Scoping a Monarch 10ee

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cpd62

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I've determined that a Monarch 10ee will be the perfect fit for what I want to do and for my shop space. I found a reputable dealer who buys-sells and restores. He'll sell as is and do any number of repairs all the way up to full restorations.

He has 3 10ee's. The one that is most ready is a 1940's round dial that has been modified to a baldor 3hp motor with a Mitsubishi vari-drive so it can easily be converted to single phase power. I had the chance to look it over today. It runs very smoothly. It had a collet closer which has a bit of wobble, but probably just needs some indicating and adjustment. I'm new to this and have never done it, but it didn;t seem to tough. The gears looked great. It also had a taper attachment

The compound and cross-slide probably needed a cleaning. The Gibs slide probably needs to be broken down and cleaned. Will this require any special tools or knowledge. Is it worth paying someone to do this?

I asked him to price out the basic machine and give me quotes for it with the 5C collet closer, and some clean up on the Gibs.

Any thoughts on what I should expect as a reasonable price for this? I'm new to metal lathe work and it looks like a collet closer can add at least $800. Is it worth it. I'd like to work with small stuff, building surgical instrument prototypes (hobby work).

Thanks
Christian
 
Christian, I like your style. A 10EE is not what most hobbyists think of as a starter lathe. If you've done your homework and that's the lathe you want, then go for it. A collet closer would add something to the cost but 800 more sounds a bit excessive. I could be wrong. I've never seen the monarch closer. Mine has the drawbar setup. I've had a closer on a lathe in the past and I prefer the drawbar. When you want to use collets, it's quick to install it, and when your using a chuck it's completely out of the way. The closer I had wobbled too. It doesn't affect the precision at the nose. I'm not sure what your referring to when you say the "gib slide" needs to be taken apart. You can take the cross slide and compound apart with basic tools. For that matter you can remove the whole carriage with basic tools. Like any used lathe, you want to look for wear on the ways and saddle. For me the fact that the drive has been changed wouldn't be a plus. I like the way the original drive performs. I would be curious what kind of prices he's asking for his machines.

Chuck
 
Thanks for the advice on the collet closer. He hasn't put a price together yet. Sounds like it might be best to stick with asic tooling and add as needed Is a drawbar standard or would I have to look for that separately. I'm coming from a beginner's perspective so any advice is helpful.
I wasn't familiar with the term "gib" either but watched a video on YouTube by "mrpete" and he explained it as the mechanism that the cross slide and compound slide on.

I know there are a lot of purists on the forum who really speak highly of the original drive systems. The modified drive that this one has really has a nice smooth sound and feel to it. I don't have much to compare to. It was nice to see the machine in person. Looks like I wouldn't outgrow it. Also it will be an easy conversion to single phase.
 
Christian, I don't know what was standard on the 10EE. I would imagine you could buy it set up different ways. A drawbar in not that hard to make. You would have to find a D1-3 5c adapter for it. That would be pricey I'm sure. When buying a used machine it's usually best to find one that has the basic attachments that you want and pay a little more for it as a package going in. When you start buying that stuff piecemeal it gets very costly. That's why people buy them and part them out. A worn machine is worth more in parts than as a whole. The gibs your talking about are real easy to adjust. They're tapered with an adjusting screw on each end. You tighten or loosen the fit by adjusting the screws. Monarch drive systems are not my strong point, but I have learned a few basic things about them since owning one. The original drive is a very smooth system. The lathe will produce a very nice surface finish running in belt drive just like the Hardinge HVLH. It does well in gear drive too. The variable drive that has been installed on the machine you're looking at probably does well also. Changing that drive over to single phase would just degrade the system.

Chuck
 
Christian,

I would stay away from the 3.5HP VFD, I think that you'll find it under-powered. Monarch tried 5HP VFD drives and they weren't very satisfactory, so they went to 7.5HP motors. One of the nice features of the DC drives is the smooth, slow speeds for threading.

Running a motor/generator (MG) 10EE from single phase power is not a big deal. You can go the static converter route for under $100 and the rotary phase converter route for about $200. The tube drive machines can run directly from single-phase power. If either type of drive is not running they can be challenging to get running if you're not electrically savvy. I’ve helped a lot of people get MG machines running, the only requirement there is that you have patience. It's also possible to drive the DC spindle motor from single phase using an after market DC controller for as little as $200, but that depends on what you have and what your requirements are.

10EEs have flame hardened ways, so the ways can look nice but the machine can still have a lot of wear on the underside of the saddle. A good indication of wear is the clearance between the saddle and the front flat way for the tailstock; a machine in good condition will have over 0.005" clearance.

Lever collet closers are very nice if you are doing a run of parts, but for one-offs a 5C or 2J collet chuck will be enough. 2J collets are very nice and have the same through capacity as the 10EE spindle (1-3/8"). If you can find a Sjogren 2J collet chuck you'll be set. You can pick one up on eBay for $200 or so, if you’re patient.

CDCO Machinery (http://www.cdcotools.com) has a 5C collet chuck and D1-3 back-plate for under $200. I have one of the back-plates and some tool holders and am happy with them. I have not seen the collet chuck, but I have heard good things about it and I plan to buy one at some point.

You can completely service the saddle, taper attachment and apron without special tools. It's an extremely good idea to plan on doing this on any 10EE that you buy, for various reasons. The cross-slide, compound and taper attachment need to be taken apart and cleaned from time to time and you may as well start when you first get the machine. (IMHO, this is true of any lathe.)

Cal
 
I hope my attempt at humor did not offend anyone. :whiteflag:

It looks like you are getting some good information, best of luck. I would be in hog heaven if I could get a good 10EE.

Bob W.
 
Cal,
Thanks for the advice. The cdco website looks like it will be a good source. He hasn't gotten back to me with a quote yet. How much is reasonable for the 5C collet closer? He is going to price it with and without.

Thanks,
Christian
 
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