# My AXA Tool Blocks From CDCO



## Buffalo21 (May 29, 2020)

Late last week I ordered a dozen of the #250-101 tool blocks from Frank at CDCO. I got a email that 7 where shipped out on 5/25/20 and the balance was shipped out on 5/26/20. The first batch arrived today, after a little clean up (they were very oily in sealed plastic bags) and my usual change out of the set screws, I use a 8 mm x 1.25 mm x 20 mm square head, full dog point set screw, were now ready for the load up of the tooling that arrived from Glanze Tools, out of India (32.5x CCMT).

Over the years, I bought for me and work, somewhere between 350 and 400 blocks from CDCO, with never an issue, they all fit, were machine square and have worked as intended. Many of them opened up to take either 5/8” or 3/4” tool shanks.


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## derf (May 29, 2020)

Seems like the blocks themselves are always good, but the supplied set screws always suck!


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## Buffalo21 (May 29, 2020)

I didn’t realize the picture, showed the world, for all to see, my other bad habit, Mt Dew Code Red...........


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## silverhawk (May 30, 2020)

Buffalo21 said:


> I didn’t realize the picture, showed the world, for all to see, my other bad habit, Mt Dew Code Red...........


Mine, too. I am a little frustrated that they stopped producing the throwback mountain dew, too, but at least I still have my code red. 

joe


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## Buffalo21 (May 30, 2020)

silverhawk said:


> Mine, too. I am a little frustrated that they stopped producing the throwback mountain dew, too, but at least I still have my code red.
> 
> joe



throwback Mt Dew, made with real cane sugar, is very high on my want list, but normally the Code Red and the original are my choices, I’m very wary of the other flavors, as most of them contain Aspartame, Sucralos, or some other artificial sugar. I do not trust them and they all have a terrible aftertaste, if I was looking for a “diet” or reduced calorie beverage, Mt Dew would not be on the list


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## NCjeeper (May 30, 2020)

I have ordered a lot of AXA blocks from them also. No issues except for the soft set screws as noted but that isn't really CDCO's fault.


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## darkzero (May 30, 2020)

I bought 4 BXA holder from them. The adjusters where threaded so crooked that making height adjustments was a nightmare. I sold them cause I will never try to return something to them ever again. 

Yrs later I ordered 4 more & the adjusters were fine. 2 of them had ugly grind marks on them before they were black oxidized. But whatever, they function fine & they are cheaper than anyone else. Those 4 are the only ones I currently own from CDCO. Most of mine are from Shars which I never had a problem with. But the Shars holders have changed & I don't like the new ones. If/when I need more I'll probably chance on ordering from CDCO again.

When I had a mini lathe I ordered a few AXA holder from them & had no issues. Don't ever try to return something, dealing with that Frank guy over the phone is a PITA for a measly $40. Still pisses me off every time I think about it.


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## DonP (May 30, 2020)

My first and last order from CDCO tool company included an AXA tool post and about 8 tool holders along with quite a bit of other tooling.  Most of the holders were ok but inconsistent how they say down on the wedge type tool post.  One was so far out of whack that it couldn't be tightened up on the post.  I tried contacting Frank about the issue and he did not return my emails.   He was very johnny-on-the-spot taking my purchase inquiry and order but when I had an issue I could get no reply from him.  I will not order from that outfit ever again.


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## NCjeeper (May 31, 2020)

Trying to return something and get a refund is pretty painful.


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## Buffalo21 (May 31, 2020)

As I said, I’ve ordered close to 400 tool blocks and a D1-4 direct mount 5C collet chuck from CDCO, I’ve never ordered anything else from Frank, my experience has been nothing but stellar. I’ve had 5-6 times more delivery/quality issues with Grizzly or Shars.

I did make the tragic error of trying to talk to Frank once, I‘d rather have a root canal, than experience that ordeal again. The 5C chuck is very good, and except for serious manufacturing errors (not really Frank’s fault, just returns can be an issue, which is his fault), like the crooked height adjusters Darkzero had, for me they have been very good buy, I can not make them for what I can buy them for.

I’ve bought some blocks from Shars, Grizzly, All Industrial and a few others, they all appear the same as those from CDCO, but cost anywhere from 1.5 to 2 times more and take longer to get. My order history from CDCO is usually 3 days, from time of order to delivery.


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## Aukai (May 31, 2020)

I liked my experience with All industrial, but have not purchased any blocks.


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## darkzero (May 31, 2020)

Buffalo21 said:


> blocks from Shars, Grizzly, All Industrial and a few others, they all appear the same as those from CDCO,



They may function the same but they are not the same as in not the same manufacturer & style. For BXA anyway. The CDCO AXA & BXA ones closely resemble the old Shars ones but are not from the same factory. But now Shars has 2 different styles. Phase II appears to be from the same factory as the old style Shars except Phase II uses different set screw. Not sure if Phase II ones are currently the same as before. Back then WT Tool carried the ones from Shars but did not say Shars on them like Shars' old stock. Not sure about these days.

The second style from Shars, Grizzly, & All Industrial appear the same, they use smaller set screws with black thick adjusters. CDCO ones use the larger set screws like the old style Shars. In BXA size these ones with the smaller set screws the holder is longer in length than the CDCO, old style Shars, & Phase II.

I prefer the style that looks like CDCO & old style Shars. But again the old style Shars is no longer availabe so I'll buy from CDCO again when I need more & they're cheap. I've never had an issue with Shars holders (or anyone else) unlike CDCO. But those bad ones I got from CDCO were probably just luck of the draw. My issue with CDCO is the person who runs the place. Extreme example of the typical take your money & no customer service if ever needed.

None of this really matters, they work, just clarifying that they are not all the same.


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## Buffalo21 (May 31, 2020)

DZ,

I do not doubt what you say, the majority of the ones I have from Grizzly and the others are 10+ yrs old and look identical to the CDCO ones I have, the only ones that are different are the newer All industrial sourced #250-101XLs (5/8” tooling in an AXA block) and the 3, I have from Dorian and the 4, I have from Aloris. Since I have not bought from anyone else recently  (except the #250-101XLs) for the last 10 yards or so, have all come from CDCO.

until your post I did not know the Shars and other ones were different now. How so?? Are they longer, higher, wider??.

About 8 yrs ago now, I ordered a box of 500 of the 8 mm x 1.25 mm x 20 square head, full dog point set screws to replace the ones that came in the blocks, the kid at the supply store entered the order wrong and I ended up with 5000 of them. It was going to cost the supplier almost the entire cost with restocking and shipping, to return the extras, so I ended up buying them at cost. I sold off many of them, gave some away and still have an adequate supply for my self.

I started out with a Grizzly QCTP, the piston type, later changed to a Phase II wedge type, happen upon a deal for an Aloris tool post and was quite happy, then with a work bonus burning a hole in my pocket, and a 25% off coupon from Grizzly, I bought a Dorian, stated to have the “New and Improved” wedge design. I sold off the Aloris and kept the Dorian. I’m still not sure if the actual performance between the Phase II, the Aloris and the Dorian was all that great, the fit and finish on the Aloris was miles ahead of the Phase II and the fit and finish of the Dorian, is a step or two above the Aloris, whether any of them worked any better is still a subject I question.


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## darkzero (May 31, 2020)

Shars has 2 styles now, not including the old style which is NLA. As I mentioned one style is longer in length & uses smaller set screws which is a popular style sold by others now. Shars even specifies to order by type A or type B depending on which QCTP model you have from them. They claim one will not fit the other QCTP even though they are the same size/series. This does not make sense to me cause if you have a BXA or whatever, all other BXA holders should fit. Of course I understand there are variances between Chinese manufacturers h this probably the reason but this just sounds like a mess to me. No one else specifies this & Shars did not specify this with their old style holders.

Can't link to their ebay pages to show the differeneces as their ebay store is still closed. Their website probably has it. They did just announce yesterday that they have resumed operation. Found their pic though.



Here's a thread here showing some comparisons. The Shars holder in this post is just one of the newer styles. Older style NLA holder not shown.








						Qctp Holder Review Part 1
					

I have read a lot of discussions on the pros and cons of QCTP holders from various manufacturers but never a head to head comparison so I collected four of the commonly used BXA-1 holders for review. I have had inexpensive import QCTP's and more recently a new Aloris QCTP . Just from an...




					www.hobby-machinist.com
				




I have nothing against Aloris, they are good quality & set the "standard". I had a DTM TP65A (AXA) for my old mini lathe which I loved. DTM was created by former employess of Aloris, owner retired & their doors closed. When I got my current lathe I wanted another DTM QCTP (well I really wanted a Multifix but cost wise it didn't make sense for me being in the US). I couldn't find a DTM TP75A (BXA).

Yup that's what I have too. I bought a Dorian SQCTP when they had just transitioned to the wedge style from their previous cam style. I assume they had to do something about model confusion cause they later changed the color of the wedge style from red to silver. I'm very happy with the Dorian but I hate their current holders. They kept changing them. Aloris came out with the oversized holders (1 shank size larger) & Dorian followed. Those standard size & oversized Dorian holders were fine for me. But then Dorian decided to change their holders & make them what I call extreme oversized (2 shank sizes bigger). Now these extreme oversized holders are their "standard" now, they no longer make the "normal" size. Here's a post I made about them a while back. (Post #8)








						Upgrading to a QCTP ....... advice please
					

I'm contemplating  replacing the old peg & wedge tool post on my old 10 inch throw lathe, currently I've been using  a Myford clamp and centre bolt but have found this unsatisfactory in that the nine inch long boring tool I was using  kept easing out of true from under the clamp, which ended up...




					www.hobby-machinist.com
				




If I knew what I knew now back then I would have just bought all genuine Aloris holders to begin with to use with my Dorian TP. But I probably wouldn't have been able to afford all that back then anyway. But I'm perfectly fine with the holders I have now which are 90% Shars old style. The rest are Dorian & a few CDCO. IMHO it's the tool post that makes most of the difference.


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## Buffalo21 (May 31, 2020)

DZ, 

thank you, the links you posted were good reads,


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## BGHansen (May 31, 2020)

I must have a lot of dumb luck as I have at least 75 BXA holders from CDCO and have had no issues at all. 

Bruce


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## uncle harry (Jun 1, 2020)

DonP said:


> My first and last order from CDCO tool company included an AXA tool post and about 8 tool holders along with quite a bit of other tooling.  Most of the holders were ok but inconsistent how they say down on the wedge type tool post.  One was so far out of whack that it couldn't be tightened up on the post.  I tried contacting Frank about the issue and he did not return my emails.   He was very johnny-on-the-spot taking my purchase inquiry and order but when I had an issue I could get no reply from him.  I will not order from that outfit ever again.




I've had sloppy fit problems with some of their AXA blocks as well.  I have made shims out of HVAC tin to fit the took post. Inconvenient at best, especially when I lose the shims.


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## Nyala (Jun 1, 2020)

I've had three on order since September 2019 and have yet to receive them.  Last week I sent an email requesting cancellation of the order, which included other items, and have decided to make my own AXA holders.  I ordered what I needed and I'm ready to proceed.


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## Buffalo21 (Jun 1, 2020)

I spent a good part of the late morning, opening up 4 of the blocks to hold 5/8” (16 mm) tooling and 4 of the blocks to hold 3/4” (19 mm) tooling and left 4 of them to hold 1/2” tooling.


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## Janderso (Jun 1, 2020)

I have had very good luck with Shars CXA holders.
 No complaints whatsoever.


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## Buffalo21 (Jun 10, 2020)

I opened up 5 of the CDCO AXA tool blocks for a friend, this morning, from 1/2” (actually .5342”) to hold a 5/8” tool.

1 - the finished blocks
2 - the test piece of 5/8” keystock


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## Winegrower (Jun 10, 2020)

I just ordered 5 more CXA holders from CDCO.   I have some Aloris, Phase 2, no names and some CDCO.   Frankly I do not see any systematic difference, other than the easily fixed soft screws.  I have an Aloris toolpost, that might be the more critical component, though I had Phase 2 AXA posts, both piston and wedge, also did not see any meaningful differences in repeatability or rigidity.


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## Buffalo21 (Jun 27, 2020)

I just received my last order from CDCO, I bought another dozen blocks, this dozen after the dozen (this group is work related), I got at the beginning of June. Frank seems to have found a different supplier (Or using numerous suppliers), they are packed differently, the part number is no longer imprinted in the blocks, its now silk screened, sizing is a bit different, about an 1/16” to 1/8” longer and the set screws are different (I’m still replacing them). Everything seems straight and square, they fit the Dorian tool post perfectly and were packed in a sealed zip-lock style bag, with copious amounts of stinky light machine oil.


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## Winegrower (Jun 27, 2020)

Interesting that the last 5 CXA tool holders from CDCO can hold a 1" shank tool, though the Shars, Aloris and Banggood acquired CXA holders will not go that big.     The centerline of the CDCO tool slot is at the same height, but it's both lower and higher than the other holders.

For me, this is a pretty good feature.


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## Buffalo21 (Jul 8, 2020)

I opened up 5 more of the CDCO AXA blocks to take 5/8” tools and, immediately 3 of them went out the door. I have 2 of the CNMG lathe tools (one right, one left), with 5/8” shanks, on order from a supplier, that are to be delivered, hopefully this week. All said and done, I still have 2 of the empty blocks, that are unaltered for my stock, not sure if, except for customer blocks, if I’m going to actually need to order anymore.


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## projectnut (Jul 8, 2020)

Buffalo21 said:


> Late last week I ordered a dozen of the #250-101 tool blocks from Frank at CDCO. I got a email that 7 where shipped out on 5/25/20 and the balance was shipped out on 5/26/20. The first batch arrived today, after a little clean up (they were very oily in sealed plastic bags) and my usual change out of the set screws, I use a 8 mm x 1.25 mm x 20 mm square head, full dog point set screw, were now ready for the load up of the tooling that arrived from Glanze Tools, out of India (32.5x CCMT).
> 
> *Over the years, I bought for me and work, somewhere between 350 and 400 blocks from CDCO*, with never an issue, they all fit, were machine square and have worked as intended. Many of them opened up to take either 5/8” or 3/4” tool shanks.
> 
> ...



It's interesting that you mention purchasing from CDCO for a professional shop.  Although it was some time back, and possibly before the advent of CDCO, I worked in a shop with 16 other machinists.  I don't think there were 300 quick change tool holders between the 17 of us.  Each of the 6 lathes had around a dozen or so, and there were probably another dozen on the shelves in the store room.

As for purchasing from a discounter, or discount brands, it was strictly prohibited.  The rule was to purchase only Aloris tool posts and holders, and only name brand tooling such as Niagara, Morse, Accupro, Kennametal, and other widely known brands.  The thought was to provide the best tools and tooling available to eliminate excuses for poor quality parts.  If the raw materials, tools and tooling were high quality the only remaining variable was the skill of the person completing the job.  

It also instilled in the machinists the pride that they and their skills were respected enough that the company would provide and entrust them with top quality tools and tooling without the fear that these items would be lost, stolen, or damaged.  I must say the relationship worked.  Most of the machinists worked their entire careers at the company.  It was not uncommon for the senior people to have 35 to 40 years in the shop.  Some were even asked to return after retirement for special jobs.  I seriously wonder if there are many, or any similar relationships in the industry today.


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## Buffalo21 (Jul 8, 2020)

I have a customer that have hundreds of the blocks, they use them to hold sensors, limit switches, slitting knives, cameras and other equipment, on speciality paper making equipment (fancy embossed wrapping paper). They don’t use them on a lathe or a tool post, they use them on sliding tracks, on the equipment. I do them for them, because I’m a hell of a lot cheaper and quicker, than done in-house, besides they are swamped with the actual paper related machinery repairs.

i done quite a few for other home shop people, that have either no milling machine or real small ones (might not up to the task) and a few others that are more than will to pay someone else to do them.


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## springer (Jul 9, 2020)

DZ, what is it you dont like about the new shars holders? I've recently ordered a handful of the BXA 3/4" holders and was pleased. Didnt even need to replace the screws as they seem to be better quality than the ones that came with my toolpost "set".


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## darkzero (Jul 9, 2020)

Nothing really, I don't think I said I disliked them, if I did I didn't mean to. I have no experience with the newer Shars holders so I can't comment on them. They do have 2 styles now, one that uses the smaller set screws. I just prefer not to buy that style, not that perform any different, just a personal preference. I do have a few holders with the smaller set screws that came with my lathe. I think I've only ever used one of them.


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