# Buying a new lathe



## GaryK

Well, my new lathe, a PM1236 will be shipping to me this week! 

I was wondering if anyone would be interested in my trails and tribulations incurred during the setup and installation? I will
be adding some accessories, such as a lever collet closer and a DRO to start with. Then some tooling as I move along.

Speak now or forever hold your piece. )

Gary


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## David

*Re: Buying new lathe*

Yes, please do share Gary.  We may all be able to learn something from your experience.  Photos from arrival to completion would be nice.  

David


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## GaryK

*Re: Buying new lathe*

Let's start with what I had before. 

This is what I started with and had been using for the last 25 years:





It worked fine within it's limits. Now it's time to move to something bigger and heavier. It's Chinese but it will due:




I'm just doing hobby stuff and not using it for production work so it will work fine for my purposes.
This new lathe should be shipping this week, so I am getting prepared for it's arrival, hopefully next week.

In my next post I will go through some of my preparations.

Gary


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## OakRidgeGuy

*Re: Buying new lathe*

Might want to check with Matt, but I think that that lathe may be built in T-wan. I know that the one that I have been looking at that he is selling is. 

http://www.machinetoolonline.com/PM1340T.html


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## PurpLev

*Re: Buying new lathe*

+1 for following along the progress. 

thanks Gary


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## jmh8743

*Re: Buying new lathe*

Hey Gary,

Glad I noticed this thread. I bought a 13X40 JET 2 yrs ago and the results were less than spectacular, with regard to service. The headstock is pinned and is still not aligned per the factory specs. Trying to work it out now. The "retailer" has sent techs, but they brushed and pulled and stared and left in same condition. But enough.

The bottom line is: If the retailer has enough "clout" with the factory, you will be fine. However, please be sure to check the lathe functions very carefully from day one. My opinion, if you do not have appropriate tests bars, acquire them. One quick check was sent to me. There are many to do.

see : http://www.hobby-machinist.com/show...adstock-alignment-nightmare-with-Walter-Meier


Also, my lathe came with a "factory" test record. 
And finally please keep us updated and I wish you the best.

Mike
Remlap AL


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## GaryK

*Re: Buying new lathe*

I got the word that my lathe shipped out today. Due to arrive the day after Christmas.
They sent me an e-mail telling me that the lathe already had a DRO installed and that they will take it off if I didn't want it.
They offered me deal if I would buy it, so I decided to take it.

In the mean time here is the spot it will live in. Same place as the atlas but with a little more width:
(There's actually more room than it looks like in the picture)




Then something I'll be needing that I really didn't need for the atlas since it was belt driven, oil:




And lastly something that I got from Grizzly that I will adapt to the lathe is a lever collet closer:




That's it for now.


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## jpfabricator

*Re: Buying new lathe*

I would be intrested in "tagging along". :thumbsup:


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## PurpLev

*Re: Buying new lathe*

did the atlas sold already? or was it moved elsewhere to a temporary location?


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## GaryK

*Re: Buying new lathe*



PurpLev said:


> did the atlas sold already? or was it moved elsewhere to a temporary location?



It sold last weekend. I needed some cash to pay for my new one!

I looks like * tripletap3*      just got his! 10 month wait?? I couldn't have waited that long!! First come first serve!

Luckily I got in at the tail end of this batch of lathes. I first contacted Matt on Nov.30, and my lathe will be here
the day after Christmas! Less than 30 days. I had also contacted Grizzly about their G4003G and they were out
to the end of Jan.


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## darkzero

*Re: Buying new lathe*



OakRidgeGuy said:


> Might want to check with Matt, but I think that that lathe may be built in T-wan. I know that the one that I have been looking at that he is selling is.
> 
> http://www.machinetoolonline.com/PM1340T.html



Nope, it's China. So far the only PM machine made in Taiwan is the lathe you linked.


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## tripletap3

*Re: Buying new lathe*



darkzero said:


> Nope, it's China. So far the only PM machine made in Taiwan is the lathe you linked.



It is China. But this lathe is made in one of the nicer China factories and I would say on the same level as Taiwan looking at it.  I have some prior experience with China made equipment. Most people think that just because two lathes (or most any China equipment for that matter) look the same then they are made by the same factory and just painted different colors with different decals, and that is just not the case. There may be a dozen factories making the same design with a huge difference in quality between them.  
Some factories have a heavy turnover and use cheap labor like migrant or temporary workers that come into the cities in the off season to work in the factories then go home to grow crops. They may be using old equipment in dim lit dirty factories. This is probably the most common factory in China but that is changing. And on the other extreme there are those that use best skilled full time workers and have clean lit factories much like what we think of when we think of a factory in the US. The latter is becoming more common but guess what? Yep you got it, it costs more and it takes longer to get these products.


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## tripletap3

*Re: Buying new lathe*



GaryK said:


> It sold last weekend. I needed some cash to pay for my new one!
> 
> I looks like *tripletap3* just got his! 10 month wait?? I couldn't have waited that long!! First come first serve!.



I sold mine for the same reason. Matt gave me a 2% discount for cash. You are very lucky that you got the last of the order. The 10 month wait was mostly my fault. I had orderd a PM1127 and literatly a week before it came in I changed to a PM1236 and just missed the order. Best move I could have made though glad I waited. Better to go 10 months waiting than 10 years wishing I had.


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## dickr

*Re: Buying new lathe*

Looks really nice. I would think that's a great improvement over the former. Nothing wrong with a Chinese lathe if it does the job. Many many years ago after WW II we (USA) started getting things from Japan and they were originally junk and earned that name. Then they improved with practice. Then Taiwan came on, because of communist china, there stuff was junk to begin with. Now they make many fine machines.There are many countries now that are going through the same process. It's an international world competing so we have to look and buy the best we can afford. That might be new or old rebuilt, but if it works for you that's the one you need. Who knows your next machine might be a Haas cnc where the parts are made all over the world and assembled in the USA. Congratulations.
dickr


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## OakRidgeGuy

*Re: Buying new lathe*

Yeah, I have read and read that there are about 5 main factories that build these bigger machines.. and I do know that some are better than others. But from what I understand, the quality from the Taiwan plants are better than the best China plant. But that is just what I have read on the "interweb"!


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## darkzero

*Re: Buying new lathe*



tripletap3 said:


> It is China. But this lathe is made in one of the nicer China factories and I would say on the same level as Taiwan looking at it.



Unfortunately I would have to disagree. Almost every Tawain lathe, mill, or bandsaw I have seen in person is much nicer than any China made machine I have seen. I can always see where they "cut corners" in the China stuff. The Taiwan machines are much better quality, especially in the casting & finish work. Even the stands are much nicer as well as the crating. For example, if you ever see a real Rong Fu (mills & bandsaws) in person compared to a China made RF clone you can tell the difference. My local MSC has a number of Taiwan made machines on the showroom floor, I always drool over them.

But don't get me wrong, remember I have this same lathe & a RF45 clone, I'm very happy with them. However they definitely show made in China quality. You get what you pay for & the PM machines are a great value compared to others.


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## GaryK

*Re: Buying new lathe*

Well, the trucking company called on the 26th when it was supposed to be delivered, and said that it will be delivered the 27th
sometime between 9 and 5. I guess we all know what that means, huh? They showed up at 4:30. 

Anyway, here they are:




What's inside:










And finally I had to do a little surgery to the pallet so I could use the engine hoist.



I just moved the lathe over to the right between the two studs and cut away the third.
Circular and hand saw were required and it only took about 5 minutes total. 

At this point I'm too tried to do anymore, plus I have some thinking to do on how to proceed.
I will be positioning this close to a wall so I won't be putting the coolant system in the pedestal.
I'll just set it underneath  or at the end of the lathe.

Anyway that's my update so far. I'll be back at it tomorrow.

Gary


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## PurpLev

*Re: Buying new lathe*

so far so good. 

so they said 9-5 and showed up at 4:30? thats good... much better than them showing up at 5:45


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## GaryK

*Re: Buying new lathe*

Got everything done but the cleanup.

Not too hard to do. I did it all by myself and a 2 ton engine hoist.

Here it is after I dropped in on the stand.



Here it is just before I removed it from the hoist.



I moved the location of the DRO from the top of the head casting to the electrical box.
This moved it farther back and inline to the chuck from where I would stand. This way I would just
have to look up rather the up and to the left.



This is just another view.



I went to Lowe's with the cover to the coolant tank and had them
color match it for touch-up paint. $2.99 for a small sample. What a deal!



Now I have to clean up all the goop.


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## jpfabricator

*Re: Buying new lathe*

Lookin good so far, but we are all ready to see some chips fly!! woo hoo


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## GaryK

*Re: Buying new lathe*



jpfabricator said:


> Lookin good so far, but we are all ready to see some chips fly!! woo hoo



Here are my first chips. I threaded the half-nut lever to accept a ball. Red to match.

I have to tell you it makes all the difference in the world. Sooo much more comfortable!
It fits perfectly in the palm of your hand.

I plan on doing the feed lever next. Of course another matching red ball.


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## jmh8743

*Re: Buying new lathe*

Glad things going well. Mine was not so easy. Yeah :nuts:. We re all keeping up. You were lucky that hoist legs fit so easy.  Mike


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## GaryK

*Re: Buying new lathe*



jmh8743 said:


> Glad things going well. Mine was not so easy. Yeah :nuts:. We re all keeping up. You were lucky that hoist legs fit so easy.  Mike



My hoist didn't fit too well either. As you can see I just hacked up the pallet it was sitting on so the legs could straddle it.)


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## tripletap3

*Re: Buying new lathe*

Gary. Have you received any word on delivery of the QCTP yet?


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## Old Iron

*Re: Buying new lathe*

Gary I've been following along on your thread nice Lathe and looks like it was a fairly easy set up. I;m sure it will give you years of chip making.

Paul


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## GaryK

*Re: Buying new lathe*



tripletap3 said:


> Gary. Have you received any word on delivery of the QCTP yet?



Matt said that he was waiting to machine it to fit the compound slide and then ship it out. I told him that I had a mill and could
do it myself so he said he would go ahead and ship it without the final machining. It was supposed to ship Friday the 28th.

I should have it this week.

He said that he should have the rest done this weekend and ready to ship by Monday (Dec 31)


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## tripletap3

Thanks. I haven't heard anything and I didn't want to be bugging QMT.  I have looked over my machine pretty close and about the only thing I see is the cams in the spindle leave alot to be desired. Also have you installed the faceplate yet. I can't even get mine to line up with the cam lock holes in the sindle. 1 pin appears to be off.


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## GaryK

tripletap3 said:


> Thanks. I haven't heard anything and I didn't want to be bugging QMT.  I have looked over my machine pretty close and about the only thing I see is the cams in the spindle leave alot to be desired. Also have you installed the faceplate yet. I can't even get mine to line up with the cam lock holes in the sindle. 1 pin appears to be off.



I got my QCTP today. I just have to machine the mount for my t-slot. I just got back inside from the shop and my face plate fits perfectly. I'm sure Matt will send you another one.
 I still need to try the 4-jaw chuck on. That's one heavy bugger!

Gary


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## Ray C

*Re: Buying new lathe*

Guys,

I have the same lathe and they are quite good.  Pretty solid, very well thought out and all the critidal areas on the basic frame of the machine are very well finished.  The machine is top-heavy and left-side heavy -expected since it does not have an integral pedestal.  I put about 100lbs of metal in the right side pedestal leg.   Put it on solid leveling base like the ones shown here.   Also, the peripherals (supplied chucks) however may need a good bit of tuning-up.  On mine, the D1 backs weren't matched to the spindle.  The taper angle hole in the backplates was too small and the angle did not match the nose angle on the spindle.  Also, the back face of the back plates were not flat.  To get consistent chuck mounting, I first surfaced ground the backside of the face plate then, matched the angle of the spindle nose and carefully opened-up the backplate hole diameter until the spindle nose taper contacted the back plate taper and still allowed the mating surfaces of the spindle face and backplate face to make perfect contact.  -Hope that made sense.  Also, the D1 lugs needed a good bit of fine-tuning and hand fitting.

After getting the backplate to match the spindle, I surface ground the front face of the back plate.  On my own collet chuck, I new that it was perfectly square front-to-back so I just cut the usual shoulder, drilled the holes and did a fine-tune centering with zero runout by DI'd off a proof bar that was mounted in a collet.  It turns out, the body is concentric with collet taper because after the initial centering, the body also DI'd within a few tens.  After that, I trimmed some of the remaining shoulder off the back plate.  Ever since, that chuck re-mounts within a half-thou each and every time and depending on which collet I'm using, the workpiece centers within a half thou.  The face of the chuck is perfectly perpendicular to the ways to the best of my ability to measure it.  That chuck is dead-on!

The 4 jaw was not flat and parallel from front to back.  It was off about a thou and a half so, in addition to tuning-up it's backplate as described above, I had to surface grind the rear side of the chuck then, do the rest of the installation.  That behemoth was hard to work with!

I mount 3 jaw chucks similar to collet chucks.  After getting the backplate tuned up, I mount a proof rod in it's jaws and center on the backplate while indicating off the proof bar.  I noticed that the jaws were holding the piece with a slight angle so I tuned-up the jaws until it held straight.  In the case of the 3 jaw, the backplate rim indicates dead-on but the body is off by 3-4 thou.  Since the face was perfectly perpendicular to the ways, I didn't care that the body was slightly out.  All you are concerned about is a flat, perpendicualar face, straight jaws and pieces that center.  For most diameter pieces, the 3 jaw centers within about 1.5 thou, some cases almost dead on.  That's about all you can ask of an independent chuck.

Let me know if you want pics of the backplate tune-up.  I have another chuck that needs mounting so I'll take pics as I go.

BTW:  I have a procedure for static balancing chucks.  It works pretty well.  Let me know if you want to hear about it.  It's all slow speed balancing techniques...  WARNING:  when you mount those new chucks, they might be pretty out of balance (mine were) so work your speeds up slowly.

Ray




Old Iron said:


> Gary I've been following along on your thread nice Lathe and looks like it was a fairly easy set up. I;m sure it will give you years of chip making.
> 
> Paul


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## GaryK

*Re: Buying new lathe*



Ray C said:


> Guys,
> 
> I have the same lathe and they are quite good.  Pretty solid, very well thought out and all the critidal areas on the basic frame of the machine are very well finished.  The machine is top-heavy and left-side heavy -expected since it does not have an integral pedestal.  I put about 100lbs of metal in the right side pedestal leg.   Put it on solid leveling base like the ones shown here.   Also, the peripherals (supplied chucks) however may need a good bit of tuning-up.  On mine, the D1 backs weren't matched to the spindle.  The taper angle hole in the backplates was too small and the angle did not match the nose angle on the spindle.  Also, the back face of the back plates were not flat.  To get consistent chuck mounting, I first surfaced ground the backside of the face plate then, matched the angle of the spindle nose and carefully opened-up the backplate hole diameter until the spindle nose taper contacted the back plate taper and still allowed the mating surfaces of the spindle face and backplate face to make perfect contact.  -Hope that made sense.  Also, the D1 lugs needed a good bit of fine-tuning and hand fitting.
> 
> After getting the backplate to match the spindle, I surface ground the front face of the back plate.  On my own collet chuck, I new that it was perfectly square front-to-back so I just cut the usual shoulder, drilled the holes and did a fine-tune centering with zero runout by DI'd off a proof bar that was mounted in a collet.  It turns out, the body is concentric with collet taper because after the initial centering, the body also DI'd within a few tens.  After that, I trimmed some of the remaining shoulder off the back plate.  Ever since, that chuck re-mounts within a half-thou each and every time and depending on which collet I'm using, the workpiece centers within a half thou.  The face of the chuck is perfectly perpendicular to the ways to the best of my ability to measure it.  That chuck is dead-on!
> 
> The 4 jaw was not flat and parallel from front to back.  It was off about a thou and a half so, in addition to tuning-up it's backplate as described above, I had to surface grind the rear side of the chuck then, do the rest of the installation.  That behemoth was hard to work with!
> 
> I mount 3 jaw chucks similar to collet chucks.  After getting the backplate tuned up, I mount a proof rod in it's jaws and center on the backplate while indicating off the proof bar.  I noticed that the jaws were holding the piece with a slight angle so I tuned-up the jaws until it held straight.  In the case of the 3 jaw, the backplate rim indicates dead-on but the body is off by 3-4 thou.  Since the face was perfectly perpendicular to the ways, I didn't care that the body was slightly out.  All you are concerned about is a flat, perpendicualar face, straight jaws and pieces that center.  For most diameter pieces, the 3 jaw centers within about 1.5 thou, some cases almost dead on.  That's about all you can ask of an independent chuck.
> 
> Let me know if you want pics of the backplate tune-up.  I have another chuck that needs mounting so I'll take pics as I go.
> 
> BTW:  I have a procedure for static balancing chucks.  It works pretty well.  Let me know if you want to hear about it.  It's all slow speed balancing techniques...  WARNING:  when you mount those new chucks, they might be pretty out of balance (mine were) so work your speeds up slowly.
> 
> Ray



Ray,

I think I've been pretty lucky. Both chucks and the faceplate seem to be balanced and running true. I would like to see your procedure for truing and balancing one. Maybe a separate post so all can see it.

How long ago did you get your lathe?

I know the footprint for the lathe is pretty small. I have already drawn up plans for fixing that. I'll post it when I get it done.

I did get my QCTP all machined and installed. A lot better that the clunky 4 way that came with it. I plan on replacing it also when a different one that I bought arrives.

The first thing I did after installing it was to thread the feed handle and add another ball. I can't tell you how much better they feel and they also give you better control.
They look cool also. I plan in installing another smaller ball on a carriage lock that I will add. I can't use a store bought on since it's too close the the DRO scale.

Here's a pic:


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## darkzero

Congrats Gary. Looking good!

The balls are cool but now you need one for the QCTP, the tailstock lever, & all the gearbox handles! 

I never checked the taper on my chuck backplates but on my 3 jaw chuck that came with the lathe it does not release easily like all my other D1-4 stuff so I assume it's off. I have to tap it with a mallet lightly to break it loose after releasing the cam locks. My other chucks fall right off the taper when I release the cam locks & they repeat pretty much dead nuts when I put them back on.

If you get unsatisfactory run out, try switching pin holes. I got .002", then switched pins, just under .002" , then finally on the last try I got just barely over .001". Normally that's good enough but I'm spolied with Set-Tru checks so I removed the 3 jaw from the back plate. Faced the front, then I turned down the boss slightly. This allows me to adjust the run out tapping with a mallet & indicating off a Thomson Linear Shaft. I can get it down to .0003" often pretty quickly. However if you have a hard bump or crash it can easily knock the chuck out of alignment but I never have issues like I did using this method on my mini-lathe.

The stock 3 jaw I kept but I only use it for holding small diameters that my 6-jaw can't hold & for sanding/polishing. It's my "beater" chuck. I use a Bison 6.25" 6-Jaw set-Tru most of the time. The Bison backplate is blanchard ground like the chuck so it was a bolt on affair, adjust to just under .0002" & call it a day. It also goes back on with the same TIR as long as you put it back with the same pin configuration. All my D1-4 stuff is marked so they go back on the same way everytime. I also got rid of the stock 4-jaw as I was not happy with the quality. I replaced it with a Fuerda 8" 4-jaw which I'm happy with for the price.

My tailstock is only .001" high but side to side alignment was pretty off so be sure to take some time checking that. The taper in my tailstock ram was not bad but it was not that great when checking with a taper & layout fluid. Reamed it with a roughing reamer followed by a finishing reamer & now it seat very nicely without having to really hammer on it like before. I put caps on the pins on the tailstock that the levers rest on. Something about them when they clank drives my nuts. The cushion makes me much more sane now.

On the thread dial, the gear that rides along the leadscew is not keyed. Mine eventually came loose after quite a few threading jobs so you might want to check it before finding out in the middle of a threading job. I Since it's not keyed, you can fine tune it to line up with the arrow more accurately if it's currently not lining up.

Also check the spindle brake assy. Mine worked fine just bolting it together. Then one day when I really had to stomp on it, I found that the micro switch lever was not aligned as good as it should be. Stepping on the brake cuts power first, then engages the drum brake as you press down further. Letting go of the brake restores power to spindle after a reset. However when I stomp on it hard & fast, the micro switch
does not fully release & I had to cycle the brake up & down a could of times to get it to release. A quick adjustment to the roller & bracket was all that was needed. Yours may work fine as mine did initially but I don't like to find things out like this in the middle of a project as I tend to stop working & fix it right then & there.

I didn't add weight to the right base intentially at first but I have filled it it up with "misc junk" to help add weight. I like the idea of adding 100lbs of weight in there though. Good idea!

If you have an optical or laser tachometer handy, it's useful to check the feed rates. My feed & threading chart is different from yours (& most others) I have seen (values are different). Essentially it's the same with only minor variances. But on my chart A1 is listed to be the slowest feed rate when set up for imperial. Using my tachometer I found that I can actually get 6 other feed rates slower than what my chart says (very little differences from each other though) & D1 actually gives me the slowest feed rate. My chart does not list any D configurations other than D4. It's aslo handy to give you an idea of what your actual spindle speeds are.

Here are the speeds that I measured.

Spindle LOW - Actual
Projected
 RPM
1
2
3
1
2
3
A
283
1398
850
235
1200
700
B
78
389
235
65
330
200
C
218
1075
656
180
910
500


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## Ray C

Will,

Thumbs up on the speed chart.  I've been using this model of lathe for several months and that never entered my mind.  I have a tach and will compare notes and report later just for the sake of it.

Also, those are the sexiest chucks I've ever seen.  I gotta think of a reason to get a 6 jaw LOL...

The stock bench is OK but one of these days, I might beef it up just a bit.  Also thinking of chopping a hole in the right pedestal to make a door -of course, will reinforce as needed.  Tired of crawling on my hands/knees to get to the backside opening on rare occasions.  I leave the coolant tank outside the unit and don't use coolant for the most part.

FWIW, some of the backplates I had were really misfit.  The plate taper holes were cut small and there was a 1/16" gap between the faces.  Chuck wouldn't re-mount worth a darn within a mile.

How do you like those "corrugated" belts, is that working OK for you?  Seems like a good idea.  What's the advantage?

BTW:  Mine does not have a brake drum.  The foot pedal just trips a switch -nothing more than that.  It looks like you have the safety shield so maybe the brake drum comes as part of that option.  Where/how did they attach the brake pads?  The pedal switch needed adjustment on mine -done with a set screw in the assemble inside the left pedestal.  

Ray


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## tripletap3

*Re: Buying new lathe*



Ray C said:


> Guys,
> the D1 lugs needed a good bit of fine-tuning and hand fitting.
> 
> WARNING: when you mount those new chucks, they might be pretty out of balance (mine were) so work your speeds up slowly.
> 
> Ray



This is my first lathe with a camlock mount and this is exactly what I have found so far. My 4 jaw and backing plate came separate on the pallet. The backing plate was machined to fit a 4 jaw chuck at the factory but it just wasn't my chuck because the box had never been opened. I mounted it and put on the machine and it looks like a one blade ceiling fan flying around. I figured it might. Like you said the lathe is very nice but the chucks, the D1 lugs and cams leave allot to be desired. The lugs in my backing plate won't even line up with the holes in my spindle.


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## Ray C

*Re: Buying new lathe*

Well, having mounted and static balanced a whole bunch of chucks for myself and others, I've worked-up a procedure that seems to work.  I have another chuck to mount in the upcoming days so, I'll photograph the ordeal and you can choose for yourself to adopt some or all of the ideas.  It takes a couple hours because you really need to get it right the first time.

But in general, I think this lathe is the best thing going in it's class...  And Matt is a good guy -albeit difficult to reach sometimes but for good reason.  He's a hard working and busy guy and I respect that.


Ray





tripletap3 said:


> This is my first lathe with a camlock mount and this is exactly what I have found so far. My 4 jaw and backing plate came separate on the pallet. The backing plate was machined to fit a 4 jaw chuck at the factory but it just wasn't my chuck because the box had never been opened. I mounted it and put on the machine and it looks like a one blade ceiling fan flying around. I figured it might. Like you said the lathe is very nice but the chucks, the D1 lugs and cams leave allot to be desired. The lugs in my backing plate won't even line up with the holes in my spindle.


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## tripletap3

My tailstock was way out too. It was quite a bit high and right. The taper adjustment screws were stuck (full of filler and sand) so I took it apart and cleaned the machined surfaces. My windage is now dead on and my elevation looks be about .001-2 high. I will have to wait for my stuff to come in so I can get turning and find out.


I do have a question about the thread dial. Like darkzero was saying the numbers and lines on the dial are not lined up with the arrow. If I start pressure on the half nut lever right on top of the line/number it doesn't lock in until slightly after the line/number. Actually I like it this way but will it throw off my threading?


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## Ray C

tripletap3 said:


> My tailstock was way out too. It was quite a bit high and right. The taper adjustment screws were stuck (full of filler and sand) so I took it apart and cleaned the machined surfaces. My windage is now dead on and my elevation looks be about .001-2 high. I will have to wait for my stuff to come in so I can get turning and find out.
> 
> 
> I do have a question about the thread dial. Like darkzero was saying the numbers and lines on the dial are not lined up with the arrow. If I start pressure on the half nut lever right on top of the line/number it doesn't lock in until slightly after the line/number. Actually I like it this way but will it throw off my threading?



No.  Its OK.


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## jmh8743

Thanks to all responding to this thread and to Gary for initiating same. Special thanks to darkzero for that thorough post. Having purchased a JET 2 yrs ago (my first), I have been struggling with setup and non-compliance to the basic specifications all that time and the manufg essentially ignored my requests. More on that is herein.

Darkzero I would like to know where to find one of the "dogplates" you discussed. I purchased a Rohm 4 jaw and it has not been kind to a novice. I did like the looks of that 4jaw you have shown since it is much shorter than mine. 

And the degree mark on the compound gave me a great idea. The JET marks are on the saddle and look like cave drawings. Hee Hee

That aside thanks to all.

Mike
Remlap AL


----------



## darkzero

Ray C said:


> Will,
> 
> Thumbs up on the speed chart. I've been using this model of lathe for several months and that never entered my mind. I have a tach and will compare notes and report later just for the sake of it.
> 
> Also, those are the sexiest chucks I've ever seen. I gotta think of a reason to get a 6 jaw LOL...
> 
> How do you like those "corrugated" belts, is that working OK for you? Seems like a good idea. What's the advantage?
> 
> BTW: Mine does not have a brake drum. The foot pedal just trips a switch -nothing more than that. It looks like you have the safety shield so maybe the brake drum comes as part of that option. Where/how did they attach the brake pads? The pedal switch needed adjustment on mine -done with a set screw in the assemble inside the left pedestal.
> 
> Ray



Thanks Ray! I only have spindle RPM data for the low range as I never used the high range. I may switch to high just to take measurements for the hell of it.

Yup, I love chuck porn! Nice chucks are like works of art & I love looking at them. I'm very happy with the 5" & "6.25" Bisons. The 5" Bison I had on my HF8x14. I got into machining because of custom flashlights & the 6-jaw really helped with that where the 3-jaw could hold stuff that i worked with. I was going to go with a Pratt Burnerd 6-jaw Set-Rite for the 12x36 but I didn't want to wait for the D1-4 back plate to be ordered so I went with the Bison. No regrets at all though of course.








I like the Fenner Power Twist Belts. I first used them cause I needed a slightly longer belt on my HF814 since the stock belt made speed changes harder. I changed speeds quite often & the belt did not last long. I assume they're not designed to be taken off/on & strecthed repeatedly. 

I hear that 220V 1 phase motors can produce a vibration that can be seen in the finish. I'm not sure if that's true as I don't remember when using the stock belts but the link belts are supposed to reduce that since they reduce vibration. Link belts are claimed to be quieter than standard V-belts but I don't think that's true, not in my experiences anyway. The link belts were not really louder, just a different type of sound. 

The belts that came with my bandsaw & HF814 were junk, they both had a bump where the ends were molded together & while running they were noticeable. also when a V-belt has been sitting for a while unused (especially in colder climates), they can suffer from "memory" which is also noticable when running. My belts suffered from this & caused bad vibrations. But a quality V-belt will take care of these issues & that won't be an issue if they're ran periodically. I run my lathe often so that's not an issue. These belts are popular amognst wood wookers who might have a table saw or sander or something that doesn't always get used.

I can't really comment on what benefits they may or may have not given me but I'm used to them & will continue using them. Plus my lathe, air compressor, & bandsaw all use the same size so whenever I have to change them I only need to keep one size on hand. 

HF carries the green link belts that are made by a competitor of Fenner. HF only sells one width but it is the same width for the PM1236 (A, 1/2")
for a bit cheaper than the Fenner Power Twist. The green belts are made in the USA (yes, HF does sell a number of US made products which some people do not believe. )



Ray C said:


> BTW: Mine does not have a brake drum. The foot pedal just trips a switch -nothing more than that. It looks like you have the safety shield so maybe the brake drum comes as part of that option. Where/how did they attach the brake pads? The pedal switch needed adjustment on mine -done with a set screw in the assemble inside the left pedestal.




If you look at my photo ealier that shows the belts, you can see the micro switch & part of the bracket that the foot pedal bar connects to. That bracket is what engages the drum brake. The drum brake assy is inside the spindle pulley & looks pretty much like drum brakes on a car. It has two drum shoes. I'm pretty sure you're should have it. Maybe it just needs adjusting?




tripletap3 said:


> My 4 jaw and backing plate came separate on the pallet. The backing plate was machined to fit a 4 jaw chuck at the factory but it just wasn't my chuck because the box had never been opened. I mounted it and put on the machine and it looks like a one blade ceiling fan flying around. I figured it might. Like you said the lathe is very nice but the chucks, the D1 lugs and cams leave allot to be desired. The lugs in my backing plate won't even line up with the holes in my spindle.



My stock 4-jaw came mounted on the back plate & was just sitting on the pallet, no box. It needed quite a bit of deburring before I was comfortable using it. The jaws did not move freely at all. I couldn't even remove the back plate from the 4-jaw for some reason. Even though I don't use the 4-jaw that much at the time I decided to replace it with something better & I'm glad I did. The Fuerda is also made in China but it's pretty nice. It's no Buck, Bison, Pratt, etc but it's decent & i would buy it again if I had to. I may get a 3-jaw from Fuerda too.




Ray C said:


> Well, having mounted and static balanced a whole bunch of chucks for myself and others, I've worked-up a procedure that seems to work. I have another chuck to mount in the upcoming days so, I'll photograph the ordeal and you can choose for yourself to adopt some or all of the ideas. It takes a couple hours because you really need to get it right the first time.



That would be great Ray, lookig foward to it!




tripletap3 said:


> My tailstock was way out too. It was quite a bit high and right. The taper adjustment screws were stuck (full of filler and sand) so I took it apart and cleaned the machined surfaces. My windage is now dead on and my elevation looks be about .001-2 high. I will have to wait for my stuff to come in so I can get turning and find out.
> 
> 
> I do have a question about the thread dial. Like darkzero was saying the numbers and lines on the dial are not lined up with the arrow. If I start pressure on the half nut lever right on top of the line/number it doesn't lock in until slightly after the line/number. Actually I like it this way but will it throw off my threading?



As Ray stated, nope it won't affect the threading. It's just for reference, what's important is that you always engage at the same place acording the numbers on the dial & the thread pitch.

The adjustment set screws on my tailstock are junk like many other screws & bolts on the lathe. But it's not surprising. The hex is broached off center & are shallow. I feel like they will strip out soon but luckily I don't touch them very often. I raplaced quite a few bolts on the lathe already & I will be replacing these too. I found exact replacements for them at Mcmaster but they come in quantities on 25 & of course I really only need two. I've been meaning to order them & when I do, maybe I'll offer some "sets" here for all us PM1236 guys.



jmh8743 said:


> Thanks to all responding to this thread and to Gary for initiating same. Special thanks to darkzero for that thorough post. Having purchased a JET 2 yrs ago (my first), I have been struggling with setup and non-compliance to the basic specifications all that time and the manufg essentially ignored my requests. More on that is herein.
> 
> Darkzero I would like to know where to find one of the "dogplates" you discussed. I purchased a Rohm 4 jaw and it has not been kind to a novice. I did like the looks of that 4jaw you have shown since it is much shorter than mine.
> 
> And the degree mark on the compound gave me a great idea. The JET marks are on the saddle and look like cave drawings. Hee Hee
> 
> That aside thanks to all.
> 
> Mike
> Remlap AL



No problem Mike, anytime.

Unfortunately I don't know anything else about my dogplate. it was NOS that I found on ebay for $70. It looked great when I received it but I decided to remachine it anyway. Not sure if I did it the "correct" way but I through it in the 4-jaw, indicated the nose taper, faced where it rests against the spindle, then mounted it in the spindle & machined the rest of the surfaces. A dog plate doesn't need to be that precise but it repeats pretty much dead nuts now & it looks even nicer now.

I wish I knew more about & what it came off of as I never seen a dog plate that looks like this. I'm used to seeing the ones that just have one cutout on one side. But I'm not an experienced machinist & it seems like not very many hobbyist machinists turn between centers anymore so maybe someone els might know more about it? It didn't have any markings on it except "1850 RPM Max" on it. That gray paint on the backside is how it came.

My stock 4-jaw was a plain back chuck mounted to a D1-4 adapter. I choose to get the Fuerda 4-jaw in direct mount D1-4 so it doesn't stick out as far. I may do the same for the 3-jaw but I'm worried about what the run out will be as I won't be able to adjust it except by reworking the jaws.

I agree, I would love to have degree markings on my cross slide for the compound too instead of just one scratch line that isn't accurate by the way. I hate how most import lathe do not have a full scale & backwards which does no good for setting up for threading without having to use a protractor everytime. I'll post a pic later on how I do that in case anyone is interested.

The Grizzly G4002 & G4003 do have markings for the compound on the cross slide. I have thought about ordering that replacement part from Grizzly. It should fit but I'm not sure if it will need some fitting work done to it for the gibs. I'm assuming yes but hoping no. It's p/n P4002512 & costs $105. I plan to order it one day unless someone else wants to try first.


----------



## tripletap3

I just measured runout on the 3 jaw and the best I got was .003. I moved it in all three positions and the other two were close to .004. I had witness marked it before I removed the chuck for the first time and the original was the best. The 4 jaw was not as bad as it had looked by eye. I put a DI on the outside and face and it showed .005 run out. I removed it from the backing plate while on the machine and of course dropped it on my little finger smashing it open. After the pain subsided I went back out and DI'd the face of the backing plate and found .004 run out.


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## Ray C

Sorry to hear about the finger and hope it mends well.  -Don't wish to force my procedures on anyone but you might want to try the technique as shown in the picture.  Toss a piece of wood in there to support your hand.  If it does drop on your hand, it won't get split between metal and it will spare you a ding in the ways.

Today I didn't heat the shop and for grins, I took all the chucks off and tested them to see if they still zero on the spindle.  -Yep.  First time, the backplate runs within a half-thou.  I'm calling it good.  It's possible that the summer heat  may change things.  -Will test again (or get AC for the garage).  Hey, there's my excuse!  Honey, I need AC in the garage so my lathe will run right.  It's real important and I gotta have it!  -Yeah -right!

I have an old 6", 4-jaw that I'm thinking of keeping but, my friend wants it desperately.  One way or another, I'll post some pics using that one or just stage pics of one that's already done.

I wish I knew someone with a dynamic balancer though...  Static balancing gets it right most of the time but one of them has a wiggle around 1200 R's but not at speeds higher or lower.  Aside from other obvious reasons, that's another reason I'm converting all my equipment to 3PH VFD -so I can tweak little harmonic vibrations away.  -Darn multiples of 60!  -Be gone!  LOL.

Ray





tripletap3 said:


> I just measured runout on the 3 jaw and the best I got was .003. I moved it in all three positions and the other two were close to .004. I had witness marked it before I removed the chuck for the first time and the original was the best. The 4 jaw was not as bad as it had looked by eye. I put a DI on the outside and face and it showed .005 run out. I removed it from the backing plate while on the machine and of course dropped it on my little finger smashing it open. After the pain subsided I went back out and DI'd the face of the backing plate and found .004 run out.


----------



## tripletap3

I have always kept a piece of wood on the ways whenever I do any chuck changes or repairs to protect them incase of a mishap. Good thing too. I think I am going to make a wood cradle before I do much more lifting of the 4 jaw.


----------



## Ray C

Yeah, that 4J is a little unforgiving.  I had the same idea of making a v-shaped cradle with roller or brass surface bearings that ride on the ways.  -And for extra credit, build in a hand crank to raise the chuck to proper spindle height.   I've busted/damaged each wrist more than once and on some days, the 4J stirs-up aches & pains.  I'm also half tempted to make a light-duty gantry above the lathe to lower pieces into position until the steady rest is positioned.  I do a lot of turning between centers.  Probably seems excessive but not when your joints are screaming at you.



tripletap3 said:


> I have always kept a piece of wood on the ways whenever I do any chuck changes or repairs to protect them incase of a mishap. Good thing too. I think I am going to make a wood cradle before I do much more lifting of the 4 jaw.


----------



## 7HC

Ray C said:


> I'm also half tempted to make a light-duty gantry above the lathe to lower pieces into position until the steady rest is positioned.  I do a lot of turning between centers.  Probably seems excessive but not when your joints are screaming at you.



Doesn't sound excessive to me, it's how the big boys do it.

Nothing to be ashamed of in working smart!


M


----------



## GaryK

Here's what I made to support the big 4 jaw chuck. There's hardly any clearance under it which allows me to slide the pins right in.





Also while we're on the subject of always mounting things on the spindle using the same holes, this is what I do. I just use a center punch to make a little dimple
in the spindle and the chuck so I always mount it back the same way. I just match up the two center punch marks.





They also make a "Sky Hook" for mounting heavy things on your lathe. It mounts to you QCTP. In this case a KDK.


----------



## darkzero

That center punch looks exactly my spindle. Not sure if yours is like this too but my spindle came marked with a red paint line on the nose taper for one of the cam holes. This hole gave me the lowest run out for the stock chuck. Would be a good idea to choose that one for reference but I didn't as I didn't need too.

You probably already know this but the stock 3-jaw chuck does not come with the pinions marked (at least mine didn't). Best to pick one & always use that one for tightening. Doesn't matter which one as long as you stick to the one you choose.


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## GaryK

For anyone interested the thread in the spindle bore is 1 5/8-16.

For those using thread wires the dimension to shoot for is 1.650 with .045" wires.

Gary


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## GaryK

I got my base today that I had made. 2"x2" square with .187" wall.

It's just primed right now. Deciding if I will paint it blue or white to match part of the lathe.

It's the same length as the machine and will fit flush to the front with the legs extending out the back.
Right now the footprint of the lathe is a little over 8" (200mm). This base will will double that to 16".

The two cross members are centered on the existing holes in the lathe stand so there will be 8 bolts attaching
it to the base.

Having just one leveling pad in each corner will make it a lot easier to level.

All in all I think it will add a lot of rigidity and stability. I have added a drawing for those that might be interested.


----------



## darkzero

Looking good, nice job on the chuck support & base riser. One think to keep in mind that some others were talking about, if your riser is too stiff you might not have enough flex to level out the bed twist enough so be sure to check that be finalizing. I think one person ended up having to cut the cross sections off. I vote for just painting the base semi flat black. Thanks for the spindle thread size, I've been meaning to make a spider for mine. Keep the pics coming!


----------



## GaryK

darkzero said:


> Looking good, nice job on the chuck support & base riser. One think to keep in mind that some others were talking about, if your riser is too stiff you might not have enough flex to level out the bed twist enough so be sure to check that be finalizing. I think one person ended up having to cut the cross sections off. I vote for just painting the base semi flat black. Thanks for the spindle thread size, I've been meaning to make a spider for mine. Keep the pics coming!



You know, I've thought about it maybe being too stiff to level. I was just going add shims in between the base and stand to level it.

There has to be some flex in the base, so shims will allow it to get close enough to use the leveling feet for the final level.

I just put a sample of both colors on it and they both look bad. I'll just go with a dark gray.


----------



## Ray C

I bet those long pieces will twist and it will level fine as long as your floor isn't off-the-charts crooked.

Looks good!

Color wise...  You're on your own there...





GaryK said:


> You know, I've thought about it maybe being too stiff to level. I was just going add shims in between the base and stand to level it.
> 
> There has to be some flex in the base, so shims will allow it to get close enough to use the leveling feet for the final level.
> 
> I just put a sample of both colors on it and they both look bad. I'll just go with a dark gray.


----------



## GaryK

I had a bunch of drive dogs that I used on my old Atlas lathe and I kept them when I sold it.





The problem was, the legs are too short for my face place and I didn't want to buy a drive plate if I didn't have to.
So my solution was to just mill a slot in my face plate.




I didn't realize that the pins in a D1 back were screwed in. At least they are this face plate.
You can imagine the time I had pulling them straight out, huh? :angry:




Anyway, all is well and the slot works perfectly. I still have the standard slots to add weight for balance if I ever need it.


----------



## darkzero

Good job on the faceplate. 

Yeah the cam pins are always threaded. That allows for adjusting height for proper lock up & the adjustment is held in place by the socket cap screw. They're also supposed to have play to allow the cams to lock on properly. They should be adjusted so the line or mark on the cam drive falls between the two arrows on the spindle. Generally the line on the pins can be used for a rough reference (lines up with the face) & then go from there. The first thing I do on anything mounting to the spindle is remove the pins, clean & deburr them, then adjust for proper lock up.


----------



## darkzero

tripletap3 said:


> I have always kept a piece of wood on the ways whenever I do any chuck changes or repairs to protect them incase of a mishap. Good thing too. I think I am going to make a wood cradle before I do much more lifting of the 4 jaw.





Ray C said:


> I've busted/damaged each wrist more than once and on some days, the 4J stirs-up aches & pains.



I forgot to mention earlier. Another advantage of a direct mount 4-jaw chuck, beside less overhang, is the lighter weight. The stock four jaw with the backplate was not fun moving around. Since the direct mount has no back plate reducing weight, it exposes the casting of the chuck which allows you to get a nice firm grip on it with your hands.


----------



## tripletap3

darkzero said:


> I forgot to mention earlier. Another advantage of a direct mount 4-jaw chuck, beside less overhang, is the lighter weight. The stock four jaw with the backplate was not fun moving around. Since the direct mount has no back plate reducing weight, it exposes the casting of the chuck which allows you to get a nice firm grip on it with your hands.



You beat me to it Will. I was going to ask that question about the advantage-disadvantage of a direct mount chuck. Thanks. The only thing I have owned on a lathe is a treaded spindle so all the D1 stuff is new to me.


----------



## GaryK

Finally got the 1/2"-13 tap in the mail so I can finish my base. It wouldn't flex enough to level the lathe so I had to add .050" of shims in one corner. No big deal.

It's done now. It really makes it more stable. It may not look like much but it's twice the footprint depth wise.


----------



## GaryK

Well after finally getting my lathe on it's base and level I can finally do some work.

The first thing I wanted to do is to adapt a grizzly 5C collet closer. That amounted making an threaded adapter for the spindle in the PM1236.

I got it all mounted and had to modify the cover by opening up the hole so that I could take it off without unscrewing the adapter I made. I also added
a small 1" hole for the pivot point on the closer.





To remove it I just have to remove the screw and pull it out.

It has some quirks I have to iron out, but it seems to work.





I had to angle the handle down since the pulleys were in the way.


----------



## Ray C

Nice!  Collets are a good thing -do a lot of work with them since many jobs I get are on existing shafts that are fairly true but have no centering holes and/or I can't divot the sides to mount  with a dog.  Fortunately most are between 1" and 1-1/8" too...  I get the odd one that's over 1-1/8 and need to fight with jawed chucks to hold it straight.  Usually, I'm rebuilding the threads on outboard motor prop shafts after doing a build-up and re-thread or conversion to a different attachment method.

BTW:  The PM bench is OK but, I think that lathe would benefit from being bolted to 500lbs of cast iron.  That's my guess.   When I have to make a long shaft from scratch, I get some noise marks going past the 18" mark and every bone in my body says it's from the light side moving a tiny bit.  -Not a real problem worth crying over.   Been thinking of beefing-up that bench but it's not as easy as I wish it were.  Still thinking of the best way to do it but haven't thought long/hard enough.  How bout you, any ideas?


----------



## GaryK

Ray C said:


> BTW:  The PM bench is OK but, I think that lathe would benefit from being bolted to 500lbs of cast iron.  That's my guess.   When I have to make a long shaft from scratch, I get some noise marks going past the 18" mark and every bone in my body says it's from the light side moving a tiny bit.  -Not a real problem worth crying over.   Been thinking of beefing-up that bench but it's not as easy as I wish it were.  Still thinking of the best way to do it but haven't thought long/hard enough.  How bout you, any ideas?



If I really wanted to beef it up I would continue with that base up making a box with the upper part sandwiched between the stand boxes at each end and the chip tray.
Then bolt it to the floor. No shims required there ) You'd have to run into it with a car to move it!


----------



## GaryK

I have added a new addition to my lathe last night. I still have to Black Oxide part of it though.

I've added an permanent carriage lock. The problem in the start was the DRO scale cover was too close to the hole. What I did to move it was replace the two SHCS screws with pan head screws.
Then I slotted the two holes in the cover and carved out a section to clear the compound. This still kept the minimum clearance around the scale but gave me the room i needed. I drilled a hole for the bolt
off center and cut flats on the sides for the room I needed on the lock. See the pictures.






You might be thinking to yourself that I have gone crazy with all the red ball handles, huh? Well, I ordered 4 of them in two different sizes so  used them. )

They do make great targets for the eye, and are very comfortable to the hand.


----------



## sanddan

Do you have a link for those knobs?

Thanks
Dan


----------



## GaryK

sanddan said:


> Do you have a link for those knobs?
> 
> Thanks
> Dan



I got them at McMaster-Carr. Under Plastic Threaded Ball Knobs

I got 2 each of:
Red Polypropylene Ball Knob, 5/16"-18 Thread, 1-1/4" Diameter
Red Polypropylene Ball Knob, 5/16"-18 Thread, 1-1/2" Diameter

Also 1 of:
Metric Red Phenolic Ball Knob, M10 X 1.5 Thread, 34.9 mm Diameter

Which fits the Chinese quick change tool post.


----------



## darkzero

In the past I got them from Enco, made by Gibraltar. They have the ones with the threaded inserts too nut not in metric. I always bought the "universal" ones that cover a range of thread, you just thread them on. I never had an issue with them stripping.


----------



## GaryK

darkzero said:


> In the past I got them from Enco, made by Gibraltar. They have the ones with the threaded inserts too nut not in metric. I always bought the "universal" ones that cover a range of thread, you just thread them on. I never had an issue with them stripping.



I hadn't seem those from Enco. Cool about being able to use different thread sizes. The McMaster ones have a brass threaded insert which I think I would be more inclined to trust more over time. The KDK QCTP was 5/16-24 so I had re-tap the insert but it worked just fine. McMaster does have a larger selection of sizes.


----------



## jpfabricator

Ray C said:


> Nice! Collets are a good thing -do a lot of work with them since many jobs I get are on existing shafts that are fairly true but have no centering holes and/or I can't divot the sides to mount with a dog. Fortunately most are between 1" and 1-1/8" too... I get the odd one that's over 1-1/8 and need to fight with jawed chucks to hold it straight. Usually, I'm rebuilding the threads on outboard motor prop shafts after doing a build-up and re-thread or conversion to a different attachment method.
> 
> BTW: The PM bench is OK but, I think that lathe would benefit from being bolted to 500lbs of cast iron. That's my guess. When I have to make a long shaft from scratch, I get some noise marks going past the 18" mark and every bone in my body says it's from the light side moving a tiny bit. -Not a real problem worth crying over. Been thinking of beefing-up that bench but it's not as easy as I wish it were. Still thinking of the best way to do it but haven't thought long/hard enough. How bout you, any ideas?



Weld re-wire into the bases and pour them full of concrete!!


----------



## GaryK

Sand bags will work also. Lead if you are a reloader that casts your own bullets.


----------



## Ray C

No, no, no...  MORE TOOLS for ballast!




GaryK said:


> Sand bags will work also. Lead if you are a reloader that casts your own bullets.


----------



## GaryK

Just in case anybody is curious about the actual size of the spindle bore is, it's 1.470". It's bigger than that up toward the chuck, but farther back
it is a smaller diameter all the way to the threaded end.

At least that is what my PM1236 measures.

Gary


----------



## darkzero

GaryK said:


> Just in case anybody is curious about the actual size of the spindle bore is, it's 1.470". It's bigger than that up toward the chuck, but farther back
> it is a smaller diameter all the way to the threaded end.
> 
> At least that is what my PM1236 measures.
> 
> Gary



Gary, that's interesting & you got me wondering as I've never actually measured mine. Mine is also bigger towards the chuck size as a D size Maglite won't fit all the way through. But I was working with 1.5" bar today & it did fit past the larger section. I'll measure mine later when I go back to finish what I was working on.

By any chance do you have a MT5 center on hand? If yes could you check if it will seat in the taper properly? On my spindle a full size MT5 center won't seat the taper properly as the back end of it will hit the smaller bore of the spindle just before it can seat the taper. A MT5 center is too big to use as I need anyway but I was just curious as another peerson I know with the same lathe did not have this problem.


----------



## GaryK

darkzero said:


> Gary, that's interesting & you got me wondering as I've never actually measured mine. Mine is also bigger towards the chuck size as a D size Maglite won't fit all the way through. But I was working with 1.5" bar today & it did fit past the larger section. I'll measure mine later when I go back to finish what I was working on.
> 
> By any chance do you have a MT5 center on hand? If yes could you check if it will seat in the taper properly? On my spindle a full size MT5 center won't seat the taper properly as the back end of it will hit the smaller bore of the spindle just before it can seat the taper. A MT5 center is too big to use as I need anyway but I was just curious as another peerson I know with the same lathe did not have this problem.



What I did, since I have no tool to measure so deep into a hole is to attach a disk to the end of a rod, and then kept turning it down and test fitting it.





I cut .020" at a time so at 1.490" it was just too big and at 1.470" it fit a little loose.

My spindle bore narrows down at 5.175" from the front face of the spindle (not the tapered nose). So to answer you question, yes I do have a #5 MT center and it did fit.
I actually tried it today. but it protruded too far out to allow me to use my dogs. The legs weren't long enough to reach the face plate. So good news, bad news for me.
I was making a test bar to get my tail stock centered. It was only about .0015" off so the factory did a pretty good job.

I guess the factory was using a shorter drill bit the day they drilled your bore. :-(

You could just shorten your center or get a big drill bit and open you bore deeper or all the way through.

I ended up doing that with the lever collet closer I have. It only had a 25mm bore through it so I couldn't put a 1" bar in it. I drilled it through at 1.0312".


----------



## darkzero

Thanks Gary. For the same reason you mentioned, I won't be using the MT5 center. With my dog plate the MT5 center sticks out way to far for my liking. I would imagine using the faceplate as a dog plate it would stick out even more. I ordered a bearing steel import center from Enco that was on sale & applied a 15% discount to it. What I received was a Bison center which was a nice surprise, it would be a shame to cut this sucker down. I'll just store it away for now. But anyway, I won't worry about it & will stick with using the sleeve & a MT3 center (also got a Bison to replace the one that came with the lathe).

Here it is with the MT5.






Here it is with the MT3 which is perfect for my dogs.






Looks like my spindle bore is slightly bigger. I'm able to fit a 1.5" bar all the way through with no snags at all.






Here's what I measured at the smallest point I could reach.







I can't imagine them using a drill bit to bore the spindle but who knows. I wonder if anyone has actually tried to bore the spindle on these 12x36 lathes. Looking through my spindle it's not bored perfectly through. Aside from the larger bore towards the front, my spindle is slighty bigger on the threaded end just before the threads about 3" deep. I measured the bore about 6" deep from the threaded end.

In regards to the TS, the stock set screws are junk. They are so loose. I've been meaning to order replacements on the next Mcmaster ordered but recently a friend did the same & sent me pair of replacements since they come in a pack of ten. I never stripped mine yet but man do the replacements feel so much more assuring.


----------



## GaryK

darkzero said:


> Thanks Gary. For the same reason you mentioned, I won't be using the MT5 center. With my dog plate the MT5 center sticks out way to far for my liking. I would imagine using the faceplate as a dog plate it would stick out even more. I ordered a bearing steel import center from Enco that was on sale & applied a 15% discount to it. What I received was a Bison center which was a nice surprise, it would be a shame to cut this sucker down. I'll just store it away for now. But anyway, I won't worry about it & will stick with using the sleeve & a MT3 center (also got a Bison to replace the one that came with the lathe).
> 
> I can't imagine them using a drill bit to bore the spindle but who knows. I wonder if anyone has actually tried to bore the spindle on these 12x36 lathes. Looking through my spindle it's not bored perfectly through. Aside from the larger bore towards the front, my spindle is slighty bigger on the threaded end just before the threads about 3" deep. I measured the bore about 6" deep from the threaded end.
> 
> In regards to the TS, the stock set screws are junk. They are so loose. I've been meaning to order replacements on the next Mcmaster ordered but recently a friend did the same & sent me pair of replacements since they come in a pack of ten. I never stripped mine yet but man do the replacements feel so much more assuring.



Your lathe is different in other ways too if I remember. Carriage stop away from the cross slide and a different threading or speed chart?


----------



## darkzero

GaryK said:


> Your lathe is different in other ways too if I remember. Carriage stop away from the cross slide and a different threading or speed chart?



Yes, that is correct. I have noticed some subtle differences. Locations of the carriage stop, gearbox dials, oil sights, oil fillers & drains. Threading, feeding, & thread dial charts, my chart also does not reference Z1 anywhere on it. Coolant system layout, control panel layout, spindle brake assy. There's a couple of others too. 

I used to wonder if my batch of lathes were made in another factory, probably not. When I got my lathe I immediately noticed the little differences compared to all the others that got the same lathe before me. Not uncommon to see stuff made overseas to have changes. Even with the PM45 I have seen quite a few little differences on a number of the ones I've seen. But then I started see those who got the lathes after me & theirs were pretty much the same as the others. Strange, for better or for worse, I doubt these type of changes throughout the batches are because of "improvements", more like what parts were available at the time. But no big deal, essentially they are all the same. I'm very happy with the lathe I have not had any problems with it whatsoever.

How is that collet closer working for you? I miss using those in shop class at the CC. I always thought there was not a taper attachment for the import 12x36 lathes as I've never seen one but I noticed Matt has them listed now. I've been meaning to ask him about it but I'll ask when I'm ready to purchase one if there really is one available.


----------



## tripletap3

I am finally up and running with my PM1236. Matt was really backed up getting the T nuts machined for the QCTP’s so I did like Gary and told him to ship it and I would do it. I can really see why it takes him so long to do 60 of them. I thought they came in at least the shape of a T nut just larger but it was just a big block of steel. No big problem though for a Hertal ¾” roughing end mill. Ran a few test cuts then decided to make some threads. Threaded a piece of scrap aluminum ½” -20 (that is what the machine was already set up for). It was set up on the lowest speed but still doesn't look too bad and fits the nut like a glove.


----------



## GaryK

tripletap3 said:


> I am finally up and running with my PM1236. Matt was really backed up getting the T nuts machined for the QCTP’s so I did like Gary and told him to ship it and I would do it. I can really see why it takes him so long to do 60 of them. I thought they came in at least the shape of a T nut just larger but it was just a big block of steel. No big problem though for a Hertal ¾” roughing end mill. Ran a few test cuts then decided to make some threads. Threaded a piece of scrap aluminum ½” -20 (that is what the machine was already set up for). It was set up on the lowest speed but still doesn't look too bad and fits the nut like a glove.



Yup, just a big chunk of steel. Anytime I'm removing a lot of material I use my Tri-dex endmill. 1.5" dia and R8 shank. R8 is the only way to go for rigidity.




I bet you wished you had done that weeks ago. Well, you're all up to speed now, so it's time to make something!

Gary


----------



## darkzero

tripletap3 said:


> I am finally up and running with my PM1236. Matt was really backed up getting the T nuts machined for the QCTP’s so I did like Gary and told him to ship it and I would do it. I can really see why it takes him so long to do 60 of them. I thought they came in at least the shape of a T nut just larger but it was just a big block of steel. No big problem though for a Hertal ¾” roughing end mill. Ran a few test cuts then decided to make some threads. Threaded a piece of scrap aluminum ½” -20 (that is what the machine was already set up for). It was set up on the lowest speed but still doesn't look too bad and fits the nut like a glove.



Congrats! Looking good.


----------



## GaryK

darkzero said:


> How is that collet closer working for you? I miss using those in shop class at the CC.



Right now the "fingers" are sticking when I release the part, but I imagine that will go away as it gets broken in. I got THIS ONE cheap since it's for a lathe that they
no longer sell. They sell the MT5 to 5C adapter for about $50 alone, so I figured I would get the whole thing. Just made an adapter and drilled/tapped one hole to mount
it. It's defiantly not a Royal but it works good enough. If you are interested I could send you a drawing for the adapter I made, to save you some head scratchin'.

I'm also going to make a light weight hand wheel closer. I've already got the tubing and have threaded it to fit a collet.
I'm just waiting for a thrust bearing to get here so I can finish it.

Gary


----------



## darkzero

That's definitely a great deal! Thanks but I haven't seen a need for collets yet so I'm good.


----------



## GaryK

darkzero said:


> That's definitely a great deal! Thanks but I haven't seen a need for collets yet so I'm good.



Whats' "need" go to do with anything? )


----------



## GaryK

When I got my new lathe (even before I got it) I was looking for a KDK tool post. I have used them in the past
and thought they were real nice. Before I found one I was using the Aloris style that came with the lathe. It worked
great at doing what it was made for. It just didn't seem as refined and compact as the KDK.

That big handle always seems to get in the way and the height adjustment thing sticking up too far. Also the
big wrench needed to move it around. About the only advantage I can see is that it has two faces to mount your holder.

I love my KDK tool post. Nothing sticking out getting in the way. Instead of having two faces to mount the
holder it has the capability of holding more than one tool per holder. The one in the picture has a boring bar
and a cutoff tool mounted in one holder. You just rotate it end over end to use the other one.
The tool height is set independently for each tool.

Height adjustment is done with a set screw and moving the tool post around just takes an allen wrench.
Another advantage is that all the tool holders fit all the different sized tool posts (Except the very smallest)
For example this is a size 100, but I can use tool holders from a smaller 0 or larger 150 size series. The only
limiting factor is the center height above your compound.

The only bad thing is that KDK went under during the recession and the owner retiring.
The good thing is the Chinese are making compatible copies so they are still available for about
half the price.

Anyway I guess it's a personal thing and most people are happy with what they are used to, so don't
start flaming me about great the Aloris style is. This is after all just my opinion.

Gary


----------



## darkzero

I always thought those KDKs were cool. Never knew exactly how they worked so thanks for sharing. One of the lathes in shop class had one (I think it was on a HLV) but I never got a chance to use it.


----------



## PurpLev

the KDKs are nice and sleek. don't see them much around.

edit: is that piston or wedge driven?


----------



## 7HC

GaryK said:


> The only bad thing is that KDK went under during the recession and the owner retiring.
> The good thing is the Chinese are making compatible copies so they are still available for about
> half the price.
> 
> 
> Gary
> 
> View attachment 46508



I haven't seen that style before, it looks interesting.
Do you have a link as to where the Chinese might be found?


M


----------



## GaryK

7HC said:


> I haven't seen that style before, it looks interesting.
> Do you have a link as to where the Chinese might be found?
> M



They are on ebay HERE or this site has them HERE


----------



## 7HC

GaryK said:


> They are on ebay HERE or this site has them HERE



Thanks, I've saved those.


M


----------



## GaryK

I've mentioned before that in addition to the lever collet closer I'm  going to make a light weight hand wheel type. I was just waiting for a  bearing to arrive.

Well, I finished it the other day. Instead of  threading it to fit the threads in the end of the spindle I just turned  it to fit. I mounted the thrust bearing in it also.

I didn't have a large diameter bar for the wheel so I made it from a piece of flat stock, so there are a total of three pieces. When I get a larger piece of material
I will probably make the wheel over. 

It works great!


----------



## GaryK

PurpLev said:


> the KDKs are nice and sleek. don't see them much around.
> 
> edit: is that piston or wedge driven?



It's not quite a wedge like a Aloris. It's wedge spreads straight out wedging it straight back against the body via the dovetails.


----------



## GaryK

I got my Gator 6-Jaw chuck and it working fantastic so far!

For more details on what I did to set it up go HERE.

I ran it up to 1200 RPM and there was no vibration at all so it's balanced very well.


----------



## tripletap3

I have been following your other post Gary. Next thing on my list is a better 4 jaw to replace the boat anchor that came with the lathe. I am looking at a Fuerda 4 jaw with integral D1-4 at Toolsforcheap.com. Not so sure I would use the 6 jaw as I can't remember the last time I turned anything thin or fragile.


----------



## GaryK

tripletap3 said:


> I have been following your other post Gary. Next thing on my list is a better 4 jaw to replace the boat anchor that came with the lathe. I am looking at a Fuerda 4 jaw with integral D1-4 at Toolsforcheap.com. Not so sure I would use the 6 jaw as I can't remember the last time I turned anything thin or fragile.



I think I'll stick with the 4J chuck that came with the lathe for now. Other than the weight I have no real complaints. I got the 6J from tools4cheap.net. Good deal.

As for the 6J chuck, It's not a matter of working on something thin for me, but basically replacing the 3J chuck that came with the lathe. For $120 more I figured that I would go with a 6J just to cover more bases and give myself more options. Not to mention how pretty it looks! 

Gary


----------



## tripletap3

I know, chuck porn.  It looks awsome. My 3 jaw is actually pretty decent as it came and it maintains .003 pretty much all the time. The 4 jaw on the other hand isn't so. The jaws are rough adjusting and one jaw doen't like any of the 4 positions at all. I am afraid to run it over 300 rpm as it starts to shake the lathe around like a one bladed ceiling fan. I will mess with it some more later but for now I have too many other money making things that need to get done first. If I spend the time on those then I can just buy a decent chuck with the money I make. All my gunsmithing goes to beer and tools anyway.


----------



## GaryK

Here's something you won't see if you have the DRO and scales that came with your PM1236:





Diameter mode with a .0001" reading on the screen.

I just got my 1 micron scale for the cross slide mounted and working. Reading in tenths is nice!

The new scale was a drop in replacement. The hardest part was routing the cable.

Changing the setting in the DRO was also very simple. It's in the book that come with it.

Gary


----------



## tripletap3

tripletap3 said:


> I know, chuck porn. It looks awsome. My 3 jaw is actually pretty decent as it came and it maintains .003 pretty much all the time. The 4 jaw on the other hand isn't so. The jaws are rough adjusting and one jaw doen't like any of the 4 positions at all. I am afraid to run it over 300 rpm as it starts to shake the lathe around like a one bladed ceiling fan. I will mess with it some more later but for now I have too many other money making things that need to get done first. If I spend the time on those then I can just buy a decent chuck with the money I make. All my gunsmithing goes to beer and tools anyway.



Ok I want to update my last post. I did take some time this evening to take a second look at the 4 jaw chuck. The first item I found was a 1/4" long mangled spot in one of the pinion gear teeth. There was also a tooth on the problem jaw that was damaged. I used the dremel tool to clean up both pieces and also spent some time deburing and cleaning up all the sharp edges were the jaws move. I cleaned everything well in the parts washer and lubed it up good. I used a 3/8" socket adapter in my drill and ran the jaws in and out about 20 times each. Much Much smoother and there are no more hang ups.  I then mounted the chuck on the lathe and measured run out on the outside at .012. Yuck. After investigating I ended up turning the inside ridge on the back plate down a few thousands and was able to tap the chuck until I got the run out down to .001. Pretty smooth at 330rpm but at the 550rpm mark it still shakes.   I do all of my work at less than 500 so this should help a bunch.


----------



## darkzero

GaryK said:


> Here's something you won't see if you have the DRO and scales that came with your PM1236:
> 
> snip...
> 
> Diameter mode with a .0001" reading on the screen.
> 
> I just got my 1 micron scale for the cross slide mounted and working. Reading in tenths is nice!
> 
> The new scale was a drop in replacement. The hardest part was routing the cable.
> 
> Changing the setting in the DRO was also very simple. It's in the book that come with it.
> 
> Gary



Gary, have you had a chance to use it much? On another forum some had replaced their X scale with a 1 micron too since their original one got damaged. I wanted to do the same, figured I'd do it if/when my scale took a crap. Doesn't seem like my scale would just fail out of the blue but now that your posting about it I'm interested again. I'd love to hear any feedback you might have on difference from the 5 micron that might convince me sooner. )

Thanks


----------



## darkzero

tripletap3 said:


> Ok I want to update my last post. I did take some time this evening to take a second look at the 4 jaw chuck. The first item I found was a 1/4" long mangled spot in one of the pinion gear teeth. There was also a tooth on the problem jaw that was damaged. I used the dremel tool to clean up both pieces and also spent some time deburing and cleaning up all the sharp edges were the jaws move. I cleaned everything well in the parts washer and lubed it up good. I used a 3/8" socket adapter in my drill and ran the jaws in and out about 20 times each. Much Much smoother and there are no more hang ups. I then mounted the chuck on the lathe and measured run out on the outside at .012. Yuck. After investigating I ended up turning the inside ridge on the back plate down a few thousands and was able to tap the chuck until I got the run out down to .001. Pretty smooth at 330rpm but at the 550rpm mark it still shakes. I do all of my work at less than 500 so this should help a bunch.



Hey Chuck,

My stock 4-jaw had similar issues as yours. Lots of ruff edges to deburred & one jaw did not move smoothly in any of the slots like yours which bothered my the most. I remember I was also not happy about the run out of the chuck body but since it was a 4-jaw it did bother me that much. I don't recally any bad vibrations caused my it but then again I did not use it much. At least you were able to remove the back plate. I used a hammer & chisel but couldn't get it apart (yes I did take the screws out the front). I didn't pound on it really hard but I felt it was more enough where it should have broke free. I ended up selling it on ebay for $150 so it covered almost half of the Fuerda 4-jaw I replaced it with & couldn't be happier with it.


----------



## GaryK

darkzero said:


> Gary, have you had a chance to use it much? On another forum some had replaced their X scale with a 1 micron too since their original one got damaged. I wanted to do the same, figured I'd do it if/when my scale took a crap. Doesn't seem like my scale would just fail out of the blue but now that your posting about it I'm interested again. I'd love to hear any feedback you might have on difference from the 5 micron that might convince me sooner. )
> 
> Thanks



I actually used it on my first project HERE. It worked great. I needed to remove a couple of tenths and it worked just like it was supposed to. 

For me I hated the idea of .004" increments and if I could fix it I would. It seemed like guesstimating. Well, I fixed and I'm very happy with it.

Gary


----------



## darkzero

GaryK said:


> I actually used it on my first project HERE. It worked great. I needed to remove a couple of tenths and it worked just like it was supposed to.
> 
> For me I hated the idea of .004" increments and if I could fix it I would. It seemed like guesstimating. Well, I fixed and I'm very happy with it.
> 
> Gary



You meant .0004" right? ) 

Well that's good enough for me, you got me sold (that's easy). I really want one now. No need for the bed though IMO.


----------



## GaryK

tripletap3 said:


> Ok I want to update my last post. I did take some time this evening to take a second look at the 4 jaw chuck. The first item I found was a 1/4" long mangled spot in one of the pinion gear teeth. There was also a tooth on the problem jaw that was damaged. I used the dremel tool to clean up both pieces and also spent some time deburing and cleaning up all the sharp edges were the jaws move. I cleaned everything well in the parts washer and lubed it up good. I used a 3/8" socket adapter in my drill and ran the jaws in and out about 20 times each. Much Much smoother and there are no more hang ups.  I then mounted the chuck on the lathe and measured run out on the outside at .012. Yuck. After investigating I ended up turning the inside ridge on the back plate down a few thousands and was able to tap the chuck until I got the run out down to .001. Pretty smooth at 330rpm but at the 550rpm mark it still shakes.   I do all of my work at less than 500 so this should help a bunch.



Glad you got it worked out.  Just saved yourself $300+.

I use my drill with a 3/8" sq drive all the time on my chucks. Especially when I reverse the jaws on my 4J chuck.

Gary


----------



## tripletap3

I still plan on replacing it sometime this spring but for now it will spin. I am trying to prioritize my machine tool purchases because there is so much I need to get for my next phase of work. If something might not be the best but if it works it gets sent down the list.


----------



## GaryK

darkzero said:


> You meant .0004" right? )
> 
> Well that's good enough for me, you got me sold (that's easy). I really want one now. No need for the bed though IMO.



Yea, .0004".

You mentioned that you don't have an Esson DRO on your lathe so this might not apply. This is the 1 micron scale that I just installed.




Gary


----------



## GaryK

darkzero said:


> Gary, have you had a chance to use it much? On another forum some had replaced their X scale with a 1 micron too since their original one got damaged. I wanted to do the same, figured I'd do it if/when my scale took a crap. Doesn't seem like my scale would just fail out of the blue but now that your posting about it I'm interested again. I'd love to hear any feedback you might have on difference from the 5 micron that might convince me sooner. )
> 
> Thanks



After using the 1 micron scale for a while I have found something I need  to be careful with.

Make sure you move to the dimension you want to cut after you turn on the lathe.
I find that when I turn on the lathe my number changes a couple of tenths due the lathe spinning up.

This is no big deal, but you just need to be aware of it. With my 5 micron scale I never saw this because the movement was in the .0004 hole of the scale.

If you're not working in tenths for your part, then you don't have to worry about it at all.

Gary


----------



## GaryK

PurpLev said:


> the KDKs are nice and sleek. don't see them much around.
> 
> edit: is that piston or wedge driven?



You had asked about the KDK a while ago but I don't think I explained it right, so Here are a couple of pictures.

This one is open waiting for a holder.






This is the clamping action. You can see it uniformly tightens in the dovetail drawing the holder against the tool post. 




The dowel sticking out is for the height adjustment. There is a set screw in each older the set the height.

Gary


----------



## jmh8743

Gary, see post #100:
If you are making a long cut, it can also move again.
Watch, whenever you decide not to is when it will move. I keep compound tight.

my method:
Start the machine, scale will change, maybe.
Then set the cut, works for unless I forget.

mike


----------



## PurpLev

GaryK said:


> You had asked about the KDK a while ago but I don't think I explained it right, so Here are a couple of pictures.
> 
> Gary



Thanks Gary. looks like it's engineered somewhat differently than the Aloris posts in more than one way.


----------



## GaryK

PurpLev said:


> Thanks Gary. looks like it's engineered somewhat differently than the Aloris posts in more than one way.



Both different, but which one is better? Who knows.

Both Aloris and KDK started over 60 years ago, but a few years ago KDK gave it up due to the economy and the owner retiring. 

That's nothing to do with which one is better. After all VHS beat out Beta which was reportedly superior in all aspects.

All I can say is that I think the KDK is a great design and I'll be using them until I wear them out and can't find replacements.

No big handle, or screw sticking up in the way. )

Gary


----------



## tripletap3

My PM1236 has a norticable gear noise difference when the feed screw direction lever is engaged so its turning from headstock to tailstock (crossslide toward the middle). Quiet as a mouse in the other direction. I know the lever is a little tempermintal and you can go past the detents and cause the gears to clash, but this is with it in the correct position.


----------



## Ray C

I think that's the nature of the machine.  Take the lid off (only 4 -6 simple screws) and have a look inside.  All the gears operate with push forks and adjustment is simple/trivial.  Whatever you do, unplug and engage the safety and unless you like the taste of oil, don't run it with the lid off.


Ray




tripletap3 said:


> My PM1236 has a norticable gear noise difference when the feed screw direction lever is engaged so its turning from headstock to tailstock (crossslide toward the middle). Quiet as a mouse in the other direction. I know the lever is a little tempermintal and you can go past the detents and cause the gears to clash, but this is with it in the correct position.


----------



## GaryK

tripletap3 said:


> My PM1236 has a norticable gear noise difference when the feed screw direction lever is engaged so its turning from headstock to tailstock (crossslide toward the middle). Quiet as a mouse in the other direction. I know the lever is a little tempermintal and you can go past the detents and cause the gears to clash, but this is with it in the correct position.



Does it make the noise at different spindle speeds?

It could just be harmonics at a particular speed. Harmonics can be funny. The speed, weight of chuck or part, position of tailstock... can all induce harmonics. Try changing things and see if it will go away.

Gary


----------



## Ray C

I just changed the oil in mine and happened to have the lid open for a look see.  About half the gears are submerged either partially or fully in oil and those don't make noise.  A couple of the selector gears are located on a top shaft and are not submerged and I suspect that's the reason they make more noise.  Sound doesn't travel well in liquid.  There's nothing wrong as far as I can see and those top gears get plenty of lubrication.  It takes all of a split second of operation for oil to get splashed up there and they get completely slathered.


Ray




GaryK said:


> Does it make the noise at different spindle speeds?
> 
> It could just be harmonics at a particular speed. Harmonics can be funny. The speed, weight of chuck or part, position of tailstock... can all induce harmonics. Try changing things and see if it will go away.
> 
> Gary


----------



## tripletap3

It doesn't relate to the speed of the spindle but to the speed of the feed shaft. I looked at some photos posted over on candlepower of the top cover removed and it looks like a very simple shifter arrangement. I will need to take a look inside the cover next week when I change the oil and hopefully the gasket will come off in one piece.


----------



## GaryK

tripletap3 said:


> It doesn't relate to the speed of the spindle but to the speed of the feed shaft. I looked at some photos posted over on candlepower of the top cover removed and it looks like a very simple shifter arrangement. I will need to take a look inside the cover next week when I change the oil and hopefully the gasket will come off in one piece.



I was thinking that since the spindle speed will affect the speed of both the threading feed and cutting feed that it might make a difference. I was doing an operation once and got a whine when I shut
the power off. When it went through a certain speed range while slowing down I got the whine. I never had it happen again so I attributed it to my setup.

Taking the top cover off is no big deal. I have had mine off a few times already. My gasket stuck to the cover no problem. I figured that if I ever tear it up I would just use the cardboard
from a cereal box to replace it.

I'm not sure what there is to accomplish by looking inside, but I guess you'll never know unless you take a look. )

Here is a picture of inside mine in the A1 setting.

Gary


----------



## Splat

GaryK said:


> Well, my new lathe, a PM1236 will be shipping to me this week!
> 
> I was wondering if anyone would be interested in my trails and tribulations incurred during the setup and installation? I will
> be adding some accessories, such as a lever collet closer and a DRO to start with. Then some tooling as I move along.
> 
> Speak now or forever hold your piece. )
> Gary



Hells yeah! Lathe smutt! 

BTW, congrats on the new lathe. How long did it take since you ordered it?  When I had called PM last year they couldn't give me any ETA on any of the lathes.


----------



## GaryK

Splat said:


> Hells yeah! Lathe smutt!
> 
> BTW, congrats on the new lathe. How long did it take since you ordered it?  When I had called PM last year they couldn't give me any ETA on any of the lathes.



I waited less than a month. I sent him an e-mail asking about stock and he told me that they were just waiting to clear customs, so I timed it just right. I had to wait longer
for the PM45 mill which I asked about at the same time. That was December 1. I should be getting the mill tomorrow March 6, so about 3 months wait for it.

Gary


----------



## tripletap3

tripletap3 said:


> My PM1236 has a norticable gear noise difference when the feed screw direction lever is engaged so its turning from headstock to tailstock (crossslide toward the middle). Quiet as a mouse in the other direction. I know the lever is a little tempermintal and you can go past the detents and cause the gears to clash, but this is with it in the correct position.



Ok I think I may have found my problem.  I recently changed out the gears and I had the lower gear too tight. (Tough to get them adjusted with one hand.) I had to place a piece of paper between them and then tighten. Ran it for a few mins in both directions and no noise so far.


----------



## Ray C

Sorry Trip... I saw your post and meant to mention that.  It's happened to me too.  Once, I put some gears on when the garage was pretty darn cold.  After a few hours of use and the heater going, I guess things expanded and I was getting a whining noise that freaked me out.  Had my head inside the gearbox looking around and everything looks good.  Huh?  Don't know what lead me to it but, all went back to normal once I cracked a gear loose and set thing right.


Ray



tripletap3 said:


> Ok I think I may have found my problem.  I recently changed out the gears and I had the lower gear too tight. (Tough to get them adjusted with one hand.) I had to place a piece of paper between them and then tighten. Ran it for a few mins in both directions and no noise so far.


----------



## jmh8743

Gary,

been interesting following this thread. One thing particular I was interested in has not been mentioned. Did your lathe include a q/c certification?

my JET did and I found the data to be grossly inaccurate. The rear bed-HS joint was filled before painting, a good indicator it had not been moved wrt shipping.

Particularly, the way-HS alignment. Further, is the PM HS pinned to the bed?

Also to my chagrin, the Rohm independent chuck I added was found to have misaligned jaws. As a novice, it took me a year to get this all worked out.:think1:

thanks,

Mike


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## Ray C

Mike,

FYI:  My PM came with a QC inspection sheet but, in general, many aspects of any spec sheet aren't worth the paper they're printed on once the lathe is unbolted from it's test fixture, bolted to a packing pallet, stuffed into a cargo hold -and jostled mightly by fast-paced forklift operators...

A lathe or any piece of equpment that's expected to hold sub-one-thousandth inch toleracnes, needs to be properly setup and that topic has been covered here ad-infinitum (thankfully).  When a large business purchases a precision machine, it shows-up in a wooden box and the next day, a field technician spends the next day or two (or week) setting it up and fine-tuning it.

If you see my thread here about the lathe bench, I just went through (after many months of using the lathe) doing a fine-tuned alignment using the Rollie and 2-collar method.  After putting the lathe on the new bench and tightening the footer bolts, it took about 1/4 turn of an ajdustment bolt to make the lathe cut within 0.0001 over 8 inches.  I'd say they did a good job at the factory.

The gearhead sits on the bed frame and can be fine-adjusted with several set screws then, big bolts clamp it into place.  I never felt the need to mess with those screws.   Even before I had it on a nice bench and before Richard King pointed-out the good ways to setup a lathe, right out of the box, the TS held 0.003" over 24" inches.  90% of the propellor shafts I work on are about that length and it was good enough to fix the ends as I usually do.  Right now, it's holding dead on at 28" (thanks to Rich).



Ray


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## jmh8743

Ray,

naivete on my behalf. I should have paid for that as Richard suggested. He also stated I needed "help".

But all aside, I guess we don't really pay for that. My error as I thought ( yeah, right) I would get that delivered. My ignorance.

http://www.hobby-machinist.com/show...-independent-chuck-8-quot?p=105258#post105258

thaks for your reply and taking the time. Tok me a while to "get with the plan", I'm there now. This thread kinda put my experience and reading into a "oh, I see.....". 

The REMF are still making life tough.


my best,
mike


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## Ray C

Mike,

I hope you didn't feel my response was harsh. It was not intended that way. Be apprised, I sneak these responses here in-between doing my real day job and the PT shop work. I think Richard is in the same boat. He's a really nice guy and I don't think either of us intentionally mean to be short with people... And please make allowances for the way written words are interpreted. Reading the same sentence twice with different mindset and cadence can reverse the intended meaning. -Happens all the time.

This is a web site where people come to learn. It's all good...


Ray


EDIT:  I only glanced at your Rohm thread... I'll look more closely tonight.  Anyhow (and I say this lightheartedly but with a hint of seriousness), chucks suck!  When you gotta make a nice shaft, spin between centers.  If you need to modify an existing shaft, use collets,  If it won't fit in a collet, use a 4J and hope for the best.  If you know it's ok to reestablish the geometry of a part, use a 3J.  -Of course, all of this pertains to average quality chucks.  When you start shelling-out a grand or more, things improve.




jmh8743 said:


> Ray,
> 
> naivete on my behalf. I should have paid for that as Richard suggested. He also stated I needed "help".
> 
> But all aside, I guess we don't really pay for that. My error as I thought ( yeah, right) I would get that delivered. My ignorance.
> 
> http://www.hobby-machinist.com/show...-independent-chuck-8-quot?p=105258#post105258
> 
> thaks for your reply and taking the time. Tok me a while to "get with the plan", I'm there now. This thread kinda put my experience and reading into a "oh, I see.....".
> 
> The REMF are still making life tough.
> 
> 
> my best,
> mike


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## jmh8743

Did not, learning is an everyday passion. I am grateful to this board for making my life easier.

Mike


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## GaryK

jmh8743 said:


> Gary,
> 
> been interesting following this thread. One thing particular I was interested in has not been mentioned. Did your lathe include a q/c certification?
> 
> my JET did and I found the data to be grossly inaccurate.?
> 
> Mike



Yes, it did. I don't really pay much attention to them though for the reasons that Ray stated. Also I don't know how must you can trust them.

Gary


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## GaryK

Well, it's now been 3 months since I received my Lathe. Just a status report.

Was it worth it? Definitely yes! Compared to my Atlas it does everything faster and with more precision.

Would I buy it again. Again yes! I should have done it a long time ago.

Is there something better. I'm sure there is, but for my hobby purposes it's all I need.

All in all I very happy with it. I have basically learned all it's little idiosyncrasies so making something is a smooth operation.
The operation is not quite second yet, but that's to be expected after using my Atlas for 25 years.

Gary


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## GaryK

Has anyone ever added some kind of extensions to the drain plugs to make it easier and cleaner to drain the oil?

Gary


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## darkzero

GaryK said:


> Has anyone ever added some kind of extensions to the drain plugs to make it easier and cleaner to drain the oil?
> 
> Gary



I thought about using something like a Fumoto valve which are excellent drains (not sure if they make a size for our lathe). This is why I asked about the drain size for the mill. But my drain location for the headheadstock is in a bit harder location to access than yours (still in the same area). Pics please if you do! 

Luckily I haven't had any messy oil changes with the type of funnel I cut to shape to use. The Form-A-Funnels are excellent for this odd type of oil change though.


I did make an extension for my air compressor though which made a world of a difference, only downside is that adding an extension slows the drain time but well worth it for cases like my air compressor where it can get messy.








On the left is the extension that I made that started out as the same type of fitting on the right.


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## jmh8743

Hey guys,

oil changes are a snap. My JET was overfilled. Can u imagine. So I had an awful mess. I had to drain it all on arrival and then refill for breakin then drain the breakin. So I had a plan.

I'm in Cullman now, but when I get back to Remlap, I'll send pics. Whoops, already have.

mike

see post #51 "My JET headstock alignment nightmare". Shutoff at bottom of tube, ball valve.


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## GaryK

jmh8743 said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> oil changes are a snap. My JET was overfilled. Can u imagine. So I had an awful mess. I had to drain it all on arrival and then refill for breakin then drain the breakin. So I had a plan.
> 
> I'm in Cullman now, but when I get back to Remlap, I'll send pics. Whoops, already have.
> 
> mike
> 
> see post #51 "My JET headstock alignment nightmare". Shutoff at bottom of tube, ball valve.




That's exactly along the lines on of what I plan on doing.

Hey, I have relatives in Cullman!

Gary


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## GaryK

RCW said:


> With all due respect, NT40 ain't too shabby.   -Bob



NT40? Is that a shank?


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## jmh8743

Gary,
My engr & surveying company is in  Cullman (my wife's hometown, she's a dental hygienist) and my shop, my bike, rifle range and 29 acres are in Remlap, 50 mi SE. ALong with a meager bachelor pad, read bare necessities, built for my retirement 30 yrs ago and before meeting Sue.

sometimes I'm here or there. Today I'm here (hee hee) other days I'm really out there. To clarify I'm now headed to Remlap. See, in the 1880s, the little town of Palmer, in north Jefferson Co, was the location of the Palmer Baptist Church. Two brothers got in a heated argument over church activities  (at that time the church included all social activities, no Internet, can u imagine) and so one brother split the church and built a rock structure 10 mi north, the REMLAP Baptist Church. Still there. The area is infamous for the hideout of the train robber Rube Burrows, later killed in Selma, Al by a storekeeper for reward, with a rusty cap and ball Colt.

have a good Memorial Day and remember our fallen.

mike
now in Cullman


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## GaryK

So far I have changed the oil one time in my PM1236 and it seemed like a pretty messy operation.

I decided to change that. First I went to Lowes and bought a couple of 1/4" double ended barbs.

Then I made a fitting to accept them. I couldn't use a store bought one (at least for the upper gear box)
since it was so close to the pulley it would hit it. Plus the holes are metric. I needed to make a stubby short one.

This is what I made:




I cut and soldered the barb fitting from the inside just using plumbers flux and solder.




In case you want to know the threads for all 4 screws on the head are M16x1.5.


Here is one mounted on the threading gearbox.




And here is both of them. I used a long enough hose on both of them to hang over the edge and drain
into a container on the floor.

Since the hose is so close to the pulley I am using a clip to make sure it doesn't rub. I an also using the same type of clip
 on each and of the hose to seal it. You see in this picture I have it clipped to the chip tray. I found that when I put the cover back on
it knocked it off. I ended up clipping it to the brake actuator.




You can see in this picture the clearance. There is actually more then the picture shows.




Now it's simple and clean to change the oil. It means that I will do it more often! )


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## Ray C

Nice mod Gary...  I was thinking of something along those lines but the list it too long...

Ray


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## toag

Gary,
40 taper (or nmtb 40 or iso 40 or cat 40 ) nmtb came up with 6 or more tapers that have a common 7 to 24 slope.  40 taper has 2 dogs that provide drive, and the size of the taper (and therefore the spindle) make for a very robust and rigid machine.  examples of 40 taper knee mills would be gorton mastermil, Beaver, some excellos (very few), larger taiwanese mills, and cincinnati toolmaster series. 
here is a pic shamelessly lifted from randyc on a different forum (hope he doesnt mind, he seems a pretty decent fellow)

from left to right MT2, R-8 and 40 taper






very nice work on your lathe!


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## Maglin

Very nice what everyone has done to there PM1236.  I've only made a 5C collet closer for mine and just last night started the install of my DRO.  As for your 30/40/50 taper tooling it was designed to be a fast release taper.  The taper doesn't hold the tool like an MT taper, JS taper, R8 taper does.  The taper in these fast taper tooling is for locating the tool.  The drive lugs are what provide positive motion.  I've a very large fan of the BT30 tooling for small machines.  It's fairly cheap and makes changing tools easy with a good tool holder on the bench.  I also like to use collet tooling in these a little more but a set-screw tool holder is still needed for heavy loads like a 3/4" EM running at max DOC max chip load.


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## toag

I agree maglin, i have 30 taper on my little barker and that little guy is a beast!
I can't wait to get the cinncy running, its 40 taper and no one would look at it and say "where's the beef?"


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