Monarch 10EE - what to do?

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Phayb

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Hello out there. I have a question for those knowledgeable in the ways of the 10EE lathes. I came across an old round dial 10EE - my guess is around 1942-ish. The only tag I found (about 1/2" x 2") is stamped 4512 and the round dial has a 'T' shaped handle. By looking at photos, it looks to be from that era. The machine is a cosmetic disaster but the ways look to be in really good shape under the grime and surface rust after a quick rub and check with my finger nail. It's been sitting in a barn for a couple of years. The original drive is long gone. The motor driving it is a DC unit with a large quick disconnect you would see on forklift batteries. The headstock side end covers, top and bottom, are missing (the previous owner set them aside to get access for the cobbled up drive set-up and they are now lost somewhere). There is no low range gearbox either. It comes with a bunch of chucks and faceplates. I'm on the fence as to what to do (I wouldn't be scared to tackle the restoration). My original plan is to get one replacement lathe for my 2 Southbends (a 9A with collets and taper attachment and a Heavy 10) for two reasons - floor space and working height. I'm 6'-1" with long-ish legs and the Southbend lathes are about 6" too low for me to work on comfortably (at least now they are). My only concern with the 10EE is the covers and gearbox...not sure I can find replacements. I can make an adapter for a gearbox and I thought I could make aluminum covers if it came to it. I use my lathes infrequently for little projects in my shop - mostly car related projects.

Thoughts? Comments?

Fabio
 
I would measure wear on the ways like this:

Super lathe but complex, hope youre really good with electrics(10ee stands for electrical engineer:cool:)
 
If you want a working lathe, put 6x6 risers under your SBs and move on.

What's the seller asking for the 10EE?

If you want a new major project get the 10EE. The Monarch has a well respected reputation and can be a really nice small lathe. Eventually you may be able to buy or build whatever you want to construct your own Frankenlathe. Maybe, if the price is right, buy it, clean it up and part it out. Put the profit toward a more attractive project?
 
The 10EE is one of the finest lathes ever built. A wore out is better than 90% of the lathes out there.

new covers will cost ya. I'd run without them or fab some up out of sheet metal.

The drive would be dead on that old lathe anyway, so you have not lost much.

Not having the backgear means you will have to have a bigger spindle motor to get torque at low speed. My suggestion, find a used 10 hp three phase motor and get a 10 or 15 hp VFD from one of the great online vendors of these. My favorite happens to automation direct. But that is only because they have treated me so good over the years. many other vendors. This is a quick and easy job. be glad to help if you have not done this sort of thing before.

You could stop here, or you can go clear through it for a complete rebuild. just doing the above will likely make it run for years.
 
The chances of finding the missing covers or the back-gear unit are close to zero.

If you look at the right end of the ways, in front of the tailstock (between the tailstock and front Vee way) you'll find the serial number stamped. The T-handle means that it's an older round-dial 10EE; probably built before mid-1942. I would need to see a photo of the tailstock end of the base to see if it originally had an inline motor/generator (MG) or the newer, piggyback model.

Don't let anyone tell you that the "old" 10EE MG drives aren't extremely good drives. If you spend a lot of time on a VFD conversion, you might end up with a drive that's about as good as the original DC motor drive. The fact that so many original MG drives are still service after two thirds of a century of use speaks to how robust they are. Ten years from now, the odds are that at least one of the chips needed to repair a given VFD drive will not longer be available, but you'll still be able to repair every part of an MG drive--in your own shop if you're clever enough. Most of the MG drives that get torn out probably just needed brushes or had a loose wire or a bad component that was easily repaired/replaced.

I know of two MGs that are available for the asking, if you want to go that route. Assuming that the existing DC motor is already in place and belted up to the spindle, an electronic DC motor controller is an option. KB Electronics makes a drive that sells for about $165 that will run the motor. It doesn't do field-weakening, so you can't get full speed out of the motor, but if you still have the large rheostats from the MG drive, there's a way around that.

We need to see some pictures of the DC motor and anything else in the compartment under the headstock.
 
You can buy several VFD's for the price of the Thyratron C16J vacuum tube, believe a 10ee needs 2.
 
If you use your lathes infrequently, than you may be better off with a new lathe or a used one in better condition. Parts for the 10EE usually command a high price, and the chance of getting a ggear box are next to nil at a reasonable price (let alone getting it shipped to Canada). Without the gearbox you could drop in a 10Hp motor, but you would need a 20Hp VFD if running off of single phase. This is because the diode bridge is meant to carry current through all three legs. Thus, the rule of thumb for sizing the single phase input on a three-phase drive is to use a VFD rated for 2 times the FLA of the motor. For example if your 3 phase motor is a 10 HP with a FLA of 28 amps, then you would need to select a VFD with an output amp rating of 56 amps which ends up being around 20 HP, possible get by with 15 Hp. You probably would need a 100A service to run the VFD on single phase. If you have a 15 Hp or larger RPC you could run a 10Hp VFD off of the RPC. A lot of power and cost for a lack of gearbox fix. With a gearbox you would do fine with a 5Hp motor and there are single phase 5Hp input VFDs, but a decent one will still run you around $600 and the other costs you will probably be into it for 1K US for the electrics/switches.

If all the pieces were there and you knew everything worked, then worth the trouble, otherwise would pass.
 
If you buy it right and decide it's not something you want to invest the time in, you can easily recoup your money just selling a few of the parts.
 
I looked at several 10ee's, both seemed very nice, $12k. Looked at several colchesters. Had a harrison boxster.but I wanted to spend my time making things not fixing a lathe, and always there is wear on the ways of a lathe 50 plus years old.
Ended buying a PM 1340 GT which is precise,a good size and installing an hitachi vfd. Good support here for that combination.
Pick your poison.
 
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