumbsup2:


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## Falcon67 (Oct 1, 2014)

Falcon67 said:


> I got my table drive from CDCO and the limit switch did come with a spacer.  There will be some variation between the drives and how the parts mount.  I used 20w-20 non detergent oil in my mill head.



Error - sourced from Shars.  Would have edited the post but apparently that has timed out.


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## zmotorsports (Oct 1, 2014)

jeff_g1137 said:


> hi
> Nice mill, a bit to big for me, no room, but i like it. :thumbsup2:



Thanks.  I agree with the room, had I had more of it I would have gone for a full-size 9x49 BP clone (PM machine) but can't afford to give up any more room or I wouldn't be able to fit vehicles in the shop to work on.


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## GA Gyro (Oct 1, 2014)

jeff_g1137 said:


> hi
> Nice mill, a bit to big for me, no room, but i like it. :thumbsup2:



Same here!  

I would like to have one of those... however there is a space issue... that is, height... 

A bench style head mill will have to do for now.


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## tmarks11 (Oct 1, 2014)

GA said:


> I would like to have one of those... however there is a space issue... that is, height...


Position it in a spot where the motor would extend up between ceiling joists, and cut through the sheetrock and box it in?  I have seen pictures of that done before.

Where there is a will...


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## GA Gyro (Oct 1, 2014)

tmarks11 said:


> Position it in a spot where the motor would extend up between ceiling joists, and cut through the sheetrock and box it in?  I have seen pictures of that done before.
> 
> Where there is a will...



Yeah, I know... However I do have a plan:  

My alternative is; Get a PM version of a RF45 now, then shop for a used 2/3-3/4 or full sized Bridgeport and rebuild it.  The space issue will resolve itself in a year or so.  
I did find one that is CNC'ed... have not looked at it yet.

Then I will have a light duty small mill, and a big strong mill.  Best of both worlds.


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## zmotorsports (Oct 2, 2014)

GA said:


> Yeah, I know... However I do have a plan:
> 
> My alternative is; Get a PM version of a RF45 now, then shop for a used 2/3-3/4 or full sized Bridgeport and rebuild it.  The space issue will resolve itself in a year or so.
> I did find one that is CNC'ed... have not looked at it yet.
> ...



Keep in mind a 2/3 or 3/4 size BP will be a clone as I believe the smallest vertical mill that Bridgeport made was a 9x42, I think I heard of a 9x36 but cannot confirm.

When you get into the 2/3 or 3/4 size BP clones most will not have nod, only tilt and their y-axis travel with be in the 8.75"-9" range.  Jet JVM-830 and JVM-836 seem to be the most popular in that 2/3 or 3/4 size criteria.  I believe Enco had a Taiwanese model a few years ago, model 100-1525 that I hear was a nice machine but again, did not have the nod feature and was only available in step pulley design.  Nothing wrong with step pulley design but that particular model was limited on low and high RPM compared to the full-size mills.  

I was actually looking for one for nearly a year before purchasing the PM-935TV but living in a machinery desert doesn't offer much.  Good luck in your search, I know those smaller vertical mills are out there as I know a few people who have them, but then again when I tried buying them they wouldn't part with them.  I guess that means they are happy with them at least.


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## Falcon67 (Oct 2, 2014)

I have seen a BP 9 x 36 so they do exist.  Not many I think.  The 9x42 is pretty common.  What he said on the rest - I think the 8x30 knee mill types take up just about as much floor space as a full size 9x42 up, so might as well go for the real deal.  I kinda have the same plan, maybe - stash cash (very hard to do!) and wait for a decent unit.  Or just use the credit union and buy new.


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## GA Gyro (Oct 2, 2014)

zmotorsports said:


> Keep in mind a 2/3 or 3/4 size BP will be a clone as I believe the smallest vertical mill that Bridgeport made was a 9x42, I think I heard of a 9x36 but cannot confirm.
> 
> When you get into the 2/3 or 3/4 size BP clones most will not have nod, only tilt and their y-axis travel with be in the 8.75"-9" range.  Jet JVM-830 and JVM-836 seem to be the most popular in that 2/3 or 3/4 size criteria.  I believe Enco had a Taiwanese model a few years ago, model 100-1525 that I hear was a nice machine but again, did not have the nod feature and was only available in step pulley design.  Nothing wrong with step pulley design but that particular model was limited on low and high RPM compared to the full-size mills.
> 
> I was actually looking for one for nearly a year before purchasing the PM-935TV but living in a machinery desert doesn't offer much.  Good luck in your search, I know those smaller vertical mills are out there as I know a few people who have them, but then again when I tried buying them they wouldn't part with them.  I guess that means they are happy with them at least.



THX Mike.

Having a mill, even if it is 'just' an RF45 clone... gives me the time to shop for a Bridgie.  If a plan I am working on turns out... a warehouse arrangement... then the space issue is resolved... and a full sized Bridgeport would be really cool.  

That is down the road though...

BTW: Matt has a VS version of the 932PDF... one of them has my name on it already.  
It is the head from the PM45CNC... on the 932 body.  Same VS range... the rest is a 932.  

I think I found a SWEET deal today... looking through a bunch of stuff at a warehouse, lots of odd stuff.  There was a table with about 5 SQ/FT of small boxes... ranging from 4x4" to 6x6".. each had some tools in it: end mills, drills with MT taper shanks, chuck on a taper shank, center drills, tool blanks, carbide inserts, just all kinds of stuff.  There was not time to really get into it... however I asked if I could come back and pick through it and work out a price... was told yes.  Now here is the good part... A lot of the mills and drills, still have the shipping coatings on them...  
Guy said he had another bunch of boxes of 'that stuff' (sounds like he may not know much about it), if I wanted to look at it... well YE-AH...


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## szenieh (Nov 28, 2018)

zmotorsports said:


> My PM935TV knee mill finally arrived last Tuesday and I have spent a few days last week getting it set up and personalized a bit.
> 
> First off, I must say that now after having it for nearly a week it is everything I had hoped for.  The quality is extremely high end and compliments my PM1340GT very nicely.
> 
> ...


Hello Mike,
The pin sizes for that collar seems 3/16". The only pin spanner wrench on McMaster Carr with that pin size has 2" maximum range. The holes seem more than 2" apart. Can you confirm that? McMaster also has a 4.8mm pin size that opens up to 100 mm which should work but pin might be hard to get into that hole. It is also twice as expensive. Any help would be appreciated.

Salah


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## petertha (Nov 28, 2018)

I removed mine with a dedicated homebrew wrench contraption that you will laugh at but it worked. I will post pictures tonight. I used 3/16" dia drill rod pins & can upload PDF. I heard that some of the commercial pin wrenches which satisfy the span criteria still may need to be modified with respect to the hubs ground or pins remachined/extended in order to function properly. I've also heard of people putting in a brass pin & doing the hammer tap-tap in a radial fashion, but mine refused.

A proper dedicated wrench would be a useful & relatively inexpensive tool to be included in the toolbox IMO. I'll donate my CAD diagram if someone wants to do the laser/water cutting from 1/8" plate. I also have a feeling it will be a similar lack of tool episode to re-clock the spring tension on the quill, but haven't gotten that far yet.

Also before I forget, realize that there is a set screw which acts against the threads. I suppose its intent is to prevent rotation but its a bit of fromage engineering IMO. Its very important that this is first loosened before unscrewing the nose, otherwise strong probability of buggering up the threads &requiring excessive torque. So glad PM shows some pics of this in their spruced up user document.
https://www.hobby-machinist.com/threads/935-spindle-nose-piece-removal.74301/#post-623063


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## szenieh (Nov 28, 2018)

petertha said:


> I removed mine with a dedicated homebrew wrench contraption that you will laugh at but it worked. I will post pictures tonight. I used 3/16" dia drill rod pins & can upload PDF. I heard that some of the commercial pin wrenches which satisfy the span criteria still may need to be modified with respect to the hubs ground or pins remachined/extended in order to function properly. I've also heard of people putting in a brass pin & doing the hammer tap-tap in a radial fashion, but mine refused.
> 
> A proper dedicated wrench would be a useful & relatively inexpensive tool to be included in the toolbox IMO. I'll donate my CAD diagram if someone wants to do the laser/water cutting from 1/8" plate. I also have a feeling it will be a similar lack of tool episode to re-clock the spring tension on the quill, but haven't gotten that far yet.
> 
> ...



Thanks a lot for your quick reply. I would love a pdf drawing of what you made. I did see that set screw in the back of the quill to lock the threads. I did back it out. This is a left-hand thread also, I guess.

Thanks for your help.


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## davidpbest (Nov 28, 2018)

Yes, the nose piece is left-hand threads.  And you will discover that it is on there quite tight.   

For the life of me I do not understand why that set screw is used because it presses directly on the threads of the nose piece (bad practice) and if you tighten that set screw enough to actually do something useful (like preventing the nose piece from unscrewing), you will discover that the quill retract spring isn’t strong enough (even when tightened to the max) to fully retract the quill.  

The relationship between that set screw tightness and the quill movement stickiness eludes me completely, but it’s real.  I’ve fussed with that endlessly.  I also put a copper ball under a shorter set screw so it doesn’t chowder up the threads on the nose piece.


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## petertha (Nov 28, 2018)

As mentioned I thought it might be worth making an inexpensive pin spanner with wood scrap on hand. I figured if I lucked out it didn’t cost me anything. If it broke, well, then I knew what I was up against. It has 2 lamination's of 3/8” ply on the head. Pins are 3/16” drill rod pressed in. I left the head as a round donut for strength in case I measured wrong or if it took a few tries & ripped the pins out I could drill more holes. Turns out it fits pretty well as shown. The proper tool would be something like 1/8" steel plate.


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## szenieh (Nov 28, 2018)

petertha said:


> As mentioned I thought it might be worth making an inexpensive pin spanner with wood scrap on hand. I figured if I lucked out it didn’t cost me anything. If it broke, well, then I knew what I was up against. It has 2 lamination's of 3/8” ply on the head. Pins are 3/16” drill rod pressed in. I left the head as a round donut for strength in case I measured wrong or if it took a few tries & ripped the pins out I could drill more holes. Turns out it fits pretty well as shown. The proper tool would be something like 1/8" steel plate.



Thanks a lot for sharing. This would be a very helpful tool to have on hand.


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## szenieh (Nov 28, 2018)

davidpbest said:


> Yes, the nose piece is left-hand threads.  And you will discover that it is on there quite tight.
> 
> For the life of me I do not understand why that set screw is used because it presses directly on the threads of the nose piece (bad practice) and if you tighten that set screw enough to actually do something useful (like preventing the nose piece from unscrewing), you will discover that the quill retract spring isn’t strong enough (even when tightened to the max) to fully retract the quill.
> 
> The relationship between that set screw tightness and the quill movement stickiness eludes me completely, but it’s real.  I’ve fussed with that endlessly.  I also put a copper ball under a shorter set screw so it doesn’t chowder up the threads on the nose piece.



Thanks for the information and for confirming that it is a left hand thread. That relationship between the set screw tightness and quill movement stickiness is peculiar- got me curious. I will sure look into that in my machine. But first, I have to get that nose nut released. For me, many of my R8 collets fit just fine. My 3/4" collet did not, but, all the other ones I tried do fit. Seems to be set right on the edge of the tolerance on that slot in the collet.


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## petertha (Nov 29, 2018)

Yes check all your R8 tool slot fits while you are tweaking the combo set screws - the inner dog point set screw followed by outer jam nut set screw. Mine were not loose but not exactly tight either. I suspect if they aren't snugged decent, the dog point screw could just thread itself inward unhindered over time & end up rubbing the slot & prevent tool from going in all over again. I was tempted to clean them with thinner & use a dot of blue Loctite to hold position, but chickened out for now & just snugged them together.


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## szenieh (Nov 29, 2018)

petertha said:


> Yes check all your R8 tool slot fits while you are tweaking the combo set screws - the inner dog point set screw followed by outer jam nut set screw. Mine were not loose but not exactly tight either. I suspect if they aren't snugged decent, the dog point screw could just thread itself inward unhindered over time & end up rubbing the slot & prevent tool from going in all over again. I was tempted to clean them with thinner & use a dot of blue Loctite to hold position, but chickened out for now & just snugged them together.



Good point. Thanks for the heads-up. I didn't think about that.

I also have another question. The spindle spins CW on the REV setting of the switch which I find odd. Is there a fix for that?

Thank you for all your help.


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## petertha (Nov 29, 2018)

excerpt from page 6 of PM manual talks about this if that's what you mean.


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## mksj (Nov 29, 2018)

Almost all Bridgeport style mills run in the opposite direction (i.e. Rev. is now For.)  when in back gear because of the gear arrangement. On some Bridgeport mills I recall they had a separate switch which you needed to flip to reverse the motor leads. The switch arrangement would vary based on single phase vs. 3 phase and if you are running a VFD. With a VFD, you can use a small micro switch that is engaged by the back gear lever and reverse the VFD run commands. This also varies depending on 2 wire or 3 wire control. On my mill I use a proximity sensor which then triggers a relay which reverses the VFD inputs when in back gear.

My mill came with a digital head (factory VFD), so it has both a mechanical switch which sets the tachometer range (Hi/Low) and a proximity sensor which can be seen as activated below with the mill in back gear.


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## ddickey (Nov 29, 2018)

My spring return is sticky also but I don't think that is unusual. I've felt that in a few other mills.


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## davidpbest (Nov 29, 2018)

ddickey said:


> My spring return is sticky also but I don't think that is unusual. I've felt that in a few other mills.


One of the reasons I dislike the J-head style - positively 19th century design.  My Rong Fu 45 had a much better designed head.   Sill looking for that Deckel FP2.


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## ddickey (Nov 29, 2018)

Agree.


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## petertha (Nov 29, 2018)

I also feel a certain 'non-linearity' to my 935 quill spring pressure down around 70% of travel. Its not a problem, but also not the silky smooth feel like when I first traversed the 935 table & said mmm... me-like-a. The down force tension feels about right, maybe a bit on the resistance side for small drills. But I figure if I reduce spring tension it will retract even more sluggish than it does now. OTOH I also don't have much run time yet so maybe things loosen up a bit over time? I'm strongly biased to only one machine, my ex RF-45. It was smooth & linear tension going down the whole travel & self retracted quite quickly. Not unlike my drill press I guess.


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