Repair worn 1930's Craftsman / Atlas ways

[kdtop]

Hey all,

I have a 1930's Craftsman / Atlas lathe as per photo



The saddle is constructed such that it rides on the outside of the flat ways and, as expected, in the area of most use, it has worn down, as per photo.



This does two things: 1) It allows the carriage to drop a bit lower, decreasing the engagement of my feed gear into the gear rack under the ways (not shown), which increases backlash slop in the feed wheel. I could live with this, but it is a bit annoying. To address this, I have put 0.010" shim under the carriage (see rolled end in the photo) which helps some.

But the second issue is that I can't adjust my carriage gibs etc in well enough get rigidity at my tool point. This is especially evident when trying to do single-point thread cutting. I can often move the tip at least 10 thousandths with just my hand. And if I try to tighten everything up, then the carriage sticks at the point of less wear.

To fix this, I think I have a few options

1) Send ways off to be ground flat.
2) Scrape the ways flat down to the lowest point.
3) Build up the worn area and then scrape flat

I'd like to explore option 3 (building up) first.

Searching this forum, I have found mention of Loctite Fixmaster Metal Rebuilding. (

) which seems to come as a liquid or putty. And then there is Turcite and Rulon which seem to come as sheets that are glued down.

Questions:
1) It seems that any type of epoxy is going to have a hard time adhering when it is so thin, i.e. 5 thou'. So would I need to abrade the surface with grooves to increase adherence?

2) For the Turcite strips, It seems they would adhere to the surface better. But can the withstand the scraping action that the saddle will place on it? Seems like I have heard that Turcite is much softer (and thus easier to scrape) than metal. So does it wear faster? And how thin are the strips. Would I have to lower my surface, which is currently 5 thou' down, to 10-20 thou'?

Thanks in advance for any advice.

Kevin T

 

[benmychree]

Turcite is applied to the underside of the saddle, not to the way surface, the way surface should be reground and the saddle built up with turcite to return it to the proper height for engagement for the rack gear engagement and the leadscrew, or perhaps more sensibly, replace the lathe with another, perhaps more sophisticated than the Atlas.

 

[pacifica]

One way to compensate for the taper effect would be to lock the cross slide and use the compound only , a slight angling of the compound to adjust for the amount of taper caused by worn ways. Tedious and limited to travel of compound.
Not sure if this addresses the other issues.

 

[martik777]

I had similar wear on my South Bend's V-way and made a sled attachment attached to the tailstock base to plane the ways down to the level of the lowest point. See post #16-20: https://www.hobby-machinist.com/threads/lathe-bed-restoration.49053/page-2#post-417252
Obviously your tailstock ways need to be in good shape for this to work.

You could then epoxy some brass strips under the carriage to raise it as needed.

Is that the 12" Craftsman model?

Early Craftsman Metalcraft & Metalmaster 9" and 12" Lathes

History and development of the Craftsman, Dunlap, Companion, Metalcraft, Metalmaster, AA109, 109, Simpson and Courlan and manufactured by the American

www.lathes.co.uk

 

[kdtop]

Turcite is applied to the underside of the saddle, not to the way surface, the way surface should be reground and the saddle built up with turcite to return it to the proper height for engagement for the rack gear engagement and the leadscrew, or perhaps more sensibly, replace the lathe with another, perhaps more sophisticated than the Atlas.

Thanks for your reply. It makes more sense if the turcite is applied to the saddle, but it doesn't then help my problem of the worn ways until I can find a way to lower them to the lowest point.

I got this lathe as a starter lathe, and perhaps it is time for me to move to something better. I just thought I ought to at least try to save this old beauty.

KT

 

[kdtop]

I had similar wear on my South Bend's V-way and made a sled attachment attached to the tailstock base to plane the ways down to the level of the lowest point. See post #16-20: https://www.hobby-machinist.com/threads/lathe-bed-restoration.49053/page-2#post-417252
Obviously your tailstock ways need to be in good shape for this to work.

You could then epoxy some brass strips under the carriage to raise it as needed.

Is that the 12" Craftsman model?

Early Craftsman Metalcraft & Metalmaster 9" and 12" Lathes

History and development of the Craftsman, Dunlap, Companion, Metalcraft, Metalmaster, AA109, 109, Simpson and Courlan and manufactured by the American

www.lathes.co.uk

That video was interesting. But I think I won't be able to do the same because I don't really have any good reference surfaces that aren't worn.

The bed is about 36" long, and It is about 6" from the spindle access to the plane of the ways. So does that mean it is 12"?

The link for the old lathes was cool! I think mine is a 1938 model.

KT

 

[martik777]

If it is 6" from the center of the spindle to the ways, then it is a 12" swing.
Aren't the tailstock ways in good condition?

 

[WCraig]

Thanks for your reply. It makes more sense if the turcite is applied to the saddle, but it doesn't then help my problem of the worn ways until I can find a way to lower them to the lowest point.

I got this lathe as a starter lathe, and perhaps it is time for me to move to something better. I just thought I ought to at least try to save this old beauty.

Fixing wear in a lathe is a costly process--generally considered not justified for a common machine like an Atlas. In a nutshell, you would have to totally disassemble the lathe and send the bed out to be reground. The grinding process isn't straight-forward as the bed has to be carefully dialed in and supported so as not to end up with a banana! It may not be easy to find a shop with the capacity for such a job that is willing to take on a one-shot like this. Quite likely to be _very_ costly. OTOH, maybe you already have a good buddy with a high-end machine shop?

Probably, the saddle needs to be reground (or scraped) as there is likely more wear on the operator side. Turcite would then be applied to the saddle and tailstock to 'replace' the material ground away. The Turcite needs to be scraped in to get good contact on all surfaces.

Anything is possible if you throw enough time and money at the issue but most people just move on to a machine that is already in better condition.

Craig

 

[macardoso]

We have a commercial forum sponsor who does lathe bed grinding. I think someone has already sent in a lathe and found the cost to be reasonable enough.

 

[kdtop]

If it is 6" from the center of the spindle to the ways, then it is a 12" swing.
Aren't the tailstock ways in good condition?

Pardon my ignorance...

So are the tailstock ways the part of the flat ways that are in the middle? I.e. point "A" in my initial photos? If so, then perhaps they are OK, or at least in much better condition.


I made the above crude diagram. I guess, then, that the tailstock ways are comprised of parts D, E, F. And those should be in relatively better shape?

So how does one use that to restore parts A, B, C?

Thanks
Kevin