# Thoughts on Imported Face Mill



## middle.road (Feb 28, 2018)

Hey gang! What might your thoughts be on this face mill. 
*Hukshawn's* post over HERE got me to thinking and looking. I couldn't find a cheap source for a FM02 but did stumble across this Face Mill on Aliexpress:
Doesn't look to be high-positive like the one Hukshawn scored, but I think a 2HP BP should be able to handle it.


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## Buffalo21 (Feb 28, 2018)

While my face mill is a Walter, using different inserts, I have some insert end mills that use the APMT inserts, that that face uses and they work well. I’ve also bought some lower priced tooling for China (BangGood) and have been pleasantly surprised, with the quality and performance.


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## cathead (Feb 28, 2018)

It looks pretty nice!  If I didn't have one I would get one ordered.  The photo indicates that the head might be
removable.  I have an Aliexpress account and a BangGood account as well and have been happy with both so far.
It would cut without a lot of effort using APMT inserts.


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## Ianagos (Feb 28, 2018)

I have a couple Chinese facemills that cost about $20 each and one that looked similar to his but I’ve yet to try them. I bought a lot of lathe tooling from Zimi-hk on eBay and all the lathe stuff has been good. Once I get my vmc fixed up I’ll be giving them some tests.


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## mattthemuppet2 (Feb 28, 2018)

You can also use APKT inserts that are ground rather than molded, that will reduce the cutting force significantly.

Or, you can get one for SEHT inserts, for a 45deg angle (instead of 90deg) - supposed to cut more freely than the 90deg style and you have 4 cutting corners per insert instead of 2. Downside is that you can mill to a shoulder. I ordered one and a pack 10 ground H01 grade inserts, should be here in a month or so. I'm going to make my own arbor with a 5/8" straight shank to save removing my R8>ER25 collet chuck. We'll see how that goes


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## Ianagos (Feb 28, 2018)

mattthemuppet2 said:


> You can also use APKT inserts that are ground rather than molded, that will reduce the cutting force significantly.
> 
> Or, you can get one for SEHT inserts, for a 45deg angle (instead of 90deg) - supposed to cut more freely than the 90deg style and you have 4 cutting corners per insert instead of 2. Downside is that you can mill to a shoulder. I ordered one and a pack 10 ground H01 grade inserts, should be here in a month or so. I'm going to make my own arbor with a 5/8" straight shank to save removing my R8>ER25 collet chuck. We'll see how that goes



I ordered a 50mm apkt(the rectangle ones) with aluminum koroloy inserts and the standard tin china special.

Also got the 80mm I think with seht (square ones) but I think I only grabbed the aluminum specific inserts for that one.

The hardest part is finding holders. If anybody needs them I have 2 bt40 fmb22 (22mm bore facemill) holders that I really have no use for as my machine is cat 40. I was originally gonna use them on my other mill that is nmtb40 but I never made the right drawbar for that.


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## mattthemuppet2 (Feb 28, 2018)

neat, I'll be interested to hear how you think the alu specific and standard molded inserts compare. I only have experience with CCMT vs CCGT inserts and there's a night and day difference!


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## Ianagos (Feb 28, 2018)

I’ll let you know I was really worried because I can’t find much info on a lot of this Chinese tooling on the net.

It might be a bit as I have à complicated situation in which I am away from home for a long time but I’ll try to get my brother to test them out once he gets the fadal cleaned up.

But I do want to spread info on these tools so others can know whether to buy or pay a bit more for a better one.


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## Ianagos (Mar 10, 2018)

I haven’t tested the face mill yet but I was testing the concentricity of the cat40 holders I bought and all the er 16 and er 32 holders I bought seem to have less than .0003” of runout. Adding the collets they all stayed close to that same number.

Collets were purchased from seller:niuniucme on eBay they are known as cme.

And 
Cat40 ER32 and er16 were purchased from totalcnctools. They go by tpac tools on their adds. 

I did mount the face mills though and they fit nice and snug on the cat 40 shanks I bought from seller:cncmachinetool

Maybe I can get my brother to test out the face mills this weekend.


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## Hukshawn (Mar 10, 2018)

When I had that crummy facemill (very similar visually to the one you linked) the inserts worked well. You can also get a bunch of other tooling that take the apmt inserts and keep your tooling somewhat universal. Then you don't have 10 different inserts kicking around like I do. Lol. 
I am super weary about the cheap facemills now tho. Two of them having the same issues. The prices are tantalizing... Its also difficult to figure out if the runout is in the insert seats or the arbor or the facemill itself. And there's no adjusting anything. I hope yours turns out well. 

One major thing the facemill trip also showed me was axial play in my spindle. That was murder... Chattering all over the place. I tightened it up but still have a thou or so of play. At some point I'll pull the spindle out again and tighten the lock nut more.


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## EmilioG (Mar 10, 2018)

Is there a website that explains the myriad of inserts available?


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## middle.road (Mar 10, 2018)

Hukshawn said:


> When I had that crummy facemill (very similar visually to the one you linked) the inserts worked well. You can also get a bunch of other tooling that take the apmt inserts and keep your tooling somewhat universal. Then you don't have 10 different inserts kicking around like I do. Lol.
> _I am super weary about the cheap facemills now tho._ Two of them having the same issues. The prices are tantalizing... Its also difficult to figure out if the runout is in the insert seats or the arbor or the facemill itself. And there's no adjusting anything. I hope yours turns out well.
> 
> One major thing the facemill trip also showed me was axial play in my spindle. That was murder... Chattering all over the place. I tightened it up but still have a thou or so of play. At some point I'll pull the spindle out again and tighten the lock nut more.


What other types did you try out? The results you had with the FMA-02 are very good.
I was intrigued by the insert geometry and layout. That's what led me to start looking around. There's been a quite an evolution in insert cutting that I just didn't keep up with over the years and am trying to reestablish.


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## middle.road (Mar 10, 2018)

EmilioG said:


> Is there a website that explains the myriad of inserts available?


Carbide Depot has a very fine Technical Ref page. There is a plethora of information there.
http://www.carbidedepot.com/resources.aspx

Then from the MFG of HukShawn's cutter there are these:

http://www.cutoutil.com/fs/tools/c6zdi-CUTOUTIL_Milling_Inserts.pdf

http://www.cutoutil.com/fs/Root/cq92f-catalog_of_FG_inserts.pdf


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## Hukshawn (Mar 11, 2018)

I have zero knowledge of cutters. I am only very mildly starting to understand certain things as required. I have small CCMT’s for my lathe and these square cutters I have for the mill. For the mill I had to understand what I wanted in order to order them as the facemill did not come with inserts. So far, I know these SEET12 inserts I have for medium steel removal and which ones I should have for aluminum. That is all. Lol 
Shawn


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## middle.road (Mar 25, 2018)

(double-post, I forgot I had started this thread...) 
I just ordered one of these for $20, with a 19mm shank/20mm cutting dia. Will have to test drive it and see.
I'd like to get a 50mm or so face mill also that uses the same size insert - APMT1135PDER 
There's only a couple of face mills around that use the 1135, but my thinking is to cut down on insert inventory.
Perhaps my thinking is flawed...


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