# New invention (I hope)



## Charley Davidson (Dec 29, 2012)

Was trying to indicate a hole to try my boring head out on and found it to be a PIA. So I came up with this little gizmo to get me close or at least closer. Looks like with a few improvements it might be somewhat functional & cool. Maybe I can sell a few on Ebay. I'm gonna color the lines 4 different colors to help keep confusion to a minimum, each line is .100 apart. What ya think?  Hopefully this has not been done before.


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## Hawkeye (Dec 29, 2012)

Charley,

I have something similar that I made about 30 years ago, with a couple of differences. Mine has a 3/16" hole in the centre instead of a shaft. And, it's used for the lathe instead of the mill - wood lathe, not metal.

To use it, you place it on the end of a block of wood and move it around until you've got the largest enclosed circle covering wood. Then you slip a centre punch through the hole and give it a hit. Repeat the procedure on the other end of the block. This lets you use the maximum wood out of a rough piece.

For the metalworking application, I think you've got something good there. Like using the circles on a four-jaw to start the centering process. You should be able to sell a bunch.


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## Charley Davidson (Dec 29, 2012)

Thanks, I have a couple ideas to expand on it but not sure how much more I should do as I'd like to keep it at a low price mark and make some money too. I'd like to keep it at $25 or less.


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## bcall2043 (Dec 29, 2012)

Now I understand! When you told me about it over the phone my thick skull was not coming up with the right mental image. Looks like a great tool to have.

Benny
The Orphanage Never Closes


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## Richard King (Dec 30, 2012)

When my kids were young we could never find the TV remote control, so :thinking:  I came up with an idea I figured I would make $ millions on.  I called it the "Remote Patrol"  I was a Cub Scout Den Leader and we had a bunch of this plastic string we made neckerchiefs slide holders from.  I cut a length of it and tide one end to my Lazy Boy chair handle and tide and taped the other end to the remote with a note  DO NOT REMOVE.  

I decided to sell them at the county fair. I stayed up nights making up baggies of them and labeled the bag.  I must have had 500 of them.  The kids and I went to the fair where I had rented a booth with a TV and Chair demo, so people could see it in use.

I priced them a $2.99.  The people would walk up to the booth and say "What a good Idea, I can make one of those out of some string"  and walk away.  This was a 4 day fair....It got pretty discouraging hearing ..Ohhhh what a good idea....I lowered the price and sold maybe 20 but on day 4,  I eventually gave them away, just so I didn't ave to take them home.   

So the moral of the story is "The easy ideas will give you false hopes of wealth" "If they can copy it and make it themselves don't make it".
Another observation. People who frequent these types of forums are looking for deals and ideas for home shop projects I am sure many will be saying..."Hmmmm what a good idea, I can make one of those"


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## rgsparber (Dec 30, 2012)

Richard King said:


> When my kids were young we could never find the TV remote control, so :thinking:  I came up with an idea I figured I would make $ millions on.  I called it the "Remote Patrol"  I was a Cub Scout Den Leader and we had a bunch of this plastic string we made neckerchiefs slide holders from.  I cut a length of it and tide one end to my Lazy Boy chair handle and tide and taped the other end to the remote with a note  DO NOT REMOVE.
> 
> I decided to sell them at the county fair. I stayed up nights making up baggies of them and labeled the bag.  I must have had 500 of them.  The kids and I went to the fair where I had rented a booth with a TV and Chair demo, so people could see it in use.
> 
> ...



You tell a sad story but not a new one. IMHO, there are two situations:

1. You invent something worthless and pay the money to get it patented. No one wants it so you are left alone. Not very exciting.

2. You invent something worth a lot and pay the money to get it patented. People either in this country or else ware ignore your patent and start to manufacture and sell it. If you do not defend your patent in court, you forfeit any rights it proves you. That can easily cost $50,000 a year. However, just because it is your patent and you defend it, does not automatically mean you get a dime from the pirates. Look up the case of the ratchet wrench and Sears if you want a sad story.

There is another path. It will cost you almost nothing and make you no money. It is called "defensive publishing". You take your idea in all of its details and publish it on the web. At that point, anyone can read it and copy it for free. It becomes part of the public record. Now, some idiot can go ahead and patent it. But when they try to defend it from pirates, the lawyers will discover the "prior art" which renders the patent worthless. You are essentially poisoning the well. You don't get a patent but neither can anyone else. You do advance the art which can be a very rewarding feeling. It might also give you bragging rights to use with your employer.

Some inventors and even major corporations do not patent some designs. They either sell the product until the competition catches up or keep it a trade secret. I know, for example, that many aspects of GE jet engines are trade secrets.

I see so many ads on TV for companies willing to help you get a patent. Don't be fooled. They will make good money on the deal and you will be left with a worthless piece of paper.


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## rgsparber (Dec 30, 2012)

Charley Davidson said:


> Was trying to indicate a hole to try my boring head out on and found it to be a PIA. So I came up with this little gizmo to get me close or at least closer. Looks like with a few improvements it might be somewhat functional & cool. Maybe I can sell a few on Ebay. I'm gonna color the lines 4 different colors to help keep confusion to a minimum, each line is .100 apart. What ya think?  Hopefully this has not been done before.



I was faced with a similar problem. I wanted to be able to scribe a center line but did not care about the width of the workpiece.

http://rick.sparber.org/aacs.pdf


 Mine is a one dimentional problem. I wonder if the idea could be expanded to work in two dimensions to find the center of a circle.


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## frbutts (Dec 30, 2012)

Charley Davidson said:


> Was trying to indicate a hole to try my boring head out on and found it to be a PIA. So I came up with this little gizmo to get me close or at least closer. Looks like with a few improvements it might be somewhat functional & cool. Maybe I can sell a few on Ebay. I'm gonna color the lines 4 different colors to help keep confusion to a minimum, each line is .100 apart. What ya think?  Hopefully this has not been done before.



Nice idea loos like a longer shank or adjustable shank might be nice

                     fb


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## rgsparber (Dec 30, 2012)

GEP said:


> Hey Rick
> Good to find you here
> Happy New Year
> GP



And a Happy New Year to you too Guenther.

Rick


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## rgsparber (Dec 30, 2012)

frbutts said:


> Nice idea loos like a longer shank or adjustable shank might be nice
> 
> fb



I wonder if a clear cone shape would work here. The top face would have a small hole for alignment. Would need a few sizes. Drop the cone into the hole, level it, and put a spud in the chuck or collet. Then move the spindle until the end of the spud lined up with the small hole in the cone. Alternately, do as you are doing and have a shank on the end of the cone.


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## xalky (Dec 30, 2012)

A cone shape would only work to center holes. The flat shape is more versatile IMO, because you can use it to center square parts in a lathe chuck as someone else mentioned. With a little creativity it could be used for other things too.

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2


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## Charley Davidson (Dec 30, 2012)

Thanks for the positive remarks guys. I'm not a good poker player cause I can't hold back my facial expressions when I got a winning hand, nor can I keep my own secretes. I'm not a bragger just a sharer, if something good happens or I make something that may be a good product or idea I have a hard time just sitting on it if I can make it come to fruition.

I was a comedian/singer/song writer for many years, I had a guy who would leave his shows on his break in Green bay every time I played there and actually tell me he came to get new material, he would also try to book his gigs off my web site calendar.  I would not perform if he was in the room and I would sometimes trick him on my calendar and post fake shows in gay bars.

A patent lawyer once told me not to waste my time/money on a patent as it was gonna get stolen anyway, just flood the market he said.

I posted this here for feed back as I know most of you would not be a potential customer for this product because of it's simplicity. Feel free to make your own but please don't make them for friends or try to sell them is all I would ask.


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## Charley Davidson (Dec 30, 2012)

xalky said:


> A cone shape would only work to center holes. The flat shape is more versatile IMO, because you can use it to center square parts in a lathe chuck as someone else mentioned. With a little creativity it could be used for other things too.
> 
> Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2



I shied away from a cone shape so there woyuld be plenty of head room for changing tooling without having to lower/raise the table plus I think there are many more options/uses of this in it's flat disk shape I just need to wrap my tiny little brain around it a bit more tighter


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## GoMopar440 (Dec 30, 2012)

Why not have your cake and be able eat it too? Make the clear piece flat on one side and cone shaped on the other with a reversable shank. I'd make a permenant threaded collar that would help keep the spindle centered to keep everything concentric. I'f you did the spindle and it's internal collar first and then cut the cone and rings last you should be able to maintain concentricity on both sides. Just be sure to keep the rings equally spaced from the center axis on either side so you can get a reference line easier.


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## Millalot (Dec 31, 2012)

rgsparber said:


> I was faced with a similar problem. I wanted to be able to scribe a center line but did not care about the width of the workpiece.
> 
> http://rick.sparber.org/aacs.pdf
> 
> ...


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## jpfabricator (Dec 31, 2012)

Charlie, looks cool and simple (I like that) most of all it looks useful. If people are willing to pay for the opti-punch they will pay for this. I say go for it!!


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## xalky (Dec 31, 2012)

Charley Davidson said:


> I shied away from a cone shape so there woyuld be plenty of head room for changing tooling without having to lower/raise the table plus I think there are many more options/uses of this in it's flat disk shape I just need to wrap my tiny little brain around it a bit more tighter


 Exactly, I was replying to the post before mine. I like your idea much better.  The flat makes it more versatile.


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## Ray C (Dec 31, 2012)

Another way to handle it is to use a centering cone like this.  It gets used on a very regular basis and sits with all the front-line mill tools.  This is a small one but 10 minutes on the lathe would fix the problem if a bigger one was needed...  And of course, you could mount a DI on a T-shaft in the spindle.


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## rgsparber (Jan 1, 2013)

Ray C said:


> Another way to handle it is to use a centering cone like this.  It gets used on a very regular basis and sits with all the front-line mill tools.  This is a small one but 10 minutes on the lathe would fix the problem if a bigger one was needed...  And of course, you could mount a DI on a T-shaft in the spindle.



From all of the suggested alternatives, I have to admit that the grooved plastic disc seems to be the most elegant. But that should not inhibit others from suggesting things. 

I was just thinking about taking some weak flat spring material and forming it into a coil. It would be compressed and dropped into the hole. The center of the hole would be near the center of the spring.


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## GK1918 (Jan 1, 2013)

Hi Charlie,  Some guys ideas.  To me as well as others the most annoying thing in any shop is
air line quick couplers.  Guess there is no standard on these things.  I have done a lot of
research on someones idea comming up empty.  Ok I picture some retired guy in his basement
that came up with the female that will fit any and all kinds of males.  Its made out of alum.
knurled extremly well made.  They are unmarked (stamped) placed in a unmarked box on
the counter at local Napa.  They sell like hotcakes for $10.  I bought two and they just dont
wear out.  Heres the big one.  I can not get it apart to see how its made- no way.  Im am
positive this guy has some kind of inverted snap ring or something so when assembled
its locked.   And then one day I went to another Napa asked-they said no such thing so that
means Local store and local neighborhood made.  Brilliant   I write this cause he has no 
patents no nothing a trade secret.   Like already said dont waste time with tv adds this guys
doing pretty well.    Well worth more than ten dollars.  Thats an invention.  How it works, you
push it in air tool the outer ring clicks and locks, next push the knurled sleeve in, that turns on the air.  And when it does fail, I shall cut it in half to reveil its secrets.  I guess thats how ya gotta
think for your invention which i think is a good one (but it has to have a secret)   samuel


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## Old Iron (Jan 1, 2013)

How about using a shaft that it drilled and taped to screw different size cones in.

Paul


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## gnerdalot (Jan 21, 2013)

rgsparber said:


> Some inventors and even major corporations do not patent some designs. They either sell the product until the competition catches up or keep it a trade secret. I know, for example, that many aspects of GE jet engines are trade secrets.



I asked someone who had a business with trade secrets  (chemical processes).   I asked "why not patent them?"  He said "patent means disclosure".


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## dwdw47 (Jan 23, 2013)

In response to the Universal Hose Socketl (air hose coupler) I have used then for years. 
I couldn't find the exact one I was supplied with but here is the replacement. 
It fits the most common industrial tips. I use them in my shop.
hxxp://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-quick-disconnect-air-hose-couplings/=l5z905
The xx in the hxxp shoulds be tt


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