1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. PLEASE: Read the FORUM RULES BEFORE registering!

    Dismiss Notice

Furnas Motor Starter, Size 0, Rebuild / Upgrade

Discussion in 'ELECTRICAL ISSUES - POWER YOUR MACHINES & SHOP' started by toolman_ar, Jul 30, 2017.

  1. toolman_ar

    toolman_ar United States Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

    Likes Received:
    85
    Trophy Points:
    28
    City:
    Birmingham
    State:
    Alabama

    -Return to Top-

    I wanted to share my experience upgrading and repairing the motor starter found on my saw.


    The motor starter I am working on is from a Rockwell-Delta 28-365, Wood and Metal bandsaw.

    What I started with looked like a mess and I was intimidated because I am not an electrician and have great respect for electricity. This starter is the original motor starter for the saw. It only had two heaters and the 3rd leg was not protected.


    Research began by looking on the internet for the Furnas Motor Starter number, 16CC104410C, and found nothing. Realizing this motor starter is 50 years old and out of date, I began looking on eBay for a size 0 starter. I found a starter that looked just like mine. Placed an order because it was new old stock and priced right. Once I received the NOS starter I hit pay dirt. Inside the box was a document from Furnas with a parts break down on the motor starter. It listed all of the parts by part number and even an add on 3rd leg relay. Looking up the parts by part number, I was able to find the parts needed to add the 3rd leg protection needed to update my old Motor Starter.

    What I started with:
    Junction Box on Bandsaw.jpg


    Today I did a bench test of the motor starter and tested the circuit. I now have a working motor starter and can begin to reassemble my saw.
     
    rdean, 4gsr, Ulma Doctor and 2 others like this.
  2. toolman_ar

    toolman_ar United States Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

    Likes Received:
    85
    Trophy Points:
    28
    City:
    Birmingham
    State:
    Alabama

    -Return to Top-

    IMG_4099.JPG IMG_4100.JPG IMG_4101.JPG IMG_4102.JPG Some steps to add a 3rd leg relay.
     
  3. toolman_ar

    toolman_ar United States Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

    Likes Received:
    85
    Trophy Points:
    28
    City:
    Birmingham
    State:
    Alabama

    -Return to Top-

    IMG_4103.JPG IMG_4104.JPG IMG_4105.JPG IMG_4106.JPG IMG_4108.JPG IMG_4109.JPG IMG_4110.JPG Some more
     
    4gsr likes this.
  4. toolman_ar

    toolman_ar United States Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

    Likes Received:
    85
    Trophy Points:
    28
    City:
    Birmingham
    State:
    Alabama

    -Return to Top-

    One of the things I learned is that there are two types of relays.
    If you look at the pictures you will notice that some of the relays have a red reset switch, and some are green.
    The Red relay is non temperature compensated. The Green are Temperature Compensated.

    I did not realize this until I started to order heaters. That is when I realized I had a problem. Not a good idea to mix and match relays. As the heaters are designed for one or the other.

    After realizing this I ordered enough parts to build two starters and have one with green relays and one with red.

    Adding the third leg relay is very easy and the directions give you the wiring diagram based on your motor starter size.
     
    fixit likes this.
  5. 4ssss

    4ssss United States Active Member Active Member

    Likes Received:
    61
    Trophy Points:
    18
    City:
    Plymouth
    State:
    Connecticut

    -Return to Top-

    I have a good Furnas starter that came off my SB Heavy 10. If you want it for parts, it's yours.
     
  6. toolman_ar

    toolman_ar United States Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

    Likes Received:
    85
    Trophy Points:
    28
    City:
    Birmingham
    State:
    Alabama

    -Return to Top-

    Good deal, I will send you a pm.

    toolman_ar
    Tom
     
  7. toolman_ar

    toolman_ar United States Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

    Likes Received:
    85
    Trophy Points:
    28
    City:
    Birmingham
    State:
    Alabama

    -Return to Top-

    IMG_4132.JPG This is the parts breakdown:
     
    4gsr likes this.
  8. 4gsr

    4gsr Global Moderator Staff Member H-M Supporter-Premium

    Likes Received:
    2,213
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Victoria, Texas
    City:
    Victoria
    State:
    Texas

    -Return to Top-

    My 14" Rockwell lathe has the same starter on it too, size 0. I was able to read the label inside the cover enough to determine what size heaters to change out to. Found three replacements on evilbay. Back in business!
     
  9. woochucker

    woochucker United States Active Member Active Member

    Likes Received:
    492
    Trophy Points:
    63
    City:
    Pittstown
    State:
    New Jersey

    -Return to Top-

    What is a heater? I was originally thinking toolman was meaning hot leads, but then I looked up furnas starters and found that there are heaters.
    Is this for a 3ph, or 1ph?
    Is it literally a heater? What's it do?
     
  10. toolman_ar

    toolman_ar United States Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

    Likes Received:
    85
    Trophy Points:
    28
    City:
    Birmingham
    State:
    Alabama

    -Return to Top-

    Woodchucker,
    In the last row of three pictures, you can see the tan colored items marked K34.
    These are the heaters. The heaters mount to the relay, item P in the breakdown.

    I had to look up what a heater was when I started working on this starter. Basically it is a circuit breaker. As current flows through the heater, it takes on heat. The more current the greater the heat.

    If the motor goes haywire and begins to over amp, the heat will rise and the heater will fail. Turning off power to the motor.

    This starter is being used on a 3 phase, 1.5 hp motor.

    You should have a motor starter on motors over 1 hp.

    The size 0, defines what size motors the starter will work with.

    toolman_ar
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2017
    4gsr likes this.
  11. woochucker

    woochucker United States Active Member Active Member

    Likes Received:
    492
    Trophy Points:
    63
    City:
    Pittstown
    State:
    New Jersey

    -Return to Top-

    Thanks for the explanation.
     
  12. toolman_ar

    toolman_ar United States Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

    Likes Received:
    85
    Trophy Points:
    28
    City:
    Birmingham
    State:
    Alabama

    -Return to Top-

    You are welcome.

    When I purchased my air compressor the guy asked; "do you need a starter?"

    My response was maybe... tell me what it does...

    My understanding of how this equipment works and why grows every day. I am still a beginner.
     
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2017
    Ulma Doctor and 4gsr like this.

Share This Page