Learning from my mistakes! Or, what did you screw up today?

J

John TV

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The older I get the more I have learned to laugh at my mistakes and the learning moments life sends my way.

Full disclosure here, I have had my 70 year old lathe and milling machine for more than a year now but I have not actually made many items and none that require great accuracy. But no problem, I have watched enough YouTube videos to get my doctorate. So when a good friend asked me to make a shell reloading " holder" for his large hunting rifle I said I would give it a try. He also sent along a price of mystery metal to use for the project.

He gave me an example for a smaller shell holder that gave me the dimensions and from the feel of how the shell fits into the holder there was not a need for extremely close tolerances.

Being the good friend I am I decided I would upgrade the steel a bit to W1 tool steel since I had not had a chance to work with that yet. I knew from videos it would be harder to machine but I have some carbide inserts on the lathe, and I'll take small cuts.

Second, I knew the slot for the "rim" of the shell to slide into was fairly critical and I did not trust my ability to grind an internal grove tool and accurately measure the inside circumference, no problem, I'll just make it in two pieces and fuse them together with TIG. I know, I know, I'll let it cool slowly so it doesn't get too hard. And I'll make a small shaft with both diameters to properly align the two prices.

So I learned a few things making this...

I learned my 70 year old lathe can create " cut off" chatter so loud it will loosen dental fillings.

I learned to crate a finish that looks a lot like knurling with that chattering cut off tool.

I learned hss endmills do not like hardened tool steel from welding. So if you dull one, try a new one so that dulls too.

I learned that I should have annealed the piece rather than using hand grinders, when the end mills crapped out, I re-learned not to forget the "file test" before trying to machine.

I leaned that patience is a virtue and that if I had some it would offset my stubborn Dutch sole that I have to just finish the damn thing no matter what it looks like.

I learned that I am still a complete nuub and will be for some time. YouTube cannot fix that. YouTube has helped a lot but not a replacement for experience.

I also learned that I'm still smiling, I didn't loose any blood and only a little treasure from the lost end mills. Im getting a little better each time i try something new.

I don't even know if the part works yet since I haven't yet delivered it back to my friend. And I just realized that in making such an ugly part even if it doesn't work, I'm not likely to get asked to make it again.

So I just thought I would share this with you other really new to machining folks out there so we can laugh and learn together.
John in Minnesota. IMG_2246.jpgIMG_2251.jpg


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When my friend asked me to make this it was because the factory holder which he had was in two parts and made the whole assembly for this large caliber too tall for his equipment. It was not seating the bullet properly at that height and he was wrecking the casings. I know nothing about firearms so not sure what else is out there or how it works. My friend has helped me with so many projects that I needed to at least try. Don't know that this will work either, but still had fun trying, and learning.


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That’s why they got erasers on pencils ,al least u made something,next one will be better I’m sure no replacement for experience.gets better with time.
 
If you aren't making scrap by trying new things, you will never learn. If you aren't learning, you aren't progressing.

It is far from the worst thing I have ever seen. And much of what is "wrong" with it, is cosmetic. I bet it works just fine, I mean it is a shell holder not a rocket nozzle.

You should try making one out of some softer material, I don't think shell holders are particularly hard or tough after all they are just holding onto a brass disk that can be pulled off with very little effort. That will make it easier to grind a workable tool for cutting the rim slot from the inside as well.
 
John TV said:
The older I get the more I have learned to laugh at my mistakes and the learning moments life sends my way.

Full disclosure here, I have had my 70 year old lathe and milling machine for more than a year now but I have not actually made many items and none that require great accuracy. But no problem, I have watched enough YouTube videos to get my doctorate. So when a good friend asked me to make a shell reloading " holder" for his large hunting rifle I said I would give it a try. He also sent along a price of mystery metal to use for the project.

He gave me an example for a smaller shell holder that gave me the dimensions and from the feel of how the shell fits into the holder there was not a need for extremely close tolerances.

Being the good friend I am I decided I would upgrade the steel a bit to W1 tool steel since I had not had a chance to work with that yet. I knew from videos it would be harder to machine but I have some carbide inserts on the lathe, and I'll take small cuts.

Second, I knew the slot for the "rim" of the shell to slide into was fairly critical and I did not trust my ability to grind an internal grove tool and accurately measure the inside circumference, no problem, I'll just make it in two pieces and fuse them together with TIG. I know, I know, I'll let it cool slowly so it doesn't get too hard. And I'll make a small shaft with both diameters to properly align the two prices.

So I learned a few things making this...

I learned my 70 year old lathe can create " cut off" chatter so loud it will loosen dental fillings.

I learned to crate a finish that looks a lot like knurling with that chattering cut off tool.

I learned hss endmills do not like hardened tool steel from welding. So if you dull one, try a new one so that dulls too.

I learned that I should have annealed the piece rather than using hand grinders, when the end mills crapped out, I re-learned not to forget the "file test" before trying to machine.

I leaned that patience is a virtue and that if I had some it would offset my stubborn Dutch sole that I have to just finish the damn thing no matter what it looks like.

I learned that I am still a complete nuub and will be for some time. YouTube cannot fix that. YouTube has helped a lot but not a replacement for experience.

I also learned that I'm still smiling, I didn't loose any blood and only a little treasure from the lost end mills. Im getting a little better each time i try something new.

I don't even know if the part works yet since I haven't yet delivered it back to my friend. And I just realized that in making such an ugly part even if it doesn't work, I'm not likely to get asked to make it again.

So I just thought I would share this with you other really new to machining folks out there so we can laugh and learn together.
John in Minnesota. View attachment 298757View attachment 298758


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Two thumbs up! I was buying some stuff at a neighborhood garage sale and the guy had a bucket full of 4" castors and wheels that were for or from gurneys. Bought the whole bucket for $20! He asked what I was going to do with them and I mentioned I was getting my Lo buck machine shop together. He perked up and said his all consuming side gig was buying reconditioning and turning reloading equipment. He showed me his garage and he must of had 20 on the bench and boxes of various partial and pieces. He said he was trying to find somebody to machine what looked like the same part. I asked how accurate they need to be and he they just needed to work. That was a red flag to me, vague is not good IMHO. As I looked that the various things needing to be done I could see it was going to be a challenge for a noob like me and as I contemplated what it would take and how long he said " remember I can buy them for $4 new. At that I just handed it back and said it was beyond me. It was beyond me why he was wanting me to do it if he could buy them so cheap but I kept that to myself.

If he was a friend it would have been different but I just felt a resentment on both sides in the making and backed out :)
 
derf said:
Well....you put forth good effort. The sad thing is that you can buy that part for 5-6 dollars.
Click to expand...

I believe that the cost of a part bought versis the time enjoyed using machines you have and learning something is priceless. From the reality side, or lack there of, I think we all enjoy the journey instead of the dollar and cents reality of just running to the store. Heck who else other then a hobby machinist would spend umpteen dollars on tooling and equipment to make a couple dollar part and feel good about it? My hand is up on this one! You learned a lot, you were able to laugh about the things you don't know but you made a part anyway which sounds like a good day to me! :encourage:
 
You did a pretty darn good job of making that shell holder. That is not an easy part to make. My shell holders fit slightly loose in the press ram and the cartridge case fits slightly loose in the shell holder. This is to help the cartridge case to self center in the die. All my shell holders are oem. An offset cartridge pressed into the die can cause all kinds of problems with seating in the chamber and ruin accuracy. Being a non machinist I also learn by my mistakes, but I try come here first to learn from others before I make the mistake if I can. Thanx for sharing with us.

Roy
 
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