Has anyone had the chance to compare these brands, Acra, Kent USA, Precision Matthews

Each company carries a range of machines over a wide price range. I looked at some of the other Acra mills (and also Kent, Gizzly, etc.) when I purchased my LMV mill and many of the less expensive models were dated design and not as well built. A lot of the Kent models at the time had been around for a decades, they recently redesigned their mills. Grizzly's SB line is their high quality line, many of their bigger lathes (1330 and larger) sold are made by Sunmaster. I would not draw conclusions about a brand/distributor based on a single machine they carry. Warranty and service wise, from my experience (direct and through working with others) with multiple machine distributors I would rate QMT/PM at the top of the heap. The Sunmaster manual lathe line (ERL, RML, TRL) is a much heavier duty and higher quality line then the 1340/1440GT and the Eisen 1440E/GE/EV, they are also more expensive. The Acra LMV/Sharp LCM has been in production for many years, and I compared it to several other mills and it is a much better built machine. Still the design's for manual mills are archaic. With the advent of CNC machines, there is little incentive for manufactures to invest in a major redesign for such a small market.

On the mills I looked at several used Lagun mills in the 3-4K range, and also had used ones at a friends shop. Nice manual mills, but they wanted 3-4K, they all needed repairs and they not longer held spec. tolerances for production work (main reason they were being sold). With the used machine market you need to know what you are getting into, factor in repairs and cost of parts (if available). Many of the light industrial manual lathes have had heavy use in machine shops, so you may be inheriting a host of issues along with limited replacement parts. I dealt with another hobbyist that purchased a used Sharp 1340 lathe, and found out after the sale that the spindle was bent most likely because it had been crashed. Replacement from Sharp was more than he paid for the lathe, I tried to source parts for him through Acra because Sharp didn't want to deal with him because the machine was purchased second hand.

Sunmaster manual lathe production
 
China can make really high quality machinery—but we won't pay for it, we want low price. China accommodates our demand by making machinery that's built to a price point instead of a quality standard, and we do buy that, and here we are.
 
kb58 said:
China can make really high quality machinery—but we won't pay for it, we want low price. China accommodates our demand by making machinery that's built to a price point instead of a quality standard, and we do buy that, and here we are.
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We're not willing to pay the price for a quality machine from China because it is made in China and therefore of lesser quality, which is proven by the quality of the Chinese goods we get for a lesser price. Circular logic makes me dizzy.
 
Never seen one in person but those Knuth machines look nice. They better be thought for the price they're asking.
 
Sun master makes all 3 brand lathes I was looking at, but who makes the Acra & PM knee mills? The Acra LCM50 from what I have seen in videos seems to look more heavy duty then the PM 949 & 1050. I did see in person the Sharp mill that is the same as the LCM50. The LCM42 & 50 have the bridgeport round style head where the lesser Acra and PM version don't, they have the more rectangle heads. When you look at the PM1050 listing it shows the PM949 in pictures. The Acra as ground and scraped ways and table top when the PM says just ground. From what I have read it seems scraping makes them last longer and even the better bridgeport where supposed to have that done on them.

Who makes the DRO's for PM. I would like to have the same DRO on the lathe and mill, just to keep things more simple. I do want one that you can do arc's with on the mill. You can get DRO's from $300 to $2400 and I'm sure the higher priced will have different options that is not available on the cheaper versions.
 
My 14" Takisawa was made in Taiwan in 1979. It's a dang good lathe. I think the point about designing to a price point is the basic issue...you can get excellent Asian machines, they just cost more than we are ready to pay. That's why I buy used, not this new stuff. Some of the posts make me weep for the new owners. Ok, maybe not literally. You know what I mean.
 
kb58 said:
China can make really high quality machinery—but we won't pay for it, we want low price.
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Some will, some won't.

China accommodates our demand by making machinery that's built to a price point instead of a quality standard, and we do buy that, and here we are.
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If you look hard enough, you will find both Grizzly and Precision Mathews same lathes and mills that have exactly the same dimensions as ones found at Harbor Fright.
The PM and Gs typically cost about 30% more than the HF--and are worth it. Better tolerances, better bearings, quality control,.....all things worth paying for.

But, no they will never be Monarchs or Bridgeports.
 
hwelecrepair said:
As a machine repair tech/rebuilder, I would put Kent above Acra. We worked on an Acra mill about 4 months after it was purchased new for a warranty repair, and the mill was already obsolete. I just don't think they are quality machines.

I can't rank PM among them, as I have never worked on one or ran one.

Jon
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Do you know who the US sales organization is for Kent? I see them being sold by Stiles. If they are your sole support for that brand I'd find a different color machine.
 
Mitch Alsup said:
... The PM and Gs typically cost about 30% more than the HF--and are worth it. Better tolerances, better bearings, quality control,.....all things worth paying for...
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Some will, some won't, :p
 
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