Decisions-- mill lathe combo or separate units.....help with your thought

i owned a HF branded Central Machinery 3 in 1
it was the second worst purchase i made,
the first worst was purchasing a basketcase Atlas TH42 lathe.
i painstakingly brought the Atlas back from the dead, used it for 6 months and traded it for a broken south bend, and was happy to do the trade

the Central Machinery 3 in 1 was barely capable of 1 function, let alone 3 functions.
i fear other 3 in 1's are similar.

when you try to do too many things, you usually can barely do them.

the only way i'd even consider to get any 3 in 1 again would be if my shop space was cut by 1/3, and i was given the 3 in 1
 
This question comes up frequently. The more I've looked at combo machines the less I see them as a satisfactory solution for anything.

Actually look at the specs of the machine and compare with similar stand alone machines. Look at what tooling comes with each machine. When you make this comparison you will often find little to no actual savings in space or cost.

The Midas 3 in 1 you mention suggests it is a 12x20 lathe, but if you look at the specs, it really compares better to a 10x20 lathe other than the swing. Spindle bore, power, bed width, and weight are all in line with the current batch of 10x22 lathes, not a 12" lathe.

As far as saving space the Smithy requires an area of 62x36" vs 44-47" x 12-16" for a 10x22 lathe leaving 15-18" for a mill before the foot print is actually shorter for the combo machine.

The mill on the Smithy is a round column type, which is generally considered less desirable. Most of the similar size mini mills are square columns.



I'm not advocating for these specific machines, but look at the specs and compare to the Smithy combo machines. The price for these two machines comes to $2700 so about the same as the Smithy Midas 1220. The Grizzly machines come with more tooling for the money and take approximately the same amount of space.

www.grizzly.com

10" x 22" Benchtop Metal Lathe

<h1>G0602 10" x 22" Benchtop Metal Lathe</h1> <h2>An efficient benchtop machine with a powerful 1 HP motor, and all the features you need for accurate machining on every project! </h2> <p>The Grizzly G0602 Benchtop Metal Lathe is the perfect size for garage or workshop at 10" x 22". It features...
www.grizzly.com www.grizzly.com

www.grizzly.com

6" x 20" 3/4 HP Mill/Drill

<h1>G0758 6" x 20" 3/4 HP Mill/Drill</h1> <h2>With a high-torque but quiet motor, this versatile mill/drill is ready to be a key player in your shop.</h2> <p>Drawing from the heritage of producing previous mill/drills, the G0758 6" x 20" Mill/Drill comes packed with impressive features.</p>...
www.grizzly.com www.grizzly.com
 
Smaller and lighter lathes make poor milling machine substitutes, except perhaps on smaller hobby parts made of softer materials than steel, cast iron, or even the harder yellow metals. A substantial lathe, set up correctly, and with rigid tooling, can work as a quite small milling machine substitute. The needed tooling can get expensive.

Before settling for light machines, take a cold, hard look at your spaces to see if there are ways to accommodate more substantial machines, if you want to work on harder materials and/or make bigger parts. Also note that a 10" lathe cannot make a 10" diameter part that goes over the carriage, more like 6". On both lathes and mills, tooling takes up quite a bit of the available space, so do not think you can actually hold and machine parts anywhere near the stated sizes of the machines, depending on what you are doing.
 
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Truefire said:
many individuals are saying to just purchase a good mini lathe and not worry about the mill option to begin with. Their argument is milling can be done on the lathe horizontally when the need for milling arises and you'll have increased capacity that the mill heads could never muster to begin with. Furthermore, they are heralding mills on combo units are built inferior to a stand alone anyway.
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I think you're on the right track with this line of reasoning. You're ultimately going to be limited in the work you can handle by the rigidity of the machine, so get as rigid a machine as possible. The combos are going to be less rigid for milling, just due to their design.

Consider getting the beefiest lathe you can manage, and add on a milling attachment (see the one from MLA) as an example. It's no substitute for a full-size mill,as you're working with a very small table, but the same is true of the combo machine.
 
ThinWoodsman said:
Consider getting the beefiest lathe you can manage, and add on a milling attachment (see the one from MLA) as an example. It's no substitute for a full-size mill,as you're working with a very small table, but the same is true of the combo machine.
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Note that this is a kit, for the $118 you get 6 castings, but not the base casting, or the Acme nut, and perhaps not the handle or hardware. You also pay the shipping. Then you have to machine all the parts of the attachment -- but how, without a milling machine or a usable milling attachment?

Milling attachments can sometimes be found on eBay and other places used. The prices tend to be outrageous for anything in usable condition, and may require considerable modifications or might not work at all if not in a configuration that will fit YOUR lathe. Finally, there is the freight issue again. You also need to learn how to properly use it.

I think a beginner with metalworking machines does well to get something in decent working condition for their first purchase. Find help if necessary to explore and inspect used machines. And of course, use this forum for advice, which will often be more than you expected.
 
Bob Korves said:
Note that this is a kit, for the $118 you get 6 castings, but not the base casting, or the Acme nut, and perhaps not the handle or hardware. You also pay the shipping. Then you have to machine all the parts of the attachment -- but how, without a milling machine or a usable milling attachment?
Click to expand...

Yesh, I should have made more clear that was an example of what a milling attachment is, not a recommendation for purchase. The actual attachment would ultimately depend on the lathe that was purchased.
 
We generally encourage folks to consider separate machines rather than the combo types like Smithy, although there are people that like them.
Most of the limitations are concerning the milling function. The milling functions are pretty limited.
It really depends on what types of projects you want to do and the sizes/accuracy of pieces you want to make.
Also keep in mind the cost of tooling and accessories, drills, cutting bits, measuring tools, etc.
mark
 
If u look up "sumore tools" in Shanghai, many of the machines sold under popular labels are made by them. If you are crazy as a loon, (like me) u can import yourself directly from them. . Most have a minimum order quantity, but will add your one machine to someone else's production run and ship separately ...try to get from a run intended for use in China, the quality/reliability will be better. Also look on "alibaba"?
I have ( http://www.sumore.com/english/cp-view.asp?id=77 ) still using when needed. I previously had one with the mill head mounted above the lathe head but didn't like it.
 
You fine gentlemen have driven home my new thought with precision. It didn't take me long to reconsider how I looked at the 3-in-1 after really digging in last night. I plan on going with a quality benchtop lathe only instead. If I find myself in need of a mill at a later point, I'll just have to think about moving some stuff around in the shop.

Initially I overlooked the immediate setback of working on one of the 3-in-1s. I simply overlooked having to remove a carriage and install a mill table every time I wanted to do something different, only to reverse the process immediately thereafter and having to redial things back in. That is NOT something I want to have to do while working on parts.

Like I said earlier, I know myself around machines and have a strong mechanical logic. It's just that I'm not familiar with all the intricate processes of work holding and other intricacies when it comes to the machinist world. Had I known a few hours ago what I know now, regarding a 'milling attachment', and that such a thing even existed I would have never even entertained the thought of a mill/lathe combo. Between the beautiful milling attachment and horizontal mill attachments, I am definitely settled in my change of heart with just purchasing a lathe.

I really do appreciate all the great responses. It's all been a warm welcome and definitely been a huge help. If I have missed someone in responding accordingly, please know that I've read all the info shared. Such a great help! I apologize for posting a topic which is consistently posted already. I guess I should have taken the time to read through some of the older posts before doing so. I didn't realize this was such a common theme.

(changing gears for a second) It will all come together in time - I'm not too concerned about it but it's fine details like 'a machined acme nut' for the milling attachment --which was mentioned in the MLA link above in Post #14-- that causes me to ask questions early on. I'm familiar with acme threads as an end-user only and I'm assuming they're not that easy to cut. Thus the logic behind buying one for $32 as opposed to just making one. It's quirky little details like that which stump my toe.

Once again gentlemen, thank you so much for your time and taking the effort to drive home some solid logic. I greatly appreciate everyone aboard.
 
if you want a mill buy a mill a clausing 8520 would be a good start. I would take a old atlas 6x18 lathe over any of the mini lathes out there now. the problem with a combination machine is the constant takedown and setup. you want to turn and the last job was a mill job. you would soon lose interest.
 
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