Anyone tig 1911 frame rails?

[KevinD]

I guess the limits of peening the frame rails has inherent limitations for durability I'm interested in how folks build up worn out frame rails? Since most 1911 frames seem to be 4140 what filler rod do you use? Do you use a heat sink? pre-heat? post-heat? Is it just a fools errand? Thanks for any insights.

It just occurred to me that this may be better on the gunsmithing forum... c'est le vie

 

[xalky]

Whats a 1911? Any pictures?

 

[KevinD]

handgun 45 acp... Sorry about that, I realized after a couple of minutes that I'd ought to put the thread in the gunsmithing list )

 

[xalky]

This might be better in the gunsmithing forum, you're right there. My instinct tells me that trying to build this up with weld might create more problems than it solves, warpage, hardening etc...

 

[pdentrem]

I had it done yrs ago. Had the guy just do 4 places. At the frt and rr of the rails. He had to be careful to not hit the lower side of the groove. About 1/2" long and then I refitted the slide and rails grooves to about .001". Been running this way for a long time. Picture shows one of the 4 built up areas.
Pierre

 

[KevinD]

Most interesting Pierre. The one's I've thought about doing this with would be on the top side of the rail as the slop develops with the slide in battery rocking up/down. At least there it is a bit bigger target to hit, that would be a pickle to get the weld in the frame groove. Be a whole lot more work.

 

[Tom Griffin]

Kevin,

4140 is a low alloy steel and is pretty easy to weld. If you choose to have the frame re-hardened and blued, you'll need to use a carbon steel rod (not stainless). Here's an article on how to TIG weld 4140 that discusses the type of rod and techniques. I welded up the frame on one of my 1911's years ago (maybe 20?) and re-machined the entire slide. It was left it as welded and not re-hardened. It is shot regularly and has held up well over the years, so hardening it doesn't seem to be necessary for reasonable durability.

Tom

 

[xalky]

I had it done yrs ago. Had the guy just do 4 places. At the frt and rr of the rails. He had to be careful to not hit the lower side of the groove. About 1/2" long and then I refitted the slide and rails grooves to about .001". Been running this way for a long time. Picture shows one of the 4 built up areas.
Pierre

Excellent! I don't think I'd attempt it but I'm a novice tig welder. But i might attempt it with lots of practice under my belt.

 

[KevinD]

Kevin,

4140 is a low alloy steel and is pretty easy to weld. If you choose to have the frame re-hardened and blued, you'll need to use a carbon steel rod (not stainless). Here's an article on how to TIG weld 4140 that discusses the type of rod and techniques. I welded up the frame on one of my 1911's years ago (maybe 20?) and re-machined the entire slide. It was left it as welded and not re-hardened. It is shot regularly and has held up well over the years, so hardening it doesn't seem to be necessary for reasonable durability.

Tom

Tom, that was a great little video. Really informative.

And the fact that your gun has held up for a good long while seems somewhat reasonable in many respects. I mean, as a casual observer and armchair metalurgist (ok, backyard blacksmith is more appropriate) the hardness seems a bit less critical than a certain toughness that comes from the carbon and alloys.

 

[Tom Griffin]

Kevin,

That's the nice thing about a semi-auto, Unlike in a revolver or single shot, most of the energy is absorbed by the action not the frame. Consequently you could make the frame out of aluminum if you want and it would work perfectly well. In fact, aluminum frames are available and quite popular for the 1911. Machining one out of 7075 is even on my project list as soon as it gets to a manageable level, but there are a few other guns that I need to finish first.

That is a good welding site and Jodie Collier, the guy who owns it, will even answer your questions if you email him.

Tom