I have run into both good and bad comments about the Hardinge TM, Some saying it is very rigid while one fellow on the practical Machinist forum stated in the vertical set up it is less rigid than most drill / mills. I'm hoping that he is completely wrong because I just made a deal for one, thinking it was about as good as it gets for a home shop machine.
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How does the Hadinge Tm compare?
- Thread starter rogee
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It's far more rigid than a mill-drill, and I own both.
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Silly to say the TM is less rigid than a mill drill.
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Re: How does the Hardinge Tm compare?
Now you have me curious. So I just put an indicator on the table, against a milling cutter in the head of the UM, pushed sideways with my thumb on the collet and got a couple of tenths deflection. I can get a little more by pushing on the end mill but it's only 1/2", the collet capacity of the Bridgeport head.
If I put the same indicator on the table of the mill-drill, a 20-year-old Grizzly, with the quill retracted, I get .001" deflection with the same sideways pressure.
Seems to me the UM is five times as rigid.
Now you have me curious. So I just put an indicator on the table, against a milling cutter in the head of the UM, pushed sideways with my thumb on the collet and got a couple of tenths deflection. I can get a little more by pushing on the end mill but it's only 1/2", the collet capacity of the Bridgeport head.
If I put the same indicator on the table of the mill-drill, a 20-year-old Grizzly, with the quill retracted, I get .001" deflection with the same sideways pressure.
Seems to me the UM is five times as rigid.
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I absolutely love my TM.
Rigid, and compact. I have a Rusnok Model 70 head on the 2" overarm. Small 50lb unit with 1/2in or 9/16 capacity if I remember. Are you interested in mounting a vertical head on yours? I often mount a cutter in the 5C Hardinge horizontal spindle when I really want to hog chips. But actually never had a problem with the vertical setup. I would eat my hat if it was less rigid than a mill-drill. (Nothing against mill drills, but they are completely differently built).
Also, 13 inches vertical knee travel (which is a dovetail of course- and mill drills only have 3 to 5 inches in the spindle, and "registration" issues beyond that)
13 inches horizontal travel, 12in with power feed. Totally sweet to have power feeds right off the back pulleys to the table. I run both spindles to have table feeds with vertical head cutting too.
Get a VFD for it and you are set to go. LOVE dialing in RPM.
What did yours come with? Mine came with the horizontal cutter spindle, but no overarm bracket, so I'll have to fabricate one someday soon. I have the measurement from this cool guy on Hardinge Yahoo group years ago.
Great luck to you! Post pics when you can! Pick our brains when you are ready!
Bernie
Rigid, and compact. I have a Rusnok Model 70 head on the 2" overarm. Small 50lb unit with 1/2in or 9/16 capacity if I remember. Are you interested in mounting a vertical head on yours? I often mount a cutter in the 5C Hardinge horizontal spindle when I really want to hog chips. But actually never had a problem with the vertical setup. I would eat my hat if it was less rigid than a mill-drill. (Nothing against mill drills, but they are completely differently built).
Also, 13 inches vertical knee travel (which is a dovetail of course- and mill drills only have 3 to 5 inches in the spindle, and "registration" issues beyond that)
13 inches horizontal travel, 12in with power feed. Totally sweet to have power feeds right off the back pulleys to the table. I run both spindles to have table feeds with vertical head cutting too.
Get a VFD for it and you are set to go. LOVE dialing in RPM.
What did yours come with? Mine came with the horizontal cutter spindle, but no overarm bracket, so I'll have to fabricate one someday soon. I have the measurement from this cool guy on Hardinge Yahoo group years ago.
Great luck to you! Post pics when you can! Pick our brains when you are ready!
Bernie
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- Jan 11, 2013
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- 1,834
Nice little piece on it half way down this page:
http://www.lathes.co.uk/cataract miller/index.html
Bernie
http://www.lathes.co.uk/cataract miller/index.html
Bernie
- Joined
- Dec 10, 2010
- Messages
- 195
Years ago, there was no such thing a "vertical mill". Once you re-orient your brain to machining from the back, a horizontal mill is just as versatile and will leave any mill/drill in the dust. I use my TM to make gears and mark graduated collars and dials with a small dividing head with excellent results. I also made 7/8" and 1 1/4" arbors for it so it's even more versatile and it uses the same collets as my lathe.
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- Jul 26, 2011
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How many years ago were there no vertical mills? That would indeed have been a long time ago. True,they were not as common as horizontals in shops,but,go back far enough,and most smaller shops did everything on just their lathe with a milling attachment. I used to have to use my horizontal for vertical milling,looking from the back of the machine. It was not a lot of fun,craning my neck to try and see what I was doing.
Doable,buy not real handy.
Doable,buy not real handy.
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based on the comment "in the vertical set up" I would have to imagine that they're commenting on the original vertical head for the machine. This is indeed much less rigid than the horizontal setup. Its a light duty bolt on. The bridgeport H head is a bit better but honestly about 90% of vertical milling can be done with a 90 degree mounting block and turning your head to the left. It can be a little limiting for plunging if you don't have long end mills.
That said I can run a 2" wide slab mill and flatten in one pass do a finishing pass and have no discernible variation from one side to the next. Mill drill? What limited to a a 1/2" endmill and light cuts. Can't imagine doing that after using the TM.
The amount of metal that one of these machines can remove in a pass is insane if you try to compare it to any other similar sized machine on the market.
After flattening in 2 passes (slab, flip, slab) I switched to a 1/2 inch endmill plunge cut into a 1" thick piece of 4140, once I pierced the blank I turned the autofeed on aggressive and cut my slot. Everything was nice and even. Reverse engineered to a better tool holding collet it would be even better, but thats picking nits.
I had almost talked myself into a larger square column benchtop mill when my TM showed up on a search. I've never been unhappy with my decision. The few limitations are significantly less than the huge benefits