Getting started, need a mill and a lathe.

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Maverick44

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Howdy,

I'm wanting to get set up with some decent tools so that I can get started machining. I'm wanting a mill and a small lathe. I've been a woodworker for years, but this is something completely new to me. I'm not sure what all I actually need. or what features I need. Most of the stuff I want to do is kind of small. I'm an avid reloader and bullet caster, so having the ability to make my own custom molds (and the cutter to make them), along with bullet sizing dies would be great. I'd like a mill capable of cutting decent sized pieces of steel and aluminum, and that would be able to do something like either finish an 80% AR lower, or possibly even make one from scratch (if I ever become that skilled). I'd also like to be able to make things like custom rings, tools for the shop, ect. Mainly, I want something that I can learn on, and that I won't feel is hindering me in a few years.

From what I've looked at so far, a lot of people are suggesting a Grizzly G0704 mill and a G0765 lathe to get started with. Are these good choices for what I'm wanting to do with them? I'd like to keep my budget under $2,500 (maybe $3,000) just to get started.
 
Welcome to the forum, the more research you do the better choices you will make ;)

There are lots of folks on here who share your passion and will be happy to help you, look for the folks with plenty of posts in your area of interest. Check out the projects they've made and how they did them.
Remember, buying the machine is less than half the story. Tooling costs quite a bit so getting a used set-up with extras can save you big time in the long run. New smaller machines will keep you under budget but may not serve your needs in the long run if you want to do larger projects eventually.

Go to the gunsmithing section here:

www.hobby-machinist.com

GUNSMITHING & FIREARMS

Show us your gunsmithing & firearm projects and accessories here. Discuss any topics regarding gunsmithing here.
www.hobby-machinist.com www.hobby-machinist.com

and read as many posts as you can. Then ask questions about what machines, tooling and accessories are best for the type of work you're interested in.

Cheers,

John
 
Welcome to the forum. Lots of great people on here that will share their knowledge and keep you out of too much trouble. Don't be afraid to ask any question no matter how simple you may think it is.

I went through this process of what to buy 3 years ago. My advice is to make a list of everything that you can think of that you would like to make with your lathe and mill. I call it a statement of requirements, SOR for short. In your SOR prioritize the list in order of importance. Then add to the SOR what type of tooling you will need to make what you want to make. The G0704 mill/drill should handle your milling needs but the G0765 lathe is probably on the small size. In that your are interested if firearms you are going to some day want to rebarrel actions. The G0765 is too small for that. A 12x36 lathe is probably the right size. It is big enough to chamber between centers yet small enough to be able to do smaller tasks.

It is just as easy to learn on a bigger lathe as on a small one. Maybe even easier.

The mill does not need a lot of tooling to start with. A drill chuck, a set of collets and a good machinists vise. Absolutely do not get a drill press vise for the mill. A 4" vise is the right size for a G0704 mill.

You will need more tooling for the lathe. There are numerous threads on here providing a list of tooling needed for a lathe. Do a search.

A quick change tool post, QCTP, is very handy to have. You can make one or buy. The whole point of a QCTP is to have a tool holder for each type of tool bit and boring bar. Plan on needing at least 10 to 15 tool holders. This can quickly get very expensive if you go the buy route. Having a small budget I decided to make a QCTP. After doing some research I made a Norman style QCTP. One benefit of making a QCTP and its tool holders is the practice that you will get learning how to machine.

You will need lots of practice. I came from a woodworking background. Precision machining is a big leap from woodworking. You go from dealing in fractions of an inch to thousands of an inch. Even ten thousands in some cases. Where cutting to a pencil line is often close enough in woodworking it won't even get you in the ballpark in machining. The best way to get this practice is to make as much of your tooling as you can.

Welcome to the madness.
 
It would be nice if there was a simple answer to your question.

I think the Grizzly models you list are on the smallish side for what you say you have in mind. A 12X36 lathe or larger might be a good place to start. Don't forget to look at the lathe's bore size relative to what stock diameter you might want to pass through the headstock. Some lathes have a bore size that is too small for some projects. You may want to save up some more before diving in.

I have a mill (like a charter oak Large 12Z Mill ) that is quite a bit larger and more rigid than the G0704, but still a bench/square-column type mill. I still wish it were even more rigid. It does aluminum just fine but it can be a struggle sometimes when milling steel (drilling is no problem). I just have to take smaller bites and/or slower feeds when milling steel.

I would also invest in a good grinder for making and sharpening your own high-speed steel lathe tools (HSS) if you don't have one.

From the standpoint of what to get, you can look at it as being "all in" and getting exactly what you think you might need later once you get more experience or getting in for lower cost with the possibility of trading up later. To me, the decision somewhat depends on how serious you are about the hobby for the long haul as well as your budget. Many people have made their hobby around smaller equipment and have done amazing work with them. Some people start small and move up. An advantage is that you get to practice and learn for a lower cost and if you still like it, you now have more experience and knowledge to trade up smartly if needed.

My start was about the same, long-time woodworker and caught the metal bug. I went quite large with the lathe (G0509G) and smallish with the mill. If I had to do it over again I might have gone bigger with the mill too but at the time the cost seemed too much to make sense. As it was, I waited and saved for a couple of years before I dove in so I could start with stouter equipment.

The large additional cost for tooling mentioned above is quite real but you "get" to spend that a little at a time.
 
If you ever have rebarreling in your to-do list, a 12×36 is the smallest lathe that you should consider.
I have a G4003G which is a fine lathe, the PM 12×36 is its clone:: can't go wrong with either.

When considering a mill, while the vertical head moving mills are competent and versatile, a knee mill is a step into another class; then the final step is Bridgeport or clone. The BPs have a few features like nod and tilt and extension of the head that makes them very conveniently powerful. It is not so much of "can this mill do <this>" it is more of "I can get this setup faster on HEM" where HEM is higher end mill.

On this, I have a G0730 mill which I am very happy with.
 
Whatever your budget is, plan on doubling it within a year or so. That is just how it is unless you are one of the lucky few to start off with a price is no object budget. Be aware that regardless of what size machines you decide on there will be people that will tell you you need something bigger.


$2500-3000 is about right to get a basic set up with a small lathe and mill. I don't have any personal experience with Grizzly machines, but the mill you list I would think would be fine for what you are wanting to do. Grizzly seems to sit at a good balance point between price and quality.

The 7x lathes like the 0765 are very much built to a budget to keep the cost down. I think you would be better off going with at least one of the Grizzly 8x or 9x lathes. Something like the G4000 9x19 is almost twice the price of the 0765 but better built and optioned. It is still small enough to be moved by two people (250lbs). The 8x16" 0768 is only a little cheaper than the G4000 so unless you really need the small size you are better off with the slightly larger machine which also includes a quick change gear box.


A new 12x36 is going to be well over your budget, and even used unless you are in one of the areas where machinery is falling out of the trees, a good one will probably still be pushing your budget. If you have the room it is still worth looking for a deal as the larger lathes do offer a lot more capability.

New the Grizzly machines usually seem to provide enough basic tooling to get you going, but you should plan on spending at least another $500-1000 in your first year to get tooling you decide "you must have".


You can often find these smaller machines on the used market for roughly half the price of new. Lots of people buy them, use them a few times then find machining isn't for them. The machines get pushed into a corner to sit for a few years until they are rediscovered during a garage clean up and put on Craigslist. Unlike larger machines used in working shops, they often have little wear and only mild neglect / abuse.
 
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Thanks fellas for the advise and the warm welcome.

Rebarreling and chambering is something I'd like to be able to do, but I don't think I would do it enough to justify the extra cost by itself. That's a LOT of barrels. It would definitely be nice though. $4500 for the lathe alone is a bit out of my budget. I'll have to take a look at the used market and see what there is around me. There's some industry, but not a lot. Other than the power plant that I work at, I can't think of any place near me off the top of my head that machines their own stuff. I don't think there's much of a used market around here, but I may be wrong. I hope I am.

Space is a bit of an issue, but I can work around it. If I want something in that shop bad enough, I can probably find a way to get it to fit.

That G4000 looks pretty nice. I can probably spend that much extra to get a better machine. I also figured that I would end up spending more on tooling than I did on the machine. It's funny how that works out. The $2500-$3000 budget is just for a more or less bare bones set up.
 
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Sounds like time for the power plant to upgrade their machines;)
 
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