Grizzly Surface plate? Snag or Pass

thebrick53

Registered
Registered
Joined
Sep 17, 2024
Messages
16
I just got my first mill and lathe. I am gearing up to go to work on hobby parts and basic farm equipment parts. I think I should get myself a surface plate. I found a local add for a 9x12x3 plate from grizzly that should do the job till I can afford a bigger plate. But looking at the price compared to a say starrett plate of similar size. The grizzly is less than a 1/4 of the price. Is there really that big of a difference in quality to just get a better one? Or will a clean surface plate from any manufacturer do?
 
By what you describe, it doesn't sound like you need a lot of precision. Having a surface plate is nice, but it's probably not needed in your situation. Keep in mind that a lathe or a mill can't archive the accuracy levels that merit the use of a surface plate. You'd need a surface grinder for that (and a lot of high precision measuring equipment).

If you go for it, definitely get the Grizzly. Or you can fly cut a steel plate if you have one lying around...
 
By what you describe, it doesn't sound like you need a lot of precision. Having a surface plate is nice, but it's probably not needed in your situation. Keep in mind that a lathe or a mill can't archive the accuracy levels that merit the use of a surface plate. You'd need a surface grinder for that (and a lot of high precision measuring equipment).

If you go for it, definitely get the Grizzly. Or you can fly cut a steel plate if you have one lying around...
What a great way to look at things thank you very much!
 
@thebrick53

You didn't mention the price or the accuracy grade of the surface plate. That's information is needed to make a purchase decision.

The dimensions you quoted are pretty small. It would probably be useful as a base for attaching wet-or-dry SC paper for lapping/smoothing parts (until you get that surface grinder).

<snip Keep in mind that a lathe or a mill can't archive the accuracy levels that merit the use of a surface plate. snip>
I would disagree, depending on the specific machines and the operator.
 
@thebrick53

You didn't mention the price or the accuracy grade of the surface plate. That's information is needed to make a purchase decision.

The dimensions you quoted are pretty small. It would probably be useful as a base for attaching wet-or-dry SC paper for lapping/smoothing parts (until you get that surface grinder).


I would disagree, depending on the specific machines and the operator.
The grizzle is 55$ and the is a grade B. Now I did not know grade was a thing till you mentioned it. I see now that this plate would be rated with in .0001 of and inch witch should be more precise then I can ever dream. But having the option to use it as a sanding and lapping area I spaced and it will be wonderful for that. Thank you so much for the comment!
 
You say you got your first mill and lathe but is that the first mill and lathe you've used in your life or first mill and lathe you've personally owned?

Some of us are utter beginners when we first set up our shops, some walk in to our newly created shops with experience already under our belts (I was and still am, a year later, a rank beginner).

If you'rea beginner like me, then at this point in your hobby 'career', right now you don't really need a surface plate. There are plenty of other things you can spend your money on that will be much more useful.

Since nobody else has asked, is there something you want to achieve that you reckon you need a surface plate for or have you just got the impression it's an early requirement for any well set up workshop. Or do you just damn well want one because they're 'machinist cool' (and indeed you're right, they are.;))

As an aside, anybody buying a new Chinese 7x mini lathe probably would find a surface plate very useful early on, but that's more an indictment of the QC of Chinese 7x mini lathes, than a recommendation for early purchase of a surface plate! :grin:

As for small used surface plates generally?

Smaller used plates have a much higher chance of being knackered to a point of uselessnes: there's a minimum size of likely scratch, chip, dent or ding that can matter to any size surface plate, and much less space for any damage on a smaller surface plate, therefore, any damage will have a greater effect on the fundamental usefulness of the plate.

One thing I'd say is that a surface plate really ought to be reasonably flat to within much less than a thou over its surface overall. For high quality used plates, it doesn't matter if there are a few dents or scratches; you can avoid using those areas but generally, you're probably looking for the deviation from flatness to be at most half a thou or really a couple of tenths. Same goes if you're buying new but more so since you paid for a new, pristine surface plate.

The reason is for that is that you want your metrology kit to be about one magnitude of order higher resolution, one magnitude of order more precise, and one magnitude of order more reliable/repeatable (probably okay at half a magnitude of order but whole magnitudes of order are easier to reason about). If you're working to single digit thous (0.001) then your metrology kit should be relied on to give you at least half a tenth (0.0005) resolution, precision and repeatability.

If you really do want a surface plate (and to be fair, if you stick with this hobby for any amount of time, you will end up if not actually needing one, finding a surface plate very useful), then something about 12" by 12" or bigger would be much more useful.

You can pick up bigger cast iron plates used, or there should be a fair number of new import 12"x12" or 16"x12" granite plates available for sensible money.

One thing I noticed on the Amazon.co.uk reviews of the various import surface plates, was that during the pandemic, the quality of these plates dropped significantly, but now seems to have come back up.

BTW, nobody from NASA will be using these import plates but they'll do for hobby purposes for most hobbyists.

If you buy new, it is possible you might be sent a low quality or even damaged one (the packaging has got better in the last couple of years but there's no accounting for delivery services), so try to make sure you can send it back for a replacement, if so.

So, I'd steer you away from this particular one in general and wait until you definitely need one. If you're sure that time is now, then the rest of my post might be helpful.

Oh and if you haven't watched these three videos yet, I 'd definitely recommend watching them:


BlondiHacks has a lot of really good videos (the lathe skills playlist and the mill skills playlist are very good for beginners; I go back and rewatch some of them from time to time) but her "Absolute Beginners Start Here" playlist really is great.

Also this:


is worth watching for her thoughts on the reasons we as beginners but tools we don't need! :grin:
 
Last edited by a moderator:
IMHO, The Grizzly, it will be more than accurate enough for that kind of work, though it might be a bit small for laying out larger parts, as you mentioned "Farm equipment". But I imagine those parts aren't super precision so it might not be an issue...
 
How much accuracy do you require?
I do some precision work but most is +/-.005 and I utilize a poor-mans solution for a surface plate since I pretty much use it for scribing lines. I'm old school and it would would taboo to scribe lines with the edge of my caliper. I went to my Lowe's store and purchased 2- 12X12 ground marble floor tiles. I glued them together to gain some thickness and rigidity. I spent less than $10 and the accuracy across the surface is .001". Not perfect but well enough for what I do. If you opt for this option I would take a reliable straight edge and verify the flatness of the surface. The important part is that the surface is a ground surface with no coating of any kind. The tile I have is ground and polished.
 
@SouthernChap summarized things very well.

I started with a 9 x 12 x 3 B-grade (±0.0001") granite plate from Little Machine shop ($35 and free delivery to Cabin Fever with my 3990 Mini-Mill). I bought a surface plate as I had seen Frank Hoose using one frequently and had used on in the distant past. However, while 9 x 12 is usable with a small to medium surface gauge,

20240924 Surface Gauge.jpeg

you quickly run out of room if you try using a height gauge, which has a larger footprint. I graduated to a 12 x 18 x 3 B-grade from SHARS (Discount Machine on eBay), even though the shipping was significantly more than the plate, and use it semi-regularly, mostly for measuring rather than layout work.

A couple of things to keep in mind:
  • Surface plates are heavy

  • Surface plates are precision measuring instruments, and need to be kept away from dirt/grit/dust (and ideally at a uniform temperature)

  • If properly protected, you can place objects on top of a surface plate, but even the cast iron plates aren't anvils
 
Back
Top