# New 9a cross slide stuck



## FriscoMustang (Jan 31, 2021)

Hey folks, picked up a new to me SB 9 today and it’s in pretty good shape. As I walked in to pick it up, the previous owner was holding the cross slide handle, but it was unfortunately no longer attached to the cross slide screw. He broke it off. Sheared very cleanly at the end of the dial indicator. Found out after I got it home why. He’d apparently been “tapping” it with likely a 5 lb hand sledge to try to get the cross slide to, you know, slide a-cross. It’s stuck like it’s welded.the actual slide will move a fraction, due to backlash in the screw, but the screw won’t turn. Not sure where it’s hung up, and I can’t find how to remove it without unscrewing it. I’ve removed the gib adjuster screws but the gib isn’t sliding out either. I’ve got it soaking in PB blaster and it’s off the saddle. Any help is appreciated. Pictures attached.


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## FriscoMustang (Jan 31, 2021)

Handle that sheared


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## jcp (Jan 31, 2021)

The screw is probably seized in the cross feed bushing. The bushing screws into the cross slide base (it's got the stationary dial makings on its o.d., R.H. thread).


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## FriscoMustang (Jan 31, 2021)

jcp said:


> The screw is probably seized in the cross feed bushing. The bushing screws into the cross slide base (it's got the stationary dial makings on its o.d., R.H. thread).


Thanks. I thought so but don’t see a way to unscrew it. I’ve searched and watched some videos but haven’t had any luck yet. What’s the beat way to unscrew that bushing?


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## Manual Mac (Jan 31, 2021)

Lucky you still have the handle & nut.
Looks like you will need a cross slide leadscrew.
jawhawkmachine tool sells those, get the nut also.
No affiliation, just a good guy to deal with.


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## jcp (Jan 31, 2021)

Sometimes a strap wrench will get it. If not, try a bit of heat and lots of penetrant, then the strap wrench again. May take several iterations.


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## SLK001 (Jan 31, 2021)

Unscrew the crossfeed nut to protect it from damage (and to eliminate it as the problem).  Use the heat and penetrant and a large pair of vice-grips on the shaft to break the shaft free (it needs to be replaced anyway).

As for further disassembly, get the rebuild manual by Ilion Industries (get the one with the felt kit).  It will help guide you in your efforts..


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## FriscoMustang (Jan 31, 2021)

SLK001 said:


> Unscrew the crossfeed nut to protect it from damage (and to eliminate it as the problem).  Use the heat and penetrant and a large pair of vice-grips on the shaft to break the shaft free (it needs to be replaced anyway).
> 
> As for further disassembly, get the rebuild manual by Ilion Industries (get the one with the felt kit).  It will help guide you in your efforts..


Ordered the rebuild book. You said “unscrew the crossfeed nut”. What nut are you talking about? The one in the body (brass with a screw through the top) seems to be completely inaccessible. And I can’t get the crossfeed screw to move at all. Thanks.


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## FriscoMustang (Jan 31, 2021)

Manual Mac said:


> Lucky you still have the handle & nut.
> Looks like you will need a cross slide leadscrew.
> jawhawkmachine tool sells those, get the nut also.
> No affiliation, just a good guy to deal with.


Looked at jay hawk machine on eBay. Didn’t see a sb9. But I’ll keep looking. Thanks.


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## FriscoMustang (Jan 31, 2021)

jcp said:


> Sometimes a strap wrench will get it. If not, try a bit of heat and lots of penetrant, then the strap wrench again. May take several iterations.


It’s on there solid. Letting it soak some more. Thanks.


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## SLK001 (Jan 31, 2021)

FriscoMustang said:


> Ordered the rebuild book. You said “unscrew the crossfeed nut”. What nut are you talking about? The one in the body (brass with a screw through the top) seems to be completely inaccessible. And I can’t get the crossfeed screw to move at all. Thanks.



Yes, I'm talking about the one in the body.  What do you mean by "completely inaccessible"?  It's on the top, just beyond the compound mount.  You can see it in your third photo.


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## Manual Mac (Jan 31, 2021)

Frisco, his email is  jayhawk35@hotmail.com
I always just call him. 913-636-6107 Mike Neville
He’ll have what you need


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## martik777 (Jan 31, 2021)

You need a pin spanner wrench like this: Pin Spanner Wrench for 9" & 10" South Bend Lathe - NEW Tool !! | eBay
to remove the crossfeed bushing. You can easily fabricate one similar to this: (208) Homemade Spanner Wrench - YouTube

You do not need to replace the crossfeed leadscrew. It can easily be repaired by tapping the existing broken shaft and making a threaded  extension with Loctite  to repair/extend it. The end of the shaft will need a 12-24 thread for the spanner nut: South Bend 9 10k cross feed or compound spanner nut PT295NR1 | eBay

I have extended  my 9A this way for larger dials and it works well even w/o loctite

Parts breakdown: 902D.pdf (wswells.com)

If you do not have another lathe, you can still make the parts with this one by locking the cross slide and using the compound for feeding in/out


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## FriscoMustang (Jan 31, 2021)

SLK001 said:


> Yes, I'm talking about the one in the body.  What do you mean by "completely inaccessible"?  It's on the top, just beyond the compound mount.  You can see it in your third photo.


That’s what I thought. I can take the screw out but can’t see how that’s doing me much good? Sorry, these things feel a bit like a Chinese puzzle. I haven’t even gotten to the compound slide.


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## FriscoMustang (Feb 1, 2021)

martik777 said:


> You need a pin spanner wrench like this: Pin Spanner Wrench for 9" & 10" South Bend Lathe - NEW Tool !! | eBay
> to remove the crossfeed bushing. You can easily fabricate one similar to this: (208) Homemade Spanner Wrench - YouTube
> 
> You do not need to replace the crossfeed leadscrew. It can easily be repaired by tapping the existing broken shaft and making a threaded  extension with Loctite  to repair/extend it. The end of the shaft will need a 12-24 thread for the spanner nut: South Bend 9 10k cross feed or compound spanner nut PT295NR1 | eBay
> ...


Interesting stuff. Thanks. I’d thought about welding the shaft back on but tapping it seems more likely to end up with a straight shaft. Any instructions or videos? Thanks.


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## martik777 (Feb 1, 2021)

It's pretty basic machining but may be a bit much for a newbie. Here's a photo of my stock shaft with the extension laying above the oil hole.  My extension will be much longer than yours because I have a large dial assembly attached to it.  I would turn down what's left of your shaft  for a 12-28 or 10-32 thread for a length of about .250, then make the extension with a corresponding female thread and duplicate the features on the original. The thread on the end is 12-24. I can give you the exact dimensions if you are unable to measure yours.


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## FriscoMustang (Feb 1, 2021)

martik777 said:


> It's pretty basic machining but may be a bit much for a newbie. Here's a photo of my stock shaft with the extension laying above the oil hole.  My extension will be much longer than yours because I have a large dial assembly attached to it.  I would turn down what's left of your shaft  for a 12-28 or 10-32 thread for a length of about .250, then make the extension with a corresponding female thread and duplicate the features on the original. The thread on the end is 12-24. I can give you the exact dimensions if you are unable to measure yours.


Does seem like a tough first project! But likely an interesting task. Thanks for the detail. First though I gotta get that bushing freed up or this is all just interesting conversation.


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## martik777 (Feb 1, 2021)

I could make the parts if you want to send me the leadscrew and bushing. 

That hole in the bottom is between 3/16 and 11/64. A drill inserted into it may provide enough leverage to break it lose. otherwise you'll need to make or buy a pin wrench or the nuclear option of vise grips


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## FriscoMustang (Feb 1, 2021)

martik777 said:


> I could make the parts if you want to send me the leadscrew and bushing.
> 
> That hole in the bottom is between 3/16 and 11/64. A drill inserted into it may provide enough leverage to break it lose. otherwise you'll need to make or buy a pin wrench or the nuclear option of vise grips


Thanks for the offer! Nuclear option already deployed and the bushing is lose from the saddle with some damage. But the shaft is still seized inside the bushing. And you’re the second person to mention the hole in the bushing but mine is smooth with no hole for a spanner.


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## martik777 (Feb 1, 2021)

Great!  I would drill a hole in the bottom for future removal. Try some heat and more solvent, a drill chuck may help to move the shaft while the bushing is held in a vise


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## FriscoMustang (Feb 1, 2021)

martik777 said:


> Great!  I would drill a hole in the bottom for future removal. Try some heat and more solvent, a drill chuck may help to move the shaft while the bushing is held in a vise


Well, it’s still attached to the saddle. Can only get about a 1/4 turn before the cross slide screw stops. Might be able rig it up in the vice though. That bushing must be close to a press fit on that shaft. It locked on tight.


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## martik777 (Feb 1, 2021)

Did you remove the screw for the oil hole? It stops the bushing from unthreading


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## MyLilMule (Feb 1, 2021)

I'd still consider welding a bolt to the broken end of the feed screw. You're still going to get that nut away from the rear of the cross slide so you have room to pull the bushing out.


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## FriscoMustang (Feb 1, 2021)

martik777 said:


> Did you remove the screw for the oil hole? It stops the bushing


Do you mean the bushing for the lead screw in the middle of the saddle?


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## FriscoMustang (Feb 1, 2021)

MyLilMule said:


> I'd still consider welding a bolt to the broken end of the feed screw. You're still going to get that nut away from the rear of the cross slide so you have room to pull the bushing out.


Sorry, lost me on this one. What do you mean?


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## martik777 (Feb 1, 2021)

FriscoMustang said:


> Do you mean the bushing for the lead screw in the middle of the saddle?


no, the screw on the flat part of the crossfeed just above the bushing stamped OIL


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## FriscoMustang (Feb 1, 2021)

martik777 said:


> no, the screw on the flat part of the crossfeed just above the bushing stamped OIL


Well, that’s a kick in the jewels. My crossfeed won’t move that far so I had no idea that was there. And they is probably what made that bushing so tough. Guessing I sheared that off with my tremendous mechanical advantage. Shoot. Here’s where I stand now. Bushing is out of the crossfeed(which has likely led to needing a new oil screw), but shaft is still stuck in the bushing. Is there a pin in that shaft (see picture)? Feels like progress, but I don’t actually think it is. Perhaps those threads on the bushing were buggered by the oil screw. That’s what happens when a car guy messes with a precision machine I guess. Man, that stinks.


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## martik777 (Feb 1, 2021)

You should have paid him $100 less after he broke that handle off! 

Those threads look ok. the oil screw was likely sheared off before it got to them, in any case you can remake that bushing and oil screw since you have a lathe. You should be able to screw the shaft out of the leadscrew nut now. Soak it in penetrating oil vertically overnight, them try to move the broken shaft. Maybe clamp that shaft in the 3 jaw and twist it, also add some heat with a propane torch.


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## FriscoMustang (Feb 2, 2021)

martik777 said:


> You should have paid him $100 less after he broke that handle off!
> 
> Those threads look ok. the oil screw was likely sheared off before it got to them, in any case you can remake that bushing since you have a lathe as well as the oil screw. You should be able to screw the shaft out of the leadscrew nut now. Soak it in penetrating oil vertically overnight, them try to move the broken shaft. Maybe clamp that shaft in the 3 jaw and twist it, also add some heat with a propane torch.


I really appreciate all the help. And no kidding on the price. Really thought it wouldn’t  be a big deal. So it won’t unscrew. I assume the gear for the power cross feed won’t feed through the handle end? Or should it slide through?


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## martik777 (Feb 2, 2021)

The gear will pull thru with the entire leadscrew, I just checked mine. Do you mean the leadscrew won't unscrew from the brass nut? It shouldn't be rusted in there. Try twisting it back and forth


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## FriscoMustang (Feb 2, 2021)

martik777 said:


> The gear will pull thru with the entire leadscrew, I just checked mine. Do you mean the leadscrew won't unscrew from the brass nut? It shouldn't be rusted in there. Try twisting it back and forth


It’s feeding through the nut fine. Just feels like it’s hitting something. You’ve got a power feed cross slide I assume. I’ll check it again and see if i can see anything.


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## martik777 (Feb 2, 2021)

FriscoMustang said:


> It’s feeding through the nut fine. Just feels like it’s hitting something. You’ve got a power feed cross slide I assume. I’ll check it again and see if i can see anything.


Yes, mine is a 9A too, circa 1947 maybe they changed the dimensions but unlikely, What is your serial #?


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## FriscoMustang (Feb 2, 2021)

martik777 said:


> Yes, mine is a 9A too, circa 1947 maybe they changed the dimensions but unlikely, What is your serial #?


Out. Butchered but out. I’m gonna go get my hundred bucks back.


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## martik777 (Feb 2, 2021)

Yikes!  Not a big deal though, it will not affect anything, you can fill that with JBweld or Devcon  later. That almost looks like it was broken before, did you find the pieces of cast iron that broke off?


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## FriscoMustang (Feb 2, 2021)

martik777 said:


> Yikes!  Not a big deal though, it will not affect anything, you can fill that with JBweld or Devcon  later. That almost looks like it was broken before, did you find the pieces of cast iron that broke off?


No. And I agree, that looks old


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## FriscoMustang (Feb 2, 2021)

martik777 said:


> Yikes!  Not a big deal though, it will not affect anything, you can fill that with JBweld or Devcon  later. That almost looks like it was broken before, did you find the pieces of cast iron that broke off?


So I found a replacement saddle and bushing on eBay for under $100. Will the ways be OK if I do that? Bushing threads are toast on the one I’ve got, both on the bushing and in the saddle. Where did you source the larger dial? Figure if I’m doing it I might as well go ahead and extend the handle and get a larger dial. Eyes aren’t getting any younger.


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## finsruskw (Feb 2, 2021)

Damn shame is what this is!!
Best of luck to Ya!!

I did learn something from this though...
I had no idea there was supposed to be a screw in that oil hole.
I assume it; is to keep the swarf out of it?


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## MyLilMule (Feb 2, 2021)

FriscoMustang said:


> Sorry, lost me on this one. What do you mean?


I was suggested you needed to turn the FEED SCREW clockwise (not the bushing) to move the cross feed away from you. With the cross slide all the way forward, you won't be able to back out the bushing, since the busing is pinned to the cross feed screw - it has no where to go.

But I see that is now a moot point - since the saddle has been broken. Since you were unable to remove the oil screw, which IIRC, can make contact with the feed screw bushing.


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## Manual Mac (Feb 2, 2021)

My 1938 SB9C does not have threads in that hole, nor is OIL stamped on the saddle there.
If the screw is there to keep swarf out, SB wasn’t worried about it in 1938.
Frisco, the rabbit hole can be deep, but you will end up with a fine lathe that you know plenty about.
Do not ask how I know this.


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## MyLilMule (Feb 2, 2021)

FriscoMustang said:


> So I found a replacement saddle and bushing on eBay for under $100. Will the ways be OK if I do that? Bushing threads are toast on the one I’ve got, both on the bushing and in the saddle. Where did you source the larger dial? Figure if I’m doing it I might as well go ahead and extend the handle and get a larger dial. Eyes aren’t getting any younger.


I'm far, far, far, FAR from an expert on lathes, but my gut tells me the new/old saddle will have worn differently than the one that's been on your lathe, so the saddle and lathe ways will no longer "match". After decades of wear, they wore together. Kinda like putting used brake pads from one car on the used rotors of a second. But maybe not as severe.

You can always have the bedway and the saddle ground and scraped. Then they'll match.


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## ericc (Feb 2, 2021)

Wow, ouch!  That looks like a setback, but if there are no extra pieces of cast iron around, it may have been broken before and "fixed" with loctite, or something.  I would be tempted to force it back together with JB Weld and try to get a little engagement back on the screw threads, perhaps with some judicious filing.  It just has to work long enough to thread a new collar.  There are probably enough cast iron bits to hold the screw in, if not, a temporary aluminum plate can do the job.


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## FriscoMustang (Feb 2, 2021)

MyLilMule said:


> I'm far, far, far, FAR from an expert on lathes, but my gut tells me the new/old saddle will have worn differently than the one that's been on your lathe, so the saddle and lathe ways will no longer "match". After decades of wear, they wore together. Kinda like putting used brake pads from one car on the used rotors of a second. But maybe not as severe.
> 
> You can always have the bedway and the saddle ground and scraped. Then they'll match.


Yeah, I‘m not planning on dropping that kind of money on this one. If I can’t get decent results with the “new” saddle, I’ll work on repairing the one with the chip out of it. Appreciate the input for sure, and I’ll definitely be taking some careful measurements. I’m guessing the machine will be more accurate than the operator for a while though.


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## martik777 (Feb 2, 2021)

Don't waste money on another saddle, it won't match the wear on your ways or cross slide. That damage will have no affect on your lathe's accuracy. I doubt I have oiled mine (under that screw) more than once every 2 years and I have no visible wear. 
I made my own large dial and glued on 200 graduations for direct reading. If you want the same travel (towards the operator), you will also need to make a much longer extension and an extension or replacement for your existing bushing. The larger dial prevents the slide from moving the original distance.  You can fix those threads on your lathe BTW. 

I'm not sure you should attempt the large dial project until you get this lathe operational and become more familiar with machining basics


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## FriscoMustang (Feb 2, 2021)

ericc said:


> Wow, ouch!  That looks like a setback, but if there are no extra pieces of cast iron around, it may have been broken before and "fixed" with loctite, or something.  I would be tempted to force it back together with JB Weld and try to get a little engagement back on the screw threads, perhaps with some judicious filing.  It just has to work long enough to thread a new collar.  There are probably enough cast iron bits to hold the screw in, if not, a temporary aluminum plate can do the job.





martik777 said:


> Don't waste money on another saddle, it won't match the wear on your ways or cross slide. That damage will have no affect on your lathe's accuracy. I doubt I have oiled mine (under that screw) more than once every 2 years and I have no visible wear.
> I made my own large dial and glued on 200 graduations for direct reading. If you want the same travel (towards the operator), you will also need to make a much longer extension and an extension or replacement for your existing bushing. The larger dial prevents the slide from moving the original distance.  You can fix those threads on your lathe BTW.
> 
> I'm not sure you should attempt the large dial project until you get this lathe operational and become more familiar with machining basics


Didn’t know you made your own. That definitely seems beyond me. Just figured if I was threading the handle and extending anyway, should think about getting the larger dials at the same time. Good advice from everyone. Thanks again for all the help.


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## FriscoMustang (Feb 2, 2021)

Well, at this point, I think I’m going to clean it up as much as possible and get it all reassembled and mounted. I’ll see if I can get the cross slide to mount and lock without the screw in it and use the compound to practice turning down a 1/4” or so for a 12-28 male thread and make a 12-28 female to fix my broken handle. Sometime next decade after I’ve accomplished that, I’ll get a replacement bushing and try to use the damaged cross slide as is. Any other thoughts? Thanks again for all the help.


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## ericc (Feb 2, 2021)

That's something like what I'd do.  I found a die for that thread in my collection.  You could probably purchase a nut.  The more difficult part would be repairing that cracked out area without goofing up the casting.  Easy and slow.

When I was at this point, there was no problem with a setscrew, since it was missing.  Just the hole, which I thought was an oil hole.  The whole assembly came out easily.


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## FriscoMustang (Feb 2, 2021)

ericc said:


> That's something like what I'd do.  I found a die for that thread in my collection.  You could probably purchase a nut.  The more difficult part would be repairing that cracked out area without goofing up the casting.  Easy and slow.
> 
> When I was at this point, there was no problem with a setscrew, since it was missing.  Just the hole, which I thought was an oil hole.  The whole assembly came out easily.


You found a die for the bushing thread? At this point I think the bushing is toast unless I add some metal back. Assume brazing is the right approach for cracked part, then re drill and tap the oil hole. As you can see, easy and slow may not be my strengths!


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## brino (Feb 2, 2021)

FriscoMustang said:


> try to use the damaged cross slide as is. Any other thoughts?



To me that looks like a prime candidate for filling by brazing and then machining the top flat and then drill/tap the new holes.
Yes there would be a bronze coloured area there, but it should clean-up well.

-brino


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## martik777 (Feb 2, 2021)

Don't understand why your earlier photo of that bushing thread looks good but the latest one is much more damaged. Looks like there are still a couple good threads so you should be able to screw it back in with some filing. You can also repair threads by "picking up the existing thread" - Here's a how-to:
(209) SHOP TIPS #238 PICKING UP A THREAD on The Atlas/Craftsman 12" Lathe tubalcain - YouTube

 Note that the original threads on the end of the shaft which connects the ball handle  are 12-24 not 12-28 as you posted  earlier.


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## FriscoMustang (Feb 2, 2021)

martik777 said:


> Don't understand why your earlier photo of that bushing thread looks good but the latest one is much more damaged. Looks like there are still a couple good threads so you should be able to screw it back in with some filing. You can also repair threads by "picking up the existing thread" - Here's a how-to:
> (209) SHOP TIPS #238 PICKING UP A THREAD on The Atlas/Craftsman 12" Lathe tubalcain - YouTube
> 
> Note that the original threads on the end of the shaft which connects the ball handle  are 12-24 not 12-28 as you posted  earlier.


Yeah, I think they galled in the hole. Turned out the thread in the cast was stronger than the thread on the bushing. Thanks for the correction.


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## ericc (Feb 2, 2021)

FriscoMustang said:


> You found a die for the bushing thread? At this point I think the bushing is toast unless I add some metal back. Assume brazing is the right approach for cracked part, then re drill and tap the oil hole. As you can see, easy and slow may not be my strengths!


You will get better.  After I bought my first lathe, I improved a lot.  And I did break a lot of stuff.  Still do.  You pretty much have to in order to make some progress, and you'll have to figure out how much is about right.

I meant, I found a die for the shaft thread, not the bushing thread.  I would recommend slowly using a file to clean up the thread on the bushing.  A thread gauge may help in this task.  This thread should not have to hold much force.  Most of the force will be downward on the cross slide.


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