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Trouble cutting bearing pockets

Discussion in 'A BEGINNER'S FORUM (Learn How To Machine Here!)' started by RHayes, Jan 23, 2017.

  1. RHayes

    RHayes United States Active Member Active Member

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    I want to install bearings (R8 2RS) in both ends of a 1.5" piece of aluminum round bar that is 2.00" diameter.

    In a 3-jaw, I face it, bore 3/4" through, then cut the first recess. Remove from chuck, reverse, cut second recess. Then install the bearings, with a light press fit,

    Any tips on improving the accuracy? The .5" shafting never fits as well as the individual bearings do on the shaft. I have a Grizzly 4003G with 3-jaw and try to reverse the piece as best I can but feel this isn't the proper way to do this operation. Ultimately, the 2" round "hub" gets installed in a woodworking project not requiring high tolerance or subject to high load, but I still want to do the bearing installation as best I can, and ultimately would like to make 50 or more of these.

    Thanks in advance for any suggestions.
     
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  2. Bob Korves

    Bob Korves H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    The problem comes when you turn it around, and is likely mostly due to the inherent inaccuracy of the three jaw chuck. If you use a four jaw chuck and dial it in carefully for each end, you should have better results. Your piece is not very long, but you still also need to check and correct for runout from one end of the part to the other while it is chucked as well.

    Edit: Another thing you can do is to accurately finish the through hole bore while doing the first side, and then turn it around and indicate the hole on the second side to get it lined up better. Still need to watch for runout from end to end while mounting in the chuck...
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2017
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  3. tq60

    tq60 United States Active Member Active Member

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    Once you move the work it indeed will move.


    Suggest drill slightly smaller then bore through so you have a good reference.

    Flip part and 4 jaw should be used but you could test centering with dial indicator in bored hole and maybe shift in chuck until it runs true.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337Z using Tapatalk
     
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  4. Tony Wells

    Tony Wells United States Vice President Staff Member Administrator

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    Normally, to get the best out of flipping work like that you have to at least skim cut the OD of the stock to get a round surface. If they are already cut to length you have to go another route. You also have to avoid chucking too tightly on an aluminum piece with ~7/16" wall. If you were going to make 50 and sawed them, you could forego the OD turn if you face/bore through/counterbore as a first operation, then make up a expanding stub mandrel for the other end. Then you would face to finish OAL and counterbore for the other bearing.
     
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  5. f350ca

    f350ca Canada Active User Active Member

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    What has been said above, or bore through in one pass for the bearing fit and cut internal snap ring groves to locate the bearings.

    Greg
     
  6. Dave Smith

    Dave Smith United States Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    like what Greg said about boring all the way through--or start with a thick walled 2" OD tube if you want to make many, and use a spacer lightly pressed between the bearings---spacer can be pinned to housing after bearings are pressed in if desired.----Dave
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2017
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  7. Tony Wells

    Tony Wells United States Vice President Staff Member Administrator

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    Spacer could even float a little if the bearings were tight enough. Just make sure if you go that way to make the spacer ID large enough to pass the shaft easily.
     
  8. chips&more

    chips&more United States Active User Active Member

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    I would not flip the round bar in the chuck. I would use a steady rest set-up when machining BOTH ends of the round bar. Taking a skim cut on the OD ends before you start would be a good idea as well...Dave
     
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  9. Tony Wells

    Tony Wells United States Vice President Staff Member Administrator

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    The way I read it, the OAL is 1.5", so steady rest is not much help. Turned OD and bored soft jaws would be the best way for me to do it.
     
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  10. Dan_S

    Dan_S Active User Active Member

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    My first question would be did you turn the bar OD to 2.0" or is this raw bar stock? If it's just plain extruded aluminum, you can not trust that it is round.

    Unless you have a really dialed in 3 jaw, the bores won't be coaxial, and that will cause binding.

    The best way to hold something like this, is in a collect (unlikely at that diameter). Next would be a 4 jaw if you only have one or 2 to do. Finally would be custom soft jaws like Tony said.
     
  11. chips&more

    chips&more United States Active User Active Member

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    Good point! OK then, I would bore it out all the way through to bearing OD size. Then make an internal bushing/spacer that would go between the bearings. This bushing/spacer could be a press fit or whatever. No flipping required. And no OD worries. Guaranteed perfect alignment…Dave
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2017
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  12. RHayes

    RHayes United States Active Member Active Member

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    Wow, thanks for all the replies. This is very helpful for someone of my experience.

    First of all, the 2" is extruded 6061 and are all short pieces from the salvage yard. After reading the replies, I'm thinking boring all the way through would be the best approach for me. I was trying to avoid turning the outside diameter, it fits nicely in a 2" hole cut in oak using a fastener bit. Will try to get a photo of the project.
     
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  13. Dan_S

    Dan_S Active User Active Member

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    if you bore all the way through the bearings will align to the accuracy of your lathe, so more than good enough. If you bore all the way through turning the OD would be up to you. If the ID is concentric enough to the OD for your purposes no need to turn it true.
     
  14. RHayes

    RHayes United States Active Member Active Member

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    Thanks Dan, thats what i'm thinking.
    Here is a photo. A friction drive for a compact spinning wheel.

    In the photo is an empty hub with a 5/8 o.d. bearing installed in the outside diameter. This leads me to another question that should probably another thread. I plunged a 5/8", 4-flute milling cutter and the bearing fits loose. What I need to know is if I can lightly grind the 5/8" to reduce its outside diameter? friction drive.jpg friction drive.jpg
     
  15. JimDawson

    JimDawson Global Moderator Staff Member Director

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    Trying to get an accurate hole by plunging with an end mill is problematic at best, when plunging with an endmill they tend to wobble around. It is possible to drill a pilot hole that is just undersize and then plunge with the end mill but this still may not make an on size pocket. A 2 flute would be better than a 4 flute for this operation. Reaming or boring would be a much better option.
     
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  16. Tony Wells

    Tony Wells United States Vice President Staff Member Administrator

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    You could, but it's not really reasonable to expect to hold bearing fit tolerances with an end mill. That's an application for a reamer. In aluminum, a reamer would last nearly forever, especially if you spring for one that is carbide tipped.
    Lightly stoning an end mill will reduce the clearance on the flutes, inducing the probability of dragging. Not good for finish or fit. I find that many, if not most carbide end mills are ~0.002 under nominal anyway, so with that and a little runout from your collet, you might get close enough, but that really isn't good practice for machine work.
     
  17. David S

    David S Canada Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Boring through the blank seemed like an awful lot of material removal, vs using say a thick wall tubing and the appropriate size bearings. However it sounds like RH is getting drops from the scrap yard so that is the starting point.

    I certainly agree boring thru would be the most accurate.

    David
     
  18. sanddan

    sanddan Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    If nothing else, this thread illustrates that in machining there are many ways to skin a cat.
     
  19. David S

    David S Canada Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    I don't know what the speed and loads are, but just thinking out loud. This seems like it could be an ideal application for oil impregnated sintered bronze bushings. Perhaps a pair of OD 5/8", I.D 1/2" x 1/2" long. That would only require one straight through bore for a slight interference fit. Could heat the slug in the oven and slip them in from both ends.

    Also with that bearing in the side, I wonder if we are running out of wall thickness if we do a straight through 1.125 " bore?

    Boring the side pocket for the smaller bearing seems like and ideal application for a small boring head...or perhaps fixture to the lathe face plate and bore it that way?

    David
     
  20. Cavediver

    Cavediver United States H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    RHays, did you find a workable solution?

    I'm in the planning stages of a DIY 2x42 belt grinder, and I would like to turn my own rollers. Since I'm working on a mini-lathe I'm very limited in terms of tooling and work space. Your issue is the same one I will face, and I'd love to know how I'm going to work around it before I start!

    Thanks!
     
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  21. markba633csi

    markba633csi United States Active Member Active Member

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    One more method: Just bore thru and press in flanged bearings
    Mark S.
     
  22. Cavediver

    Cavediver United States H-M Supporter - Premium Content H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Would a draw-bar version of something like this (plus an adapter plug turned to the ID) work as an open end mandrel?

    [​IMG]

    Simplified process:
    Face and bore / ream stock to the appropriate diameter
    Cross-drill and thread for a set screw or two
    Mount stock (on the adapter plug) and turn the OD and the bearing pocket
    Flip the part, take a skim cut to check for alignment issues, face and cut the 2nd bearing pocket.

    I like this idea as it has long-term versatility, but I don't know if the 5/8-16 threaded section of this 3mt blank would hold up to machining a 2"x 2" aluminum cylinder.
     
  23. RHayes

    RHayes United States Active Member Active Member

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    I've made ten so far (two batches of five) and will be making another 5 soon. Still boring from each side, and lining up a reverence mark on the same jaw. I know this isn't the most accurate way but the mechanisms have all worked well so far. I ran out of drops from the scrap yard and ended up buying a 5' length of 2" 6061-T6.
     
  24. gheumann

    gheumann Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    If you bore all the way through, even undersize, you can use a center in the tailstock to center the work in the chuck after you flip it round. Should get you very close. But as a rule, planning your work to only have to chuck a part once is always the best if possible.
     
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  25. RHayes

    RHayes United States Active Member Active Member

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    Thanks. I have been boring all the way through but will make a point of bringing up the live center cone as well upon reversal.
     
  26. Wreck™Wreck

    Wreck™Wreck United States Active User H-M Supporter-Premium

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    I make hundreds if rollers per year with bearing bores in each end that will be mounted on a shaft during assembly.

    If possible bore soft lathe jaws to hold the parts, this has the added advantage of leaving little or no jaw marks on the part.
    If possible use an adjustable chuck.
    If mounting the finished product on a shaft of questionable size and roundness use what is often known as "Bearing Quality Bar" stock, turned, ground and polished, this is not to be confused with TGP material for general use.
     
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  27. MarkM

    MarkM Canada Active Member Active Member

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    If you need a shoulder for the bearings to butt up against and have to flip it and re chuck it. Make a pass with your boring bar through the part and when you flip it to the other end indicate off your bore and machine the second bearing pocket.
     

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