Large fly cutter

Janderso

Jeff Anderson
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I decided to make a large cast iron fly cutter.
This is my progress thus far.
After considering many options, I’ve decided to have one 3/8” HSS cutter at a specific angle-to be determined.
After getting this far I think I’ll reduce the diameter. I think there is too much mass for the 7/8 holder.
I’ll have three 1/4-20 cap screws to add rigidity and strength.
Rather than 8”, I’m thinking 6.5”? It’s kind of a visual thing for me.
 

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7/8ths collets are pretty thin . I would hate to see one break with that beast in it . How about a solid end mill holder or a screw on R8 adapter Jeff ? You think that would be better ?

Edit , I remember your mill is not R8 .
 
7/8ths collets are pretty thin . I would hate to see one break with that beast in it . How about a solid end mill holder or a screw on R8 adapter Jeff ? You think that would be better ?

Edit , I remember your mill is not R8 .
Yeah, I wouldn't want that sucker breaking while working.
I'll trim the OD to 6", mill a flat on the arbor to lock in the end mill holder.
You remembered correctly =30 taper so a straight 7/8' shank.
Or, I could remake it with a 1" holder.......?????
Would 1/8" really make that much difference? I'm using 12L 14. Probably not the best choice.
Still learning :)

Well, here goes nothing. It runs very concentric. I use to struggle with the concept.
When I was boring model steam engine cylinders and flywheels I learned how to do it :)
 

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Looking good Jeff,

Following along to watch your progress.
 
This gets into stuff I have yet to experience, and I am soaking it all up. This is because I have ambitions of my own, and I do rely on what you folk know, and I take seriously the caution from @mmcmdl about having it get loose at speed.

Getting theoretical for a minute, the problem (and danger) from an oversized fly cutter is the stored energy from its rotational inertia mass, and this gets out of hand when coupled with unbalance. A huge fly cutter was made by Brandon, who has the "Inheritance Machining" YT channel. He chose to make the disc of aluminium, which, being so light, can twirl the cutter without so much scary anticipation. Big disc fly cutters do, of course, need the adjustable counterbalance, to limit vibration for that fantastic finish.

Then there was the approach by Quinn Dunki. Her design done on Fusion 360 accounts for the rotating masses, and manages to look crazy wobbly when rotating, but does, in fact, cancel the majority of the unbalance.

I am reminded of solution used for a (very) high speed rotating disc for a homopolar generator that was supposed to be spun up, and then deliver a high current pulse, which would rapidly decelerate it, and cause major stresses in the disc. When something is spun up so fast the problem becomes exceeding the tensile strength of the material at the disc edge, and having it break up with the force of an explosive. I have also operated a spin rig for turbine parts intended to spin up stuff to destruction, hence 2" double walls, and in a vacuum. The big heavy discs were made to dangle on a 10mm diameter shaft which was intended to shear off, and let the destruction happen without damaging the spin mechanism

One solution was to make the generator disc thickness taper to thinner towards the diameter edge in a section profile designed to keep the stress constant. The total energy it could be spun up to was greater than if it was made as a cylindrical flywheel. If the aim is to make a (big diameter) fly cutter which is not so threatening if it gets loose, then tapering to the edge may help.

Such stuff is still only theory until one makes it, and, perhaps ideally, also breaks it! I also want a big diameter fly cutter, and I accept it can only do small depth finish cuts, but that's what it's for! Also, I agree you should go with your gut feeling about "visual thing". If it looks wrong, then it may well be inappropriate size. You have a lifetime of accumulated judgement that drives these things. For me, about 150mm might be the limit!

Here is Brandon's project.
 
the problem (and danger) from an oversized fly cutter is the stored energy from its rotational inertia mass, and this gets out of hand when coupled with unbalance.

Agree that internal stress and imbalance should be considered in a flywheel, but a larger flywheel here should reduce force in the machine. The large inertia filters the cutter impact, so it should be easier on the spindle bearings and produce a better finish. That’s why people use these disc-shaped fly cutters, isn’t it (along with larger cutting width)?

I suppose it’s possible that torsional vibration in the spindle becomes significant with a large mass, by the natural frequency dropping with the large mass, so that could be a reason to limit mass.
 
Agree that internal stress and imbalance should be considered in a flywheel, but a larger flywheel here should reduce force in the machine. The large inertia filters the cutter impact, so it should be easier on the spindle bearings and produce a better finish. That’s why people use these disc-shaped fly cutters, isn’t it (along with larger cutting width)?

I suppose it’s possible that torsional vibration in the spindle becomes significant with a large mass, by the natural frequency dropping with the large mass, so that could be a reason to limit mass.
Yes - I do agree about the benefits of flywheel. For the interrupted cuts that are by nature what a fly cutter does, having it made with lots of flywheel stored energy can greatly aid what the spindle can do. It smooths out the irregularity in the the rotation, and requires less from the machine rigidity. There still needs to be enough torque to continue the cut after the impact. @mmcmdl and @Janderso were expressing some probably justified concern about the wisdom of making a inappropriately oversized cutter for the size of the holder.

I would go for the strong steel one, with as much flywheel action as I could contrive, and make the design limit something based on the torque available from the machine in making a quite modest depth of cut. I only have a "small" mill, not quite a toy, but not a mighty Bridgeport. I am always taking it to the limit, and beyond, and I plan to "upgrade" the motor. If it breaks, it breaks! There will be enough polycarbonate between the cutter and me to stay safe.

[Edit: @Janderso . Regarding that extra 1/8". The effect in strengthening the shaft is disproportionate to the simple linear increase of 1/8" in diameter. This is about metal section area. That extra 1/16th inch thickness is all around at the outer diameter, and the force moment it can exert is multiplied by its radius. If you have already invested enough in making it 7/8, then stay with it. If not, and you have the material, then make it stronger. Also, you might go for 6.75" or even 7". Unless you think it risks coming off just by sheer weight spinning, it's hard to think "too much mass" is a bad thing.] :)
 
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Looks like your getting there Jeff. I have a pair of Harley flywheels, and have plans to convert one of them into a fly cutter. Will most likely use an R8 mounting, and plan on using it mostly for surfacing engine blocks and cylinder heads. Mike
 
Looks like your getting there Jeff. I have a pair of Harley flywheels, and have plans to convert one of them into a fly cutter. Will most likely use an R8 mounting, and plan on using it mostly for surfacing engine blocks and cylinder heads. Mike
Sadly - it cannot serve in a real Harley instead? :)
 
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