# G4003g Change Gears Noisy



## Dman1114 (May 2, 2015)

Since I've changed the motor on my g4003G   its a lot quieter....

now i hear noise from the change gears.....

If i drop the main gear out of the way and run the lathe it is very quiet. but then i don't have a any power feed or thread capability.

Ive played with the alignment and the back lash but i can't seem to quiet it down much .

is there a special lube that may help?

thanks in advance


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## dave2176 (May 3, 2015)

Yeah, I've had to fiddle with mine to get them quiet. You might try Napa open gear lube. About $7 for a spray can.
Dave


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## RVJimD (May 3, 2015)

I did notice on my G0752 they were pretty loud but I think I had the mesh too tight.  

Jim


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## bosephus (May 3, 2015)

i'd expect a bit of gear noise unless you can get the lash set absolutely perfect , my fav lube to use that might help quiet them is motorcycle chain lube , it stays on the gears and doesnt collect debris


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## darkzero (May 3, 2015)

I also use onroad type motorcycle chain lube on my open gears & prefer it over everything else I've tried. It's a "dry" lube but goes on wet then dries to a tack. As said does attract debris. Someone posted a lube they used where it had a webbing effect. I don't like wet lubes like that cause they're messy and attracts debris.

One thing to consider, one or more of your gears might not be perfectly concentric (OD & ID). So if you think you set gear mesh pretty well, it could tighten up in another spot. I always rotate the spindle a few times & check when setting gear mesh. A piece of paper between the gears can be used as an aid if you need. I find with my lathe if gear mesh is too tight I get a sort of grinding type sound under power. If too tight I get a ringy sound. I adjust so I eliminate both sounds.


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## Chip (May 3, 2015)

Do the norton change gears on that model get any lubrication? I've hit all the oiling points on my lathe, but I don't see where any of those oiling points reach the open gearbox.

I've been hitting each gear individually from the underside with a pump oil can.


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## Dman1114 (May 3, 2015)

IDK ....   but i stick the oil pump hose under there and just pray and spray.... hoping they stay nice and lubed....

Ill stop at the local Cycle shop and see what they got.


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## randyc (May 3, 2015)

I just happened to have some of this and gave it a try.  Worked much better than oil although open gear lube might be better still


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## epanzella (May 7, 2015)

The G4003G has two oiling holes on the side of the Norton gearbox facing the apron. These are for lubing the quick change gears with an oil can.


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## ortho (Jun 3, 2015)

DM1114, if you would to take a look at the gearbox side facing the tailstock, you can see that the side is a 1.25" thick cast iron plate with two oiling ports.  Now this plate is held in with three socket heads.  Remove these socket heads and the plate will come off.  What you should see are THREE, NOT TWO, oiling ports.  One hole is circular and the other two is oval shaped.   For the life of me, I could not figure out the necessity of having that cast iron plate in place; in my opinion it's becoming vestige.  I could not find that cast iron part called out in all versions of Grizzly G4002, G4003, and G4003G manuals.
Now, with that plate off, the top oiling port goes directly into the top portion of the gearbox.  The top portion performs as a shallow oiling pan/reservoir.  The bottom of the pan has two or three additional holes situated above the gear assembly where it should be lubed.  So the top oiling port needs to be squirted with oil generously.   The other two oiling ports (oval shaped) go directly to some shaft bearings that need to be lubed.
Hope this helps.


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## epanzella (Jun 3, 2015)

ortho said:


> DM1114, if you would to take a look at the gearbox side facing the tailstock, you can see that the side is a 1.25" thick cast iron plate with two oiling ports.  Now this plate is held in with three socket heads.  Remove these socket heads and the plate will come off.  What you should see are THREE, NOT TWO, oiling ports.  One hole is circular and the other two is oval shaped.   For the life of me, I could not figure out the necessity of having that cast iron plate in place; in my opinion it's becoming vestige.  I could not find that cast iron part called out in all versions of Grizzly G4002, G4003, and G4003G manuals.
> Now, with that plate off, the top oiling port goes directly into the top portion of the gearbox.  The top portion performs as a shallow oiling pan/reservoir.  The bottom of the pan has two or three additional holes situated above the gear assembly where it should be lubed.  So the top oiling port needs to be squirted with oil generously.   The other two oiling ports (oval shaped) go directly to some shaft bearings that need to be lubed.
> Hope this helps.



I want to make sure I understand your post. Are you saying you take the endplate off every time you oil your transmission rather than using the two factory supplied oiling ports?


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## ortho (Jun 3, 2015)

epanzella, I guess you could, but I'm planning on removing the plate permanently and storing it.  I'm basing on assumption that G4003, G4002, and G4003G gearing and structure designs are basically identical; the manuals show that G4002 and G4003 do not have that plate part.  I've a mind to use these three oiling ports instead of two until I'm shown that the plate needs to be put back on.


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## epanzella (Jun 3, 2015)

ortho said:


> epanzella, I guess you could, but I'm planning on removing the plate permanently and storing it.  I'm basing on assumption that G4003, G4002, and G4003G gearing and structure designs are basically identical; the manuals show that G4002 and G4003 do not have that plate part.  I've a mind to use these three oiling ports instead of two until I'm shown that the plate needs to be put back on.


 The exploded view in my G4003G manual doesn't show that plate either but in the oiling section it shows the two oiling ports and instructs to oil the transmission there. I'll have to take that plate off and take a peek underneath. A long time ago I read a post in which a guy stated that he takes a cover off to get to the "other" oil port. I couldn't figure out what he was talking about but I bet he meant the same thing that you're referring to.


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## epanzella (Jun 3, 2015)

A followup. I looked up and compared the G4003 and the G4003G manuals. It looks to me that the headstock is bigger in the G4003G and that plate extends the transmission so it's flush with the headstock.  The G4003G has a smaller headstock so the transmission and headstock are flush without that plate. Could the plate just be for looks??? Seems like a pretty hefty plate to be cosmetic.


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## ortho (Jun 3, 2015)

I agree that it's kind of beefy to be cosmetic.  However, I'm wondering if the G4003G inboard spindle bearing has wider race than the one in G4003/4002, thus accounting for headstock size difference.  But we're looking at 1.25" difference!


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## jmanatee (Jun 4, 2015)

I pulled my plate off last night.  (G4003)  Couple things.  I got the lathe used and it didn't come with original manual,  I got the manual (PDF) for the G4002/G4003 from grizzly.  

The manual does not show the plate.  I have the plate.   The manual shows 3 oil ports.  I have two.  The oil port for the power feed bar is not there but my plate is cut away and allows direct oiling of it.

I removed the plate and I can see right down to the top of the lower gear box shaft bearing.  On mine, the plate definitely shields chips away from that so I will not be leaving mine off.

If I look at the manual for the G4003G it looks more like mine


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## jmanatee (Jun 4, 2015)

is the year of manufacture stamped somewhere on it?


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## ortho (Jun 4, 2015)

" year of manufacture stamped"
jmanatee,
On my G4003G, it is stamped above the INCHING button.  When you mentioned the plate shielding chips away, I think I'll leave that plate on just as well.  Thanks for the insight.  Maybe, later, I'll modify the plate to take care of lubing the power feed bar bearing.


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## jmanatee (Jun 4, 2015)

Ortho,

I looked by the buttons the only thing stamped is the "Mach #"  I assume that is the serial number.  can it be decoded?

DMan,
When I was playing with the plate and oiling it I looked at my change gears....   I have a little play in them,  I don't think you should have them real tight because I think they will grumble


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## Mork (May 27, 2016)

*Stens 770-123 "00" Grease!  

I've tried just about everything and this stuff makes my change gears super quiet. The only negative is changing the gears (sticky mess). The color is a semi-clear light blue gray. Much cleaner than the open gear lub.

Amazon has it for 22 a quart. I'm guessing one quart will last me 10+ years

*


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## MSD0 (May 27, 2016)

Mork said:


> *Stens 770-123 "00" Grease!
> 
> I've tried just about everything and this stuff makes my change gears super quiet. The only negative is changing the gears (sticky mess). The color is a semi-clear light blue gray. Much cleaner than the open gear lub.
> 
> ...


Might give this a try. I've been using open gear lube and it gets all over the place.


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## Mork (May 28, 2016)

If it's the same open gear lube I tried thats nasty stuff. I've got a 1942 Logan 200 that I restored about a year ago. As I mentioned before I've tried all sorts of gear oil, white lithium chain lube etc...  Then I read about open Gear Lube and by the name I figured it would be perfect. After one shot to the gears I realized it was the same nasty tar stuff I spent hours (more like days!) removing during the restoration. I'm guessing it puts a great protective film on the gear teeth for sure but no way will I use it.

This 00 grease sticks to the gears great and unless you overdo it doesn't sling. What tells me it is really doing a good job is how quiet the gears run.


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## dirty tools (May 29, 2016)

have you checked the gear clearances?
for example SB instructions say to use a piece of paper between the gears to set the clearance.
My SB gears ways very noisy before I adjusted the gears clearances, now very quite before oiling


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## Mork (May 29, 2016)

My gears are not very noisy really and the back lash is about right... Just saying that this lube made them very quiet. With that said...  the majority of the noise coming from my gears is from an area that is not adjustable, that being, the reverse gears for the feed. A little wear in the bushings no doubt.


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## Andre (May 29, 2016)

Over time the gears will wear in and quiet. When I run my lathe in reverse with the gear train engaged it's very loud, but forwards even at high speeds it's fairly quiet. That's because one side of the teeth have meshed together, but the other sides are fairly new.


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## Mork (May 30, 2016)

My Logan has cast iron gears which are nearly perfect. The only gear that has any sign of wear is the one on the spindle and it isn't too bad. There is a bit of movement in the reverse gears I need to address. It's making the gears mesh a little deep. Long term my only concern is the spindle gear and removing it. I'm guessing its been attached to the spindle for 74 years (1942 model)


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