Roller Bearing blade guides for Rockwell 28-365 20" Vertical Wood&Metal Bandsaw

[GeneT45]

I thought I'd broken my variable speed bandsaw a few days ago - but apparently just kicked it into neutral. Having already found a problem with one of the blade guides I thought I'd take care of some nuisance bits. I need to make a new knob / handle for the hi/lo speed range lever, a new throat plate, a knob and latch mechanism for the lower wheel door, and of course, fix the guides. Which brings me to my question: Are roller guides, like those sold by Carter, worth it on a metal cutting saw? I currently have steel blade guides with a bearing in the back (the back of the blade bears on the flat portion of the bearing). If it's worth it, what sort of advantage should I expect?

TIA,

GsT

 

[pontiac428]

My HF horizontal has rollers and my Enco vertical has block guides. After many years, I can't say that I have a preference one way or the other. I'm usually someone who enjoys splitting hairs on these discussions, but I can't see much difference, advantage, or disadvantage between the two systems. Friction is negligible either way. Maybe there is a slight deflection reduction in the block guide over the bearings, and bearings really only offer some small amount of reduced friction that is tiny in comparison to cutting loads. Whether you set your guide/guard height at all when cutting will make more difference in the cut.

It's funny, I want to love bearings for this, but they pick up saw chips that have to pass between the guide bearing race and the blade, and that requires clearance greater than the blade-scraping blocks require, negating any benefit they may have to saw tracking. But all in all, the differences are tiny. In my experience, anyway. My band saws are hobby grade imports, so I might be missing the point.

 

[GeneT45]

My HF horizontal has rollers and my Enco vertical has block guides. After many years, I can't say that I have a preference one way or the other. I'm usually someone who enjoys splitting hairs on these discussions, but I can't see much difference, advantage, or disadvantage between the two systems. Friction is negligible either way. Maybe there is a slight deflection reduction in the block guide over the bearings, and bearings really only offer some small amount of reduced friction that is tiny in comparison to cutting loads. Whether you set your guide/guard height at all when cutting will make more difference in the cut.

It's funny, I want to love bearings for this, but they pick up saw chips that have to pass between the guide bearing race and the blade, and that requires clearance greater than the blade-scraping blocks require, negating any benefit they may have to saw tracking. But all in all, the differences are tiny. In my experience, anyway. My band saws are hobby grade imports, so I might be missing the point.

That's kind of where my mind is at. In spite of my desire to always improve my tools, I'm just not sure that roller bearings bring much to the table. My Ellis horizontal has ball bearings, but it's never had anything else, so I may not know the difference. Still, I suspect you're right - the steel guides are probably good enough.

Thanks!

GsT

 

[talvare]

Don't know if I can add much value to the conversation, but I'll just give my observations. I have one of the import horizontal band saws with the bearing blade guides that I've had for over 40 years. It has performed just fine for all of these years, but as pontiac428 noted, I do have to clean the chips off of the bearing/blade contact surfaces pretty frequently. A few years ago I bought an old WWII era 18" Grob vertical band saw that I completely rebuilt. It had the bronze block blade guides and I contemplated purchasing one of the roller bearing blade guide kits for it, but after reading many mixed reviews about the pros and cons, I decided to stick with the block guides. So far, I've been quite satisfied with the bronze guides and have never noticed any chip build-up in the guides or any noticeable blade deflection.

Ted

 

[pontiac428]

I think one factor that matters with this discussion is, at least in my case, I am focused on metal cutting band saws, and I have nothing to say about wood or wood tools. The blade speeds that metal saws see are the basis for my comparison between the two guide types. I might have something different to say at wood cutting speeds. So here is my caveat.

 

[GeneT45]

I think one factor that matters with this discussion is, at least in my case, I am focused on metal cutting band saws, and I have nothing to say about wood or wood tools. The blade speeds that metal saws see are the basis for my comparison between the two guide types. I might have something different to say at wood cutting speeds. So here is my caveat.

Agreed. I think if I were cutting wood, especially re-sawing, it'd be a no-brainer, but I question the value as a metal roughing tool - hence my question.

Thank you both for well-considered answers.

GsT

 

[projectnut]

My Startrite horizontal bandsaw uses both roller bearing and carbide blade guides. The roller bearings are positioned at the top edge of the blade while the carbide blocks are positioned just above the cutting edge. The bearings are supposed to minimize the blade twist while the carbide inserts actually position the teeth for the cut.

I've had the saw close to 25 years and it gets used on an almost daily basis. When I got it, I changed out the bearing guides because they were full of dried coolant. As far as I know the carbide guides are the originals. Between the two sets of guides the saw is accurate to within less than +/- .005". Blades last on the average of 2-3 years cutting everything from aluminum to tool steel.

 

[bill70j]

Agreed. I think if I were cutting wood, especially re-sawing, it'd be a no-brainer, but I question the value as a metal roughing tool - hence my question.

Thank you both for well-considered answers.

GsT

I replaced the cool blocks on my Sears Taiwanese 14" wood cutting band saw with Carter-style bearing guides and it did make a marked improvement in resawing.

Don't have a large metal bandsaw so can't comment of what improvement if any that change would have.

But since you're building other parts for your variable speed saw, why not just add the bearing guides to the list. Can only help, and they're straightforward to make. (At least they were in my case.)

 

[GeneT45]

Well, crap. Here's my lower blade guide, and I'm having a heckuva time finding a replacement bearing...

GsT

 

[GeneT45]

I should have posted a pic of the complete guide. Here's the top guide, which is identical, except for mounting.

GsT