Little machine shop universal kit

Archer60x

Archer60x

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Hello, i am just getting into milling and got a PM 728VT.

I like the idea of using the tablet and TouchDRO so i am going to go that route.

I was looking at this little machine shop kit that is magnetic scales.

It only had 3 inputs on the transceiver.

Once i get more experienced with milling can i replace the transceiver that comes with the kit with the TouchDRO Adapter that has 4?

A touch probe is probably what i want for the 4th input.

Thanks!
Chad
 
Archer60x said:
Hello, i am just getting into milling and got a PM 728VT.

I like the idea of using the tablet and TouchDRO so i am going to go that route.

I was looking at this little machine shop kit that is magnetic scales.

It only had 3 inputs on the transceiver.

Once i get more experienced with milling can i replace the transceiver that comes with the kit with the TouchDRO Adapter that has 4?

A touch probe is probably what i want for the 4th input.

Thanks!
Chad
Click to expand...
Hi Chad,
TouchDRO will work with those scales, so you can upgrade the adapter later.
That said, those scales have really bad cyclic error, on the order of +/-0.005" if you get lucky. Then, the adapter is a knockoff of the very first generation TouchDRO kit (circa 2014).
The 3-axis kit from LMS is $540-ish.

You paid good money for an "Ultra Precision" mill, and it has more than enough space for full-size glass scales. For that much money you can get a set of Ditron or Aikron glass scales with a real TouchDRO adapter. That setup will be better in pretty much every regard.

There is a lot of hype around magnetic scales, but they are a niche product that was designed for specific application (high vibration and/or high pressure flood coolant).
Unless you get into brand-name stuff, magnetic scales will be significantly less accurate than glass scales. The cheapest magnetic scales that approach 5um glass scales in accuracy are Electronica/EMS 1um scales, and those start around $250/piece and go up from there. Good stuff (Sony, Newall, etc.) costs $$$$. So far I haven't come across a Chinese magnetic scales that had true resolution of 5um.

Regards
Yuriy
 
Thanks Yuriy!

I have so much to learn and I appreciate your honest feedback.

I will keep looking for a vendor.

Thank you so much for taking the time to help me.

Chad
 
Another question if you dont mind. I think i am going to modify my PM order and add their DRO.

$900 for already installed.

MagXact MX-100M Magnetic 3 Axis Mill DRO – 10x20x16 Inch Scales – Precision Matthews Machinery Co.

www.precisionmatthews.com www.precisionmatthews.com

At this point my brain is over loaded with information i dont trust the vendors and i just want a good solution. So i hope i can trust the PM scales.

The scales in this kit i assume will be compatible with TouchDRO? Have you heard how accurate they are?

Thanks!
 
Pending Yuri response, I don't think PM has any magic sauce for scales. You may be aware that Blondihack has a 728VT with magxact DRO from PM. She has some initial thoughts in her set-up video.

She runs TouchDRO on her lathe and has another video on that set-up. She seems very enthusiastic about that.

My thoughts: I bought a PM-833TV a few months back. rather than get bogged down selecting, buying,installing DRO bits, I bought it with the PM "3 axis Mill DRO" installed with glass scales. The strategy here remains that I wanted turn-key scales installed and the LCD display should be fine, for now. Upgrade to TouchDRO is a highly likely as I really like what I am seeing here in terms of very creative and enabling TouchDRO software that you won't find anywhere else. When the upgrade happens I'll move the PM LCD display over to my 13x40 lathe. Still need to buy/install glass scales for the lathe. (I am liking the 1 um glass scale that PM is offering for lathe cross slides). If I find my lathe operation yearning for TouchDRO capabilities, I'll likely upgrade that as well.

Why glass scales on my new mill? The 5um glass scales easily allow setting any axis position to 0.0005" precision. I can get 0.0003" if I want it. The limitation is mainly the thread pitch on the axis and the VERY tiny handle movement required to bump the axis by a couple of ten-thousands. The scale resolution does not introduce loss of indicated precision greater than 0.0002". At that precision and below the display numbers are random. BUT IT DOES NOT MATTER as I cannot move the handles so finely as to set such a value with any reliability.

My suggestion: Put glass scales on the mill. The extra few-hundred dollars that mag scales cost gets you no benefit. The Precision Matthews product is very nice. I have had no problems with it. Their factory installation is top notch.
 
Thanks Allen! I looked at the glass scales on PM and they do not have the 10 16 20 sizes as a package.

So they only seem to offer the magnetic scales with the PM728VT. I have to go with the easy button i am afraid as i am too new to this. I did read someone said the PM magnetic scales appeared to be a version offered by DRO Pros' i believe was the name.

Also Blondihacks is the entire reason i bought the PM728VT. She rocks! :) I will catch up on here videos about the TouchDRO.

I really appreciate the information and help! There is so much to read i am skimming some so i apologize as i am sure you guys have answered these questions like a thousand times already.

Chad
 
MagXact scales are re-branded Electronica S1 scales. They are pretty good, and $900 is a decent price (if you bough the same scales from DroPros, you'd be paying more than that just for the scales).
Electronica states +/-0.010mm accuracy (https://www.machine-dro.co.uk/media/downloads/dro-el-s1_techincal.pdf), so that is 20um/0.008". In my experience with the samples I tested, this number is correct, as long as you set up the scale perfectly. I.e. 0.5" mm above the tape, straight and parallel. If you set it up so the "green light turns on", you will have about double that spread.

I would not recommend the fancy DRO display from PM, though. The lower-end model (I think the one that sells for $900) is pretty decent for what it is. The model with the LCD is slow and I've heard of people having issues with switches not responding or double-tapping randomly.

Upgrading this set to TouchDRO is a straight plug-and-play (one of the pre-wired options has the compatible pinout).

That said, why are you so set on magnetic scales? Are you concerned about space?

Regards
Yuriy
 
Archer60x said:
Another question if you dont mind. I think i am going to modify my PM order and add their DRO.

$900 for already installed.

MagXact MX-100M Magnetic 3 Axis Mill DRO – 10x20x16 Inch Scales – Precision Matthews Machinery Co.

www.precisionmatthews.com www.precisionmatthews.com

At this point my brain is over loaded with information i dont trust the vendors and i just want a good solution. So i hope i can trust the PM scales.

The scales in this kit i assume will be compatible with TouchDRO? Have you heard how accurate they are?

Thanks!
Click to expand...
The DRO which came on my PM940V are very good and I like the display/controller.
 
On a reasonable sized mill, there should be lots of room for glass scales. They are reasonably priced from AliExpress, especially for the 5um scales. Having installed a roll your own DRO on my lathe, I would think a mill installation would be pretty easy. If it was me, I'd skip adding the DRO from PM and simply install your own glass scales and go straight to TouchDRO.
 
ycroosh said:
MagXact scales are re-branded Electronica S1 scales. They are pretty good, and $900 is a decent price (if you bough the same scales from DroPros, you'd be paying more than that just for the scales).
Electronica states +/-0.010mm accuracy (https://www.machine-dro.co.uk/media/downloads/dro-el-s1_techincal.pdf), so that is 20um/0.008". In my experience with the samples I tested, this number is correct, as long as you set up the scale perfectly. I.e. 0.5" mm above the tape, straight and parallel. If you set it up so the "green light turns on", you will have about double that spread.

I would not recommend the fancy DRO display from PM, though. The lower-end model (I think the one that sells for $900) is pretty decent for what it is. The model with the LCD is slow and I've heard of people having issues with switches not responding or double-tapping randomly.

Upgrading this set to TouchDRO is a straight plug-and-play (one of the pre-wired options has the compatible pinout).

That said, why are you so set on magnetic scales? Are you concerned about space?

Regards
Yuriy
Click to expand...
Trust me i am not set magnetic. :) I just need easy right now and that was the easiest to install. If i had more time to do research i would get glass scales. I just cannot find a vendor that i trust to deliver the scales i need in the three weeks that i would like to have them. I got burnt out doing research the last few days and gave up to the easy button of having PM install them for me. As long as my $900 is not a waste like i almost did then i am fine with this solution. Again, Thank You! You guys are awesome.
 
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