# Open Wheel



## Robert LaLonde (Sep 14, 2017)

I recently picked up a second cheap import bench grinder.  The plan is to take my slightly newer old import bench grinder and throw a couple brushes on it using the new to me older import bench grinder for tool grinding.  I've made spacers for one wire wheel already and installed it, but have not replaced the outer wheel cover.  The even spaced out 3/16 of an inch the wire brushes the inner cover a little bit.  I'm debating removing the inner cover as well and running the wire brushes open wheel.  That bothers me.  I know it probably shouldn't, but it does.  Other than throwing wires in unexpected directions when the brush wears out what other issues are there?  

The other part of the plan is to make the table on my bench grinder stand longer, and mount the two grinders back to back with some space in between.  I've got an extra cast iron table saw leaf that should do nicely.


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## ch2co (Sep 14, 2017)

Remember the first rule, you can't just explain stuff, you have to provide photographic evidence. 
And the second rule is the same as the first.


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## Bob Korves (Sep 14, 2017)

Bob La Londe said:


> I recently picked up a second cheap import bench grinder.  The plan is to take my slightly newer old import bench grinder and throw a couple brushes on it using the new to me older import bench grinder for tool grinding.  I've made spacers for one wire wheel already and installed it, but have not replaced the outer wheel cover.  The even spaced out 3/16 of an inch the wire brushes the inner cover a little bit.  I'm debating removing the inner cover as well and running the wire brushes open wheel.  That bothers me.  I know it probably shouldn't, but it does.  Other than throwing wires in unexpected directions when the brush wears out what other issues are there?
> 
> The other part of the plan is to make the table on my bench grinder stand longer, and mount the two grinders back to back with some space in between.  I've got an extra cast iron table saw leaf that should do nicely.


I have a grinder with brushes on it, and I leave the guards on it until they need to come off to get to the work, then take them off and work even more carefully.  After brushing the difficult areas I put the guards right back on.  The more brush exposed, the more danger, to parts and to flesh and eyes...


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## DHarris (Sep 15, 2017)

I agree with Bob. I was using a wire brush on my grinder (with all covers on) and one of those pesky little wires came of and still managed to hit my wife who was ~7' away and off to the side in the garage.  I don't even want to think about the carnage an uncovered 8" wire brush could cause in it's normal "sheading" process during use!  Just my $0.02 worth.


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## Bob Korves (Sep 15, 2017)

I have had many wires off wheels stuck  in my apron.  Glad I was wearing it, and full goggles, not just safety glasses.


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## Laytonnz (Sep 15, 2017)

Bob Korves said:


> I have had many wires off wheels stuck  in my apron.  Glad I was wearing it, and full goggles, not just safety glasses.


They are savage! I've had my fair share of wire in my arms, hands ect.. I find them in my cloths days later! 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk


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## kd4gij (Sep 15, 2017)

I thought this was about dirt track racing.


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## brino (Sep 15, 2017)

Bob La Londe said:


> Other than throwing wires in unexpected directions when the brush wears out what other issues are there?



1) It'll grab any cloth (long sleeves, gloves, etc.) and wind them in quick with no guard to jam against and slow/stop the wheel.
(of course those things are a hazard anyway.....it just makes it worse.)
2) It'll grab a corner of a part and throw it hard in an unpredictable direction (down, back, up) 

Now with that said, I do run a wire wheel on a bench grinder without guards....but I respect the inherent danger.



Bob Korves said:


> and full goggles, not just safety glasses.



I would go one step better and say full face shield _AND_  safety glasses/goggles with side protection.
I've had a wire in my lip, and heard a story here about one up someones nose.....that's gotta hurt!

-brino


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## Bob Korves (Sep 15, 2017)

brino said:


> I would go one step better and say full face shield _AND_ safety glasses/goggles with side protection.
> I've had a wire in my lip, and heard a story here about one up someones nose.....that's gotta hurt!
> 
> -brino


I have done the both goggles and visor thing at times, but then I get to asking myself if perhaps I am trying something I should not be trying, and I regroup, but often do end up wearing the double eye protection.  Actually triple, I wear polycarbonate prescription glasses as well.  It definitely reduces my vision for seeing the work, but then so do sharp needles in your eyes, long term...


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## Bob Korves (Sep 15, 2017)

The problem with wearing multiple eye protection is that they fog up badly...


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## 4GSR (Sep 16, 2017)

Bob Korves said:


> The problem with wearing multiple eye protection is that they fog up badly...


Don't breathe so hard!

Sorry Bob.


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## Robert LaLonde (Sep 16, 2017)

Well, I decided to go open wheel.  I am sure I'll catch flack for it, but I work by myself in the shop all day, and I can easily hang one of my face shields over the wheel so I have to pick it up to turn on the grinder.  I already use one when using the angle grinders anyway, so its no big deal.  I keep several around the shop in places where I use them.  Just like I keep safety glasses hanging off the side of the enclosure for my big (for me) mill.  I don't have any leather aprons, and I definitely do not wear long sleeves or a coat in the shop, but I do have full length denim aprons I wear when I remember to.


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## brino (Sep 16, 2017)

Bob La Londe said:


> I am sure I'll catch flack for it



....hopefully not literally!


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## wlburton (Sep 16, 2017)

I have two steel wire wheels, a 6" fine and a 4" very fine (.006 wire) mounted on a 1/2 hp motor, which I use all the time--mostly for rust removal and cleaning off steel parts and tools.  I have a rule for myself that the motor NEVER gets switched on if I'm not wearing the full face shield (plus my regular glasses) which hangs above it.  I also try not to stand directly in front of it.  These rules really apply for any wire wheel, enclosed or not.  Aside from the occasional wire in my apron or shirt I don't think there's any problem.  The very fine wheel is great because it will remove thin oxides and dirt but doesn't noticeably scratch steel.

Bill


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## Terrywerm (Sep 17, 2017)

I have two wire wheels also, both 6". They are mounted on an old bench grinder arbor, which is connected to the motor via a v-belt. The arbor and motor are mounted to a piece of 3/4" plywood that is suspended beneath my bench out in the garage. The two wheels are unguarded, but are covered by the bench top, partially guarding them at least. I've been using them that way for over twenty years, never a bit of trouble, but like others have said, you have to respect those wire wheels and take a very serious and careful approach when working with them.


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## xman_charl (Sep 17, 2017)

This 8 inch grinder and 8 inch wire wheel works well for me.











Charl


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## Robert LaLonde (Sep 17, 2017)

Another open wheel...  

See it really happened.  ~PICTURES~  This stand already feels more solid than my old commercial grinder stand.  Once I get that "open wheel" filled with concrete I won't want to move it but once.  I decided that the base wasn't big enough or heavy enough on my old grinder stand, so I decided to make a whole new one instead.  

Nothing is bolted down yet.  I'll probably use my old grinder stand for my little 1x30 belt grinder to get it off the work bench.


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## Robert LaLonde (Sep 17, 2017)

Just poured about 100lbs of Quick-Crete into that wheel.


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## shoeboxpaul (Oct 1, 2017)

Bob Korves said:


> I have had many wires off wheels stuck  in my apron.  Glad I was wearing it, and full goggles, not just safety glasses.


An apron, thanks for the tip. I have carried wire  from the wire wheel into my house, getting the carpet and they having to pick it out of my foot. A dedicated apron should help tremendously. Thanks again.


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## woodchucker (Oct 1, 2017)

Bob Korves said:


> I have had many wires off wheels stuck  in my apron.  Glad I was wearing it, and full goggles, not just safety glasses.


For that reason I prefer knotted wheels on my hand grinders,


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## dlane (Oct 1, 2017)

"This stand already feels more solid than my old commercialgrinder stand"

Bob is that post gona stay attached to the cast top, looks like a week link 
 hate it when a grinder lands on my big toe  .
Think ied try using angle iron welded to post and bolted to the cast , may have to grind out the cast Webs a little or use spacer material, ied use two 180* apart .
Other than that should be a good grinder stand .


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## talvare (Oct 1, 2017)

I have two bench grinders with wire wheels on them and have removed the guards from both. I HATE guards with wire wheels or buffing wheels. When using wire wheels, it's not "if" it will snatch a part from your hands, it's "when and how often". My experience has been that when a wire wheel grabs a part from my hands without guards in place, it just throws the part to the floor and it may ricochet off the back wall, but when the guard is in place, it will suck the part through the guard while trying to pull my hand with it and it usually spits the part back out at high velocity smacking my fingers before I can react quick enough to get them out of the way. I have had hundreds of wires stuck in my clothing and a few in my skin, but none of it has been of any real concern.  As mentioned by Bob here, a shop apron helps a lot and ALWAYS wear a face shield with safety glasses.

Ted


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## dlane (Oct 2, 2017)

My buffing center is on a roll around cart with three bolted down double wheel buffers no guards
My grinders have guards on them , flying rocks = no fun


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## GoceKU (Oct 2, 2017)

I would suggest attach the stand to something more solid, you don't want your bench grinder moving at all when using it.Especially with the open wheel, it can grab you.


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## dlane (Oct 2, 2017)

My roll around has locking wheels but I don't use them because it weighs 400# it don't move
The attachment of the post to the cast iron table in Bobs stand above looks scary , hope he's careful with that .


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## crazypj (Oct 2, 2017)

GoceKU said:


> I would suggest attach the stand to something more solid, you don't want your bench grinder moving at all when using it.Especially with the open wheel, it can grab you.


 I agree with that, te 'legs' need to be at least. as long as grinding position. Wouldn't be a big deal to weld on some more square section then attach hinges for fold out 'stabilisers'. Extra mass at base also keeps things steady. Apart from that, to original question, open wheel, 8" wire brush, full face shield. Using guard and rest, OUCH. Only time I did that (wire brushing rusty side stand for Yamaha RD250, 1978, in 1978), wire in the eye bounced off tool rest. Having a very large sweaty male nurse hold your ead steady while a doctor probes around your eye with a hypodermic needle using syringe body as handle tends to stick in your memory for some reason?


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## Robert LaLonde (Oct 2, 2017)

dlane said:


> My roll around has locking wheels but I don't use them because it weighs 400# it don't move
> The attachment of the post to the cast iron table in Bobs stand above looks scary , hope he's careful with that .



It welded more like cast steel than cast iron.  Of course without a metallurgical analysis I can't convince anybody of that.  LOL.  The steel tube is actually wedged between the webs on the bottom of the table, and then welded up everywhere the stinger would reach.  In order to break loose it would take multiple simultaneous failures.




GoceKU said:


> I would suggest attach the stand to something more solid, you don't want your bench grinder moving at all when using it.Especially with the open wheel, it can grab you.



Have you seen a commercial grinder stand?  They are light weight flimsy contraptions that you have to put your foot on if you lean into the grinder even a little bit.  If you bolt it to the floor with a some redheads and drill it and bolt it hard once you find your height its ok, but that doesn't work out very well in a home shop or even some production shops where space is at a premium for some projects. 

Full of concrete as it is now it doesn't move unless I grab it and tilt it.  Mass makes a difference.  I would have liked a little more mass, but that 16" wheel off one of my 3/4 ton work trucks was the biggest one I had.  Well, I do have some 17" wheels, but they are still on the trucks.  LOL.  It may lighten up a little as the concrete continues to cure, but it felt like about 200 lbs when I had to turn it back over after welding some rebar in the bottom and finished filling it with concrete. 

A concrete filled wheel base is not a new concept.  I've seen them that way in more than one garage or farm shop over the years.  Most just used a large pickup truck wheel like I did.  A few used larger wheels, but they were more in the way. 

I'm planning a 2x72 grinder build (* because its the hot fad right now) and I'll probably use a concrete filled wheel as a base for that too.  (I have three more of those wheels and wheels are cheap at the scrappers if you make nice with them.)  

* Actually, as I see the 2x72s get used for more than just knife making I can see some real utility there.  I know even since I got my little 1x30 bench sander I use my bench grinders a lot less than I used to.


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## GoceKU (Oct 2, 2017)

Bob La Londe said:


> Have you seen a commercial grinder stand? They are light weight flimsy contraptions


Bob, i've seen lots of designs and the commercial grinder stand are garbage in my opinion, i fully agree that mass makes a difference, that's why good commercial grinder stand are made from cast iron, my suggestion is couple of bolts in the floor or in the wall for added security, or some launching if you like too move it around, this is my setup, i really shouldn't keep it this close to my lathe because of the grinding dust but my machine shop is so small its only place i have, i also put couple of shelves underneath for tools.


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## crazypj (Oct 2, 2017)

16"~17" wheel filled with concrete makes a great grinder stand in my opinion. Gives you somewhere to put your foot as well. If your pushing so hard it's moving about, your pushing too hard for grinding anyway. The only 'improvement' I've ever seen was to put 1" airline around bottom edge (when I worked with 'medium sized-80~600SCFM) compressors it was very common to find blown out airlines. No idea how it was fixed on, maybe some welding wire before concrete?


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## Robert LaLonde (Oct 2, 2017)

I don't do any grinding in the room where my bigger lathe is, but I still throw a plastic shower curtain over it when I am not using it.


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## Robert LaLonde (Oct 2, 2017)

crazypj said:


> 16"~17" wheel filled with concrete makes a great grinder stand in my opinion. Gives you somewhere to put your foot as well. If your pushing so hard it's moving about, your pushing too hard for grinding anyway. The only 'improvement' I've ever seen was to put 1" airline around bottom edge (when I worked with 'medium sized-80~600SCFM) compressors it was very common to find blown out airlines. No idea how it was fixed on, maybe some welding wire before concrete?




I like that.  Makes for a rubber no slip foot all the way around the outer perimeter.  Too late for this stand, but its something to remember for the future.


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