# 'new' Powr-kraft 10" Lathe And Some Questions.



## T. J.

Well, after owning my first lathe (Craftsman/Atlas 6") for only a few months, I'm already 'upgrading'!  Over the weekend, I picked up a Powr-Kraft (Logan) model 15TLC-2136 while traveling to visit family.  I wasn't really shopping, but here on the high plains, this stuff is scarce and you better get it when you can (at least that's what I told my wife).  The man I bought it from acquired it when he bought his deceased neighbor's machine tools.  He tells me that it was in pieces when he got it and that he replaced several gears in the headstock and QCGB as he was putting it back together.  It runs smoothly and everything seems to work as it should.

I've attached some pics of it in its temporary location in my barn.  The bench it's on came with it, but it's much too large for my shop, so I'll have to build a new one.  You'll notice the 'two-tone' paint scheme.  According to the Logan website, the 2136's weren't shipped with a QCGB, so that was probably added later.  I'm wondering about the headstock cover and gear cover though.  There is a gap between the headstock and the cover when it's closed.  Also, the hole in the gear cover doesn't line up exactly with the spindle.  Do you think these are unoriginal parts, or is that just the way they came?  Right now I'm cleaning it up and trying to decide whether or not I want to disassemble and paint it...


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## eeler1

Nice looking machine, and a bit of tooling too, good for you!  On the fit, original or not, those are adjustable on every Logan I've seen, using the brackets and such on the rear of the headstock where they attach.  If not original, they look like similar replacements.


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## bama7

T. J. said:


> Well, after owning my first lathe (Craftsman/Atlas 6") for only a few months, I'm already 'upgrading'!  Over the weekend, I picked up a Powr-Kraft (Logan) model 15TLC-2136 while traveling to visit family.  I wasn't really shopping, but here on the high plains, this stuff is scarce and you better get it when you can (at least that's what I told my wife).  The man I bought it from acquired it when he bought his deceased neighbor's machine tools.  He tells me that it was in pieces when he got it and that he replaced several gears in the headstock and QCGB as he was putting it back together.  It runs smoothly and everything seems to work as it should.
> 
> I've attached some pics of it in its temporary location in my barn.  The bench it's on came with it, but it's much too large for my shop, so I'll have to build a new one.  You'll notice the 'two-tone' paint scheme.  According to the Logan website, the 2136's weren't shipped with a QCGB, so that was probably added later.  I'm wondering about the headstock cover and gear cover though.  There is a gap between the headstock and the cover when it's closed.  Also, the hole in the gear cover doesn't line up exactly with the spindle.  Do you think these are unoriginal parts, or is that just the way they came?  Right now I'm cleaning it up and trying to decide whether or not I want to disassemble and paint it...
> 
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When I first got my Powr-Kraft I took it all apart, cleaned, and painted it.  I wish now I would have just done a good cleaning and inspection without taking it apart.  I would have ran it for awhile to see if it had any issues that needed to be addressed first.  After all the "kinks" had been worked out I would then have put thought into a paint job.  Hide sight is a wonderful thing.  I would not be having the problems I am having now second guessing what might be wrong or what I might have caused to be wrong.


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## T. J.

eeler1 said:


> Nice looking machine, and a bit of tooling too, good for you!  On the fit, original or not, those are adjustable on every Logan I've seen, using the brackets and such on the rear of the headstock where they attach.  If not original, they look like similar replacements.


Thanks, I'll try adjusting them this weekend.



bama7 said:


> When I first got my Powr-Kraft I took it all apart, cleaned, and painted it.  I wish now I would have just done a good cleaning and inspection without taking it apart.  I would have ran it for awhile to see if it had any issues that needed to be addressed first.  After all the "kinks" had been worked out I would then have put thought into a paint job.


Thanks bama. I think that's probably what I'm gonna do. I haven't had much time to mess with it yet. I have cleaned up the ways and mounted the countershaft. Hopefully I can get the motor hooked back up and make a few chips this weekend. Some issues I've identified so far:

The bronze bearings on the countershaft need to be replaced. 
The turret tool post is cracked on one side from someone tightening the set screws on a toolbit too tight. (I was planning on getting a QCTP eventually anyway, but now there's already one on the way from Enco thanks to their sale)
Hopefully I can report some progress by tomorrow!


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## bama7

Glad to hear!  I got everything working good on mine today except for the "thread dial".  I am supposed to get one in the Tuesday mail.  Really looking forward to having this project done.  Then I can get to the Logan 1825 project!


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## T. J.

I got to spend a little time with the lathe on Saturday. I got a few layers of crud off of it and even found some original Logan blue gray paint on the carriage!  Per eeler1's advise, I was able to get the gear cover aligned properly. For the belt cover, it looks like I'll need to take it off and do some light filing on the mounting brackets - no big deal.   I got the motor wired up and made a few cuts on some 3/4" cold roll - very nice!  Here's a couple of pics, plus one of the broken tool post. Just one more turn...


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## bama7

Doin good and glad to hear it!  I will never be a machinist, but these machines just fascinate me.


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## T Bredehoft

bama7 said:


> I will never be a machinist,



Don't be a defeatist, who knows what you will achieve, hobby or not, if you can make stuff for your bike. it doesn't matter what the world calls you.


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## T. J.

T Bredehoft said:


> Don't be a defeatist, who knows what you will achieve, hobby or not, if you can make stuff for your bike. it doesn't matter what the world calls you.



:+1:


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## bama7

T Bredehoft said:


> Don't be a defeatist, who knows what you will achieve, hobby or not, if you can make stuff for your bike. it doesn't matter what the world calls you.



I have been called many things in my 67 years on earth, but machinist isn't one of them.  I did not mean for that to be a statement of defeatism.  I know my limitations.  I truly believe I have the capability to make many things with a lathe.  I just need to take the time and effort to make things happen.  I worked on and around jet aircraft for almost 40 years.  Keep your heads covered and beware of falling objects!


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## T. J.

I thought I'd revive this thread to show some progress on the lathe. I acquired a chip pan off eBay and built some legs for it. The pan was from a slightly longer lathe, so I had to weld up the bolt holes and drill new ones. Since I had to disassemble the lathe to move it to its permanent home in my shop, I figured I just as well paint it too.  I'm using Sherwin-Williams All Purpose Enamel matched to Benjamin-Moore's 'Baby seal black' color. More pics to come as progress continues.


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## francist

Ooo, I like that colour! 

-frank


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## T. J.

Making progress...






All that's left to paint is the headstock and QCGB, then on to reassembly. 

Frank- the paint is Sherwin-Williams All-purpose enamel matched to Benjamin-Moore's 'Baby seal black' color. I would have preferred S-W Industrial enamel, but it only comes in gallons.


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## Silverbullet

That four way tool post must have been weak. I've snapped Allen wrenches in two or twisted the ends off. But I've never broken a tool post. That may have hit the chuck while running. Would be my guess. Nice machines I have the 11" LOGAN , had it for thirty years or more. With a little care and oiling most will last longer then we will.


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## wa5cab

Looks like Navy blue.


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## TomKro

Looking good, and a really nice job putting together those legs.


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## T. J.

Assembly is coming along nicely. Now I have a question about the cross slide nut. The nut is a two-piece assembly as shown in the pics. 







My assumption is that this setup is to allow removal of backlash from the cross slide. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong. The owners manual doesn't say anything about adjustment and the parts list doesn't illustrate this detail. When installed on the screw, there is about a .055" gap between the two halves. I was concerned about the pinching effect of tightening the screws causing undue wear on the screw. I solved that somewhat by placing a flat washer (.045" thick) between the halves. There was room for a washer on only one screw. It now looks like this:
	

		
			
		

		
	




The screws can be snugged up to where there is no detectable backlash in the cross slide. Does this look reasonable?  Is this an original Logan nut, or an addition by a previous owner?

Thanks!


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## CluelessNewB

I haven't seen a Logan with a nut like that before.   I suspect it was a PO addition.


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## wa5cab

Over the past couple of years I've looked through several logan manuals on different size machines and haven't seen anything like that.  But even if I hadn't I would spot it as an obvious owner mod.  There is almost no space for the threads for the screws.  A factory design would have looked like an un-modifed nut with the slab added to it.  And would probably have had an "E" shaped shim pack.

The nut was probably worn and a PO did that instead of what he should have done, which is get a new nut.


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## markba633csi

So T.J. did you have to buy some Benjamin Moore baby seal black and take it over to a Sherwin Williams store? Or can they match it just from the name from some fancy code-book? Also do you find SW enamel better than BM's?  Why not just use BM?
Mark S.


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## T. J.

The SW store actually had a BM color book and could match the two codes. My choice of brands was nothing more scientific than the SW store is handier for me to get to.


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## Nogoingback

That is a GREAT looking color.  It's so good, I'm almost (but not quite) motivated enough to paint mine too.


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## T. J.

I will say that the baby seal black is a very close, but not exact match to the original paint on mine. The most important thing to me though is that it's all painted - with the same color all over!  It's been a long project, but I'm glad I did it. 

It's getting close to being fully assembled. I found that I can't mount the Harbor Freight motor that came with it without installing a riser between the countershaft assembly and chip pan. I was planning on replacing that motor eventually anyway so I decided to do it now. There's a new Baldor 1/2 HP 3 phase motor on the way.


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## Nogoingback

Well, it looks very nice.  My project lathe is sort of camouflaged:  currently 4 different colors and that doesn't include the motor!


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## T. J.

It's getting really close now. I'm waiting on the paint to dry on a couple of hinge brackets for the headstock, then I can finish the reassembly. Detailed pics to follow!

I have a question regarding the name plates. The switch plate and feed chart were painted black, but the Powr-Kraft nameplate on the headstock was a sort of brown color. It can be seen in the pics in my earlier posts. Is that the original color, or was it black too?


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## Nogoingback

Are you making chips yet?


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## T. J.

Yes!  I got the electrical work done over thanksgiving. I am now in the process of making leveling feet for the lathe. Once I get those done and finish the name plates, I'll post some more photos!


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## Nogoingback

Great!  Looking forward to pics...


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## T. J.

I finally got some more photos taken!

First, here are the leveling feet that I made:


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## T. J.

And here is the more or less finished product:









More to follow...


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## T. J.




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## T. J.

This has been quite a project and I've learned a lot. Here are a few observations and things I would do differently if I ever do another one. 


Old paint is more durable than new paint. The newer paint stripped easily with chemical stripper, but it wouldn't touch the original paint. It was removed with a wire wheel. 
I painted the legs and chip pan with a HVLP spray gun, but chose to brush paint the lathe. This was fine for the rougher castings, but the parts that had been sanded smooth (i.e. headstock covers, compound, cross slide screw cover) have obvious brush marks. These should have been sprayed. 
I bought a parts washer from Harbor Freight and used the PSC-1000 solvent from Tractor Supply. This was an invaluable tool for cleaning up the parts after disassembly. 
The legs I built aren't as solid as I would like. There is considerable side-to-side wobble (along the lathe's long axis). I will have to add some cross braces on the back legs to minimize this.
Overall, I'm very happy with the lathe. Now to make some chips!


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## francist

That's a great looking machine, TJ. Very nice.

-frank


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## brino

TJ,

Great job!
Thanks for sharing your journey and what you learned along the way.
That is valuable info for anyone else starting their own refurb.
It is much appreciated.

-brino


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## eeler1

Wow, that turned out nice!  

On the legs not being as rigid as you hoped, the pic looks like about the same surface area under the lathe feet as the old Logan lathes.  Of course, those were cast and had virtually no 'give' at all.  Also a heavier material (thicker).  But the older legs also had that curvy art-deco look.  So the feet were broader apart front/back, and also sat a few inches outside, compared to where they connected up to the feet of the lathe bed.  A bigger footprint so to speak, like an a-frame.

Bracing ought to cure any movement in the stand.  So just my ramblings on machine stands.


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## T. J.

Thanks!  I tried to roughly duplicate the dimensions of the Logan legs, however not nearly as curvy .  I think mine are wider from front to back (18") because I allowed enough area on the top to bolt the countershaft assembly to it. 

The legs are pretty rigid themselves. I think the play is coming from where they bolt to the lathe. The bolt holes on the lathe bed feet have a slight boss on the underside.  This creates a pivot point.  I assume that the boss is desirable for leveling purposes - so as not to create undue stress on the lathe bed by having contact anywhere other than right at the bolt.


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## Nogoingback

Very nicely done:  your paint looks great.  It's just not dirty enough yet...


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## CluelessNewB

You "Baby Seal Black" paint job makes me almost want to repaint my Logan.  Nice job!


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## jperry109

How do you like the operation of this lathe? I'm looking at the same machine tomorrow for purchase and wonder what your feedback is now that you've been running it for a few years. Any specific things to watch for with this specific lathe? I'm an experienced machine buyer but have not owned or used this specific machine before. Thanks.


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## jperry109

BTW, beautiful job on your restoration.


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## T. J.

Thanks.  It has worked well for me, and I'm happy that I bought it and spent the time on it.  That said, every machine has its weaknesses and this one has its fair share.  Here are a few of the things I don't like about it:

Small spindle through hole (25/32") - limits the size of stock that can pass through and doesn't allow for using 5c collets in the spindle nose.  
Plain apron - all feeding is powered by the lead screw.  Also, no clutch.
As a result of the above, the finest feed is 0.004" per revolution.  I often wish for a finer feed to produce a better surface finish.
Underpowered.  Mine has a 1/2 HP motor (which is what the machine is spec'ed for).  You're not going to be doing any "hogging"
Those are the main drawbacks for me.  As with everything, YMMV and that mostly depends on the kind of work you plan on doing.  Fill us in if you wind up buying it and of course ask questions if you have them!


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## jperry109

Thanks for the reply. All good info. I didn't know the Powr-Kraft couldn't use the 5C collets. I bet the specific collets for this machine are hard to find. I knew the spindle hole was small but can likely work around that. The feed rates may bother me a bit. I'll look at it tomorrow and provide feedback. Thanks again.


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## T. J.

It will take 3AT collets.  They're not as common as 5c, but they are available.


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## CluelessNewB

You can use 5C collets with a 5C collet chuck but it's not ideal since it increases the overhang and runout.   That's what I have on my Logan 820 and has been good enuf for me.


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## jperry109

Very helpful, thank you. It's come down to this machine and a larger 11" Logan table lathe which has the 1.375 spindle hole, automatic apron and motor under the table. Same price but the bigger machine will require rigging costs. It's 850 lbs versus the Powr-Kraft at 450.


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## wa5cab

The larger through-hole requires a larger spindle nose which means that generally almost everything that goes on the spindle will cost more at least when new, and some when used.  This usually includes the lathe itself although you say it isn't true with what you are looking at.  So it usually depends upon what your pocketbook can stand.


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## jperry109

I bought the Powr-Kraft lathe tonight. I have one reservation about the purchase and would appreciate your thoughts. The lathe sat for 15 years unused. It's in a heated dry space but the spindle was stuck at first. I released the spindle so it should move freely and it did not. After sometime I muscled it and it broke free and began to move. The more we spun it, the easier it got. Makes sense. However, it didn't move as freely as I thought it should. I'd describe the sensation as feeling the ball bearings moving around in the bearing race. I suspect the bearings are not sealed and likely filled with dust and debris over 15 years. Thoughts?

The lathe included the original 3-jaw chuck, a face plate, three drive dogs, basic original tooling. It's on it's original cast iron legs and oil pan. The ways are in good condition. All seemed right. I paid $750. How'd I do?


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## jperry109

It also includes the quick change gearbox. I left that out.


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## T. J.

Used machinery prices vary according to what part of the country you're in.  To me, it sounds like a steal.  But if the spindle bearings are shot, you're not done spending money yet 

The Logan spindle bearings are supposed to be "permanently" lubricated, but remember that lube is at least 50 years old.  Check the spindle runout with a DTI and see what you get.  Once you have it under power, run it and see if the bearing gets hot.  If you need to replace the bearings, I believe there is at least one thread here dealing with that process.  I won't be much help, since that's the only part of my lathe I didn't tear apart.


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## jperry109

I tore down the Powr-Kraft lathe. I was able to salvage the front spindle bearing by irrigating and repacking it. But the back bearing was toasted and sealed. I ordered the back bearing and it should ship out today. I "refreshed" all components of the lathe. It's in remarkable condition. The ways are spotless. The screws have very little backlash. It should be a nice little machine once complete. I'm upgrading it with a forward/reverse switch but may put a 2.5HP DC motor and tachometer on it for finer control. I have both from another project I abandoned. 

I can see where the manual apron may represent a challenge to finish quality. I may make a tool holder for a grinding stone to take off any threading that occurs. No pictures yet. Still in pieces.


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## Mikinvt

T. J. said:


> And here is the more or less finished product:
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> More to follow...


Hello
How does your countershaft attach to the chip pan?  Is there a bracket that attaches it to the feet?


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## T. J.

Mikinvt said:


> Hello
> How does your countershaft attach to the chip pan?  Is there a bracket that attaches it to the feet?


It bolts directly to the legs with the chip pan sandwiched in between. The leg frames have a piece of 3/8” thick plate on top that the lathe feet and countershaft bracket bolt to.


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