Run start capacitor motor wiring.

[BruceW]

I’m here to learn.
Something in my 40 yr old Chinese single capacitor motor went cactus wompus on me and started to may a metalic grinding noise.

I went to a "specialist " shop and wanted a motor to replace this one as I was told it obviously wasn’t worth even looking at.

Long Story short.

I have ended up with a run /start capacitor motor I;e two capactor motor Generic type nothing special r1 motor (well it is but common).
it is a 1.5 kw motor compared to the 1hp old one.

I was told I should be able to wire it up like the old one no problems.

After hacking away with a grinder at the universal flange and recutting The keyway and fitting the pulley.

I thought I’d wire it up before trying to fit it in situation for the final clean up.
Can’t be too hard. Just like the old girl.

The switch I have swaps the neutral around on the old motor to make it spin backwards.

Ohh two capacitors what do they do?

I got onto to The inter web and it seems it could be a little above my pay grade to wire up. And I’m unsure.

It seemed to me you could wire the reverse switch between the winding on the start or was it the run wire to make it reverse by changing the direction of the neutral or live wire and not blow the start capacitor up after bridging the motor to run the direction you want it to.

anyhoo.

Can it be done like that?
Can it be done at all without a board full of gizmo’s
Can It be done at all?
I’m only asking to find out if I’m being royally *****d over or not.

I do not know where else I could ask about such things.


I ran the wonderfull place in question and they said he didn’t know How to wire it up
I am led to believe their is someone else who is an expert who runs the place that comes and goes every now and again ....but it my be just *******t at best anyway.

Thnx
I feel I should go stick it up their arse and burn their ******* place down
But I just want to get my lathe going Honestly.

 

[Ulma Doctor]

The cap start, cap run motor cam certainly run in both directions .
You will need to extend leads from the motor to your switching devise.
The OEM control system my need to be modified or eliminated to make the installation go smoothly
It sounds more work than it actually is

 

[markba633csi]

Bruce: post pictures of the motor nameplate info and show the wires leading to the motor, we'll get you going
-Mark

 

[BruceW]

O.k
here we go.
motor

 

[BruceW]

Switch



May have the F&R wrong way round but is what The poles do.

The old wiring to the old motor has 4 wires
An active ,an earth ,and 2x neutral or (command wires?)
I will need to change the old wiring anyway as I need a bit more length to make it fit.

As a side note.
Talk about throwing good money after bad.
I thought what the hell and took the old motor apart anyway.
Blew out all the black sooty rubber you can rub of from a complete veebelt.
A wire had come loose from the throw out switch to the coils? or rattled or vibrated From its route and was getting rubbed by the armature.
It has a small bare patch which was grounding and tripping out to earth When it would make contact.
I put some new to me "liquid electrical tape" goop on it and wow, saved so much hassle.
Put it back where it is supposed to lay.

I prised up the bearing covers a little and squeezed a bit of grease in them with a grease needle, but I think I’m too late and they need replacing.
It runs up and I spent a 5 hr stretch with it no troubles at all.
It was very warm to the touch, query bearings.
It could have been revamped as the armature says it has 8 poles instead of 4, but who knows.
I may just change out the bearings as I should be able to take out the armature in situ And fix it now I know.

I still want to wire up the new one thou.
Keep it handy for replacement.
What do they say?
Paying it forward.
Taking a brighter side to all this.

And they told me it didn’t even have a fan.
Ha

 

[Ulma Doctor]

essentially you are switching V1 and Z2 in combination with U2

 

[markba633csi]

Bruce I need to see the wiring diagram on the old motor as well in order to put all the pieces together. The new motor looks as though it is configured for 120 volts/ USA power even though the nameplate says 240 v. Also notice the circuit breaker is hanging free with no wires connected. Somewhat puzzling
Anyhow, for 240 volt it should be possible to end up with only 3 wires from switch to motor- we shall see, if I can cogitate this a bit more. Stay tuned
-Mark

 

[BruceW]

O.k...o.k.

Sorry Mark.
There is no wires connected to the new motor at all

I’ve been think’n.
Now if I wanna cut a metric screw thread up the tail stock end in this lathe I will have to do a quick 2x side set to get to the switch before it crashes into the fixed steady.
With my new knee and wonky leg it ain’t gunna happen these days. Not that it wouldn’t be thwart with danger if I was nimble and young.

One : I could plug the power lead end into a power switch and turn it off that way and then proceed to the headstock and reverse the motor.
This would work for the OLD MOTOR.


Two. With the NEW MOTOR make a long lead with switch in a remote box to locate where one is working hanging off the swarf tray routed underneath it out of harms way.

I would need a new switch and box to house it and some lead but it seems feasible and doable.
unless their is some electrical issue I’m missing.
This will keep everyone from. A headache maybe.

I do. Like the old switch. It seems appropriate for the old banger.
I’ve rebuilt it all nearly now over the last month and apart from some unexpected leaks and things it’s tuning up o.k. And quite do-able/ usable as I find it’s personality and design limitations.
I can see moving back and forth to the headstock a great exercise program.
I’m more worried buy the time I get back to the tail stock I’’ll have forgotten what I Doing or spend the next half an hour finding something I put down again.

But hey!
I ain’t doing production work.

thanks for the help so far.
if you can enlighten me more please do so.
or. More pictures if needed
Bruce

 

[markba633csi]

Bruce: I need to clarify your original wiring. I see only 3 wires on the drum switch: red, black, and green.
Are/were there any other wires on the switch? Which of those went to the motor and which went to the mains 230 volts?
It would help if you could make a simple sketch and post it here- thanks
-Mark
You could easily add a second on/off switch if you need it- in series with the mains
I was able to find a Techtop brochure online, your new motor is a dedicated 240 volt motor with two windings, unlike the dual voltage/ 3 winding motors we often see here in the states. Once we verify the pole positions of your drum switch we can connect it in place of the old motor. I think you need to ring out the switch again with all wires removed to check the poles.

 

[markba633csi]

Hi Bruce- If your switch matches what I drew here, then the new Techtop motor would be wired like this:
Remove the two jumpers at the motor box and extend wires as necessary
Swap U1 and U2 if required for proper rotation with respect to switch handle
Add a second on/off switch in "L" line if you want a remote shut off