PM-30MV Casting Imperfections - Is this ok?

[fursphere]

Had to remove the table on my mill to tighten up the Y axis lead screw nut. Thread is here if you're curious

When I got the table off, I found these casting imperfections in the ways on the saddle. I received the machine in Feb 2021, and honestly has barely been used due to me just not having time for it and moving to a new home in May. I'm just now starting to get into it more. I'm rather new to this stuff - I've done a little machine work in the past, but I've never torn a machine down. So I don't know if this is 'acceptable' or something I should be contacting Precision Mathews about and treating it as defective. It doesn't seem like its a huge issue, just a casting defect? But I'm curious what you all think anyway. The table looks fine top and bottom, its just the saddle that seems to be in question.

 

[yota]

pitiful.

 

[benmychree]

I would not be happy to see such a sight; the voids could be filled with epoxy or solder peened in and finished off, I'd like to hear from Richard King as to what he thinks.

 

[Cletus]

Not pretty at all, but I doubt the pitting in areas would pose any problems. I would however be concerned about bumps and high-spots. That IMHO should not have passed QC inspection however. Inform PM and get their take on it, maybe they may offer a resolution?

 

[Richard King 2]

I won't comment inside a sponsored forum. We pay to have the privilege to answer our product questions, help folks and advertise our products. Ask inside the reconditioning forum and I will give my opinion. If PM owner asked me to comment here I would, if not sorry.

 

[fursphere]

I would not be happy to see such a sight; the voids could be filled with epoxy or solder peened in and finished off, I'd like to hear from Richard King as to what he thinks.

I was thinking something similar.

Not pretty at all, but I doubt the pitting in areas would pose any problems. I would however be concerned about bumps and high-spots. That IMHO should not have passed QC inspection however. Inform PM and get their take on it, maybe they may offer a resolution?

I haven't put a test indicator on it yet, but it doesn't feel like it has any high spots. I suspect the casting just had some voids in it, and the OEM just machined right through them. I've sent an email off to PM support to get their opinion. I'm with you - how did this get through QC? Removing the table on every single mill they receive and ship would be a lot of labor - but how else would you find stuff like this?

I won't comment inside a sponsored forum. We pay to have the privilege to answer our product questions, help folks and advertise our products. Ask inside the reconditioning forum and I will give my opinion. If PM owner asked me to comment here I would, if not sorry.

Understood. Thanks

 

[7milesup]

I would consider that unacceptable. Granted, it may not have much affect on the actual operation of the mill, but to get a brand new machine from a well known company such as PM would be impermissible. As you mentioned, for PM to remove every table would be unreasonable but it still should fall on PM to put some pressure on their supplier/factory.

 

[RJSakowski]

This would be a failure of in-process Q.C. Or it would demonstrate that the manufacturer has low standards for quality. Hidden defects are virtually impossible to detect on an assembled machine.

The correct action would be to report discovered defects to the vendor and ask for compensation. This additional burden on the vendor would eventually move the vendor to demanding better in-process Q.C. If enough complaints come in, the manufacturer would take appropriate corrective action to prevent future problems. Money talks.

The is the function of a good quality system like ISO9000. If CE marking a product requires a manufacturer to have a quality system like ISO9000 in place, there is a requirement for continuous quality improvement which usually includes a process for reviewing customer feedback that includes closure for a complaint. This means that a manufacturer can't just ignore complaints. Unfortunately, CE marking isn't taken seriously in the US.

The defect in question wouldn't compromise proper functioning of the machine, IMO, but it is annoying to know that it is there. From the manufacturer's point of view, they have a lot invested in the part when they discover the defect and they would have a strong tendency to just ignore it. Again, money talks. If there was some penalty for approving the part as is, they might decide the other way.

 

[B2]

I agree, it is very disappointing. However, provided they(ways) are hard, straight, and have been machined correctly, then the missing material from the casting holes will probably not effect your performance. I have the PM940 also a China machine and I do not see these, but have seen other things that I consider poorly done or poorly designed. I guess we get what we pay for. I also have the PM1440GT from Taiwan and it is far better made.

By the way, scraping always bothers me. They machine a nice surface and then scrape all the patterns into the surface. It is no longer as uniform, but does carry oil. My guess is that the high points wear down a bit and they carry all the load as they are the bearing points. So the voids you have will just be carrying oil like the deeper scrape marks.

 

[qualitymachinetools]

I won't comment inside a sponsored forum. We pay to have the privilege to answer our product questions, help folks and advertise our products. Ask inside the reconditioning forum and I will give my opinion. If PM owner asked me to comment here I would, if not sorry.

Rich, comment away. I am not sponsoring to hide anything, just to keep the forum going.


Since its on the edge, and where it is, in MY opinion its never going to hurt anything. Should it be like that? I sure wish it wasn't. Will it ever affect anything at all? No. But, OP let us know what you want. If it ever did, we would certainly handle it. I just noted on your invoice that this particular part of the machine has a lifetime warranty should that imperfection cause any problems, and sent that to you so you have it in writing.

Also noticed that this one was a discounted sample machine, but I think the original PM-30MV part is the same. We would have gone over this one well and nobody saw that, but we were working with the head, not the table.

That would pass the QC in China if it works right, these are not air plane parts. (I sure would not want to ride on a plane made in China though, thats for sure!)

I've worked with castings made in the US over the years before and it was common practice to fill in voids. They happen a lot more than people realize.

You guys can talk about it all you like, but the OP just let us know what you want and they will get it taken care of. Not as simple as just sending a new part though, they are each scraped in and fit.