# Machining work bench



## hman

Durn!  Them thar's some mighty purty welds.  Wish I could do even half as good.


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## dmittz

hman said:


> Durn!  Them thar's some mighty purty welds.  Wish I could do even half as good.


Thanks, i'm trying my best!
 Actually that was part of the reason I wanted to do this project, was to practice my welding, i've hardly welded at all over the last couple years and was worried I was getting 'rusty'.


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## ddillman

that is going to be a stout work bench. looks nice


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## Gaffer

Great job - what a beast of a bench!


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## dmittz

ddillman said:


> that is going to be a stout work bench. looks nice





Gaffer said:


> Great job - what a beast of a bench!



Thanks guys!    Ya the bench should be pretty sturdy.   
I hope to be using the bench for a long time so figured might as well build it to last.


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## cbellanca

Nice job.   I wish my welding looked that good. Did the top stay flat after you tacked it to the frame?


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## dmittz

cbellanca said:


> Nice job.   I wish my welding looked that good. Did the top stay flat after you tacked it to the frame?



Thanks.

I'm not sure about the top just yet as I haven't turned it over yet. I tacked the whole thing to the frame yesterday and did the finish welding today.  I tired to move around the table while welding so I didn't get to much heat in one spot, but we'll see.  Hopefully it didn't get to warped.


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## dmittz

So today I got some more welding wire and after reloading the miller 211 and adding a new tip it was time to get welding again.

I got the whole top plate finished welded to the frame, I also ground smooth the welds that will be facing down, just so the tool chest doesn't get scratched when it is pushed in.




Next I spent a lot of time trying to get the legs installed squarely.  It took time measuring and using a square but in the end I got them dead on.  Once they were in place I finished welded them in.






Legs installed!




The next challenge was figuring out how to get this beast on the ground so I can weld the base onto it...Luckily I had made the 4 mounting points on the top frame, I had planed to use and engine hoist and shackles, the chains for the engine shackles ended up being to short.  I should have planned ahead better, I had to spend and hour looking around the shop to piece together enough chain and connectors to make the rig to lift it (at least I did manage to find what I needed)  Anyway in the end I was able to use the hoist to put it down on the ground nicely.






Next time, I will be welding this bottom frame onto the legs...


Just as I was congradulating myself for a good afternoon's work I started planning out how I was going to install the 1 ton sizor jacks on each end to lower the wheels...



It was at this point I got that sick to your stomach feeling and realized I should have milled some access slots in legs before I installed them so the sizor jacks could be raised or lowered from the front of the bench.  Sort of shot myself in the foot on that one    No way those legs are coming off now, so I'll have to re-think a new way to raise and lower the legs.  I'm not going to be putting this bench in a place were I won't be able to access the jacks from the side so it's proabbly not a big deal, But in my original design I had tried to allow for that posibility.  I'll have to see what I can come up with to salvage the situation.


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## AmericanMachinist

Very nice!  

Regarding the access slots... what about drilling 2 holes for each and cutting the length with some type of cut off wheel? 

I like your idea (at least what I'm interpreting it to mean), and am encouraging you to go for it still.


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## dmittz

AmericanMachinist said:


> Very nice!
> 
> Regarding the access slots... what about drilling 2 holes for each and cutting the length with some type of cut off wheel?
> 
> I like your idea (at least what I'm interpreting it to mean), and am encouraging you to go for it still.



That is a good ideal and I can give it a try, the only concern is how difficult it will be to drill holes through a metal 2x4 without the mill or a drill press.  I'll give it a go with a hand drill and see how feasible it is.


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## AmericanMachinist

dmittz said:


> That is a good ideal and I can give it a try, the only concern is how difficult it will be to drill holes through a metal 2x4 without the mill or a drill press.  I'll give it a go with a hand drill and see how feasible it is.


Any chance you could set the frame on its side and raise the table to the legs and still use the drill press?

Depending on how far the mill head swings out (from over the knee) you could maybe even use the mill, to the side of the knee on one side of the table?  

If all the dimensions allowed... maybe you could even still clamp to the table and mill the slots?   Giving the frame some support that isn't too rigid and traveling slowly?


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## dmittz

AmericanMachinist said:


> Any chance you could set the frame on its side and raise the table to the legs and still use the drill press?
> 
> Depending on how far the mill head swings out (from over the knee) you could maybe even use the mill, to the side of the knee on one side of the table?
> 
> If all the dimensions allowed... maybe you could even still clamp to the table and mill the slots?   Giving the frame some support that isn't too rigid and traveling slowly?



Those are some good ideas, I'll have to do some measurements and see if its possible.  Thank you for the ideas.


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## dmittz

So I looked into using the Mill, but I spent a lot of time putting a nice paint job on my mill when I refurbished it, and it seemed like it could very easily get the paint all gouged up trying to muscle the table onto it.  The drill press also seemed like it was going to be a major pain.  So I think I'm just going to try using the a hand drill on the legs.

I have a pretty decent big dewalt hammer drill with an 8.6A motor i'll try using.  (It can do regular drilling too)
	

		
			
		

		
	



If that fails I have a couple of 1950's era 1hp drills which weigh about 50lbs each that I inherited from my grandfather. But... they are very powerful, not variable speed and take about 3 seconds to spool down so they are sketchy to use. But are a last resort.



Anyway before I start pushing on the legs to drill I wanted get the base welded on. the base must have warped a bit which meant I had to abuse my woodworking camps to hold it down while I welded it.  This actually worked, but just barely!


The base was now finish welded and the welds ground smooth.


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## AmericanMachinist

Looks good!

That Dewalt drill will drill through your tubing no problem!   The biggest risk (for any steel drilling) will be at the bottom of the hole when the bit catches on the face of the steel, and will tend to quickly twist the drill.   Be careful and don't have your face near the drill... step up a bit at a time.   But it's plenty of drill


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## dmittz

AmericanMachinist said:


> Looks good!
> 
> That Dewalt drill will drill through your tubing no problem!   The biggest risk (for any steel drilling) will be at the bottom of the hole when the bit catches on the face of the steel, and will tend to quickly twist the drill.   Be careful and don't have your face near the drill... step up a bit at a time.   But it's plenty of drill



That is great advice. 

Your very correct, that you have to be careful about the drill wanting to spin as the drill bit breaks through the metal. I had that happen when using one of the 1950's era 1hp drills some years's ago and it literally hit me so hard I fell backwards, luckily I was ok aside from a bruise.  Certainly not something I intend to repeat so I will be careful when drilling and hopefully using a easier to use more modern drill will help too.


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## tweinke

Good looking bench! That should be very sturdy!


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## dmittz

tweinke said:


> Good looking bench! That should be very sturdy!


Thank you!  

Yes, I think it should be pretty strong.


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## tweinke

The eyeball engineer in me thinks a car on top wont hurt it.


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## matthewsx

Use a step drill rather than regular bits, will be faster and safer.

John


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## dmittz

tweinke said:


> The eyeball engineer in me thinks a car on top wont hurt it.



haha, Ya I think it could proabbly support quite a bit, lol.



matthewsx said:


> Use a step drill rather than regular bits, will be faster and safer.
> 
> John



Ya I can give that a try I have a step drill so it will be easy to try.  Thanks for the suggestion.


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## dmittz

Also Happy new years everyone! 

 Thanks for all the advice.


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## dmittz

So I made a little more progress on the bench today.

Here's the casters I will be using.  They are a steel construction and rated for 750lbs each, so 3000lbs combined. All 4 caster swivel.






Based on this mock-up I took some measurements and figured out where the support for the jack needs to be...


I also added a cross-brace across the back of the bench for more rigidity/support.


The leveling feet are also in place now.

After those pieces were welded in I figured it was time to start making the access slots on the front on the legs so the sizor jacks can be easily raised and lowered from the front.  I used AmericanMachinists idea of drilling a hole at each end of the slot (once I figured out the required travel).



So for all my worrying I think making the slots will end up being a non-issue.  drilling the holes with the dewalt drill was a piece of cake.  The drill was plenty powerful, but not so powerful I couldn't hold it if the drill bit jams when brsking through the metal.  I drilled the holes out to 13/16 size, I think that will be plenty.  All that's left now is to use a zip disc to cut between the holes which should be simple.


This bench is a bit of a beast to move, so i'm glad it is going to have casters, I's estimate it is around 350lbs now and will likely be close to 400lbs when finished!


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## AmericanMachinist

Looks great!  I really like your approach with the scissor jacks.  I'm looking forward to seeing how you 'channel' them to keep the them flat with the bench, i.e. the bench from pivoting on top of the scissor jack. 

Thanks for sharing and keep up the nice work!  You're going to have a bench that's a joy to work at for sure.


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## dmittz

AmericanMachinist said:


> Looks great!  I really like your approach with the scissor jacks.  I'm looking forward to seeing how you 'channel' them to keep the them flat with the bench, i.e. the bench from pivoting on top of the scissor jack.
> 
> Thanks for sharing and keep up the nice work!  You're going to have a bench that's a joy to work at for sure.



Thanks, Americanmachinist.  Your idea for drilling a hole at each end of the slot worked perfectly 

There will be a sizor jack at each end of the table, which will have to be raised and lowed indpendently using the access slots on the front legs of the table. The 2x4'sthat the casters are attached too at each end of the table will have a 1×1  notch front and back which will allow them to be guided by a 1x1 which will be welded vertically to the legs and prevent any twisting or lateral forces from bending the sizor jacks if your pushing the table around with the casters down.  

It's a little hard to explain but will make sense once I take some pictures of it, once I build it.


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## dmittz

Hey everyone, so I did some more work on the bench yesterday. 

I finished making the access slots for the sizor jacks.  I used a air powered cutoff tool with a zip disc.  It was kind of a pain and took a while complete the slots but in the end it worked.


I also milled the guide slots on the 2x4 that the casters mount to on the one side.












Hopefully with the pictures it makes sense how the mechanism to raise and lower the casters works...

I had really hope to finish the table yesterday as i'm back to work tomorrow, but ran out of time... so the last little bit may take longer.

Here's where I left off after welding the 'guide rails in place on the one side:


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## hman

That's a VERY slick way to raise and lower your table!  Great leverage, able to handle the weight, and nicely out of the way.


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## dmittz

hman said:


> That's a VERY slick way to raise and lower your table!  Great leverage, able to handle the weight, and nicely out of the way.


Thanks, ya I had to spend a lot of time thinking about how to make the raising and lowering mechanism work and also be out of the way.  Hopefully it works as well as I envision it will


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## Papa Charlie

Nice work, just wondering, how many tons do you plan to have this bench support?


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## dmittz

Papa Charlie said:


> Nice work, just wondering, how many tons do you plan to have this bench support?


Haha ya this bench is way overkill for sure, but it'll be nice to have a real sturdy work bench, and also be able to move it around the shop too.


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## dmittz

So I picked up some paint for the machine bench, I went with battleship grey.  Originally I was going to do catelyized automotive paint like I did on my Mill and Lathe, but decided that having to mix paint every time I want to touch up a scratch would be a pain, and being this is a 'work' bench i'm sure i'll get scratched often, so I just went with an enamel paint instead. This bench is only going to be inside so i'm not super worried about rust, the paint is mainly cosmetic.




I also got some grade 5  bolts to attach the casters. The cheap mastercraft sockets are going to be welded to the sizor jacks, that way with the use of an extension I can use my battery powered impact driver to very quickly raise and lower the casters when needed.  (a rachet would work to.)

This evening I was able to get the guide rails for the lowering mechanism on the otherside welded in place...


Finally I drilled the holes for mounting the casters to the metal 2x4.  I only had time to do one side, i'll drill the other side next time.





Using the mill to drill a bolt pattern sure makes it simple to drill the patter squarely.   Have the mill is great, don't know how I got along without it for so long!


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## theradioshop

Really nice job! That should hold up for a long time.


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## Papa Charlie

I have been contemplating your comment regarding using a mill to do the drilling operations. I have always found floor drill presses to be lacking. Their tables lack good support and seem to flex too much while drilling, and the tables are generally too small for most of the work I have done.

So my thought is to have my mill be the drill press and not to bother with a a separate unit. Besides any of the ones I would buy are almost as expensive as the mill.


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## Just for fun

Looks Great!  I sure like the idea of the scissor jack!


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## dmittz

Papa Charlie said:


> I have been contemplating your comment regarding using a mill to do the drilling operations. I have always found floor drill presses to be lacking. Their tables lack good support and seem to flex too much while drilling, and the tables are generally too small for most of the work I have done.
> 
> So my thought is to have my mill be the drill press and not to bother with a a separate unit. Besides any of the ones I would buy are almost as expensive as the mill.


Ya I really like using the mill as a drill press.  Using the X and Y axis makes makes it really easy to drill accuratly in a pattern or strait line, etc... Also both the vice and the Mill are way more ridgid than my drill press and its vice, which can tend to shake and flex if doing heavy drilling.

The only downsides I can see versus a drill press is, since my mill only has a single handle for lowering the quill drilling deep holes is a bit awkward, you can of course use the knee, but its a bit more work than just pulling down on a 3 handle drill press quill for deep holes.  The other down side is you have to actually get up on a stool to install the chuck, vs the drill press I just leave the chuck installed, so if I just had to drill one hole without to much precision the drill press might be better.  Finally even with a big knee mill the drill press does offer a little more verticle clearance for drilling large/tall objects. Oh and if drilling holes in wood i'd proabbly rather not get sawdust all over the Mill so I might be inclined to use the press for wood also.

I already have an older import floor mounted 'delta' drill press that I inherited from my grandfather.  So i'll keep it around for the odd time that its more suitable, but I doubt it will be used much now that I have the Mill.


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## dmittz

Just for fun said:


> Looks Great!  I sure like the idea of the scissor jack!


Thanks, hoping it will work out well.


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## Papa Charlie

dmittz said:


> Ya I really like using the mill as a drill press.  Using the X and Y axis makes makes it really easy to drill accuratly in a pattern or strait line, etc... Also both the vice and the Mill are way more ridgid than my drill press and its vice, which can tend to shake and flex if doing heavy drilling.
> 
> The only downsides I can see versus a drill press is, since my mill only has a single handle for lowering the quill drilling deep holes is a bit awkward, you can of course use the knee, but its a bit more work than just pulling down on a 3 handle drill press quill for deep holes.  The other down side is you have to actually get up on a stool to install the chuck, vs the drill press I just leave the chuck installed, so if I just had to drill one hole without to much precision the drill press might be better.  Finally even with a big knee mill the drill press does offer a little more verticle clearance for drilling large/tall objects. Oh and if drilling holes in wood i'd proabbly rather not get sawdust all over the Mill so I might be inclined to use the press for wood also.
> 
> I already have an older import floor mounted 'delta' drill press that I inherited from my grandfather.  So i'll keep it around for the odd time that its more suitable, but I doubt it will be used much now that I have the Mill.



All good points, and having the drill press already, it makes sense to keep it and use it. But if you didn't already have it, would you spend the money to purchase one? I haven't found one less than $750 that I would have and those often require work. Which can be fun unto itself, or I could be making something else on the mill.

I flop back and forth on purchasing DP, if I were to find the right one for the right price, I would, but I haven't.


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## Boswell

I used my Mill as a drill press for a few years and sure it works fine but I did eventually buy dedicated drill press and it gets plenty of use when speed and easy of use is more important than 0.001 accuracy. I did take awhile to save the $ for the drill press but I am now glad that I did it.


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## dmittz

Papa Charlie said:


> All good points, and having the drill press already, it makes sense to keep it and use it. But if you didn't already have it, would you spend the money to purchase one? I haven't found one less than $750 that I would have and those often require work. Which can be fun unto itself, or I could be making something else on the mill.
> 
> I flop back and forth on purchasing DP, if I were to find the right one for the right price, I would, but I haven't.


If I you already have a Mill, but not a drill press, I would likely not bother with a drill press unless you got a good deal on a floor mounted one.  Of course it depends on the type of work you do, if you do a lot of wood working or have to drill large objects often it cpuld be worth while I guess.  But for metal working and general workshop use I'd say using the mill will be superior 90% of the time.  

Another thing to consider, is that if you limited shop space the drill press is a big tool, so having the extra space  avaliable it would take up has value too.


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## dmittz

Boswell said:


> I used my Mill as a drill press for a few years and sure it works fine but I did eventually buy dedicated drill press and it gets plenty of use when speed and easy of use is more important than 0.001 accuracy. I did take awhile to save the $ for the drill press but I am now glad that I did it.


For sure, if you find that you often just need to drill 1 or 2 holes quickly without too much percision then the drill press is certainly quicker, then the Mill.  Kind of just depends on what type of work you do.


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## hman

@dmittz - Treat yourself to a couple of machinists' jacks.  They're great for supporting the ends of long workpieces, especially when drilling.
http://www.cdcotools.com - p/n 29529 or 29530





						2 JACK MACHINISTS JACKS TOOL
					

<!-- <ul><li>1" adjustment</li><li>height: 4" when fully extended</li></ul> -->




					www.shars.com
				








						Jack Screw Set
					

<!-- <ul><li>Range: 1-1/2 to 2-1/4" (6Pcs)<br /></li></ul> -->




					www.shars.com


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## dmittz

hman said:


> @dmittz - Treat yourself to a couple of machinists' jacks.  They're great for supporting the ends of long workpieces, especially when drilling.
> http://www.cdcotools.com - p/n 29529 or 29530
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2 JACK MACHINISTS JACKS TOOL
> 
> 
> <!-- <ul><li>1" adjustment</li><li>height: 4" when fully extended</li></ul> -->
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.shars.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Jack Screw Set
> 
> 
> <!-- <ul><li>Range: 1-1/2 to 2-1/4" (6Pcs)<br /></li></ul> -->
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.shars.com


Thanks, those look like a good idea.  I'll add them to my purchase list.


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## dmittz

So this evening I got the bolt holes on second 2x4 drilled out.



I also got the second sizor jack prepped for welding.  Additionally I cut off the end of the sizor jacks so that I can weld a socket on the end.










That's as far as I got today.


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## dmittz

Before I went any farther this evening, I decided to take a pause on the work bench and get the Mill cleaned up now that its part in the project was finished.




I proabbly could have got a lot more done today, if I didn't clean up the mill  but I really like to keep my equipment is good shape now that its restored, plus walking on a crispy metal shaving covered floor around the mill isn't the best either.


Anyway once that was done, I got back to work on the bench.

I got the one side pretty much done minus bolting the casters on.





I used my impact driver to test it and it raises and lowers perfectly.  Takes about 2 seconds to put it up or down with the impact driver. The only catch is you need a decent sized 1/2in extension to reach the socket, but that's no big deal as I have lots.  All in all I am very pleased with how it works.  Now I just need to finish the other side and get the whole thing painted!


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## AmericanMachinist

Looks great!   If you wanted to forgo the need for the extension (it you end up moving it a lot) maybe weld a bar or tube between the jack and the socket?

Regarding machinist jacks... This Old Tony on youtube has at least one great video about making them.  But mostly done on a lathe.


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## dmittz

AmericanMachinist said:


> Looks great!   If you wanted to forgo the need for the extension (it you end up moving it a lot) maybe weld a bar or tube between the jack and the socket?
> 
> Regarding machinist jacks... This Old Tony on youtube has at least one great video about making them.  But mostly done on a lathe.


Thanks for the suggestion.

For sure I could do that if I find it becomes a problem but, I don't really think it will be to much of a bother to use a 8-10in extension. I have lots of long extensions and its not really any harder to grab a long extension than a short one.


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## dmittz

AmericanMachinist said:


> Regarding machinist jacks... This Old Tony on youtube has at least one great video about making them.  But mostly done on a lathe.


I'll have to look up Old Tony...

No worries about needing a lathe, thankfully I've got a nice little South Bend 9A.


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## AmericanMachinist

He's great at mixing helpful knowledge and comedic relief.


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## dmittz

Hey Guys, so I have done a bit of work on the bench since my last post.

I got the lowering mechnism on the second side finished and masked it off for paint.


I started painting the bench yesterday, but the paint gun quit working and despite my best efforts to clean it I couldn't get it working properly.

Anyway I went out and got another cheap paint gun yesterday  but didn't have anymore time to paint...


So I picked up where I left off this afternoon and finished painting all the underside surfaces of the bench then flipped it up right at painted the rest of it.




The overall height came in at about 38.75 inches, so its a little on the tall side but certainly workable and in order to fit the chest I couldn't really go much shorter.  Overall I'm very happy with how it has turned out given that i've not done much in the way of large welding projects like this before.

Next time when the paint's dry I'll wire wheel the top and get the casters installed.  Then once I put the tool chest in,  this thing will be done.


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## dmittz

Hey Guys, I just had a few min to spend in the shop today.  So I put the casters on...
	

		
			
		

		
	



I used 5/16 nuts bolts and washers along with lock washers so they don't come loose.

I tested the lowering mechanism and it seems to work pretty well, its very quick and easy using and impact gun to raise and lower the casters



I did encounter one problem I hadn't anticipated when I designed this bench...There are a total on 8 pivot points on each on the sizor jacks, each of which is not exactly a tight fit.  Which means when carrying the weight of a 400lbs bench over them there is a bit of play withing the jacks themselves. The play results when you push or pull on the front or back of the table and causes the table to tilt up or down when pushed on about 1/2in before the guide rails I installed stop the movement.

I was a bit concerned at first, but after pushing and pulling it around the shop even aggressively, I don't belive you could really tip it over sort of being totally reckless.  However, you might have some things slide off if you left them on top of the bench.  I determined if I only lower the castwrs to 'just' below the leveling feet they limit the tiliting to a very small amount, also pushing on the sides vs the front or back also prevents the tilting issue.

If I were to build this again I would either make my own sizor jacks with much more toleranced pivot points or use a phunematic bottle jack to raise and lower the casters, but I think for may purposes it will work just fine as it is.

All that's left now is to get the top cleaned up and put the tool chest in it.


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## matthewsx

Now that's a workbench

Nice thing is since you built it yourself if it ever needs modified you'll know exactly what to do. When you get the toolbox installed you might not have the problems you mentioned, or it might get worse. If you're not moving it around often it could be totally a non issue, your basic concept is solid and I might look into copying it for my lathe bench when I get around to building one.

If the jacks bother you I'd keep an eye out for some pneumatic cylinders. You can sometimes get them really cheap and since you only need a couple of inches travel you'll have a good chance of being able to make lots of different parts work. Plus, how cool to just plug in your air hose to lift rather than bending down to crank the jacks.

Nice work, thanks for sharing.

John


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## dmittz

matthewsx said:


> Now that's a workbench
> 
> Nice thing is since you built it yourself if it ever needs modified you'll know exactly what to do. When you get the toolbox installed you might not have the problems you mentioned, or it might get worse. If you're not moving it around often it could be totally a non issue, your basic concept is solid and I might look into copying it for my lathe bench when I get around to building one.
> 
> If the jacks bother you I'd keep an eye out for some pneumatic cylinders. You can sometimes get them really cheap and since you only need a couple of inches travel you'll have a good chance of being able to make lots of different parts work. Plus, how cool to just plug in your air hose to lift rather than bending down to crank the jacks.
> 
> Nice work, thanks for sharing.
> 
> John


Thanks John,

For my purposes I don't see myself moving it around very often, just once and a while, so having the ability to move it when needed will be nice, but its certainly not intened as a rolling table, just a moveable bench.
  So I think it will be ok as is, But if I build another bench like this or a rolling table I'll do it with some pneumatic cylinders as the means to raise and lower the wheels.


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## dmittz

Ok guys I need a little help.

I spent and hour or so out in the shop this evening. First I put a wite wheel on my grinder and remove the rust on the top plate, that was easy enough.

Next I tried to remove whatever ugly coating is on the top plate. Well whatever the coating is it doesn't come off easily, I spent an hour so far and I'm sure I could spend pleanty more to get it all off.

Here's what I tried so far, Wire wheel on a grinder, a DA sander, a belt sender and a vibrating sander.
	

		
			
		

		
	




I didn't even really get one 4in strip of the top cleaned up after an hour...


I know this is purely an aesthetic thing but I want the top to look nice and uniform not 'scaley'.  

So what do you guys recommend to remove whatever ugly coating is on the top plate.


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## AmericanMachinist

Were you using a coarse grit paper?  

Google "remove mill scale".

I'd think the belt sander and coarse paper would remove it reasonably quickly.   A coarse flap disc on the grinder would as well but may be easier to accidentally dish ares of the surface.


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## dmittz

AmericanMachinist said:


> Were you using a coarse grit paper?
> 
> Google "remove mill scale".
> 
> I'd think the belt sander and coarse paper would remove it reasonably quickly.   A coarse flap disc on the grinder would as well but may be easier to accidentally dish ares of the surface.


I was using 40 grit sandpaper on thr belt sander.  Didn't do much.

I'll look into a flap disc on the grinder and google how to remove mill scale also.

Thanks for the suggestions.


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## Papa Charlie

I have had good luck with a 6" 3m Scotch Brite pads on a grinder. Use a course one. They will peel most things off a surface.


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## Boswell

40 grit flap disk on an angle grinder, if you have not tried that yet. Might take a few flap disks


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## dmittz

Papa Charlie said:


> I have had good luck with a 6" 3m Scotch Brite pads on a grinder. Use a course one. They will peel most things off a surface.





Boswell said:


> 40 grit flap disk on an angle grinder, if you have not tried that yet. Might take a few flap disks



Thanks for the suggestions guys,  i'm going to go to the local tool store and get either a flap disc for the grinder or the 3M pad or both and i'll give it try.


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## matthewsx

Hate to say it but you probably should have left the mill scale alone. As you've found out it's hard as **** and it does a surprisingly good job of protecting from rust.

That said, flap disk and patience. Then etch and put a good quality paint on there.

John


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## dmittz

matthewsx said:


> Hate to say it but you probably should have left the mill scale alone. As you've found out it's hard as **** and it does a surprisingly good job of protecting from rust.
> 
> That said, flap disk and patience. Then etch and put a good quality paint on there.
> 
> John


I proabbly would have left the mill scale alone in an ideal world. 

However, It was raining hard the day I picked up all the steel and it all got wet in the back of the truck and to make matters worse the top sat in the rain in the bed for an extra hour, because I had to wait for a friend to help me unload it as it was just a little to heavy to carry myself.

I blew everything off with an air hose and dried it with rags when I got the steel in the shop but the top in particular still got quite rusty and when when I removed the rust with a wire wheel what was underneath looks aweful.  So i'm sort of stuck removing it.

Your right I could proabbly paint the top, but I think it would get scratched pretty bad over time.  My plan is to remove the mill scale, then sand it with increasingly higher grit sand paper until it has a nice finish, then heat it up just a little with a blow torch and rub oil into it when its warm for rust resistance.  I don't tend to have to worry much about rust as my shop is kept at at 50-60F in the winters and isnnsulated  with vapor barrier, so that should be enough to keep the top from rusting.

**If it was in a garage where wet cars were parked regularly painting might be the only option**


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## AmericanMachinist

dmittz said:


> I proabbly would have left the mill scale alone in an ideal world.
> 
> However, It was raining hard the day I picked up all the steel and it all got wet in the back of the truck and to make matters worse the top sat in the rain in the bed for an extra hour, because I had to wait for a friend to help me unload it as it was just a little to heavy to carry myself.
> 
> I blew everything off with an air hose and dried it with rags when I got the steel in the shop but the top in particular still got quite rusty and when when I removed the rust with a wire wheel what was underneath looks aweful.  So i'm sort of stuck removing it.
> 
> Your right I could proabbly paint the top, but I think it would get scratched pretty bad over time.  My plan is to remove the mill scale, then sand it with increasingly higher grit sand paper until it has a nice finish, then heat it up just a little with a blow torch and rub oil into it when its warm for rust resistance.  I don't tend to have to worry much about rust as my shop is kept at at 50-60F in the winters and isnnsulated  with vapor barrier, so that should be enough to keep the top from rusting.
> 
> **If it was in a garage where wet cars were parked regularly painting might be the only option**


I think your polished top will be very nice.  The work will bear good rewards every time you use it.  Maybe keep cardboard, MDF, or similar on hand to cover it when completing tasks that may mar or scrape the surface?


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## dmittz

AmericanMachinist said:


> I think your polished top will be very nice.  The work will bear good rewards every time you use it.  Maybe keep cardboard, MDF, or similar on hand to cover it when completing tasks that may mar or scrape the surface?


Thanks ya I think it will look nice, I'm not going to go too crazy on polishing it just want it to have a decent shine and smooth surface.  

Ya, I could use something like that to protect the surface and I may do that depending on the task, but I think geberally it'll be ok it is a work bench after all so the odd scratch is ok. Also despite its heavy construction I actually don't forsee a lot of heavy work happening on the top, its more or less just going to be a place I can setup and clean up tooling etc... for the mill and lathe, I don't plan to use it as a fab or welding bench.

But it sure will be nice to have a place to set stuff up right next to the machines, right now I have to walk the  other side of the shop as there were no benches by my Mill and lathe and because i'm some times lazy I tended to set stuff up on the top of the old kitchen stove that lives between my machines which was a bad place to put things and work on setup.


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## dmittz

I also thought I'd let you guys know I went out today and visited the local tool place and got some flap wheels for my grinder (no-multi surface pad avaliable)
Frusteratingly they did not have hardly anything for 7in grinders, but I got 3   6in flap wheels instead.  Hopefully they still work in the 7in grinder.


	

		
			
		

		
	
 Hopefully I can get that aweful mill scale off now.  I've got to work at least half the day tomorrow but sometime this weekend i'll try to get the scale off.

Also dropped off 13 of my drill bits that were dull for sharpening today, and while driving ther and back I thought about how to stop the play sizor jacks when the wheels are lowered...
I think i've got a simple plan, I'll drill a hole in each front leg and weld on a corresponding thick walled tube on the top of the metal 2x4 that the casters are mounted to.  I'll then use a remove able pin to hold everything steady when the wheels are down.  and when I want to raise the wheels I'll just pull the pin out.  I even have the materials I need laying around the shop to make this setup.


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## AmericanMachinist

dmittz said:


> I also thought I'd let you guys know I went out today and visited the local tool place and got some flap wheels for my grinder (no-multi surface pad avaliable)
> Frusteratingly they did not have hardly anything for 7in grinders, but I got 3   6in flap wheels instead.  Hopefully they still work in the 7in grinder.
> View attachment 351283
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hopefully I can get that aweful mill scale off now.  I've got to work at least half the day tomorrow but sometime this weekend i'll try to get the scale off.
> 
> Also dropped off 13 of my drill bits that were dull for sharpening today, and while driving ther and back I thought about how to stop the play sizor jacks when the wheels are lowered...
> I think i've got a simple plan, I'll drill a hole in each front leg and weld on a corresponding thick walled tube on the top of the metal 2x4 that the casters are mounted to.  I'll then use a remove able pin to hold everything steady when the wheels are down.  and when I want to raise the wheels I'll just pull the pin out.  I even have the materials I need laying around the shop to make this setup.


Good idea.  Wonder if you could even drill a hole and slide a pin through the side of the 1" square tube and the tube on which the casters are mounted to. 
I see several potential advantages.
-- no need to weld on your nice paint job.
-- you could use pins to lock both front and back if ever needed 
-- no need to have excess holes in the front of the legs (cosmetic only).

Of course this means you couldn't lock them until you get access to the sides.  May also be suboptimal depending on how tight of a fit the cabinet is


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## AmericanMachinist

I suppose another approach to avoiding more welding but with out losing the front-access pins would be to lower casters, insert pin from front, and raise rhe casters slightly until their tube stops at the pin. 

Just some ideas.


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## dmittz

AmericanMachinist said:


> Good idea.  Wonder if you could even drill a hole and slide a pin through the side of the 1" square tube and the tube on which the casters are mounted to.
> I see several potential advantages.
> -- no need to weld on your nice paint job.
> -- you could use pins to lock both front and back if ever needed
> -- no need to have excess holes in the front of the legs (cosmetic only).
> 
> Of course this means you couldn't lock them until you get access to the sides.  May also be suboptimal depending on how tight of a fit the cabinet is





AmericanMachinist said:


> I suppose another approach to avoiding more welding but with out losing the front-access pins would be to lower casters, insert pin from front, and raise rhe casters slightly until their tube stops at the pin.
> 
> Just some ideas.


Those are all great ideas, I appreacite you taking the time to share them.  I will take them under consideration.

I don't really mind having to weld again and repaint, i've got about 1/3 of the 1 quart paint can left so I should have plenty left to touch up from welding.

I am going to try to maintain the ability to not have anything stick past the sides as its quite possible the bench could one day end up being pushed up beside something. But I could potentally add rear locking pins, if the front pins alone don't feel sturdy enough.

Thanks again for taking the time to give me some good ideas.


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## dmittz

Hey everyone, so I had hope to finish the bench this weekend but had to work half the day yesterday and also today which cut into my time, however I did manage to get the lock pin system for when the caster are down finished.

The whole lock pin system was just made out pieces of spare thick walled round stock I had laying around.

First step was to make some pins...I used thick wall 1/2 round stock. Aftwr cutting to length I used my SB 9a to machine some tapered ends on them


That was followed by drilling some holes for the rings in the end and polishing. I think they turned out pretty good for pieces for left over steel.





Next up I drilled some holes in the front legs and added a 'sleeve' for the pins to slide into and repainted the area when it was done. I also leveled the whole thing befor welding eveything in place...






Just to be clean when the wheels are down the pins do slide inside that little tube, I just forgot to grab a picture until I had raised the wheels...

Since i'm in my early 30's and want to be working in the shop for a long time without causing myself health problems i'm fairly big into safety items.

My old dust respirator broke in a non-repairable way (after 10-12 years of service) so I picked up a new 3M respirator and filters.  It seems pretty nice and i'm happy with it.   


I'll use the respirator for all my grinding and NON-Paint 'hazzardous' type work.    I use a supplied air reapirator for paint work to be extra safe.

I didn't have enough time to strip the whole top today, but I gave the flap disc on the grinder a try to see how it works...this represents 3-4min of work on the top


So based on that i'm guess 1-2hours hours work should get the top looking how I want it.


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## dmittz

Sorry guys, I forgot to mention the the 2 locking pins work great, they eliminated 90-95% of the movement the table had with the wheels down which is very acceptable for my purposes and i'm happy with how the system works now.

I could proably eliminate that last little bit of movement (less than an 1/8in at the top) by adding rear locking pins, but its so minor I don't see much point, espcially since the wheels will only be down when it is being moved, when I work on it, the bench will always be sitting securely on the leveling feet.


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## dmittz

I finally got around to getting rid of all that mill scale on the top today and it was a pain, but its all gone.  I was going to spend a lot of time polishing the top to perfection, but after thinking about it, I decided that was kind of silly since this is a work bench and will be used for work.  Anyway here's what I ended up with... and i'm happy with it.



The top looks a little shiney because I gave it a lite oil rub down for rust protection, after its had a few days to soak in I'll clean the top with some cleaner so it doesn't attract dust.

Next up was installing the tool box...




The tool box fit exactly as planned.

There is a little space behind the box, trying to think if there is anyway I can make use of it...



Next up I put the wheels down and easily rolled this 600lbs beast (with the tool box) into its place, then wheels went back up and its rock solid and ready to go.




I think my solidly made machine bench looks right at home next to the machines.  The lathe on the right of the picture is a SB 13 that I really need to get working on restoring... but that's for another day.

I had a mastercraft top chest that I had been using to store my tooling, I transfered the tooling to the new tool chest  but figured might as well keep the top chest for now. I may sell the top chest at some point...
	

		
			
		

		
	





One last picture...


Its sure going to be nice having that bench right by the mill, perfect for setting things up on.

Well I guess that about wraps up this project.


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## AmericanMachinist

That looks very, very nice! 
I suggest you keep the top box.  Eventually (probably sooner than you think) you'll need the space for storage and it'll cost a lot more to replace if you buy new.


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## Gaffer

Great job! I love your shop.


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## dmittz

AmericanMachinist said:


> That looks very, very nice!
> I suggest you keep the top box.  Eventually (probably sooner than you think) you'll need the space for storage and it'll cost a lot more to replace if you buy new.


Thanks, ya i guess for now might as well keep the top box.   I might make a mounting system so it is mounted to the wall behind the bench, sort of like a top cabinet, that way it won't take up space on the bench top.


Gaffer said:


> Great job! I love your shop.


Thanks!


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## hman

Very good looking job!  Too bad you have to keep the work bench against the wall ... if it were in the middle of the floor, you could make use of the space behind the tool box ... maybe a good place to hang angle grinders, etc.  Ah, well ...


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## cbrasher

Love your shop pics, especially the hidden Trans Am! But I absolutely drooled when I saw your mill! I grew up 30 minutes south of Jackson, still live in Michigan, and had never heard of the Index Company. Did you document that restoration here as well? I haven't had much time to spend on here ogling.


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## dmittz

hman said:


> Very good looking job!  Too bad you have to keep the work bench against the wall ... if it were in the middle of the floor, you could make use of the space behind the tool box ... maybe a good place to hang angle grinders, etc.  Ah, well ...


Thank you.  Ya for now, against the wall is sort of where it has to go but maybe at some future point I can re-arrange the shop.  still trying to figure out if there is a way to use the 6in space at the back for something, I'm considering storing some longer metal stock there...


cbrasher said:


> Love your shop pics, especially the hidden Trans Am! But I absolutely drooled when I saw your mill! I grew up 30 minutes south of Jackson, still live in Michigan, and had never heard of the Index Company. Did you document that restoration here as well? I haven't had much time to spend on here ogling.


Thanks yes, the Trans Am is a bit of a back burner project, one day i'll get to it...  My 1988 Corvette tends to consume most of my time and project funds, I am literally am just finishing an LS/T56 magnum swap etc... on it.  Took it out for the first short 'shake-down' drive last Saturday.





I did document the Milling machine 'refurbishment'  you can find it here:

https://www.hobby-machinist.com/threads/new-mill-wells-index-745.69200/

I also did document the south bend 9A also, but its not as detailed because I lost a lot of the pictures when my phone died a few years ago:
You can find the south bend 9A thread here:

https://www.hobby-machinist.com/threads/south-bend-9a-refurbished.73351/


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## cbrasher

Nothing wrong with a little C4 lovin! Looks great!


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## reynrick1

Nice work on the bench!  Do you have any pic's of it finished??  Love to see it!


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## dmittz

reynrick1 said:


> Nice work on the bench!  Do you have any pic's of it finished??  Love to see it!


I think I posted these earlier but in case there now showing up.


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## Jsmurphy

dmittz said:


> Hey Guys, so I finally got a decent tool box to hold my machining tooling...
> 
> Craftsman 41inch tool chest...
> View attachment 349225
> 
> To house the tool chest I decided to build a nice sturdy metal work bench.  It will be really nice have to have a bench near the Mill and lathe.
> 
> So the plan is to build a sturdy metal frame around the tool chest and then put a 1/4in steel top on it.  This is just a work bench NOT a welding table, so a really thick top isn't required.
> 
> I'm also going to incorporate a system so that the bench can have wheels that raise/ lower if I want to move it.
> 
> Here's all the steel that will soon become a bench...
> 
> View attachment 349236
> 
> 
> I used my mill to drill out holes in the front and back pieces of the frame.
> View attachment 349227
> 
> The holes on the bottom frame will be for leveing feet...
> View attachment 349229
> 
> View attachment 349230
> 
> I cut to length some 3/4in steel round stock and pre-drilled to size the ID for threading.
> View attachment 349231
> 
> Next the round stock was welded in place and threads cut through the whole 2.5in length...
> View attachment 349233
> 
> View attachment 349232
> 
> pre-fit of leveling feet...
> View attachment 349234
> 
> I used the same process for the top frame. The threaded holes in the top frame are to allow attachent points if the bench needs to be hoised in a truck etc... 1/2-13 bolts can be used.
> View attachment 349235
> 
> Now that that was done it was time to start building the the frame for the top out of metal 2x2 and 2x4 (1/8 wall). Yhe dimensions for the top is 28in wide × 50in long.
> View attachment 349240
> 
> View attachment 349237
> 
> View attachment 349238
> 
> View attachment 349239
> 
> View attachment 349241
> 
> View attachment 349242
> 
> View attachment 349244
> 
> 
> Next up was to build the bottom frame that supports the tool chest...
> View attachment 349245
> 
> I ran out of welding wire, so that's as far as I got for now.


Where did you get your leveling feet?


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## dmittz

Jsmurphy said:


> Where did you get your leveling feet?


Amazon.


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## John Dilsaver

Thank you for posting this detailed description of your workbench build, as well as your shop photos.  There are lots of good ideas here, I'm thinking of something in that general type of project.  Thanks again!


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## MrCrankyface

Beautiful shop and bench build, great job!


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## dmittz

John Dilsaver said:


> Thank you for posting this detailed description of your workbench build, as well as your shop photos.  There are lots of good ideas here, I'm thinking of something in that general type of project.  Thanks again!


Your very welcome.

I'm actually going to be moving in a couple months to a small acerage and will be building a new shop, so the good part about this bench is that I can take it with me to the new place easily.


MrCrankyface said:


> Beautiful shop and bench build, great job!


Thank you.


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