Phase II QCTP. Not what I expected.

[7milesup]

Hi guys. I have a PM1022 lathe with the "standard" chinese QCTP. I felt it had a lot of slop in the mechanism, including the round part that the handle attaches to. My brother has an older Jet lathe (40"?) with a Phase II QCTP on it. It is nice and tight with basically no slop. The Phase II that I got is absolutely no better than the craptastic Chinese one that came on the lathe from PM. The only thing that would be better about the Phase II is the center mounting bolt is much more substantial than the mounting system on the originial, but I don't need to pay $225 just for a bigger mounting bolt. It was purchased through Amazon from Travers tool. Didn't really want to spend $300+ on just a QTCP but it looks like that is what one must do to get a decent QCTP.

 

[ezduzit]

Very disappointed in the Phase II holder I bought.

 

[7milesup]

Maybe their QC is going in the tank?

 

[Nogoingback]

When I got my Phase II, it was kind of gritty feeling when I turned the handle. In the end I pulled it apart and found
almost no lubrication and grunge from manufacturing inside. After cleaning it up and lubing it, it worked fine.
Make sure the "nut" at the top is tight as well: mine was barely snug. I know you shouldn't need to do these
things after buying a new tool, but they might help you sort things out. Mine has been fine since I did them.

 

[Bob Korves]

Chinese stuff often has poor quality control (QC). Whatever comes off the machines goes into the box unless there are significant visual flaws. That is part of the reason it is cheaper than an Aloris. I also have a BXA Phase II tool post set, and it is mediocre -- not awful, not great. If I or you would have ordered a second one, it may have been just fine. Mine has worn in and I have adjusted and cleaned it and have become used to it over time, and it now works fine for me. My approach nowadays is to never pay extra for the so called "premium" inexpensive Chinese products. You are kidding yourself. However, some really high quality tooling is made in China, and it gets proper QC and QA. You also pay a lot more for that. Currently, I would buy the Bostar from CDCO, which is the cheapest one out there that I know of. Why pay more when you are rolling the dice?

Or, buy an Aloris...

 

[Technical Ted]

The first one I bought was a Phase II. The second was one from AllIndustrialSupply. The later was much tighter and better feeling and from my experience I would suggest that one.

YMMV,
Ted

 

[Bob Korves]

ROR! (raff out roud)

The Chinese send rockets to the moon. They do not make the hardware with cheap tool posts. Much of the manufacturing equipment used in USA and other 1st world countries is now made in China. It is not the same stuff that we hobby machinists are buying from Shars, CDCO, All Industrial, and many other suppliers. We seem to have reached a conundrum where we want ever cheaper stuff, and the importers and manufacturers are filling that need, yet we whine when we get the mediocre or worse products that are unavoidable when pricing is the all important consideration. The importer/exporter, the manufacturer, the retail seller, and us as buyers are all parts of this loop. We love the cheap stuff, but hate the poor quality of it. *TANSTAAFL. Markets respond when buyers no longer purchase their products, and feed the monster when they do. An example of really good products from China that hobbyists purchase is Glacern work holding products: https://www.glacern.com/ which are made from world wide sources -- including China.

*There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch

 

[Firstgear]

The only way to get really good tooling out of China is when a foreign company (US, Germany etc)provide the design and has QC boots on the ground to drive quality. The Chinese when left to be a totally Chinese company often has employees where they think “good enough”. That means it may or may not be 100% to specifications.

When we ***** about something that isn’t quite right, in their mind “it’s good enough”. Back 50 years ago we used to ***** about the Japanese quality...cars, toys, etc. it was good enough then. China hasn’t gone through the make it right the first time change in mentality. Boots on the ground is the only way to get it.

 

[COMachinist]

I have found it depends where you buy it counterfeiting is not a crime over there. China’s industry are owned by the Commie gov. So they are all phase II no mater who makes them. Most of the factorys are owned by the Army and the stuff from them is junk. The ones that work with the supplyer/resellers tend to be better quality. The BXA I got from PM with my PM-12x36t was junk, it now has my Alais BXA. Untill you have a really top quality QCTP you will always have problems with registration, finish quality and repeatable tool changes. I know there are some China QCTP that do a passable job, but for the most part they don’t. Least ways the the 4 I have in the junk pile don’t, by buying top quality I only cry once.
Good luck
CH

 

[mikey]

I only have Aloris and Dorian tool posts and have used them extensively and find no major issues with them. They are expensive but they require no mods or cleaning or anything to make them work as they should. My Aloris is a current model but the Dorian is an older one, made in the day when Dorian cared about quality control. @ddickey can tell you a different story, though. Seems like Dorian is letting things slide recently.

I only jumped in here to express the opinion that tool posts are like milling vices. Both are foundational tools that make a difference in how the machine performs. Hobby guys like cheap and given how much machine tools cost, I can't fault anyone for that. However, some tools need to perform well and typically the cheap versions do not do that as well as we would like. On a lathe, I think your lathe chucks, drill chuck and tool post should be the best quality you can find. On the mill, you need a good milling vise, drill chuck and collet tool holder. These are foundational tools that impact on all the work these machines do.

Going cheap seems to be the norm in the hobby machining world but for some tools, maybe not the best idea.